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Who's Developing for "Square" MagStripe CreditCard Reader & Touchscreen Payment Systm

Who's Developing for "Square" MagStripe CreditCard Reader & Touchscreen Payment Systm
When I first saw a display ad here on XDA for this gizmo around beginning of April, I thought it was an Fool's joke because the gadget was so small, and it seemed "too smart" to be true.
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... but many of you know it's been out for quite a while. Threads here go back to I think September 2010, (though there was zero traction then)...
Website: https://squareup.com/media
FAQ: https://help.squareup.com/customer/portal/topics/4139-frequently-asked-questions/articles
It works on Android phones and iphones...
Then, by the end of April, having poked around a bit, following links, asking questions on their twitter feed and at facebook, I come to find out that SQUARE, the name of this device, new company and payment system, is the brainchild of Twitter founder Jack Dorsey, a real visionary, who's been ahead of the curve before, regarding the ways people, and groups of people, interact, and where technology can play a role there.
With this new knowledge -- which is significant -- it completely reframes the way I looked at this device: from a QUESTION MARK about
"who's using it and what do you think of its viability?"
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to
"who's using it and WHAT KINDS OF APPS do you see developing around this system for use by small businesses -- delivering them customized apps with physical credit card transaction systems?
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Very different perception about the entire product and viability as you see in the 3 short posts I made in this thread, how it quickly progresses
So, has anyone here....
• used one? If so, how did the transaction go? Is it smooth sailing, does the card reader work the first time? (if so, it's better than most checkout stands at grocery or drug store)
• bought one? if so, have you used it for a business, or just to try out, or to write an app for?
• developed custom software for it?
From the looks of it, if this works half as well as it appears, it seems pretty darn revolutionary.
Curious to see if there is any feedback.

To be honest it's not something that i would trust.

matt.blackwood said:
To be honest it's not something that i would trust.
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Explain more please. Do you mean as a card holder making a transaction? You mean you would not trust ...
(a) the security of the system to properly authenticate with the credit card company and approve the transaction
(b) the card reader's and software's inherent reliability to firewall your credit card data and isolate just that single transaction, without grabbing your credit card info?
(c) the vendor using the credit card reader and who knows what software has been tied to the reader to grab and suck down all your credit card data, nicely stored for vendor to use another time, another place -- or sell off to some third party?
(d) or the vendor is acting in good faith but someone makes an app for his particular business and sells to him and he is legit, but unbeknownst to him the app is "phoning home" to app maker or some third party with credit card data?
-------- Please explain , don't just pick a, b, c, d .... I'd really like to understand. And these just sprang off the top of my head once you said that.

I've been eyeing them as a company and as a mobile PoS system solution for a while... I signed up today, guess we'll see in a month how it goes.

RADRaze2KX said:
I've been eyeing them as a company and as a mobile PoS system solution for a while... I signed up today, guess we'll see in a month how it goes.
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Great! I hope you'll give us some feedback.
My first impression, as mentioned, upon seeing just the top image, was "what a clever joke" -- because I hadn't really thought something so small was realistic.
Then when I'd clicked through and saw it was tied together thru the headphone jack, I thought: wow, this is clever: Immediately flipped my thinking from joke -- to -- very clever engineering -- with a very smart snap/snug, stable external device mounting method, plus the critical input/output connection.
Then, seeing nothing more my mind wondered but what's the quality of the mag-stripe reader? ---- that's impossible to know... But upon seeing the device was actually in use and had history, I knew it had to work-- and -- my mind instantly flipped again to: How many times had I been to a major chain grocery store or "big-box" store, or ATM machine or parking lot checkout reader, and have my credit card rejected because "not readable" -- only to then have the same card work perfectly fine 10-feet away at another ATM machine? ... Answer: Very often.... And the cashier ends up taking the card and either swiping it in another device, or manually entering the numbers, so, my thought was: hey if it works 75% of the time, it's as good as most industrial strength systems i encounter in every day life... SERIOUSLY.
My mind tumbled out all of these reactive thoughts all in a split second -- like, what about signatures -- and of course, touchscreens, just like in stores. I didn't check to see if they provide a capactive stylus, but i have used about 3 brands of capactive stylusus on my various devices, and they are not bad ---- Put it this way, They are EASILY as good as controlling my signature as the crappy pens provided with almost every touchscreen signature system I have used at grocery stores, drug stores, etc, where my signatures is wildly uncontrolled and yet the system accepts it.
(NOSTALGIA NOTE: The argument has long been had about resistive vs capacitive screens -- I've been in on those for several years. The feature I miss the most on my post-windows-mobile phones is stylus-based drawing and handwriting and character recognition and "handwriting to text"... The entire industry took a giant 10-year step backwards with capacitive screens when that incredible advancement -- poof - just went away, got buried -- and most post-iphone-world consumers today don;'t even know that it was ever possible... oh.well. .... )
So, when I posted this thread, I was pretty psyched.
THEN came the first reply -- and his was the only reply before yours -- saying
To be honest it's not something that i would trust.
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And that lead me to immediately examine everything I'd ignored while I marveled at the technology. I never got a reply back from matt.blackwood
which is a real drag
because he raised the issue, and at the very least I wanted to know if the factors I then took apart were the factors bothering him -- or if it was just an overall intuition he hadn't really examined in the detail I did.
In the end, there is NO WAY THIS CONCEPT CAN FAIL ultimately... whether this particular company solves all the problems of security or someone else does... whether they get bought out by paypal, or whatever may happen. It's TOO SMART TO FAIL and I would consider investing money in the company.
Let's face it, the Apple Store uses clunky mobile credit card transaction devices, and they swipe the cards -- and the whole thing is very smart... But I recall asking a guy at Apple store in San Francisco a year ago
"Hey, how come you guys haven't hooked up an external card reader device to an iphone to do this same function? It seems kind of foolish to be touting the iphone's "there's an app for that" only to then have this dedicated terminal that seems way bigger than it needs to be to perform its function"
And the guy looks at me... You know that semi smug look you get with their cool blue t-shirts and tags around neck with the general attitude of "I know all" and "there's nothing you can possibly know that apple hasn't altready thought of" ...
And he starts to speak about "well I am sure they are working on..."
And I pull out my HTC Desire and say "But I'm just saying.. it's a pretty simple concept, anyone could do it, it's not that hard, they could do it to THIS phone, right?...So I'm just kind of surprised it's not even in prototype stage"
And the smug look has evaporated with no place to go... I wasn't being smug at all. I was just being correct. And he says "You're right. We should have that by now" ....
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So, *I* had envisioned an add on that was, of course, credit card sized, and was flat, and would butt-up flat to the bottom of a touchscreen device. That seemed so obvious.
Which is why I was initially baffled by this gizmo and thought it was a joke, because it seemed so unrealistic .... Until I clicked through and saw --- wow, *I* was wrong. Very very smart product design. They should change the external design to look less plastic and cheap, so as to convey a more durable and serious, secure product.
Please let us know what you think.

I think the main issues are definitely B, C and D on your previous post. I'm sure A has been solved by now, otherwise this wouldn't even be a product.
People are very paranoid about their credit cards, and with good reason. Anything remotely "new" will have a tough period of adaptation and the fact that this is portable and so ad-hoc (clever though it is) will only fuel people's doubts. It's great from an engineering perspective but its more of a risky bet when you take marketting into account. But not to worry, there's a lot of places that could pioneer these devices. Cyber cafe's with iphone-armed waitresses and such would be ideal. From there on it would spread. (I would NEVER use it on a hot dog stand like the ad photo suggests though, no way XD)
The signature thing caught my eye as well. Its gonna be really awkward to sign with your fingers. They should DEFINITELY package an iphone-compatible stylus with each reader.

Wow, didn't know SQUARE is from inventor of Twitter, his next "vision"
This quadruples my interest in this gizmo and belief in its destiny to take over the credit card terminal business:
http://www.vanityfair.com/business/features/2011/04/jack-dorsey-201104
Frankly, now with this information, I'm really surprised XDA-devs is so slow to get onboard with this. My god, people are dragging their heels on this? It's completely nuts. This is a homerun. If someone has an app to develop for android or windows7, or even iphone, or vendor-by-vendor custom apps, this is going to be a huge huge money maker for app developers customizing apps for SMALL BUSINESSES.
He or she who drags feet will be like Microsoft dragging feet after the iphone flipped the UI for touchscreens to finger-based navigation.

CptAJ said:
I think the main issues are definitely B, C and D on your previous post. I'm sure A has been solved by now, otherwise this wouldn't even be a product.
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Thanks for replying. Here's what their site says about security. I would love to see the XDA-dev security experts scrutinize every aspect of the security issues, and pick apart any shortcomings -- simply for identification purposes. I want to see this succeed, and as you can see in the way I have reframed the way I see the product, I am certain it will. I can't see it failing to gain significant traction in X years' time. It will probably be way faster than it took paypal to build user trust -- because that was a different time in the internet curve of adoption by consumers.
https://squareup.com/security | VeriSign Secured seal | PCI Compliant link
Physical & Network Security
Sensitive data is encrypted using industry-standard methods when stored on disk or transmitted over public networks.
Only standard, well-reviewed cryptographic protocols and message formats (such as SSL and PGP) are used when transferring data.
Symmetric cryptographic keys are required to be at least 128 bits long. Asymmetric keys must be at least 2048 bits long.
Security updates and patches are installed on servers and equipment in a timely fashion.
Security settings of applications and devices are tuned to ensure appropriate levels of protection.
Square’s website and API are accessible via 128-bit, extended-validation SSL certificates issued by VeriSign.
Networks are strictly segregated according to security level. Modern, restrictive firewalls protect all connections between networks.
Card-processing systems adhere to PCI Data Security Standard (PCI-DSS), Level 1.
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Web and Client Application Security
Card numbers, magnetic stripe data, or security codes are not stored on Square client devices.
Applications developed in-house are subject to strict quality testing and security review. Web development follows industry-standard secure coding guidelines, such as those recommended by OWASP.
Card-processing applications adhere to the PCI Data Security Standard (PCI-DSS), Level 1.
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Organizational Security
Access to sensitive data, including application data and cryptographic keys, is strictly controlled on a need-to-know basis.
Two-factor authentication and strong password controls are required for administrative access to systems.
Security systems and processes are tested on a regular basis by qualified internal and external teams.
All access to secure services and data is strictly logged, and audit logs are reviewed on a regular basis.
Security policies and procedures are carefully documented, and are reviewed on a regular basis.
Detailed incident response plans have been prepared to ensure proper protection of data in an emergency.
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Research and Disclosure
We want to encourage responsible reporting of problems with our service. If you believe you have discovered a problem with our service, please contact us at [email protected].
Square will respond to all reasonable reports of potential security problems, usually within 24 hours. If you report a problem, we will:
Acknowledge your report, and provide you with contact information for our team as we investigate;
Work with you to ensure that we understand the issue, and consult with you about the best way to address it;
Work with other organizations, if necessary, to ensure that other services are protected too;
Keep you informed as all of this takes place; and
Give you credit, if you wish, for helping us.
Security is critical to Square. By reporting problems to us in a responsible manner you enable us to address issues and protect our users in a timely fashion. We also recognize that legitimate and well-intentioned researchers are sometimes blamed for the problems they disclose. In order to encourage responsible reporting practices, we promise not to bring legal action against researchers in response to a disclosure, provided they:
Share the full details of any problems found with us.
Do not disclose the issue publicly or to others until we have had a reasonable amount of time to address it. We will try to act quickly, but some aspects of our system are complicated and may take time to patch and test.
Do not intentionally harm the experience or usefulness of the service to others.
Never attempt to view, modify, or damage data belonging to others.
Do not seek compensation or reward for the report, either from Square or a third party.
This pledge is intended to balance the protections and guarantees necessary to encourage responsible disclosure against our own requirements and responsibilities for data security. It is not an invitation to test the security of our service without authorization. If you have any questions about this, or have any doubts about whether your tests are appropriate, please contact us before proceeding.
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***
*** I want to actually respond to your post's points that I can respond to in next post. This was to isolate the security info into one post.

I have one of these and have used it, the transactions have gone smoothly. I haven't used it often, but I've had it since they first launched (I was one of the first people to get one of them), and it works great as a swipe card reader as well as a manual input card device if you need to take a credit card number over the internet or phone. I'm not planning on using it in place a normal merchant account (I'm in the process of getting one set up for online transactions), but for in-person transactions I'd feel just as comfortable using this as I would any other card-swiping solution.
Just my two cents.

FORGET ABOUT ALL DOUBTS in Square payment system: VISA investing in Square
http://www.cnbc.com/id/42783124
For all those who were marginalizing SQUARE with a "wait and see" approach, you might as well sprint ahead and get into adoption mode, and start developing for it. With this VISA partnership, hard to see SQUARE needing any more validation. It's going to clean up big time.
Square Partners with Visa, Gaining Advantage in Mobile Payments Race
Source: squareup.com​
Startup Square just secured a major advantage competitive mobile payments space — a strategic investment from Visa which will put one of its executives on the company's advisory board.
This isn't about the cash — earlier this year Square raised $27.7 million in financing, led by Sequoia capital — this is about validation from Visa, a leader in credit card payments.
Considering that all of Square's rivals, including Quicken and PayPal, have been looking to partner with a giant like Visa, this gives Square a huge advantage in getting merchants to adopt its service.
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more in link: http://www.cnbc.com/id/42783124
And from GigaOm:
Visa is making a strategic investment in mobile payment provider Square, providing the start-up with an undisclosed sum of money as well as a new advisory board member. It’s a nice boost for Square, which is on a roll as it tries to ramp up payments via a smartphone. But it also highlights the growing role of credit card companies as they try to prepare for the growing mobile payments boom.
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Kaessa said:
I have one of these and have used it, the transactions have gone smoothly. I haven't used it often, but I've had it since they first launched (I was one of the first people to get one of them), and it works great as a swipe card reader as well as a manual input card device if you need to take a credit card number over the internet or phone. I'm not planning on using it in place a normal merchant account (I'm in the process of getting one set up for online transactions), but for in-person transactions I'd feel just as comfortable using this as I would any other card-swiping solution.
Just my two cents.
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Kaessa, would love to get more anecdotal information about how customers are responding to this form of payment -- what questions do they ask... and even procedurally -- walk me through it, do you in fact hold the phone in your hand, as pictured, and they swipe it? Or do you turn phone sideways (90-degrees) so they can swipe card more like at cashier terminals?
Then what, do you keep the reader plugged in and flip phone around for people to sign?
Do people have an okay time with finger?
Is there a reset/ try signature again?
Just curious! Thank you.

I really want to get one of these to play with, but they are not available outside of the US. I don't want to use it for payments, just as a mag-stripe reader.
I was wondering if anyone in the US would be willing to buy one and send it over? I heard you can buy them over the counter from apple stores...

crazy stuff

MOD note: After going through the thread, indeed it's related to phones and shall be moved back to general shortly.
It might have been misinterpreted by ORB, even we moderators are humans and can make mistakes.
So, I suggest OP and everyone relax.
Also, if OP you have any further issues address them to me via PM ( not rant threads - like the one I shut ).

That is correct, initially it seemed to be an iphone only related thread, now OP edited and included other OS´s.
@OP, Next time please contact Moderator instead of creating rant threads please

orb3000 said:
That is correct, initially it seemed to be an iphone only related thread, now OP edited and included other OS´s.
@OP, Next time please contact Moderator instead of creating rant threads please
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OP only edited it to make it more apparent that it was about phones. No image was changed. No information was changed re OS. It was about Android from Day 1.

quicksite said:
Kaessa, would love to get more anecdotal information about how customers are responding to this form of payment -- what questions do they ask... and even procedurally -- walk me through it, do you in fact hold the phone in your hand, as pictured, and they swipe it? Or do you turn phone sideways (90-degrees) so they can swipe card more like at cashier terminals?
Then what, do you keep the reader plugged in and flip phone around for people to sign?
Do people have an okay time with finger?
Is there a reset/ try signature again?
Just curious! Thank you.
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I've only done it a couple of times, so I'm probably not the best one to ask. One was online, as an eBay transaction... PayPal had screwed up his account so I just took his Visa over the phone. There is a "card not present" option, just like with any other credit card machine.
As far as swiping the card, I would take the card from them and swipe it. It's a fairly delicate device, not like a grocery store card reader, and someone getting over-enthusiastic with it could break it or your phone's headphone jack. I don't worry about breaking it myself... I carry it around in my purse in the same pouch I carry my headphones in.
As far as the signature goes, the finger signature works fine... just turn it around and either give it to them, or put it on a flat surface and have them sign. I don't know if there's a "try again", but there probably is. It's a well developed piece of software, really slick. Looks like they thought of everything when they put it together. I haven't had anyone hesitate to use it. Now that Visa is in on it, I'm sure there won't be any problems.
I'm thinking of using it at my next yard sale. Should get all those looky-loos that "forgot to bring enough money".

[Amateur Editorial] Next Generation of Phones will be the last for many

It is hard to argue that phones have not plateaued in terms of functionality. The iPhone 4S is simply an incremental upgrade to the iPhone 4. The next generation of Android phones are pushing pocket-able screen sizes to the limit. There is only so much you can do with a certain form factor, and this upcoming generation of phones is it. Applications run entirely smoothly, batteries are lasting entire days of moderate to heavy use, everything from a TV to a Vacuum Cleaner can interact with your phone through it's plethora of radios. And screens are so crisp that the human eye cannot even detect the pixels, perfect for watching full length, high definition movies on-the-go.
Two-year contracts sound like an eternity since the rapidly improving operating systems of Apple, Android, and Windows. However, there is an exponential decline of innovation between iterations of firmware. Donut to Eclair. HUGE. Eclair to Froyo. Big. Froyo to Gingerbread. Bug fixes and optimizations. Gingerbread to ICS. Superficial. What could possibly be next for a phone? Two years will surprisingly be too short for all but the nerdiest and niche interest groups. It's already been more than a year and a half with my Samsung Vibrant and other than tech-lust, there is no genuine reason for me to upgrade.
The next step for phones really isn't about phones at all. The next step is to systematically destroy every other gadget you currently own. The first to go? Laptops. The Atrix began this process, but it was for the most part a broken and overpriced experience. That will change as phones are becoming exponentially more powerful. One could argue that gaming laptops will still exist. Sure, for a couple more years. Kal-El, Wayne, Logan, Stark, Nvidia's superhero line-up of gpu/cpu chips. Stark being 100x more powerful than Tegra 2! One Hundred. These are theoretical, but the potential is staggering. Compounded with cloud-assisted browsing from Amazon Silk or Opera Mobile? Laptops are dead. Long Live Laptop Docks.
Next to go are dedicated tablets. Operating systems such as Android's Ice Cream Sandwich will unify the tablet and phone experience. ASUS wants to capitalize on this with their Padfone. Why buy a full price phone and tablet when you can buy just a phone and the tablet as an accessory for half the price? For myself, I would come home and plop my phone into the tablet. When I go out, I remove it. No more syncing. It's all consolidated. Not to mention when my tablet husk is home, it'll be charging all day. I won't even have to charge my phone or change my battery before I couch surf. Ah, laziness.
Last to go are game consoles. In fact, casual gaming is already on the horizon of being completely overrun by mobile devices. Portable gaming devices such as the Vita and 3DS are probably near the last of their kind. Nvidia's Stark will most certainly be able to support Full Stereoscopic HD output, if a processor before it cannot. This is my most speculative moment, but I can picture a future where your phone gets plugged into an HDMI/HDD Dock connected to your TV and you download most of the data for rented video games and stream the more volatile aspects such as sound effects, textures, and geometry. Discs will still exist due to their practicality, ownership, and offline use. Services like On-live will also become more prevalent as bandwidth costs decline. Okay, maybe consoles will be around for quite some time still, but their days are numbered.
In the meantime, phones will even make the phone part obsolete. Minute plans will be optional since not only is VoIP much cheaper, it's so much more clear and crisp. T-Mobile and Walmart are already headed down this direction. GPSs? Already dead. External webcams? Gone. Digital Cameras? Nope. External Hard drives? Cloud and SDXC will cover the masses.
Unless you are an IT or Content Creation professional, this next generation of phone will literally handle anything that you will ever need or want in a stand-alone phone device. For most of you, this is it. If you want a social networking, casual gaming, high quality photo-taking, VoIP/Webcam chatting, Global positioning, Netflix streaming, Hulu watching, cloud storing/syncing Super-phone, the wait is finally over. This is your year. This is not to say that phones will continue improving in performance and incremental updates, but there is literally NO more room for groundbreaking innovation within this particular form factor, only the hybridization and replacing of every other gadget that you own.
Oh, except for one feature I want. Built in noise-canceling support for headphones, like the Sony X-Series.

While this might be true, never forget that the platforms you use and love evolve. And that might get users to upgrade after all!
Take facebook for example. Right now, video calling is only available via Desktop operating systems. But I'm pretty sure that over the next few years this will come to mobile, meaning that your handset must be strong enough to handle it smoothly.
I don't think that even the average consumers will last with their 2011/12 handsets "forever".

This was a very good editorial.
I must say, that before every generation of new phones, people think "this is it, this will replace my pc/psp/etc...". While I do believe, that huge things are coming, I don't think this is THE generation yet.
We're getting more power, more apps, better screens, but we still lack (in my opinion) a solid OS that could replace Windows in every day use, and - perhaps more importantly - the average consumer lacks the mentality, that everything he wants done, can be done on his smartphone.
Also, to your list of killed devices, I would add "MP3 players"

good post and interesting read.
But isn't the next upgrade in generation of phones always been about replacing some other technology?
cameras, mp3 player, pda, operating system (android, ios) etc..
And all the while replacing these other things, the cell phone gets more efficient at it.

@smirny stuff like facebook specific video calling i would consider as incremental and non-essential. with upcoming generation, google talk is a viable option for video chat, plus there are many services such a Qik and Fring. I doubt (hope) that people aren't holding out on their phone purchase for facebook video. I couldn't imagine video chatting with an acquaintance from high school. All of your closest (video worthy) friends probably have another way of contacting you than facebook. I know that was just an example, but with quad-core devices on the horizon, video chat is covered.
@darktori i think that any OS that could replace Windows entirely would have to be on a different form factor than a phone. there will never be a way for a smartphone to do a better job creating a document than a laptop. that's where the hybridization comes in. my article discusses this is the end of the stand-alone smartphone road in terms of innovation. anything meant to replace windows in everyday use will break the phone form factor, whether it is tablet hybrids or laptop docks. those who want a smartphone, this is the year, because the only reason in the future to upgrade is to get this extra functionality. and yes, i did forget mp3 players
@dpmace yes it is. however, the phone has reached it's limit in its own form factor. everything from here on out will need a different form factor. to replace laptops, they need a dock, to replace game consoles, they need a controller built in (xperia play), to replace tablets, they need to become one. Phones themselves are maxxed out in terms what the can do as stand-alone devices. So this upcoming generation, the generation right before the mass hybridization of devices is the best time to buy a stand-alone smartphone for a long period of time. the upgrades afterwards will be superflous to those who don't need a laptop or tablet. their phones are already fast and capable of handling everything they need them to. they have an 8MP camera, why do they need a 16? they have a good phone GPS, why do they need a phone with a better one? they have a good GPU, why do they need a stronger one if they don't plan on outputting it to a TV? etc

Very nice and well thought out editorial piece. I'd have to disagree though, there's no way this is the best we're getting.
Regarding the iPhone 4S: Apple have always used incremental updates to get the most money possible from their users, and have mostly gotten away with it until now, because the earlier iPhones were missing really basic features. The iPhone 3G was big because it had 3G (what phone didn't even then?). The 3GS mostly upgraded the camera and I think the processor? The 4 was the only one that fundamentally changed anything in my honest opinion.
Software I'll mostly agree on, but I think ICS serves a great purpose of making android look better to the masses, standing out, and doing a much better job with multi-tasking.
Hardware is the big one. They still have a long way to go, in many ways.
Cameras are never likely to replace a dedicated camera, for the simple fact of space. A camera only gets so much space within the phone, and for every advance made in cameras that gets used on a phone, that same advance could be used on dedicated cameras, as well as extra ones that require more space.
Batteries are a big one, it's the reason you'll see so many posts on every phone's section of these forums, asking about battery life, and with kernels and mods aimed at giving extra battery life. It's why "battery extenders"can be downloaded so much in the market. If a phone came out next year, or the year after, where they concentrated their efforts on a great battery, and gave significantly more battery life, I'd definitely buy it.
I'll admit that the phones are reaching limits on what they've been concentrating on for now (screen size and processor/RAM) but they'll just expand in other ways. There's no way the phone manufacturers are just going to pump out similar phones and hope the customer prefers theirs to the one next to it on the shelf because of brand. There's still plenty of new ideas coming out every day, and they can add to the phone's functionality, not just superficially (like 3D). There's NFC, flexible screens (which on its own could bring about a lot of new ideas), added durability, and I'm sure a lot of things we haven't heard of.

Did you ever hear the quote that says "Technology has advanced more in the past thirty years than in the previous two thousand..."? That is 100% true and there is no sign of slowing down. Things that you can't imagine today can be possible within years. So I just can't agree to the fact that you are basically stating that besides a few tweaks and improvements, technology has come to a complete halt.

Excellent editorial. Love all your points except with gaming consoles becoming extinct. I find this to be untrue and impossible in the sense that phones, computers, Hard drives, or whatever, the concept of them storing your games, e.g. PS3 games which are at most 50gb (note gaming data size will grow too since it is proportional to graphics), is impractical. In the sense that you can only "hold so much", and our "so much" capacity isn't nearly close to our desire capacity. So gaming consoles will stay.
Unless you are suggesting we develop a different evolutionary storage medium or sort of micro usb which stores the game and the phone simply reads off the device and plays. Now that is plausible. The only problem there is will the phones withstand the heat exerted? As we all know in proportional to the graphic intensity of the game so will the amount of power demanded by the GPU or porcessor, which in turn will be expended as heat. So considering it will take a lot of power, it will give a "lot" of heat. Story short, our phones will not withstand the heat and melt.

Kailkti said:
Excellent editorial. Love all your points except with gaming consoles becoming extinct. I find this to be untrue and impossible in the sense that phones, computers, Hard drives, or whatever, the concept of them storing your games, e.g. PS3 games which are at most 50gb (note gaming data size will grow too since it is proportional to graphics), is impractical. In the sense that you can only "hold so much", and our "so much" capacity isn't nearly close to our desire capacity. So gaming consoles will stay.
Unless you are suggesting we develop a different evolutionary storage medium or sort of micro usb which stores the game and the phone simply reads off the device and plays. Now that is plausible. The only problem there is will the phones withstand the heat exerted? As we all know in proportional to the graphic intensity of the game so will the amount of power demanded by the GPU or porcessor, which in turn will be expended as heat. So considering it will take a lot of power, it will give a "lot" of heat. Story short, our phones will not withstand the heat and melt.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The future of gaming lies with Onlive. Your device will just be a thin client, awaiting video from the Onlive servers that will do the heavy lifting for you. I envision a gaming world where you use a bluetooth controller to play a game that's streamed to your TV in HD resolution via your smartphone.
We have the technology to do this already, it's just not the kind of gaming experience hardcore gamers will accept, but give the technology a couple more years to develop.

Oh right. Forgot about OnLive, prolly cuz i haven't heard about it since the release. But you are right it is a promising feature. the only problem is it requires a steady data connection, which sadly, we know not everyone is blessed with. But soon enough the entire world will modernize to have data being able to flow to every where so that won't be a problem, the problem will be in the case of system failure, both data provider and server, which I am sure happens a lot.

Have you not seen Iron Man 2? I want a phone that is just a sheet of glass and is fully integrate-able with everything around it on the fly. When that comes out, I think the innovation has ceased.
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"lightbox_stop_slideshow": "Stop slideshow",
"lightbox_full_screen": "Full screen",
"lightbox_thumbnails": "Thumbnails",
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If any of you guys play Shadowrun 4th edition, you'll know that the ultimate is a display in your glasses, goggles, contact lenses, or even cybernetic implants in your eyes.
Pocketability be gone!

vadyr56 said:
Have you not seen Iron Man 2? I want a phone that is just a sheet of glass and is fully integrate-able with everything around it on the fly. When that comes out, I think the innovation has ceased.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
or remember when he was designing the suit, everything was virtual and he could touch it.
One day we shall have that!! Then maybe screen sizes will be obsolete.

vadyr56 said:
Have you not seen Iron Man 2? I want a phone that is just a sheet of glass and is fully integrate-able with everything around it on the fly. When that comes out, I think the innovation has ceased.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Un What about graphene tech? Samsungs going to be releasing foldable and bendable phones. The first one using this tech is apparently due next year.

hungry81 said:
Un What about graphene tech? Samsungs going to be releasing foldable and bendable phones. The first one using this tech is apparently due next year.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That would be cool too, how about a phone that can be used in a "normal" size mode (say around 4.5") and then can unfold into a 20" tablet!

Good first try. Not everyone willing to put down their thoughts in a form of long article.
However there are some fundamental flaw:
bdroc said:
The next step for phones really isn't about phones at all. The next step is to systematically destroy every other gadget you currently own. .
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not sure you understand the word "systematically" and "destroy". I simply don't see phones "destroying" EVERY other gadget, especially the following few you mentioned.
bdroc said:
The first to go? Laptops.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, at least for a good decade. People been saying this to desktops when laptops became very popular. Now? Desktops are still being made and sold. Nowhere near "been destroyed".
And this paragraph gets ridiculous when you say cellphone SoC can replace dedicated GPU. You are saying essentially play Crysis (PC Game, 2008) on a cellphone, which is NEVER going to happen.
Once you understand how powerful a dedicated GPU is, you will realize how stupid it is to make such claim.
bdroc said:
Next to go are dedicated tablets.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is purely based on user habits. My cousins have both iphones and ipads. I have a G2x and a laptop. Unless you can make sure a 4 inch phone screen does not exhaust your eyes with extended use, then you can never make such claim.
bdroc said:
Last to go are game consoles.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is getting more ridiculous. Also mentioned above the "power of a dedicated GPU", cellphones are NEVER to replace game consoles.
I personally still prefer those gadgets you mentioned as separate gadgets and I am not a minority.
So let's calm down with the Android fanboyish hardware craze, and face the reality.

I don't think it's safe to say that phones have reached feature-completeness, although i agree that developers are going to have to start thinking in dimensions other than "what can we do without having to make any serious changes to the system".
When i look at the Android platform, especially, i see huge amounts of possibility. For example, your phone could basically obsolete a huge amount of what we encounter in our daily lives. Bus/train pass? Nope, NFC with a phone app. (These will still exist, of course, but for those with phones there won't be any interaction with them.) Credit cards, likewise, will be gone. Ultimately we'll be going to all-data, eliminating the phone/text/etc nonsense. Or at least, someone will. Probably not the US. That will become more useful in the long term, though.
But i think there's going to be more than just replacing other things with a more unified device.
For example, in the future your phone could ping your home PC and wake it up even if it was sleeping. Then you would be able to "log in" just like a normal user and get your full PC desktop on your phone. This isn't replacing your PC, it's using your phone as an additional way to access it--much like your mouse/keyboard/monitor! You could, for example, do an "OnLive" sort of thing but with your phone. This is actually already possible, but it's a pain to set up and we don't have phones that are strong enough/batteries that last long enough/data connections big enough to truly make it happen.
Or for another possibility, Google Goggles is something that already exists... but in the future it will operate in real time. Hold your phone up and you'll get all the information from Goggles overlaid on top of the image from the camera. You could take it a step further, too, and have a digital "message board" or comment system, where people can write things and attach them to real world objects which will then be displayed for others. (As someone suggested: really you want this sort of tech in your glasses, or something like that, but it will likely go through phones first.)
Heck, you could set that as your phone's wallpaper and not even have to open an app.
The "Tony Stark phone" could be a reality, although not at those precise dimensions. You could have a phone with no "UI" (although Stark's phone has a pretty interesting-looking UI on it if you examine it) but just have the Goggles-enhanced real world overlay on it. To interact with it you could issue voice commands--or touch it to bring up a UI.
Your phone could control your car in a tremendously "what the 1950s thought the future would look like" sort of way: get into the car, pull the phone out, then say "Car, take me to my house". Then sit back and relax, because the car will drive itself there. (Technically you don't even need the phone for that, but hey...)
This is all sort of crazy dreaming, but it's still not even "lateral thinking"--it's just extending things your phone can already do.

::::Calling my fellow Android users::::

Okay, here's the deal:
My mother goes to school part time, for her work who requires her too. bottom line is she has like 4 essays to write but one of them i told her - since im an Android junkie - i would give her at least a really good outline for.
Here's where I ask you guys for help, cause I think I have my main points but still maybe you all can put in your main points (two or three) so I can get some other ideas as well.
heres the topic:
Why the Android OS is BETTER THAN the iPhone OS for the ORDINARY CONSUMER.​
So the thing to keep in mind here when I write this is that it is for a normal, everyday consumer.... This is the main reason I ask you guys for input is because it is hard for ME to separate the geeky points from points that the students in her class would see.
Anyways, thanks for anyone who has some input as I need to write a good outline for my mom before she goes into work tonight, again thanks.

Found this while in a os battle with my buddy and his iPhone. This has got 5 good plot points from a user perspective.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9WF6M1hy0EE
Sent from Soundwave aboard Nemesis.

Freedom. Want a screen bigger than 3.5"? There's a phone out there. 16gb of storage not enough? Spend 20 bucks more and double your storage with a micro sd card. Want to install an app that isn't on the market? Download another appstore or the apk file itself. Don't want to have to deal with iTunes for music? Congrats, just drag and drop files from any computer or download many different music stores with Android.
Sent from my HTC myTouch_4G_Slide using xda premium

The single largest freedom an Android device grants a and user is the ability to utilize a MicroSD (or ANY) memory card for expanded or interchangeable memory.
You can unmount and remount sdcards on the fly, so you can change them out without turning the unit off and keep a whole mess of media on a bunch of cards.
(this memory card for Rock, this memory card for Blues, this memory card for action movies, this memory card for etc...)
The greatest hardware improvement over an i-something is the option of a hardware keyboard. You will also never see this on an i-pocket device. This is something we are all familiar with right here moreso then elsewhere and bears no further explanation.
The biggest frustration shed by an end user when leaving the communistic apple universe is ditching iTunes. - No more need be said on that either here, you can fill in the details on that.
Android is encouraged to be used on any device that can be made to run it. iOS runs on 3 (and only 3) pieces of hardware. Android offers users a choice of hardware that fits their needs and budgets, not just a single price point at take it or leave it.
Due to the 'promiscuous licensing' of Android (as steve jobs has been known to say) Android devices can consistently offer hardware that is at least one (if not more) generation(s) ahead of what the single Apple phone offers.
(Android has quad core processors now - what's the iPhone got?)
Bottom line is the two contenders can be summed up quite simply:
Apple = control
Android = freedom
In an Apple ecosystem you can do what Apple says you can do, when they say you can do it, precisely the way they allow you to do it and no more.
In an Android ecosystem you are encouraged to seek innovative ways of doing things and utilizing the hardware and software.
----
A jailbroken i-device still offers less freedoms then a full-security on and locked Android device. So an i-something at it's most open state is still more locked down then an Android in it's most locked state.
----
I don't have any more time and there were quite a few other points I wanted to touch on, but that should be some to get the outline started in addition to what is or hopefully will be posted.
Good luck!

Most android phones have removable batteries so you can always keep a spare on you.
More customizable. You can pretty much change any software aspect of the phone.
There are android phones on many carriers including a lot of prepaid carriers.
Devices running android are generally cheaper than devices running iOS.
Choice of screen size and resolution even up to 720p on phones.
Thought of a couple more. You have a choice of size and also more color choices... You don't just get to choose between black and white because there are so many different colored android powered devices out there.
Hmmm... A lot of other stuff has already been covered, but if I think of anything else I will post it.

for the average user it really is just down to money.
cheaper phones (with way better price/performance ratio) and cheaper/more free apps.
the average joe won't even notice the difference in freedom you can have with android over ios

Go on Rootz. I did a whole did on this. It's Under the username "NomyNomyNomy".
Sent from my myTouch_4G_Slide using Tapatalk

Multitasking is a real nightmare on the iPhone...
I can't stand the fact that I'm flipping through 4 apps at a time
Not to mention the smaller screen and lack of widgets. I also like the app drawer in android, compared to the sliding panes in iOS. It's just easier to navigate through all your apps, instead of flipping from page 1 to 9. Oh, that brings me onto the leap screen, which is a neat little feature to get from one screen to another quickly.

When I used iOS I was Jailbroken and had my iPhone looking like a Nexus S. Also, I had my 3G running Sense 2.1. I liked iOS for the Apps, but Android caught up.
Sent from my myTouch_4G_Slide using Tapatalk

Freedom of choice. This is it. There's all sorts of shapes, sizes, options, UI choices; you name it. You want choices? Android's the platform to go to.
Unfortunately, you pay for this freedom of choice for usability for everyday users that don't really care about rooting, SD cards, using something that isn't iTunes for music, and a lot of other things.
Personally, I disagree with you mostly because I deal with all of this nonsense all the time and a normal person won't care to explore the potential of something they have bought, let alone paying more than $50 for something that isn't the O GREAT IPHONE. Great for people like us who care about doing the most we can with what we buy, but most people "can't be bothered" to actually try doing something with the things they buy.

Limewirelord said:
Freedom of choice. This is it. There's all sorts of shapes, sizes, options, UI choices; you name it. You want choices? Android's the platform to go to.
Unfortunately, you pay for this freedom of choice for usability for everyday users that don't really care about rooting, SD cards, using something that isn't iTunes for music, and a lot of other things.
Personally, I disagree with you mostly because I deal with all of this nonsense all the time and a normal person won't care to explore the potential of something they have bought, let alone paying more than $50 for something that isn't the O GREAT IPHONE. Great for people like us who care about doing the most we can with what we buy, but most people "can't be bothered" to actually try doing something with the things they buy.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's not the point though... The outline isn't for what OS is better it's for why android is better...
Also I thought of something else... Most android devices are built stronger than than iOS devices and aren't totally encased in alumina-silicate glass the iPhone uses and when they do use glass it's gorilla glass which is many times stronger than alumina-silicate glass the iPhone uses. So basically android devices can withstand falls better than the iPhone (some being better than others).

Has anyone mentioned, no freakin' back button on the iPhone? I've had a few users complain about that in my presence.... must be maddening!

Limewirelord said:
...
Unfortunately, you pay for this freedom of choice for usability for everyday users that don't really care about rooting, SD cards, using something that isn't iTunes for music, and a lot of other things.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree with you about sdcards, but part of it is also the psychological aspect of "I can!" even if it's never actually done. People like us really get use out of that sdcard slot, but the average joe has the card that came with the phone still in it.
The psychological aspect those same people who can't be bothered to learn anything more then they know about it makes the few distinct things it does different more important to cling to and cry louder in a typical apple fanboi vs average android user comparing phones in a bar or something.
If you paint the average user in the ignorant light that(mostly fairly from what i've seen too, ) you do, then this strawman argument on their behalf carries even more weight, because it's one of their few pieces of ammunition to save face against "O GREAT IPHONE" (lol'd at that btw - it does set the mentality) their actually using it means nothing, it's just the knowledge that they can we care about here.
----
As far as iTunes, I haven't met a single flesh and blood real (not ethereal like all of you online people lol) person that hasn't hated the living daylights out of iTunes.
Again, these are the same types of people that you painted earlier - people that may or may not have an android phone and maybe an ipod touch or something, or an iphone. Their friends might have one or the other of the above devices.
I've heard nothing but the strained frustration of loss from every single one of them to a man (or woman) based on contact with another accounts i-device or host computer...
(...which i'd generally refer to as 'infected' with iTunes on it, because the average user and a foreign i-device = computer owner, device owner, or both losing everything...)
...because these same people that only know what they know and want to learn no more don't even know that you can turn off auto sync and so on, or the rules of when you can or can't connect the devices and not be shedding a tear a few minutes later.
We all either know or would figure out within minutes of opening the app how to handle everything correctly with at least a 90%+ success rate on execution.
The average user? Install iTunes, synce device. 3 weeks later friend comes over. Their i-device gets plugged into the computer. Chaos ensues.
Limewirelord said:
Personally, I disagree with you mostly because I deal with all of this nonsense all the time and a normal person won't care to explore the potential of something they have bought, let alone paying more than $50 for something that isn't the O GREAT IPHONE. Great for people like us who care about doing the most we can with what we buy, but most people "can't be bothered" to actually try doing something with the things they buy.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And herein lies the rub, because you are exactly right and the scorn you drop here is the exact equal to:
...the person who takes the time learning how to operate a vehicle properly hear someone say " and they asked me when the last time I changed my oil was, and I said 'what oil?' "
tit for tat that's an exact frame of reference to the perspective you cast for consideration, so it really comes down to:
Where is the person who - after doing the most, and also importantly the most common, maximum level of unintentional damage the most upset? Apple or Android?
The iTunes thing I think everyone would agree puts the saddest person in the Apple camp, also since that burns many people very often.

Thanks so much to all who responded!!!! I gave her the link to this thread and "said you can use what you want"
She responded back tonight when I asked her "did the links I sent you pan out?"
She said this:
{
"lightbox_close": "Close",
"lightbox_next": "Next",
"lightbox_previous": "Previous",
"lightbox_error": "The requested content cannot be loaded. Please try again later.",
"lightbox_start_slideshow": "Start slideshow",
"lightbox_stop_slideshow": "Stop slideshow",
"lightbox_full_screen": "Full screen",
"lightbox_thumbnails": "Thumbnails",
"lightbox_download": "Download",
"lightbox_share": "Share",
"lightbox_zoom": "Zoom",
"lightbox_new_window": "New window",
"lightbox_toggle_sidebar": "Toggle sidebar"
}
Once again: Huge thanks to all who chimed in, turned out great from the outline she sent me!
If you didn't have the time to get your post up before she finished its alright, I'm overwhelmed myself when I see the amount of attention I got from this community
My mom and I appreciate it and I'm sure someone else may come along and need this thread too, so thanks for that :beer:
Typed by ---- oh wait! I'm schizophrenic!

Education and sharing knowledge is what XDA is built on.
I do not want to see this devolve into a petty apple bashing thread, because there is a real message to be had if we agree with the things mentioned above.
This serves to illustrate the importance of treating new people with the ability to look back to when you were like that.
At some point we all had to decide to see what was a little further down the rabbit hole, but the average person that isn't into computer tech loses 2/3rds of their common sense and IQ the moment they sit down at a terminal.
It's just a pre-concieved fear of the unknown, not knowing what you can't do that results in breaking or just messing the whole thing up.
People that aren't familiar with this stuff can be paralyzed by the fear of doing something catastrophically wrong - often to the extreme. If they show up here and start asking questions, then they are taking steps to conquer that and become that person who changes their oil.
This should serve as a good reminder of what it was like for you, whoever you are reading this, when you first started wondering how to tinker with your device.
Here and there you can see when someone forgets what it was like and loses that perspective - Remember this, though, you no longer respect what you can do if you forget what it's like not to be able to.
Take a minute or have an extra shred of patience when someone new starts asking questions, you could be nurturing someone becoming what you are.
The best place to send anyone new first is right Here.

Little Off Topic but throw Espier Launcher on your phone and you will get a slight sense of how it is to be on ios. It gets horrid. With the loss of freedom.
Sent from my myTouch_4G_Slide using xda premium

[Discussion] Ubuntu Edge

"In the car industry, Formula 1 provides a commercial testbed for cutting-edge technologies. The Ubuntu Edge project aims to do the same for the mobile phone industry -- to provide a low-volume, high-technology platform, crowdfunded by enthusiasts and mobile computing professionals. A pioneering project that accelerates the adoption of new technologies and drives them down into the mainstream." - http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/ubuntu-edge
What do you guys think about the device? I for one can't wait for it! Discuss below.
"Give a man a fish you feed him for a day, teach him to fish, you feed him for a lifetime." In other words help others find an answer don't just give it to them.

Does anyone know if the CPU architecture will be ARM or x86?
This phone seems really interesting and if it has Merrifield inside (Bay Trail for smartphones) I might actually get one. Hopefully I can find this out before the 21st of August.
I was initially thinking of getting it when my contract ran out next year but I'm getting the idea that if one wants one you need to buy through the campaign.

cypher49 said:
Does anyone know if the CPU architecture will be ARM or x86?
This phone seems really interesting and if it has Merrifield inside (Bay Trail for smartphones) I might actually get one. Hopefully I can find this out before the 21st of August.
I was initially thinking of getting it when my contract ran out next year but I'm getting the idea that if one wants one you need to buy through the campaign.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They haven't specified at all, only saying it will be the very best available when they start manufacturing.

"armv7 A15 support 40bit adressing"
That is what one of the officials said on indiegogo. The guys name is Victor Palau.

Help spred the word!
https://www.thunderclap.it/en/projects/3486

Someone buy me one... I want one... can't afford... I will just pray they start making it for US carriers and I can get one with my new contract next year ha. Seems like this phone will be the "next best thing" if the project gets enough support. I like the sapphire screen and sleek design they've come up with. Would buy 10/10.

t3hcurs3 said:
Someone buy me one... I want one... can't afford... I will just pray they start making it for US carriers and I can get one with my new contract next year ha. Seems like this phone will be the "next best thing" if the project gets enough support. I like the sapphire screen and sleek design they've come up with. Would buy 10/10.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This phone will never ever ever ever come to carriers.
A) the phone will never exist.
B) even if it will, they will start a new campaign and change the price to a more realistic $850. Can carriers subsidize this to $200? They won't like it much...
C) the phone is the phone equivalent of a Bugatti Veyron. You won't see these just lying around in a store. They are limited production and must be built on a per order basis. Carriers on the other hand, stockpile phones, something canonical can't allow with the little support they have.
D) The margins are extremely small. Ubuntu style. Seriously, look at the specs, then the price. You can't expect a company that has such small margins to really take off and compete with multi billion dollar companies.
This phone is only for hardcore Ubuntu enthusiasts who absolutely must have the best, and can afford it. Since you're American, if you buy this phone, you'll end up paying for it twice during the course of 2 years. More if you keep it longer.
Don't worry. Since Ubuntu is open source, it's only a matter of time before Ubuntu Touch is finalized and flagships start shipping with dual boot capability.

I backed it, but am sadly anticipating the crowd fund to fail.
If you look at the descriptions, pretty much every hardware aspect is still up in the air, even the cpu architecture. And given how poorly they handled the developer preview release, burst their hype bubble, and only barely have a dd-ready build after all this time, I don't think it would release on time even if it did fund successfully.
Motorola was way ahead of its time starting with the Atrix and its webtop mode, is a shame that they axed it and Google never built in that support after buying Motorola. The whole screen becomes a touchpad when in webtop mode on a tv was really cool. (Granted, the web dock laptop WAS like $500 for a crappy screen and keyboard dock, but still, it worked!)
I REALLY want to see the whole desktop convergence thing happen, but the MHL vs OTG stuff still needs to be worked out and standardized, so one port can simultaneously output hdmi, be a usb host, and still charge the device, before it will be ubiquitous. One dock to rule them all! (Either that or standardize the two-port hdmi & usb side by side with specified orientation and spacing)
In the meantime, newegg has a deal today on a Samsung 11 pin mhl dock sometime today. (Good for s3/4 and notes)

Today we broke past $10M in support, and soon the world record for crowd funding will be broken.
The Ubuntu Edge has an unlocked bootrom and we are encouraged to hack/tinker with it.
Yesterday Mark Shuttleworth posted this message:
A message from Mark Shuttleworth
Hi everyone
Thanks in large part to all of you, the Ubuntu Edge campaign response has been incredible. In just over three weeks more than 20,000 people have backed the project, from individuals giving a single dollar right up to Bloomberg’s fantastic $80,000 contribution. Along the way we’ve broken crowdfunding records, including the fastest project to hit $2 million (7hrs 59mins), and the highest ever 24-hour total ($3.45 million). We’re now on the verge of an even bigger milestone as we approach the all-time crowdfunding record of $10.27 million.
Speaking both personally and for the team, the more time we spend on this project, the more excited we get about the possibilities of this new class of device. And as the news has spread we’ve seen industry thought leaders coming round to the idea that convergence can be a real force, and that this project represents a new way to underwrite innovation.
That led to some significant engagements with suppliers that enabled us to drop the price below $700, without compromising the specification. And now that we’ve seen next-generation phones from other major names, we think the price-performance of the Edge is off the charts -- it offers real value. We’re even more convinced that it will take a new approach to unlock the next wave of mobile innovation.
Whatever happens in the next nine days, the Ubuntu Edge is already making a difference. This campaign lets enthusiast consumers signal their interest to a mobile industry that caters overwhelmingly to the mainstream. It’s making it clear that we’re no longer satisfied with minor updates; we’re looking for true innovation and we’re ready to pay for it. And that message is getting through.
So in a sense, we can be proud of what’s been achieved already -- but we really want to hit that $32 million! We’re going to need a huge push, a surge in awareness that builds momentum to carry us over the line. No one here is giving up while the goal remains achievable, and you’ve all gone out of your way to add your voice to the chorus. So I’m writing to ask you to take to the Twitterverse and other social networks to encourage like-minded types to join you, and me, and companies large and small, in backing the Ubuntu Edge.
As they say, the future is already here, it’s just not widely distributed. We’re working to put it in the hands of 40,000 people, to start a revolution. And you’re there at the start.
Mark Shuttleworth
Founder, Ubuntu and Canonical
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think there is still a ton of people who do not know about the device, and if you want one, help spread the word and support the campaign!

Aonoa said:
Today we broke past $10M in support, and soon the world record for crowd funding will be broken.
The Ubuntu Edge has an unlocked bootrom and we are encouraged to hack/tinker with it.
Yesterday Mark Shuttleworth posted this message:
I think there is still a ton of people who do not know about the device, and if you want one, help spread the word and support the campaign!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can't wait to get my Edge, I'm so fed up of my Lumia 920 and it's constant niggles that gripe me on a regular basis, I'm really looking forward to trying Android... To be honest I can't believe the storage capacity on this thing!!! There's no way Apple will ever do a 128gb model... imagine the price after Apple tax gets included

Since the op seems to be on vacation there is no need for this thread to stay open. Please continue your discussion here
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2379508&page=4
Thread closed

Glowdeck - Wireless charger, alarm clock, and bluetooth streaming device.

Hey guys, i have just come across this on kickstarter.
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/glowdeck/glowdeck-wireless-power-light-and-sound
It looks interesting and i think it may be the first of its kind? Anyone aware of any other viable alternatives? I love that it has multiple charging coils so you can just chuck your phone down on it.
This will beat my current setup which is an energizer qi charger and an old logitech alarm clock with a bluetooth ipod dongle (this works well btw, just not pretty)
What do you guys think? Any other things like this available or going to be soon?

dalton8 said:
Hey guys, i have just come across this on kickstarter.
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/glowdeck/glowdeck-wireless-power-light-and-sound
It looks interesting and i think it may be the first of its kind? Anyone aware of any other viable alternatives? I love that it has multiple charging coils so you can just chuck your phone down on it.
This will beat my current setup which is an energizer qi charger and an old logitech alarm clock with a bluetooth ipod dongle (this works well btw, just not pretty)
What do you guys think? Any other things like this available or going to be soon?
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Looks nice! For a $100 for the mini version is kinda steep for a charger. $275 for the one with bt speakers and display...is ok, but still kinda steep for a nightstand piece. EDIT: I kept looking at it and I opted for the single display with speakers lol. I may change my mind down the road, but I like the look of it. It's a step up from the multiple charger stands like the Tylt VU but that one has no display and runs retail for $70usd plus any shipping.

glowdeck - Wireless Power, Light, and Sound
kpjimmy said:
Looks nice! For a $100 for the mini version is kinda steep for a charger. $275 for the one with bt speakers and display...is ok, but still kinda steep for a nightstand piece. EDIT: I kept looking at it and I opted for the single display with speakers lol. I may change my mind down the road, but I like the look of it. It's a step up from the multiple charger stands like the Tylt VU but that one has no display and runs retail for $70usd plus any shipping.
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I see you guys are discussing Glowdeck - which is great; I'm very glad to hear that it is of interest to you - so I thought I'd chime in and try to explain some of the price-related comments you raised. A backer just asked how much I expect the Multiple Device Edition to retail for after the Kickstarter campaign, and here's a paraphrase of the response I sent him:
Because there are still some cost details to be hammered out (with components suppliers/manufacturers), it's difficult to say exactly what the retail price point for Glowdeck will be (assuming the campaign succeeds), but I set the reward levels on Kickstarter about $50.00 below what I expect the Multiple Device Edition to retail for (i.e. $375.00). I thought this would be a way to reward the first folks who support the product.
To be sure, it's not an inexpensive product, but in addition to going against the grain (at least in the tech world) with an elegant wood finish, I was determined to use only premium quality components. Instead of Glowdeck being a product that does a bunch of things just okay, I set out to build a high-end device that would perform excellently across the board.
The question now is whether the market is willing to pay a little bit more for a product that doesn't skimp on quality - both aesthetically and functionally. But with your pledge, I'm encouraged that the answer might be yes...
Feel free to contact me at [email protected] if you have any questions or comments, and please continue to spread the word!

glowdeck said:
I see you guys are discussing Glowdeck - which is great; I'm very glad to hear that it is of interest to you - so I thought I'd chime in and try to explain some of the price-related comments you raised. A backer just asked how much I expect the Multiple Device Edition to retail for after the Kickstarter campaign, and here's a paraphrase of the response I sent him:
Because there are still some cost details to be hammered out (with components suppliers/manufacturers), it's difficult to say exactly what the retail price point for Glowdeck will be (assuming the campaign succeeds), but I set the reward levels on Kickstarter about $50.00 below what I expect the Multiple Device Edition to retail for (i.e. $375.00). I thought this would be a way to reward the first folks who support the product.
To be sure, it's not an inexpensive product, but in addition to going against the grain (at least in the tech world) with an elegant wood finish, I was determined to use only premium quality components. Instead of Glowdeck being a product that does a bunch of things just okay, I set out to build a high-end device that would perform excellently across the board.
The question now is whether the market is willing to pay a little bit more for a product that doesn't skimp on quality - both aesthetically and functionally. But with your pledge, I'm encouraged that the answer might be yes...
Feel free to contact me at [email protected] if you have any questions or comments, and please continue to spread the word!
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Does the Glowdeck top up the phone overnight? Ive read a few posts about some qi chargers charging the phone to 100% then turning off completely, so if you charge it over night it will be at about 90-95% in the morning instead of 100%..

glowdeck said:
I see you guys are discussing Glowdeck - which is great; I'm very glad to hear that it is of interest to you - so I thought I'd chime in and try to explain some of the price-related comments you raised. A backer just asked how much I expect the Multiple Device Edition to retail for after the Kickstarter campaign, and here's a paraphrase of the response I sent him:
Because there are still some cost details to be hammered out (with components suppliers/manufacturers), it's difficult to say exactly what the retail price point for Glowdeck will be (assuming the campaign succeeds), but I set the reward levels on Kickstarter about $50.00 below what I expect the Multiple Device Edition to retail for (i.e. $375.00). I thought this would be a way to reward the first folks who support the product.
To be sure, it's not an inexpensive product, but in addition to going against the grain (at least in the tech world) with an elegant wood finish, I was determined to use only premium quality components. Instead of Glowdeck being a product that does a bunch of things just okay, I set out to build a high-end device that would perform excellently across the board.
The question now is whether the market is willing to pay a little bit more for a product that doesn't skimp on quality - both aesthetically and functionally. But with your pledge, I'm encouraged that the answer might be yes...
Feel free to contact me at [email protected] if you have any questions or comments, and please continue to spread the word!
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Click to collapse
I would absolutely be interested in something like this, but the Qi wireless standard, while the dominant standard now, may not be in the near future. I'm sure you've done your research to know that a bunch of big names back another standard (and I won't get into it here). As such, investing $200+ on a device that may not work with my future devices is a hard pill to swallow. I'm not the kind of person that would buy a wireless charging case as an accessory so if my next phone doesn't support Qi, my Glowdeck would lose much of it's functionality.
In addition, and again with my view of never buying a wireless charging case, just not enough phones support Qi natively (integrated). If wireless charging was mainstream (and ignoring the standards war), I would really be interested in something like this. I currently use a wireless charger for my Nexus 4 and it's awesome, but will my next phone have it? My next phone may be the Moto X and it's already stated that it won't come with wireless charging. If my phone is the Nexus 5, again, we will not know if it comes with wireless charging. I almost feel that if I buy a Glowdeck, I would be restricting myself to wireless charging phones only to ensure I won't be stuck with having a $200 alarm clock.
Overall, wireless charging having an uncertain future through it's adoption and competing standards hurts this product in my eyes. Tack on the premium price and I can't see myself buying something like this right now. However, the idea is great -- many times I wish I had 2 wireless chargers so I could put one on my nightstand. Glowdeck does this and so much more.
Just my feedback that I'm sure people will disagree with. Goodluck on your campaign!

Really nice charger/speaker/clock! Would love to have one but yes, the price of $275 (not considering FX) is a bit too steep for me since it is just going to be a "want".. But you have a nice product there! Good luck with your kickstarter project!

Enhanced said:
I would absolutely be interested in something like this, but the Qi wireless standard, while the dominant standard now, may not be in the near future. I'm sure you've done your research to know that a bunch of big names back another standard (and I won't get into it here). As such, investing $200+ on a device that may not work with my future devices is a hard pill to swallow. I'm not the kind of person that would buy a wireless charging case as an accessory so if my next phone doesn't support Qi, my Glowdeck would lose much of it's functionality.
In addition, and again with my view of never buying a wireless charging case, just not enough phones support Qi natively (integrated). If wireless charging was mainstream (and ignoring the standards war), I would really be interested in something like this. I currently use a wireless charger for my Nexus 4 and it's awesome, but will my next phone have it? My next phone may be the Moto X and it's already stated that it won't come with wireless charging. If my phone is the Nexus 5, again, we will not know if it comes with wireless charging. I almost feel that if I buy a Glowdeck, I would be restricting myself to wireless charging phones only to ensure I won't be stuck with having a $200 alarm clock.
Overall, wireless charging having an uncertain future through it's adoption and competing standards hurts this product in my eyes. Tack on the premium price and I can't see myself buying something like this right now. However, the idea is great -- many times I wish I had 2 wireless chargers so I could put one on my nightstand. Glowdeck does this and so much more.
Just my feedback that I'm sure people will disagree with. Goodluck on your campaign!
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Thanks for the feedback - it is all well taken. Deciding on a wireless standard was difficult, but there was a rationale behind the decision to go with the Qi standard (at least for the time being), and I think I will address this point in an update to the Kickstarter campaign in the next few days.
---------- Post added at 04:45 AM ---------- Previous post was at 04:11 AM ----------
tanwg said:
Really nice charger/speaker/clock! Would love to have one but yes, the price of $275 (not considering FX) is a bit too steep for me since it is just going to be a "want".. But you have a nice product there! Good luck with your kickstarter project!
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Thanks for the kind words. And I know where you're coming from with regard to the price. Out of curiosity, would a modified version of Glowdeck with no display (nor WiFi connectivity) appeal to you as well? If so, what price would seem reasonable for such a product?

glowdeck said:
Thanks for the kind words. And I know where you're coming from with regard to the price. Out of curiosity, would a modified version of Glowdeck with no display (nor WiFi connectivity) appeal to you as well? If so, what price would seem reasonable for such a product?
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I like the display because that will make it function as a bedside clock too, but WiFi to receive feeds does not appeal to me . As for price, I would not comment since I don't know the cost involved in such a project.

IMO Lose the display, things like daydream make up for it. The screen is too small anyway (OR/AND) Lose the wifi, apps should make it possible to pull all info from the phone. Make something like a slope or stand with the nfc inside so the phone can stay upright(Also lowers the number of coils u need).

It has all of the functionality I've ever wanted in speakers before except the design is so terrible. I don't know why anyone would want the weird wood finish on this, it looks so tacky and gives off a hipster vibe. I would kill to have a speaker with all these functions in something more geometric, modern, satin colors and less of a 1950s vibe. Price is also a turnoff.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 4 Beta