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Good Afternoon Everyone.
I appologise if I am not allowed to post this here but I thought XDA-Developers would be a great place to come for this.
I am thinking of retailing a Google Android 7" Touch Screen Device.
I am still waiting for some more information and some tests to come back to me but I have got the basic specification and some pictures of the device and I was wondering if I can get some thoughts back from other members here.
I have currently setup a survey at: http://www.dhcd.co.uk/surveys/AndroidTouchDevice.aspx
If some of you could take a look and leave you thoughts that would be great.
I am currently talking with the factory because I beleieve that the Ram needs doubling, the processor needs increasing and the Storage capacity needs improving alot other than that I personally think its a great device but would love some feedback on it.
Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.
Regards,
Max
More like pentuple the RAM. Current Android phones have about 512 MB of RAM [and that's phones not tablets], and processors of 1GHZ.
Actually, i looked at this device at ebay yesterday while looking for an ebook reader. Looks nice but having around 384-512MB RAM would definitely help with web browsing. The CPU could be a bit faster but even as it is it should be able to handle ebooks and www well enough. A few MHz more would be nice extra for games and media but it's not that critical in my opinion.
What don't like is the proprietary connector. It would be much better if there was a standard miniUSB for recharging and copying files over to the device.
I don't have any complaints about storage memory - 4GB might not be much today but it's more than enough for your apps and SDHC card slot means almost unlimited storage space for everything else. So i'd say leave the internal memory as it is.
The overall design looks nice. I especially like the fact that it isn't a straight ipad clone. Okay, ipad may look nice but its knock-offs rarely do.
However it seems that someone didn't think the screen size trough. 800x480 screen is too narrow for this device size and leaves ugly thick black borders at the sides. having a 800x600 screen put into that thing would be really sweet It would also greatly improve ebook reading experience in portrait mode (a few more words per line).
The stated price seems fair, especially if it would remain the same after upgrades (sorry, chose "High price" in survey by mistake ).
From what i read, these devices run android 1.6. It would be really great if they got 2.x upgrade along with upgraded specs since more and more apps require android 2.
Anyway, for now i'm sticking with my old TC1100 tabletPC as books and pdf docs reader but if you manage to get this device upgraded it might be a nice lightweight alternative to the full-featured tabletPC.
Thanks for the feedback all very helpful.
I am taking what is said back to the factory and hopefully I can get the device upgraded.
Regards,
Max
Yeah I think if you bump up the specs as suggested above (ROM memory especially), you'll probably move some at the price you mentioned in the survey. However, I think you'll need to be sure to play up the fact that your device does have the real Android on it...there's Chinese/Taiwanese "KiRF" (knockoff) hardware out there that looks like a full featured device, but is running a home-brew Android look-alike OS, with far less features...don't want yours getting confused with those
Hey Everybody,
Before I get to the meat of this sandwich, I'd just like to say thanks to all the devs (both this site's makers and the contributing kind) who so graciously share their intellectual property. You guys F'in Rule!
I have a question that has been bothering me for a while now and even more so now that higher and higher-end phones keep emerging. Besides HTC, whom I am a huge fan of, I can't fathom why most phone developing companies build such sophisticated handsets and then only stick 512mb of RAM in them. I keep reading all these spec sheets (I read just about everyone I can get my hands on) and when it comes to the memory, each has only this seemingly minuscule amount. Am I missing something? How can you build a mobile device that has dual-core 1.2ghz processors, (forgive me for saying it) "Retina" type screens, soon to be 3D technology and only put this small amount of memory it? Is 512mb more than adequate? Would it kill them to put a full gig? I use a Dinc and have somewhere north of 140 apps (and this is after I deleted at least 20) and I was using (and still am to a lesser degree) a combination of App Categories, Smart Shortcuts. Multicon and maybe 10-15 widgets (google search X2, 2 news types, calendar, small HTC scrolling people widget, dictionary.com, powerstrip, plus the individual wifi & gps widgets X2 each). Before I deleted said apps and changed my widget use, I had a constant warning in my notification bar that read "Insufficient Memory." In checking my phone's file managers, neither my sd card nor the 8gigs of internal storage were even close to full. Can you see where I'm going with this? I feel like Jack Nicholson in the church scene at the end of Witches Of Eastwick... "is it a mistake!? Or did they do it to us, on purpose?! Cause I want to know!!" (I clearly know it is done on purpose, it's just an illustration) So to simply say it, Why the standard of 512mb and is this really enough?
P.S. Sorry for the Dennis Miller-like rant.
The complete answer is long...... so the short answer is --- the motherboard on a smart phone has to have many of the same things as a computer. MB/VDO/Sound/modem/rom/ram/memory (both internal and external) + music, camera ...etc.
Originally, voltage and power were the real limiting factors plus physical size, as time went on (from-2001-2009) things got smaller and smaller and faster and lower voltage. It has taken until 2008 -2009 to reach the technology to have 1 gig ram, but since development leads market (when we see it) by 18 months we do not see until 2011, some of the new phones this year will have 1gig ram.
That, and most things that need a lot of ram are games, and most people do not use the phone for that. Plus, more ram more processing more power usage then mad customers claiming their phone battery sux. Also, there were not many apps that need a lot of ram, so build for the need, as the need increases then the phone will be updated accordingly. go to remember we at XDA are 1% of the users not the 99% most do not care about knowing whether their phone is really working right or not, just as long as they can have it do the useless things they want it to do.......... bottom line, until marketing sees improving the tech side of the phone will improve sales it doesn't happen. That's how it works...sorry to say
I hear everything that you are saying and it all makes perfect sense. Just out of curiosity, what, other than games, would use a heavy amount of RAM on a phone? I don't really play many games, I have a couple but mainly stick to Angry Birds if the occasion actually calls for one. To clarify what little I know about RAM, it is the memory a device/comp uses in order to read/store bits of info for quick use at a later time. Would it not help the phone's overall general processing, like switching between apps and the like, to have a great deal more of it?
You can tryout "system panel" at the apps store, this will graph out the usage of the ram and so you where the memory and cpu resources are going. This will probably answer your curiosity better. But, yes more is always better...... I have 32 gigs on my desktop (LOL) yeah i am a junkie but wow program are so fast now.
I don't play game either but there are some of the role playing games that are real memory hogs Neocore is a game we use to test the phone for speed. Just like a computer, the 2 things that will make a difference....... more ram better video card. Or, in this case vdo-chip. That is why (imho) the dual cores are coming 1 core for video and one for everything else.
Im curious. Do you still have unlimited data? What are your plans about keeping it? Whats your next phone?
I switched to the 6GB share plan, and I'm either getting an iPhone 5, or a Droid DNA.
Seriously?..... I guess we should each have our own thread when we decide to get a new phone.
Each day that passes, I look more and more forward to getting away from the redundancy and boringness of these Tbolt forums.
Well I'm loving my TB its on liquid ics 3.2 I think over fast and the next fone should be the Droid DNA or Samsung note 3
Sent from my Thunderbolt using xda app-developers app
Why in the hell would you switch from unlimited to 6GB? You do realize that higher phones will pull more data, higher quality video streams, and so on right? What used to be 4GB on the TB will turn into 8GB on the DNA or other similar phones.
Anyway I bought the DNA and gave it a trial run, found out it really wasnt for me and didnt suit my needs so I'm back on the TB. The only thing I want in a new phone is a bigger screen now. The TB fills every other category on my wish list perfectly.
At this point I'm probably going to wait until I really see something I like come out. The Droid DNA had a lot of potential, but it's major shortfalls (16GB only, no uSD slot, non-removable battery) are hard to ignore. It's tough to justify the GS3 now that it's already 6 months old, so I think I'm going to wait and see what 2013 brings to the table. While I'm fine with the large phone size (although I think phablets like the Note are too large), I do wish one of the big Android manufacturers would put out a top tier phone in a smaller form factor. There's no way my wife could comfortably use the DNA or GS3 (the Tbolt is about her hand's limit), but it seems there's no top tier phone in the low 4" sizes anymore.
I still have unlimited. Next phone? I won't know that for 6 month but it will have 64GB or an SD slot. I have 64 Gig SDXC in my tbolt now.
Why would you want 64GB? Isnt that like 30,000 songs? At least 100 movies? Half the apps in the app store? You should probably get over your memory requirements since removable batteries and stuff are a thing of the past. Phones are moving into the cloud, designed for wireless charging, ultra light weight and portability. To achieve this you need to be able to just cram everything in there any way you can, which makes it less likely for access.
RunNgun42 said:
Why would you want 64GB? Isnt that like 30,000 songs? At least 100 movies? Half the apps in the app store? You should probably get over your memory requirements since removable batteries and stuff are a thing of the past. Phones are moving into the cloud, designed for wireless charging, ultra light weight and portability. To achieve this you need to be able to just cram everything in there any way you can, which makes it less likely for access.
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I was once asked why anyone would want 1MB (yes megabyte) of RAM in a computer. The "cloud" is finicky, not always available, and not to be trusted if you care anything about privacy. Memory is cheap and light. ($42 retail less than 1g for my 64GB). I'm willing to bet the trend toward no removable battery or memory is money (i.e. cost of manufacture and support) not ability of the designers to execute. The trends seems to be LARGER phones (bigger screens bigger batteries).
Buy a used phone and keep your unlimited data. eBay, swappa, etc. I've bought my wife and I each a galaxy nexus for around $220 each. You won't regret it.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda app-developers app
Keeping the tbolt and bought a tablet to use along side my bolt with tethering on...
Sent from my ThunderBolt using xda app-developers app
tburns said:
Keeping the tbolt and bought a tablet to use along side my bolt with tethering on...
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Me, too. I just got a Lenovo A1107 for $120 (as a carputer) and have a 10.1" Samsung Tablet for around the house. The Bolt can stay as a telephone and mobile hotspot.
Verizon sucks, though.
nonews said:
I was once asked why anyone would want 1MB (yes megabyte) of RAM in a computer. The "cloud" is finicky, not always available, and not to be trusted if you care anything about privacy. Memory is cheap and light. ($42 retail less than 1g for my 64GB). I'm willing to bet the trend toward no removable battery or memory is money (i.e. cost of manufacture and support) not ability of the designers to execute. The trends seems to be LARGER phones (bigger screens bigger batteries).
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You knew 1MB would never suffice for a computer because you could foresee the advancements in technology requiring more space in the future. So what advancements do you see in cell-phone technology requiring 64gb, 128gb, screw it a full terabyte if storage? You might as well tell me that I'm foolish for feeling 160mph is fast enough in my car, because one day we might all be cruising at 250mph through the neighborhood. Movies arent getting any longer, songs are getting any bigger. There is no practical reason for a feature length film to be more than a couple of gigabytes since the screen size will always be less than 7".
It is precisely because phones are getting bigger that the engineering involved is getting more difficult. Special considerations have to be made when designing a battery that can be removed. It is MUCH easier for a designer if he doesnt have to worry about this. Imagine if cell-phone had removable 4G chips, video processors and ram. Do you really think the design could still be kept as portable as something like the Iphone, DNA, or SGS3? Of course not, you'd end up with a phone as big as a laptop trying to accommodate this.
RunNgun42 said:
You knew 1MB would never suffice for a computer because you could foresee the advancements in technology requiring more space in the future. So what advancements do you see in cell-phone technology requiring 64gb, 128gb, screw it a full terabyte if storage? You might as well tell me that I'm foolish for feeling 160mph is fast enough in my car, because one day we might all be cruising at 250mph through the neighborhood. Movies arent getting any longer, songs are getting any bigger. There is no practical reason for a feature length film to be more than a couple of gigabytes since the screen size will always be less than 7".
It is precisely because phones are getting bigger that the engineering involved is getting more difficult. Special considerations have to be made when designing a battery that can be removed. It is MUCH easier for a designer if he doesnt have to worry about this. Imagine if cell-phone had removable 4G chips, video processors and ram. Do you really think the design could still be kept as portable as something like the Iphone, DNA, or SGS3? Of course not, you'd end up with a phone as big as a laptop trying to accommodate this.
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Bad assumption, straw man and non sequitur
I had no special knowledge for what computer memory would be used. I only know, looking BACK at computer technology, that EVERY time someone has suggested “No one will ever need more than _____” we blew right past that without a pause. People are pretty clever in using all of a given resource. For myself I am just under 32GB used on my SD right now so 64GB I don’t have to worry about filling given my current usage model. (Which is why I stated that I could live with a 64GB fixed memory phone?) Even so 128GB devices are practically a given and 1TB is not much of a stretch. This trend will probably continue until we can fit no more into 1cm^2. What will use all of this storage? I don’t know. People are very clever in using all of a given resource however.
Does online storage and fast wireless mitigate the need for large local storage? Yes. Does it fully replace the need? No. Are data caps and overage charges making replacing local storage harder? Probably.
As for video I think your assumption of 7” is incorrect. Phones already have outputs (HDMI or the like) to drive large screens. What will those screens be in the future in size and frame rate be? HD, 2K 4K 8K? 24,30,48,60 FPS? I fully expect video files to grow.
Audio – I don’t see it changing much but perhaps bandwidth and storage will favor lossless CODECs.
Your car analogy is weak. Automobiles already operate close to the human ability to perform in many areas, portable devices… not so much. I would like to go 800 miles on a tank of gas.
I really disagree with you regarding designing for bigger vs smaller phones. A larger phone, dominated by say the display should offer more opportunity to fit things in. Of course if the wider and taller phone actually has less volume than previous phones then it would be more challenging and if it has to weigh less even with a larger volume then it may be really tough. Removable storage and batteries ARE harder to design as I said before and I fully understand that the extra cost of design and manufacture of removable storage and batteries favors the design of non-removable storage and batteries. No one mentioned changing SOC or coms or radios but that is another straw man.
Before I go on, I'm just curious, what does your 32gb of cellphone storage consist of?
The key word here is "right now."
Right now 64 GB might seem like a top end tier for mobile storage. But the DNA is 1080p resolution with more phones to likely follow suit. The files will be larger, and data consumption will increase.
Carrier networks are no longer in the unlimited era. Caps, throttling, and insanely annoying persistent wifi alerts rule the day. If carriers insist on treating network bandwidth like gold from Ft. Knox, then I'm going to want to carry more, and cloud less.
16 gigs of storage becomes 11 after OS and bloat. 11 gigs is pretty pedestrian on a device that can hold apps, movies, and songs. How long have we had iPods with more than 11 gigs in storage?
SGS 3 had it right. So does the Note 2. If I want locked down drudgery I'd buy an iPhone.
I love HTC, but they need to get somebody else making decisions over there. Carrier exclusive phones? Fail. No SD Card or removable battery? Sigh.
I'm considering a Nexus 4, but that's only because it has budget pricing, and I can use it with pre-paid service. (Read: I'm cheap)
Duely blundered from my thunderdolt.
RunNgun42 said:
Before I go on, I'm just curious, what does your 32gb of cellphone storage consist of?
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25.6GB of audio
1.1G of nandroids (each about 1Gig)
2G Ti backups, app data, app cache and system stuff
I could live with 32GB if I had to for a while at least.
If you have a few Roms you like and have nandroids of, they're almost a gig a piece.
I hate how new phones are stopping at 16 gigs with no sd slot. It's not enough memory for me, nandroids and app backups are necessary and use a lot of space.
I'm the last person I ever thought would be advocating for less storage space. Believe me I'm with you when it comes to the ignorance of people who always thought ABC/XYZ was enough. I guess a better way to justify the design of something like the Droid DNA is that it at least gets the job done. I watch tons of movies, listen to tons of music, and keep my phone docked in a cradle on my desk to surf at work all day long. I just found alternatives to storage limitation that just so happen to be the direction the industry is trying to push us in. I recognized that I dont need to have 10 movies on my device at any given moment because it's not like I'll ever really be watching them. At least not often enough to justify a need for storage to keep them. I uploaded my entire song library to Google Play which was a huge boon because now I have it with me on any device anywhere I go. I dont keep more than 1 nandroid of my device because my previous build is the only thing worth keeping. When I flash a new rom I simply keep a failsafe, and I only store about 2-3 roms on my device as redundant failsafes for each other in the event things really go sour or I just get really bored.
If this is the tradeoff necessary to have a beautiful 5" display with wireless charging and weighs light as a feather, then I consider this a win. If the alternative is a larger, heavier, more expensive phone to accommodate the best of both worlds (tons of storage and tons of power) then I consider that a loss. I will gladly take form over function since the function can be made up for in other areas that actually add quite a bit of newfound convenience. To me, this whole idea of clinging to old phone standards of sd-cards and removable batteries is just oldschool thinking. It reminds me of the business tycoon still using his monochrome blackberry thinking he's the ****, and that all these kids just dont "get it" with their fancy colors and lack of technical needs. Or the supposedly tech savvy laptop pro who buys the heaviest most impossible to carry device with a 17" screen, optical disc drive, and 10 USB ports for that 1 time he actually needs it. Everything you use your storage for is just for an emergency. 25gb of music, multiple nandroids, etc. They're all just "what if" scenarios that probably see the light of day once every few months. Sacrificing the entire build of a phone for this off-chance scenario is just very backwards thinking imo.
You dont have to believe me but the dna gets excellent battery life for a phone with a 1080p and the lack of an sd card is irrelevant since it is otg capable meaning an external hard drive can be used. The sad part is that a new one x phone is right around the corner.
Sent from my ADR6400L using Tapatalk 2
RunNgun42 said:
I'm the last person I ever thought would be advocating for less storage space. ....
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I glad you found a usage model with which you are happy. I prefer another.
Hello,
I will probably buy this phone: http://www.chinaphonereview.com/jiayu-g3t. I have a question. I read that this phone has 4gb rom, but no internal storage for new apps, downloaded from store and other websites, and so on. Is this true?
Don't buy a chinese phone,
it might have bad system software, there might be lies, you get no support and 4GB is very very low, trust me. You'll get like 2-3GB usable space and that's very small.
Daniel120201 said:
Don't buy a chinese phone,
it might have bad system software, there might be lies, you get no support and 4GB is very very low, trust me. You'll get like 2-3GB usable space and that's very small.
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My friend has Jiayu phone and it is very good. But what do you think about the internal storage?
If you want to play games or install a couple of apps 4GB is pretty low. You can put an SDcard in there but still 4GB isn't very good. MediaTek is not a great CPU either
The app storage is actually 2,5GB. Bigger apps install to sd card by default and smaller ones can be moved from settings/apps. I have all needed apps and about 4 hd games installes and still have about 1,6GB free. If you are the kind of person that installs 100+ big apps, maybe the 2,5gb could become a problem, otherwise you're ok. Oh, there's no media partition(most 4GB rom phones have only 1gb for apps) so a sd card is a must(can't even take pictures without it).
Decent phone, no lag, good camera, great screen, GPS wotks very well, GREAT battery life(for my normal usage, I get 5-7days with one charge). I suspect it should hold for 2 days even if you are a HEAVY user. The front is vey interesting, but the back is uninspiring(not ugly, just not on par with the front). No USB OTG, a bit heavy and large for a 4.5 inch screen(3000mAh battery...). Speaker(ringtones) and microphone are a bit weaker than my previous phone(Alcatel X'Pop), but they work ok.
All in all, a very decent dual-sim for the price. I love it.
I have noticed recently that some flagship phones are getting more and more RAM. Some are getting either 3Gb or 4Gb of the stuff.
At the moment my Nexus 4 and & have 2Gb of Ram respectively and neither show any signs of slowing down. However are all bets off with the new 64bit operating systems?
I am in the market for a new phone, and don't want to get sucked into the marketing Arms Race of more and more RAM as a way to make one phone look better than another.
May I ask how much is too much RAM and how much would be considered the sweetspot for an Android phone with a 64bit processor running Marshmallow and future upgrades?
Android frees up RAM on its own when it needs to. It does this by killing running processes (apps), so a phone without enough RAM will seem slow because it has to re-load the app from storage after being killed. So more RAM is always better. How much is "enough"? That all depends, of course. Like you, I've never seen any issues with my Nexus 4, nor my Galaxy S4 with 2GB RAM. And certainly not my OnePlus One with 3GB. But as screen resolution increases and apps (games, mostly) get more complex, more RAM is needed.
I'll put it this way: Your phone is a computer. I built my first PC something like 13-15 years ago. Pentium 3 450MHz, 256MB RAM, 32MB video card., and 8.4GB harddrive. I played games like Halflife, Unreal, and Thief on it. Soon, the 8.4GB HHD wasn't enough, so I got a 20 gig. Then an 80. Then a 200, and with that one, I thought "that'll be plenty for a long time". Now I've got a few TB lying around, and I need more. My phone is several times more powerful than my first PC, and that 200GB harddrive can fit in a microSD card no bigger than your fingernail.
I do think we're hitting a plateau though. A phone, while a computer, is still a phone, and not a PC, gaming laptop, or a X-Box or PS4. What's possible is what drives technology forward. But what is actually necessary might eventually drag that progress down. The last couple of years the trend hasn't been so much what the important advances are, but more what is possible for less money. OnePlus One, Moto G, all the stuff coming from China, etc. Like computers. That first PC I built cost me $2000. My new laptop was $750, and it'll play pretty much any game on the market. I don't game much anymore, so it suites my needs (but it's still pretty badass). And that doesn't even take inflation into account. We're seeing the same from smartphones. Unless you're an iDiot, you don't need to spend several hundreds of dollars to buy a phone that does everything you want and need it to. But that doesn't mean we shouldn't still advance the tech as much as we can. If anything, it makes the older tech more affordable and attainable.
RAM vs battery life
RAM is essentially required but if the platform can make the need for RAM smaller, it will be much better because it is consuming most of your battery life in standby mode.
I will go for a 2GB RAM only if the battery is more than 2500ma.
If the battery is larger, then I would like more RAM.
This is getting weirder and more complex as I read more.
I also seem to remember a while back that Android was going to make their Kit-Kat operating system more lean by using less RAM because there were a lot of budget phones and tablets hitting the shelves with limited amounts of RAM. Google didn't want an operating system to compete with Apple only to have it too bloated for the majority of the budget kit flooding the market. Microsoft's Vista suffered this problem.
But I am still non the wiser about how much is enough and how much is too much when looking for an upgrade. Up until today I would have said 1Gb was too little. This is because I have an ASUS TF300T Tablet, since 2012. In March 2014 ASUS gave it their last official update from Ice Cream Sandwich to Jelly Bean. And from that fateful upgrade, my Tablet became a sluggish pile of crap. And I wasn't alone because ASUS screwed over every TF300T user the world over. I tried a couple of unsupported operating systems (ROM's) but they were just as bad so I gave up and left it for 18 months. I simply had an expensive pile of plastic.
Today however I had another stab at looking for a new operating system. This time I have been successful in my quest as my new operating system has jumped two full incarnations, and more importantly incorporated the slimmed down use of RAM.
My three year old Tablet, which has 1Gb of RAM is now zipping along the latest-ish version of Lollipop 5.1.1.
So with no technical knowledge, am I correct in guessing that 1Gb is the minimum for Android and 3Gb is a bit excessive?