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Hello
Will the sensation be better for playing games than the SGS 2, which needs games to be updated before they can play on the mali400? I hoping apps and games don't have to be recoded/reprogrammed to work on the adreno 220, if they work/play fine on the adreno 205?
Thanks
Ian
Not 100% sure but I think the problem with the SGS2 is that the Mali400 GPU doesn't support any form of texture compression. So any games that use texture compression needs to be recompiled and have the textures modified.
The Sensation should not have the same problem since the adreno 220 is just the next gen of the 205 and should be backward compatible.
benchmark
Any new benchmarks comparing ADRENO 220 with MAli 400
i've seen a benchmark for an overclocked CPU with ADRENO 220 (clocked at 1.5 GHz). This does not give a good comparison as the real life sensation will be clocked at 1.2 GHz
Also any new overall benchmarks for the sensation, the old ones scored horrible 1200 pts. People are saying this is because the preliminary firmware is using only one core, but they did not post any reference proving their claim
RADLOUNI said:
Any new benchmarks comparing ADRENO 220 with MAli 400
i've seen a benchmark for an overclocked CPU with ADRENO 220 (clocked at 1.5 GHz). This does not give a good comparison as the real life sensation will be clocked at 1.2 GHz
Also any new overall benchmarks for the sensation, the old ones scored horrible 1200 pts. People are saying this is because the preliminary firmware is using only one core, but they did not post any reference proving their claim
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Wtf are you saying -_- ? String a complete coherent sentence together, damn no child left behind...
Sent from my LG-P999 using XDA App
RADLOUNI said:
Any new benchmarks comparing ADRENO 220 with MAli 400
i've seen a benchmark for an overclocked CPU with ADRENO 220 (clocked at 1.5 GHz). This does not give a good comparison as the real life sensation will be clocked at 1.2 GHz
Also any new overall benchmarks for the sensation, the old ones scored horrible 1200 pts. People are saying this is because the preliminary firmware is using only one core, but they did not post any reference proving their claim
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Click to collapse
What you're saying is not entirely true.
The 1.5 GHz is the chip's default speed (check Qualcomm's website) - the benchmark was of the Qualcomm development unit (MDP). The Sensation uses an underclock probably to reserve battery life.
Keep in mind, and I'm basing it entirely on tidbits I hear here and there on this forum and on tech blogs, that Qualcomm CPUs tend to get higher overclock speeds than the competition (or at least those who do it make more noise ).
As for the early benchmark - I was able to play with a similar device in question, software version 0.50.something, and yes - it was horrid. I ran Neocore just for laughs and it got 5 FPS. Later on I had a few minutes with one running 1.05 (not the final 1.20 that was leaked) and Neocore got 59.9. Wish I could upload a screenshot, but if I did I'd probably get fired (it has the confidential watermark with the serial number on it, which could than trace it directly to me).
Do take the above with a grain of salt - this is the internet and at the moment I have no way to give solid proof that what I said is true - you can just take my word for it (which if you're smart - you won't).
I will say this though - I have already pre-ordered one.
I think the Qualcomm cpus are the most efficent by far. My dhd runs undervolted all the way up to 1.2ghz and overvolts upto 1.6ghz, we have a stable 2ghz kernel atm too, my phone has never felt warm or hot. So it wouldn't surprise me if it was natural running at 1.5ghz.
Sent from my Desire HD using XDA App
Trekest said:
What you're saying is not entirely true.
The 1.5 GHz is the chip's default speed (check Qualcomm's website) - the benchmark was of the Qualcomm development unit (MDP). The Sensation uses an underclock probably to reserve battery life.
Keep in mind, and I'm basing it entirely on tidbits I hear here and there on this forum and on tech blogs, that Qualcomm CPUs tend to get higher overclock speeds than the competition (or at least those who do it make more noise ).
As for the early benchmark - I was able to play with a similar device in question, software version 0.50.something, and yes - it was horrid. I ran Neocore just for laughs and it got 5 FPS. Later on I had a few minutes with one running 1.05 (not the final 1.20 that was leaked) and Neocore got 59.9. Wish I could upload a screenshot, but if I did I'd probably get fired (it has the confidential watermark with the serial number on it, which could than trace it directly to me).
Do take the above with a grain of salt - this is the internet and at the moment I have no way to give solid proof that what I said is true - you can just take my word for it (which if you're smart - you won't).
I will say this though - I have already pre-ordered one.
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If the neocore was that fast, that'll do me nicely one other question, will the sensation struggle to play resource heavy games with the ram only being 768mb?
Thanks
Ian
Beaker491 said:
If the neocore was that fast, that'll do me nicely one other question, will the sensation struggle to play resource heavy games with the ram only being 768mb?
Thanks
Ian
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No it will not heavy emulator rely more on the CPU than the gpu. Look at computer you can have a crappy gpu and an I7 processor would play an xbox Wii emulator just fine. Mytouch 4g plays n64 emulator just fine.
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA Premium App
hmmm... honestly its what resources the games use because i have seen bench marks of the intel i5, i7 vs the amd phenom 2 x4 and the scores were quite similar because of the gpu... so i would take everything said with a bit of salt
So as you can see in my signature, I've been implied into fpse for years, before Android existed, when it was FpseCE for Windows Mobile
For people who don't know, Fpse is the best playstation emulator for Android (and WinMo of course)
Fpse has just been updated with an openGL plugin, giving impressive graphics
But here is the fact: with an Adreno 205 (example! Xperia Play), the new openGL plugin is really fast
With mali 400, it has compatibility problems, some gfx glitches, but the working games are fast
BUT on the Sensation, as well as the Evo 3D, so our Qualcomm CPU + Adreno 220 combo, it's slow !!!!!!! (for me, and reported slow by every adreno 220 users on Fpse forum so far)
Example? => games in full 3D like Tekken 3 or time crisis are more than 50% slower on a Sensation than on a Galaxy S2, a Xperia Xplay, and every other device with Adreno 205
Time crisis is exactly 66% slower on my Sensation at 1.7 Ghz than on an Xplay
(in terms of Frames Per Second, displayed by Fpse)
Forget about Gameloft games, emulation is another field, much more ressources demanding, no need to comment to say you have Angry birds or GTA3 running smooth, it's totally different.
Trying some possibilities with Schtruck (Fpse developper), trying to change some memory allocation features with modified versions of the plugin, it was impossible to improve these poor results.
So how can it be explained??? How can a single core with Adreno 205 perform better than a dual core with Adreno 220? (remind: it's also twice faster with a mali400, faster with powerVR GPU, onlt Adreno 220 is slow!)
What differences are here between Adreno 205 drivers and Adreno 220 ones?
Any hint appreciated, since I now hate my Sensation
EDIT: if you have a Sensation or an Evo3D, and have Fpse latest version with openGL plugin, please try games like Tekken 3, Gran Turismo, or another full 3D game, not an RPG like Final Fantasy, without frameskip, and repport displayed FPS. If you can go above 60 fps for Tekken 3, tell me which ROM you're using!!
My inclination is to say that the explanation is HTC. Adreno 220 itself is a pretty good GPU. HTC f***** so much up with software with the Sensation that my bet is that it's something on HTC's end that is to blame.
The Janitor Mop said:
My inclination is to say that the explanation is HTC. Adreno 220 itself is a pretty good GPU. HTC f***** so much up with software with the Sensation that my bet is that it's something on HTC's end that is to blame.
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True.harware-wise the Adreno 220 is much more powerful than the 205.
that's also Schtruck's opinion about it, the software, drivers, are full of junk.
But hell, I get about 20 fps for Tekken 3 on my Sensation when Schtruck gets about 80 !
yesterday, we tested Time Crisis 2 with same settings at the same time, he was getting 66% more fps on his Xperia Play, so depending on the games, the difference ranges from 1/2 to 1/4, that's way too much!
Did I mention that using CF3D doesn't change anything?
That really sucks! Something must be done. Schtruck will continue to look for a fix, he doesn't have an Adreno 220, I hope he will borrow one to plug the debogger while Fpse is running
i have an evo 3d and have been playing final fantasy ix which used to run terribly on version 0.10.37 for some reason. frameskip would make the game run at 60 fps however it would also make the animations all jerky. with the new version the game runs fine on soft mode but the graphics using the opengl driver are to die for! i noticed turning framelimiter off gives me around 10 more fps. i get an average of around 45-55 depending what's happening. it runs pretty well considering the graphical boost but it`s kind of aggravating knowing that adreno 205 owners are getting fps boosts! i hope this issue is fixed soon
My Xperia Play using FPSE with the opengl plugin is getting around 26-36 FPS on Gran Turismo 2 without any frameskip used, this makes the game run at approximately half speed, playable but slow motion, so no fun. With Frameskip enabled I get from 32-60 FPS, but its very choppy at times, so its like 55 on the straights, 32 on the turns etc, hard to play without feeling its having trouble.
Anyone else have numbers they can post? or advice on how I can get the smoothness and playability up so that I can enjoy the gaming with the OpenGL plugin.
RoleX1 said:
My Xperia Play using FPSE with the opengl plugin is getting around 26-36 FPS on Gran Turismo 2 without any frameskip used, this makes the game run at approximately half speed, playable but slow motion, so no fun. With Frameskip enabled I get from 32-60 FPS, but its very choppy at times, so its like 55 on the straights, 32 on the turns etc, hard to play without feeling its having trouble.
Anyone else have numbers they can post? or advice on how I can get the smoothness and playability up so that I can enjoy the gaming with the OpenGL plugin.
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Can you tell me your ROM (and Android base) ? So that I can compare to Schtruck's Xplay, he has really better results it seems.
i900frenchaddict said:
that's also Schtruck's opinion about it, the software, drivers, are full of junk.
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This seems to have been true for years.
I remember reading an article a while ago about HTC's Windows Mobile graphic drivers and how poor they were even then.
If I find it I'll post it here.
Edit: Found them!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HTC_TyTN_II#Video_driver_issues
http://www.engadget.com/2008/01/25/htc-further-responds-to-video-driver-issue-will-improve-future/
any updates on opengl for the 220?
Try different opengl drivers or a true senseless rom
There's a new forum thread on FPSE about OpenGL. Go to the FPSE forums and search for "Understanding FPSE and PEOpS OpenGL"
(I'm still a new member so I can't post links).
The issue with the 220 seems to have come up again, and doing a quick search in the fpse forums shows a couple people commenting on it over the last couple months.
I'm going to add it to a new section in my main post about hardware. Also, I'll see if I can get more info from schtruck and i900frenchaddict.
Question: how do you use a different driver? I'm not aware of anyway to change the driver on non-rooted phones other than updates from the manufacturer. And, on rooted phone, I'm not sure that different drivers exist - do they? I think the only option is other ROMs or apps like chainfire 3d
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1643472
Howdy everyone,
i happened to come across an app on the market called CPU Gauge and this demonstrates to you exactly what each core on your phone is doing at all times, even in your notification bar at all times. Now i have noticed no matter what i do there only ever seems to be 1 core running which is pretty pants i reckon. how can i enable it to run dual cores all of the time? i dont understand it personally, why have a dual channel architecture if its hardly ever used? and surely it having to decide whether to use one core over two and to send data down both channels or just the one is probably a reason why we get lag? i am probably completely wrong but id rather the cpus always be on and drain battery if it improves overall performance
androidfanboi said:
Howdy everyone,
i happened to come across an app on the market called CPU Gauge and this demonstrates to you exactly what each core on your phone is doing at all times, even in your notification bar at all times. Now i have noticed no matter what i do there only ever seems to be 1 core running which is pretty pants i reckon. how can i enable it to run dual cores all of the time? i dont understand it personally, why have a dual channel architecture if its hardly ever used? and surely it having to decide whether to use one core over two and to send data down both channels or just the one is probably a reason why we get lag? i am probably completely wrong but id rather the cpus always be on and drain battery if it improves overall performance
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Though a mod will move this thread please post questions in the general section this is for development purposes only..
But if what you say is true i will have to look into this. What rom are you currently running?
Just a rooted/overclocked LG stock gingerbread rom.
For me it shows 2 Cores working ,but second is ON only when needed (as it should be) So its OK. Lags are because of poor ram managment on LG software, I recommend Rushdroid ROM.
What I know, Android 2.3 and below does not provide a support for multi cores. However, ICS does support it. So, I think the phone will run much better when the ICS update comes.
abo_mara7 said:
What I know, Android 2.3 and below does not provide a support for multi cores. However, ICS does support it. So, I think the phone will run much better when the ICS update comes.
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nope. thasts only an urban legend But it can improve performance at some points, but I would be rather sceptic. Custom roms must be always better (what they are doing making software, making it slower on purpose? go Samsung way and hire cm team members)
In games it uses both cores but im dissapointed that when testing swapping between different apps and web browsing seemed to all be using just the one core, and that was with lags inbetween swapping from for instance gallery to browser. I love this phone great specs but it annoys me more and more to think LG really did have no clue when it came down to putting it all into action. is there any way to have 2 cores on at all times or atleast change the values that decide when to use second core/channel.
If anything it makes for an interesting discussion
IFLPI said:
nope. thasts only an urban legend But it can improve performance at some points, but I would be rather sceptic. Custom roms must be always better (what they are doing making software, making it slower on purpose? go Samsung way and hire cm team members)
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It has a partial support, not 100%, and the proof is that all dual core phones which received ICD update, got a huge improvement in the performance, as their users said.
androidfanboi said:
In games it uses both cores but im dissapointed that when testing swapping between different apps and web browsing seemed to all be using just the one core, and that was with lags inbetween swapping from for instance gallery to browser. I love this phone great specs but it annoys me more and more to think LG really did have no clue when it came down to putting it all into action. is there any way to have 2 cores on at all times or atleast change the values that decide when to use second core/channel.
If anything it makes for an interesting discussion
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The processor works as it should be, all cores when needed. Check System Panel app. Ram is the issue here. On stock it will be always laggy. On rushdroid and samba there is good ram management. Almost 250mb for the user. On stock i doubt if there is 130mb free available.
@up: there is no evidence that GB supports 1 core only and ICS multiple cores. A better performance on ICS can be due to the bigger optimizations, and hw support (that can be buggy) like gpu enabled scrolling etc.
But Ive heard that ics supports fully multicores, and that is an urban legend for me (no evidence) Ics can be just more optimized than gingerbread (and more like honeycomb which was quite fast)
IFLPI said:
The processor works as it should be, all cores when needed. Check System Panel app. Ram is the issue here. On stock it will be always laggy. On rushdroid and samba there is good ram management. Almost 250mb for the user. On stock i doubt if there is 130mb free available.
@up: there is no evidence that GB supports 1 core only and ICS multiple cores. A better performance on ICS can be due to the bigger optimizations, and hw support (that can be buggy) like gpu enabled scrolling etc.
But Ive heard that ics supports fully multicores, and that is an urban legend for me (no evidence) Ics can be just more optimized than gingerbread (and more like honeycomb which was quite fast)
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you are correct cores are working as they should be not a problem here at... Gingerbread supports multicore and does use the cpu to the max when needed, you don't need to run both your cores all the time if that was the case you would need to charge your phone every 3 hours....
The issue with our optimus 3d is it needs ram tweaks to keep it smooth, 512mb ram is good i am not complaining because it's dual channel and so on so the ram speed is amazing just to free up ram we have tweaks...
Also the cpu is used to the max when needed, when you make a call you do not need both cores working at the same time that would be pointless. But when you play games, browse the net and bench your device all cores are used at the same time...
if you want to try it (see the difference) with both cores enabled ,(and cpu speed at max) try system tuner app , in cpu setting put governor to "performance" the first core will go to max speed , then go to active tweak and there is an option to force all cpu on , try it , it will be hard for the battery... when you put governor back to hotplug , the second core will return on demand (on/off) . if you want to do it again after you have to redo all step and turn the force all cpu on off and on again...
i'm on v21D on rushdroid 3.6.3. Both cores show up as working. 1 core ususally hits 1.4ghz and 2nd one upto 1ghz during regular processing. Great app btw tnx for letting us know
Which kernel you use on rushdroid @1,4ghz?
IFLPI said:
Which kernel you use on rushdroid @1,4ghz?
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Titan kernal v21d
Sent from my LG-P920h using XDA
Its not neccessary to use dual core all the times ,using dual core for small task degrade the performance that increasing. Since our phone have dual memory the cache plays an important role in deciding which core should be used.
recently i came across overlocking GPU.. in sense4a built by derefas made GPU overlocked to 220 n he mensioned that its safe.. is i dont think it wont create any problem.. some problem ll exist.. can anybody know that problem?? and overlocking to 220 means now we have adreno220 ?? is it like dat?? n i google it but i saw that for adreno220 it clock speed would be 1.2Ghz to 1.5GHz(acc. to this site - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imageon). so that rom has gpu overlocked n cpu optional, it means iguess it make some problem.. can anybody explain me pros n cons..:fingers-crossed:
shree alwaz said:
recently i came across overlocking GPU.. in sense4a built by derefas made GPU overlocked to 220 n he mensioned that its safe.. is i dont think it wont create any problem.. some problem ll exist.. can anybody know that problem?? and overlocking to 220 means now we have adreno220 ?? is it like dat?? n i google it but i saw that for adreno220 it clock speed would be 1.2Ghz to 1.5GHz(acc. to this site - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imageon). so that rom has gpu overlocked n cpu optional, it means iguess it make some problem.. can anybody explain me pros n cons..:fingers-crossed:
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I have the same query... If it's safe then the work is remarkable:thumbup:
Sent from my HTC Explorer A310e
arey nobody knows about this.. how can know??
All that a newbie could get.
can anybody know that problem??
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The dev's have had their phone's NAND memory fried due to overclocking the Processor. I don't have info about the GPU.
and overlocking to 220 means now we have adreno220 ?? is it like dat??
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No, it ain't like that. The chip is embedded, and can't change.
Our Chipset is MSM7225A (according to http://pdadb.net/index.php?m=specs&id=3073&c=htc_explorer_htc_pico) and the GPU supported is Adreno 200 (enhanced) according to (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snapdragon_(system_on_chip)).
The Adreno 200 was said to support the following in the wikipedia site.
Adreno 200 (AMD Z430) inside the QSD8x50 (1 GHz) and MSM7x27 (600 MHz A11+L2 cache). It offers a programmable function pipeline and streaming textures with support for OpenGL ES 2.0, OpenGL ES 1.1, OpenVG 1.1, EGL 1.4, Direct3D Mobile, SVGT 1.2 and DirectDraw. (22M triangles/second, 133M pixels/second, clock speed up to 128 MHz).
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Even some googling didn't help in finding the clocking speed of our GPU. According to wikipedia, it supports 128 MHz.
Note that it was for the devices QSD8x50 (1 GHz) and MSM7x27.
But, an enhanced GPU is supported in our Chip. So, I got the following info from the Qualcomm website.
Adreno™ 200 is the first OGLES 2.0 GPU with unified shader architecture and makes maximum use of the graphics processing power of the GPU. This GPU is a leap forward in visual graphics quality from OpenGL-Es 1.x, which enables developers to implement effects that were previously a daunting task. APIs supported include OpenGL ES 2.0, OpenGL ES 1.1, OpenVG 1.1, EGL 1.3, Direct3D Mobile, SVGT 1.2 and DirectDraw. The Adreno 200 delivers streaming textures to combine Video, Camera, SVG and other image surfaces with 3D graphics. It also enables concurrent CPU, DSP, Graphics, and MDP and includes a programmable function graphics pipeline.
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And, so, I summarized that an enhanced GPU, in our chip, has a normal clocking speed of around 200 MHz, and it can be overclocked. How this is done, and all the other stuff, the developers might help you. And, if its safe... I also read that overclocking a little wouldn't harm. So, I guess it's safe.
Anyways, the Pros are that you would get a little extra fps, so you could "expect" a little improvement in gaming and video playback.
The Cons... Well, anyone using an overclocked GPU for long might know.
vineethraj49 said:
The dev's have had their phone's NAND memory fried due to overclocking the Processor. I don't have info about the GPU.
No, it ain't like that. The chip is embedded, and can't change.
Our Chipset is MSM7225A (according to http://pdadb.net/index.php?m=specs&id=3073&c=htc_explorer_htc_pico) and the GPU supported is Adreno 200 (enhanced) according to (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Snapdragon_(system_on_chip)).
The Adreno 200 was said to support the following in the wikipedia site.
Even some googling didn't help in finding the clocking speed of our GPU. According to wikipedia, it supports 128 MHz.
Note that it was for the devices QSD8x50 (1 GHz) and MSM7x27.
But, an enhanced GPU is supported in our Chip. So, I got the following info from the Qualcomm website.
And, so, I summarized that an enhanced GPU, in our chip, has a normal clocking speed of around 200 MHz, and it can be overclocked. How this is done, and all the other stuff, the developers might help you. And, if its safe... I also read that overclocking a little wouldn't harm. So, I guess it's safe.
Anyways, the Pros are that you would get a little extra fps, so you could "expect" a little improvement in gaming and video playback.
The Cons... Well, anyone using an overclocked GPU for long might know.
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yea.. actually.. i dint understand what is mean by GPU OC.. how it ll improves the gaming performance??
Maybe if its highly OC'd, then...
shree alwaz said:
yea.. actually.. i dint understand what is mean by GPU OC.. how it ll improves the gaming performance??
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If the fps increases a lot, then, gaming and video playback might improve.
shree alwaz said:
yea.. actually.. i dint understand what is mean by GPU OC.. how it ll improves the gaming performance??
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When overclocked the textures are rendered little quicker than normal clocking. It won't double the frame rate as some guy doubted. Look at the details of our CPU and gpu.
http://pdadb.net/index.php?m=cpu&id=a7225a&c=qualcomm_msm7225a
Sent from my HTC Explorer using xda app-developers app
I am currently loading old school gaming roms on my phone and soon to be tablet. Years ago I had n64 roms and they were laggy, I figured years later they would run without a hitch, not so much.
Here is what I am running.
Verizon Droid RAZR HD
Micro SD (class 4) 32GB
Snapdragon S4 MSM8960
CPU 1.5 GHz dual-core Krait
GPU Adreno 225
Memory 1GB Dual-channel, 500 MHz LPDDR2 RAM
I am running the standard vanilla rom so it's stock with Verizons bloatware, so I now a bit of lag could rest there.
I am looking to buy a cheaper android tablet that will run Ps1/N64 games without a hitch if possible. I guess what I am wondering is what controls ROM's lag, is it the GPU? Memory? Processor? The ROM/Program itself? I am wondering what hardware (if any) runs these without major issues.
Thanks a ton guys, very happy to help join the ranks. If I missed a thread that covers this please point me in the right direction!
Bumb this should be easy...