Greetings. I just picked up a used MT4GS because I had to have a hwkbd and want to get it into top fighting condition. I've read through the posts on Bulletproof and MikTouch ROMs and am trying to understand what the real differences are. I'd appreciate any comments on features that one has that the other doesn't.
So far i have been able to determine:
In MikTouch, the screen capture is broken
This is my first Android phone, so i'm lacking context to understand a lot of the descriptions of changes.
Thanks
This phone is an oldie but a goodie, and welcome to the board.
I just came off of miktouch, which is a clean sense experience, but I was getting reboots on this ROM (don't know why, could have been a problem on my end). My understanding is the miktouch is slightly newer than bulletproof, and is based on a newer HTC firmware (this is for the version 0.7 miktouch, which is the most recent and the one you want to use).
If you need sense, then I think this is a good rom, but probably either one is good. They are both widely reported as stable, so I am not sure if my own experience regarding reboots is just a rare exception.
If you are not committed to the sense framework, I highly recommend scverhagen's CM9.1, which is very solid in my experience. I have used v12 for at least a month, and v13 came out yesterday, and is so far (knock wood) rock solid.
There are quite a few CM10.X variations available, and I've tried several. In my experience (and on my device) they are not as completely rock solid as the CM9.1, which is the only reason I am not using one as a DD. That said, they are quite mature, and are in wide use by many who want to be on the later CM versions.
nosuchfile said:
If you are not committed to the sense framework, I highly recommend scverhagen's CM9.1, which is very solid in my experience. I have used v12 for at least a month, and v13 came out yesterday, and is so far (knock wood) rock solid.
There are quite a few CM10.X variations available, and I've tried several. In my experience (and on my device) they are not as completely rock solid as the CM9.1, which is the only reason I am not using one as a DD. That said, they are quite mature, and are in wide use by many who want to be on the later CM versions.
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Click to collapse
Thanks for your comments. Having almost no experience with Android, i don't really know if i object to the Sense overlay or not. I have read that losing Sense loses a lot of the capabilities of the camera, and the camera is the other reason i got this phone (with the keyboard).
Anyway, i just finished unlocking the phone now. Did you get S-Off on yours?
Flandry said:
Thanks for your comments. Having almost no experience with Android, i don't really know if i object to the Sense overlay or not. I have read that losing Sense loses a lot of the capabilities of the camera, and the camera is the other reason i got this phone (with the keyboard).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I believe that was once true, but I think most of the camera issues have since been solved. I don't use the high end functions of the camera much. I think also there were some problems with 1080p video, which have also since been solved.
The CM roms are based off of the google android base code, and so they are able to work with certain apps that may not work with the version on which both bulletproof and miktouch are based, which is version gingerbread, android 2.3. CM 9.1 is based on android 4.0 (icecream sandwich). and CM 10.X is based on android 4.1-4.3. Chrome browser requires min android 4.0, and is probably the best browser.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Android_version_history
Flandry said:
Anyway, i just finished unlocking the phone now. Did you get S-Off on yours?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, I did S-off mine. There is a post that describes the procedure using a wire to short between a spare uSD card and a very small hole at a precise time. The S-off is somewhat handy as it eliminates one step in flashing ROMs, namely, extracting a file from the ROM and separately flashing that single file (using fastboot) after flashing the ROM itself the 'normal' way, but is not necessary, and I would not suggest it as it is kind of tricky (but if you feel lucky...). I think it took me around 20 tries to finally get it right.
Hope this helps, and I would suggest starting with CM 9.1, as it will give you a more 'pure' android experience. Although some do like the Sense overlay, I don't care for it, and it is a lot less customizable.
Yes, the original sense camera produced excellent photos and videos, especially in low light, which I've never matched with others since. One person (can't remember who) who used later ROMs on a daily basis said he used to swap back to sense whenever he wanted to use the camera at a particular event. So I guess that's another option for you. For me, I've stuck mainly with CM9.1 for daily use (camera wasn't central to my 'buy' decision), and dabbled with other ROMs evenings and weekends.
davidf9 said:
Yes, the original sense camera produced excellent photos and videos, especially in low light, which I've never matched with others since. One person (can't remember who) who used later ROMs on a daily basis said he used to swap back to sense whenever he wanted to use the camera at a particular event. So I guess that's another option for you. For me, I've stuck mainly with CM9.1 for daily use (camera wasn't central to my 'buy' decision), and dabbled with other ROMs evenings and weekends.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you. I actually did a simple comparison (talk.maemo .org /showpost.php?p=1378114&postcount=27) between the camera and my previous phone's camera to see which handled low light better, and my results agree with your experience. This is a pretty high priority for me.
I think your comments confirm for me that i do want to stick with GB + Sense for now. That brings me back to the OP though. From reading through the threads for the respective ROMs i think i have another difference:
* Bulletproof has a more colorful customized theme/paradigm.
* Bulletproof has some geeky utilities like bash shell and nano editor
Still wondering about substantive differences. I'll probably flash Bulletproof unless i hear of any disadvantages of it relative to Miktouch.
Edit: meh can't post links blah blah.
Fuzi0719 said:
... For an updated version, try the Miktouch ROM. It is based on the last HTC stock ROM, 1.63.531.2 and thus has a bit better performance in several key areas (GPS, Bluetooth, WiFi) and has more updated tweaks, as well. Bulletproof is based on the original stock ROM.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
siani_8 said:
As a long time Bulletproof user and probably the biggest Bulletproof cheerleader from day one, I will agree that the MikTouch ROM is a smoother experience.
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Click to collapse
Hmm i thought that the fixes had gotten incorporated in Bulletproof in the later revision (1.1). :/
From what I read on another forum, Bloater is no longer being developed or supported.
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Click to collapse
This may be a problem because i need e.g. Exchange Mail and i read that it's been removed in the custom ROMs.
Well i've used clockworkmod recovery to make a nandroid of the stock system and have flashed Bulletproof 1.1 and the UV5 undervolting kernel. I'll see if it can be made to do what i want/need. Kudos to WeekendsR2Short for archiving the files so they are still available and to the hackers who put the ROM together.
I'm still looking for comments on current, real differences between the two ROMs, particularly from those in the know about whether there are meaningful differences in performance due to the origin of each. I would expect the fixes that went into the later stock ROMs also could be incorporated into Bulletproof, regardless of whether it was based on that ROM, but were they? I see guides from Blue6 on tweaks for network performance and GPS performance, so it seems he was aware of the issues.
Edit: I don't have working wifi so i'm guessing a custom kernel is a no go without S-off. That's what i thought but then i couldn't understand how people can run ICS without S-off. Obviously my assumptions are wrong somewhere... I'll reflash the boot image from Bulletproof 1.1.
Flandry said:
Well i've used clockworkmod recovery to make a nandroid of the stock system and have flashed Bulletproof 1.1 and the UV5 undervolting kernel. I'll see if it can be made to do what i want/need. Kudos to WeekendsR2Short for archiving the files so they are still available and to the hackers who put the ROM together.
I'm still looking for comments on current, real differences between the two ROMs, particularly from those in the know about whether there are meaningful differences in performance due to the origin of each. I would expect the fixes that went into the later stock ROMs also could be incorporated into Bulletproof, regardless of whether it was based on that ROM, but were they? I see guides from Blue6 on tweaks for network performance and GPS performance, so it seems he was aware of the issues.
Edit: I don't have working wifi so i'm guessing a custom kernel is a no go without S-off. That's what i thought but then i couldn't understand how people can run ICS without S-off. Obviously my assumptions are wrong somewhere... I'll reflash the boot image from Bulletproof 1.1.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bulletproof 1.1 is still based on the original stock ROM (1.28), whereas Miktouch is based on the 1.63 release. In the 1.63 release, HTC made some major improvements in GPS, Bluetooth, and overall smoothness of the ROM as well as closed some security issues. Miktouch retains all the base stuff, including the Genius subsystem. By default, however, the Genius button has been remapped to do search, but there is a small patch that can be applied to revert the mapping back to the Genius function.
I've tried Bulletproof and though it is very stable, I still prefer Miktouch. It just seems more "fluid", especially with the patches like Liquidsmooth Rosie, and No-scrolling Cache. I also like the CM9.1 version from sverhagen, now on r13 release. It is very stable and works very well.
But, as others have stated, if the camera is very important, only the stock-based ROMs like Miktouch are going to give you 100% of what this phone can do. That's because HTC put a lot of the control of the image processor directly into the Sense framework, which of course is lacking in other ROMs. Other ROMs can access basic functions and do processing using the CPU, but cannot access some of the higher functions of the dedicated image processor. The CM9.1 camera is good, but if you look at photos side-by-side with those taken with Miktouch, for instance, you can see a difference in depth of field, exposure, lighting, compression. It is subtle, but visible. Most people probably would not care or even notice, so it is a personal choice.
Fuzi0719 said:
Bulletproof 1.1 is still based on the original stock ROM (1.28), whereas Miktouch is based on the 1.63 release. In the 1.63 release, HTC made some major improvements in GPS, Bluetooth, and overall smoothness of the ROM as well as closed some security issues. Miktouch retains all the base stuff, including the Genius subsystem. By default, however, the Genius button has been remapped to do search, but there is a small patch that can be applied to revert the mapping back to the Genius function.
I've tried Bulletproof and though it is very stable, I still prefer Miktouch. It just seems more "fluid", especially with the patches like Liquidsmooth Rosie, and No-scrolling Cache. I also like the CM9.1 version from sverhagen, now on r13 release. It is very stable and works very well.
But, as others have stated, if the camera is very important, only the stock-based ROMs like Miktouch are going to give you 100% of what this phone can do. That's because HTC put a lot of the control of the image processor directly into the Sense framework, which of course is lacking in other ROMs. Other ROMs can access basic functions and do processing using the CPU, but cannot access some of the higher functions of the dedicated image processor. The CM9.1 camera is good, but if you look at photos side-by-side with those taken with Miktouch, for instance, you can see a difference in depth of field, exposure, lighting, compression. It is subtle, but visible. Most people probably would not care or even notice, so it is a personal choice.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Best description of the differences between Miktouch and Bulletproof I've read on the XDA forums! :good:
Thanks
Fuzi0719 said:
Bulletproof 1.1 is still based on the original stock ROM (1.28), whereas Miktouch is based on the 1.63 release. In the 1.63 release, HTC made some major improvements in GPS, Bluetooth, and overall smoothness of the ROM as well as closed some security issues. Miktouch retains all the base stuff, including the Genius subsystem. By default, however, the Genius button has been remapped to do search, but there is a small patch that can be applied to revert the mapping back to the Genius function.
I've tried Bulletproof and though it is very stable, I still prefer Miktouch. It just seems more "fluid", especially with the patches like Liquidsmooth Rosie, and No-scrolling Cache. I also like the CM9.1 version from sverhagen, now on r13 release. It is very stable and works very well.
But, as others have stated, if the camera is very important, only the stock-based ROMs like Miktouch are going to give you 100% of what this phone can do. That's because HTC put a lot of the control of the image processor directly into the Sense framework, which of course is lacking in other ROMs. Other ROMs can access basic functions and do processing using the CPU, but cannot access some of the higher functions of the dedicated image processor. The CM9.1 camera is good, but if you look at photos side-by-side with those taken with Miktouch, for instance, you can see a difference in depth of field, exposure, lighting, compression. It is subtle, but visible. Most people probably would not care or even notice, so it is a personal choice.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks, that's a very useful summary.
OT:
I flashed the MikTouch 0.7 ROM and most of the patches that you uploaded in its thread. What difference do you see with the MikTouch-No-Scrolling-Cache patch? From my understanding of scrolling caches, disabling them would make it less smooth rather than more.
Answering my own question (OP):
Now that i have flashed both ROMs i can mostly answer my own question about the differences. As i had guessed from my reading, Bulletproof is a more complete or thorough mod. It provides some nice options for the quick settings and the status icons that sit at the top right. It has cut out most of the extra apps, and hidden the Kid's Zone icon. It has a custom theme and keeps the other themes.
A brief play with some network access suggests that MikTouch may be smoother more optimized due to its more updated origins. On the other hand, it feels less cohesive and polished.
It might be summed up by saying that, in terms of visible modifications, Bulletproof goes overboard, while MikTouch isn't quite enough.
So if Bulletproof were based on the latest stock ROM and wasn't missing a couple "bloatware" features that i want to keep, i would reflash it now. Because it's not, i'll give MikTouch a go for a while.
I'm trying to establish, as much as possible, the functionality my Maemo device had. I'm going to post my progress here for any to whom it might be useful.
notes
I've copied my Conboy notes to Tomdroid, but the ancient stable version doesn't support editing and the beta version (0.7.2) corrupts notes with bulleted lists. I really liked Conboy, so i hope the devs can get things sorted. Development seems to be really slow, which surprises me considering the popularity of Tomboy.
terminal
I encountered the hilarious problem with Terminal Emulator that others have: the forward slash key (of all things) only produces tildes, making the hwkb completely useless for terminal work. Someone suggested a Connectbot connection to local, and that versatile little app seems like a little slice of home coming from a linux environment. You can put an icon on your desktop that will open you right to that connection, too.
I'm still trying to figure out the best way to modify my keyboard mapping. I'd like to make the www. a Tab and repurpose the android keys and extra (right) shift, perhaps as arrows and a CTRL. The spacebar is also obnoxiously out of reach so i might move it to the Back key. Fortunately, Connectbot has some sensible workarounds that make these changes less urgent.
I have the latest ES File Explorer but the locked down nature of Android seems to make any kind of file system activities hopelessly complicated compared with a more conventional linux system. I was trying to install this nano editor binary but am not sure if remounting root R/W and unzipping it to / is going to cause issues.
spreadsheet
I've been using gnumeric on my N900. TBD
e-reader
FB Reader and PDF reader on the N900. TBD
offline maps
Used Modrana and Navit on N900. Both have strengths and weaknesses. TBD
misc.
It's nice that Flashlight is pre-loaded but i can't see any way to leave it on while i do something else on the phone. I think the custom setting in the quick settings of Bulletproof could do that. :/ It is a nice bright flash we have here.
The stock camera app combines the functionality of three separate apps on N900: BlessN900, Panorama, and the stock camera app, and in a much snappier interface, albeit with fewer options. I'm excited about that. I need to find an app that will simulate a scan from a photo (perspective correction), though.
Offline dictionary, wikipedia, and a gps recorder are also needed. TBD
Of course, porting a few classic games and apps (e.g. Doom, Starcon2, Gweled, MAME) with a few hours work each isn't going to happen in Android like it did with Maemo and its SDL framework. The ability to achieve feature parity ends with the software selection...
Will edit when i have made more progress.
ETA: I have S-OFF now. I thought i could leave it alone until i tired of GB and/or stock kernel, but i should have known better. I used my Linux Mint14 (64 bit) box, a random USB cable (original HTC one is presumably with the original owner), and a twist-tie, and to be safe i flashed back my nandroid of stock first. After all the wind up about original this, 32 bit os, and precise that, i got it on the first try and it didn't wipe my SD card.
First thing i did is flash a custom splash screen. I made one and it was realizing it wouldn't work without S-OFF that pushed me over the edge.
Flandry said:
I'm trying to establish, as much as possible, the functionality my Maemo device had. I'm going to post my progress here for any to whom it might be useful.
notes
I've copied my Conboy notes to Tomdroid, but the ancient stable version doesn't support editing and the beta version (0.7.2) corrupts notes with bulleted lists. I really liked Conboy, so i hope the devs can get things sorted. Development seems to be really slow, which surprises me considering the popularity of Tomboy.
terminal
I encountered the hilarious problem with Terminal Emulator that others have: the forward slash key (of all things) only produces tildes, making the hwkb completely useless for terminal work. Someone suggested a Connectbot connection to local, and that versatile little app seems like a little slice of home coming from a linux environment. You can put an icon on your desktop that will open you right to that connection, too.
I'm still trying to figure out the best way to modify my keyboard mapping. I'd like to make the www. a Tab and repurpose the android keys and extra (right) shift, perhaps as arrows and a CTRL. The spacebar is also obnoxiously out of reach so i might move it to the Back key. Fortunately, Connectbot has some sensible workarounds that make these changes less urgent.
I have the latest ES File Explorer but the locked down nature of Android seems to make any kind of file system activities hopelessly complicated compared with a more conventional linux system. I was trying to install this nano editor binary but am not sure if remounting root R/W and unzipping it to / is going to cause issues.
spreadsheet
I've been using gnumeric on my N900. TBD
e-reader
FB Reader and PDF reader on the N900. TBD
offline maps
Used Modrana and Navit on N900. Both have strengths and weaknesses. TBD
misc.
It's nice that Flashlight is pre-loaded but i can't see any way to leave it on while i do something else on the phone. I think the custom setting in the quick settings of Bulletproof could do that. :/ It is a nice bright flash we have here.
The stock camera app combines the functionality of three separate apps on N900: BlessN900, Panorama, and the stock camera app, and in a much snappier interface, albeit with fewer options. I'm excited about that. I need to find an app that will simulate a scan from a photo (perspective correction), though.
Offline dictionary, wikipedia, and a gps recorder are also needed. TBD
Of course, porting a few classic games and apps (e.g. Doom, Starcon2, Gweled, MAME) with a few hours work each isn't going to happen in Android like it did with Maemo and its SDL framework. The ability to achieve feature parity ends with the software selection...
Will edit when i have made more progress.
ETA: I have S-OFF now. I thought i could leave it alone until i tired of GB and/or stock kernel, but i should have known better. I used my Linux Mint14 (64 bit) box, a random USB cable (original HTC one is presumably with the original owner), and a twist-tie, and to be safe i flashed back my nandroid of stock first. After all the wind up about original this, 32 bit os, and precise that, i got it on the first try and it didn't wipe my SD card.
First thing i did is flash a custom splash screen. I made one and it was realizing it wouldn't work without S-OFF that pushed me over the edge.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not sure what your needs are as for a notes app, but I use the one HTC included in the ROM simply called Notes. It can import/export but I haven't used that feature or know the format. Also, Adobe PDF reader comes with the ROM, too. These are both in Miktouch. I have also run into that keyboard issue with Terminal, someone posted a revised Terminal app that fixed that issue but now I don't know where it is located. Perhaps look around on the Play Store. As to spreadsheets and other office-type apps, QuickOffice is now owned by Google and was made free in the Play Store. It can read/write most MS Office documents. And Google Maps now has the feature of storing offline maps for when you don't have network access.
Fuzi0719 said:
Not sure what your needs are as for a notes app, but I use the one HTC included in the ROM simply called Notes. It can import/export but I haven't used that feature or know the format. Also, Adobe PDF reader comes with the ROM, too. These are both in Miktouch. I have also run into that keyboard issue with Terminal, someone posted a revised Terminal app that fixed that issue but now I don't know where it is located. Perhaps look around on the Play Store. As to spreadsheets and other office-type apps, QuickOffice is now owned by Google and was made free in the Play Store. It can read/write most MS Office documents. And Google Maps now has the feature of storing offline maps for when you don't have network access.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah i had just discovered QuickOffice was free after finding the usual subjects (Gnu apps, OO, etc) aren't available and presumably decent since Google decided to buy it. I vaguely remember there being a QuickOffice on my Handera(?) a decade ago. Wonder if it's the same thing.
The attention to detail in the ConnectBot app makes it actually possible to hack system files, and its support for copy and paste, combined with that nano binary i got installed, lets me copy-paste text into files. The lack of universal clipboard and general lack of time-honored keyboard shortcuts is driving me up the wall. I sure took that for granted on maemo. Android just isn't designed with a hardware keyboard in mind. :/
Nano is super flaky with poor refresh, and without keyboard arrows it's a bit hard to use. It would be impossible without ConnectBot's workaround for lack of CTRL, though. Can anyone recommend a good simple GUI text editor for editing config files etc.? One that supports copy/paste, unlike that half-assed ES File Explorer note editor atrocity.
Anyway, I used the above setup to make the changes to the gps.conf file recommended here.
I'm also finding the long-press on Home is a passable imitation of the camera-button or CTRL-BACKSPACE shortcut to task switcher on the N900 too.
I'm going to give the Sneaky Pete kernel a try now.
Flandry said:
Yeah i had just discovered QuickOffice was free after finding the usual subjects (Gnu apps, OO, etc) aren't available and presumably decent since Google decided to buy it. I vaguely remember there being a QuickOffice on my Handera(?) a decade ago. Wonder if it's the same thing.
The attention to detail in the ConnectBot app makes it actually possible to hack system files, and its support for copy and paste, combined with that nano binary i got installed, lets me copy-paste text into files. The lack of universal clipboard and general lack of time-honored keyboard shortcuts is driving me up the wall. I sure took that for granted on maemo. Android just isn't designed with a hardware keyboard in mind. :/
Nano is super flaky with poor refresh, and without keyboard arrows it's a bit hard to use. It would be impossible without ConnectBot's workaround for lack of CTRL, though. Can anyone recommend a good simple GUI text editor for editing config files etc.? One that supports copy/paste, unlike that half-assed ES File Explorer note editor atrocity.
Anyway, I used the above setup to make the changes to the gps.conf file recommended here.
I'm also finding the long-press on Home is a passable imitation of the camera-button or CTRL-BACKSPACE shortcut to task switcher on the N900 too.
I'm going to give the Sneaky Pete kernel a try now.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
For hacking system files, an easy app to use is Kernel Tuner. Even though I'm using the stock kernel on Miktouch, I use Kernel Tuner to set my min CPU and governor (I have 1134 max/192 min and conservative governor on both cores) and I set the I/O scheduler to noop with a 2048kb cache. The app has the built in ability to make edits to system files and is geared for Sense ROMs.
Also, you might want to download/install the newer Swype keyboard from Play Store. It is newer/better than the Swype that is built in to the HTC ROM. The built in Swype can be disabled (I use MyBackup Pro to freeze certain things that are built in, like the Group messaging and Tmobile ID stuff that I never use).
Flandry said:
)
The attention to detail in the ConnectBot app makes it actually possible to hack system files, and its support for copy and paste, combined with that nano binary i got installed, lets me copy-paste text into files. The lack of universal clipboard and general lack of time-honored keyboard shortcuts is driving me up the wall. I sure took that for granted on maemo. Android just isn't designed with a hardware keyboard in mind. :/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Have you found some of Blue6ix' posts yet? He listed ways to remap the keys to whatever you wanted, and I seem to recall keyboard shortcuts was one of the things lamented when he moved to a phone without a hardware keyboard. (though I don't use shortcuts myself so can't say more)
davidf9 said:
Have you found some of Blue6ix' posts yet? He listed ways to remap the keys to whatever you wanted, and I seem to recall keyboard shortcuts was one of the things lamented when he moved to a phone without a hardware keyboard. (though I don't use shortcuts myself so can't say more)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah that's what i linked to a few posts back when i mentioned it. I've spent a while playing around with it now that i have a functioning nano editor and bash. I found, to my disappointment, that CTRL can't be used as a modifier until Android 3. At least that's what i gathered. The amount of conflicting information on every thing i search for is mind-boggling, both due to vendor and device differences and android API differences, i assume. Anyway, no CTRL isn't too big of a deal since the standard CTRL-+ shortcuts aren't really standard on it, and VX Connectbot makes it easy to generate CTRL+? inputs. I switched to VX, an improved Connectbot fork, when i realized i had no way to generate angle brackets or pipe characters. VX Connectbot enables the SYM selector pop-up and and lets you map most buttons. It's really quite nice.
The more amusing/aggravating thing i discovered is that if you map a key to TAB, it actually is "symlinked" to DPAD_DOWN (keycode 20). That means it behaves vaguely TAB-like in the browser, but not in text editors. I found this out using the debug show keycode option in VX Connectbot. So the obvious system remap for the asinine www./.com key is pointless, and there doesn't seem to be any way to get a real tab input using just a remap. I'm not sure how much further up the pipeline you can go with a closed ROM -- really have no idea -- but again at least there's a way to get TAB in a shell with VX. I did, in desperation, try just entering the keycode for TAB (61) in the key layout file, instead of the enum name. Hilarity and a dead keyboard ensued... yay for cwm recovery. :silly:
So now most of my grand plans for modding the keyboard layout are sort of in tatters. I think I will
map the right shift, genius, sym, and alt keys to cursor keys (just too hard to consistently press the dpad left or right without getting an up or down in there somewhere). That's similar to the layout i'm used to on my N900.
I'd move sym to Home and make Back another spacebar. The spacebar has to be pushed close to its middle on this keyboard, and it's too far away to make sense.
probably remap www. to SHIFT_RIGHT so that it can be tab in Connectbot (built in option)
that leaves just the menu key as redundant (well, and two shifts and space bars after the changes). TBD
Edit: After reading through this, it is clear that if i went with an ICS ROM i could remap as intended. Prior to Froyo the key map files were much less versatile. I think i could get TAB working if i modded the binary keymap file, but it's probably not worth it.
Flandry said:
Edit: After reading through this, it is clear that if i went with an ICS ROM i could remap as intended. Prior to Froyo the key map files were much less versatile. I think i could get TAB working if i modded the binary keymap file, but it's probably not worth it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The best ICS w/Sense ROM for this phone, in my opinion, was one from sun_dream. It was a direct port from the Sensation, using that phone's 3.3.2 ROM release as the base. There was an 3.3.3 release port but I found it to be much less usable/stable. The best ICS ROM, though, is scverhagen's CM9.1r13. It isn't Sense based, but it is very stable, excellent battery, and everything works as it should (for a CM ROM).
Fuzi0719 said:
The best ICS w/Sense ROM for this phone, in my opinion, was one from sun_dream. It was a direct port from the Sensation, using that phone's 3.3.2 ROM release as the base. There was an 3.3.3 release port but I found it to be much less usable/stable. The best ICS ROM, though, is scverhagen's CM9.1r13. It isn't Sense based, but it is very stable, excellent battery, and everything works as it should (for a CM ROM).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Without having even used an Android phone before, i'm not partial to Sense, but i decided after the previous discussion that i'm going to stick with GB for now for the extra camera quality. However, after this tweaking i think i will make a final nandroid and then flash scverhagen's CM9.1r13 to see if the android really is greener on the other side.
Is it worth going all the way to JB, or are those much less functional?
I've set the Miktouch keyboard layout up with relatively minor changes for now:
www. = SYM
Home key = SPACE
SYM = Left Up (caught again by the limited keymapping vocabulary of GB. If you set to DPAD_LEFT, it registers as DPAD_DOWN when the device is in landscape mode...
ALT (right) = Right Down " " "
Genius key = ALT (right)
I found this post and this post to be useful references when changing the layout.
Flandry said:
Without having even used an Android phone before, i'm not partial to Sense, but i decided after the previous discussion that i'm going to stick with GB for now for the extra camera quality. However, after this tweaking i think i will make a final nandroid and then flash scverhagen's CM9.1r13 to see if the android really is greener on the other side.
Is it worth going all the way to JB, or are those much less functional?
I've set the Miktouch keyboard layout up with relatively minor changes for now:
www. = SYM
Home key = SPACE
SYM = Left Up (caught again by the limited keymapping vocabulary of GB. If you set to DPAD_LEFT, it registers as DPAD_DOWN when the device is in landscape mode...
ALT (right) = Right Down " " "
Genius key = ALT (right)
I found this post and this post to be useful references when changing the layout.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can only speak for my own tastes and experiences when discussing a ROM. I personally run Miktouch on my MT4GS. I've tried nearly every ROM available, and given them a good try out. For Sense, I'm gonna run Miktouch, just nothing else comes close to the stability. If I were using a non-sense ROM, I would use scverhagen's CM9.1r13, which is as close to the stability of Miktouch as I've found in a non-stock ROM. I've tried the CM10, 10.1, and 10.2 ROMs but for me the differences just aren't worth the little quirks and issues. Now, many people don't mind those things, or may not even face those same quirks as they might use their phone differently than me. On my Nook Tablet, I use the CM10.1.3 Stable release, as it is so rock-solid. But on this phone, I want 100% (or as close to 100% as is possible) uptime without having to make excuses for why that call got dropped or that text didn't send or my Bluetooth disconnected, etc.
Related
"RC33JF" vs. cupcake - does cupcake have multitouch built in?
I expect some are going to jump on me for asking a dumb question, but a search on this site, which I consider the finest knowledge base around on this topic, yielded mostly conversations around the fact that cupcake will support multitouch, but they don't mention if it is turned on out of the box. In other words, would we need Luke/JF's patch work as we did with RC30 for multitouch to work, or would it just work as it should.
With RC33 out and my confidence in JF that there will be a "RC33JF out within a week" and what appears to be a MUCH more usable cupcake image (as of 2/2, anyway), I am thinking hard about if I'd give up RC33 and Maps, Gmail, etc. and just use AndNav, K9, etc. and APK repositories to survive to get my A2DP bluetooth and full time virtual keyboard, and cupcake is looking more and more promising...
first off, multitouch only works in the browser. Im not sure if the current browser would work with the cupcake firmware. If it does then you could just push it to the phone using adb.
JF or LucidREM can one of you please please please make this image without the multi-touch hack in it. You don't know how much i would appreciate it and probably others. Its too weird to have it throughout the OS and there aren't any apps that can utilize it.
I have no use for the multi and don't like the quirky issues that come with it.
Again please please please and thank you! Your work IS appreciated greatly!
you are incorrect multi-touch effects apps other than the browser in 1.41
It may cause problems but it doesnt work properly. The app would have to be coded to work with the hack. I dont know of any apps that have been coded to work with this hack.
It's off by default. Just go into your browser settings and uncheck what you checked in the first place.
I don't know much about it (multi-touch) but if it's built into the OS and (allegedly?) leads to some quirks here and there (does it?) I don't understand how you can turn it off from the browser...
I'm sure there are a lot of us who don't care about multi-touch at this point, so I would agree with the OP that it would be nice to have the option of a modified RC33 *without* multi-touch.
I would like to add my request as well.
Its off by default in the browser but the kernel is still hacked to sense multi-touch which causes issues with certain apps. This is because the hack uses an existing field to sense the 2nd finger. So apps that actually use that field for legitimate purposes don't work correctly.
Pls add me to the requests for a no-multi-touch version.
It is my understanding that you can turn auto rotate on and off in the browser, but not multi-touch.
there are the highest chances that multi-touch wont be included in cupcake..that is in the original unmodified update..
kernel is still hacked to sense multi-touch which causes issues with certain apps
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Which apps are having issues? Somebody mentioned Steamy Windows in another thread... what other apps are having issues. I like the auto-rotate/multi-touch functionality in that order.
aukicadeso said:
Which apps are having issues? Somebody mentioned Steamy Windows in another thread... what other apps are having issues. I like the auto-rotate/multi-touch functionality in that order.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was having issues where my home screen would skip back and forth. I also had issues clicking the proper menu options/icons.
So yeah count my vote in too.
justanothercrowd said:
JF or LucidREM can one of you please please please make this image without the multi-touch hack in it. You don't know how much i would appreciate it and probably others. Its too weird to have it throughout the OS and there aren't any apps that can utilize it.
I have no use for the multi and don't like the quirky issues that come with it.
Again please please please and thank you! Your work IS appreciated greatly!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OMG, how many threads are you going to post this in? I've counted about 4. If your steamy windows app doesn't work on JF v1.41, go back to non-rooted. I took a look at your past 15 posts, and it all relates to the multi-touch. Version 1.31 didn't have it, you could use that...
/rant
Honestly, beggars can't be choosers.
If JF chooses to not implement this, I think it'd be a step back. You are all welcome to go back to 1.31 or even use the nonrooted version... or better yet, come out with your own version of root.
But, ultimately it's up to JF, and I really hope he doesn't waste his time making two separate versions of 1.33. Ofc, if you really want him to listen to you, don't be a beggar, and be a supporter.
https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_s-xclick&hosted_button_id=1014600
If JF doesn't do it, someone else probably will... which is perfectly fine. Nobody is knocking JF if he won't do this.
I think people are just asking (kindly, I don't see anyone being a jerk about it honestly) for a "vanilla" RC33... As in, exactly as it came from Google except WITH root access added back in. No extra stuff, no recompiled kernel, no extra modules, nothing but root access added back in.
All of my posts are about it because it is the biggest issue with people in the 1.41 build.
The stock RAW image viewer does not work properly either...or cracked screen app....just becasue the apps that take advantage of the second field arent great right now doesnt mean that this isn't an issue. It could end up being a big issue since most dev's don't develop for hacked ROMS.
And for your info I have been running 1.31 for the past few days. I just don't want to see this hack pigeon hole users into not being able to use certain apps. I would like to be able to take advantage of future releases without having multi-touch.
Currently it is only a benefit in the browser and the stock zoom works much smoother, and in the rest of the OS it is a bother.
I will continue to voice my concern and it appears that quite a few others have the same concern.
justanothercrowd said:
All of my posts are about it because it is the biggest issue with people in the 1.41 build.
The stock RAW image viewer does not work properly either...or cracked screen app....just becasue the apps that take advantage of the second field arent great right now doesnt mean that this isn't an issue. It could end up being a big issue since most dev's don't develop for hacked ROMS.
And for your info I have been running 1.31 for the past few days. I just don't want to see this hack pigeon hole users into not being able to use certain apps. I would like to be able to take advantage of future releases without having multi-touch.
Currently it is only a benefit in the browser and the stock zoom works much smoother, and in the rest of the OS it is a bother.
I will continue to voice my concern and it appears that quite a few others have the same concern.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Feel free to ask all you want. I think it might fall on deaf ears. The point I was trying to make, is that it's not necessary to post in 4-5 different threads. I think one thread would be sufficient enough...
I agree with justanothercrowd. I'm all for the multi-touch hack, but the fact that its using an existing documented field is an issue.
I believe if you search the threads JF has already answered this question or it has been at least brought up. The only problem that was really brought to light was the steamy app. Really I think this would be a huge hassle for JF who works for free to have to update two versions every time an update is to come out maybe a simple setting to turn it off would be easier and more likely.
a setting would be great. and im more than willing to contribute $$$ for the extra time spent. i would recompile my own but im not that savvy with the android platform yet.
any feedback jf?
So I've tried a TON of roms from some amazing chefs (I'm mostly a lurker around here, so let me say thanks for all the time you put into your work while I'm at it) but what I've decided I'm really looking for is just a phone that works quickly and doesn't require me to reset it constantly (the classic speedy and stable goal).
My favorite roms have been MightyMike's, Mr. X's, and Deck's, over at ppcgeek (I'm CDMA and they seem to have more CMDA friendly stuff over there). But still, I find myself resetting my phone often or waiting for certain screens to load.
I've been looking into some blank-slate roms but the ones I found were carrier-specific and apparently buggy (I guess you can't take out everything...there's probably a science to cooking this style of rom even if it's supposed to be the bare-essentials).
I have decided I could care less for the Sense UI, and will settle with anything as long as it works basic functions as smoothly as a non-smartphone does.
Any chefs out there making something like this that would work for a Verizon tp2?
Thanks a lot.
Sense is eye candy. For me personally, I prefer functionality over eye candy.
I use the titanium (windows default) interface because it is a clean interface.
I think some of the problems with sense is it a resource hog, and the video driver(s) for the 7200/01 chips are still pretty much software, and not hardware based, thanks to Qualcomm or HTC or whoever for not releasing proper drivers.
p51d007 said:
Sense is eye candy. For me personally, I prefer functionality over eye candy.
I use the titanium (windows default) interface because it is a clean interface.
I think some of the problems with sense is it a resource hog, and the video driver(s) for the 7200/01 chips are still pretty much software, and not hardware based, thanks to Qualcomm or HTC or whoever for not releasing proper drivers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But does just "disabling" Sense give you the same performance as not having it in the rom at all?
You took the words right out of my mouth.
I began with flashing my T-Mobile Touch Pro 2 because no matter what I did, I could not get my phone to recognize my position through Google maps. It was incredibly frustrating because I use it a lot. I always ended up being show in the same part of New York no matter where I was.
Given the understanding that 23529 was the latest but still very buggy, I focused on a few 21892 ROMs. The following happened in various combinations:
- Incredibly slow and buggy Sense SMS software
- Messages listed out of order
- Unwanted text messages popping up after checking my voicemail from 129
- Unplugging the phone to go to work and being down to 94% battery by the time I got down the street
- Memory hovering at about 82%
- Constant struggles with typing with the onscreen keyboard if anything came in (email, text, etc.) completely froze up the phone for a few seconds, very annoying.
And while the stock T-Mobile ROM had none of the perks of these ROMs, it ALWAYS worked without bugs with the exception of Google Maps. I appreciate the efforts so much from all the chefs but I have to agree that ultimately, functionality always outruns perks. I'm not sure what to try anymore. It's become frustrating. I wanted the animated weather, I wanted the new Sense interface, and I wanted the programs on the home screen. Oh well...
RE90 said:
But does just "disabling" Sense give you the same performance as not having it in the rom at all?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Other than the storage memory, yes.
But you can find, for instance, NRG's rom's that have Sense removed altogether. They are the "titanium" named roms.
rajuabju said:
Other than the storage memory, yes.
But you can find, for instance, NRG's rom's that have Sense removed altogether. They are the "titanium" named roms.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I had been considering this but wasn't certain this was what I was looking for. I tried it anyways and sure enough everything is smooth enough so far. I haven't done any heavy messaging with it yet but I haven't had much, if any, lag yet. Coupled with chome editors found here on xda, I can still have eye candy AND speed...which is more than I was looking for. Thanks, rajuabju.
One complaint: battery life seems dismal :/
Everything else is near perfect.
i recommend Indagroove's titanium ROM, battery life and everything else is awesome in my experience
If you have tried so many ROMs over at PPCGeeks, how did you not notice the titanium ones there? Just take a look and pick one or try several.
Could Not Agree More
I have the same experience when flashing ROMS. Constant lockups and hours of searching for fixes. I have downloaded ROMS by just about everyone. I am heavy with the MMS and SMS, i would say i send/receive over 2-300 daily. And i would experience so many problems with this, i have found fixes to these issues and resolved that. I loved the LEO SMS because of the threading and ease of sending pictures. But the most common and constant problem i have is System Lockups. I have to hard reset many of times, that or just overall lagging. I love what all the ROMS are capable of but the frequent dropped calls and other issues are frustrating. Like talking to someone and then have them shouting "Hello, Hello, Hello" midway through your conversation because your phone has magically decided it hates you and doesn't want to work, the mute button was not enabled. Anyone know of ROMS they have use with NO problems? (I know it is newbish for me to believe one exists, )
David.RodriguezVI said:
I have the same experience when flashing ROMS. Constant lockups and hours of searching for fixes. I have downloaded ROMS by just about everyone. I am heavy with the MMS and SMS, i would say i send/receive over 2-300 daily. And i would experience so many problems with this, i have found fixes to these issues and resolved that. I loved the LEO SMS because of the threading and ease of sending pictures. But the most common and constant problem i have is System Lockups. I have to hard reset many of times, that or just overall lagging. I love what all the ROMS are capable of but the frequent dropped calls and other issues are frustrating. Like talking to someone and then have them shouting "Hello, Hello, Hello" midway through your conversation because your phone has magically decided it hates you and doesn't want to work, the mute button was not enabled. Anyone know of ROMS they have use with NO problems? (I know it is newbish for me to believe one exists, )
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think now with more time delicated to roms by chefs, I rarely encounter freeze and lock-ups,I tried all kinds of roms, it seems that your description is from old time days......
For the last couple of days I've been trying to get Eclair 3D acceleration running on 32A with old radio. I was somehow succesful so I decided to release one Sense based ROM port and one "plain" Eclair. I had succes with other ROMs though (not all of them, but a few). Edit March 2nd - It now seems that it works on 32B/G1 as well, so I've added the porting package for those phones, see below.
This ROM is highly experimental! So bear that in mind. The only testing I've done is here on my own Magic - I am not using any ext3/ext4 partition for app2sd, for example, so I'm not sure how it behaves if you use one.
I've added a few things here and there that are essential to me like Market Enabler, More Locale 2, some ringtone and notification files and mixed in a few files from other Eclair ROMs to get a few things working. I've also changed the default analog clock (the Android widget, not HTC widget) to Pulse clock.
Thanks to:
ahmgsk (obviously), Kingclick, Cyanogen and all the other devs working on his kernel source, Amon_RA, all OpenEclair devs, polyrhytmic, dzo, vilord and many others.
What seems to work:
- 3D acceleration seems to work fine. I can get about 20fps in Neocore benchmark. I've also tested Radiant, Armadillo Roll and iDracula and they all seem to work. 3D Gallery works as well.
- Multitouch works
- Camera works, mostly - no video recording, though. If you take picture, it shows a garbled screen for a moment, but the picture itself is taken just fine.
- GPS and accelerometer work
- LED notifications work, all colors
- Bluetooth MIGHT work, needs testing. But you can enable it.
- Google Sync seems to work just fine
What seems not to work:
- YouTube and video playback in gallery doesn't work at all for now. Sorry.
Known Issues:
- Rather slow on startup. Give it time to start up fully, even after you see the home screen. You may even get a few "App not responding - FC/Wait?" warnings - just click on Wait and give it more time. But after it starts, it seems pretty fast to me. It's no SuperD, but still quite fast, I'd say.
- Live wallpapers are problematic and I'd recommend staying away from them. Some work (not very fast, though), some don't.
- Launcher 2 is problematic. I've kept it in the ROM and it certainly looks nice, but I've had all sorts of problems when I had it enabled, including long phone freezes, terrible lag in applications and other. I'd HIGHLY recommend just using the "normal" launcher (it's "Nexus style" anyway).
Note:
Take this port "as is" 'cause I probably won't support it much. I think of it more as a "proof of concept" that seemed too cool to me not to share it with others, but I don't have enough time to offer full support or work on it much these days. Maybe I'll release another version someday, maybe not. Sorry. I'm just being honest here.
Download:
v1.0 - md5 1d52c09ac080abd6f1620a00afb96d30
Rapidshare mirror
Mediafire mirror
Porting package for 32B - Warning: potentially unstable in many different ways! (see the thread comments first) - md5 506d30b69186059abc2a22804952e7a8 (Flash over the main ROM without rebooting the phone)
Rapidshare mirror
Mediafire mirror
(reserved just in case)
I will check it inmediatly...
but this driver 3d not work on magic 32b??Why not come out yet for the ROM 32b?
It might, as I don't think the solution here is specific to 32A. I'll maybe try to make a 32B kernel soon and let someone test it. Right now, I've yet to hear about this working for someone else on 32A other than me
Im flashing it ATM.
Give me a few minutes
ok when you relase a 32b Kernel,Warn
Well, i flashed it.
You're right, 3D is working
I tried it with SpeedX and Hyper Space, and they both are working. Not as fast as it would on a donut based rom (looks like the frame rate is a little lower) but they are absolutely working.
Launcher2 is still a bit laggy.
Some Live Wallpapers aren't working, they forced the phone to restart.
The gallery is working.
There are some bugs (like pressing the home button while in an app, will sometimes block my phone) that forced me to remove the battery.
This rom is not working enough for a daily use, but you did a great job.
Waiting for a bug fix Imma try the hero port now
Good to know, thanks!
BTW, as I've mentioned in the first post, I don't recommend using Launcher 2, it causes all sorts of weird issues with this ROM. And I also mention that live wallpapers are problematic and you should just stay away from them
Oh, and as for the framerates in 3D - in my experience they're actually slightly higher on average than with my own SuperD port I'm now using as a day-to-day ROM (I miss Sense UI, but 1.5 is starting to lag behind on all the interesting stuff, so...).
Case_ thx for working on this
i could not work becoz my tester was on new radio
i hope u get my hero 2.1 working too
From what I gather, this is a KERNEL modification that makes the HERO drivers work with this "old radio", correct?
Could you please provide the kernel diff (patch)?
ahmgsk: You're welcome. I'm always somehow uneasy as to what the reaction of the original dev would be when I'm using and perhaps modifying someone else's work, so thanks for this
I'll try to follow the progress of most Eclair ROMs but I'm gonna be quite busy for at least the next week or so, so no promises on any other updates or more ports (but I'd LOVE to have a reliable Sense UI ROM with Android 1.6 or higher, I can tell you that - Kinglick's Eclair Hero is close, but still not close enough to rely on it on day-to-day basis). I'm glad I managed to at least steal the weekend for Android for once and got this working, more or less.
lbcoder: Actually, there's really not much to patch. I've spent countless hours trying to port parts of the Kaiser kernel as discussed in one of the G1 forum threads, yet in the end I've ended up using pretty much just the plain vanilla Cyanogen Eclair kernel sources with only the camera code backported from the Donut sources to get the camera working (but I can certainly provide some kind of diff if need be).
Then there's the permission problem with /dev/msm_hw3dc and /dev/msm_hw3dm that on most Eclair ROMs needs fixing (chmod 666 and chmod 660 in init.rc, respectively).
And then it might or might not be an issue with the contents of /system/lib/egl and /system/lib/hw (and perhaps some other libs as well) which, I'm sorry to say, I've yet to fully test. Those from ahmgsk's AME Eclair seem to work, but looks to me like it's not exclusively just those, that it might work with some others as well. I know it's not very professional (but I've said it many times, I'm no dev and certainly no coder, I'm just determined and persistent ), but I honestly didn't have time to test those different libraries fully, sorry. I was just trying to get something as usable as possible and share it with others so they may perhaps investigate further. Though it somehow amazes me that I of all people got it working when there's so many people with coding and Android knowledge WAY beyond my own here (which is not that hard to achieve, anyway)
Case_ said:
ahmgsk: You're welcome. I'm always somehow uneasy as to what the reaction of the original dev would be when I'm using and perhaps modifying someone else's work, so thanks for this
I'll try to follow the progress of most Eclair ROMs but I'm gonna be quite busy for at least the next week or so, so no promises on any other updates or more ports (but I'd LOVE to have a reliable Sense UI ROM with Android 1.6 or higher, I can tell you that - Kinglick's Eclair Hero is close, but still not close enough to rely on it on day-to-day basis). I'm glad I managed to at least steal the weekend for Android for once and got this working, more or less.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i hav no problem when u use my rom
its no probs -> but i m glad 32A (old radio) users are getting this. i m working on hero rom i think i can try to get everything working
for now videos and all are working
now some widgets n network is remaining (mostly solved) v2 coming soon
YouTube and video playback in gallery doesn't work at all
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Why? I remember in the original ahmgsk 's ROM they are working as well...
What has been changed from the old to the new Radio/SPL to break the YouTube/Gallery video playback?
As for the "why?", that's a very good question I'd really like to know the answer to.
As for "what has changed" - the kernel has changed (had to for the ROM to work with the old radio) and with it all the "drivers". I'm not happy that YouTube and video doesn't work, but I don't have much time to investigate further right now. And until now, neither did Eclair 3D acceleration with the old radio, so I guess it's still progress.
I'm sure someone will figure it out eventually.
Added links for 32B/G1 porting package. Yes, 3D really seems to work on those phones as well.
how do I apply the 32B patch?
just replace the files with the once from teh original zip file , repack it, and then apply the new zip?
stefanero313 said:
how do I apply the 32B patch?
just replace the files with the once from teh original zip file , repack it, and then apply the new zip?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yeah how do us g1 owners do this thang ...
?????????????????????????????????????????
I guess I figured it out,
download both zip files, apply zip one, then apply the 2nd one other the other.
replacing files wont work because of the files within the "META-INF" folder
Given under my hand this 12th day of August 2011, I hereby post a bounty of $100 for a ROM build for the Samsung/T-Mobile Sidekick 4G (AOSP?) that functions, and will allow me to sync e-mail from Exchange @ work.
I) This will have to have a non-Touchwiz/Samsung Dialer (contacts in same window, not open a new one, like on Droid1 [Vanilla?]), and not have any of the Bull known to be associated with the WHACKNESS that is typically seen on this phone with Stock.
II) It will be running Launcher Pro, so must work as such.
III) Another requirement is that when a page is loading, and you scroll at the same time, the BS Checkers are not showing (I think this is TouchWiz/Samsung specific, so shouldn't be a problem), if I wanted the checkers when scrolling, I'd have an iPhruity device.
IV) As staed above it will have to pull e-mail from an e-mail app (email.apk?) from MS Exchange server from the drop down notification without a FC.
*EDIT*:
V) Calendar must allow multiple notifications (from the app), and actually notify as such.
*/EDIT*
*MUCHO EDITO*
VI) PATTERN Lockscreen must be the only one. Not doubled. (No Shade lockscreen 1st if pattern is enabled, I need the pattern!)
*/MUCHO EDITO*
I am hoping this is kosher to post a bounty, but I detest TouchWiz, Samsung's dialer (phone.apk), etc.
I am looking to get something like Cyanogen's Vanilla builds.
I haven't coded anything since Borland's/MS C for DOS, so I cannot do this myself.
Hopefully I can get some takers, and they can better this phone for the community.
I assume the source is out there, just need to be compiled. Several ROMs are very good, but all have Samsung's TouchWiz elements, seeking to avoid that.
Thank you for your time!
i like that you're going at! i know that if you use oprea mobile browser you dont get the bs checker boarding. its a very good browser check it out
sduvick is working on a stock dialer i believe its on his long list of work!
also he is trying to port cm6 which is helpful
im sure someone can get this working and will be easier if we get a gingerbread leak.
We can't get a AOSP Vanilla ROM there are no leak's of gingerbread so we can't get anything beside's TouchWiz but if i was you try out my ROM "Light'ning ROM V2" It has the vanilla feeling .
the86d said:
Given under my hand this 12th day of August 2011, I hereby post a bounty of $100 for a ROM build for the Samsung/T-Mobile Sidekick 4G (AOSP?) that functions, and will allow me to sync e-mail from Exchange @ work.
I) This will have to have a non-Touchwiz/Samsung Dialer (contacts in same window, not open a new one, like on Droid1 [Vanilla?]), and not have any of the Bull known to be associated with the WHACKNESS that is typically seen on this phone with Stock.
II) It will be running Launcher Pro, so must work as such.
III) Another requirement is that when a page is loading, and you scroll at the same time, the BS Checkers are not showing (I think this is TouchWiz/Samsung specific, so shouldn't be a problem), if I wanted the checkers when scrolling, I'd have an iPhruity device.
IV) As staed above it will have to pull e-mail from an e-mail app (email.apk?) from MS Exchange server from the drop down notification without a FC.
*EDIT*:
V) Calendar must allow multiple notifications (from the app), and actually notify as such.
*/EDIT*
I am hoping this is kosher to post a bounty, but I detest TouchWiz, Samsung's dialer (phone.apk), etc.
I am looking to get something like Cyanogen's Vanilla builds.
I haven't coded anything since Borland's/MS C for DOS, so I cannot do this myself.
Hopefully I can get some takers, and they can better this phone for the community.
I assume the source is out there, just need to be compiled. Several ROMs are very good, but all have Samsung's TouchWiz elements, seeking to avoid that.
Thank you for your time!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This phone is really crippled, even with the AWESOME Custom ROMs posted here, and MANY are VERY good.
The issue is features that were not thought about when Samsung screwed up their TouchWiz version of Android for this phone. Calender not able to add multiple notifications, or not notifying via the 1st one if two were added prior (via gmail or a functional phone), Phone.apk not having built-in Contacts section, etc.
tylermaciaszek said:
i like that you're going at! i know that if you use oprea mobile browser you dont get the bs checker boarding. its a very good browser check it out
sduvick is working on a stock dialer i believe its on his long list of work!
also he is trying to port cm6 which is helpful
im sure someone can get this working and will be easier if we get a gingerbread leak.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Revolution said:
We can't get a AOSP Vanilla ROM there are no leak's of gingerbread so we can't get anything beside's TouchWiz but if i was you try out my ROM "Light'ning ROM V2" It has the vanilla feeling .
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It too is very good, but the dialer is still without the built-in contacts that is VERY efficient, and the calender is still touchwiz crippled.
I was late to an appointment due to this and the mentioned ROM.
Revolution said:
We can't get a AOSP Vanilla ROM there are no leak's of gingerbread so we can't get anything beside's TouchWiz but if i was you try out my ROM "Light'ning ROM V2" It has the vanilla feeling .
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
he didnt say it has to be GB, just AOSP. and Sduvick has quite some projects on his hands atm but an AOSP build is definitely one of them
ayoteddy said:
he didnt say it has to be GB, just AOSP. and Sduvick has quite some projects on his hands atm but an AOSP build is definitely one of them
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Nice, I am treading very badly right now!
Are there better leaks with MotoPhones or something?
Those came out all the time, solid and fully featured.
(FYI: Currently running your TouchMIUIwiz v2.0 ROM, 'Tis very nice.)
I would gladly drop the $75 for a new T-Mobile phone with a larger screen (since I am in my 30 Day trial for a few more days) but no other QWERTY w/dedicated number phones avail, and the stock on those will probably have the same issues...
Sduvick is building CM6 / 2.2 i herd , but i doubt that'll be any time soon cause he's busy with other thing's prob .
ayoteddy said:
he didnt say it has to be GB, just AOSP. and Sduvick has quite some projects on his hands atm but an AOSP build is definitely one of them
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Revolution said:
Sduvick is building CM6 / 2.2 i herd , but i doubt that'll be any time soon cause he's busy with other thing's prob .
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Lol i just said that.. CM6 is an AOSP build
We can get AOSP, it will just be AOSP 2.2.
This just jumped to the top of my list, I shall begin the challenge as soon as my Kernel finishes compiling.
As far as your list goes, let me make sure that I've got everything figured out:
I) This will have to have a non-Touchwiz/Samsung Dialer[\QUOTE]
This shouldn't be an issue, as an AOSP build will have the AOSP dialer, rather than Touchwiz.
II) It will be running Launcher Pro, so must work as such. [\QUOTE]
I use Launcher Pro myself, wouldn't dream of letting anything release without it working.
III) Another requirement is that when a page is loading, and you scroll at the same time, the BS Checkers are not showing (I think this is TouchWiz/Samsung specific, so shouldn't be a problem), if I wanted the checkers when scrolling, I'd have an iPhruity device.[\QUOTE]
I'll have to check in with you when I get it built to see what that part is doing, I'm not familiar with this, but I'm guessing it would be fixed by AOSP
IV) As staed above it will have to pull e-mail from an e-mail app (email.apk?) from MS Exchange server from the drop down notification without a FC. [\QUOTE]
Should work, if I remember correctly it worked right in AOSP
*EDIT*:
V) Calendar must allow multiple notifications (from the app), and actually notify as such.
*/EDIT*[\QUOTE]
If this works in AOSP, it should work, never tested I suppose, but could be wrong.
*MUCHO EDITO*
VI) PATTERN Lockscreen must be the only one. Not doubled. (No Shade lockscreen 1st if pattern is enabled, I need the pattern!)
*/MUCHO EDITO*[\QUOTE]
there won't be any doubled, pattern should be no issue. (Misread that the first time, thought you wanted puzzle :])
let me know if you had anything else on your mind you wanted in it.
too lazy to fix quotes
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I've been wanting to do this for quite some time as well. The only issue is being a full time student without a job makes putting up any sort of "bounty" just for some improvements is not possible.
However, I do have some spare cash and will toss all of it towards whoever breaks out an AOSP rom.
Good luck.
Meanwhile, me being a fulltime student who wants to get married, any extra payday sounds incredibly enticing ;]
Just to clarify, I want it as close to AOSP as possible.
Then, from that point, as much of it to work in landscape (EG: lockscreen) as possible.
And of course, any improvements like supercharge, voodoo, and so on.
I say improvements because I want just that. No changes.
I figure specifics aren't too important, because I can always tweek it from there or ask for what I'm not capable of.
Current unallocated money in my bank is just over 15$ xD
But with you already making the AOSP ROM, I figure it won't take too much effort from you.
I'm excited :3
Well, compiling AOSP, rather than just making an AOSP rom is very different. making an AOSP rom is just a matter of theming some things and pulling certain apps, where compiling an AOSP rom is more like building a kernel, where you have to compile the system from the source.
Whenever I see or use the words "AOSP ROM" it's always related to a ROM that is built entirely from the source code. Unless otherwise specified.
AOSP themed stuff, and AOSP apps are of course, just that. But when I say AOSP ROM, I mean a true AOSP ROM.
If there's something I'm missing, please let me know!
That's what I'm working on, theming is lame anyways, doesn't do what you really want it to. but because I have to compile it and screw with the source it may take a bit, it's my current project though and I'm starting now.
I am not sure if this helps but I have a non-rooted phone and hae "Go Contacts EX" (Contact Manager and LANDSCAPE Phone dialer) & "Business Calendar Free" (Calendar Replacemets - more like Google Calendar for Desktop Web)
These are much more feature-rich than the stock apps.
ncmacasl said:
I am not sure if this helps but I have a non-rooted phone and hae "Go Contacts EX" (Contact Manager and LANDSCAPE Phone dialer) & "Business Calendar Free" (Calendar Replacemets - more like Google Calendar for Desktop Web)
These are much more feature-rich than the stock apps.
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your not rooted why? so much more potential in the device
YES!!!
Alpha ETA? Hahahaaa!
KIDDING!
In case all you developers here are unaware, YOU BELONG IN THE ANDROID BIBLE!
the86d said:
YES!!!
Alpha ETA? Hahahaaa!
KIDDING!
In case all you developers here are unaware, YOU BELONG IN THE ANDROID BIBLE!
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they really do they put so much work into our devices!
Hello,
I installed (with pain) the official stock jelly bean on my GEDified Xoom. I thought "project butter" was a real big improvement, according to what I could read in many threads, I was then asking myself why, if it's such a big improvement, the release name didn't change to 5.0 instead of 4.1.1...
Now I have my answer !
Launcher :
I can say yes, there is a fluidity enhancements, but not as much as expected. I could not see much differences between ICS and JB regarding the fluidity, the stock launcher has only been improved a bit : if an icon page is full of icons, with 2 widgets on it, then there are a few lags ...
I use Nova launcher since ICS, and this one is really smooth as butter, much more than the stock JB launcher. You can put 3 or 4 widgets on a same icons page with absolutly no lag at all.
Web browser :
The same with the default JB web browser : I can feel improvements, but some web pages (with no Flash activated) are still laggy ... Compare it with Opera Mini and you will see what smooth as butter should mean ! Opera is just perfectly smooth, no lag at all on any web page.
Non-Google applications :
I couldn't find any fluidity enhancement when running non-google applications. The applications which where laggy with ICS are still laggy with JB, and unfortunatly, perfectly smooth Android applications are too rares ...
I can't even really use most of the new features of JB :
- I can't use the new icons auto-rearranging when moving a widget on a page as the stock launcher is not smooth enough for me, I use Nova Launcher which is perfectly fluid but does not have this feature.
- I can't ear the beautifull voice of Google Voice Search, as I'm french, and it only works for English language ... But I'm not even sure the problem is here, the main problem is that on the official stock JB release, there is no "download offline speach recognition" option in Google Now, so you just cannot activate it. But you can do it on a Team EOS ROM !!!!! This is a shame !!!
- I forgot this one ... I even lost an important feature ! My external SD Card could read or write with ICS, now it's READ ONLY !!!
As the fluidity is my main concern on my Xoom, I was disapointed, I was expecting too many improvements when I read threads of people testing Jelly Bean, so by making this thread I hope I will help people not yet running JB to not be disapointed as I am.
Now I hope the "project butter" is not closed at Google as there are still many improvements to do on this point, I can say that because some third party applications are perfectly smooth where the Google ones are not, so it is not an hardware problem, I am pretty sure that a dual core tablet should be enough to display 2D applications smoothly. But will our good old Xoom receive the future major Android release ? I don't think so as we are already lucky enough to receive JB after more than one year of existence for the Xoom ... But there are still a few bugs to remove in JB, I hope Google will update it (I never had a single crash when running ICS, on JB, I had one the first day I used it when I tried to change the background wall paper, my screen became black and the Xoom rebooted ...).
So now I am thinking of trying a JB custom ROM, but it was so painful to me to restore all my data and applications after the official OTA update (my bootloader was unlocked so the OTA didn't work, I had to put back my Xoom to a factory state with locked bootloader which let me loose all my data) that I'm now a bit lazy and not sure that the custom ROM will be smooter than the stock one.
I have HTC One X and if I get the same JB results on this phone I am definitely giving up on Android and testing Windows Phone. There was a Nokia promotion at my school a few months back and I tested one of their models with Windows. I was impressed by how fast and lag-free it is. I would definitely give it a go.
This phone that I am using has a quad core cpu, 1gb of RAM and what not and OS still lags!! I mean come on!!
Sent from my HTC One X using xda premium
flash an eos rom and you will see the real "smooth as butter"
omnia1994 said:
flash an eos rom and you will see the real "smooth as butter"
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Did you compare the EOS rom to the stock one ? In fact I would be glad to see a video of the Team EOS release running on a Xoom ...
One of my friends tried windows phone and said it was like running a Beta. Came back to Android.
Major benefits were integration with Xbox.
Windows tablet may fair slightly better but the ARM not being able to run current apps seems a bit like cutting of their arms
I don't think there is cause to assume we will not get KLP (Android 4.2 or 5.0) yet, its a year old. Google seem to want to support devices for 18 months as per last IO...?
Sent from my HTC EVO 3D X515m using xda premium
It's time to be honest- there's only going to be so much ANY software can do on our Xooms, as it turns out that part of the issue is a hardware problem- but not where you'd expect. One of the things folks don't realize about Android is that the performance can be heavily dependent on the type, kind and size of the Flash disk storage a device contains. Flash storage, especially the what's-now-older kind that's on our Xooms, just doesn't perform very well if there's a lot of small, random writes to it, and there's a lot of these in a typical running Android system.
What ends up happening during these small writes is the system can end up waiting a relative eternity on any other disk-based I/O once the Flash controller chip (the one built into the Flash device, not the controller on the CPU) determines it's time to reorganize itself- and what that means is that during that time, the system can (and often does) appear unresponsive, or "stutter". I've worked on several Android handsets and tablets over the last few years, and this problem is beginning to be well-known.
A good example of this is to try listening to music, then browsing a complex webpage- as the browser writes its cache and various database files, many times the music will pause, stutter or click.
I've been doing what I can in EOS kernels to improve the random-small-write performance of the Flash disk- changing when and where writes happen, changing the geometry of where they occur, and I'm now actually testing a series of changes that are based on an academic Whitepaper that look quite promising (but it'll require an entire "Factory Reset" type wipe to make it work).
BTW, if you want to see something eye-opening, run PassMark (or some other disk-I/O benchmark that compares against other devices) and see how badly we do against more-modern devices.
(TL;DR: newer handsets and tablets will likely perform better on JB, mostly 'cause our Flash devices could perform better in many often-used scenarios.)
Thanks a lot for this answer, I understand what you mean about flash memory.
But there are some ways, with the current Xoom hardware, to make things very smooth as some third party softwares do it :
- Nova Launcher -> Perfectly smooth, no lags whatever the number of Widgets are displayed. JB Launcher is much more laggy ...
- Opera Mini -> Perfectly smooth, and very responsive.
So I really cannot understand why Google cannot make things smoother if other companies do !
Plus some apps have perfectly fluid menus (I mean when you just scroll a menu, it's perfectly fluid) and some other apps have their menu so laggy ...
So I really feel like it's not a hardware question but more the way the apps have been developped.
and what about the Linaro code ? Wouldn't it make JB smoother ?
Opera Mini isn't really a fair comparison. How does it compare to Opera Mobile or Firefox or Dolphin or whatever? Opera Mini was intended for small memory devices and doesn't even render the pages locally. The are rendered on Opera's servers and then the result is compressed and sent to the device to be displayed.
I'd say your comparison regarding the launcher though is valid. I haven't personally experienced much lag but I don't have many Widgets.
Sent from my Xoom using Tapatalk
Go EOS you will not be disappointed!! I was very disappointed when ICS came out for my stingray Xoom i didn't even stay on it for more than a couple hours after getting it OTA before i went and flashed the EOS ICS ROM.
As for browsers i love Dolphin HD.
I have stock JB on my Xoom and other than minor launcher lag with multiple widgets, I find this to be really smooth and 100% stable. I see very noticeable improvements over ICS, especially with graphics and overall the smoothness. Overall I am very content.
I will also say, the battery life has surely improved over ICS! For 3D gaming, I lose about 7.5% - 10% in 45 minutes, which projects to about 7.5 hours of gaming with a possible max of 10 hours!!
Sounds like project rusty beans on your Xoom then.
Sent from my Xoom using xda premium
I was wondering if many of the Project Butter enhancements were launcher related. I've always used Nova Launcher as well, and I have seen lag in the past on ICS. Especially since my desktop consists mostly of widgets. PB Launcher is definitely a little better than Nova when loaded with widgets, in my experience. But the ability to customize rows/columns and get rid of icon labels is compelling enough to use Nova. Nevermind the ability to utilize most of the screen without a 1" border on each side, as is the cast with the stock launcher.
One huge difference is with the Netflix app. I remember them talking about Project Butter enhancements to the Framework during the I/O keynote speech, and I suspect the changes helped almost completely eliminate the AWFUL lag I'd experienced in the Netflix app in ICS. Once a show got going, the streaming was fine. It was when navigating through the app that it was horrendous. In JB, it is great!
Fix External Card Write problems
Dizzy,
I had the same exact issue when trying to write to my SD Card - it was write protected and only allowed read permissions. I had problems restoring backups with Titanium Backup and creating new ones - as my backups were on my External card.
I found the solution which seemed to cure-all. I found it with this post: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=20869996&postcount=7
Basically, assuming you are rooted, in /system/etc/permissions/ mount this folder using ES File Explorer or Root Explorer as R/W, then open platform.xml in text editor and find WRITE_EXTERNAL_STORAGE permission. Add an additional group definition for this permission...<group gid="media_rw" />. Save changes or exit and save changes and then reboot tablet.
You can always try the automated way: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1458021
Good luck!
Skeetch79 said:
Dizzy,
I had the same exact issue when trying to write to my SD Card - it was write protected and only allowed read permissions. I had problems restoring backups with Titanium Backup and creating new ones - as my backups were on my External card.
I found the solution which seemed to cure-all. I found it with this post: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=20869996&postcount=7
Basically, assuming you are rooted, in /system/etc/permissions/ mount this folder using ES File Explorer or Root Explorer as R/W, then open platform.xml in text editor and find WRITE_EXTERNAL_STORAGE permission. Add an additional group definition for this permission...<group gid="media_rw" />. Save changes or exit and save changes and then reboot tablet.
You can always try the automated way: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1458021
Good luck!
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Thanks a lot for these informations, unfortunatly my Xoom is not rooted (I had so many problems to update to JB when my Xoom had the bootloader unlocked that I had to re-lock it...).
So I cannot use this solution, and I don't understand why Google put the SD card Readonly where it was read/write in ICS ...
This is really a big disapointment for me from Jelly Bean. I hope Google will change that in the next JB update.
I have tried Jelly Bean as well and noticed that while it is a little smoother than ICS, it isn't "buttery" smooth. That said I don't believe it's so much the software as it is the hardware. Tegra 2's GPU is quite lacking in general and was a huge letdown for many people. If for example you check out JB on an Asus Transformer Prime/Infinity or a Nexus 7, you'll notice it is MUCH smoother overall. Finally, a lot of older apps haven't been updated yet to use GPU acceleration but there is a setting in the developer options to force gpu acceleration which should make those apps perform better.
My Droid Bionic running an ICS leak is smoother than my Xoom on JB simply because it has a faster gpu. The only thing I really noticed that helped with my Xoom's performance was running it at 1.5Ghz OC on the Team EOS rom. There are still websites that lag and have issues, but in general it does run much better than stock.
As for WP7 it is a smooth OS yes but VERY incomplete....WP8 looks to address many of the issues with WP7 but it will also break a lot of compatibility yet again and will basically alienate the current entire WP7 userbase...(if you didnt know WP8 will run most WP7 apps, but WP7 can't run any of the WP8 apps).
Is it just me, or does the Xoom seem to get faster over time with Jelly Bean? I was part of the soak test, so may have had it a few days loner than most, and I have done a couple of resets early on, but over the last couple of days, it definitely seems snappier
Sent from my Xoom using Tapatalk 2
I've got a mz601 and i have to say that JB is totally lag-free on my XOOM. I've never used stock firmware (EOS only) and after updating from ICS (that was laggy as hell) i havn't seen any lag whatsoever. But when i updated to JB i did a complete factory reset (formatted system, user data, cache, internal sdcard and external sdcard) and it was as if i had bought a new tablet.
Stock JB launcher has no lag, system ui has no lag, browser has a little lag when opening complex websites, music and videos have no lag. Also Flash works much better (even if it's not officially supported).
Some apps still lag like they did on ICS but i guess that is an app developement problem since most apps also work lag-free...
GO... GO.... GOOGLE... Android just keeps getting better and better...
PS! I also have the original iPad and that lags alot with ios 5. I also have a powerful desktop-PC (i7 with 8gb ram) with windows 7 and I have to say that the XOOM opens websites faster and scrolls much smoother (even with a bluetooth mouse).
PS2! I'm not an android fan. I like all gadgets but android seems to be moving in the right direction.
http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2012/07/revisiting-the-xoom-examining-jelly-bean-on-a-10-inch-tablet/
Here is an interesting review of JB on the Xoom
rcatron said:
Is it just me, or does the Xoom seem to get faster over time with Jelly Bean? I was part of the soak test, so may have had it a few days loner than most, and I have done a couple of resets early on, but over the last couple of days, it definitely seems snappier
Sent from my Xoom using Tapatalk 2
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I have the exact same feeling ...
dizzy33 said:
I have the exact same feeling ...
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I have been very critical of JB since getting it last Friday but I have to say that today the whole experience seems to be coming together and some of the early faults I was experiencing have pretty much gone all of a sudden.
It seems quicker now though only marginally but thats still a step up from how it was at the beginning. And since switching to chrome instead of ICS browser it seems to be giving a better browsing experience; which was definitely not the case with chrome on ICS for me.