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Unlocked phones in the US

My AT&T contract is currently up and I am considering what my next phone should be. So far, the options are not pretty.
I am definitely staying with AT&T, since I don't like t-mobile's 3G coverage nor the freakish frequency they use (it's even rarer than the at&t frequencies).
I have been a big WinMo proponent (and currently have a nicely ROM'd tilt) but do not see a future in WinMo (at the moment).
It will be a work/personal phone, so email, calls, surfing and apps are important.
I pretty much hate Apple (and the people using it) but see myself deciding between Android and iphone.
So far, I seem to have the following options:
1. wait what Android phones will land at AT&T in January,
2. buy an iPhone 3GS now and keep it,
3. buy an iPhone 3GS and sell it immediately/unused to buy an unlocked phone now/later, or
4. buy an iPhone 3GS, use it and sell it sometime in Q1 to buy an unlocked phone then.
What to do?
If I could get a fast Android phone on at&t I would get it in a hearbeat (e.g. Acer Liquid A1).
I don't like a lot of things about the iphone (no files/saving attachments, lack of word/excel support, walled garden, I hate itunes, ...).
The best GSM android devices (Magic & Hero) are too expensive, slow, small(er) screen (than the iphone), no 3.5mm headphone jack, ...
Last but not least, the choices to buy unlocked (android) phones in the US are abysmal and overpriced: ebay, Negri Electronics and ImportGSM ... that's IT? IMO all of these are just way too expensive, especially compared to what the 'rest of world' versions sell for.

I suggest you to wait until January to get a Android device

Rumor has it that the Sony Xperia X10, a high spec android phone with a 1GHz processor and high resolution screen (slighly taller than WVGA), will be coming to AT&T's network sometime next year. If you can, I'd wait and see what AT&T has to offer next year.

A Diamond is a very good phone too.

I sense that this holiday season is a big transition period for smartphones, so as alluded to in the other comments, there might be lots of good Android handsets coming.
If you don't want to wait thought, couple of options to consider:
1) Forum trading for phones. The HTC Android phones (like Magic and Dream, and even the Hero now is showing up) are between $200-300 in forums (like the Marketplace section on XDA ). If you do the homework and check references and such, forums are a great place to buy.
2) Apple stuff tend to hold their value quite well. So, especially if you can get an iPhone cheap on contract, selling it later (the 3GS now fetch $300-400 on forums) could make a good profit, even if Apple comes up with something new (their product refresh cycle is about every 6 months or so)
3) Waiting it out. Though I definitely see a downward shift of Andriod handsets towards more lower-end phones (which is good for me since I definitely cannot afford an X10) so its like that carriers would bring on phones like the Motorola CLIQ rather than the high end stuff like the Acer Liquid.

I COULD wait until January but word is very mum on at&t and it's android plans.
And in my experience there is at least 2-3 months of HEAVY rumors about a device's launch on at&t before the device ACTUALLY comes out.
The Sony Xperia x10 is a nice phone ... and so is the Acer Liquid A1. If the there was a firm release date for either on at&t and a price, I would be very tempted to wait. But so far it looks like the Dell mini 3xi might be the first android phone and I would not bet against someone telling me that the first android phone on at&t will come out in March. also, the dell is not exactly a high performance device.
I have to admit that I am also quite turned off by the lack of built in exchange support. WTF Google?

Samsung Captivate or Samsung Focus?

Short story: I'm up for an upgrade on AT&T and I can't decide between the Captivate and the Focus. I like Android and its massive amount of customization but WP7 looks amazing and I have a gut feeling it will be a pretty big success going forward.
Long story: So I signed up with AT&T on a family plan back in September of this year and, since I had just moved back to the US, I decided to save my money and use my own phone from abroad. I made this choice mostly because smartphones on AT&T were still kind of expensive and the only two options at the time were the Captivate and the HTC Aria. And they pretty much offered zero desirable free phones (before smartphones you could get some great phones for free).
About a month later, my phone started freaking out on me and still continues to do so. The phone restarts itself randomly throughout the day; this is an issue because it's a Sony Ericsson phone so it goes to the Phone Mode/Flight Mode screen before actually starting so I've missed quite a few calls. Over time the phone has also started to have issues picking up any signal at all, so I've been forced to restart the phone every time (and it temporarily fixes the problem).
This whole thing became a big headache and I got worried I would have to shell out $300+ for a decent off-contract or unlocked phone. Luckily, since I didn't get a phone on my line, AT&T is saying that I am eligible for an upgrade and I've been looking online and I've found some great deals.
Two deals in particular: the gorgeous Samsung Captivate for free and the drool-worthy Samsung Focus for $50 (both on Amazon). Both of these prices apply for an upgrade, so now I'm trying to decide which one I want. I love Android and its insane customizations (and the TouchWiz UI is not that bad tbh) and its awesome features (Navigation being a huge plus). But I am very tempted to get a WP7 device; gaming looks to be MUCH better and the whole UI is quite handsome in addition to being just blazing fast. And I know I'll be kicking myself if WP7 grows into a killer OS while I'm still stuck on 2.2 (and at that point 3.0 will probably be out and Sammy will have a new flagship Android).
Now I ask you XDA-ers: which one should I get?

I hate doing this but...bump.

I'm in the same boat. What decision did you end up making, and do you have any regrets?
For me the trade offs between the two are the Focus with the LED Flash, 8gb mem, and WP7. And tehn the Captivate with no LED Flash, 16gb mem, and Android
BUMP

Im an Android guy but go with the Focus, Ive used one many times and its wonderful, ive been using WP7 since february and its come a long way, also I know there are some cool features coming in an update next feb.

Now I really don't understand Mobile Phone Makers don't they just make a best phone

Now I'm not a mobile phone maker, but i do consider my self an active proponent of the Android Community. But there is one question that bothers me why don't phone manufacturers make a beast above all phone.
Now there are quite a few big players when it comes to Android phone manufacturers such as HTC, Samsung, Motorola, and LG those are the companies that i consider to be the TOP dogs (whether you choose to agree or not). Ok each company is known for certain things
HTC: Originally the most innovative of the bunch now in my opinion LG is becoming the most innovative, HTC builds excellent phone case-wise i personally prefer to have a heavier/thicker metal/plastic hybrid versus a plastic cheap a*s case that Samsung loves to use, HTC adopted the android OS first with the G1, you may not have noticed it but, HTC has rolled out the first LTE phone for all of the USA's major cell companies so far Sprint-EvO 4G, T-Mobile-G2 and MyTouch 4G, Verizon-Thunderbolt, and At&T-Inspire 4G, last time i checked there isn't any other manufacturer that can claim that they did that, HTC released the first pure 100% google experience with the Nexus One, and even if you didn't release it that phone was and still is a beast of a phone it is based off of the HTC Desire but it sported a great AMOLED screen, 1 GHz Qualcomm QSD 8250 Snapdragon ARM(which was the bomb). The great majority of HTC's phones have came pre-installed with the newest Firmware rather it be 2.1 or 2.2(they havent released a phone with 2.3 yet but non of the manufactures have yet right?(excluding the Nexus S). HTC although they utilize their own skin on top of Android OS called Sense UI and although i have never purchased a HTC phone i've always wanted one for this single reason it is by far the best manufactures skin when compared with MOTOBLUR, TouchWIz, and idk what LG's is called i do believe its LG Star ui but im not sure. And the biggest problem with Android is phones getting supported and HTC in my opinion upgrades the greater majority of its phones @ least once and usually in a timely manner thats something that Samsung cant say and Mototola definitely cant say now for LG they just recently stepped into the ball game so only time will tell.
Samsung- Just stepped into the real ball game with their Galaxy S devices now their devices are great hardware wise with their super ultra sexy Super Amoled screens and soon to have Super Amoled plus screens they sport those lovely Hummingbird Proccesors, but they had a huge dowfall they were released with the already old 2.1 Eclair update when the 2.1 froyo had already been out for sometime which imo is stupid and lazy they also put on top of their phones the most disgusting and horrendous skin their Touch Wiz which is horrible but meh i guess the product sells. There biggest downfall is not supporting phones such as their failed Behold 2 which didn't see a upgrade over 1.6. Their Galaxy S devices just recently began to receive updates to the Vibrant and the Evo 4G began to get its 2.2 but i guess it was recalled, Fascinate no update still on 2.1, Captivate i believe it has received its update but non the less thats ridiculous to wait so long for an update that should have been there already. Their phones are great but software not so great very simple.
LG-Very little is known about LG besides they have quite a few of great high ed phones coming very soon and their midrange Optimus One line is very impressive as a mid range phone at least.
Motorola(lol i accidently forgot them)- Moto well what to say they stepped into the Android game with the release of the Moto Cliq which was by far one of the worst phones ever imo how do u release a phone for $200 and then a month later release a phone with way superior specs the original Moto Droid for the same price if not cheaper some places and then call the 2 phones equals thats insanity the Moto CLiq was released with 1.5 which was donut i believe then was upgraded to 1.6 cupcake were it stayed at forever it was completely tied down with Motoblur if you hate motoblur now hows it is on the DRoid X it ws completely worst on the cliq and the worst part was the locked bootloader so very few roms existed for the Cliq and even the roms couldnt remove the Blur their was one exception the Eclair2CLiq rom which was great but stopped getting support so it was never finished anyways. Motorola has always been about the money im positive that it has a contract with Verizon because verizon has always gotten their high end sh*t Droid Droid2 Droid X and now the Xoom while the other companies have gotten the worst phones possible T-mobile: Defy, Cliq, Cliq XT, Cliq 2, and that one phone thats just a rectangle looking blackberry thing, and 1 more cant think of name either. At&T: had the crappy blackflip then they got the cool a*s Atrix. So Moto is always a hit or miss in my eyes i will never buy from moto because they tie their phones down wayyy 2 much if its not on Verizon and now At&T. Sprint doesnt even have a Moto phone thats android. Moto also has the dreaded bootloader locks which makes the already crappy phone even crappier and if its a good phone it makes it so you cant root or even if you can root it wont be a full root experience like Overclocking and CM7 etc.
So for now IMO HTC owns all by a football field to be honest
Now to my main question why doesn't a company say hey we can make a great phone that has all the features people wont and it will be great and sell well and everything we can put it on all carriers like the Galaxy S devices and the Optimus V/M/S/T/C/and anymore i forgot.
I personally would like to find in my found @ minimum 16 GB of internal memory(like the Samsung Vibrant/Nexus S), A kickstand (just like the HTC Thunderbolt and Evo 4G), A HDMI out connector, 720p recording capabilites, a 8mp camera @ bare minimum, 4G radios depending on the Carrier, a decent stock battery ie 1800 MaH or even 2000 MaH something decent, a lovely screen size better yet make 2 different choices for screens 4" and 4.3" thats the best 2 sizes imo, you can make a slider version for those slider people, come with a dual core proccesor of some sort rather it be Tegra, Hummingbird, Qualcomm, TI, or whatever else is out their, Come pre-installed with @ least 16gb SD CARD, come preloaded with the newest most recent Android update even if you use your skin ie Sense @ least make a separate partion on the phone that the User can flash or make an App similar to Rom Manager yet make it wayyyyy easier to utilize but make it so you can run a completely stock version of Android, come with a decent loud speaker not these tiny lite baby ones like the Galazy S and Nexus S devices im talking about ones like the Thunderbolt or LG's optimus devices(they have great speakers), come with NFC just for the hell of it, strong vibrate, stop using these crappy screens WVGA etc only use SAMOLED/PLUS or since samsung doesn't have enough for their own product even you can use the next best thing avaialbe which is qHD or that Super Clear LCD/PLUS, these are really not that big of demands to find in a phone they're actual very simple please take a look into it and tell me if this is to hard to find in a phone?

Price and affordability and compactness. For a device to feature all that, it'd be ridiculously expensive, probably >€1000 sim free. Also, to fit all that in a phone, you'd have to carry an absolute brick in your pocket. Unfeasable as of yet.

There's no point in making a single, killer handset because you that would mean you'd stop innovating and that leads to stagnation.
Nokia effectively had the killer phone for years - 90% of people I knew would have a variant of the basic Nokia handset (they varied in size but the features were the same) - and look what happened there...
You have to remember that people have a wide variety of needs too -not everyone wants a $400 'does everything' handset - there's still people who don't even text!!

I could've sworn sprint had a low end motorola i1 android phone?

Timing and market drive some development but alot of development is a function of when to release to maximize profit. Then, you start providing horizontal integration that is: to provide X then add X+1 then X+2 etc. That way they can sell you the phone at a discount once you are hooked then they sell you all the update @ retail....... ergo more profit. Sucks, but that the American way !

It's not a feasible business model to put out one killer phone and forget about it.

At the moment the scale goes from Dumbphone, few features but great battery life -> Smartphone, feature filled, crappy battery life.
Build a phone with every possible feature and you'd need to carry a generator around with you.

@ OP
lol, dude you are very naive.

Eh, I may dislike android but some of your info is a bit off. For instance the Cliq actually did see a 2.1 update which goes to show they may not be the absolute worst when it comes to updating devices. Samsung takes that cake in my opinion. The Cliq also wasn't too much lesser than the droid, the droid was just in a much fancier casing. Manufacturers would not make a perfect phone because then they would have a pinnacle issue. People would only be going for that phone and all other phones would be ignored including the OEM's other endeavors. Not to mention there is no device that would fit everyone. Your device may sound perfect to you but to me it holds all the issues that leave android lacking in my opinion so they release multiple devices to appease the masses.

rawr4dj said:
So for now IMO HTC owns all by a football field to be honest
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I have felt this way too, especially validated by fact that I have bought 5 in a row HTC smartphones ---
(1) way way back: WindowsMobile > T-Mobile MDA
(2) way back: WindowsMobile > T-Mobile Wing
(3) 2 years back: Android: HTC Hero (actually bought 2 of them, liked it so much)
(4) 1 year ago: Android: HTC Desire (worked flawlessly til about 3 months ago where a problematic USB port surfaced - later found out thru web searches that its sister model, the Sprint Evo, had this problem like CRAZY, and tons of returns and warranty replacements -- however, HTC in my case is NOT HONORING THE WARRANTY)
(5) 3 months ago: Android: myTouch 4G (HTC Glacier) --- this is a kickass phone that I still believe is very underrated because of its branding with T-Mobile) but has more internal memory to hold more apps than even nexus s
However ....
HTC America is really screwing up the BRAND REPUTATION of HTC overall. They are not only completely disorganized, but if anyone has ever called their tech suppoort, they are generally clueless, reading off of LCD screens worse that AT&T phone support -- and that's saying a lot, you can't get any worse than AT&T level 1 Support, they define "HORRIBLE CLUELESS SCRIPT-READING CUSTOMER SERVICE". But that is nothing compared to trying to get WARRANTY REPAIR WORK done by HTC AMERICA. My phone is under 1 year old, with a 2 year warranty for defective parts & labor, and yet HTC AMERICA says I am out of warranty and to fix this defective USB port --- again -- just google MICRO USB PORT HTC DESIRE ... or EVO and you can't miss it... and HTC America says they are happy to repair it for $ 317.43 .
So, I tell you what, this is having a serious impact on my next purchase. I don't have time for this bull****. And they could give a rat's ass about my customer loyalty. I've been buying HTC phones longer than the majority of their goons have even been employed there. You ask someone "Oh, how long have you been with HTC?" And you're lucky if you get "2 years".... Me -- more like 7 years. I don;t expect first line phone support to have such tenure. But when they are complete idiots...
(SEE MY THREAD FOR ACTUAL DIALOGUE AND you'll understand my statement)
... I'm sorry but this goes to overall management of a global corporation. And in this hyper-competitive space, if they don't clean up their act, they may not survive. That's not an overstatement. I thought that, with this site having formed around the HTC "XDA" all these years ago, and HTC having been ahead of the curve all these years, and they kept Windows Mobile alive by innovations like TouchFlo etc which compensated for WinMo's 6pt type size and stylus UI after the iPhone debuted, that they were probably the #1 smartphone device maker. I just assumed that.
Someone can pull the stats, but no, I was shocked to find out at the end of 2010, the pivotal year where Android just exploded -- starting with Oct 2009's Moto DROID launch, then Jan's NEXUS 1 launch -- then phone after phone in 2010, and so many HTC models, that HTC's marketshare as device maker was TINY -- fractional ... It shocked me.
So, I'm just saying... They launched their multi-million dollar "YOU" BRANDING CAMPAIGN last year I'm sure to help propel the name HTC into the brains of people who had used HTC products for many years, but many times they were co-branded by carrier names for those phones, and most average consumers weren't even aware the name HTC .... and yet their share is so small. Well, if they treat EXISTING LONG-TIME CUSTOMERS this way, they will erode their existing base. And why would I have any further brand loyalty?
Samsung is making great stuff, so is Motorola. The next device i get will be a tablet. After that, I will NOT be upgrading and buying new phones every year or 2... They will have reached a point of diminishing returns.
So, HTC better clean up their act in America or it's 再见 new phone.

you are right but that phone was for boost mobile

You seem to be quite rich
why dont you buy me a high end phone i really really need one . but i cant afford damnit!

Technology evolves
I think one you call beast today will not be a beast tomorrow.
Again phone manufacturer has to keep price in mind.

HTC is not even close to owning the whole football field.
Besides an unlocked bootloader which is changing now they are nothing special.
Every phone looks the same with minimal difference in specs.
All these companies cater to a wide range of people so thus why no one super mega phone.

Best is relative to time. What may be the best today may not be the the best tomorrow.

The best phone is already the G2

Kailkti said:
Best is relative to time. What may be the best today may not be the the best tomorrow.
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The best today is definitely NOT the best tomorrow. Nothing will ever be the best.
Not to mention that the OP's 'best phone' doesn't equal to another person's 'best'.

Agreed, a 1ghz processor will be laughed at in the next 2 years or so.
Whaddup dual core?
and it's only gonna get better

they already made a phone with quad core and 5 inch screen lol o hate to big screens though.
Sent from my LG-P500 using XDA

Post is a year old mate.

Is it just me or are the phone manufacturers getting out of control?

I feel like Android phone manufacturers are making so many new phones no one can even keep up anymore. (Unless you have thousands of dollars to invest into phones). I just bought a droid Charge in August 2011 and pretty much there are 3-4 phones out or that will be out that are better in the next 2 weeks.
Personally I think they are making to many phones to fast and they are not giving the older phones the updates they need. This could turn in to a major fail. Just wanted to hear some other peoples thoughts on this issue.

Riddlin said:
I feel like Android phone manufacturers are making so many new phones no one can even keep up anymore. (Unless you have thousands of dollars to invest into phones). I just bought a droid Charge in August 2011 and pretty much there are 3-4 phones out or that will be out that are better in the next 2 weeks.
Personally I think they are making to many phones to fast and they are not giving the older phones the updates they need. This could turn in to a major fail. Just wanted to hear some other peoples thoughts on this issue.
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get used to it br0. It's the cycle of technology. You can NEVER keep up. Just love what you have.

I do love what I had. That is why I just sold it on ebay. LOL I want the latest and greatest, but this is getting ridiculous. Who in the heck wants to hang with their old droid when there are 20 better phones out there within a year. Either Apple is on something or they are on to something. 1 new phone ever 6 months to a year and people go nutz for the fricking thing.

My advice evaluate the phone technology and its likelihood to be supported. These are the 2 most critical items to consider.
I have had a Galaxy phone since its release and I waited for it for 5 months before getting it............ because I knew it was going to have tech that would endure for a while. Now, we have the dual cores everywhere. Beware, just because it is dual core does not make it a great phone. Make sure to check everything out, and make sure it will be supported. Finally, As soon as you get a dual core in ........2012 there will be quad cores..........and so it goes...........

illuminarias said:
get used to it br0. It's the cycle of technology. You can NEVER keep up. Just love what you have.
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exactly the same goes for PCs

Riddlin said:
I do love what I had. That is why I just sold it on ebay. LOL I want the latest and greatest, but this is getting ridiculous. Who in the heck wants to hang with their old droid when there are 20 better phones out there within a year. Either Apple is on something or they are on to something. 1 new phone ever 6 months to a year and people go nutz for the fricking thing.
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Well, yeah. Then commercial groups offering spaceship travels for big money definietly shouldn't do it, but wait until everyone can afford it.
If only having the best phone makes you feel the best I feel sorry for you. : (

Riddlin said:
I want the latest and greatest
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Then the problem is clearly you and not the manufacturers. Ask yourself why you always want the latest and greatest. What significant and meaningful difference does it make in your day-to-day life.

Riddlin said:
I feel like Android phone manufacturers are making so many new phones no one can even keep up anymore. (Unless you have thousands of dollars to invest into phones). I just bought a droid Charge in August 2011 and pretty much there are 3-4 phones out or that will be out that are better in the next 2 weeks.
Personally I think they are making to many phones to fast and they are not giving the older phones the updates they need. This could turn in to a major fail. Just wanted to hear some other peoples thoughts on this issue.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The carriers will never update their phones as quickly as we would like, but we have CM7, Miui and other distributions to fix that.

Do you upgrade a laptop every 3-4 months? Likely not.
'phones' are becoming similar.
Also, Android being a powerful free OS allows many phone makers to get in on making a smartphone quite quickly. This is a good thing, not a bad one.
I dont go to the food store and complain there are too many different types of bread. Choice is a luxury.
/firstworldproblems

There is a problem.
The problem isnt choice or speed of new handsets. Its the fact these handset makers seem to be going out of there way to hold back features just to create more options.
Nearly every choice you make you sacrifice something that shouldnt be. This last year Samsung was incredibly guilty of that.
We shouldnt have to pick between the phone with the best camera or the best screen 3g or 4g when theyre released with identical specs within a few weeks/months of each other.
You end up with a situation where IMO since 3GS/NexusOne were both available at same time theres basically no best handset to get. They all have some glaring downside that often seems intentional. Nexus Galaxy having weak gpu/pentile screen/5mp camera for a flasgship phone is the calling card of this awful trend.
Hopefully Google buying Moto means a true flagship android phone will be out in the future. HTCs lousy digitizer selection , and Samsungs half assed approach really are getting on my nerves.
Win7 just needs more options PERIOD.

Actually I'm happy I'm a reviewer and I get all the newest models for a week only. I never have to regret my choice and invest in next generations and upgrades.
That's why I chose a mid-tier device - If review phones must be wiped, I can still keep my data on my Ace and customize how I want.
It's good that technology is moving so fast. You buy a thing, but there are many others that haven't bought this thing. If they were iPhoners, they would have to wait until June (or October in 4s case) till the next model.
But Androiders and WP7ists just go in the store and buy tech that is up to date, because it is released just weeks ago and so specs are always at its zenith.

Phone manufacturers are really going out of control. They produce phones with specs that are missing, then include them in their next offerings. but then they produce phones which are pretty much the same as the ones before except for 1 or 2 upgrades to increase sales.
They like to make their products 'diverse' but if you look on the bird's eye view of it. It becomes clear that they are just going for quantity without quality products.
Why don't they just drop down a killer phone whose specs will stay for at most 2 years?
Better buy a product which suits you for the next year or two

I think it's great, actually. People only THINK they need the latest and greatest device, when they don't. I rather have 5 new phones come out in a 2 week period than having to wait for something for a year or so. With android, there's little chance of you not finding the PERFECT phone for you. (Mines is the SK4G, I can care less about any other phone now)
The only problem I see with rapid phone releases is updates. I highly doubt the Sidekick 4G, even with it coming out earlier this year, will see ICS... let alone Gingerbread, because they're forgotten about/ not important enough.
Honestly, if you have a rooted GB device, and it runs how you like it, do you need to worry about the newer phones?

yujin_11 said:
Why don't they just drop down a killer phone whose specs will stay for at most 2 years?
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Because, short of Apple and their ability as a small company producing both hardware and software,there is not profit in that. Companies are out to make money, it is not their fault that the wealthy people of the world have decided that they must have the latest phone no matter what, that's on the consumer.

I bought a Nexus One in April 2010 and I've not felt tempted to replace it before now because it runs Gingerbread and newer phones didn't seem to offer that much more.
However, the release of the Galaxy Note with the stylus for accurate screen pointing and screen large enough and with sufficient resolution to display entire Web page makes an upgrade now worthwhile to me. Zooming and panning a small phone screen across a Web page to find specific points of interest is a pain and I look forward to leaving that experience behind.

zerocool79346 said:
Because, short of Apple and their ability as a small company producing both hardware and software,there is not profit in that. Companies are out to make money, it is not their fault that the wealthy people of the world have decided that they must have the latest phone no matter what, that's on the consumer.
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^What he said

yujin_11 said:
Phone manufacturers are really going out of control. They produce phones with specs that are missing, then include them in their next offerings. but then they produce phones which are pretty much the same as the ones before except for 1 or 2 upgrades to increase sales.
They like to make their products 'diverse' but if you look on the bird's eye view of it. It becomes clear that they are just going for quantity without quality products.
Why don't they just drop down a killer phone whose specs will stay for at most 2 years?
Better buy a product which suits you for the next year or two
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Click to collapse
Because if they play apple's game, they will lose horribly. Apple is apple, and apple is the standard whether you like it or not. When a average person compares a phone, what does he compare it to? The iPhone of course. So a manufacturer will not survive if they only release a oh so powerful phone every year or two, simply because they do not have nearly as much of a fan base apple has.

it's really awesome imo
always something to be excited about
I love waiting for a phone I've been wanting to drop in price, and while I wait, an even better phone gets released lmao

http://www.facebook.com/motorola?sk=wall&filter=1 click the link people like it and comment on it.
I have seen first hand proof of this working. I had an evo 3d. Htc decided all futre devices would have locked bootliaders well that made alot of people angry. Someone posted a thread on xda suggesting we let htc know that is not gna fly. So it turnd out thousands of people got on there facebook wall and twitter. Guess what the next day htc released a statement saying that they wanted too keep there coustamers happy and that the bootloader would be unlocked. They were. Id like to be able too have a device and not have too get a new one juzt because moto or htc or sammy wants too put them out constantly get people too buy them and then ditch them and out out another. The atrix is 100 percent capable of runing ics and theres no excuae for it l not too recieve it just because moto wants people too buy new devices every couple months. I know many many people feel the same way well as i said we have the power too change that if people would stop bickering and take it seriously. And also if moto started supporting devices longer not just bug fixes but the new android flavors. Id definately make my next device a moto it would do nothing but benefit them

Kailkti said:
Because if they play apple's game, they will lose horribly. Apple is apple, and apple is the standard whether you like it or not. When a average person compares a phone, what does he compare it to? The iPhone of course. So a manufacturer will not survive if they only release a oh so powerful phone every year or two, simply because they do not have nearly as much of a fan base apple has.
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I think it is this statement that sums it all up. Very well said.

I actually WANT to pay more for my phones, and here is why?

With iPhones beginning to show its age, and Android phones coming out with faster processors, more PPI, and more premium materials, I think Android is in a prime position to take the crown here. But with this fierce competition, I'm starting to notice more and more quality control issues, weird design decisions, and what seems to be less-than-thorough testing before release.
Take the HTC One and Galaxy S4 for example. Both are getting high praises from reviewers, and people are generally happy with these devices. But looking at the forums here, the problems that people have about these phone are glaring and very noticeable but at the same time not necessary/innate, meaning that it could have been easily avoided by both manufactures with just a bit more attention to detail, better testing, and better quality control. The shear number of people who have dead pixels on their HTC One is mind boggling for example, where they have to go through exchange after exchange in order to get one without dead pixels. Looking at one of the poles, 60% reported at least one defective pixel! The lack of a menu button, or an out-of-the box option to long press for menu baffles me even more. Yes, you can root/unlock and mod the phone (and maybe lose your warranty or brick it), but how about that person who is switching from an iPhone to an HTC One who has no desire to modify their phone? Are they not going to be turned off by that ugly black box taking up an appreciable portion of their screen real estate? Then there are many people who are turned off by the gaps in HTC claimed "zero" gap design. Again doing exchange, after exchange in order to get a "good one".
Same story with the S4 with its lags, screen smearing, the always-on red pixels.....and now they are trying to fix these issues with firmware updates. These are problems that are apparent straight out of the box. Its not like HTC or Samsung could not have noticed them during testing. Someone didn't complain to HTC about that black box during testing? HTC couldn't require that a majority of its LCDs be free of pixel defect? Samsung didn't notice the ugly smearing in their menus, or the burgundy tinted blacks before release? None of the testers reported to Samsung about their god-awful Dialer app? (I'm talking about the ATT version, not sure about the international version here). No one noticed the glaring lag in at least some of the tested devices?
I mean, why shoot yourself in the foot with these easily avoidable problems? These phones are close to perfection, and in a strange way, it makes these kind of problems even harder to swallow. Why have all this great hardware under the hood, and then handicap it in the worst way with some stupid design decision, QC problems, or an obvious lack of usability testing prior to release?
Part of the problem might be that we are demanding more for our money. The 1080p LCD/AMOLED isn't cheap, machining a piece of aluminum isnt cheap, the Snapdraon 600 isn't cheap, Gorilla Glass 3 isnt cheap...so maybe Samsung/ HTC skimp on testing prior to release or demanding less from quality control. But is that what we want going forward? We all love new toys, but the joy and excitement of having a new gadget fades away quickly after you take it out of the box. Having to wait for firmware updates, or holding off to buy in hopes of a new stock, just makes the novelty fade away even quicker.
I for one would like cellphone manufacturers to take more of my money but give me a better product out of the box. Charge me more, but don't knowingly skimp somewhere. The more I think about it, the more I realize how cheap cellphones really are considering all the bells whistle they come with. I rarely use my laptop anymore unless I need to type up a paper or to do photo/video editing. I'm a gadget junky, through and through. Like many of you, I spend a good amount of my hard earned cash on newer and better TVs, cameras, game consoles, PC components, laptops, etc etc. But I must say, none of those have required more exchanges, more returns, and more DOH!s than cellphones.
My question to tech junkies and laymans alike is, where do you stand? would be willing to pay more than that ubiquitous $200 for a high-tiered subsidized phone, if you knew it was "Muaaaaaaaaaa" *kisses fingertips* out-of-the box and not have to wait for a firmware update? Would you pay more If you knew you wouldn't have to exchange it countless times in order to get a "good one"? How much more? .....or you could just say "Sam, you are an ass for typing all this"

$200?! What?!
The S4 is 649 euro's....
And you're asking if I'd be willing to pay even more?! What the hell do you expect us to pay, 1200 euros?!
Send From My Samsung Galaxy S3 Using Tapatalk 2

Pat. said:
Ass
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In response to your unedited post....the whole point is to not have to wait for these glaring bugs and QC issues to be fixed. By that time newer phones will be out.

ShadowLea said:
$200?! What?!
The S4 is 649 euro's....
And you're asking if I'd be willing to pay even more?! What the hell do you expect us to pay, 1200 euros?!
Send From My Samsung Galaxy S3 Using Tapatalk 2
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LOL No, no i wasnt suggesting anything that drastic. Maybe a 50 dollars/euros increase.
PC compenent manufacturers do something similar with their "binned" versions of hardware; where they cherry pick chips/ram/vrm/controllers and sell the finished product at a slightly higher price. im not saying we should necessarily have a "binned" and regular versions of phones, but what Im hoping for is for phone manufacturers to do better inspection, better testing, and hold higher standards for what they release out in the market, even if the price goes slightly above what the consumers are use to be paying

: D
yea fair enough, I just thought "Ass" was funnier.
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I'm with you, except I disagree with paying more. If these companies want to lead the market, they HAVE to test them thoroughly before they sell them. I will say that I think Google's level of testing is very high. For that reason, I think I'm only going to get Nexus phones until they give me a reason not to.

I would pay more for a phone if everything worked and was good quality. i mostly do development with my phones and the phone i have right now has always had gps issues with none of the fixes ive ever found to help. quality damnit!

Ecksera said:
I would pay more for a phone if everything worked and was good quality. i mostly do development with my phones and the phone i have right now has always had gps issues with none of the fixes ive ever found to help. quality damnit!
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I'm with you! You can change software but not quality hardware

LOL
:laugh:
very long article. i would like to pay more only if i found it is worth , for example the hardwarequality , antishock , and more

I think the biggest problem is not in the price pressure, but in the time pressure. We want more and more quickly. The time it takes for device development (both hardware and software) is getting shorter. This means that engineers have less time to polish the device and hence the initial releases can be at most considered early beta releases.
Of course you can try to leverage that by employing more engineers, but this won't buy you much time.
So instead of offering more money for a phone I'd rather suggest giving the manufacturers more time to thoroughly develop and test their toys before launching them.

Mitt Romney jr, is that you?

KrissN said:
I think the biggest problem is not in the price pressure, but in the time pressure. We want more and more quickly. The time it takes for device development (both hardware and software) is getting shorter. This means that engineers have less time to polish the device and hence the initial releases can be at most considered early beta releases.
Of course you can try to leverage that by employing more engineers, but this won't buy you much time.
So instead of offering more money for a phone I'd rather suggest giving the manufacturers more time to thoroughly develop and test their toys before launching them.
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I agree. I think the manufacturers know how to make good hardware and software they are just rushed to release a new phone before their competitor releases theirs. Maybe phones could be released like cars. Then we could all wonder what the "2014's will look like".
Sent from my HTC One using xda premium

JustLiveIt said:
I agree. I think the manufacturers know how to make good hardware and software they are just rushed to release a new phone before their competitor releases theirs. Maybe phones could be released like cars. Then we could all wonder what the "2014's will look like".
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I think we're reaching that point now, actually, or not far from it. This new x phone that leaked it a great example. Last year's hardware, but the idea is probably going to be more about good battery life or something like that.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus

lol if someone if switching from Apple, it tends to be for better reason than never-modding or some stock FW aesthetic.
Honestly, ~$600-850 for new phones that are marginally better than last quarter's is already asking quite a bit, so even more and I'll just go back to old brick phones for all the right reasons.
Also our US carriers butchering hardware for god knows what purpose into clunky excuses for what originals were supposed to be.
I'm not really all that happy with the whole smartphone boom over the past 4 years. I quite enjoyed when these toys required proper owners who even knew of their existence.

I DO NOT want to pay more for a phone.
Why ?
Because the $600 or $700 tag already is several hundred dollars over material cost. Yes, they need to account for labour, shipping, and profit but take a look at Google and the Nexus line. Is it because Google can afford to take a loss on the hardware knowing that by using it you'll drive their revenue ? I don't think they would sell at a loss, but I'm open to being moderately surprised if that is the case. I'd guess they're breaking even.
There's no point in paying more for things that could be improved at the same price-point and still drive profit.
What WOULD help ?
Stop signing contracts that screw you for a subsidized phone. They have no incentive to make those phones as perfect as they can - they need some reason for you to keep re-signing that contract two years from now - they WANT you to be wanting to get rid of that phone. Why would they keep updating the firmware when they don't even want you to be using it two years from now ? Why not just have you keep paying them high monthly fees so you can get a "newer and better" phone for cheap (a cost they'll recover from you and then some) ?
What would help is people moving to buying their phones outright and demanding more for what they are paying - driving the market by where they're willing to spend money.
I don't think the components of a smartphone are "not cheap". They kind of are since the material cost is only $2-300. That's less than a decent desktop PC. Yes, it's a decent chunk of change but we're talking smartphones here, they're nice to have but still a luxury good (although I'd agree that a regular cell phone is not a luxury in this day and age). Many people pay more than $300 for a pair of shoes - a pair of Allen Edmonds is $350 ffs and that's $350 on some leather and stitching that people get romantic about - not an electronic device that can pinpoint your location by GPS, holy your music library, and play Netflix. A smartphone is a tiny computer, I would expect it to be priced as such.
So, no, please don't "charge me more" when there is no reason to. Please just have some quality control, although I don't really think it's a big deal because I'm not picky I guess. O well.

The theory behind what you're saying makes sense, but in reality at least here in Canada the prices have already increased a lot the past 3 years.
HTC desire came out almost 3 years ago here in Canada and it was the flagship phone. Full price no contract was $449.99. Then the HTC desire HD came out as its predecessor and it was $499. The desire z was also 499 launching around that time too.
The HTC one s was I think $550 and the one x $599 but dont quote me on that.
Now the HTC one is $650 and others from Samsung are $700. Iphones have always been more but I'm pretty sure they have been increasing steadily as well. So really how much do you want them to increase it? I take it you're very wealthy. Lol
Sent from my Desire HD using xda app-developers app

You're paying for the brand most of the time.. not actual quality

KrissN said:
I think the biggest problem is not in the price pressure, but in the time pressure. We want more and more quickly. The time it takes for device development (both hardware and software) is getting shorter. This means that engineers have less time to polish the device and hence the initial releases can be at most considered early beta releases.
Of course you can try to leverage that by employing more engineers, but this won't buy you much time.
So instead of offering more money for a phone I'd rather suggest giving the manufacturers more time to thoroughly develop and test their toys before launching them.
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I'd agree with that.. I honestly don't see it as as price issue. The life cycles of new phones currently is ridiculous. It seem like by the time one concept is finalized they move on to "the next big thing" and try to mass produce as many of the currently "new" product before next version is released, sometimes in less than a year.

I' m good with mine...
To be completely honest, I got my phone for.99 cents and have never been happier...I don't need multi window nonsense on it and with dev ROMs on here I am fixing to get 4.2.2. So for that price who cares if it burns up but my first and only one is bug free and fast after the OC kernel soooo....
sent from my SGH-I577/Slimbean/1.5oc LZ kernel

I'm not sure how much benefit a manufacturer has to gain from creating a premium smartphone.
Such a project will cost untold amounts of resources with no real promise of consumer acceptance.
Apple pretty much set the precedent for competitive pricing with the $200 subsidized price tag. It has become the main reference point when consumers consider their purchases. New Android phone, specs x, y, and z for $300. Well, the immediate thought is going to be... "so what makes this so great that it is $100 above the iPhone's price tag?"
That is why I think the smartphone market does not have room for a "high end", because the $200 range is already a high end.