I see Microsoft reported on version of the surface sold out of pre order. initial estimates were 2-5 million units (including all the models) were on hand for pre order.
I'm curious if anyone has seen links to estimated numbers of sales of the sold out units. a million,100000, 10000?
haven't seen a big grinning "I told you so" mug from balmer yet... hmmm
post whatchafind here.
I'm sure that the stock they have made available online is nowhere near the number of units that they have actually produced for availability. The online stock was probably a small quantity. Of course, I'm sure we won't know much about numbers till after launch.
Don't forget they need to have units available to ship to other retailers and they need to have units to ship to their own stores. I think at this point, pre-ordering at a Microsoft Store is your best bet.
The number would be really small maybe even not an amount but a clever marketing person going after x amount of time we will display the cheapest version as out of stock! This then creates a panic in the wait and see crowd who then jump in and pre order the higher models. Basically I wouldn't believe anything you see till they produce numbers as this is the typical rubbish people pull. I mean isn't it amazing how EVERY xmas the current games consoles go out of stock only to all of a sudden have loads in the last couple of weeks??? They know that loads of people would want to wait and see but if they do then you don't get high first sales and you stall but if you make people think they might miss out its amazing how many people will jump at it.
That said I hope they have sold loads and cant wait to get mine, after an initial worry on pricing I have decided its worth it, after all you can run bluestacks for apps so that's now not a problem
lumpaywk said:
The number would be really small maybe even not an amount but a clever marketing person going after x amount of time we will display the cheapest version as out of stock! This then creates a panic in the wait and see crowd who then jump in and pre order the higher models. Basically I wouldn't believe anything you see till they produce numbers as this is the typical rubbish people pull. I mean isn't it amazing how EVERY xmas the current games consoles go out of stock only to all of a sudden have loads in the last couple of weeks??? They know that loads of people would want to wait and see but if they do then you don't get high first sales and you stall but if you make people think they might miss out its amazing how many people will jump at it.
That said I hope they have sold loads and cant wait to get mine, after an initial worry on pricing I have decided its worth it, after all you can run bluestacks for apps so that's now not a problem
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
BlueStacks is a regular desktop application - RT does not run desktop applications, unfortunately.
Valerianus said:
BlueStacks is a regular desktop application - RT does not run desktop applications, unfortunately.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Please check this link http://bluestacks.com/technology/ You will see that there will be an ARM bluestacks for windows 8 launch (maybe a small wait).
"•Android on Windows (for ARM):
Run Android on Windows on ARM architectures starting with the Windows 8 release"
lumpaywk said:
The number would be really small maybe even not an amount but a clever marketing person going after x amount of time we will display the cheapest version as out of stock! This then creates a panic in the wait and see crowd who then jump in and pre order the higher models.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The trouble is that the higher models of the Surface are now on backorder too. Some people may not bother preordering, anymore.
Looks like the last week of October will be a fun week. All three of the Big Boys (APL, MSFT, GOOG) will be releasing new toys: iPad Mini, Surface RT, and rumored Nexus 10 by Samsung.
The Samsung Nexus 10 if true should be a beast. 2560x1600, likely Exynos 5 Dual (5250) based on Cortex-A15. Base pricing should be same as iPad. If so, we'd be looking at three 10"-ish tabs from the three platforms at the same $499 price.
Out of the three, Nexus 10 would win on hardware, iPad on software (apps). Doesn't look good for Surface RT, no matter how MS spins the "low-res is just as good as hi-res".
e.mote said:
Looks like the last week of October will be a fun week. All three of the Big Boys (APL, MSFT, GOOG) will be releasing new toys: iPad Mini, Surface RT, and rumored Nexus 10 by Samsung.
The Samsung Nexus 10 if true should be a beast. 2560x1600, likely Exynos 5 Dual (5250) based on Cortex-A15. Base pricing should be same as iPad. If so, we'd be looking at three 10"-ish tabs from the three platforms at the same $499 price.
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Click to collapse
Meh... It's still just Android, only on a bigger, high-res screen, running smartphone apps... Double meh for iPad Mini and the same boring UI on a 7" screen...
Although, I do agree on the screen resolution. I don't understand why MS didn't specify at least a 1080 screen on the RT especially with Office pre-installed. Windows Phone 8 on a 4"-5" screen, Windows 8 RT on a 10" tablet, Windows 8 Pro on a 27" desktop, Xbox w/ kinect on a 50" TV and SmartGlass to connect them all... what more do you need?
>I don't understand why MS didn't specify at least a 1080 screen on the RT
I think it's because of a long development cycle. The Surface specs were probably finalized some time last year, when 1280x800 tablets (and the $499 price) were still the norm. The low-priced KFs and N7s didn't exist then.
BTW, here's a good read on Steven Sinofsky, the exec in charge of the whole Windows initiatives, including Surface. His rigid management style, as depicted in the piece, may be the underlying reason for Surface's current state.
http://news.cnet.com/8301-10805_3-57536905-75/steven-sinofsky-microsofts-controversial-mr-windows-8/
e.mote said:
>I don't understand why MS didn't specify at least a 1080 screen on the RT
I think it's because of a long development cycle. The Surface specs were probably finalized some time last year, when 1280x800 tablets (and the $499 price) were still the norm. The low-priced KFs and N7s didn't exist then.
BTW, here's a good read on Steven Sinofsky, the exec in charge of the whole Windows initiatives, including Surface. His rigid management style, as depicted in the piece, may be the underlying reason for Surface's current state.
http://news.cnet.com/8301-10805_3-57536905-75/steven-sinofsky-microsofts-controversial-mr-windows-8/
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Click to collapse
I think also going with a higher res screen has its tradeoffs - requires more battery consumption(screen is the main factor in battery life) and smoothness of the OS. Isn't this an issue wit hthe Ipda3 vs the Iad 2 - I head battery was worse. My wife has a Nexus 7, and the great thing about it is the OS is snappy, partially because its only a 7 inch screen but running a quad core to drive it.
I know the screen display has become a big issue with Apple - But the Surface is at least better than the Ipad 2 (maybe not the Ipad 3) but again, aren't we all getting caught up in specs without knowing implementation and real world use. Its funny how Apple is focusing on how their screen is better, but they are still running a dual core processor, and fall short in so many other areas including usb, micro SD. But one thing I am curious about is implementation of USB devices on RT - how compatible will it be considering there may not be drivers for everything.
I do agree with MS that resolution alone isn't everything - Contrast has a lot to do with it. I am still running a 2005 50" Panasonic plasma at home that is only 720p but I have to tell you it looks just as good as some cheap 1080ps I have seen lately. There's the same argument when it comes to megapixel counts on camers with cheap CMOS (More is not always better).
We have to remember we are also just talking about a 10" screen.
I have my 64gb Surface with touch cover on orderand will have on or before 26th (Ordered it before the backorder came on). I Am curious what the return policy is for Microsoft Online store if this thing turns out to be a dud after all.
>I know the screen display has become a big issue with Apple - But the Surface is at least better than the Ipad 2 (maybe not the Ipad 3)
This is PR spin coming out of MS. Nobody knows how Surface RT fares in a head-to-head match against iPad 2/3, because MS still hasn't let anyone review it. May be the spin is right, and may be not, but I'd rather hear it from a less biased source.
Anyway, the spin falls apart when one considers that MS is pricing the RT against iPad 3 (actually higher than the 3), not the 2.
>aren't we all getting caught up in specs without knowing implementation and real world use
Sure, geeks tend to obsess with specs. Regular Joes care about other things, like screen image, size/weight/style, brand, price, and apps. RT loses in most if not all these categories.
>Its funny how Apple is focusing on how their screen is better, but they are still running a dual core processor, and fall short in so many other areas including usb, micro SD.
I thought we weren't going to talk about specs. About that, you do realize that the Teg3 used in Surface RT is a year-old design that's now used in the $200 Nexus 7, right? You also realize that the Exynos 5 dual blows away the Teg3 quad, right?
>I do agree with MS that resolution alone isn't everything - Contrast has a lot to do with it.
Here's a counterpoint: If low-res is just as good as high-res, then why not put the same low-res on Surface Pro?
Yes, the PPI thing is partly a marketing thing, just as was the megahertz war of yore. Part of it confers real benefits, part of it is hype. But understand that MS is pooh-pooh'ing high-res display because its own product use dated components. Surface RT has 2011 parts, and MS simply didn't keep up with the fast pace of advancing technology.
>I Am curious what the return policy is for Microsoft Online store if this thing turns out to be a dud after all.
http://google.com/search?q=microsoft+store+return+policy
e.mote said:
>I know the screen display has become a big issue with Apple - But the Surface is at least better than the Ipad 2 (maybe not the Ipad 3)
This is PR spin coming out of MS. Nobody knows how Surface RT fares in a head-to-head match against iPad 2/3, because MS still hasn't let anyone review it. May be the spin is right, and may be not, but I'd rather hear it from a less biased source.
Anyway, the spin falls apart when one considers that MS is pricing the RT against iPad 3 (actually higher than the 3), not the 2.
>aren't we all getting caught up in specs without knowing implementation and real world use
Sure, geeks tend to obsess with specs. Regular Joes care about other things, like screen image, size/weight/style, brand, price, and apps. RT loses in most if not all these categories.
>Its funny how Apple is focusing on how their screen is better, but they are still running a dual core processor, and fall short in so many other areas including usb, micro SD.
I thought we weren't going to talk about specs. About that, you do realize that the Teg3 used in Surface RT is a year-old design that's now used in the $200 Nexus 7, right? You also realize that the Exynos 5 dual blows away the Teg3 quad, right?
>I do agree with MS that resolution alone isn't everything - Contrast has a lot to do with it.
Here's a counterpoint: If low-res is just as good as high-res, then why not put the same low-res on Surface Pro?
Yes, the PPI thing is partly a marketing thing, just as was the megahertz war of yore. Part of it confers real benefits, part of it is hype. But understand that MS is pooh-pooh'ing high-res display because its own product use dated components. Surface RT has 2011 parts, and MS simply didn't keep up with the fast pace of advancing technology.
>I Am curious what the return policy is for Microsoft Online store if this thing turns out to be a dud after all.
http://google.com/search?q=microsoft+store+return+policy
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Regarding return policy - I guess I was looking for a more real world understanding from someone. Had previously read the official, and it basically says that if its a computer, which it is, and it has been opened, then they won't take it back. So basically we are all screwed if we don't like this thing after opening it and bought it from Microsoft online.
not a very good return policy.
Nobody really knows about MS return policy, because this is the first time MS is selling a whole computer (as opposed to just peripherals). I think your best bet is to phone or go to a MS store and get the low-down on Oct 26.
Really, if you're unsure, just don't get RT on launch day. Wait for reviews, and to see what other choices are there. There'll be lots. Personally, I think once Clovertrail tabs show up at $499, that'll be the best option for Win users who want regular Windows on a tablet.
BTW, news peeps who went to the MS Surface "Hardware R Us" shindig have all gotten a Surface RT unit for review, and NDA should be lifted today (Tues Oct 23), so we should have a better idea of what Win RT is shortly.
e.mote said:
Really, if you're unsure, just don't get RT on launch day. Wait for reviews, and to see what other choices are there. There'll be lots. Personally, I think once Clovertrail tabs show up at $499, that'll be the best option for Win users who want regular Windows on a tablet.
.
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Click to collapse
Or AMD-Z60 as it should be cheaper has more graphics ability (run call of duty at 30fps) and has better support for bluestacks. That said it uses more power gets hotter and needs more airflow.
Now that NDA is lifted, looks like the first Surface RT review is up. Unsurprising verdict: Still too many unknowns.
http://www.engadget.com/2012/10/23/microsoft-surface-rt-review/
Related
I got my g-tablet from Sears on November 2 and returned it to the store yesterday. I told them it does not have flash as stated on the box and the display is of very poor quality. I got full refund.
Why did I return it?
- Nvidia quality sucks: I had dead laptop, because of defective nvidia chip. If you don't believe it check this: Apple, Dell and HP got a class action suit against Nvidia: www nvidiasettlement com. OpenGL drivers are full of bugs they may have fixed Angry Birds, but there are plenty other bugs I'm sure.
- Nvidia does not conform to standards. No NEON instructions in Tegra. They try to play their desktop video card game, by providing custom APIs and making their applications incompatible with other ARM CPUs. So far it is the opposite - applications that run good on every other Cortex A8, does not play on Tegra.
- Nvidia keep their specs closed. I tried to get information on how to hook a hardware JTAG debugger, but all specs are opened only for partners.
- The device has the worst display I've seen. In portrait mode it gives me distorted colors even when looked at 90 degrees angle.
- The device is made by Malata and not Viewsonic. There is no track history for this company and I don't want to risk my money with unknown hardware quality (software we all know sucks)
For all folks expecting Notion Ink Adam: I'm sorry but this is going to be the same crap. Notion Ink has no proven record (neither Pixel Qi),combined with a low quality Nvidia chip, this is going to hurt.
I'm going to wait for the upcoming Acer tablet with a 10-inch screen that will run a Qualcomm dual-core 1 Ghz processor (produced on the new 28nm technology, supports out of order execution).
One good word about the G-tablet: the apx mode allows you to flash any OS, but the tablet has only 512MB internal Flash, which is not enough for dual boot.
My perfect tablet needs to be a laptop replacement: that means dual boot Android/Gentoo Linux, ability to boot every other ARM OS(windows phone,etc) from a sdcard. Also it has to have a case with keyboard and mouse pad (to be used as laptop when needed).
The TnT interface shows how clueless are Viewsonic about what the people actually need.
I bought mine about 3 days ago.. and I'm returning it today because of the poor viewing angles on the screen.. and also because of the laggy ui.. even with custom roms
edit: changed my mind and I'm going to keep mine for a while. there's a lot of great work being done with custom roms that might fix the lagginess. looking forward to notion inks announcement on december 9th!
i have had mine for about a week, the only way i'm returning it is if something better comes out within my 30 day window. it certainly does have flaws but i'm gonna give it more of a chance.
I am keeping mine because I am running Android 2.2 which doesn't take advantage of the dual-core processor, and because it is more of an accessory than a laptop replacement for me. This is definitely a hacker's unit more than an out-of-the-box laptop replacement.
-=Sent from my ViewSonic G Tablet using Tapatalk=-
To get a better one
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA App
Keeping mine. Roebeet has been working hard to make this tablet worth something. I have no compaints with this device while running tnt lite other than the screen viewing angles. Even still, 9 times out of 10, im holding my device right in front of me so viewing angles are not as big of factor. This device is really just ahead of its time. The hardware is there, just the operating system is yet to be optimized for a 10 inch tablet with a tegra 2 processor. Roebeets tnt lite is just a sneak peak at what this thing is capable of. Once there is a 100% stock android it will run even faster, or even android 3.0. With this thing being completely open, its only a matter of time. This is a hackers paradise. Its so new that not everyone was able to get their hands on it yet. Give this thing time, i think you will be suprised what this thing can do and regret returning it.
I'm keeping mine. With a good bit of modding its actually nice to use. The screen angles are pretty bad in good lighting but is fine in low light situations. So I just use it in landscape in good light areas. Aside from the screen and sadly the TnT software this Malta pad is great. It even has a potential to be a beast as new products are released and Tegra 2 support becomes stronger.
Anything we get until Feb of next year is going to be a bit of a mess. All the top tier companies who only want to release a 100% consumer friendly product are holding off for Honeycomb. The current releases are either mid tier companies hungry for market share, bottom of the barrel companies releasing crap, and start ups like Adam using time as an opportunity.
We're on the bleeding edge and it shows. Likely the only company thats going to put in the effort needed to make this a good experience is Adam. They're a new company with something to prove. That said, I wouldn't be surprised if the their tab ends up going for $600 and still selling well.
Bottom line: If you can put up with the viewing angles and 1 reboot a day this is a decent deal. Especially if you got it for $280 like I did .
Keeping mine and bought up Sears stock for today's sale, sorry about that anyone who shops near me. These rock after being loaded up correctly
No way I'm taking my back. After flashing to TnT Lite 2.02 it's a keeper. Now if I could only get wireless tethering to work it would be golden.
does this question really belong in development?
switt said:
Bottom line: If you can put up with the viewing angles and 1 reboot a day this is a decent deal. Especially if you got it for $280 like I did .
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
For $280 this tablet is a steal. There is no doubt in my mind that I would keep this tablet at that price.
However, at $417 after tax I'm on the fence about keeping this tablet. Performance wise, I can't complain. It's easily the fastest tablet on the market right now. After loading up TnT Lite with flash, this tablet is amazing. It's so much fun surfing the web. Battery life is great, this thing sips power.
but the screen, OMG the screen. It's just bad. I don't know any other way to say it. In portrait mode, it's usable but you can tell the image looks different at the top than it does at the bottom. I've found that there is really only one way to hold the tablet to get a good view and that is directly infront of you slightly below eye level.
linckraker said:
does this question really belong in development?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That was my question also, but I decided not to comment as I had assumed that a mod would've moved it to general by now.
Anyways ATM I'm keeping it. My primary reason for returning it would be driven by the form factor, as I REALLY MUCH prefer 7" for tablets. Just more portable and better for reading fiction, which means IF I keep that I'll also want a complementary 7" tablet. I just find 10" to be unwieldly.
As secondary reasons I would point out the absence of various features advertised on the box itself.
Just wish that a 7" Tegra2 would come out... I'd be all over it.
Where do i get one for $280
switt said:
I'm keeping mine. With a good bit of modding its actually nice to use. The screen angles are pretty bad in good lighting but is fine in low light situations. So I just use it in landscape in good light areas. Aside from the screen and sadly the TnT software this Malta pad is great. It even has a potential to be a beast as new products are released and Tegra 2 support becomes stronger.
Anything we get until Feb of next year is going to be a bit of a mess. All the top tier companies who only want to release a 100% consumer friendly product are holding off for Honeycomb. The current releases are either mid tier companies hungry for market share, bottom of the barrel companies releasing crap, and start ups like Adam using time as an opportunity.
We're on the bleeding edge and it shows. Likely the only company thats going to put in the effort needed to make this a good experience is Adam. They're a new company with something to prove. That said, I wouldn't be surprised if the their tab ends up going for $600 and still selling well.
Bottom line: If you can put up with the viewing angles and 1 reboot a day this is a decent deal. Especially if you got it for $280 like I did .
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Where do i get one for 280$, see them at staples for 399$?
acuralegendz said:
Where do i get one for 280$, see them at staples for 399$?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
some sears outlet stores have refurbs for 279
I think the problem with the question of "why did you return it" is that the people who did return it are probably not scanning this forum anymore.
I've been scanning the negative comments (which are mostly valid crticisms, I might add), and I've compiled a list in my head:
- The crappy UI
- The crappy UI (important enough to be mentioned twice)
- The viewing angles, especially when watching while laying on a desk. (btw, flip the device around, so that the camera is on the bottom, and you can get around that).
- No official Flash yet, even though the darn icon is on the box.
- App compatibility issues, in particular the g-sensor issue in games.
- Lack of h264 high profile playback support (this is a Tegra 2 hardware limitation, btw).
- Performance, even with the UI mods. That seems to be more of an Android limitation, given that dual core is not being exploited.
- Lack of HDMI given that there's no dock, and a lack of accessories like a case.
- The bang-for-the-buck.
The last one is important because I have seen more than few posts from people returning the item who mentioned that they might have kept it of were $300, or if they could snag a $279 outlet device. It's not that the device is "bad", but more that you didn't want to break the bank for a device that is really not fully optimized yet. And I can understand that 100%.
roebeet said:
I think the problem with the question of "why did you return it" is that the people who did return it are probably not scanning this forum anymore.
I've been scanning the negative comments (which are mostly valid crticisms, I might add), and I've compiled a list in my head:
- The crappy UI
- The crappy UI (important enough to be mentioned twice)
- The viewing angles, especially when watching while laying on a desk. (btw, flip the device around, so that the camera is on the bottom, and you can get around that).
- No official Flash yet, even though the darn icon is on the box.
- App compatibility issues, in particular the g-sensor issue in games.
- Lack of h264 high profile playback support (this is a Tegra 2 hardware limitation, btw).
- Performance, even with the UI mods. That seems to be more of an Android limitation, given that dual core is not being exploited.
- Lack of HDMI given that there's no dock, and a lack of accessories like a case.
- The bang-for-the-buck.
The last one is important because I have seen more than few posts from people returning the item who mentioned that they might have kept it of were $300, or if they could snag a $279 outlet device. It's not that the device is "bad", but more that you didn't want to break the bank for a device that is really not fully optimized yet. And I can understand that 100%.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm FIRMLY in the $300 camp as BOTH Staples & Sears had the gTab right next to a $299 and $249 Atom based netbooks(ASUS, Acer, Toshiba and something else...). Kind of a smack in the face to be asked to pay $400 for a less functional device, although I can kind of understand part of the reason being that the Tegra2 SoC isn't quite as cheap as ALL of the other SoCs. $400 still just seems like a hype price to me, and I do feel kind of ripped... would feel better IF it had a better camera(maybe 2) and GPS builtin... ...and if I had any REAL expectations of longterm VS support and OS upgrades, e.g. next Android version...
Yes, and I'd have to add viewing angles to my list of possible return reasons from using it a bit last night(in bed) with some sideloaded apps that forced portrait mode...
gturnersr said:
I got my g-tablet from Sears on November 2 and returned it to the store yesterday. I told them it does not have flash as stated on the box and the display is of very poor quality. I got full refund.
Why did I return it?
- Nvidia quality sucks: I had dead laptop, because of defective nvidia chip. If you don't believe it check this: Apple, Dell and HP got a class action suit against Nvidia: www nvidiasettlement com. OpenGL drivers are full of bugs they may have fixed Angry Birds, but there are plenty other bugs I'm sure.
- Nvidia does not conform to standards. No NEON instructions in Tegra. They try to play their desktop video card game, by providing custom APIs and making their applications incompatible with other ARM CPUs. So far it is the opposite - applications that run good on every other Cortex A8, does not play on Tegra.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wow, glad you were given an opportunity to complain about NVidia.... The class action suit you're referring to was in reality a problem of the OEM which NVidia and most OEMs covered completely. My Dell laptop at work died and was replaced with a newer model in ONE WEEK. Two year old information = FUD.
I returned mine after about 2 weeks. Didn't work well out of the box and wanted something with smaller screen. I went ahead and got the Galaxy Tab instead.
But I will be checking out the Sears Outlet for the blackfriday returns to play around with it.
Because of touch screen
I got my g tablet from Sears the day before Thanksgiving and had a lot of time to play with it. I had gotten to market to work and installed several apps and had even gotten used to the stock UI. But I am extremely disappointed in the responsiveness of the touch screen. There are time you have to press very hard on the icon to open a program. And typing is a chore. Unless there is something you have to do to calibrate the screen I will be returning it Monday. Also, I thought I read that it came with a temporary plastic film over the screen, but mine did not. There was a foam protector attached to the inside of the box.
Is there anything I can do to increase the sensitivity of the touch screen? I would love to keep it - but not with the way the touch screen is working (or NOT WORKING)
cutterjohn said:
I'm FIRMLY in the $300 camp as BOTH Staples & Sears had the gTab right next to a $299 and $249 Atom based netbooks(ASUS, Acer, Toshiba and something else...). Kind of a smack in the face to be asked to pay $400 for a less functional device, although I can kind of understand part of the reason being that the Tegra2 SoC isn't quite as cheap as ALL of the other SoCs. $400 still just seems like a hype price to me, and I do feel kind of ripped... would feel better IF it had a better camera(maybe 2) and GPS builtin... ...and if I had any REAL expectations of longterm VS support and OS upgrades, e.g. next Android version...
Yes, and I'd have to add viewing angles to my list of possible return reasons from using it a bit last night(in bed) with some sideloaded apps that forced portrait mode...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Tegra 2 is in the starting point of it's cost curve, so about $75 of the price is cost and correlating profit margin, since companies are not going to scale to their cost
You will find that the newer Tegra 2 devices in Q1 & Q2 2011 will all be around $500, since you will then also be paying for better displays and brand names too
The display on this device is how they were able to put a Tegra 2 in it -cost balancing. Ironically, if the OEM would have rotated the display 180 degrees when building them, it would not be an issue. Display looks as good as the Archos 101- when upside down
i wonder if this could run on Gtablet.. Lol. D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p92QfWOw88I&feature=player_embedded
amazing UI..
but i'm still loyal to android.. D its an OS WAR on 2012 ,
iOS 5, Google Icecream Android, Windows 8..
That looks like a hell of a lot of processing power for a mobile device.
well tegra 3 is on the way...
boltgd said:
well tegra 3 is on the way...
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But it's not compatible with windows.
Eh. Its a Mickeysoft product. Overpromise, Overhype, and Underwhelm. There are promised features from Vista that have yet to be developed and introduced. So I am not gonna hold my breath.
yeah they have a lot of work to do.. since the release is way too far ahead, 2012.. i guess ICEcream won't give up easily with this kind of UI..
Impress us GOOGLE.. your'e still my bet.. LOL
juntunen said:
Eh. Its a Mickeysoft product. Overpromise, Overhype, and Underwhelm. There are promised features from Vista that have yet to be developed and introduced. So I am not gonna hold my breath.
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Click to collapse
What features, exactly, are you referencing? I only ask because I have been Alpha and Beta testing MS operating systems for almost 20 years.
And why on earth would they work to introduce features on an OS that was replaced by a better one only about a year after release (thank god)?
Kind of like saying "when is Android 1.6 going to support HTML5?" Not going to happen because Android 2 added that support.
Maybe you should hold your breath.
That actually looks pretty amazing, Google has some work to do, they are the modern day version of the old Microsoft with the bugs and such, seems the new Microsoft has figured out that making it work is more important, so now google ditch the Linux kernel and find your own way. I am an Android fan and a GTab owner, but I have to say I hate tinkering with this thing and would rather it wake up and do what I want it to do, and do it consistently. I don't even mess with my GTab anymore, I hate to say it but I have reverted back to my iPad, simply it works consistently. Just my 2 cents.
goodintentions said:
But it's not compatible with windows.
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Click to collapse
Win 8 will be compatible with ARM processors.*
*Not official, but one of the demos of Win8 a few weeks ago was running on an ARM. Before you ask, the Tegra2 (and Tegra3) is an ARM processor.
scrantsj said:
Win 8 will be compatible with ARM processors.*
*Not official, but one of the demos of Win8 a few weeks ago was running on an ARM. Before you ask, the Tegra2 (and Tegra3) is an ARM processor.
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Click to collapse
That could change everything then.
Android better get way better, way faster.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7MnEndww2YQ&feature=player_embedded#t=0s
I am going to try to hold on to my G-Tablet until the Tegra 3 tablets are out. Should be able to put Win8 on it, maybe even dual boot Android.
I also saw a video somewhere of a Xoom running build 7955, and it ran really well. 1 ghz processor with 1 gb ram should be the system requirements for ARM and Tegra 2 chips. IOS is dead.
Honestly that ui looks like a windows phone to cartoony for me and childish. They really need to do something more innovative take ie9 for example just a down right copy of chrome ms is just worried about market share. Not to mention everything here lately from them has nothing but bloated kernels and fail coding.
Sent from my SGH-T959V using XDA App
Quote
I am going to try to hold on to my G-Tablet until the Tegra 3 tablets are out. Should be able to put Win8 on it, maybe even dual boot Android.
I also saw a video somewhere of a Xoom running build 7955, and it ran really well. 1 ghz processor with 1 gb ram should be the system requirements for ARM and Tegra 2 chips. IOS is dead.
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speaking of dead... I saw a picture of Steve Jobs.. I didn't know he was gay.. I saw a pic of his 'man' having to hold him up as they took a picture of him... he looks like death.. so thin, looks so old... poor guy... well I guess Apple wasn't good to him after all...
IOS/SJ RIP together?
that could be possible that win 8 will run anywhere... the OS core is going to be cloud base, and while most devices run a java, or specialized VB, a simple modification to be able to get market share, why not? MS wants you... With the way WP7Mobile is, and how bad of a phone it is, MS has a bigger picture in mind... and they are a lion in waiting.... and with all ur data on a server that you may have to pay 4.95 (beginning charges on MS) Money is about to come back rolling in... and since cloud based... illegal apps are going to be difficult to run... just as they can turn off your development key in MS, they will be able to turn off your system from processing as they hold all the cards... so be ready... Apple is doing same for 2012. lets hope Android won't follow, although MS has a big stake in it... we shall see.
cmiuc said:
Quote
speaking of dead... I saw a picture of Steve Jobs.. I didn't know he was gay.. I saw a pic of his 'man' having to hold him up as they took a picture of him... he looks like death.. so thin, looks so old... poor guy... well I guess Apple wasn't good to him after all...
IOS/SJ RIP together?
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I give him two months - not a slant on the man, but when you step down as the CEO of the most profitable company in the world, there's a reason behind it. And given how he looked in June, I suspect that the cancer is back and he's terminal. I feel very bad for him, and for his family.
juntunen said:
Eh. Its a Mickeysoft product. Overpromise, Overhype, and Underwhelm. There are promised features from Vista that have yet to be developed and introduced. So I am not gonna hold my breath.
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O O and U -- sounds like Android, to me.
I am looking forward to Windows 8, as I think both Google and Apple need a shot in the arm. My only concern is that MS has never done well in the mobile space. But they have surprised me with Windows 7 so maybe they can work their magic again.
Windows 8 Tablet Reach Developers Soon
Windows 8 tablet builds are rumored to be coming to developers as soon as this fall, so within the next 2-3 months, maybe even sooner. This means that a Windows 8 build is close to finish and Microsoft can expect to make a Windows 8 shipment sometime next summer in 2012. There is also a Microsoft Build event on September 13-16. The Anaheim California conference is focused on Windows hardware and software developers. Supposedly, it is expected to be Microsoft’s Windows 8 coming out party to get partners and OEM’s started on developing devices and apps for Windows 8.
Having said that, the issue for the tablet is not just performance but design. Apple junkies love the design, the apps, and the uniqueness of the product. It stands apart. While Microsoft may be able to make a competent and reliable product, can they make one that consumers will fall in love with?
The question comes up is what is the Quad Core processor that is supposed to run on tablets? That isn’t clear and running the tablet with a laptop processor wouldn’t be a good move since the battery life would be limited. Note, however, earlier this year three developers NVIDIA, Qualcomm, and Texas Instruments each announced quad-core mobile chips and announced that they’d arrive before the end of 2011. Nvidia is supposed to make an announcement soon about the state of a quad-core table. Nvidia, by the way, is an ARM chipmaker, which is the preferred Windows 8 OS chip of choice, (although x86 based chips will still be used).
Windows vs Android
cotangent05 said:
i wonder if this could run on Gtablet.. Lol. D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p92QfWOw88I&feature=player_embedded
amazing UI..
but i'm still loyal to android.. D its an OS WAR on 2012 ,
iOS 5, Google Icecream Android, Windows 8..
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I love my gTablet (and other tablets) and Android is really slick, but Android is to Windows like a toasteroven to a double oven with range and griddle. Android is made for a few functions and to be really small and compact. Again I love my tablet but it doesn't really do what my netbook does with ease. On the other hand, my netbook isn't as convenient or as much fun as my tablet.
That said, if you put my netbook with a slick, capacitive touch screen and it could do all the things my netbook can do - then wow! That would be very nice.
---------- Post added at 08:51 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:41 PM ----------
Gilpinreid said:
Windows 8 tablet builds are rumored to be coming to developers as soon as this fall, so within the next 2-3 months, maybe even sooner. This means that a Windows 8 build is close to finish and Microsoft can expect to make a Windows 8 shipment sometime next summer in 2012. There is also a Microsoft Build event on September 13-16. The Anaheim California conference is focused on Windows hardware and software developers. Supposedly, it is expected to be Microsoft’s Windows 8 coming out party to get partners and OEM’s started on developing devices and apps for Windows 8.
Having said that, the issue for the tablet is not just performance but design. Apple junkies love the design, the apps, and the uniqueness of the product. It stands apart. While Microsoft may be able to make a competent and reliable product, can they make one that consumers will fall in love with?
The question comes up is what is the Quad Core processor that is supposed to run on tablets? That isn’t clear and running the tablet with a laptop processor wouldn’t be a good move since the battery life would be limited. Note, however, earlier this year three developers NVIDIA, Qualcomm, and Texas Instruments each announced quad-core mobile chips and announced that they’d arrive before the end of 2011. Nvidia is supposed to make an announcement soon about the state of a quad-core table. Nvidia, by the way, is an ARM chipmaker, which is the preferred Windows 8 OS chip of choice, (although x86 based chips will still be used).
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As far as power, I have to say my 160 GB netbook runs for over 6 hours on wifi and with pretty heavy use on a charge. The processor will/can be improved, I;m sure, but the biggest (and maybe only) issue is getting windows capabilities with a capacitive touch screen. The Atom at 1.6 is about the same capability as our Tegra2 at 1 - although I'm not sure about the video side of things.
If I were designing the new system I'd make it about the same size as the current netbooks with a keyboard that folds all the way behind kind of like the Pocket Edge, whenever you only wanted to use touch but could fold around like a netbook when you wanted to rest it on a counter or use the keyboard/trackstick.
Windows and mobile
I am looking forward to Windows 8, as I think both Google and Apple need a shot in the arm. My only concern is that MS has never done well in the mobile space. But they have surprised me with Windows 7 so maybe they can work their magic again.[/QUOTE]
I sure wouldn't want to counter anything you said as you're the king of the tablets as far as I can tell, but I think you're comment about MS (which is an opinion shared by many) is heavily influenced by very recent history I think. Up until the full blown development of the capacitive touch screen in the Apple phone Microsoft's Mobile OS was the preferred choice. I had an Axim 5 which did most everything we're talking about with tablets but with a lot less elegance and functionality. Microsoft was the first major manufacturer to advance touch screens in portable devices. I had a Fuji "tablet" computer years ago and it was pretty slick BUT it used a resistive touch screen which made touch features less than elegant.
What microsoft (and others) missed was the capacitive touch screen and how it changed the world. Apple had an early in to this technology since they first adopted it for their iPod controller wheel and that led to their incorporating it into the main display. Capacitive touch screens had been around a long time but they couldn't be controlled precisely until recently (can't remember the company who did it first but it was Apple's key supplier to iPod wheels). So in the blink of an eye the slickest Blackberry or windows smart phone looked crippled compared to the slick interface the multi-touch capacitive touch screen apple produced. Since then resistive screens have actually gotten pretty good, but the technology of choice is multi-touch capacitive.
I don't know if MS will do the Windows 8 with a trimmed down tablet version or not, or even if they do it, will they do it well. But, I do know they have many more engineers than Apple and a base kernel in Windows which is fabulous to build on. Heck if they just gave me that interface on my current netbook I would be thrilled.
Why Microsoft was so late to the mp3 player and why they let Mobile Windows falter is a mystery. I did have one MS engineer (proj mgr on Office at the time) told me they took their eye off the ball on mobile as they kind of looked to the entertainment (xBox) div to push that stuff and they just never got beyond game systems.
Microsoft also missed on the spreadsheet for many years and had a couple attempts which didn't cut it (multiplan was nifty but too hard to use) but when they came out with Excel they conquered. Same with Word. Same with console game boxes, and even to some extent with keyboards and mice and web cams.
You'd think I "liked" MS. I don't really. I much prefer Linux and the whole GPL scheme of things, but I give the devil her due. I use microsoft products every day and I have to say they do a terrific job. No other tech company I know of could match them on taking care of their past customers. That legacy in many ways has been a blessing and a curse. That said, I wouldn't count them out by any means and they will do very well in mobile/tablets when they embrace the touch interface. I'm not sure about phones. I've never really seen the vision of a phone-size computing device. To me a phone size is all about sync and media (photo, music, and light video media), and of course, phone. Tablet is your GPS, planner and organizer, newspaper and email, heavier duty mobile media consumption and phone (skype). Laptop is the primary working device to actually earn an income from, and the desktop is simply a legacy for all that stuff you still want to interface with and stream on your local network.
I think MS's mobile image was damaged quite a bit by them virtually abandoning Windows mobile, the low takeup of the Zune and the piling on of the apple community. That caused MS to go after a phone which was a disaster. In a nutshell there wasn't a failure of note until the iPhone in the middle of 2007 which has led (largely) to a remake of the MS image in this arena. They certainly deserve their lumps, but like you pointed out Win 7 was great and if they do get that interface they are showing on Win 8, watch they roar back in the mobile space.
I do wonder about another competing "app" development framework. It would have been nice to see that part of the interface somehow stick with the Android model. I'm sure MS will produce a free dev kit of some kind but that doesn't replace all the work for good developers to get up to speed.
Now that pricing has been revealed. Who's still going to buy? I was on board, but I might wait for the pro since those prices are close to the full Win8 pc's I saw at Best Buy over the weekend.
http://www.theverge.com/2012/10/16/3271243/microsoft-surface-tablet-pricing-availability
nuprotocol said:
Now that pricing has been revealed. Who's still going to buy? I was on board, but I might wait for the pro since those prices are close to the full Win8 pc's I saw at Best Buy over the weekend.
http://www.theverge.com/2012/10/16/3271243/microsoft-surface-tablet-pricing-availability
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Y u no start a poll using the poll function?
Ncyde47 said:
Y u no start a poll using the poll function?
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sorry. had to think of some good polling questions. its up now! lol
This is too high considering the tablets out and the AMD powered tablets coming.
No buy.
About a year and half ago I bout my wife a (comparable) Asus Transformer for the same price....1.5 YEARS AGO. Currently I am using an Acer w500. My keyboard has 2 extra usb ports, an ethernet port, serves as a cover and (fwiw) "Clicks". cost: $0.
I was really looking forward to buying a surface pro, but if these prices are indicative of the pricing for the pro, I'll have to pass. Nevermind the fact that the only real "feature" that we know about these tablets is the keyboard. With RT I pretty much have not much else to go on, at least with pro, I can still use my existing software.
All that said, I know why they did this - to keep the OEMs happy. They're trying to get those consumers who want a premium product at any price and I'm just not in that camp. I have my Acer w500 with win 8 so I'm not in any rush. Maybe in a few years...
I'll just wait for the Pro. Buying the RT now and the Pro later is going to by some serious $$$$. I'd rather just make one purchase. Most of the stuff I would do on the RT I can do on my phone especially when the Win 8 Phones come out. I like that the Pro has a 1080 screen, displayport out, and USB 3.0. It will take the place of my laptop and it can function as a tablet. Win-Win.
That said, I'd still like to have an RT for longer battery life and for using as a reader at home. I'm sure there will be some people with buyers remorse or will just sell the RT when the Pro comes out. I'll pick up a refurb or used one by then.
thundr51 said:
No buy.
About a year and half ago I bout my wife a (comparable) Asus Transformer for the same price....1.5 YEARS AGO. Currently I am using an Acer w500. My keyboard has 2 extra usb ports, an ethernet port, serves as a cover and (fwiw) "Clicks". cost: $0.
I was really looking forward to buying a surface pro, but if these prices are indicative of the pricing for the pro, I'll have to pass. Nevermind the fact that the only real "feature" that we know about these tablets is the keyboard. With RT I pretty much have not much else to go on, at least with pro, I can still use my existing software.
All that said, I know why they did this - to keep the OEMs happy. They're trying to get those consumers who want a premium product at any price and I'm just not in that camp. I have my Acer w500 with win 8 so I'm not in any rush. Maybe in a few years...
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I guess we have to wait on reviews. I was really really looking forward to purchasing one. I guess $499 is competitive to the Asus Transformer Pad Infinity and the Ipad 3. But those two ecosystems have tons of apps and proven. SurfaceRT is windows w/o being able to install Windows apps. It'll be a real hard sell. My heart was broken over those prices. lol
However, I believe Microsoft knows what their doing and maybe the reviews will show its worth that pricey tag. I went to bestbuy.com and read the reviews for the Asus Infinity and their all pretty positive and it's priced at $499. However, its Android, and I can bring ALL of my droid apps to that tablet. I'm so lost. lol
Tempest790 said:
I'll just wait for the Pro. Buying the RT now and the Pro later is going to by some serious $$$$. I'd rather just make one purchase. Most of the stuff I would do on the RT I can do on my phone especially when the Win 8 Phones come out. I like that the Pro has a 1080 screen, displayport out, and USB 3.0. It will take the place of my laptop and it can function as a tablet. Win-Win.
That said, I'd still like to have an RT for longer battery life and for using as a reader at home. I'm sure there will be some people with buyers remorse or will just sell the RT when the Pro comes out. I'll pick up a refurb or used one by then.
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What if you already have a very nice, powerful, long battery life Windows laptop? Would the Pro still be worth the wait? I'm torn between the RT and the Pro. I have two very high end desktops I built, a powerful Windows laptop and not sure if I should break down and bust out $599 for the Surface RT or wait and sell my laptop and get the pro.
nuprotocol said:
What if you already have a very nice, powerful, long battery life Windows laptop? Would the Pro still be worth the wait? I'm torn between the RT and the Pro. I have two very high end desktops I built, a powerful Windows laptop and not sure if I should break down and bust out $599 for the Surface RT or wait and sell my laptop and get the pro.
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I'm not in that camp. My personal laptop is an older 17" HP that I gave to my daughter anyway. I have a work laptop that I use but it's a Dell 17" laptop. I'm looking for something smaller. I'm done with 17" laptops and 2 hour battery lifes and that's on a good day.
Unfortunately, I need legacy program support, specifically Microsoft Access. MS Publisher support in RT would be nice too. If MS ever offered that as part of the RT package (even for more money) I'd be all over the RT.
If you already have a powerful, long lasting laptop, I personally would just get the RT since it wouldn't make sense to duplicate the legacy functions anyway. Unless you don't want to lug around two machines (Laptop and Surface RT).
A lot of decisions. Plus, I'd really like to try out that new keyboard before committing to it.
My original plan was to get a slim laptop like the Asus UX31A and the Surface, but I think that's overkill. I see less and less reason to have a full laptop anymore since it's not really what I'm using. I don't use CD/DVD drives anymore, and the new smaller hi-res screens work good for me (I have great eyesight). Might as well just combine them together, and when MS announced the Pro version, it pretty much answered all my needs.
How is it possible that the warranty is just 1 year instead of 2? Even on the european pages of Germany and UK is limited to 1 year...it is actually too weird...
Tempest790 said:
I'm not in that camp. My personal laptop is an older 17" HP that I gave to my daughter anyway. I have a work laptop that I use but it's a Dell 17" laptop. I'm looking for something smaller. I'm done with 17" laptops and 2 hour battery lifes and that's on a good day.
Unfortunately, I need legacy program support, specifically Microsoft Access. MS Publisher support in RT would be nice too. If MS ever offered that as part of the RT package (even for more money) I'd be all over the RT.
If you already have a powerful, long lasting laptop, I personally would just get the RT since it wouldn't make sense to duplicate the legacy functions anyway. Unless you don't want to lug around two machines (Laptop and Surface RT).
A lot of decisions. Plus, I'd really like to try out that new keyboard before committing to it.
My original plan was to get a slim laptop like the Asus UX31A and the Surface, but I think that's overkill. I see less and less reason to have a full laptop anymore since it's not really what I'm using. I don't use CD/DVD drives anymore, and the new smaller hi-res screens work good for me (I have great eyesight). Might as well just combine them together, and when MS announced the Pro version, it pretty much answered all my needs.
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Thanks for the advice!
Uk Prices http://www.microsoftstore.com/store/msuk/en_GB/pdp/productID.257929400
Cheaper to get in in US even with sales tax.
I just got a shock! After reading the specs below it seems there is no NFC!!! I am so disappointed. I want a tablet that is future proof. Seems the Asus Vivo Tab is the best right now.
http://www.microsoftstore.com/store/msuk/en_GB/pdp/productID.257929400#tab5
Very sad to see such a high price. Will fail. I won't be buying now, even the pro.
I'll wait for Google Nexus 10.1 with 2560×1600 pixel screen 299ppi versus the new iPad’s 264ppi. What's the point of these ****ty screen? 1300 x 728 on a 10 inch?
Oh and I am sure there will be ports of the RT version to other arm tabs...
Seems too high, I will wait for the Pro prices.
$299 Awesome. $399 Awesome. $499 with the touch cover? Awesome.
$599 for a bottom of the line with a touch cover? DOA.
I was spreading the word of these Win8 RT tablets like they were the gospel but if price gouging is going to be the M.O. then I guess there's no reason to slow down the iPad app development.
Balls in your court, MS. Try not to zune this up :crying:
mdomino said:
$299 Awesome. $399 Awesome. $499 with the touch cover? Awesome.
$599 for a bottom of the line with a touch cover? DOA.
I was spreading the word of these Win8 RT tablets like they were the gospel but if price gouging is going to be the M.O. then I guess there's no reason to slow down the iPad app development.
Balls in your court, MS. Try not to zune this up :crying:
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I don't think it's DOA, but I agree that being just $100 cheaper would have opened up even more sales. $499 with the touch cover would really be the sweet spot for a lot of people. However, I wouldn't be surprised if MS drops the price $100 after the holidays to keep interest in the Surface throughout 2013. I think it would be a smart move by MS to cash in on the early adopters (like Nokia is cashing in on me for the Lumia 920). Around March to May next year, MS should drop the price and watch them fly even more.
Since MS is only selling it online and through their stores, they are pretty much selling to those who already knew about the Surface and wanted it anyway. Once you start seeing the Surface at Best Buy and other retailers is when MS will need to adjust the price point.
I am not going to pay 599 USD for a tablet that is just running WinRT.. For a few hundred bucks more, I can get a tablet running full-fledged Windows 8 and I would rather buy that. While there may or may not be many apps for the Metro-style interface, I can get pretty much all applications I want for the standard Windows which can also handle the Metro-apps anyways.
So,too bad for you Microsoft.
the blogs and comments I've read say the same thing: Microsoft misinterpreted interest in the surface and prices it badly. they expected lines around the corner like an apple event, and are going to find out its not happening for rt.
hopefully they didn't poison the well for the future x86 tablets.... cause when users lay this much money for a device with windows all over it, they expect it to run windows programs. all of them.
Probably not. You won't see lines around the corner for this or other Win8 tablets. However, over time, I think it will eventually surpass the iPad and definitely Android. As more and more Win8 (both RT and Pro versions) machines are sold, the creation of apps is going to skyrocket as people try to cash in on being first. Some iPad and Android developers may initially balk at RT but when they see their competitors getting more and more of the lion's share, it will become a "me too" attitude as they jump in. Despite the naysayers and gloom predictions, I would bet that three years from now when MS is ready to release Win9, the RT ecosystem will be supporting 100,000's of apps. More importantly, it will begin to support big name apps. Imagine a Photoshop RT version from Adobe. Why concede the photo market to some other third player? Granted, it will take time, but I believe it will happen.
The real good news is that Win8 Phone uses pretty much the same OS and system so once those apps get created, it will be very easy to port them to the phone. Basically, you create one app and you get up to four target markets: desktop, laptop, tablet, and phone. No other provider or OS will have this advantage.
But, I might be wrong...
I am fuming at the price! Americans think its bad check out the UK price! I am a huge MS fanboi I admit that openly I own a Zune I have had 3 Windows Phones I have xbox my wife has windows phone I use windows on desktop and laptop and at work including server AD Exchange etc.
I love it all but I will not and cannot accept this price! MS is really taking the p**s now! This was my gripe with Apple and now MS has joined them. Looks like its time to build bridges with Android.
I've been excited about the Surface since it was first announced... and my excitement held true even after getting my hands on a demo unit... but now, considering the price, looking at the future of Windows RT and finally their announcement that they're cutting order amounts has me second guessing my upcoming purchase.
I just don't think it's a viable platform anymore, I feel like RT will be dead in a year and this device will be the Commodore Amiga of the Tablet world.
Any current users feel the same? Differently? I'm just scared to buy one now.
ih8sense said:
I've been excited about the Surface since it was first announced... and my excitement held true even after getting my hands on a demo unit... but now, considering the price, looking at the future of Windows RT and finally their announcement that they're cutting order amounts has me second guessing my upcoming purchase.
I just don't think it's a viable platform anymore, I feel like RT will be dead in a year and this device will be the Commodore Amiga of the Tablet world.
Any current users feel the same? Differently? I'm just scared to buy one now.
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You bought a good tablet, mate. build quality and software is awesome, that's why u got interested in the first place.
On the other hand, will it get support?, i believe in time it will. My reasons is touch screen. Touch is the future, yes x86 apps already exist but they dont exist in touch. So the future being touch will revolutionize the existing apps for touch and this will make room for metro apps. And this is were rt will win.
Secondly the future is portable, x86 is not, rt is. Windows 8 is bridge to what will become sindows of the future, a touch only windows. Besides if MS fails in marketing RT, someone else will want a cut of the pie and market RT.
Lastly, modders will break this device before xmas, sideloading will b possible,emulation will happen and i foresee a future were android emulators will run on this beast. A lot will happen
RT has potential, surface may fail but RT will not cos its light weight and its future proof.
I think RT will not fail. PPL will wait till they see their lovely apps on it but they will come. Windows is used on more than 90% of the computers in the world. So I think its just a matter of time to developers finish and publish their apps. Even if winRT won't get as popular as win8, the code is almost the same which makes easy to publish the same app for Arm.
Sent from my Windows 8 device using Board Express
you know, the only pros of surface pro over surface IMO is the MKV support and 1080p screen.
2 things that made me return surface are
- lack of MKV support (which 90% of my movies are in mkv)
- low resolution. When i used it while lying down the bed, i tend to use it closer to my eyes than when i'm sitting down. The text doesn't look crisp and i can see pixels in the pictures.
If those 2 reasons won't bother you, surface is one hell of a tablet and for 499$, it's a steal. Remember that it's a tablet, apps would be optimized for touchscreen and you will have great mobility over laptop. The apps are pretty limited for now but i believe developers will start developing for it. I love the surface even though i return it.
I think that the biggest hurdle for Windows RT is the WinRT runtime. It's horribly gimped. I was honestly amazed at how god awful and stunted C# was in WinRT. It's almost as if they intentionally limited it for reasons only MS knows.
First off, Microsoft haven't announced a halving of orders. It is merely conjecture. What they have announced is support for Surface RT until 2017 though we dont know any details around this.
I dont think that Windows RT will be a big platform in the way that other lightweight OS's are - iOS and Android - but I do think it offers something unique. If you use tons of popular apps on other platforms, you will be disappointed in the Surface RT. If you live in a web browser, you will love Surface RT. I am not sure this will change unless those apps come for Windows 8 and can also be cross compiled for Windows RT.
If a 10" tablet is what you want and it fits your life, I see only 2 usable options - an iPad or a Surface RT. Android is awful on 10" tablets.
Sounds to me though that if you want the form factor the Surface brings, then Surface Pro might be more suitable, but I am not convinced it is a viable tablet as Windows desktop mode is horrible to use with touch.
quoted:
Sounds to me though that if you want the form factor the Surface brings, then Surface Pro might be more suitable, but I am not convinced it is a viable tablet as Windows desktop mode is horrible to use with touch.
pro =$1000, 4ish hour battery life.
no sales numbers released from rt.
ruh roh.
What about the Lenovo Twist? Windows 8 Pro, i5, 128gb SSD 12.5 touch screen and it is a tablet and laptop.. I returned my Surface and bought a Twist for $699 on BF.. Hoping it will do it all....
Sent from my SCH-I535 using xda premium
Got to agree with some of the above posts.
RT is the future of windows, it is the new NT, and some of us older users will remember how that was initially received...
The Surface RT is one helluva sexy tablet. In build quality, specs, and screen beauty it just is awesome. Really without software it is way ahead of the whole pack..... I played with it a long time....
But every time I interacted with the windows interface, there was just that familiar slow feeling. I am even now very serious about the Surface RT and am hotly debating buying it. But the software is just slightly underwhelming. I love the Metro interface, but not whats under it.
IF you do web browisng, games, movies and pics ONLY - this is an ABSOLUTELY must buy. The gorgeous experience is unbeatable. But the whole interaction at the windows level tends to wake me up from my dream. Having support for proper PowerPoint with HDMI ouput makes this a traveling presentation platform etc. But apps? apps? apps? You cannot entice people if the apps are missing - you cannot say " buy it now, I guarantee that apps are coming". It does not work with consumers. That it may lead to a slow down fro the Surface is one of my biggest fears.
On a tablet I browse the internet, listen to music, read books, email, and watch some sports. So by my own standard I should buy it. But Windows keeps me away...
One thing I do not agree about as said above - that windows desktop is not for touch. Using the touch laptops I find this to be quite intuitive, coming from a tablet world. Yes, on vertical screens one's hands can get tired to do a lot of touching - holding it up to the screen for extended periods. But I find it much more natural than trackpads - I hate trackpads, even Apple's "magic" trackpad ....
My 2 cents.... I need to decide if I just want a tablet, or a tablet that can double as a small laptop.
saryu said:
you know, the only pros of surface pro over surface IMO is the MKV support and 1080p screen.
2 things that made me return surface are
- lack of MKV support (which 90% of my movies are in mkv)
- low resolution. When i used it while lying down the bed, i tend to use it closer to my eyes than when i'm sitting down. The text doesn't look crisp and i can see pixels in the pictures.
If those 2 reasons won't bother you, surface is one hell of a tablet and for 499$, it's a steal. Remember that it's a tablet, apps would be optimized for touchscreen and you will have great mobility over laptop. The apps are pretty limited for now but i believe developers will start developing for it. I love the surface even though i return it.
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In less than a month after the release there are at least two applications tha support some mkv. They are still not perfect but it took developers more than a year to get the same result for the iPad.
Sent from my Windows 8 device using Board Express Pro
---------- Post added at 01:38 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:34 AM ----------
Yes, I'm worry about the cut down the numbers of orders for RT reported by suppliers and Microsoft rushing to release the PRO version acting like it will be the saver.
http://ultramobilepc-tips.blogspot.com/2012/12/the-high-risk-behind-surface-pro.html#links
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ctitanic said:
In less than a month after the release there are at least two applications tha support some mkv. They are still not perfect but it took developers more than a year to get the same result for the iPad.
Sent from my Windows 8 device using Board Express Pro
---------- Post added at 01:38 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:34 AM ----------
Yes, I'm worry about the cut down the numbers of orders for RT reported by suppliers and Microsoft rushing to release the PRO version acting like it will be the saver.
http://ultramobilepc-tips.blogspot.com/2012/12/the-high-risk-behind-surface-pro.html#links
Sent from my Windows 8 device using Board Express Pro
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After hearing the pricing of the pro and the battery limitations, I actually like my Surface RT more now. Unfortunately there is so much pressure for it to beat the IPAD that people write it off without giving it a chance . I like it more and more every day.
ih8sense said:
I've been excited about the Surface since it was first announced... and my excitement held true even after getting my hands on a demo unit... but now, considering the price, looking at the future of Windows RT and finally their announcement that they're cutting order amounts has me second guessing my upcoming purchase.
I just don't think it's a viable platform anymore, I feel like RT will be dead in a year and this device will be the Commodore Amiga of the Tablet world.
Any current users feel the same? Differently? I'm just scared to buy one now.
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It very depends on your propose, what you need for it.
for me, i do need a lot excel , ppt, word, and I tried do it on iPad, it sucks. I own a Macbook Air, but a bit trouble while checking something on street .....
After testing Surface for an hour, I love it. Of course if you looking for fun more than a working tab, its not a good choice at this moment as lack of apps support.
Just hope Chrome will come and get more apps soon , then will be the king of tablet im sure.
guitar1969 said:
After hearing the pricing of the pro and the battery limitations, I actually like my Surface RT more now. Unfortunately there is so much pressure for it to beat the IPAD that people write it off without giving it a chance . I like it more and more every day.
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I completely agree. I can't put the damn thing down! The browser experience is sensational. And Xbox music is phenomenally good! I mean free streaming music, albeit with fairly unobtrusive add support.
And as for apps you needn't worry. The company I work for has figured out that Windows 8 is going onto every budget laptop from here on out and the Windows 8 marketplace presents a great opportunity. As such are having their iOS & Android app ported to Win8 as we speak.
Also as another example the impetus to get into Windows 8/RT the VLC Player devs are going to the extreme of going to Kickstarter for funding to hire full time devs to get VLC Player into the Windows 8 marketplace as fast as possible... http://www.wpcentral.com/vlc-starts-kickstarter-windows-8-and-beyond-development-funding
So I sincerely believe the WINRT app catalogue will really take off.
Also, you know it's a good device when the missus is continually wanting it off you!
I agree with others... The RT has a good life to it. The problem IMO, is that people are holding out to see the Pro, then they'll decide.
Honestly I think people will end up with the RT over the Pro.
You just can't use a 10" screen for full desktop applications. It doesn't work.
Also, and this is big, the Pro is not using a Run Time system, that means you must shut it down when not in use, it will suspend instead of sleep, and it will go through battery like mad (they expect 4 hours max).
If you like how fast the Surface RT turns on, and how your e-mails, status updates, and calendar reminders are there, kiss that goodbye with the Pro. It is, for all intents and purposes, a PC in a thin form factor. An engineering marvel for sure, but I think people will expect it to be like the Surface RT, iPad, or Android tab just beefier. When they find out it isn't, I think RT sales will shoot up.
I also read somewhere that the Surface is not optimized to use all the 5 cores of the Tegra3 and it is still running crippled. I believe it came from Nvidia themselves. Once fixed, it should be more responsive. I hope so, because it does seem a bit slow in opening apps and such, although it is tolerable.
guitar1969 said:
I also read somewhere that the Surface is not optimized to use all the 5 cores of the Tegra3 and it is still running crippled. I believe it came from Nvidia themselves. Once fixed, it should be more responsive. I hope so, because it does seem a bit slow in opening apps and such, although it is tolerable.
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Microsoft will continue to optimise the base firmware of the device to improve performance. They've released one such update already and there will be plenty more to come.
Just look how far they've pushed the Xbox 360.
Think Nvidia will ever create another one? Shield tablet. I hope so! I do enjoy my K1
I doubt it they don't seem interested in maintaining competition with tablet makers. There was a comment made by a high up member at Nvidia that they were not interested in what they view as a dying market.
Nvidia had once a phone..
Either way, their chips are top notch.
mirrin said:
I doubt it they don't seem interested in maintaining competition with tablet makers. There was a comment made by a high up member at Nvidia that they were not interested in what they view as a dying market.
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Yes unfortunately, just about all the decent manufacturers have decided it's a dead market. At least in the smaller format, the only real tablets currently available (with updated hardware) are the iPad Mini and the Amazon Fire (neither of which I want, due to their closed ecosystems).
You can't get a decent spec 7-8" tablet with current hardware anymore. Samsung gave up, they offered the Galaxy Tab S2 in 8" size in 2015 (having offered higher-end 8" tablets for a few years running), but then skipped an update last year, and are now only offering the S3 in 9.7" size. And for a ridiculous price of $600 US (and only 32 GB of storage!), so they seem to be trying to compete more with the iPad Pro, than anything else. And I'm pretty much done with Sammy, with their horrible skinning of Android (even if they no longer call it TouchWiz - still the same garbage) and stifling development with unlockable bootloaders.
NVIDIA seemed to bail on an updated tablet as well, last year. NVIDIA seemed to be gearing up late last year for an update to the Shield. The stock of existing K1's seemed to be disappearing, and I think they even filed with the FCC for a new tablet? But then NVIDIA basically bailed on the whole ting, announced they would not update the Shield, and more K1's would be back in stock.
I'd love an updated version of the Shield, but NVIDIA doesn't seem interested.
I own both, the s2 Tab 8" and the Shield and screen-wise the s2 blows the Shield away. Performance-wise (gaming) it's the other way around.
IMO nowadays it's all about the screen. If Nvidia came out with an OLED screen device plus their power chipsets.. win-win.
redpoint73 said:
Yes unfortunately, just about all the decent manufacturers have decided it's a dead market. At least in the smaller format, the only real tablets currently available (with updated hardware) are the iPad Mini and the Amazon Fire (neither of which I want, due to their closed ecosystems).
You can't get a decent spec 7-8" tablet with current hardware anymore. Samsung gave up, they offered the Galaxy Tab S2 in 8" size in 2015 (having offered higher-end 8" tablets for a few years running), but then skipped an update last year, and are now only offering the S3 in 9.7" size. And for a ridiculous price of $600 US (and only 32 GB of storage!), so they seem to be trying to compete more with the iPad Pro, than anything else. And I'm pretty much done with Sammy, with their horrible skinning of Android (even if they no longer call it TouchWiz - still the same garbage) and stifling development with unlockable bootloaders.
NVIDIA seemed to bail on an updated tablet as well, last year. NVIDIA seemed to be gearing up late last year for an update to the Shield. The stock of existing K1's seemed to be disappearing, and I think they even filed with the FCC for a new tablet? But then NVIDIA basically bailed on the whole ting, announced they would not update the Shield, and more K1's would be back in stock.
I'd love an updated version of the Shield, but NVIDIA doesn't seem interested.
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unfortunately at around the 7" mark is where people would rather just go for one of the big phones that is one reason for the lackluster sales of tablets. In the 8"+ setting you are competing with the ipads and laptops. And honestly the power of even a budget laptop blows all tablets away... So there is a slim number of consumers who want a 8-12" tablet. Honestly I would pick up a 2018 shield x2 tablet in a heart beat...
i would for one like a bigger nvidia tablet.
mirrin said:
unfortunately at around the 7" mark is where people would rather just go for one of the big phones that is one reason for the lackluster sales of tablets.
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I've heard people say similar, that basically folks don't want a small tablet when they can just use their phone. And I personally can't agree. Anyone who thinks that, must not actually have ever used a tablet (or at least otherwise convinced themselves they don't need a tablet for different, unrelated reasons - cost/budget, don't want to own too many devices, etc.). While the diagonal screen "size" on paper of a big phone/phablet versus a smaller tablet may not look that different (say around 5.5" versus 7"); that is a deceptive way of looking at screen size, as the actual difference in area is huge. Literally, the tablet will have double the area of the phone (while the difference in diagonal length is only 27%), which makes a big difference when viewing videos, web browsing, etc.
I own both a decently large phone (OnePlus 3T, with 5.5" screen) and the Shield, and they both serve their purposes. The 3T is better for portability, as it's what I carry whenever I leave the house. But when I'm at home, I find myself reaching for the Shield most all the time (unless I'm actually making a call, sending a text, or taking a pic) as the larger screen real estate make it much more pleasurable to use. But it never leaves the house (unless I'm going on an overnight trip) as it's not convenient to carry around on a daily basis (plus WiFi only).
mirrin said:
In the 8"+ setting you are competing with the ipads and laptops. And honestly the power of even a budget laptop blows all tablets away...
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Agree that larger tablets compete directly with iPads. But for me personally, Apple devices are not a choice; as I'm simply against Apple's closed ecosystem, proprietary standards (ports, etc.) and generally dictating to people what they should want/like instead of actually listening to what customers want.
Laptops, while they also have their place, are too bulky for my normal usage (mostly media consumption & web browsing). I have a nice laptop provided by my work, which often goes home with me. I never take it out for my own personal purposes (only for work) even though it's readily available. Simply too big and bulky.
BTW, not arguing with you, so hopefully doesn't come off that way. I agree with your points in general. But everyone has their own personal preferences. And unfortunately for me, mine contradict the masses or majority. And it's unfortunate that most all the manufacturers have decided that is not even enough of a niche market to provide a decent small tablet this year.
Thats why Microsoft did it right with the surface. If Nvidia went that path, but not as aggressive as in the laptop area performance. but made a nice tablet that can be used like a laptop per say.
Like the prior poster stated. outside i have my phone for portability. but anytime im sitting still ie. traveling and staying. i always have my Nvidia with me.
Spadizzle said:
Thats why Microsoft did it right with the surface. If Nvidia went that path, but not as aggressive as in the laptop area performance. but made a nice tablet that can be used like a laptop per say.
Like the prior poster stated. outside i have my phone for portability. but anytime im sitting still ie. traveling and staying. i always have my Nvidia with me.
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Problem is microsoft surfaces don't sell well either. Imagine 12 inch screen all of the power of a netbook or low end laptop at best the surface has a i7 6650U which hits the $500-600 laptop mark. a surface pro 4 with the max specs is around 1400. vs an ipad for 800 or less
For 1400 the surface has to compete with laptops and for that price you can get way more powerful laptops.
To sell well a tablet needs to be in the 8-10" size category it needs to have at least the power of the latest ipad and it must be priced under 400 anything higher the masses will just jump to an ipad. Anything under 180 will have too many corners cut to make a profit build, quality, function or appearance will suffer.
So that leaves us we need a tablet 8-10" with a good ips or oled display it needs to have the power of a tegra x1 or better and at least a sot battery life of 5-8 hours priced somewhere between 200-399