Related
Thank you for all of your hard work on the D2. With the X, the competition is stiff, and it seems/feels like there are more of us that "ended up" with a D2 out of a warranty replacement than actually made the decision to buy one.
With that said, I am formally starting a bandwagon for an actual "stock" Android OS ROM. None of this color changing, applications because i like them, better home screen, etc., etc., stuff. I want to see an "actual" Android vanilla ROM for the D2.
I can't be the minority in this request.
I appreciate all of the work that you guys do, I really do. If I had the time to invest in this, I'd build the damn thing myself, but I dont, so I have to rely on you guys.
Thanks.
I'm on the bandwagon.
I believe doing this would require cracking m-shield/efuse in order to get a custom kernel in place, which to my knowledge hasn't been done, nor am I even sure if anyone is actively working on it.
psionicalpha said:
I believe doing this would require cracking m-shield/efuse in order to get a custom kernel in place, which to my knowledge hasn't been done, nor am I even sure if anyone is actively working on it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i'm not asking for a kernel. i'm asking the ROM developers to go stock with their approach as opposed to customizing. That's why i used quotes on "OS". I want a clean ROM that reflects as much as the actual Android OS as possible.
640k said:
i'm not asking for a kernel. i'm asking the ROM developers to go stock with their approach as opposed to customizing. That's why i used quotes on "OS". I want a clean ROM that reflects as much as the actual Android OS as possible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you root your device you can clean out the stock rom yourself. Follow the remove bloatware guide. Once you clean it out you can install launcherpro which IMO is the best home replacement out there. I believe it will be some time before there is a vanilla rom for the d2. We will always need the dialer and a few other apps that are tied into other blur apps.
MotoBoy said:
If you root your device you can clean out the stock rom yourself. Follow the remove bloatware guide. Once you clean it out you can install launcherpro which IMO is the best home replacement out there. I believe it will be some time before there is a vanilla rom for the d2. We will always need the dialer and a few other apps that are tied into other blur apps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
removing "bloat" doesn't cut it for me. i'm already running launcherpro without root and it gets me by. the ROM devs are working hard to bring things back to normal and they're doing a good job. i just don't want to have to pick between a broken phone icon and a black notification bar.
i'm not asking for miracles. i recognize that most of blur is limiting this activity. that's why i'm asking for just a clean ROM. as apks become available and more of blur can be replaced, the ROM will get better.
640k said:
i'm not asking for a kernel. i'm asking the ROM developers to go stock with their approach as opposed to customizing. That's why i used quotes on "OS". I want a clean ROM that reflects as much as the actual Android OS as possible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is harder than you think. Moto modified many services that build with dependencies on the kernel. If we had access to Motos kernel source, then we could just build the vanilla rom directly with google source and be done. Since this is not currently an option, you need to have services that happen to be compatible with the kernal and Motos current structure which is also difficult. Its easy for simple apps that can be switched out like mail and such. But not everything is that easy to swap out. Pull and replace some services on your phone and your phone won't start, because an alternative will not work because the blur service is expressly called, or expected to function in a very "Moto way".
I don't think people are avoiding the stock approach because they don't want stock, I think it hasn't happened (yet) because Moto has made it difficult. Right now its like a Jenga tower. We keep pulling blocks to see which one won't cause the tower to fall. Pull the wrong one...oops we won't pull that one next time. If we could rebuild it from scratch, it would be much easier, because you could build it in the image you wanted opposed to doing surgery to mimic what you want.
facelessuser said:
It is harder than you think. Moto modified many services that build with dependencies on the kernel. If we had access to Motos kernel source, then we could just build the vanilla rom directly with google source and be done. Since this is not currently an option, you need to have services that happen to be compatible with the kernal and Motos current structure which is also difficult. Its easy for simple apps that can be switched out like mail and such. But not everything is that easy to swap out. Pull and replace some services on your phone and your phone won't start, because an alternative will not work because the blur service is expressly called, or expected to function in a very "Moto way".
I don't think people are avoiding the stock approach because they don't want stock, I think it hasn't happened (yet) because Moto has made it difficult. Right now its like a Jenga tower. We keep pulling blocks to see which one won't cause the tower to fall. Pull the wrong one...oops we won't pull that one next time. If we could rebuild it from scratch, it would be much easier, because you could build it in the image you wanted opposed to doing surgery to mimic what you want.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
this i get, and recognize. but if you read through current ROMs (all two of them), there ARE tweaks that i just don't want/agree with.
i dealt with this alot with WinMo and i've avoided putting ANY ROM on my D1. blur is so terrible, all i want is my D1 one back.. but in my D2's body.
I think these ROM developers simply have no choice but to do the tweaks they've done because Moto services can't just be taken out, they have to be replaced instead of the original so the phone would still work.
We just have to wait, time solves everything, even Moto
facelessuser said:
It is harder than you think. Moto modified many services that build with dependencies on the kernel. If we had access to Motos kernel source, then we could just build the vanilla rom directly with google source and be done. Since this is not currently an option, you need to have services that happen to be compatible with the kernal and Motos current structure which is also difficult. Its easy for simple apps that can be switched out like mail and such. But not everything is that easy to swap out. Pull and replace some services on your phone and your phone won't start, because an alternative will not work because the blur service is expressly called, or expected to function in a very "Moto way".
I don't think people are avoiding the stock approach because they don't want stock, I think it hasn't happened (yet) because Moto has made it difficult. Right now its like a Jenga tower. We keep pulling blocks to see which one won't cause the tower to fall. Pull the wrong one...oops we won't pull that one next time. If we could rebuild it from scratch, it would be much easier, because you could build it in the image you wanted opposed to doing surgery to mimic what you want.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
640k said:
this i get, and recognize. but if you read through current ROMs (all two of them), there ARE tweaks that i just don't want/agree with.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Apparently you don't get it. As stated, stock Android will require the kernel source, which we don't have.
As a former Ion and Nexus One owner who flashed probably a hundred ROMs, I can honestly say Froyo and root is enough to make me happy. Many of the tweaks custom ROMs offered are now built in (they came from AOSP to begin with) and the hardware has advanced to the point that swapper and overclocking aren't necessary. Frankly I'm not sure what more you could want that isn't possible without root and launcher replacements.
640k said:
this i get, and recognize. but if you read through current ROMs (all two of them), there ARE tweaks that i just don't want/agree with.
i dealt with this alot with WinMo and i've avoided putting ANY ROM on my D1. blur is so terrible, all i want is my D1 one back.. but in my D2's body.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am like you. On my D1 I only used OEM ROMs that I modifed myself. I did the same to my D2 and it runs just like my D1. Their are only two differences. Backup assistant services is still running in the backgroud and I still have the messaging app. I removed all blur widgets and all the bloatware I don't need. If I can get rid of the backup assistant I would be very close to plain ROM. Once you remove everything you can safely you are not too far away from a vanilla ROM.
karnovaran said:
Apparently you don't get it. As stated, stock Android will require the kernel source, which we don't have and likely never will.
As a former Ion and Nexus One owner who flashed probably a hundred ROMs, I can honestly say Froyo and root is enough to make me happy. Many of the tweaks custom ROMs offered are now built in (they came from AOSP to begin with) and the hardware has advanced to the point that swapper and overclocking aren't necessary. Frankly I'm not sure what more you could want that isn't possible without root and launcher replacements.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well said. This is not my first android phone either. I have also used Cyanogen and others. Root is more than enough for me.
Back in the day, the custom Roms were pushing us into new territories, giving us features we didn't already have; that was why I wanted them. Now I have everything I need with stock and root. There are so many replacement launchers, lockscreens, etc. Going vanilla is just icing on the the cake; if it ever happens at all.
All of blur's UI flaws and app quirks hardly bug me much at all; I can happily live with them if I have to. Overall, the Droid 2 is a great phone as it is ( with root of course ).
I think i might get my head bitten off for this but id be happy with a stock deoxed rom with the stupid bloat apps removed.
I've come to like the blur widgets and features, well except for the contacts sync issue with facebook.
jerseyh22accord said:
I think i might get my head bitten off for this but id be happy with a stock deoxed rom with the stupid bloat apps removed.
I've come to like the blur widgets and features, well except for the contacts sync issue with facebook.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you goto droidforums.net and in the Xeudoxus ROM section you will see the xultimate thread which is what you need to deodex a rom yourself. If you have the android sdk installed already it is not much work to do. Just follow the instructions and read through the thread for problems that may pop up.
karnovaran said:
Apparently you don't get it. As stated, stock Android will require the kernel source, which we don't have.
As a former Ion and Nexus One owner who flashed probably a hundred ROMs, I can honestly say Froyo and root is enough to make me happy. Many of the tweaks custom ROMs offered are now built in (they came from AOSP to begin with) and the hardware has advanced to the point that swapper and overclocking aren't necessary. Frankly I'm not sure what more you could want that isn't possible without root and launcher replacements.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
apparently you don't get it.
you're not reading what i'm asking. there are ROM devs out now, doing the work. they can debloat and use as many stock apps as possible (or as available). i'm not asking for miracles. i'm asking devs not to customize what they're doing.
i'm asking for standard looks, not black themes. i'm asking for stock apps, where possible. i'm asking for it to work.
don't come in here and thread crap because you don't understand what i'm saying/asking.
MotoBoy said:
If you goto droidforums.net and in the Xeudoxus ROM section you will see the xultimate thread which is what you need to deodex a rom yourself. If you have the android sdk installed already it is not much work to do. Just follow the instructions and read through the thread for problems that may pop up.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I know, i did it before i ran 928droid's theme and epic's rom to change the text to white in the notification bar. Lost it when i restored my nandroid of stock but i could do it again. Just saying if i flash a rom i want it deoxed
I am working on this. Please just wait.
Newbie here. I have rooted my D2, but I haven't yet installed a new ROM. Is there any way that I can use a D1 ROM in my D2?
Sent from my DROID2 using XDA App
640k said:
apparently you don't get it.
you're not reading what i'm asking. there are ROM devs out now, doing the work. they can debloat and use as many stock apps as possible (or as available). i'm not asking for miracles. i'm asking devs not to customize what they're doing.
i'm asking for standard looks, not black themes. i'm asking for stock apps, where possible. i'm asking for it to work.
don't come in here and thread crap because you don't understand what i'm saying/asking.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe I (and others) misinterpreted, but you said stock and vanilla multiple times.
Sorry, but I just don't take well to people starting threads like this. Either do the work yourself, contact a developer directly to inquire about their intentions, or sit tight and wait. It's this kind of "gimme" attitude in forums that scares away talented people.
What the hell? Do it yourself. Are you really acting like this because you don't like black notification bars? If it upsets you so much, learn how to change it. Requests are fine. Acting indignant because you don't know what "I want a vanilla ROM" means is rude.
Can you tell me the benefit or the main reason(s) why you rooted your Inspire?
My main reasons are the ability to change whatever I want. And better battery life.
Sent from my Inspire 4G using Tapatalk
Are you serious?
Not to sound mean, but have you ever searched Google or this forum before you thought of asking?
There is tons of information on here... just sayin
sent from my secret agent phone in my shoe
Dinman said:
Are you serious?
Not to sound mean, but have you ever searched Google or this forum before you thought of asking?
There is tons of information on here... just sayin
sent from my secret agent phone in my shoe
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes I searched. There are no search words that will return results showing specific reasons why a member prefers a custom rom over the stock rom. In older devices a custom ROM would allow you to tether for free, remove bloatware to make room for 3rd party applications, remove buggy 2nd party software, remove unnecessary apps to allow the system to run faster, allow the customization of the UI when it was otherwise un-modifiable or fix glitches that made it through testing on the stock ROM but that doesn't seem to be needed on the Inspire. This is the first device I haven't hacked because so far it seems to be unnecessary. I could read custom ROM threads all day but finding a post where a user cited an issue relieved by using a custom ROM or a major benefit (that's not a trivial figment of their imagination) would be one heck of a needle in a haystack search. So it would be great to get this specific info into a thread.
Custom Roms.
jamespaulritter said:
Yes I searched. There are no search words that will return results showing specific reasons why a member prefers a custom rom over the stock rom. In older devices a custom ROM would allow you to tether for free, remove bloatware to make room for 3rd party applications, remove buggy 2nd party software, remove unnecessary apps to allow the system to run faster, allow the customization of the UI when it was otherwise un-modifiable or fix glitches that made it through testing on the stock ROM but that doesn't seem to be needed on the Inspire. This is the first device I haven't hacked because so far it seems to be unnecessary. I could read custom ROM threads all day but finding a post where a user cited an issue relieved by using a custom ROM or a major benefit (that's not a trivial figment of their imagination) would be one heck of a needle in a haystack search. So it would be great to get this specific info into a thread.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I prefer stock Android to sense and hate bloatware. I won't buy a phone now until cm7 is available.
Sent from my HTC Glacier using xda premium
jamespaulritter said:
Yes I searched. There are no search words that will return results showing specific reasons why a member prefers a custom rom over the stock rom. In older devices a custom ROM would allow you to tether for free, remove bloatware to make room for 3rd party applications, remove buggy 2nd party software, remove unnecessary apps to allow the system to run faster, allow the customization of the UI when it was otherwise un-modifiable or fix glitches that made it through testing on the stock ROM but that doesn't seem to be needed on the Inspire. This is the first device I haven't hacked because so far it seems to be unnecessary. I could read custom ROM threads all day but finding a post where a user cited an issue relieved by using a custom ROM or a major benefit (that's not a trivial figment of their imagination) would be one heck of a needle in a haystack search. So it would be great to get this specific info into a thread.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
wait, what? All the things you just said that aren't needed in the stock rom without rooting are actually all reasons why people root the inspire. If you have found another way to remove bloatware without rooting please pass on that information so that those who simply rooted to remove the bloatware can do so without having to go through the entire rooting process. Without rooting you there are a lot of helpful apps you can't run, you can't remove bloatware, you really can't customize anything significant in the UI..I mean really the only reason why I rooted was to remove the pesky bloatware (sorry I just hate looking at blockbuster apps and that stupid teeter game)...the added bonuses of full customization in AOSP roms and the ability to have the performance tweaks in every other rom/kernel just made the decision easier. If you like the stock rom and see nothing wrong..keep on moving, no reason to fix something that isn't broke...I just like having full control over my device..it's for some, it's not for everyone..just my .02 cents
MMM-BACONSTRIPS said:
wait, what? All the things you just said that aren't needed in the stock rom without rooting are actually all reasons why people root the inspire. If you have found another way to remove bloatware without rooting please pass on that information so that those who simply rooted to remove the bloatware can do so without having to go through the entire rooting process. Without rooting you there are a lot of helpful apps you can't run, you can't remove bloatware, you really can't customize anything significant in the UI..I mean really the only reason why I rooted was to remove the pesky bloatware (sorry I just hate looking at blockbuster apps and that stupid teeter game)...the added bonuses of full customization in AOSP roms and the ability to have the performance tweaks in every other rom/kernel just made the decision easier. If you like the stock rom and see nothing wrong..keep on moving, no reason to fix something that isn't broke...I just like having full control over my device..it's for some, it's not for everyone..just my .02 cents
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1, pretty much summed up my response.
MMM-BACONSTRIPS said:
wait, what? All the things you just said that aren't needed in the stock rom without rooting are actually all reasons why people root the inspire. If you have found another way to remove bloatware without rooting please pass on that information so that those who simply rooted to remove the bloatware can do so without having to go through the entire rooting process. Without rooting you there are a lot of helpful apps you can't run, you can't remove bloatware, you really can't customize anything significant in the UI..I mean really the only reason why I rooted was to remove the pesky bloatware (sorry I just hate looking at blockbuster apps and that stupid teeter game)...the added bonuses of full customization in AOSP roms and the ability to have the performance tweaks in every other rom/kernel just made the decision easier. If you like the stock rom and see nothing wrong..keep on moving, no reason to fix something that isn't broke...I just like having full control over my device..it's for some, it's not for everyone..just my .02 cents
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks, I agree. I hate seeing the blockbuster app. I actually went looking for an Obfuscate app to hide it. We use to have to remove the bloatware to make room for 3rd party apps because there was limited ROM. Meaning back in the day we got '32 megs, 64 megs' whatever for apps we wanted so we had to remove bloatware. Its not the issue it once was because now we get 1Gb, 2GB...... The reason I'm asking is because I was thinking of rooting so I could tether reverse wifi. So i'm looking for reasons to take the plunge.
rooting my inspire has made it like a completely different phone. actually, each custom rom is almost a new device itself.
but as far as perks, i like the better battery life, full customization, speed increases (data, smoothness, overclocking, etc.), constant updates, and just the joy of trying out different roms. the definite BEST perk of them all is the simple fact that you can find support for each rom from their respectful devs (not all, but the majority of the popular roms out there). HTC and the various service providers always have terrible support.
jamespaulritter said:
Thanks, I agree. I hate seeing the blockbuster app. I actually went looking for an Obfuscate app to hide it. We use to have to remove the bloatware to make room for 3rd party apps because there was limited ROM. Meaning back in the day we got '32 megs, 64 megs' whatever for apps we wanted so we had to remove bloatware. Its not the issue it once was because now we get 1Gb, 2GB...... The reason I'm asking is because I was thinking of rooting so I could tether reverse wifi. So i'm looking for reasons to take the plunge.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah man, the droid milestone (the first smartphone from HTC that I remember having) was awesome in regards to bloatware. I was able to remove pretty much anything I wanted, not the case now unfortunately . Pretty much the benefits of rooting are that you get full control of your device, in pretty much every aspect. As for tethering, I'm not 100% that its supported in every ROM but I'm pretty sure there are some out there, if that's what your immediate reason for rooting is I would say start asking in the Q&A in each ROM or hopefully someone else can chime in to help you out. Like I said I rooted to get rid of the dumb bloatware, getting the performance tweaks, battery life, and customization (for most roms but more so in the AOSP ROMs) were just added bonuses
Take control of your device. Imagine being locked out of the C: drive on your computer.
Sent from my HTC Glacier using xda premium
jamespaulritter said:
Thanks, I agree. I hate seeing the blockbuster app. I actually went looking for an Obfuscate app to hide it. We use to have to remove the bloatware to make room for 3rd party apps because there was limited ROM. Meaning back in the day we got '32 megs, 64 megs' whatever for apps we wanted so we had to remove bloatware. Its not the issue it once was because now we get 1Gb, 2GB...... The reason I'm asking is because I was thinking of rooting so I could tether reverse wifi. So i'm looking for reasons to take the plunge.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh just root it already! When you use the Ace hack kit, you can't even tell it's rooted. If you like it just the way it is you can keep it that way. If you don't, try some different ROMs. You can always flash the stock ROM back (or restore it if you backed it up).
If you don't have a huge desire to root, it may not be the thing for you. I'd still recommend rooting though, you wouldn't regret it.
unclecyclops said:
If you don't have a huge desire to root, it may not be the thing for you. I'd still recommend rooting though, you wouldn't regret it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You'll be thinking about rooting it until you do.
Sent from my HTC Glacier using xda premium
".....
+1
Posting this on an android forum your going to get major disagreements, but I totally support you. Switched from an iPhone 3Gs to a Nexus S and I would change back in a heartbeat!
Everythings so much more, polished, okay not as many mods, etc for battery life but the battery lasted so much longer anyway!
cdaly985 said:
Posting this on an android forum your going to get major disagreements, but I totally support you. Switched from an iPhone 3Gs to a Nexus S and I would change back in a heartbeat!
Everythings so much more, polished, okay not as many mods, etc for battery life but the battery lasted so much longer anyway!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
that's exactly what I want, i want people to argue their case, i've explained through personal experience why I feel this way, if somebody beg's to differ, I want them to explain why! Please enlighten me!
As it stands there are more mod's and tweaks available for a Jailbroken iOS!
.
Thread moved to Q&A due to it being a question. Would advise you to read forum rules and post in correct section.
Failure to comply with forum rules will result in an infraction and/or ban depending on severity of rule break.
i jailbroke and unlocked a lot of iphones i must that iOS is a dry OS with nothing to look for too after i saw the iOS 5... also iTunes is a Piece of **** of a program..
i cant imagine myself need to jailbreak everytime i update the phone it kinda annoying and insane..
TDMaster said:
i jailbroke and unlocked a lot of iphones i must that iOS is a dry OS with nothing to look for too after i saw the iOS 5... also iTunes is a Piece of **** of a program..
i cant imagine myself need to jailbreak everytime i update the phone it kinda annoying and insane..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
the iOS updates only come once every few months, and only when major updates are required. In this case, u wait until that release is jailbreakable and hold off. In the mean time u can find apps that backup all ur tweaks and settings so its a simple backup and restore process once u re-jailbreak on the newer firmware. no biggy.
iOS is only dry if you don't tweak it, if u use all the tweaks and addons, lockinfo screen, biteSMS, sbsettings, home screens, dock modifiers, it's all there.
I don't see how you can say it's dry if the apps on iOS look pristine compared to Android apps
Android is easier to work with
Stupidusername7 said:
Android is easier to work with
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
easier to work with how?! have u used a jailbroken iPhone?? at least explain
UKROB86 said:
easier to work with how?! have u used a jailbroken iPhone?? at least explain
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The only thing jailbreaking really allows is the use of 3rd party apps...which android can do out of the box. Not a shot at you, but you probably don't know enough about android or computers in general to have a clear cut idea of what you can really do. The ability to use adb and fastboot and apply System themes (not just overlays) make the possibilities endless. The ability to change between sense, touchwiz, blur and AOSP ROM's. Changing fonts, creating your own app icons, bootanimations, splash screens. Android gives you the tools to easily do these things on your own, not just use someone elses. You can create your own theme in 10 minutes online.
Cydia would not be possible for Android. The tweaks and mods android uses go much much deeper into the system than anything on Iphone. Changes made to the system are not compatible for every phone. And with the such high number of android phones it would make it an almost impossible app to keep up with, and not really worth the time.
I'm going to leave most of this topic alone, as I've never used an iPhone and therefore have no way of countering any claims made in its favour, however I must point out that I don't consider the availability of pirated apps when I decide on which phone to purchase.
If you can afford a $600 phone you can probably afford to buy a few apps as well.
UKROB86 said:
the iOS updates only come once every few months, and only when major updates are required. In this case, u wait until that release is jailbreakable and hold off. In the mean time u can find apps that backup all ur tweaks and settings so its a simple backup and restore process once u re-jailbreak on the newer firmware. no biggy.
iOS is only dry if you don't tweak it, if u use all the tweaks and addons, lockinfo screen, biteSMS, sbsettings, home screens, dock modifiers, it's all there.
I don't see how you can say it's dry if the apps on iOS look pristine compared to Android apps
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is a huge headache about iOS updates. Yes you don't have to update, but what if your device broke and you needed a replacement? All your pre-5.0 SHSH blobs are now useless and you are stuck with a phone that is user friendly enough for your mom, but not powerful enough for yourself.
I don't even need to explain how terrible iTunes is.
Yes, iPhones are all good phones, and iOS is a good OS, no doubt about that (actually I myself am an iPhone user). But to say it's easier to mod and tweak iOS than Android is just not true.
lowandbehold said:
The only thing jailbreaking really allows is the use of 3rd party apps...which android can do out of the box. Not a shot at you, but you probably don't know enough about android or computers in general to have a clear cut idea of what you can really do. The ability to use adb and fastboot and apply System themes (not just overlays) make the possibilities endless. The ability to change between sense, touchwiz, blur and AOSP ROM's. Changing fonts, creating your own app icons, bootanimations, splash screens. Android gives you the tools to easily do these things on your own, not just use someone elses. You can create your own theme in 10 minutes online.
Cydia would not be possible for Android. The tweaks and mods android uses go much much deeper into the system than anything on Iphone. Changes made to the system are not compatible for every phone. And with the such high number of android phones it would make it an almost impossible app to keep up with, and not really worth the time.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
ok i see your point on some stuff here, it is "possible" to make these smaller detail changes to Android and not just overlays (ful themes etc) but you have to completely do it all yourself using command lines, pulling files, modifying java perhaps etc this also probably requires a computer therefore u can't just do it directly on your phone like you can with cydia, its also not organized into categories simply for downloading and patching, as it is with cydia
I beg to differ about the depth (system wise) of these tweaks and mod's, because although you have to do more work to apply them on android, the depth of them, relative to the system processes, is exactly the same really.
Either way, I do see your points, do you have any suggestions for good methods of modifying say for example: the colour of the GSM reception bars ONLY, in absence of everything else, without having to code in java?? (it would probably be very hard to come up with a simple answer to this question, yes i know. Because it's not straight forward and easy like it is on a jailbroken iPhone)
ctbear said:
It is a huge headache about iOS updates. Yes you don't have to update, but what if your device broke and you needed a replacement? All your pre-5.0 SHSH blobs are now useless and you are stuck with a phone that is user friendly enough for your mom, but not powerful enough for yourself.
I don't even need to explain how terrible iTunes is.
Yes, iPhones are all good phones, and iOS is a good OS, no doubt about that (actually I myself am an iPhone user). But to say it's easier to mod and tweak iOS than Android is just not true.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
simple, if this was to ever happen and you lose your previous SHSH blobs then u just have to wait AT MOST, a month of jailbreak to become available. maybe 2 weeks, if its a fresh firmware
most likely if u had a replacement device then the firmware if came with would be jailbreakable anyways because each firmware gets jailbroken very quickly, and again its not like they come out with new firmwares every week. Rarely do people run into SHSH blob problems now that it's always auto backed up by cydia
forget itunes.. what do we use it for now anyways? its only a partial server backup of ur apps and such, i dont use it for music or movies etc.
In any case, when i upgrade firmwares, i resync all my apps back, from itunes cracked or not.. and all the backed up cydia apps and tweaks also.. in no time ur device is back to normal.
Im still saying its definitely easier to mod and tweak iOS when it's all laid out for you right there in cydia, without having to punch a whole bunch of command lines, pull files, edit some java and then put the file back in, thats the bare more hard way to ever have to tweak or modify for your average non-programmer user.
UKROB86 said:
simple, if this was to ever happen and you lose your previous SHSH blobs then u just have to wait AT MOST, a month of jailbreak to become available. maybe 2 weeks, if its a fresh firmware
most likely if u had a replacement device then the firmware if came with would be jailbreakable anyways because each firmware gets jailbroken very quickly, and again its not like they come out with new firmwares every week. Rarely do people run into SHSH blob problems now that it's always auto backed up by cydia
forget itunes.. what do we use it for now anyways? its only a partial server backup of ur apps and such, i dont use it for music or movies etc.
In any case, when i upgrade firmwares, i resync all my apps back, from itunes cracked or not.. and all the backed up cydia apps and tweaks also.. in no time ur device is back to normal.
Im still saying its definitely easier to mod and tweak iOS when it's all laid out for you right there in cydia, without having to punch a whole bunch of command lines, pull files, edit some java and then put the file back in, thats the bare more hard way to ever have to tweak or modify for your average non-programmer user.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hmmm at most a month? Are you sure about that? I waited 3 months before I could jailbreak my iPad 2. And that's because comex was not working for Apple then. Apple has always been keen on patching vulnerabilities so I would imagine jailbreaking becoming more and more difficult.
Cydia backs up the blobs automatically? How can you even do that if you can't jailbreak in the first place?
Sure, Cydia is easier for average users. But how good is it if you can't even put it on your device?
Anyways I don't think it's a good idea for a user to mod his phone if he can't even search on forums for mods.
UKROB86 said:
ok i see your point on some stuff here, it is "possible" to make these smaller detail changes to Android and not just overlays (ful themes etc) but you have to completely do it all yourself using command lines, pulling files, modifying java perhaps etc this also probably requires a computer therefore u can't just do it directly on your phone like you can with cydia, its also not organized into categories simply for downloading and patching, as it is with cydia
I beg to differ about the depth (system wise) of these tweaks and mod's, because although you have to do more work to apply them on android, the depth of them, relative to the system processes, is exactly the same really.
Either way, I do see your points, do you have any suggestions for good methods of modifying say for example: the colour of the GSM reception bars ONLY, in absence of everything else, without having to code in java?? (it would probably be very hard to come up with a simple answer to this question, yes i know. Because it's not straight forward and easy like it is on a jailbroken iPhone)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Rom Toolbox has icons for the GSM reception bars, along with some others.
Sent from my R800i using Tapatalk
MilkyJoePD said:
Rom Toolbox has icons for the GSM reception bars, along with some others.
Sent from my R800i using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i'll check it out for sure
UKROB86 said:
ok i see your point on some stuff here, it is "possible" to make these smaller detail changes to Android and not just overlays (ful themes etc) but you have to completely do it all yourself using command lines, pulling files, modifying java perhaps etc this also probably requires a computer therefore u can't just do it directly on your phone like you can with cydia, its also not organized into categories simply for downloading and patching, as it is with cydia
I beg to differ about the depth (system wise) of these tweaks and mod's, because although you have to do more work to apply them on android, the depth of them, relative to the system processes, is exactly the same really.
Either way, I do see your points, do you have any suggestions for good methods of modifying say for example: the colour of the GSM reception bars ONLY, in absence of everything else, without having to code in java?? (it would probably be very hard to come up with a simple answer to this question, yes i know. Because it's not straight forward and easy like it is on a jailbroken iPhone)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Personally, I would rather it not be that easy to tweak and mod. Changes that deep into the system can eff up your phone, and if it is as easy as clicking an app..you probably won't know how to fix it. Plus, when it is hard, less people do it. So while you debate about Apple being better, I already know my Android is better than the guy's next to me.
Well as said, something like cydia would not work for us since we have so many devices with different hardware and structure. I do not get what you mean by more customizable though. We can change our notification bar, launcher, icons, system layout, anything. Literally anything. Why? Cuz we have the friggin source code. I could go and get the source code and make android have some code in it to make a backdoor that sends your private information to me. I really could do anything. Get how drastic the changes could be? Now here's what it comes down to really, the app developers. The people who would spend time and implement your ideas or make apps that would satisfy your needs. Nothing to do with android the system, has to do with its ecosystem however.
Well in my opinion, the Android is not easy to work with, but it is easier to understand. I used to be an Iphone user but, it didn't work out for me. Its features confused me and I didn't understand what its JailBreak meant for it. I also found it difficult (Was an Iphone Jailbreaker ) on how to get to where I wanted to get.
One major thing to consider: Android has more than one phone. Not every single developer has the same exact phone which they are all developing for. If every Android user had a say, HTC EVO 3D, then the development community for the EVO 3D would be huge, like Apple's. This is not a draw back, but a difference between the two platforms. I respect both, but I love Android too much to leave with. And yes with multiple phones comes fragmentation, but hey get the best phone every time you can, like me, or root that SOB!
Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk
They are putting so much effort into these new interfaces - now all redone for ICS. And you look at these new interfaces and you say to yourself - WHY?!
Take Samsung's new TW for ICS. Why oh why would they take anything that is so fresh and new and put the same old TW - making the phone look like it's old before it even came out?
Now HTC are doing the same.
They are all missing out on the fact that users would rather just have it 'the way it is". This is the reason XDA is so full with people changing the roms, and so on.
benyben123 said:
They are putting so much effort into these new interfaces - now all redone for ICS. And you look at these new interfaces and you say to yourself - WHY?!
Take Samsung's new TW for ICS. Why oh why would they take anything that is so fresh and new and put the same old TW - making the phone look like it's old before it even came out?
Now HTC are doing the same.
They are all missing out on the fact that users would rather just have it 'the way it is". This is the reason XDA is so full with people changing the roms, and so on.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is sad. I've had opportunity to play with vanilla ICS on my HD2 and love it so much I was hoping HTC wouldn't mess it up with Sense or the same old thing. I have an Inspire waiting for the update and want vanilla ICS...or something resembling it. I guess rooting will have to be an option to get what it should have.
You may not like it, but alot of people do. Sense is a beautiful thing. The companies absolutely have to implement their own UI. To the casual user, this is the only selling point that distinguishes one company from another. A non-tech savvy person could care less how many Ghz the CPU runs at, or how many cores it has...they are going to pick the one with the pretty screen. If us at XDA don't like sense or touchwiz, we flash an AOSP based ROM...problem solved.
lowandbehold said:
You may not like it, but alot of people do. Sense is a beautiful thing. The companies absolutely have to implement their own UI. To the casual user, this is the only selling point that distinguishes one company from another. A non-tech savvy person could care less how many Ghz the CPU runs at, or how many cores it has...they are going to pick the one with the pretty screen. If us at XDA don't like sense or touchwiz, we flash an AOSP based ROM...problem solved.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I disagree. I did think that for a long while, but made my own little survey. I asked literally anyone that I know and has an android if they would rather give more to speed or to looks. Across the board ppl say "speed, speed, speed". These modern smartphone are insanely hungry - they sometimes need to run more tasks than my personal PC. Yes, you do get the occasional teenager that says that "the way it moves [sense] is soo cool". But all things aside, I am not sure these teenagers are the biggest buyers. I may be completely wrong here though, and perhaps this is what counts. I am in my late 20's so the ppl i ask are my circle of age
benyben123 said:
I disagree. I did think that for a long while, but made my own little survey. I asked literally anyone that I know and has an android if they would rather give more to speed or to looks. Across the board ppl say "speed, speed, speed". These modern smartphone are insanely hungry - they sometimes need to run more tasks than my personal PC. Yes, you do get the occasional teenager that says that "the way it moves [sense] is soo cool". But all things aside, I am not sure these teenagers are the biggest buyers. I may be completely wrong here though, and perhaps this is what counts. I am in my late 20's so the ppl i ask are my circle of age
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My opinion on it was null until I used ICS. Having Sense or TW on GB or FroYo is no big deal to me or any kind of tragedy. But ICS is altogether a much different affair. It is the best Android Google has ever conceived and it will feel like a horrible downgrade covering it up with an OEM UI.
With GB or FroYo, I could install any 3rd-party UI if I didn't want Sense or TW and I didn't mind. Right now, in fact, I'm using an authentic iOS UI on my Inspire. But with ICS, it's already the best UI humanity will ever be graced with using. Sense or TW will only muddy it.
benyben123 said:
I disagree. I did think that for a long while, but made my own little survey. I asked literally anyone that I know and has an android if they would rather give more to speed or to looks. Across the board ppl say "speed, speed, speed". These modern smartphone are insanely hungry - they sometimes need to run more tasks than my personal PC. Yes, you do get the occasional teenager that says that "the way it moves [sense] is soo cool". But all things aside, I am not sure these teenagers are the biggest buyers. I may be completely wrong here though, and perhaps this is what counts. I am in my late 20's so the ppl i ask are my circle of age
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't disagree with you one bit. I never go away from AOSP ROM's. I'm just saying why they do it. It's like asking Nike to make some shoes without the swoosh...
But you can't disagree that they don't cover both end of the spectrum by using their own UI. The manufacturers know that if the techy people don't like it, we just get rid of it.
benyben123 said:
I disagree. I did think that for a long while, but made my own little survey. I asked literally anyone that I know and has an android if they would rather give more to speed or to looks. Across the board ppl say "speed, speed, speed".
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, duh, if you ask your question like that... But the problem is, with such a question, you're not getting the data you want to get. The way to get what you really want know, they would need to be using (and for more than 30s) both interfaces on the same phone. Only then could you get a valid answer as to which interface they prefer.
:O
I cant DISAGREE MORE
Sense (and HTC's build quality) is all that is keeping me AWAY from Samsung.
And on that same note, Touchwiz and Blur are all that keep me away from Samsung and Motorolla....
If HTC stopped making Sense I would switch to IOS. Stock android is UGLY and lacks the functionality of Sense.
Well hopefully Samsung (and other mfgs) move towards the GUI being "less intrusive" to the OS. Have it as a launcher option instead of being imbedded into the OS. This would make OS updates quicker and give people a choice (as in keep it, use vanilla, or use another 3rd party launcher like LP, Go, etc).
adelmundo said:
Well hopefully Samsung (and other mfgs) move towards the GUI being "less intrusive" to the OS. Have it as a launcher option instead of being imbedded into the OS. This would make OS updates quicker and give people a choice (as in keep it, use vanilla, or use another 3rd party launcher like LP, Go, etc).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can't agree more emphatically with this. This is exactly what they all should be doing. It would please everyone all at once.
adelmundo said:
Well hopefully Samsung (and other mfgs) move towards the GUI being "less intrusive" to the OS. Have it as a launcher option instead of being imbedded into the OS. This would make OS updates quicker and give people a choice (as in keep it, use vanilla, or use another 3rd party launcher like LP, Go, etc).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yup, you are wrong here. It is not intrusive enough, and that is the main problem. Sense, touchwiz, blur, etc. are just overlays. This fact causes the ROM to be huge and use up resources which causes the lag. If it was "more intrusive" and built into the framework of the ROM, the performance gains would be huge.
I hated touchwiz on the sgs, although it added some nice functionality it had alot of annoyances. However I love tw on sgs2. But this of course is on GB. If they just stuck the same looking tw on Ics I'd be upset. Ics changed the ui so dramatically (imo positively) that I feel that manufacturers should also adjust. Of course I feel that since we all know companies will throw in their own overlay, I hope it will now be in a way that will not interfere as much with the update process.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I777 using Tapatalk
Now with the ICS they can stop putting so much effort in messing with Android UI. There are some changes that I really like, such as Samsung notify bar and contact.
I love Timescape UI, and from what I saw, the ICS update will mix Timescape with ICS, it will be so beautiful, i think. I just have to wait until I buy my Nozomi
Sent using Mini CM7 Pro by Paul
You can either: flash a custom rom or just live with it. No biggie for me though.
Sent from my E10i using XDA App
sooyong94 said:
You can either: flash a custom rom or just live with it. No biggie for me though.
Sent from my E10i using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You have to root first before you can flash a custom ROM. And from what I see of the rooting process of the Inspire, it's pretty complicated and technical. So rooting isn't really a viability in this case.
MartyLK said:
You have to root first before you can flash a custom ROM. And from what I see of the rooting process of the Inspire, it's pretty complicated and technical. So rooting isn't really a viability in this case.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, it's not very hard though....
Root phone
Install recovery
Boot to recovery and install
???
PROFIT!!! (For typical Android phones)
Then if everyone is so paranoid about manufacturer skins or updates why don't they simply get a Nexus? Problem solved. Or they can go for other platforms such as WP7....
Because we aren't iOS or WP7 where everyone has the same layout, style or icons, and we all look the same.
Personally I hate the stock look, it looks bland and right now cliched due to the unchanging appearance. (yes, I will say the ics launcher still looks like gingerbread/froyo/eclair to me, just a different color, whoopteedoo)
However I like the other poster's ideas of including the ics stock interface, as this was also proposed in the sgs 2 forums. Rather give us the touchwiz/sense/blahblah and include ics stock if we don't like.
sooyong94 said:
Well, it's not very hard though....
Root phone
Install recovery
Boot to recovery and install
???
PROFIT!!! (For typical Android phones)
Then if everyone is so paranoid about manufacturer skins or updates why don't they simply get a Nexus? Problem solved. Or they can go for other platforms such as WP7....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Have a look at the Inspire process. I understand the general process and can do it rather painlessly on most other phones, but the process for the Inspire is overwhelmingly intimidating.
MartyLK said:
Have a look at the Inspire process. I understand the general process and can do it rather painlessly on most other phones, but the process for the Inspire is overwhelmingly intimidating.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
True dat. I wonder why HTC is locking their bootloaders when other phone manufacturers like Sammy and SE are doing right now. Even Moto is going to unlock their bootloaders too.
Something I've noticed is that I slowly become frustrated with whatever rom I'm on, be it cyanogenmod or liquidsmooth, cleanrom, etc. But as soon as I flash back to stock, I remember all the things I didn't like with stock, and want to flash back.
Where is the sweet spot? I find myself jumping back and forth, getting frustrated and tired no matter what rom I'm on. It could just be a personal problem :silly:
But I'm still kinda hoping for answers. For all the people out there who aren't modders, or devs, or who just barely know what they're doing: how do you survive with all the choices, where there's so many unique options of so many devs hard work (each with their own frustrations)? How do you choose?
SirProudNoob said:
Something I've noticed is that I slowly become frustrated with whatever rom I'm on, be it cyanogenmod or liquidsmooth, cleanrom, etc. But as soon as I flash back to stock, I remember all the things I didn't like with stock, and want to flash back.
Where is the sweet spot? I find myself jumping back and forth, getting frustrated and tired no matter what rom I'm on. It could just be a personal problem :silly:
But I'm still kinda hoping for answers. For all the people out there who aren't modders, or devs, or who just barely know what they're doing: how do you survive with all the choices, where there's so many unique options of so many devs hard work (each with their own frustrations)? How do you choose?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just a heads up, this thread is going to get shut down quickly, so I'm just going to lead you in the direction I think you want to go. There is no "sweet spot".
AOSP is made for many phones, and because of that fact you're going to miss a lot of features you're going to get from touchwiz that makes the s3 unique. It's fast, smooth, and debloated. Nice experience, but not for everybody.
Touchwiz has a range of different kinds of roms. You have heavily modded ones and some that are as bare as possible. These run drastically different on people's devices, and because of this fact you're going to get people swearing that their rom of choice is the best. However, just because a rom runs perfectly on someone's device, you might not have the same experience.
You choose by looking at the features you want and comparing them to the roms. If you want a heavily modded interface then roms like hyperdrive, goodness or jellybeans would be a good choice. If you want a more bare bones rom then bonestock, CleanROM, or tkrom would be solid choices. If you want a completely debloated experience, then aosp would be your option.
Basically, there is no real answer to your question. Flash one rom, give it a few days, if you don't like it then flash another.
Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2
BadUsername said:
Just a heads up, this thread is going to get shut down quickly, so I'm just going to lead you in the direction I think you want to go. There is no "sweet spot".
AOSP is made for many phones, and because of that fact you're going to miss a lot of features you're going to get from touchwiz that makes the s3 unique. It's fast, smooth, and debloated. Nice experience, but not for everybody.
Touchwiz has a range of different kinds of roms. You have heavily modded ones and some that are as bare as possible. These run drastically different on people's devices, and because of this fact you're going to get people swearing that their rom of choice is the best. However, just because a rom runs perfectly on someone's device, you might not have the same experience.
You choose by looking at the features you want and comparing them to the roms. If you want a heavily modded interface then roms like hyperdrive, goodness or jellybeans would be a good choice. If you want a more bare bones rom then bonestock, CleanROM, or tkrom would be solid choices. If you want a completely debloated experience, then aosp would be your option.
Basically, there is no real answer to your question. Flash one rom, give it a few days, if you don't like it then flash another.
Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
One of the things that frustrates me is that I can't solve these issues on my own. I'm trying to learn linux and a lot of basic things like that, but it doesn't come naturally. If I could just know how to fix things, then I'd be happy.
I just learned about flashing radios not a few months ago. Before that I was having a ton of issues getting google voice search and my camera to work, and I didn't know why.
So many people write guides and such, but they never give the deeper explanations. Just the quick, easy answers. Take the one-click root for D2VZW. Does it work amazingly? Yes, I used it earlier today, and it was flawless. But I want to learn more in a way that's doesn't require 200% commitment and prior knowledge of things like how to use the linux terminal.
I don't like being a noob, but it's impossible to learn this stuff on your own unless you dedicate yourself, body and soul...
SirProudNoob said:
One of the things that frustrates me is that I can't solve these issues on my own. I'm trying to learn linux and a lot of basic things like that, but it doesn't come naturally. If I could just know how to fix things, then I'd be happy.
I just learned about flashing radios not a few months ago. Before that I was having a ton of issues getting google voice search and my camera to work, and I didn't know why.
So many people write guides and such, but they never give the deeper explanations. Just the quick, easy answers. Take the one-click root for D2VZW. Does it work amazingly? Yes, I used it earlier today, and it was flawless. But I want to learn more in a way that's doesn't require 200% commitment and prior knowledge of things like how to use the linux terminal.
I don't like being a noob, but it's impossible to learn this stuff on your own unless you dedicate yourself, body and soul...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's all part of the learning experience. You can't expect someone to give you answers all the time. I learned so much from not being happy with some aspect of my phone, searching for answers, and applying fixes for my problems.
You can learn anything without dedicating time, you learn as you go along. I was brand new to all of this a year ago, and now I'm able to fix nearly anything that happens to my phone.
Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2
BadUsername said:
It's all part of the learning experience. You can't expect someone to give you answers all the time. I learned so much from not being happy with some aspect of my phone, searching for answers, and applying fixes for my problems.
You can learn anything without dedicating time, you learn as you go along. I was brand new to all of this a year ago, and now I'm able to fix nearly anything that happens to my phone.
Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just needed to vent some frustration at this lol...
Thanks.
On the bright side I know how to use odin, so I can almost never kill my phone
Sometimes I feel like I need two phones though. One to mess with and one to actually use for being a phone.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1950824
This is a great guide. Just thought of it and couldn't remember where I saw it but it's worth skimming through.
Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2
SirProudNoob said:
Sometimes I feel like I need two phones though. One to mess with and one to actually use for being a phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is exactly why I haven't flashed a single rom/kernel on my phone since I had it (run debloated stock with a few mods). I need my phone functional 100 percent. I was a flash-a-holic with my OG Samsung Epic, and learned from this that you can't have both variety and function. Do I miss the experience? Sure, but right now I can't afford to have a phone that isn't functioning the way I need it to be. Speajing of two phones: just upgraded to GNote 3, so may finally got to mess around with the S3 once the Note is activated.
SirProudNoob said:
One of the things that frustrates me is that I can't solve these issues on my own. I'm trying to learn linux and a lot of basic things like that, but it doesn't come naturally. If I could just know how to fix things, then I'd be happy.
I just learned about flashing radios not a few months ago. Before that I was having a ton of issues getting google voice search and my camera to work, and I didn't know why.
So many people write guides and such, but they never give the deeper explanations. Just the quick, easy answers. Take the one-click root for D2VZW. Does it work amazingly? Yes, I used it earlier today, and it was flawless. But I want to learn more in a way that's doesn't require 200% commitment and prior knowledge of things like how to use the linux terminal.
I don't like being a noob, but it's impossible to learn this stuff on your own unless you dedicate yourself, body and soul...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Might I suggest XDA-University to help you learn these things?
I've bookmarked those links. Thanks for the help. I didn't know about the XDA university, since as you can see I'm new here.
If it was shown to us during registration (along with that one video), sorry I missed it.
SirProudNoob said:
I've bookmarked those links. Thanks for the help. I didn't know about the XDA university, since as you can see I'm new here.
If it was shown to us during registration (along with that one video), sorry I missed it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The video is probably older than the university...it just opened about 3 months ago.
i'll be honest...I love cyanogenmod and would (almost) die for it...I have found my happy rom to be (Carbon) and while i have no issues with it, i live in a bad signal area...long story short, we don't have Verizon Coverage (Altell) atm...There was a lawyer issue that created a problem back in the seventies and that was just lifted about a year ago...Verizon's towers are being put up everywhere and i can't wait till they are activated...That being said i get data drops in the town i live in and sometimes have better experience on Touchwiz...But i cannot stand being on 4.1.2 and to be honest even though i might have data on touchwiz i can't really get it to work...so...
My experience is that when cyanogenmod in its current state is more honest about connectivity....because where cyanogenmod has none touchwiz has a connection that can't do anything.... If we had touchwiz with the latest android version i would probably be fine with an aosp theme....but not really... xD