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Just as we get use to the Tegra 2 now comes the Tegra 3 quad core processor...
http://www.junauza.com/2011/01/nvidia-set-to-unveil-tegra-3-with-quad.html
Read it -- it will be a beast!
Let's hope we see it in some tablets quicker than it took for the Tegra2 to catch on though...
Makes me sorry that I sold my NVIDIA stock
I've just emailed the folks at Rubicon development complaining that their Great Little War Game (which is a great game btw) is laggy on my ASUS EEE Pad Transformer which is powered by the Tegra 2 SOC when you set the detail to high or ultra. Setting it to medium plays the game smoothly. Some folk posted a review of the game in the Android market praising the game runs smoothly even on his Incredible S which runs on the Adreno 205 GPU. Running the game on high / ultra adds in an excellent water effect which causes the game to slowdown on the Transformer.
I highlighted this to the Rubicon developers and one of them said that while the Tegra 2 CPU is powerful, the GPU isn't as powerful as the Adreno 205 GPU on the Incredible S. I seriously find that really really hard to believe because the benchmark figures here shows that Tegra 2 even beats the PowerVR GPU in Nexus S which is more powerful than the Adreno 205:
http://androidandme.com/2011/03/news/tegra-2-benchmarks-motorola-atrix-4g-vs-lg-optimus-2x/
So I emailed them to see if they can actually optimize it for Tegra 2 because as I understand it, you have to optimize your game for Tegra 2 chipsets in order to make full use of the GPU much like in games such as RipTide GP which has excellent graphics and I dont believe the Adreno 205 could render the water effect that brilliantly.
Could someone shed some light on this?
Update:
Here's what the developers of "Great little war game" have to say about tegra 2 tablets:
We've done just that with v1.0.4 - have a play in the new settings screen.
We've kind done all we can do now tbh, of the 4 different GPU's in Android phones, Tegra 2 comes bottom and its in most of the devices with the biggest screens.
---
Can you believe that? Sounds to me they are getting lazy rather than trying to optimize it for Tegra 2 because right now, they have two modes in the game with the new update - a fast graphics and a best graphics mode. Fast graphics mode appears to set the game resolution at a horrible 640x480 to speed things up but makes things very very ugly with heavy pixelation on tablets. while best graphics uses the native resolution, everything is sharp but slows down on certain larger levels of the game.
I suggested to them to change this to 800x600 when toggling to fast graphics which i believe will reduce the pixelation effect while still maintaining a decent graphics for the player. What do you guys think?
Nexus S should be right about the same hardware as the Galaxy Tab, and I do run RipTide GP at full quality equally smooth on that thing. Tegra 2 is a kinda all around lame chipset, but you really notice the single core when a mail comes in, and the TF keeps you splashing around while the Galaxy stutters badly for a moment... Also no choice on the chipset at the moment if you want a tablet.
Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk
AlexTheStampede said:
Nexus S should be right about the same hardware as the Galaxy Tab, and I do run RipTide GP at full quality equally smooth on that thing. Tegra 2 is a kinda all around lame chipset, but you really notice the single core when a mail comes in, and the TF keeps you splashing around while the Galaxy stutters badly for a moment... Also no choice on the chipset at the moment if you want a tablet.
Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk
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Nexus S is powered by the PowerVR GPU - its not the same as the Galaxy Tab at all (i'm referring to the Galaxy Tab 10.1).
And I'm talking about the one they sold one year ago, the 7" Froyo little monster using the same Hummingbird coupled with an SGX 540 that the Nexus S has
Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk
AlexTheStampede said:
And I'm talking about the one they sold one year ago, the 7" Froyo little monster using the same Hummingbird coupled with an SGX 540 that the Nexus S has
Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk
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how did you manage to run RipTide GP which is a Tegra only game? I suppose you used something like chainfire 3d? ( I havent tried it tho)
Exactly, Chainfire 3D and the Tegra plugin. No settings changed it just works, exactly like the pinball game. I didn't try any other game.
It requires a lot more power to render a game at 1280x720 than 800x480. As for which SoC is more powerful, I think benchmarks prove that Tegra 2 > Snapdragon S2.
AlexTheStampede said:
Exactly, Chainfire 3D and the Tegra plugin. No settings changed it just works, exactly like the pinball game. I didn't try any other game.
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I see. cool. but it still doesnt make sense why Rubicon mentioned that the Adreno 205 is more powerful than the Tegra 2.
Killer Bee said:
It requires a lot more power to render a game at 1280x720 than 800x480.
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this part i totally agree in terms of resolution but to say the Adreno 205 GPU is more powerful than the Tegra 2 GPU is wrong in every sense. Just because a game plays well in 800x480 doesnt make that GPU more powerful than the Tegra 2 GPU which plays game on 1280x800 in tablets. If it were the same resolution in the incredible S i'm pretty sure the game would be just as sluggish or worse.
mlbl said:
Could someone shed some light on this?
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Assuming the game runs at the Transformer's native resolution, the ULP GeForce would be required to push nearly three times as many pixels as the Adreno 205 in the Incredible S. Consider then that the ULP GeForce is maybe 50% faster in best-case scenarios.
As for Tegra optimizations, all that really is is a proprietary texture format that only Tegra chips can use. It provides a few benefits.. that can already be implemented in OpenGL ES 2.X anyway.
Edit:
Man it obviously took me a long time to type that.. got ninja'd three times over..
mlbl said:
I see. cool. but it still doesnt make sense why Rubicon mentioned that the Adreno 205 is more powerful than the Tegra 2.
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Just because they are developers, doesn't mean they aren't ignorant of certain hardware.
Sjael said:
Assuming the game runs at the Transformer's native resolution, the ULP GeForce would be required to push nearly three times as many pixels as the Adreno 205 in the Incredible S. Consider then that the ULP GeForce is maybe 50% faster in best-case scenarios.
As for Tegra optimizations, all that really is is a proprietary texture format that only Tegra chips can use. It provides a few benefits.. that can already be implemented in OpenGL ES 2.X anyway.
Edit:
Man it obviously took me a long time to type that.. got ninja'd three times over..
Just because they are developers, doesn't mean they aren't ignorant of certain hardware.
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Your explanation makes a lot of sense and yep doesn't mean they are developers, they're always right. Its possible they've made a mistake there and just make some assumptions on their own instead of basing off facts.
To begin with, the "Tegra Zone" means quality exactly like say, Amazon AppStore. Example? Galaxy on Fire 2 runs smooth-ish (I'd say 20fps or so) on an iPhone 3G. Not a 3GS. The mighty 600mhz (is it still underclocked to 400?) money printer Apple sold in 2008 with 128mb of ram. But hey, I'm sure the resolution of the screen is low enough to counterbalance the amazing graphics possible only thanks to Nvidia!
Anyway the Galaxy Tab runs at 1024x600 that is closer to the 1280x720 of the TF (the lower bar is 80 pixels, and there isn't any game using those obviously).
Here's what the developers of "Great little war game" have to say about tegra 2 tablets:
We've done just that with v1.0.4 - have a play in the new settings screen.
We've kind done all we can do now tbh, of the 4 different GPU's in Android phones, Tegra 2 comes bottom and its in most of the devices with the biggest screens.
---
Can you believe that? Sounds to me they are getting lazy rather than trying to optimize it for Tegra 2 because right now, they have two modes in the game with the new update - a fast graphics and a best graphics mode. Fast graphics mode appears to set the game resolution at a horrible 640x480 to speed things up but makes things very very ugly with heavy pixelation on tablets. while best graphics uses the native resolution, everything is sharp but slows down on certain larger levels of the game.
I suggested to them to change this to 800x600 when toggling to fast graphics which i believe will reduce the pixelation effect while still maintaining a decent graphics for the player. What do you guys think?
Sjael said:
Just because they are developers, doesn't mean they aren't ignorant of certain hardware.
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I gotta bump that one up. I'm in a development shop and the majority of the developers wouldn't know what CPU they had if there wasn't a sticker on their laptop.
Understanding software and hardware is a completely different skill set.
Well, could just be gpu optimization. Adreno uses a VLIW5, similar to AMD gpu, with an extra scalar unit, which apparently is hard to develop for, but can yield great results on shader heavy prgrams that are designed for it (or just happen to favor it). The Adreno 205 does outpace the [email protected] in vertex shader heavy benchmarks... and most implementations of snapdragon only use one of its two memory channels! ( because the first is PoP, but thesecond must be off package).
Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk
while the Tegra 2 CPU is powerful, the GPU isn't as powerful as the Adreno 205 GPU on the Incredible S.
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That's the most retarded thing I've ever heard. Rubicon mainly develops for the iOS platform; I'd reckon they are just lazy at optimizing for several different SOCs.
grainysand said:
That's the most retarded thing I've ever heard. Rubicon mainly develops for the iOS platform; I'd reckon they are just lazy at optimizing for several different SOCs.
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There is another point I didn't address. Adreno 205 is Unified shaders. So is sgx540. Tegra 2, however, is 4 pixel, 4 vertex. So there are definately situations, even entire genres, that would be potentially slower on Tegra 2 compared to what a benchmark would say.
Sent from my Transformer TF101 using Tapatalk
I had bought Great Little War Game 2 weeks ago. But after few minutes of playing I canceled the purchase and refunded. Why? Because of poor optimization for Asus.
I have this game also on Ipad2. It runs smoothly and much better.
Orion66 said:
I had bought Great Little War Game 2 weeks ago. But after few minutes of playing I canceled the purchase and refunded. Why? Because of poor optimization for Asus.
I have this game also on Ipad2. It runs smoothly and much better.
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generally not just the asus but all the tegra 2 tablets have poor performance for this game
So is the issue that the tegra 2 in some respects is slower or that developers need to write with the way the tegra 2 gpu works in mind?
Sent from my tf101 using xda premium 1.59Ghz
When I read about the upcoming quad-core tablets a few months ago, I was thrilled - especially when the Transformer Prime hit the news. But then, after reading a lot more news, I began to hesitate. Here's some of my thoughts (in terms of hardware):
1) CPU: I recognized that the biggest differences between Tegra 3 and Tegra 2 is just the quantity. So I think that when other manufacturers (Samsung, Qualcomm, TI, etc.) release their quad-core chips, the Tegra 3 will mostly stay behind in the performance battlefield.
2) RAM: 1GB is now standard and enough to use, but when MS release Windows 8, and I think many people would like to install it on their tablets, it is unsure whether 1GB of RAM is enough or not. Better be prepared with 2GB. Also, when I decided to buy a tablet, I intended to use it for at least 3 or 4 years. Who knows if the future Android OS recommend 2GB of RAM to run smooth?
3) GPU: Same as CPU, I'm looking forward to see how powerful the new ones are (especially the ones from Imagination Technologies).
4) Display: Since the iPhone 4, the high-res trend has risen in the phone arena, and in 2012 it'll happen with tablets. We all like to see a smooth, detailed graphics from our tablets, aren't we?
Feel free to criticize me, I will be very appreciated.
go to anandtech for reviev.i have the same problem...lets waith...
inviato da sgs2
The Galaxy S 2 for sure slaughtered the Tegra 2 in benchmark numbers, but in actuality, Tegra 2 has the best dev kit Android has to offer and offers a better gaming experience.
The results are that THD (Tegra HD) enhanced games are vastly superior to the Galaxy S 2 running the standard Android version, so in my eyes, Tegra 2 won in the department of real world performance. I expect gpu acceleration from ICS to be that much better on Tegra 2 devices.
The Tegra 3 is the latest and most powerful hardware available now, and unless you're European, you'll be waiting a full year to get Samsung's next offering in which Tegra 4 will be right around the corner by the time it actualizes in our market.
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WAiting for quadqore..
Sent from my GT-S5570
Dsparil said:
The Galaxy S 2 for sure slaughtered the Tegra 2 in benchmark numbers, but in actuality, Tegra 2 has the best dev kit Android has to offer and offers a better gaming experience.
The results are that THD (Tegra HD) enhanced games are vastly superior to the Galaxy S 2 running the standard Android version, so in my eyes, Tegra 2 won in the department of real world performance. I expect gpu acceleration from ICS to be that much better on Tegra 2 devices.
The Tegra 3 is the latest and most powerful hardware available now, and unless you're European, you'll be waiting a full year to get Samsung's next offering in which Tegra 4 will be right around the corner by the time it actualizes in our market.
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Indeed Tegra 2 is quite good in games, however I still think that the PowerVR SGX GPU series are the most powerful. But why didn't the manufacturers use them in their SoC (except TI with the old SGX540)?
Although Samsung produced good quality SoC, if other competitors can release new chips sooner with the same performances then we will have other choices. So let's wait for the full wave of quad-core chips and then we can decide.
I think the big difference will be the manufacturing process of the new snapdragon processor, it could really increase the battery life. But, as the engadget review of the transformer prime says, it has 10 h of battery life, not bad for a 5 core.
Elwood_It said:
I think the big difference will be the manufacturing process of the new snapdragon processor, it could really increase the battery life. But, as the engadget review of the transformer prime says, it has 10 h of battery life, not bad for a 5 core.
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It's obvious that in the Engadget battery test, there are times when their usage wasn't too heavy, and that was when the fith low-power core performed.
.
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Wait....
Hi there!
I'm currently in the hunt for an Android Honeycomb 3.1/3.2 tablet. and i'm choosing between Samsung's new Galaxy Tab 7.0 Plus which has the Mali 400MP GPU and the Sony Tablet S' own Geforce by Nvidia Tegra 2. (both has a dual core processor although Samsung has a slight edge i think with the new Exynos 1.2GHz)
Based on the initial tech specs i've seen online the Samsung has a supposedly mind-altering 20 hours battery life while Sony has only 6 hours max. advertised.
I'm not a technical person but may i ask in your opinion is the better device's GPU in terms of better gaming, better graphics rendering, better battery life and better heat dissipation?
Thank you.
In the cpu department the exynos wins. In the GPU i'm not sure since it's a bit harder, but all i do know is that tegra 2 is unable to play high profile HD/1080p.
Am i correct in saying that Samsung made the Exynos processors and ARM the Mali-400MP? or are they the same now?
Did samsung made the iPhone 4/S' processor/GPU?
Would you consider the Mali-400MP better than Nvidia's Geforce Tegra 2 GPU? (in terms of the above i mentioned)
(i.e. Samsung Galaxy Tab 7 Plus vs Sony Tablet S)
They didn't/don't make the Mali, but they do put it together with the cortex a9's.
As I said, I'm not sure on the graphics part.
$1 gets you a reply
Does a processor speed or the graphics card determines a device's overall performance & responsiveness?
I'll be mainly surfing the net, watch Youtube videos, facebook, twitter, viewing .pdf or .doc files, odd photos & uploading them, listening to music, playing games, using DLNA to watch movies to my TV.
I wonder if a few bucks of investment on a faster processor is worth it. (e.g. Galaxy Tab 7.0 Plus vs Galaxy Tab 7.7)
That and software efficiency. I am not sure about samsung tablets, but all I know is that the sgs 2 is the smoothest and possibly fastest android phone available. But personally samsung tablets are overpriced, you'd be better off with the new or old asus transformer.
$1 gets you a reply
I like more the tablet with Tegra 2
Tegra 2 is okay, but IMHO it's the software/drivers/OS that was released (Honeycomb) with Tegra that gave Tegra a bad wrap. Those two just don't work well together.
I played around with a 7.0 Plus awhile back and man those Exynos dual cores fly!
IMO Exynos is better at this current time, but doesn't have the gamer following like Tegra, and may never with Tegra 3 out now.
I prefer something that has a smaller than 10" screen like the Galaxy tab 7.0 Plus or the Galaxy Tab 7.7 because of the size and as i heard of the dual-core processors being that good.
I still don't know if there is any truth to the "rumour" that the Exynos-powered tablets (like the 7.0 Plus and 7.7) have 20 hours of standby battery life. is this true?
And can you gauge a tablet's battery life on the processor speed, RAM or the OS?
exynos is better as i,ve heard
Saw this video on Youtube comparing a Samsung Galaxy S2 (with the Tegra 2 chipset) and the LG Optimus 2X with an Exynos chipset.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JR4jzO3sN5U
and it looked like the LG with the Exynos one is smoother in running/rendering 3D.
am i correct?
+1 for exynos. Tegra 2 is awesome as well.
sent from an HTC sensation on CM7 alpha #10
The problem with those new Galaxy Tab 7.0 Plus and 7.7. are just that...they are new. sure there are reviews but there isn't much on the high-street to actually try it.
The one i fancy right now is the Sony Tablet S. seen the actual thing and it is really smooth and almost flawless. and it has Tegra 2. so surely even on a 1Ghz dual-core it must be good.
Which processor is better and why? I'm thinking about getting the Samsung Galaxy Tab S in July. But I'm also hearing great things about the Asus Infinity Transformer TF701 with the Tegra 4. Better graphics? Faster? Appreciate all the input guys.
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Tegra 4 has better graphics and probably better optimised games than the Mali on the Exynos. CPU wise, I think the CPU on the Exynos is slightly better.
xRevilatioNx said:
Which processor is better and why? I'm thinking about getting the Samsung Galaxy Tab S in July. But I'm also hearing great things about the Asus Infinity Transformer TF701 with the Tegra 4. Better graphics? Faster? Appreciate all the input guys.
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Since Tegra's dead I'd say go with the one that's got a future...
NVIDIA says the mainstream tablet and smartphone market is no longer their focus
May 22nd 2014 by Quentyn Kennemer
Once upon a time NVIDIA made plays to try and get into any smartphone or tablet they could. With stiff competition from Qualcomm and other chipset vendors, they’ve found that task to be very difficult. They credit their hard hurdles to MediaTek even more, because MediaTek’s value-positioned platform wins out for many mid-level or small OEMs.
So NVIDIA’s calling it quits… somewhat. In a recent interview, NVIDIA CEO Jen-Hsun Huang talked about their struggles in the market so far and what they’re doing to adapt. For starters, he says they realize that competing for the “mainstream” smartphone and tablet market is no longer a desire for them.
http://phandroid.com/2014/05/22/nvidia-ceo-interview/
Really? I heard their was a Tegra 5 ( The 192 CUDA-core Tegra K1) coming...
http://www.theverge.com/2014/1/5/5278206/nvidia-debuts-tegra-k1-192-core-processor
Nvidia's new processor is the latest in the Tegra family, succeeding last year's Tegra 4. This processor now puts them in the same camp as Intel. They claim it has more raw computing power than the Playstation 4.
The Tegra K1 A15 variant will max out at 2.3GHz, while the Denver version will max out at 2.5GHz. The former is expected to hit devices in the first half of this year, while the latter will hit in the second half.
the K1 is offered in two versions: the first is a 32-bit quad-core ARM Cortex A15 processor, similar to the Tegra 4 but more efficient.*According to an Nvidia whitepaper (PDF),*it can use half the power for the same CPU performance, or get 40 percent more performance for the same power. The second variant is a long-awaited custom 64-bit dual-core "Denver" ARM CPU, Huang spoke at great length to demonstrate the K1's graphical capabilities, showing it capably render Unreal Engine 4:
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So is it really dead?
It will also power Google's Project Tango Tablet
http://www.forbes.com/sites/greatsp...a-k1-powers-googles-project-tango-tablet-kit/
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system.img said:
Tegra 4 has better graphics and probably better optimised games than the Mali on the Exynos. CPU wise, I think the CPU on the Exynos is slightly better.
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What's the reasoning behind that? There are more Mali GPU devices out there so won't it be a bigger focus for app developers?
---------- Post added at 12:12 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:11 AM ----------
xRevilatioNx said:
Really? I heard their was a Tegra 5 ( The 192 CUDA-core Tegra K1) coming...
http://www.theverge.com/2014/1/5/5278206/nvidia-debuts-tegra-k1-192-core-processor
So is it really dead?
It will also power Google's Project Tango Tablet
http://www.forbes.com/sites/greatsp...a-k1-powers-googles-project-tango-tablet-kit/
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Yeah K1 is already out. It is in Xiaomi's new tablet.
I've now just read that chip is going to "revolutionize gaming" and will power 4K easily.
The K1, along with the new Unreal Engine 4 will, Huang promised, bring "Next-Gen" "Photo-Real" gaming to tablets and mobile phones. "Unreal Engine is the most successful game engine of all time,"
According to Huang, theTegra K1 mobile CPU offers almost 3x the performance of Apple's A7 Chips.
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http://mashable.com/2014/01/06/nvidia-tegra-k1/
Now I'm afraid to even pull the trigger on the Asus or Samsung offerings. Not until I see where this chip lands, in future devices, and how they spec out.
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xRevilatioNx said:
So is it really dead?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
[Q] CNET - You delayed Tegra 4 for Tegra 4i. Did that turn out to be a mistake? Did you miss this whole design cycle?
[A] Nvidia's CEO: I would say that Tegra 4i didn't pan out. We learned a lot in the process. But there are many things in our company that didn't pan out. That's OK. If you want to be an innovative company, you have to fail. Look, we built a great chip. LG's shipping it in the rest of the world outside the United States. It's a fantastic processor. But from a business strategy, it wasn't a success. So I learned a lot from it. It's OK. I'm glad I did it, and now we're moving on.
[Q] CNET: Why did Tegra struggle in smartphones?
[A:] Nvidia's CEO: Our focus as a company is still performance-oriented. The mainstream phone market commoditized so fast that really the...differentiators were price. And you can see the pressure that MediaTek is putting on Qualcomm, and you can see the pressure that MediaTek is putting on Marvell and Broadcom and all of these companies. Because guess what? They're the lowest-cost provider. I think that for mainstream phones, there's one strategy that really works right now, which is price. That's not our differentiator. That's not what we do for a living.
Sounds dead to me; at least in mainstream tablets and smartphones. Who's going to use it anyway? Qualcomm, Samsung, and MediaTek have better scale and produce equal or better chips so who needs Nvidia if they aren't price competitive?
This really isn't a relevant conversation for the SGS5 forum anyway. The Tab S' are still using S-800 so it appears all of Samsung's tablets starting with the N10.1-14 are using the same h/w which means Exynos 5420 for the Tab S which doesn't have HMP enabled where the 5422 in the SGS5 does. The display area and sheer amount of pixels in Samsung's 2560x1600 tablets also make this an irrelevant comparison. There's like 10 people in the TF701 forum and it's been marked down everywhere to $299. Between Nvidia's and the TF701's position I'd say its day in the sun has passed. If it every had one.
Barry
They aren't leaving the market. They just don't want to be mainstream. In order to do do they would have to be cost efficient as well. That's not what Nvidia is about.
You left this tidbit out..
So NVIDIA’s calling it quits… somewhat . In a recent interview, NVIDIA*CEO Jen-Hsun Huang talked about their struggles in the market so far and what they’re doing to adapt.
“Mainstream" could mean a lot of different things, but it sounds like he’s talking about every other chipset vendor’s need to hit every price point there is. He doesn’t want the Tegra brand to conform to something they don’t want it to be — their belief is that Tegra is a powerful line, and they don’t want to sacrifice that standard of power for the sake of creating more cost-efficient chipsets .
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Lastly, as another poster said, your seeing their latest chip by Nvidia rolling out in tablets. So as I said before, I may wait it out. See what other manufacturers this chipset pops up in, and how the rest of the tablet specs out. 4K capability is also a plus, along with be the best gaming tablet on the market, with that chipset.
Barry. Thank you for your opinion. If you were a gamer like me. Who also enjoys multimedia consumption, at the highest quality. What would you do?
Edit: Barry, disregard my quote. I see you have it up there and now realize your rationalization. So you don't expect it showing up (in any prominent fashion) , in the tablet market.
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