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It seems mister Steve Jobs is very scared of Android, as I'm sure your all aware.
http://m.engadget.com/default/artic...es-patents-appea/&category=classic&postPage=1
Apple continues to target the major Android handset manufacturers. Unfortunately it seems HTC lost its battle with Steve for now, with Samsung also under fire.
Does Apple really think they can slow down Android enough to keep its precious iPhone on top? Not likely. I don't think showing fear is good for the company.
Apple continues to rely on its brand name's reputation, instead of doing something truely innovative (the iPhone was innovative... WAS. The iPad was innovative as well, but lets just say the Xoom beats the crap out of it). Now the iPhone is small screened and slow (network and CPU wise) compaired to any high-end Android device.
Apple is only buying time. Sooner or later, the iPhone fad will come to an end, much like Facebooks current plight.
Feel free to give your input.
*NOTICE* These are my personal opinion. If you like the iPhone or Apple for that matter, then more power to you. Apple makes good products, expensive as they are. Flaming is not necessary.
Sent from my HTC Cyanogenbolt
"All Things D is reporting that the two patents in question are 5,946,647 and 6,343,263, the former of which is said to be "fundamental to Android."
Any ideas?
orkillakilla said:
but lets just say the Xoom beats the crap out of it
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Isn't the Xoom some half-finished product, both software and hardware-wise?
Other than that, I fully agree with your post - Apple is afraid. Very afraid. They're not the only ones though, Microsoft is as well. That's why they're both resorting to patent litigation. While at the same time Apple is totally copying Android's notification dropdown. Hypocrisy at it's best.
The ones who are really afraid? The ones who keep talkin' smack about Apple and MS. Otherwise they would sit back and watch it.
MartyLK said:
The ones who are really afraid? The ones who keep talkin' smack about Apple and MS. Otherwise they would sit back and watch it.
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Yes, we're talking out of fear, it's totally not about calling companies out on their crap. Sure. LOL
Totally agree bother! Didn't Microsoft get in trouble for forcing there software into pcs? Someone got paid off for win this last one with HTC. I think its totally against our rights to hold back technology for the gain of one. Plus the iphone is old school. Its time to move on to better pastures Mr jobs! Remember how technology was for apple before the iphone came out or the ipod? Apple sucked the big one! I think there running scared cause android is its competition! to bad,we the people have a right to choose!
droid charge
orkillakilla said:
It seems mister Steve Jobs is very scared of Android, as I'm sure your all aware.
http://m.engadget.com/default/artic...es-patents-appea/&category=classic&postPage=1
Apple continues to target the major Android handset manufacturers. Unfortunately it seems HTC lost its battle with Steve for now, with Samsung also under fire.
Does Apple really think they can slow down Android enough to keep its precious iPhone on top? Not likely. I don't think showing fear is good for the company.
Apple continues to rely on its brand name's reputation, instead of doing something truely innovative (the iPhone was innovative... WAS. The iPad was innovative as well, but lets just say the Xoom beats the crap out of it). Now the iPhone is small screened and slow (network and CPU wise) compaired to any high-end Android device.
Apple is only buying time. Sooner or later, the iPhone fad will come to an end, much like Facebooks current plight.
Feel free to give your input.
*NOTICE* These are my personal opinion. If you like the iPhone or Apple for that matter, then more power to you. Apple makes good products, expensive as they are. Flaming is not necessary.
Sent from my HTC Cyanogenbolt
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Click to collapse
hmm another android vs apple thread...hmm.. lost count on the numbers now
jags_the1 said:
hmm another android vs apple thread...hmm.. lost count on the numbers now
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Hmm... another pointless post. Lost count on the number now...
If you don't want to add to the discussion, or don't like the fact that there are many of these threads, simply don't read it.
Has far as the Xoom goes, I've only read good things about it, and that it's at least on the same level as the iPad. I haven't played around on one though, so I can't say for sure.
It seems Microsoft and Apple, being the "old dogs" in the computer/tech/smartphone world, have their tails between their legs, acting like a chihuahua showing it's teeth at a pit bull...
orkillakilla said:
something about dogs
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I don't think its Apple with the problems.. check out some snippets from the link below:
http://fosspatents.blogspot.com/2011/07/itc-judge-finds-htc-in-infringement-of.html
ITC judge finds HTC in infringement of two Apple patents
Google's Android mobile operating system is in serious trouble:
Patents appear to be at the core of Android and are likely infringed by all Android devices
I have looked at those patents before and they appear to be very fundamental. They are very likely to be infringed by code that is at the core of Android.
This could in a worst-case scenario result in an import ban against many or even all Android-based HTC products in the U.S. market.
In a slightly less negative scenario, HTC might have to remove certain functionality from its products, and that could result in a significant or even substantial degradation of the quality of those devices.
Since those patents don't appear to relate to HTC's own extensions of Android but to Android itself, they may affect all of the other makers of Android-based devices. Apple could soon be in a strong position to obtain import bans against dozens of device makers.
Apple unlikely to grant a license -- but might make damages claims
Android is also under fire in dozens of federal lawsuits. By my count, there are 49 Android-related infringement suits (federal and ITC). A very prominent one is Oracle's lawsuit against Google, and the judge presiding over that case has raised very serious questions about the possibility of Google's intentional infringement of Java-related intellectual property.
Tone_ said:
I don't think its Apple with the problems.. check out some snippets from the link below:
http://fosspatents.blogspot.com/2011/07/itc-judge-finds-htc-in-infringement-of.html
ITC judge finds HTC in infringement of two Apple patents
Google's Android mobile operating system is in serious trouble:
Patents appear to be at the core of Android and are likely infringed by all Android devices
I have looked at those patents before and they appear to be very fundamental. They are very likely to be infringed by code that is at the core of Android.
This could in a worst-case scenario result in an import ban against many or even all Android-based HTC products in the U.S. market.
In a slightly less negative scenario, HTC might have to remove certain functionality from its products, and that could result in a significant or even substantial degradation of the quality of those devices.
Since those patents don't appear to relate to HTC's own extensions of Android but to Android itself, they may affect all of the other makers of Android-based devices. Apple could soon be in a strong position to obtain import bans against dozens of device makers.
Apple unlikely to grant a license -- but might make damages claims
Android is also under fire in dozens of federal lawsuits. By my count, there are 49 Android-related infringement suits (federal and ITC). A very prominent one is Oracle's lawsuit against Google, and the judge presiding over that case has raised very serious questions about the possibility of Google's intentional infringement of Java-related intellectual property.
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As far as HTC goes, they are likely to settle with Apple, paying them god knows how much money, if Apple even accepts an offer like that.
I have read some about the Oracle case, but I haven't really read all about it yet. I'll definitely give that a look.
Also, I would like to thank you for making a productive post that isn't negative, and that actually adds to this discussion.
Well it's not really a surprise here. Every software dev does this kind of thing. They ask patents on certain elements that they know would slow down or make another product less appealing.
Otherwise spending thousands of dollars on patents would be kinda pointless.
And like MS did and does it sues those that so called took there patent without asking or paying. I don't see anything new here. Sure it's again the big companies Apple vs Android but heck those are the 2 biggest players for home usage.
The point of all these lawsuits is:
Try and get money from competition even banning devices
Showcase all features you have but others can't get
Advertise
And for the other company sympathy. Besides ads even if they are bad are always good for sales
And a good lawyer stretches it till it either expires or till they invent something better.
orkillakilla said:
As far as HTC goes, they are likely to settle with Apple, paying them god knows how much money, if Apple even accepts an offer like that.
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HTC bought S3 recently and Apple has been found infringing on S3 patents. This stupid game works both ways. So there may not be a one-way settlement, but instead a cross-licensing deal.
@Tone_: Apple resorting to patent litigation is because it is them with a problem. Android's growth is much faster than iOS's. And Apple doesn't like that.
Also, it begins, the backlash because of this software patent stupidity: http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/appsblog/2011/jul/15/app-developers-withdraw-us-patents <- It's app developers for now, but I'm really, really waiting for the day when hardware makers simply pull out of the US market. Let the US companies sue each other into oblivion, while the saner parts of the world flourish in actually moving things forward.
orkillakilla said:
As far as HTC goes, they are likely to settle with Apple, paying them god knows how much money, if Apple even accepts an offer like that.
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HTC bought out the rest of S3 and apple infringed them so who knows, would most likely be other Android manufactures that cop it..
http://www.thinq.co.uk/2011/7/4/apple-found-guilty-s3-patent-infringement/
Gusar321 said:
@Tone_: Apple resorting to patent litigation is because it is them with a problem. Android's growth is much faster than iOS's. And Apple doesn't like that.
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They say there is no smoke without fire also a lot of people buying Android probably could not afford or do not want iphones so Apple probably aren't that worried as its a sale they would not have made.
Tone_ said:
They say there is no smoke without fire also a lot of people buying Android probably could not afford or do not want iphones so Apple probably aren't that worried as its a sale they would not have made.
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That's not necessarly true. Before Android, if you wanted a smart phone, you either got a WMP, crapberry, or an iPhone. Most people probably wouldn't want a windows phone. Blackberries were good, but moslty for business people. That leaves iPhone. If Android weren't in the picture, you can bet a lot of people would be getting iPhones.
Sent from my HTC Cyanogenbolt
orkillakilla said:
That's not necessarly true. Before Android, if you wanted a smart phone, you either got a WMP, crapberry, or an iPhone. Most people probably wouldn't want a windows phone. Blackberries were good, but moslty for business people. That leaves iPhone. If Android weren't in the picture, you can bet a lot of people would be getting iPhones.
Sent from my HTC Cyanogenbolt
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True but I would say wanting rather than getting at the time they were expensive, still are in comparison. All Android sales are not sales lost to Apple as I alluded to earlier.
Apple are probably more bothered about all the taglines the iworshipers love to hear that they can no longer use..
Isn't another selling point of Android the screen size of some devices? I mean alot of people can't type or anything on the iPhones tiny screen
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Jmatch said:
Isn't another selling point of Android the screen size of some devices? I mean alot of people can't type or anything on the iPhones tiny screen
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I remember going to the Apple store when the iPhone came out to try it. I couldn't type with my sausage thumbs. So I was banned to sliders and flippers until the newer 4.3 Android phones. And now Apple winning against HTC... WTF. Go to hell Apple. I'd rather reactivate my VX8300 than buy a iTurd.
I remember when the iPhone first came out. The only smartphones we had were low-quality, low-tech devices with resistive, un-finger friendly LCDs. The best we had was Treos or other stuff. There were no smartphones with all the tech the iPhone employed at that time. When the iPhone came out, it included all that futuristic tech we all dreamed of but could never get. It was like going from vinyl records to CDs. For you young-uns, that was a huge and exciting step.
The iPhone opened up a whole new world. Here in the US, companies were either too scared or too lazy to make an effort to incorporate solid reliability and high-tech into a smartphone. Then comes Apple. They not only made a world record phone, but made it genuinely reliable and usable. Sure...other companies had smartphones. But they didn't have the simplicity and cleanness and reliability or contain all of the high-end hardware the iPhone contained. Apple did for us consumers what the rest of the industry at that time did not want to do: make a fully developed and reliable smartphone that they (Apple engineers) wanted to use. Apple made a phone that they, themselves, wanted. You don't get that anywhere else in industry. Companies only make what their bean counter, lawyers, committees or shareholders want them to make. The other companies are only interested in putting out just barely good-enough products that will sell. Apple basically said to hell with the committees, lawyers, bean counters and made what they wanted to make. *THAT* is why the iPhone became a world-wide phenomenon. When a company makes something you truly want and wish a company would make, it will sell wildly and take over the world.
That is Apple. The company that did us all good and right and now, because other companies are copying Apple's success, and spreading lies and mis-information about Apple, people hate Apple. Apple gave us all what no other company had the stones to give us. And people are hating them for it. People look at all the smartphones we have now and say Apple's stuff is ****. But they never stop...or are too young to realize...that before the iPhone, the only thing we had was nothing like or as good as an iPhone.
MartyLK said:
I remember when the iPhone first came out. The only smartphones we had were low-quality, low-tech devices with resistive, un-finger friendly LCDs. The best we had was Treos or other stuff. There were no smartphones with all the tech the iPhone employed at that time. When the iPhone came out, it included all that futuristic tech we all dreamed of but could never get. It was like going from vinyl records to CDs. For you young-uns, that was a huge and exciting step.
The iPhone opened up a whole new world. Here in the US, companies were either too scared or too lazy to make an effort to incorporate solid reliability and high-tech into a smartphone. Then comes Apple. They not only made a world record phone, but made it genuinely reliable and usable. Sure...other companies had smartphones. But they didn't have the simplicity and cleanness and reliability or contain all of the high-end hardware the iPhone contained. Apple did for us consumers what the rest of the industry at that time did not want to do: make a fully developed and reliable smartphone that they (Apple engineers) wanted to use. Apple made a phone that they, themselves, wanted. You don't get that anywhere else in industry. Companies only make what their bean counter, lawyers, committees or shareholders want them to make. The other companies are only interested in putting out just barely good-enough products that will sell. Apple basically said to hell with the committees, lawyers, bean counters and made what they wanted to make. *THAT* is why the iPhone became a world-wide phenomenon. When a company makes something you truly want and wish a company would make, it will sell wildly and take over the world.
That is Apple. The company that did us all good and right and now, because other companies are copying Apple's success, and spreading lies and mis-information about Apple, people hate Apple. Apple gave us all what no other company had the stones to give us. And people are hating them for it. People look at all the smartphones we have now and say Apple's stuff is ****. But they never stop...or are too young to realize...that before the iPhone, the only thing we had was nothing like or as good as an iPhone.
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Click to collapse
Yes, Apple opened the doors to the modern smartphone, but if it wasn't them, someone else would have.
As for Apple as a company, the ONLY thing they did right was the iPhone/pod/pad. Their computers were crappy as hell (WERE). They have done better with computers recently, though not for the price in my opinion. I don't necessarily hate apple, I just think most if their products are way too expensive for my taste (mainly their computers).
Sent from my HTC Cyanogenbolt
I saw this in another forum and thought I would also share it here in the Sensation Forum.
Well I'm not a Apple or MS fan, but Apple is throwing all it's punches towards Android it seems. Just shows how much of a impact Android has had on them and will have in the future.
Anyway read this article about the ITC and HTC violating Apples Patents. I hope HTC comes back a wipes the **** out of Apple in the end.
http://allthingsd.com/20110715/itc-rules-htc-violated-two-apple-patents/?refcat=news
And here http://news.cnet.com/8301-1035_3-20079905-94/itc-says-htc-violating-two-of-apples-patents/
Apple is just full of crap.
This will blow over, it wont have a huge impact, they wont be able to sue much for damages even if HTC did loose. Android is open source, they will either find a loop hole or just work around it for future releases. No worries here.
That's crap.. The patents are 15 years old. Looks like Android is starting to be a threat to them.
Sent via HTC Sensation
They are very paranoid of all the Android success...hope HTC wins the appeal!
Google need to take action to protect its eco system.
Send from: gplus.to/everyday
I like to see Apple suing more OEMs so they will gang up on Apple and sue back togather in revenge, and if at the end of the day HTC loses and got banned from selling Android devices in the US market, American consumers will probably be stuck with smuggled products.
Patent enforcement is a big and lucrative business. All the major players have a portfolio of patents they use defensively to protect themselves from being sued. This quote sums up HTC's particular position:
HTC is considered the most vulnerable legally of the Android partners because it lacks a robust portfolio of patents that act as a potential shield. Earlier this month, HTC purchased S3 Graphics, largely because of a collection of patents that the ITC administrative law judge recently determined were used illegally by Apple.
http://news.cnet.com/8301-1035_3-20079905-94/itc-says-htc-violating-two-of-apples-patents/
dhumil said:
That's crap.. The patents are 15 years old. Looks like Android is starting to be a threat to them.
Sent via HTC Sensation
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They're that old??
Hmm.....IIRC,international patents last 17 years.
Two years of appeals....
I suspect that in the end,Apple will get theirs.
The sad part is that I don't dislike Apple,they just don't impress me.
It was only judge who ruled in Apple's favor. It's still going to be reviewed by the whole panel of judges. This isn't even close to a "victory" for Apple. Yet.
BarryH_GEG said:
Patent enforcement is a big and lucrative business. All the major players have a portfolio of patents they use defensively to protect themselves from being sued. This quote sums up HTC's particular position:
HTC is considered the most vulnerable legally of the Android partners because it lacks a robust portfolio of patents that act as a potential shield. Earlier this month, HTC purchased S3 Graphics, largely because of a collection of patents that the ITC administrative law judge recently determined were used illegally by Apple.
http://news.cnet.com/8301-1035_3-20079905-94/itc-says-htc-violating-two-of-apples-patents/
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Thanks for the link, I added it to the first post as well. It looks like HTC might be buying the patents as defense.
Like others said it is a long way from over.
everyday48 said:
Google need to take action to protect its eco system.
Send from: gplus.to/everyday
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It really sucks they lost out on the Nortel patents. It would have helped a lot. But honestly, this patent trolling has to stop. It's getting ridiculous now.
The only reason why android is getting all these random lawsuits is because its a threat.. Apple never cared before Google bought android. YES android existed before the G1 from Google, Google bought android out and took it to new levels, which we all thank lol.. The big players do this all the time, Apple Vs Microsoft, Apple Vs. Samsung, Apple Vs. Android... Well microsoft owns part of Apple's stocks, and vise-versa, its a way to move money around without being blunt obvious..
aNYthing24 said:
this patent trolling has to stop.
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+1
Even if HTC loses, it won't really change anything except their profit margin. They'll end up paying Apple something per handset for use of their intellectual property but won't have to redesign the handsets. But now that they own patents that Apple's theoretically infringing on the whole thing could be a draw anyway.
Apple has resorted to patent trolling hopefully...the appeals court will overturn the ruling
Bloody Apple...why don`t they just create great products instead of suing competitors. Stupid American thinking - if you can`t beat your competitor, sue him.
But no to worry - Google reported that every day there are 550 000 Android devices activated.
I cannot believe that Apple is actually trying to claim that they invented SCROLLING and TOUCH SCREENS. And all this as they're blatantly copying Android's notifications for iOS 5. I hope Google sues the living **** out of them.
This company is the very definition of scum.
I don't like Apple at all
Sent from my HTC Sensation 4G using XDA App
When your own pool of innovation has run dry, sue the other guy for having a bigger pool
Steve Jobs fostered this sort of thinking by Apple back in the garage days, and although they have found ways over the years to manipulate their groupthink disciples and the non-techie commonman into believing that they have changed, it's never really been any different. Small wonder, since Microsoft and Apple basically created each other, and forged their own business personas together... an endless game of backstabbing between two foul companies, whilst at the same time they attempt to destroy anyone else in the middle.
Companies like Microsoft and Apple make me wish that anti-trust investigations were more centered around *groups* of corporations, rather than simply individual ones. A lot more of the real dirt going on in the tech markets would maybe get scrubbed off of the floor, so to speak
So now that Google has acquired Motorola, what does this mean for us? I would assume the big Android backers like LG and Samsung have plan B's? I know samsung has the Bada O.S., not sure what LG will do. But we can all expect that as of today, all plans for Samsung to continue android development has all but ceased. Wouldn't make good sense for them to continue to put money in Google's pocket now that they are in the hardware business.
in case you haven't seen it...
http://www.bgr.com/2011/08/15/google-to-acquire-motorola-mobility-for-12-5-billion/
orateam said:
But we can all expect that as of today, all plans for Samsung to continue android development has all but ceased.
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It would be silly for Samsung to stop making android phones. Your assumption is just that, and it's not a very good one.
This deal isn't closed. It's still subject to regulatory approval.. and if it gets approved we wont see anything for a while..
Posted via tapatalk from my Samsung Stealth.
writing is on the wall.
http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/dail...V0aGFib3U-?sec=topStories&pos=1&asset=&ccode=
If you believe google bought Motorola for just the patents, pass the pipe this way....
Google could have paid a fraction of that, to buy the patents and give motorola a long term lease on them that expires beyond the patent. This occurs frequently. Google just did this a few weeks ago where they bought 1000+ patents from IBM.
Google bought Motorola for both reasons. They realized that apple is running the table with profits on hardware. You can only make so much money giving away your stuff for free.
I hate when companys do stuff like this. This will only turn into another iphone type company. You will see the cost of phones going up.. Google is trying to be the next Apple.
We can all kiss open source goodbye.
Goodbye ANDROID hello MOTOROID OR MOTODROID
Relax, this is a good thing.
http: //androidandme.com/2011/08/news/google-acquires-motorola-mobility-in-order-to-protect-android-from-patent-trolls/
lefunque said:
Relax, this is a good thing.
http: //androidandme.com/2011/08/news/google-acquires-motorola-mobility-in-order-to-protect-android-from-patent-trolls/
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+1
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Definitely a good thing. Google will remain open source (they're not dumb enough to put an end to that) and it helps with the frivolous legal battle apple and microsoft has been going after everyone about. I just hope they finally unlock the motos soon. Always liked the phones but I love custom roms too much to deal with a locked bootloader (thus why my X2 went bye bye)
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I wouldn't worry. Google purchasing Motorola actually benefits all Android device manufacturers.
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What does Google buying Motorola MOBILITY have to do with the other android OEM's? Nothing. Google just did this to back up all their OEM's with Motorola's patents.
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Another thing people don't seem to realize is that if Google does begin to behave badly, Samsung et al can just fork the code base.
Nothing is stopping Samsung, LG, HTC, Amazon, BN, and others from forming a consortium to develop there own brand of forked Android OS for use on their own smart phones.
For those that are optimistic, sorry to disappoint, but this is not. I’ve seen this same situation many times and it never works out. In fact, think of the last time this situation has turned out positive for the co-dependents.
I was at a huge oracle conference when oracle stabbed their 2 biggest sponsors in the heart. These sponsors (HP and Redhat) paid millions for sponsorship. They had their logos on stages, bags handed out, and BANG! Oracle announced on Day 1 that they were acquiring SUN and supporting all unix O.S. by themselves. HP had just the previous year made a huge deal with oracle on an agreement to be their primary hardware supplier and even worked on Oracle’s newest tech, oracle exadata, with them. At first, all the lovey dovey stuff came out and HP and oracle both said this was going to be great for both of them. Redhat said the boost in Unix OS would be good for them. NOT TRUE. Redhat is barely staying alive after putting all their eggs in the oracle basket. HP partnered with Microsoft to make the next big thing in the HP slate, vaporware, only to have to buy the PALM O.S. which isn’t working too good. It’s always like this. The mobile industry is about to become a 2 horse race. Samsung, HTC, LG, I see T.V. Sets in your future.
orateam said:
For those that are optimistic, sorry to disappoint, but this is not. I’ve seen this same situation many times and it never works out. In fact, think of the last time this situation has turned out positive for the co-dependents.
I was at a huge oracle conference when oracle stabbed their 2 biggest sponsors in the heart. These sponsors (HP and Redhat) paid millions for sponsorship. They had their logos on stages, bags handed out, and BANG! Oracle announced on Day 1 that they were acquiring SUN and supporting all unix O.S. by themselves. HP had just the previous year made a huge deal with oracle on an agreement to be their primary hardware supplier and even worked on Oracle’s newest tech, oracle exadata, with them. At first, all the lovey dovey stuff came out and HP and oracle both said this was going to be great for both of them. Redhat said the boost in Unix OS would be good for them. NOT TRUE. Redhat is barely staying alive after putting all their eggs in the oracle basket. HP partnered with Microsoft to make the next big thing in the HP slate, vaporware, only to have to buy the PALM O.S. which isn’t working too good. It’s always like this. The mobile industry is about to become a 2 horse race. Samsung, HTC, LG, I see T.V. Sets in your future.
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Nope, different situation. Oracle's bread and butter is, and has always been, very proprietary software and consulting services. Once they had there own underling OS and control of Java, they quickly began bringing as much as possible in house. That was the Oracle mentality from the giddy-up though and Red Hat/HP should have been aware of that. Very common with companies like that (MS, for example, has a very long and sordid history of doing the same thing).
Google is quite a bit different. For one thing, their bread and butter isn't in Android as an OS, it is in data collection and analytics (for advertising, marketing, and such) as well as various cloud services. Hardware margins being what they are, and Google's core business being what it is, it will be in Google's best interest to make sure that Android continues to be on as much hardware as possible.
yeah if anything the acquisition should be a good thing, hopefully they will take the moto phones and unlock them and put some pressure on other companies to follow suit. i think they will do some good things with moto's hardware and get other companies on top of their stuff, IE updates, unlocked bootloaders, not such garbage UI's, etc, etc......
Raccroc said:
Nope, different situation. Oracle's bread and butter is, and has always been, very proprietary software and consulting services. Once they had there own underling OS and control of Java, they quickly began bringing as much as possible in house. That was the Oracle mentality from the giddy-up though and Red Hat/HP should have been aware of that. Very common with companies like that (MS, for example, has a very long and sordid history of doing the same thing).
Google is quite a bit different. For one thing, their bread and butter isn't in Android as an OS, it is in data collection and analytics (for advertising, marketing, and such) as well as various cloud services. Hardware margins being what they are, and Google's core business being what it is, it will be in Google's best interest to make sure that Android continues to be on as much hardware as possible.
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Love ya response. It's a very good point. I looked a little more into it and found that motorola aquired General instruments. The company every cable company uses for it's DVR. apparently motorola owns the DVR patents and is currently suing TIVO. if motorola wins, nobody will be able to record T.V. but them. If Google can get into every Cable box and keep apple from ever creating a DVR.......
Samsung said this:
“We welcome today’s news, which demonstrates Google’s deep commitment to defending Android, its partners, and the ecosystem.”
J.K. Shin, president of Samsung’s Mobile Communications division.
If anything this will boost more innovation.
"This acquisition will not change our commitment to run Android as an open platform. Motorola will remain a licensee of Android and Android will remain open. We will run Motorola as a separate business. Many hardware partners have contributed to Android’s success and we look forward to continuing to work with all of them to deliver outstanding user experiences."
-Larry Page (http://googleblog.blogspot.com/2011/08/supercharging-android-google-to-acquire.html)
Google is anything but stupid, and they're not going to go shooting their partners -- which are the reason Android's so successful -- in the foot. Yes, this is obviously going to result in stronger competition for HTC, Samsung, LG, etc., and of course they aren't going to be thrilled about that, but it also drastically strengthens them against patent trolls and exorbitant patent licensing fees can cut into profits even more than stronger competition.
Plus, keep in mind that Motorola has a seriously low market share compared to HTC or Samsung -- they're in seventh place worldwide. This isn't like if Google bought HTC (which could have afforded to do -- but didn't because HTC has a tiny patent portfolio). In other wordS: if Motorola were the only one making Android handsets, Android would quickly fall to third or fourth place in the OS race.
Anyways, long story short: this means nothing for us other than that the next time we buy a phone, Motorola handsets may be better options. Of course, it just may spur competitors to keep up faster with updates, etc., leading to better devices all-around. Either way, we, the consumers, win.
Falcyn said:
"This acquisition will not change our commitment to run Android as an open platform. Motorola will remain a licensee of Android and Android will remain open. We will run Motorola as a separate business. Many hardware partners have contributed to Android’s success and we look forward to continuing to work with all of them to deliver outstanding user experiences."
-Larry Page (http://googleblog.blogspot.com/2011/08/supercharging-android-google-to-acquire.html)
Google is anything but stupid, and they're not going to go shooting their partners -- which are the reason Android's so successful -- in the foot. Yes, this is obviously going to result in stronger competition for HTC, Samsung, LG, etc., and of course they aren't going to be thrilled about that, but it also drastically strengthens them against patent trolls and exorbitant patent licensing fees can cut into profits even more than stronger competition.
Plus, keep in mind that Motorola has a seriously low market share compared to HTC or Samsung -- they're in seventh place worldwide. This isn't like if Google bought HTC (which could have afforded to do -- but didn't because HTC has a tiny patent portfolio). In other wordS: if Motorola were the only one making Android handsets, Android would quickly fall to third or fourth place in the OS race.
Anyways, long story short: this means nothing for us other than that the next time we buy a phone, Motorola handsets may be better options. Of course, it just may spur competitors to keep up faster with updates, etc., leading to better devices all-around. Either way, we, the consumers, win.
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+ 1
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i get that is what is being said, but if i were in Samsung or HTC's camp, i would be re-considering my funding into a technology where the software i've been depending on could be pulled away at any moment. Now that google has the hardware side covered, if HTC and Samsung keep throwing money that way, it's a big risk.
Microsoft could always have bought a hardware company like Dell, but it knew what that would do to the confidence of other builders. IMO, google should just have bought the patents.
orateam said:
i get that is what is being said, but if i were in Samsung or HTC's camp, i would be re-considering my funding into a technology where the software i've been depending on could be pulled away at any moment. Now that google has the hardware side covered, if HTC and Samsung keep throwing money that way, it's a big risk.
Microsoft could always have bought a hardware company like Dell, but it knew what that would do to the confidence of other builders. IMO, google should just have bought the patents.
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Like someone else said, it's in Google's best interest to keep android on as many devices as possible. I seriously doubt anything will change for sammy or htc.
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Now that Google is buying Motorola anyone think Motorola device will have an edge in terms of compatibility and/or performance? I know I will look harder at the Motorola product next time I get a tablet.
No. Google isn't like Apple... Google isn't a money hungry giant. Proof of this, just ask yourself "How many Google services do I pay for?" Your answer? None.
They aren't bias and one-sided either. Knowing Google, they will just use this to improve Android and their Nexus line, and Motorola's devices as well.
Google already said that this isn't going to effect Android in a bad way, but only make it stronger.
"We recently explained how companies including Microsoft and Apple are banding together in anti-competitive patent attacks on Android. The U.S. Department of Justice had to intervene in the results of one recent patent auction to 'protect competition and innovation in the open source software community' and it is currently looking into the results of the Nortel auction. Our acquisition of Motorola will increase competition by strengthening Google’s patent portfolio, which will enable us to better protect Android from anti-competitive threats from Microsoft, Apple and other companies."
"This acquisition will not change our commitment to run Android as an open platform. Motorola will remain a licensee of Android and Android will remain open. We will run Motorola as a separate business. Many hardware partners have contributed to Android’s success and we look forward to continuing to work with all of them to deliver outstanding user experiences."
Google says this was a way to strengthen Android and their fight to defend it from MS and Apple. If you look at the responses from HTC, Samsung, LG, and Sony Ericson, they also think this was only a move to help Android.
The quotes are from DroidForums.
i love how all the apple kids are saying that google is now just like apple. i dont see google firing patent lawsuits over everyones bow...
drksilenc said:
i love how all the apple kids are saying that google is now just like apple. i dont see google firing patent lawsuits over everyones bow...
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That's because they are ignorant and don't understand why Google did what they did.
actually, google is as money hungry as apple...except google's business model is in ads. the more appliances using google's ads, the more money google makes. this is why it is in google's interest to keep the android platform as lawsuit free as possible. by giving away free operating system that uses googe services, the better it is for google.
thankfully for us consumer, google's business model is actually pro-sumer as well (assuming you don't mind all the information gathering and stuff ). the way google makes money involves free (more like ad-supported), quality software for us.
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It's all a guessing game now. Only time will tell. No matter what they say.
Well, sadly, in another thread regarding the shipment delays I made the poor mistake of defending Apple and claiming the shipments being held by the ITC was likely a routine screening and not being held up because of Apple.
Turns out, I was wrong. Apple has filed a formal grievance with the US ITC today saying that HTC hasn't actually resolved the software issues and should meet as an emergency and re-enact the ban blocking imports of HTC phones.
http://www.phonescoop.com/articles/article.php?a=10560
This is just more over-aggressive bull**** lawsuits for no reason. HTC is in no position to even directly compete against Apple in the market, and ultimately is doing some of the most unique software and hardware design in the industry.
At what point does this whole mobile lawsuit nonsense come to a boiling point?
Also, as a point of full disclosure, and because I don't really want to ***** about Apple being the worst company on earth, I do own use and love my iPad, Macbook Air, and iMac. I do own an iPhone 4S but as of recently it sits off in a drawer while I use my HOX.
This thread was not started with the intention of people piling in to say how Apple is terrible, or builds ****ty products, but rather have a conversation about the challenges of the mobile industry moving forward. As each company tries to innovate and release compelling products the likelihood of overlapping features and functionality is inevitable. How does the industry encourage innovate without trampling intellectual property rights? (or in other words, **** Software Patents)
Apple is just pissed the one x is better than the iPhone
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This is so ridiculous...
What gets me is how many of these patent disputes are actually FRAND (fair use) issues.
I'm waiting for some judge to put down his iPhone and see things clearly. Patent law is out of control and companies are only using it to maintain a monopoly or remain profitable to their stockholders when their product is actually no longer inovative and has lost market share (see also TiVo)
Apple sees a threat in Android a threat that will screw the company I hate apple but now its the devil to me .
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But this is bs! Why would they do that, apple needs competition, its basic business 101. Does apple think since I can't get a htc one phone imma get me some ios?? Hell no and im sure like me, that's just gonna piss others off and make it a point NOT to buy any apple products.
Maybe a boycott of apple is in order.
Man anyone see the original apple commercial for the first imac from the 70's or whatever? Oh the irony
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They should start focusing on a new iOS or putting something extraordinary in the iPhone 5 instead of law suites. Hop off android. Power users choose android and the rest use iOS their lawsuits won't convert anybody. They're always suing somebody haha. Samsung, HTC, might as well sue Google and the rest of the world.
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This has little to do with rightfully protecting intellectual property, and everything to do with patent trolling and using the law to attack competitors.
Android has gobbled up market share due to the fact that manufacturer are willing to give people variety and choices. Meanwhile, Apple is trying to lock everyone into one device form factor.
This also more represents Apple's failure to innovate, rather than the opposite. The iPhone has hardly changed its looks after 5 iterations. Aside from different backing material, it has looked almost exactly the same. And few internal hardware innovations as well. Aside from moving to a better screen, and a better camera, the hardware has only had incremental improvements (CPU and memory) over its entire lifespan.
The one form factor business model has benefited them in many ways, but we've come to a point where people now want bigger screens on their smartphones. Apple has simply run out of new ideas in the present form factor. Their biggest recent innovation. . . Siri (chuckle). They are stuck and they know it. If they move to a larger iPhone (and also a smaller iPad, or "iPad Mini" as its rumored) they begin to experience some of the OS fragmentation that they have criticized Android for so many times in the past.
I don't mean to complain about Apple so much, or sound like a hater. They make some nice devices, and have contributed some nice interface design to the smartphone world (earlier in the iPhones history). But its clear that they have stopped innovating. Instead of coming up with new ideas, they have chosen to use petty methods of attacking their competitors.
freakboy13 said:
Man anyone see the original apple commercial for the first imac from the 70's or whatever? Oh the irony
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It was the first Mac (or Macintosh back then) not iMac and the year was 1984. It played during the Superbowl. The irony is that 1984 (spelled out) is a book by George Orwell which was published in 1949 that dealt with a society under total government control. Apple's claim during the Macintosh commercial was that they were going to show the world how 1984 (the year) was not going to be like 1984 (the book). Apple has become the antithesis of what it proclaimed back in 1984.
I really tend to agree. While no one can argue that iOS and the iPhone were amazing innovations, and helped spur the mobile industry as it stands now, iOS has really stagnated on innovate.
There haven't been amazing new features / innovations to the platform in awhile and it seems Apple cares more about others not doing what they have done in the past then focus on what they can do in the future.
I think everyday there are more examples of software design that should be open and licensed rather than closed IP. Things like "pull to refresh" and "pinch to zoom" are functionalities that exist in natural user interface and simple should be able to freely licensed to all software developers.
If Apple approached HTC and simply said pay $X dollars per device to have open cross licensing with Apple's software licenses this whole bull**** could be put to bed in a legal manor.
I just feel like software patents are going to be increasingly difficult to develop and protect and that these major players in the market need to understand there will be functionality overlaps. As such I want to see this bull**** end and cross-licensing begin.
fungflex said:
If Apple approached HTC and simply said pay $X dollars per device to have open cross licensing with Apple's software licenses this whole bull**** could be put to bed in a legal manor.
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That is rational. Apple has no interest in negotiating nor being rational. They are the highest valued company in the world. They have no intention of licensing IP. They have so much cash that they don't know what to do with it and there is no sign of their revenue stream stopping any time soon, so they don't need the money. This is just a pissing match at this point. Apple's intention is total "Thermo-Nuclear-War" annihilation of Android. Things might start to get a bit different now that Steve Jobs is not around...but perhaps it is too soon. Not that I agree with Apple.
I just think patent reform is needed. Competition is good though. In some ways I think Apple has helped HTC. Now HTC has notoriety. Everyone I've recently showed my One X to asks to hold it, and then while holding it they are wowed and act as if they are handling a rare illegal piece of contraband. This HTC One X is now notorious. So even though sales were stopped because of customs I think more people now know what HTC is and that it represents a credible threat to Apple. People will want what they are told that they can't have....human nature.
This is why i got away from apple products not going to support their lawsuits... im tired of hearing this stuff but of course its not going to stop...
Instead of innovating they use wide spread patents to squash competition.
It's not just a problem in the phone industry, patents are way too wide sweeping, long lasting, and powerful these days. Try and remember patent law was created to promote innovation not crush it.
galfert said:
Everyone I've recently showed my One X to asks to hold it, and then while holding it they are wowed and act as if they are handling a rare illegal piece of contraband.
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I have experienced this too and with my old Samsung Captivate as well. When people see an Android phone they are wowed by it and by the ability to make it what YOU want. When they see an iPhone, it's just another iPhone, there's nothing special anymore, nothing "magical." I used to get excited over iPhone announcements back in the days where I was a poor high school student yearning to have a smartphone. Now, howveer, I find the annoucements boring because really, there's nothing to be excited about anymore.
Apple where we invented the lawsuit
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fungflex said:
If Apple approached HTC and simply said pay $X dollars per device to have open cross licensing with Apple's software licenses this whole bull**** could be put to bed in a legal manor.
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galfert said:
Apple has no interest in negotiating nor being rational. They are the highest valued company in the world. They have no intention of licensing IP.
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Well, it looks like that's exactly what happened, and HTC refused to license.
"Apple reportedly asked for $5 - $15 per device to settle Android patent dispute" (I'm not 'allowed' to post my source link, but if you google that headline, you should find it on the Dow Jones website. Article is dated May 5th, 2012.)
So HTC just went on their merry way and knowingly infringed on the patent. If they didn't see this coming, then they're idiots.
That said, I LOVE this damn phone! I see why Apple might have a little envy smeared on their faces!
Does anybody know what exactly it is they are claiming infringes on their patent still? I thought this was resolved with the adding of HTC Linkify Dispatcher. I've used the AT&T ROMS and I've seen how annoying this has made the UI compared to the Rogers version, what more do they want?
kilo89 said:
Does anybody know what exactly it is they are claiming infringes on their patent still? I thought this was resolved with the adding of HTC Linkify Dispatcher. I've used the AT&T ROMS and I've seen how annoying this has made the UI compared to the Rogers version, what more do they want?
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Money plain and simple friggin monopoly
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galfert said:
It was the first Mac (or Macintosh back then) not iMac and the year was 1984. It played during the Superbowl. The irony is that 1984 (spelled out) is a book by George Orwell which was published in 1949 that dealt with a society under total government control. Apple's claim during the Macintosh commercial was that they were going to show the world how 1984 (the year) was not going to be like 1984 (the book). Apple has become the antithesis of what it proclaimed back in 1984.
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Thanks for clearing up my ignorance, that's totally what I meant to say, (reference to the book by G.O.), and the point I was trying to make, lol.
I don't totally hate on apple my MacBook pro still best computer I have, and its almost 4yo, and still kicks ass media wise. But this lawsuit thing is just out of control.
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Boycott Crapple and encourage others to do the same. Enough already.
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