[Q] Galaxy s2 stable overclock to 1.6 ghz? - General Questions and Answers

Hello,
I just installed the ressurection remix 1.5 rom, in combination with Thoravukk kernel, and i set my cpu to 1.6 ghz.
Set it at boot, and rebooted the device.
I'm really impressed about the boot speed, and overall smooth scrolling etcetera.
My question is, is there something else i need to do to keep it stable, or change other settings, like voltage, gpu, ram or anything else?
Because i'm really happy with the changes it's given me, but i don't want problems in a while.
Batterylife is not an issue, i don't expect it to last as long as it did on 1.2 ghz
Looking forward to information.
If i don't need to do anything else, i would like to know as well.
Thank you

Lost in space xD
Can any one help me with some info on where can I download the Thoravukk kernel. I've entered around 3 or 4 (including the official team blockbuster) sites and I don't see any download links

Why do you have it overclocked to 1.6? is there even a difference in performance? The phone's so powerful already lol, you could UV for better battery life, increase gpu for performance (in games) I don't think you need more Ram, I have the OG epic 4g and I have plenty lol
As far as stable, pushing your processor may create problems that you won't necessarily see at stock frequency, you get what ask for.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using xda premium

Fire n mage said:
Why do you have it overclocked to 1.6? is there even a difference in performance? The phone's so powerful already lol, you could UV for better battery life, increase gpu for performance (in games) I don't think you need more Ram, I have the OG epic 4g and I have plenty lol
As far as stable, pushing your processor may create problems that you won't necessarily see at stock frequency, you get what ask for.
Sent from my SPH-D700 using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Exactly what I had in mind
The Note is plenty powerful even amongst the current crop of droids. And no app requires a dual-core 1.6Gghz. The stock frequencies were chosen for a reason, I'm guessing it's quality. All chips burn out in time, they have a lifespan. But you overclock your device and you burn your chip faster.
So what I'm saying is stay with the original frequencies. Port an optimized ROM and that should suffice.

Thanks for your answers, but i really notice the differenct, especially with a reboot, it normally takes 30-40 seconds, and now in less then 10 secs i'm at my home screen, and ready to go.
Also it is smoother with scrolling, and apps launch even faster.
so the diff is hugh to me.
Battery life is not an issue, i said, even if it goes to crap, i replace it for €20,- (Just about $25,-)
And the performance is nice, but my question was if i have to set other things.
And i use lulzactiv governor, it uses only what it needs, it's not always the full 1.6 ghz. Only when speed is preferred.
@Kenepo112x40 this is where i found it, i use it now, so it works:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1574672
Edit: There's a zip in attachment, that's the one, install in cwm recovery

SGS2-1989 said:
Thanks for your answers, but i really notice the differenct, especially with a reboot, it normally takes 30-40 seconds, and now in less then 10 secs i'm at my home screen, and ready to go.
Also it is smoother with scrolling, and apps launch even faster.
so the diff is hugh to me.
Battery life is not an issue, i said, even if it goes to crap, i replace it for €20,- (Just about $25,-)
And the performance is nice, but my question was if i have to set other things.
And i use lulzactiv governor, it uses only what it needs, it's not always the full 1.6 ghz. Only when speed is preferred.
@Kenepo112x40 this is where i found it, i use it now, so it works:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1574672
Edit: There's a zip in attachment, that's the one, install in cwm recovery
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I had to go and look for the 2.30 on another post cuz the 2.41 doesn't allows me to have data on the phone. Thanks anyway man, the problem was that they hadn't uploaded the link yet on the official site but they did yesterday.

To OP, I suggest u increase voltage at over locked 1.6 to keep it stable

Related

NOOB question: overclocking, Mhz, JIT

hey guys,
looking to make the jump to 2.1 rom (most probably htcclay). but ive been looking at alot of different threads and i'm seeing a lot of comments regarding overclocking, setcpu, 528Mhz, 710Mhz, and JIT.
I'm trying to make sense of it all and want to know how to understand it properly. can anyone help? or point me in the right direction with a link explaining stuff?
im currently using a 32A magic with the old radio =)
Noob tries to help noob:
MHz refers to the frequency of the CPU. This reflects the speed at which operations are executed on an overall level. The original HTC Magic ROM was around 312 MHz if I remember correctly (which was in fact underclocked). Then the threshold was pushed to original frequency (around 512 MHz).
However, the frequenzy is not fix but rather adaptive in a range (speed stepping). If an application requires CPU time, the frequency goes up to those values indicated in the paragraph above. When the processor is idle however, frequency goes done to somewhere around 200MHz to save power (as higher MHz consumes more power).
Therefore 710 MHz reflects the upper limit of the range and is beyond the factory 512 MHz. Thus you gain roughly 30% peak performance.
JIT: Just In Time compilation. Another way to compile the Java code . This methode is introduced by replacing a library in the system and available in ROMs >= Android 1.6 . The performance gain is said around 30% but... I don't now whether this affects only apps or the overall system.
Hope this helps (probably not all numbers given are correct, but the concept should be).
Romwise I stick with Sanpei's Eris port. Not overclocked but smooth and good for everyday live
thanks for that dude! that makes a hell of a lot more sense to me =)
i popped the htcclay 2.1 rom from for 32A on last night and its working a charm. i set the frequency to max 528MHz, and min 245Mhz.
Is there any recommended settings to optimize the battery life so you can use it as an everyday rom? I grown quite fond of android 2.1, and the launcherpro beta is SO fast.
i know the whole idea of SetCPU is to customise whats right for you, but because I'm knew to all this I just need some direction as to what the best general settings are
Yes the non-sense 2.1 ROMs are speed wise amazing. I missed the HTC dialer though. I like to be able to type names on the keypad which is - to my knowledge - not possible on standard dialer. Also the HTC calendar app is a thing I havily rely on and the 2.1 Andorid Calendar is simply crap in comparison. That's why I stick with Sense ROMs.
However, speaking of overclocking. There is now clear rule. To factors affect your choice: your phone usage pattern, the individual quality of your hardware.
Hardware Quality: Processors and boards are guaranteed to operate flawless in a certain frequency range. Most processors can handle more that guaranteed (because there is a safety margin introduced by the factory) . However, how much more the processory can actually handle (before it starts to throw errors and faults) is rather individual.
Usage pattern meaning: if you're a havy gamer and you play ressource hungry games you will put the upper threshold as high as possible (however, you might also consider buying an XBOX which is more fun). Also if you feel that your phone response is sluggish. But, as long as you feel fine with the response of your phone, I would not go up with frequency (not for power reasons, rather stability of the OS). Go up if you feel that you need more processing power.
The lowest threshold is probably 128 MHz. I never tried that because I read of phones which would not wake up after having gone in standby. This is not dangerous (you only have to reboot) but personally I cannot afford to miss a call because of that. So I stick above 200.
Regards,
F
well in regards to my usage pattern, i dont play any games on my phone at all. for the reason being i dont want it to consume battery on the handset.
i dont even use it much for calls. i do a LOT of sms, facebook, youtube, emails, and some widgets which requires data usage. so what would u recommend for something like this? i want the rom to be zippy, not sluggish, but not drain the battery too fast?
and how do i know which operations/apps require CPU time?
no doubt about sense-ui is amazing! im even thinking of getting a htc desire soon, or just seeing what else is coming out soon. which model of phone are u using the sanpei eris port??
32A, New Radio. Use Radio Switcher from eyegor: Sticky Post. Works like charm but be careful and read the instructions (or you might end up buying a desire sooner than you intended to). I am usind a partitioned SD with EXT 3 System for apps2SD and a cache partition. SD can be formatted this way from Recovery.
I think Sanpei's Eris is the best 2.1 compromise for the time being. However, based on your comments on how you use your phone, probably you even don't need 2.1 and are fine with 1.5. Then try this (this is also for the new Radio: use Radio Switcher)
Cursorsense's 1.5 (Most solid build I know of)
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=592856
Then before booting flash this:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=681378
Boot and fasten your seatbelt. It's not as fast as HTCClay... but its the closest experience you can get with any Sense ROM...
Regards,
F
PS: Probably there is a huge flame coming our way for off topic discussion. I guess we have to stop. Going for cover
LOL! ur help has been awesome my friend =)
LOL! ur help has been awesome my friend =)
I would recommend you use cyanogenmod 5 if you want stability
sense roms cannot compare to AOSP roms for stability because they are a proprietary framework which cannot be updated unless htc releases a new version
and CM 5 is the fastest eclair rom I have tried - faster than even donut roms
i wouldnt go with 1.5....there are to many apps/widgets that wont run...
i would recommend cyan's latest 1.6 rom, 4.2.15.1 .. stable (better than stock roms), fast and has great battery life...
if you must get 2.1 then go for cyan's latest 5.0.7 test6 2.1 rom, or sanpei's if you must really want sense...
i run cyan's latest 2.1 rom and its stable as hell, as fast as his 1.6 rom, rock solid and great battery life..
ultimately its your choice.. i would stay away from JIT though, to unstable...
feicher said:
Yes the non-sense 2.1 ROMs are speed wise amazing. I missed the HTC dialer though. I like to be able to type names on the keypad which is - to my knowledge - not possible on standard dialer.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
try DialerOne, it has the "keypad-T9" function and is free on the market
the only downside is it's really not as pretty as the sense dialer(feels a little clunky and outdated)
as far as the ROM goes, i'm using alan090's modded CM5 t5 right now, OC'd to 710MHz and with JIT enabled. best rom i've had so far, really snappy and stable. JIT seems to be very stable on my phone, i wasn't even sure i had enabled it correctly at first.. until i ran linpack and got a good 4.5 MFLOPS
I have a somewhat related question:
should i be afraid of a overclocked cpu rom heating wise? sometimes i feel my phone heating a little and i am using a default speed rom.

CPU Tuner - Battery Saver

Guys, look that...it seems to be nice...I installed and im still testing...Some users said this app helps to increase the battery life in almost 25%....I liked the UI also, is very very nice...
Im going to test...
Share your results....
http://www.appbrain.com/app/cpu-tuner-(rooted-phones)/ch.amana.android.cputuner
u know which frequency to set
dennka said:
u know which frequency to set
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My kernel does not allow me to change the frequency....
Need to change...By the way...I notice the phone become a quiet slow with this app...
same here, I cannot change settings, however, I do not find apps running slower or the whole sys response got worse
There is no way a cpu tweak can save you anywhere near 25% ...
The screen uses about 80-95% of the battery even with a 1.2ghz overclock cpu doesn't make near that much of a difference...
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App
It's funny because I thought the screen was a new technology super battery-saver lol and it's clearly not
However, the Wave who have 0.7 smaller screen but the same technology have a battery like 3x times better.
the difference? the os. I'm pretty sure the problem comes from the Android and nothing else.
I would second android being the culprit....considering most of us are running leaked 2.2 battery management has not been fully implemented. I had great battery life on jh3 and jh7...... but I would never go back to eclair to get better battery life. The epic is starting to get.official froyo and I read that Canada should start seeing froyo this week......all we need is for att to get on the ball and Samsung to release their source code
Sent from my SAMSUNG-GT-I9000 using XDA App
hey guys,
does anyone have an older version of this app. It used to work great for me, but with the latest updates it has not performed as well.
thanks.
Actually the 1.0.1 version is really good. Here is a guide how to use it:
linux-tipps.blogspot.com/2010/12/make-your-android-power-efficient-in.html
*** Adrian *** said:
My kernel does not allow me to change the frequency....
Need to change...By the way...I notice the phone become a quiet slow with this app...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
change the settings(current governor: conservative into PERFORMANCE
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App
I haven't tried it yet. But if I understand what it is by the name I don't think it will help that much. Android OS already changes frequency based upon usage. You can see these percentages in the Android System Information app. For example, mine reads as follows:
1000.0 MHz 3.19%
800.0 MHz 6.49%
400.0 MHz 5.5%
200.0 MHz 9.58%
100.0 MHz 75.13%

Anyone else having tons of lag?

Just a quick question for you guys: I recently purchased an Infuse from the marketplace here, and so far I've gotten an absolute TON of lag using the device. I've flashed Infused 1.5 and Bionix with the Infusion kernel, and so far the lag has gotten better, but it's not totally cleared up. I'm definitely not new to Android, but I haven't seen anything like this before. I know that Quadrant isn't a reliable benchmark, but I'm scoring about 1900, OCed to 1.5Ghz.
Just to give an example: I'm using desktop visualizer to add some custom icons to my screen. When I go to select an icon image, it's fine, but it freezes for about 90 seconds when a list of my apps comes up.
Anyone experience this before? And if so, how did you solve it? If this was widespread, I'd imagine there would be complaints all over here.
Which app are you using to set your overclock settings, how many clock speeds do you have enabled, are you under or over volting, and *which governor* are you running?
I have seen some similar problems here when I was using conservative governor with poor choices of clock speed. Right now Infusion 1.5.2 kernel has some issues with not liking the ondemand governor, so I reduced my number of available clock speeds so it would jump to the top more quickly while using the conservative governor.
Also, did you use either the return to stock, or the ultimate unbrick flash before you flashed your ROM? If it was a used Infuse, I would do one of the above before I start looking anywhere else, then reflash your rom/kernel of choice.
I'm using SetCPU with the OnDemand gov (400/1500), no undervolting. I have a profile set to underclock it to 300/700 on conservative when I'm charging, but that's about it.
I think I'm going to use GTG's unbrick/return to stock and root the thing myself, I figured I'd ask before I did anything drastic. My UI is a ***** to set up every time, and I hate wiping because of it.
Just a quick note, I've had some serious lag using the oc kernel... Like real world usage got worse after oc'ing
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I997 using XDA App
Although it is counter intuitive to the way governors should work I have seen less lag on Infusion 1.5.2 when I use conservative. The ondemand governor seems to be having some issues with the most recent update. If you flash back to 1.0 Infusion you get a max overclock of 1.4, but it is much more stable IMHO. Also FFC is presently broken in 1.5.2 and will hard freeze the phone (battery pull).
I'm debating flashing back to community kernel, but I am going to wait and see how long it takes my battery to drain because I am using some undervolting. You might try using conservative governor and only enable 100, 400, (800 or 1000), (1200 or 1300) and 1500. Honestly the infuse is my first smartphone, but I've tinkered with desktop hardware the last 15 years. It literally amazes me everytime I pull the battery out of this phone and feel how light it is.
I also used the desktop vis app and yes it lagged when chosing apps however it seemed to get better after three or four times but that seems to be the only place it lags for me im using the oc-uv kernal 1.0 clocked to 1.4 seems bulletproof compared to later versions im getting great speed and batt life with this kernal but i had the same lag in the same event as you
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I997 using XDA Premium App
I'm going to try bringing it back to stock and re-rooting it myself, if only because I trust myself with adb//scripts/rooting, and I'm hesitant to trust someone I don't know. Lag has gotten a lot better since switching to conservative, OCing to 1.6 and undervolting a tad, but it still lags when opening apps or scrolling through long lists. Desktop Vis is of course, still a nightmare.
Oh well, I'll report my findings tomorrow I guess. Hopefully I'll be scoring higher than the 1700 I just pulled in quadrant.
entropism said:
I'm going to try bringing it back to stock and re-rooting it myself, if only because I trust myself with adb//scripts/rooting, and I'm hesitant to trust someone I don't know. Lag has gotten a lot better since switching to conservative, OCing to 1.6 and undervolting a tad, but it still lags when opening apps or scrolling through long lists. Desktop Vis is of course, still a nightmare.
Oh well, I'll report my findings tomorrow I guess. Hopefully I'll be scoring higher than the 1700 I just pulled in quadrant.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I997 using XDA App
Do you use spareparts?
usually yes, but I dont believe I installed it yet on the infuse. Why?
lag on stock also
I'm 100% stock & get lag also. Definitely in the situation you describe, when the app list comes up for adding shortcuts to any homescreen. Takes forever for that list to come up. Secondly, simply from running for a while, i have to kill all the apps using the built in task manager in order to get it to run smoothly again. It's like it never closes an app. I'm new to android, but guessing this is a problem inherit to android. Can't see how samsung or at&t could have screwed this soo badly to cause it to never close an app. Hoping memory management is better in Gingerbread.
Blario, you're new to Android, so you need to read up on how memory management works with Android. It's not SUPPOSED to kill apps, and that's not what's lagging your phone. In your case, I'd think it was more of a case of WHICH apps you were running.
yeah, the longer I have the phone the more it lags it seems
probably going to push me towards the Evo3D
If you're on stock and after a week or two your phone gets slow as hell (mine did), install a Voodoo lagfix kernel. All the current ROMs include it.
superweapons said:
If you're on stock and after a week or two your phone gets slow as hell (mine did), install a Voodoo lagfix kernel. All the current ROMs include it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I did
I still have random slow downs when it gets bogged down with stuff
I'd give a left nut to have this phone with dual core
entropism said:
Blario, you're new to Android, so you need to read up on how memory management works with Android. It's not SUPPOSED to kill apps, and that's not what's lagging your phone. In your case, I'd think it was more of a case of WHICH apps you were running.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't do much. Twitter, "Web" (some mozilla stock ish), SMS, phone, Android Market app (browsing), and Maps. I've had it lag up using only those. Far less often, I use Yelp... that's about it.
Not supposed to kill apps? When I kill them it fixes the problem. Maybe it *should* be killing apps?? If its supposed to flush their state to disk... it seems to be doing a poor job at it.
I would be suspicious of your microSD card (if you have one). Do you know what class it is? Have you tried removing it and performing the same functions in which you see lag?
hydrogenman said:
I did
I still have random slow downs when it gets bogged down with stuff
I'd give a left nut to have this phone with dual core
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'd more readily assume the 512MB RAM is the issue. Looking forward to SGSII
SolusCado said:
I would be suspicious of your microSD card (if you have one). Do you know what class it is? Have you tried removing it and performing the same functions in which you see lag?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's the stock card that came with the phone. Any way to check? The apps are installed to it... so removing it I wouldn't have the apps available anymore.
A little update: I returned back to stock and re-rooted. I installed 3E, then CWM, then threw on Infused 1.5 and Infusion, OCed to 1.6Ghz and slightly undervolted (about 25-100mv along the range) using SetCPU.
As of right now, it still lags on occasion, but not as bad as it did. Quadrant is giving me a whopping 1300 average score, with a low of 800 and a high of 1600. This is just pathetic.

Overclocking questio.

Howdy folks. Could someone point me in the right direction? Thinking about overclocking but have not done it. What are the benefits / rewards?
Is there an app or program i can to do this?
And what is a safe range?
Thanks in advance!
Sent from my intergalactic space modulator using XDA App
Benefits : Faster phone, smoother ui
Cons: Phone may heat up if overclock is set too high
For this phone 1500 is the highest, safest number we can get to right now. I would suggest setCPU, which you can find on XDA for free. (search setCPU)
You'll need a new kernel first, the stock one doesn't support oc. Go with Faux's assuming you're running a rom compatible with it (and most are).
After that, download Pimp My CPU from the market and you're good to go.
Sent from my Nexus Prime using XDA Ultimate App
To be honest with you, I notice hardly, if any, real-world phone speed increase when I overclock...barring benchmark numbers. I'm not really sure why that's the case for me, and why for some others it's such an extremely obvious difference (or so they claim). Perhaps I'm not running the same cpu intensive apps that they run. But for general, day to day, running of my phone, it's just not worth it for me due to the battery cost.
So I would love to hear from some of you where "precisely" do you see such a marked improvement on the speed of your phone?
Well, first off, make sure you have a custom Recovery installed... Then find a ROM you'd like, and then, flash a custom OC Kernel..
You'll need an app such as SetCPU to control the overclock.
mmapcpro said:
To be honest with you, I notice hardly, if any, real-world phone speed increase when I overclock...barring benchmark numbers. I'm not really sure why that's the case for me, and why for some others it's such an extremely obvious difference (or so they claim). Perhaps I'm not running the same cpu intensive apps that they run. But for general, day to day, running of my phone, it's just not worth it for me due to the battery cost.
So I would love to hear from some of you where "precisely" do you see such a marked improvement on the speed of your phone?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Are you using the stock launcher? It's alot smoother with the stock launcher if OCed to 1500, although i don't notice a difference from 800 to 1500 on launcher pro.

[Q] HTC Sensation 4G T-Mobile US Kernel above 1.5Ghz

Has anyone used any kernels for HTC Sensation 4g (TMO US) above 1.566Ghz?
I am currently using a ROM by Mike1986 and kernel witch took my phone to 1.566Ghz and i am loving it.
However, i am a big OC freak and i would like some pointers on any tested kernels above 1.566Ghz, preferably that work well with Mike1986's ROM as i find them to be most stable our of all i have tried (i have tried 3 different types).
Any input is highly appreciated and welcome. Thanks team.
dronepro said:
Has anyone used any kernels for HTC Sensation 4g (TMO US) above 1.566Ghz?
I am currently using a ROM by Mike1986 and kernel witch took my phone to 1.566Ghz and i am loving it.
However, i am a big OC freak and i would like some pointers on any tested kernels above 1.566Ghz, preferably that work well with Mike1986's ROM as i find them to be most stable our of all i have tried (i have tried 3 different types).
Any input is highly appreciated and welcome. Thanks team.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1256668
I honestly don't see the benefits except lower battery life and a warmer device, I doubt you'll notice the speed difference past like 1GHz. All of the higher freqs seem pretty much the same and aren't really worth the bother with, use a governor that accesses higher freqs quicker and you won't be needing high freqs.
Ace42 said:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1256668
I honestly don't see the benefits except lower battery life and a warmer device, I doubt you'll notice the speed difference past like 1GHz. All of the higher freqs seem pretty much the same and aren't really worth the bother with, use a governor that accesses higher freqs quicker and you won't be needing high freqs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What governor would you suggest??? also, i know that when using you phone and maybe even playing games i wouldn't see much of a difference between the stock 1.2 Ghz vs 1.5 or 1.9Ghz but it's all about the bragging rights, lol. I like to go to my geeky friends and slappin’ a higher clock frequency than they have on their poor devices or silly I Phones. Also I have to tell you from my tests I do see Mike1986’s latest 3.6.7/4.1.7 Rom using much less battery life than stock Rom. I have noticed about a 10% improvement, maybe even more.
Also i do see a big improvement in Benchmarks. When i was using stock 1.2Ghz setting i was benchmarking much lower than the 1,5Ghz i am at now.
Thanks again for the input.
The benefit of custom ROMS and kernels, is that they are optimized to run well. Unless the chef sucks, most big name ROMS are optimized and more efficient.
I was running 1.2ghz for a while and whenever I'm playing Snes roms it would FC. After bumping it up to 1.72ghz it never did it again. Although 1.72ghz may be overkill for what I use my phone for but everything seems to be running extremely smooth.
dronepro said:
What governor would you suggest??? also, i know that when using you phone and maybe even playing games i wouldn't see much of a difference between the stock 1.2 Ghz vs 1.5 or 1.9Ghz but it's all about the bragging rights, lol. I like to go to my geeky friends and slappin’ a higher clock frequency than they have on their poor devices or silly I Phones. Also I have to tell you from my tests I do see Mike1986’s latest 3.6.7/4.1.7 Rom using much less battery life than stock Rom. I have noticed about a 10% improvement, maybe even more.
Also i do see a big improvement in Benchmarks. When i was using stock 1.2Ghz setting i was benchmarking much lower than the 1,5Ghz i am at now.
Thanks again for the input.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I use conservative(810/192), super charger v6, ultra smooth rosie on 4.1.6. I haven't used benches, but they'll be low on this ROM since I'm assuming it's based on the Sense 3.5 leak for sensation.
Rickdaddy said:
I was running 1.2ghz for a while and whenever I'm playing Snes roms it would FC. After bumping it up to 1.72ghz it never did it again. Although 1.72ghz may be overkill for what I use my phone for but everything seems to be running extremely smooth.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What Kernel is this? Can you provide a LINK?? thanks.
Thanks again to all for the imput.

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