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Early Battery Care

I know you want the phone's battery to fully charge and fully drain, but which do I start with? It comes with a partial charge... so should I charge it first? Or drain it first?
Thanks.

thehyecircus said:
I know you want the phone's battery to fully charge and fully drain, but which do I start with? It comes with a partial charge... so should I charge it first? Or drain it first?
Thanks.
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i always charge my phone before using it for the first time.. then let it drain completely then charge it completely. i try to do this a couple times. So far it's worked out for me on all my electronic devices... never had battery problems.

Please do not ruin your batteries as far as i know Lithium-Ion batteries don't need to be drained and charged.
Go down to the second bulleted list, the third bullet
I have never ran my battery completely down, and my Kaiser will last for a full day, and i use it a fair amount.

Wow. Thats good to know.

from my understanding it's mandatory for NiCad batteries to be fully drained but Li-Ion are not. :-D i don't want anyone to have a dead battery :-D

mikemorris said:
Please do not ruin your batteries as far as i know Lithium-Ion batteries don't need to be drained and charged.
Go down to the second bulleted list, the third bullet
I have never ran my battery completely down, and my Kaiser will last for a full day, and i use it a fair amount.
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LMAO.
From the above link:
"-If you completely discharge a lithium-ion battery, it is ruined.
-There is a small chance that, if a lithium-ion battery pack fails, it will burst into flame."
They should be a bit more specific. Lots of people probably think there battery is "completely discharged" when it won't turn on there phone.
Be sure you put it on the charger when you get the low battery notification, or else it may burst into flames!

thehyecircus said:
I know you want the phone's battery to fully charge and fully drain, but which do I start with? It comes with a partial charge... so should I charge it first? Or drain it first?
Thanks.
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Click to collapse
If you want to prolong the life of your Lithium-Ion battery, DO NOT let it fully drain. This will decrease your battery's overall charge capacity and you'll find yourself having to recharge more frequently. I'm an electrical engineer by education and profession, so here are a few quick points:
1) You do not have to power cycle a Li-Ion battery. Charge it when it drops to about 70% and typically you don't want it to drop below 50%; extremely low voltage levels could render Li-Ion batteries useless because of the internal circuitry.
2) Charge slowly, with a low current, if possible and avoid rapid chargers.
3) Don't leave your battery charging, unnecessarily, when it is already full--this will also diminish it's maximum potential more rapidly. Only charge it when it needs it and unplug it when at 100%.
4) Keep it away from hot environments (e.g. don't leave it sitting in a black car on a hot Summer day, etc.). Heat kills batteries, along with all electronics.
Battery University is a good resource if you're looking for more information on how to take care of your batteries or just want to understand how they work. Hope this helps.
weaselcossey said:
LMAO.
From the above link:
"-If you completely discharge a lithium-ion battery, it is ruined.
-There is a small chance that, if a lithium-ion battery pack fails, it will burst into flame."
They should be a bit more specific. Lots of people probably think there battery is "completely discharged" when it won't turn on there phone.
Be sure you put it on the charger when you get the low battery notification, or else it may burst into flames!
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Click to collapse
It's actually true that a heavily depleted Li-Ion battery may burst into flames. Li-Ion batteries have a much higher energy density than Ni-Cad and NiMH batteries, and a if they lose too much of their charge, their internal circuitry may become damaged. They should have been more specific in that link, but you should definitely be cautious with Li-Ion battery handling. If it wasn't for the voltage/current regulating circuitry protecting the cells of Li-Ion batteries, they could very well be considered bombs.

So I usually plug my phone in when I come home and unplug it when I leave. Thats bad for my battery? How do I stop it when it reaches 100%?

Man oh man have I been misinformed.
I have ALWAYS heard to drain it fully, then charge it fully...
Fu*kin sh*t!!! I've been destroying li-ion batteries for as long as I've been using them.
So, once you've drained it once it's bad for good, or what?

thehyecircus said:
So I usually plug my phone in when I come home and unplug it when I leave. Thats bad for my battery? How do I stop it when it reaches 100%?
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That's potentially bad for your battery. The protection circuitry in Li-Ion batteries these days are refined enough to prevent overcharging, but leaving it plugged in can still make it build up heat, which I mentioned won't help you. For the average cell phone battery, the typical charge time is about 3 hours for a full cycle. So that being the case, my best advice for you is to check your phone's charge indicator after a few hours and unplug it if it shows it's at 100%.
Lithium-ion battery lifespans are inherently limited by their manufactured date and by the finite number of charge cycles (one charge cycle is considered the charging from 0% to 100%). So if you deplete your battery by 25% each day and recharge to 100% each night, it would take 4 iterations of this process to complete one cycle. Over the course of using your battery you can expect the off-the-shelf maximum potential to decrease by about 20% each year.
r603 said:
Man oh man have I been misinformed.
I have ALWAYS heard to drain it fully, then charge it fully...
Fu*kin sh*t!!! I've been destroying li-ion batteries for as long as I've been using them.
So, once you've drained it once it's bad for good, or what?
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Power cycling by fully draining is good practice for NiMH batteries, since they have different properties. But again, for Li-Ion batteries you should avoid doing this. One full depletion may not destroy it necessarily, but there's a good chance that it will have become damaged. This depends on the battery manufacturer's build quality and specifications. You can pretty much be guaranteed a permanently reduced total capacity with a complete discharge though, sorry to say But I guess now you know for future practice to steer clear of the full drain.

orlandojumpoff said:
i always charge my phone before using it for the first time.. then let it drain completely then charge it completely. i try to do this a couple times. So far it's worked out for me on all my electronic devices... never had battery problems.
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Just FYI, most batteries that are included with new cell phones are pre-charged to approximately 70% in order to maintain a charge above the protection circuit breakdown voltage. The end-user shouldn't have any problems just using the battery out of the box, in this state, but it's a good idea to charge the phone before the first use, just to make sure you're starting from a good reference voltage. Lots of manufacturers include charging recommendations with their lithium-ion batteries stating something along the line that the first charge should be 8+ hours. This is excessive and unnecessary. They probably had some inventory of those notes for some older battery technology or carrying on an obsolete heritage practice. All you have to do is let the phone charge till the full-charge indicator lights up.

Power cycling is helpful from time to time to calibrate the sensor (which is different from the reason you want to do this for nicd)
For everyday use, just charge it whenever you can
It's batteries these days are smart enough to not recharge when already full
I'd carry a retractable mini usb cable to charge it frequently (this will help reduce # of cycles used)
Honestly, I think one of the biggest advantage of having a user-replaceable battery is the fact that you could use the phone without worrying too much about all this
I go by the "I'll put my convenience over the battery's" mentality

Dramacydle said:
Just FYI, most batteries that are included with new cell phones are pre-charged to approximately 70% in order to maintain a charge above the protection circuit breakdown voltage. The end-user shouldn't have any problems just using the battery out of the box, in this state, but it's a good idea to charge the phone before the first use, just to make sure you're starting from a good reference voltage. Lots of manufacturers include charging recommendations with their lithium-ion batteries stating something along the line that the first charge should be 8+ hours. This is excessive and unnecessary. They probably had some inventory of those notes for some older battery technology or carrying on an obsolete heritage practice. All you have to do is let the phone charge till the full-charge indicator lights up.
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The initial overcharge and draining is to compensate for the meter's accuracy (or the lack of it) when a battery is first installed
It's entirely possible for the device to report 0% when the battery is actually alive and well
For example, IBM (now Lenovo) has a little software for their laptops that alerts the user when such power cycling is helpful, and so far, I've benefited from it

We should get such software on Windows Mobile!
How much do you think batteries for this phone will cost? And I'm assuming my local AT&T stores will carry them.

Dramacydle said:
3) Don't leave your battery charging, unnecessarily, when it is already full--this will also diminish it's maximum potential more rapidly. Only charge it when it needs it and unplug it when at 100%.
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Sorry, but as far as I know if the battery meter is 100% the device will prevent overcharging. If you let the device charging overnight in the morning the device will have a normal temperature (it's not getting hot as you said in other post), thus the device doesn't get more that it needs.

thehyecircus said:
We should get such software on Windows Mobile!
How much do you think batteries for this phone will cost? And I'm assuming my local AT&T stores will carry them.
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I can't vouche for the quality, but batteries out of Hong Kong are available at 2 for just under $20 (including shipping) on eBay.
http://cgi.ebay.com/Battery-x2-for-...14&_trkparms=72:1205|66:2|65:12|39:1|240:1318

thehyecircus said:
How much do you think batteries for this phone will cost? And I'm assuming my local AT&T stores will carry them.
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According to the leaked documents from a few days ago, the retail price for the standard battery via AT&T will be $42.00 and $65.00 for the extended battery.
Obviously you can do much better than that with non-OEM products, as noted elsewhere in this thread.

weaselcossey said:
LMAO.
From the above link:
"-If you completely discharge a lithium-ion battery, it is ruined.
-There is a small chance that, if a lithium-ion battery pack fails, it will burst into flame."
They should be a bit more specific. Lots of people probably think there battery is "completely discharged" when it won't turn on there phone.
Be sure you put it on the charger when you get the low battery notification, or else it may burst into flames!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's actually true that a heavily depleted Li-Ion battery may burst into flames. Li-Ion batteries have a much higher energy density than Ni-Cad and NiMH batteries, and a if they lose too much of their charge, their internal circuitry may become damaged. They should have been more specific in that link, but you should definitely be cautious with Li-Ion battery handling. If it wasn't for the voltage/current regulating circuitry protecting the cells of Li-Ion batteries, they could very well be considered bombs.
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I understand, but I think you would agree that the general public probably doesn't understand what "completely discharged" or "heavily depleted" battery really means when we're talking about cell phone batteries becoming flaming bombs.
I just thought there wording was pretty funny.

Strangely I found that after a full charge at night, if I continue to charge via usb either in my car or on my computer for several hours, the battery will last all day with only very little loss...like 10%.
This also works if I hook my phone to the computer when I get home around 6pm and then hook up to wall plug by my bed (I use it for my alarm) it will also work!
Otherwise with just the single night charge (7hrs) it only will last about 12hrs.
I think the Fuze's circuitry shuts off charging before it is fully charged. I'm ordering a seperate battery charger (I have 2 HTC batteries) when the charger comes in I will see if it does a better job than the phone.
Anyone else have similar stories?

Is it true charging li-ion no more than 80% increase its life?

From http://www.wmskins.com/blog/how-to-increase-battery-life-of-windows-mobiles:
1. A Lithium Ion battery should never be charged to 100% or fully Discharged. The famous 80-20 rule is applicable here as well, though in a different way. Charging to 80% increases battery life.
2. Don’t wait for full discharge, charge it frequently. Keeping the battery near to 80% always, gives better life. This is also what many vendors claim as “memory effect”.
I followed that advice and then after a few weeks, when once I charged it to 100%, it dropped quickly to 80%! and has been like that since. now I don't give a damn to that rule and charge my phone to 100% instead.

At this point, I would advise you do a full charge and deep discharge of your phone. Just to allow the phone to calibrate itself to the battery again.
However, I would advise against running programs to intentionally drain it at a high draw. So instead of playing 5 hours of FPSECE to drain it flat, just let it sit on standby and use it as you normally would, until it dies. Then charge it back up in one continuous charge (refrain from unplugging until it goes back to 100%). Hopefully that will restore the accuracy of your battery meter by a bit.
And IMHO, the article you included discusses things about batteries that are no longer true....
2. Don’t wait for full discharge, charge it frequently. Keeping the battery near to 80% always, gives better life. This is also what many vendors claim as “memory effect”.
No. "Memory effect" is, in laymen terms, the battery not being able to hold above a certain charge after being repeatedly discharged from the same capacity. E.g. being discharged at 80%. It doesn't "give battery life" -- in fact it kills your battery's capacity.
This is a term more relevant for old NiCd batteries. LiONs and most NiMH batteries have very weak/no memory effect.
3. Every battery has limited Full charge-discharge cycles. Of the order of 300+. In other words a typical phone battery can be fully charged/discharged 300 times. Doing more frequent charges, as specified in point #2, will increase overall life.
Partially true. Every battery can be charged a number of times before its ability to hold a charge deteriorates. Usually this is around 300, though the exact number varies between individual batteries. However, the concept of a "cycle" isn't exact -- just because you charged from 60-80% (or whatever) doesn't mean you didn't use a cycle. It's really a continuum, and should only be conceptualized as the battery losing its ability to be charged and hold a charge, the more times you charge it.
4. During first time use (when the battery is new) don`t use it till its fully charged. This is why it is always written on manuals “let the device charge for 2-3 hours”.
The necessity of preconditioning is controversial now. There is little evidence to suggest that devices nowadays benefit from preconditioning, and likewise there is little evidence that not doing so harms battery longevity. Many manuals these days simply omit to mention preconditioning.
5. Best way to increase battery life is Not to use it. If you keep AC power plugged in on your phones, keeping the battery at 80% (as in #1), your battery will last longer. Though discharging it once in a month would be must in such cases.
Partially true. Not using your battery does indeed help its longevity, but not by plugging into the AC. Heat is a LiON battery's enemy, and plugging it into your wall will generate heat that is ultimately bad. This translates to laptop batteries as well -- if you want to store a laptop battery, the best bet is to discharge it to 40%, then put it somewhere cool (even the fridge if you want).
Also I would say doing a deep discharge once a month is too frequent. Once every 2 or even 3 months is more appropriate.
Finally, LiON batteries themselves have a shelf life. So even if you let them sit there, they will lose their function after a few years. Just so yo uknow.
6. Surrounding temperature contributes a lot. Colder weather gives better battery life. So make sure your cellphone doesn’t overheat, if it does, find ways to keep it cool.
True. And that's why you shouldn't leave it plugged in.
Learn more about batteries here: http://www.batteryuniversity.com/

felixdd said:
E.g. being discharged at 80%. It doesn't "give battery life" -- in fact it kills your battery's capacity.
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is that so? why? so i guess now my battery's capacity has lessened. damn the article.
have drained my battery to 1% and charged it to 100%. let's see how it goes from here..

good subject for discusion. WM user or not the battery life and the tricks of LION only a few knows.
1.i have two batteries for my HTC. he original battery and one with 2800mAh. Does my phone cofused if i change tha batteries aternately?
2. if ai want to work with my phone for hours is it better to connect it with the charger?
3. Wich kind of charging is better? with USB cable from pc or wall charger.

I have the option in my BIOS for my laptop which says an 80% charge will prolong the lifespan of the battery.
Batteries must undergo a fair bit of research (for environmental impact reasons if nothing else!) and to have such a bold statement to me indicates that its an obvious fact to battery researchers.
Given ive lay in bed this morning messing about on facebook and setting up rss feeds on my phone and emptied a full battery I dont think Id ever stop charging at 80%. Ill just buy another battery!

i really doubt cold weather improves battery life, numerous times my family and I brought electronic products to cold countries and the Battery life always drops at a much quicker rate

dan138zig said:
is that so? why? so i guess now my battery's capacity has lessened. damn the article.
have drained my battery to 1% and charged it to 100%. let's see how it goes from here..
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You are taking what i said out of context.
What I'm saying is that IF your battery had a memory effect as the original article claimed, then charging the battery to only 80 will create a memory at 80, which would be worse for your battery. I'm merely trying to point out an inconsistency in there article.
However, I went on to say that li ON batteries do not have a memory effect. So more relevant to the real world is the fact that our batteries will not experience memory as claimed by the article.

Two main things kill lithium batteries, heat and time as they promote deposits forming in the electrolyte, which reduces the capacity of the battery.
So, buying a "spare" battery at the time you buy a phone with a plan on using it when the original battery starts to fail is a bad idea as the spare battery would be slowly deterorating on the shelf.
Deep charges rather than top up charges are bad as they produce more heat inside the battery, although doing it if your battery doesn't seem to be holding it's chage is a good idea as it should recalibrate the phone's battery level software.

To paraphrase the old saying, " blogs and opinions are like a##holes, everyone has one "
I have followed the links in this thread and so far I have just read unsubstantiated opinion.
I have used " cordless " electronics for most of my life and have used all kinds of batteries extensively as well as talked to company reps and battery " experts ".
Nickel Cadmium batteries had memories. The batteries had to be conditioned and fully charged and discharged. The new Lithium Ion batteries were advantageous , not only because they held a bigger charge and lasted longer, but also because they have NO memory. The latest example being, I regularly charged my Tilt battery to all levels of charge. Mostly 100% everyday and ran it down to 5% most times before charging it again. I used it a lot and charged it a lot. and it lasted 2 yrs.
The only difference I have really noticed in batteries has nothing to do with the way you charge it. It has to do with " getting what you pay for " I have had quality batteries really show their quality and $ 12 batteries give me up to and only my $12 worth.

Charging Lithium Ion Batteries to 80%
denco7 said:
To paraphrase the old saying, " blogs and opinions are like a##holes, everyone has one "
I have followed the links in this thread and so far I have just read unsubstantiated opinion.
I have used " cordless " electronics for most of my life and have used all kinds of batteries extensively as well as talked to company reps and battery " experts ".
Nickel Cadmium batteries had memories. The batteries had to be conditioned and fully charged and discharged. The new Lithium Ion batteries were advantageous , not only because they held a bigger charge and lasted longer, but also because they have NO memory. The latest example being, I regularly charged my Tilt battery to all levels of charge. Mostly 100% everyday and ran it down to 5% most times before charging it again. I used it a lot and charged it a lot. and it lasted 2 yrs.
The only difference I have really noticed in batteries has nothing to do with the way you charge it. It has to do with " getting what you pay for " I have had quality batteries really show their quality and $ 12 batteries give me up to and only my $12 worth.
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I have a Nissan Leaf. It is clear that the engineers have spent a LOT of time thinking about how to maximize the life of the battery in the car. One of the options the car come with is to ALWAYS charge the batteries to 80%. In fact, they've gone as far as to add a button on the dashboard to override that setting in cases where a 100% charge is needed. According to the documentation that comes with the car, this is the single most important step to prolonging battery life. Next is frequent charges. Next is monitoring battery temperature which is constantly shown in a BIG display on the dashboard. In general, a good way to think about a lithium ion battery is that over its life you're trying to maximize the amount of power stored and then subsequently removed from the device. From the research I've done, if the "charging/discharging life" of the battery were cycles that swung from 100% to 0% you might get X kwHrs of power "moved" through the battery, yet if you were to limit charges to 80% and constantly charge it after each use, you could expect at least 2X! So it's a big deal. I live in Bellevue, Washington which has a very mild climate and have put 26,000 miles on this car in the last 2 years, making mostly small 3-to-20 mile trips, and I routinely charge the car when I pull into the garage, and would estimate that the battery has been charged well over 1000 times. To date, there is no detectable loss in battery capacity; the first indication of which would appear on the car's instrumentation when just over 4% of the charging capacity of the car has been lost.

My Sony VAIO Pro 13 actually offers the 80/20 option in Power Settings. However, I do not use it.

Useful Battery Information and Calibration

Here is some information that should be useful to everyone in one way or another if not then you should have told us your secret months ago. lol
A Li-ion batteries life is on a time clock from the day it's produced and how it is used, maintained and the number of cycles it goes through reduces it's life. Even when not being used at all the clock is ticking and life is shortening.
So if any of you are like me I know many of you are far worse than me when it comes to the amount of stress put through it with flashing and extreme general use. Hopefully this will shed some light for us as to what we can do to try and prolong the life of our batteries.
The majority of the following information is from the book “Batteries in a Portable World – A Handbook on Rechargeable Batteries for Non-Engineers” (2nd edition) and Battery University™
Special thanks to the books author and sponsor of Battery University™,
Isidor Buchmann
CEO and Founder, Cadex Electronics Inc.
How to Prolong the Life of Li-ion Batteries
Battery wear-down on lithium-based batteries is caused by two activities: actual usage or cycling, and aging. The wear-down effects by usage and aging apply to all batteries but this is more pronounced on lithium-based systems.
The Li-ion batteries prefer a shallow discharge. Partial discharges produce less wear than a full discharge and the capacity loss per cycle is reduced. A periodic full discharge is not required because the lithium-based battery has no memory. A full cycle constitutes a discharge to 3V/cell. When specifying the number of cycles a lithium-based battery can endure, manufacturers commonly use an 80 percent depth of discharge. This method resembles a reasonably accurate field simulation. It also achieves a higher cycle count than doing full discharges.
Simple Guidelines
Charge the Li-ion often, except before a long storage. Avoid repeated deep discharges.
Keep the Li-ion battery cool. Prevent storage in a hot car. Never freeze a battery.
Avoid purchasing spare Li-ion batteries for later use. Observe manufacturing date when purchasing. Do not buy old stock, even if sold at clearance prices.
Hints to long battery life
3.92V/cell is the best upper voltage threshold for cobalt-based lithium-ion. Charging batteries to this voltage level has been shown to double cycle life. Lithium-ion systems for defense applications make use of the lower voltage threshold. The negative is reduced capacity.
The charge current of Li-ion should be moderate (0.5C for cobalt-based lithium-ion).The lower charge current reduces the time in which the cell resides at 4.20V. It should be noted that a 0.5C charge only adds marginally to the charge time over 1C because the topping charge will be shorter. A high current charge tends to push the voltage up and forces it into the voltage limit prematurely.
Memory Myth or Fact?
Lithium batteries are not affected by memory, but the chemistry has its own peculiarities. Current inhibiting pacifier layers affect them through plate oxidation. This degenerative effect is non-correctable on a lithium-based system
Calibration
A more serious issue is maintenance requirements, better known as capacity re-learning. This procedure is needed on a regular basis to calibrate the battery.
Why is calibration needed?
The answer is in correcting the tracking errors that occur between the battery and the digital sensing circuit during use. The most ideal battery use, as far as fuel-gauge accuracy is concerned, is a full charge followed by a full discharge at a constant 1C rate. This ensures that the tracking error is less than one percent per cycle. However, a battery may be discharged for only a few minutes at a time and commonly at a lower C-rate than 1C. Worst of all, the load may be uneven and vary drastically. Eventually, the true capacity of the battery no longer synchronizes with the fuel gauge and "a full charge and discharge are needed to ‘re-learn’ or calibrate the battery."
How often is calibration needed?
The answer lies in the type of battery application. For practical purposes, a calibration is recommended once every three months or after every 40 short cycles.
What happens if the battery is not calibrated regularly? Can such a battery be used in confidence?
Such a battery is able to function normally, but the digital readout will be inaccurate. If not corrected, the fuel gauge information simply becomes a nuisance.
Just Tell Me WTF I Should Do!
Charge your battery as often as possible, partial discharges are actually better for your battery
Once your battery is charged to 100% avoid leaving it plugged in any longer if you are not using a OEM charger.
Your battery should never get hot from charging if it does this is a sign it may be damaged.
If fuel gauge starts acting up calibrate your battery.
Yeah but how the f^$% do I calibrate my battery?
Charge phone up and then delete your battery stats.
Unplug your phone from your wall charger and let your battery drain all the way down until phone shuts off.
While still off charge phone to 100% and then boot up as normal.
There is so much more that it's mind boggling but I think this covers the main parts and beyond for everyone. So far it appears that the bump method is not necessary nor are the numerous other steps.
I can only laugh when I think that the reason the method of calibration I was using was actually working is due to the fact that the "wipe batt stats, drain battery completely and charge to 100%" is basically the last step and all that is essentially needed.

3 hours? That's it? I thought whenever I charged from empty to full when it's off it's longer.. I should time it.. hmm

darkamikaze said:
3 hours? That's it? I thought whenever I charged from empty to full when it's off it's longer.. I should time it.. hmm
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I removed the time completely since some may vary. But the 3 hours is how long it should take to charge on a standalone battery charger. So rather than confuse or have questions it's better without it.

Nice work!
Charging a 1500mAh battery at 500mAh for example will take 3 hours. The Captivate charges at 2 levels though depending on if it's USB (500mAh max for charge + phone use) or a charger (whatever it says on the charger up to ~1200mAh) so it can probably get done in under 2 hours.
The phone charges to 4.23V and stops charging when full but continues to run on external power, and shuts down at 3.500V where it only consumes current to monitor the power button.
Just for reference.

Battery Stats
Since this is the first time i had a really good battery life. I would like to share it with everyone. Please see the attached screen shots.
I am using Darky's 9.1 with SuckerPunch's 1280/500 Kernel and TLJL3 modem.
I hope this will help anyone trying to get more battery life out of their Captivate.
Thanks,

CuriousTech said:
Nice work!
Charging a 1500mAh battery at 500mAh for example will take 3 hours. The Captivate charges at 2 levels though depending on if it's USB (500mAh max for charge + phone use) or a charger (whatever it says on the charger up to ~1200mAh) so it can probably get done in under 2 hours.
The phone charges to 4.23V and stops charging when full but continues to run on external power, and shuts down at 3.500V where it only consumes current to monitor the power button.
Just for reference.
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Thanks Curious appreciate it and thanks for the additional info.

I had some other random thoughts about the calibration because I keep seeing so many posts daily.
For example "I installed a new kernel 15 minutes ago, recalibrated and the battery drain is horrible." or "After a few charges it lasted longer."
I don't think people get the idea of calibration. Recalibrating determines the capacity of the battery to convert to a % full gauge. To do that you need to fully charge until the "Battery full. Unplug charger." notification, and not rely on the display and unplugging as soon as it hits 100%. That's the inaccurate display that you're trying to calibrate.
Think of it like having an opaque container and a teaspoon. You think the container can hold 100 teaspoons, so you stop filling at 100. All you can get out of it is 100 until you try to fill until it tops off and then count how many come back out.
The phone works the same way. It has an ammeter that monitors the charge current and drain current from the battery from the time you unplug it until it shuts off and remembers that total as the capacity. Unless it's recharged in the middle which voids the data.
After that full discharge, it should stay pretty accurate even with partial discharges. At least until the next rom/kernel flash which wipes it out. At that point (I assume) it uses a simple voltage level and some relative amps drawn to display the gauge, instead of the smarter method of keeping a constant value of mAh by adding when charging and subtracting when draining to know exaclty how full the battery is.

CuriousTech said:
Nice work!
Charging a 1500mAh battery at 500mAh for example will take 3 hours. The Captivate charges at 2 levels though depending on if it's USB (500mAh max for charge + phone use) or a charger (whatever it says on the charger up to ~1200mAh) so it can probably get done in under 2 hours.
The phone charges to 4.23V and stops charging when full but continues to run on external power, and shuts down at 3.500V where it only consumes current to monitor the power button.
Just for reference.
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hm. so if the phone switches to external power when the charge is full, is it okay to leave my phone plugged in once it's done charging? or is it just the fact that the battery is holding a full (4.2V) charge for a long time that's bad for its health?
in any case, useful post! i knew there were ways to preserve the life of li-ion batteries, but was never well-versed on the details.

Yes to both. Once the battery is fully charged, the charge circuit stops completely. It doesn't even need to trickle charge, so leaving it plugged in doesn't hurt anything.
Once the charge is complete the voltage isn't being held at 4.20V so it can come back down a little. I think BatteryUniversity generalizes becuase there have been many different designs over the years that weren't as good as what we have now, and some may have trickle charged their Li-Ions which shortens the life.

Which is it that wipes the battery stats, ROM or kernel? or is it both?

CuriousTech said:
Yes to both. Once the battery is fully charged, the charge circuit stops completely. It doesn't even need to trickle charge, so leaving it plugged in doesn't hurt anything.
Once the charge is complete the voltage isn't being held at 4.20V so it can come back down a little. I think BatteryUniversity generalizes becuase there have been many different designs over the years that weren't as good as what we have now, and some may have trickle charged their Li-Ions which shortens the life.
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One word of caution though is to ensure that you are using an OEM charger. Battery University recommends that you unplug once capacity is reached but perhaps this is a general statement for Li-ion batteries as you state.

zerkai said:
Which is it that wipes the battery stats, ROM or kernel? or is it both?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Both. The first thing in a ROM flash script is to format all the partitions, so that means the batterstats.bin file is erased. When flashing a new kernel the file gets reset by some other means. No idea what. It could be CWM.

Yeah but how the f^$% do I calibrate my battery?
Charge phone up and then delete your battery stats.
Unplug your phone from your wall charger and let your battery drain all the way down until phone shuts off.
While still off charge phone to 100% and then boot up as normal.
My noob question is, how do you delete the battery stats?

iNFRiNGE said:
One word of caution though is to ensure that you are using an OEM charger. Battery University recommends that you unplug once capacity is reached but perhaps this is a general statement for Li-ion batteries as you state.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What happens when you introduce the variable of occasional car charger use?

Sanctus Peregrinus said:
Yeah but how the f^$% do I calibrate my battery?
Charge phone up and then delete your battery stats.
Unplug your phone from your wall charger and let your battery drain all the way down until phone shuts off.
While still off charge phone to 100% and then boot up as normal.
My noob question is, how do you delete the battery stats?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
the file is located at /data/system/batterystats.bin . you'll need a file browser with root access (i use root explorer, a paid app). make sure you mount the storage as read/write or you won't be able to delete the file.
after that, reboot your phone and it will rebuild the batterystats file.
***disclaimer: be careful doing this. if you delete a crucial file, you risk messing up or bricking your phone. such is life.

Nice write up with alot of interesting information. I have never calibrated my battery but will have to try it out. Thanks for posting.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App

I'm not positive of this, but I don't think batterystats.bin holds any battery capacity or health info. I was looking at BatteryManager and it looks like a database of processes and what they use only. But there is info somewhere that gets lost easily, which is the capacity and current amount consumed.
I've been skipping the delete of that file (using CWM) and have noticed that it recalibrates fine anyway. This coming from the point of dropping just after unplugging, which is a good indication that the info is gone.
It doesn't matter if you use a car charger, USB, or AC. The phone has the actual smart charger in it, the external connection is just the power supply. The chip inside regulates and monitors the charge.
So think of it this way. The charger knows when the battery is empty or full, and measures what goes in and comes out. So to know the capacity, it has to go from full to empty. That's really all there is to it. Just wait for the real "Battery full" before unplugging.

Who started this Lithion Ion battery conditioning.

There is no “break-in” or “conditioning” required for the Li-ion batteries. They do not need the old “fully discharge – fully charge” routine for the initial three charges as was recommended on older battery technologies. For a number of years now, the advice has been to fully drain a new rechargeble battery at least three times in a row, then do so at least once a month from then on in order to ‘condition’ it. This is designed to prevent ‘memory’ effects and to prolong the life and capacity of the rechargeable battery.
Unfortunately, it appears that this advice is not only incorrect but could be causing battery damage in that it’s reducing the shelf-life of your equipment.
Modern Li-ion batteries apparently do not suffer from memory effects. All that matters is how many recharging cycles they support. The more cycles they are put through, the less effective they become at holding a charge down the line. The caveat, however, is that you can accelerate their decline by forcing them to drain deeper and deeper.
According to Battery University, the depth-of-discharge on a Li-ion device will determine its ultimate cycle count. What this means in practice is that you should recharge your battery frequently and let it drain as little as possible in between recharges. Partial discharges are better.
As expected, high temperatures are also disastrous to the lifespan of Li-ion batteries. Interestingly, high-voltage charging has a similar effect. Higher voltages will charge the battery faster but damage it. The article suggests that user-regulated voltages for laptop batteries might be a useful way to allow the consumer to decide which is more important to them in their daily useage – faster recharge or longer life.
Always store a Li-ion battery full charged. Not doing so will reduce its lifespan and capacity.
Similarly, it would seem that keeping it connected to a power supply when it is 100% charged is not very wise either.

Thanks for posting this! I was wondering something similar after I got my Sensation. I was looking to improve my battery life and was wondering if the fact that I've let my battery discharge irregularly only a handful of times along with hardly ever leaving it off the USB laptop cable at home had anything to do with it. I'll be sure not to discharge it unnecessarily from now on.

Tacjim said:
There is no “break-in” or “conditioning” required for the Li-ion batteries. They do not need the old “fully discharge – fully charge” routine for the initial three charges as was recommended on older battery technologies. For a number of years now, the advice has been to fully drain a new rechargeble battery at least three times in a row, then do so at least once a month from then on in order to ‘condition’ it. This is designed to prevent ‘memory’ effects and to prolong the life and capacity of the rechargeable battery.
Unfortunately, it appears that this advice is not only incorrect but could be causing battery damage in that it’s reducing the shelf-life of your equipment.
Modern Li-ion batteries apparently do not suffer from memory effects. All that matters is how many recharging cycles they support. The more cycles they are put through, the less effective they become at holding a charge down the line. The caveat, however, is that you can accelerate their decline by forcing them to drain deeper and deeper.
According to Battery University, the depth-of-discharge on a Li-ion device will determine its ultimate cycle count. What this means in practice is that you should recharge your battery frequently and let it drain as little as possible in between recharges. Partial discharges are better.
As expected, high temperatures are also disastrous to the lifespan of Li-ion batteries. Interestingly, high-voltage charging has a similar effect. Higher voltages will charge the battery faster but damage it. The article suggests that user-regulated voltages for laptop batteries might be a useful way to allow the consumer to decide which is more important to them in their daily useage – faster recharge or longer life.
Always store a Li-ion battery full charged. Not doing so will reduce its lifespan and capacity.
Similarly, it would seem that keeping it connected to a power supply when it is 100% charged is not very wise either.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have to disagree with this to an extent, as its preferred to discharge and recharge the first times, as it freshens the cells and calibrates the phone to the battery.
But after this you should recharge it when it's at 30-40%
Also you should not leave a lithium batter fully charged when storing it, but rather have it at 60% and throw it in the refrigerator. This is what i have been doing to all mine batteries, but don't let it freeze though, this will harm the battery!

There's nothing worse than a know-it-all Uni student! If there's a real technician or scientist on the matter I would like to hear their advice.
As I am a mechanical technician I use a variety of battery powered tools all of which are Li-ion, I like to condition all my batteries but for the few that cannot be conditioned due to lack of time those particular batteries are, weaker, last less time and overall die out faster.

Flashmore said:
There's nothing worse than a know-it-all Uni student! If there's a real technician or scientist on the matter I would like to hear their advice.
As I am a mechanical technician I use a variety of battery powered tools all of which are Li-ion, I like to condition all my batteries but for the few that cannot be conditioned due to lack of time those particular batteries are, weaker, last less time and overall die out faster.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Haha, it's not a Uni student, its batter university, a well known webpage
http://batteryuniversity.com/

Utking said:
Haha, it's not a Uni student, its batter university, a well known webpage
http://batteryuniversity.com/
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I see, so I suppose it just posted this all on its own?

Flashmore said:
I see, so I suppose it just posted this all on its own?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No this man did: Isidor Buchmann
http://www.cadex.com/about/people.asp
http://www.myistop.com/blogs/greenbatterys/isidor-buchmann-battery
http://nutsvolts.texterity.com/nutsvolts/200612/?folio=58#pg58
I believe i can say i trust him

Are you sure? sounds more like Dracula's side kick, haha

Utking said:
I have to disagree with this to an extent, as its preferred to discharge and recharge the first times, as it freshens the cells and calibrates the phone to the battery.
But after this you should recharge it when it's at 30-40%
Also you should not leave a lithium batter fully charged when storing it, but rather have it at 60% and throw it in the refrigerator. This is what i have been doing to all mine batteries, but don't let it freeze though, this will harm the battery!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is exactly what I do. Last time I drained a phone down to 0% it killed the battery and wouldn't hold charge like it used to (was fine before I did it). Was on an old LG. Same thing happened to a friends phone too. From then on I try and tell everyone to never do it as well.

While I'm sure you have your sources, I have to disagree. When I got my vibrant, I didn't condition it at all, battery life was horrible. I bought a new battery (the same one), conditioned it, and it was 10000x better.
But I do agree that batteries have become much greater than they used to be about this.
Batteries are always a fun topic

This comes from rooted phones and batterystats.bin
It's recommended when you flash your new ROM that you turn off the phone. Than fully charge it. And while still charging removing batterystats.bin so your android phone knows 100% and than let it die down so it knows 0%.
I think that is where this all came from.

Flashmore said:
There's nothing worse than a know-it-all Uni student! If there's a real technician or scientist on the matter I would like to hear their advice.
As I am a mechanical technician I use a variety of battery powered tools all of which are Li-ion, I like to condition all my batteries but for the few that cannot be conditioned due to lack of time those particular batteries are, weaker, last less time and overall die out faster.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The only thing I'm trying to do is help people from shortening the life of their batteries by listening to people who don't have a clue what they're talking about. Since you seem to spout out that "unconditioned" lithium Ion batteries are weaker, last less time and die out faster...lets see some professional resources from your "know it all" conclusion?

By no means an expert, just putting in my 2cent, i think people seem to mix the ideas of battery conditioning and recalibration. I think it IS useful to recalibrate batteries by draining the battery to 0% so the phone can recognize the accurate battery levels. However in terms of the battery, its always the same and there is no "reconditioning". the drain/recharge cycle is only useful for the PHONE for accurate recognition of battery level.

personally, i havn't bought into the conditioning aspect.. i can afford the $10-$15 it takes to replace a battery when it dies out and i always charge before it is dead (min 30%); (on the sensation so i dont lose temp root) but also because usually it would take 10 minutes or so for it to get enough juice to turn back on (in the iphones/touch's case.. but in any case i had always learnt that NiMH batteries you could drain fully and make sure to fully charge before you use them again; whereas Li-ion you could charge at 30% keep your good life and use the device at the same time pretty simple really

c19932 said:
By no means an expert, just putting in my 2cent, i think people seem to mix the ideas of battery conditioning and recalibration. I think it IS useful to recalibrate batteries by draining the battery to 0% so the phone can recognize the accurate battery levels. However in terms of the battery, its always the same and there is no "reconditioning". the drain/recharge cycle is only useful for the PHONE for accurate recognition of battery level.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed. From what I've read this hasn't anything to do with battery capacity or memory effect, it's so the phone can calibrate itself correctly to the battery inserted using the batterystats file giving a better indication of peak to zero.

Tacjim said:
The only thing I'm trying to do is help people from shortening the life of their batteries by listening to people who don't have a clue what they're talking about. Since you seem to spout out that "unconditioned" lithium Ion batteries are weaker, last less time and die out faster...lets see some professional resources from your "know it all" conclusion?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well you know what they say it takes one to know one!
As well as that I havent "spouted" anything (well not here anyway hehe)
My conclusion is this, dont believe everything you read, what a cliché
Seriously though I already gave my "real" practical know-it-all conclusion so unless you have somethijng to disprove it go and you know what

will fast charging will damage battery.?
I want to use fast charger for Nexus 5. Original charger gives 5.6 volts and 1.2 Ampere output.
Some post I found on xda which shows that fast charging working perfect on nexus 5,
can OP tell me that fast charging will affect battery or not? If it affects then how can I find its getting affected?
Thread which shows nexus 5 fast charging works perfectly.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/goo.../hands-best-fastest-cheapest-nexus-5-t2729066

[GUIDE] How to prolong the life of your Li-Ion battery

First off this isn't a guide about how to make your battery last longer between charges, at least it isn't yet. If a demand arises I will happily facilitate. *EDIT* For simplicity's sake I am including a link to V7's battery guide which addresses increasing the time between charges. ✭[GUIDE][26-07-2016]Extreme Battery Life Thread(Greenify+Amplify+Power Nap)✭This guide is about reducing wear that happens from many thing we all either knowingly do; out of a possible misunderstanding, or ignorance. All of this information is available doing a simple Google search, I am posting it here though for those who otherwise would not think to Google it. Furthermore I claim credit for absolutely none of this, but I do hope you find it helpful.
HOW TO PROLONG YOUR Li-Ion BATTERY'S LIFE​
1) Keep your battery at room temperature: Heat is the worst enemy of your cell phones battery. So keeping your battery at room temperature (65-75*F) is the first step towards prolonging your battery's life. According to Battery University
each 8°C (15°F) rise in temperature cuts the life of a sealed lead acid battery in half.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They also go on further adding
Once the battery is damaged by heat, the capacity cannot be restored.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There are many things you can do to keep your battery cooler, such as taking it off the charger when the phone is done charging, and avoiding prolonged continuous usage. Also avoid leaving your phone in your car, it gets upwards of 140* in a car during the summer. The worst thing that can happen to a Li-Ion battery is a full charge and high heat, so avoid charging your phone until your car has cooled off if you are charging your battery in the car. Heat is by far the greatest factor when it comes to reducing the lifespan of a Li-Ion battery.
2) Use partial-discharge cycles: According to lancair.net
Using only 20% or 30% of the battery capacity before recharging will extend cycle life considerably
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Click to collapse
Other sites I read while researching this stated that users should use up to 80% of their energy before recharging, they were all consistent with regards to a few things including: avoiding full discharges will prolong battery life, and it takes several partial charges to use one full charge cycle. Additionally Li-Ion batteries do not have "charge memory", but your digital device most likely does. Discharging the battery until cut off after every 30 charge cycles re calibrates the devices gauge.
3) Avoid keeping your battery at 100%: Every source I referenced for this guide said the same thing about keeping your battery at a full capacity, but oranageinks.com explains it most simply by stating
Permanent capacity loss is greatest at elevated temperatures with the battery voltage maintained at maximum (fully charged).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
4) If you are going to store your battery for an extended period store it at about 50% charged: This goes hand-in-hand with number 3. Also keeping the battery cool during extended storage will slow deterioration. Keeping the battery in a sealed bag or tupperware in your refrigerator is okay, but storing your battery in the freezer is not. When a battery is fully charged oxidation is occurring at its highest rate, and oxidation is essential corrosion. Oxidation occurs whether the battery is in use or not, for this reason it is better to get a high capacity battery rather than a spare. So with this said it almost should go without saying that if you can, buy batteries with a recent manufacture date.
5) Avoid completely discharging your battery: Lancair.com states:
Very deep discharges will quickly, permanently damage a Li-ion battery. Internal metal plating can occur causing a short circuit, making the battery unusable and unsafe. Most Li-ion batteries have protection circuitry within their battery packs that open the battery connection if the battery voltage is less than 2.5 V or exceeds 4.3 V, or if the battery current exceeds a predefined threshold level when charging or is charging
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you found this helpful please don't forget to hit the "Thanks" button

now that explain why my battery drain so fast,my phone temperature is a bit high these days,thank you :good

I decrease my battry drain with installing som suitable kernal
this way realy effective in my device battry mangement

You're absolutely right, and you hit the nail on the head,
Saeedblack said:
realy[sic] effective in my device battry[sic] mangement
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But the physical battery itself needs care too. Device battery management is more related to how much power the CPU sees that the device has. Understanding how a Li-Ion battery works is kinda important at this point. So basically the positive electrode is made of Lithium cobalt oxide (cathode), or LiCoO2. The negative electrode is made of carbon (anode). When the battery is charging, ions of lithium move through the electrolyte from the positive electrode to the negative electrode and attach to the carbon. During discharge, the lithium ions move back to the LiCoO2 from the carbon. Over time the Lithium ions bond to the carbon thereby restricting the flow, creating resistance which decreases the battery's ability to deliver current. So properly caring for your battery is really the only thing that will slow the inevitable. Its kinda the same thing for a car...all cars eventually die, but if you take care of them they will last much longer than if you neglect them.

Thanks for this. It's not the usually same guide for battery improvementent.
My battery life got a little better.

Thanks mate, that's some good information.

Hi.
Just wondering:
in "5) Avoid completely discharging your battery"
Most battery calibration softwares say you SHOULD fully discharge your battery then fully charge it for a good calibration.
So, someone like me, who likes to try new roms, new nightlys all the time, are "slowly" burning the battery to ashes by calibrating it after every flash.

It looks like running the processor faster than specified (overclocking) can result in higher temperatures inside the device and faster battery wear as a result.

azraelus said:
Hi.
Just wondering:
in "5) Avoid completely discharging your battery"
Most battery calibration softwares say you SHOULD fully discharge your battery then fully charge it for a good calibration.
So, someone like me, who likes to try new roms, new nightlys all the time, are "slowly" burning the battery to ashes by calibrating it after every flash.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
YES you are slowly burning the battery out, by draining it after every flash. The battery is going to die inevitably anyways though, most of the sources I found suggest doing a "full drain" every 30 charge cycles. Perhaps this is when you should go ahead and do your battery calibration. Also a full drain is not exactly self-explanatory in this case. Your device may say that a battery has 1% of its energy left and to an extent it does, but the battery is designed to cut off before it gets too hot or too low. If you have a tendency to cut your phone back on after it dies then you will deplete the battery completely, possibly resulting in permanent damage.
adrian816 said:
It looks like running the processor faster than specified (overclocking) can result in higher temperatures inside the device and faster battery wear as a result.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes O/C can raise temperatures of the device. Certain kernels run a little hotter than others. My device is currently O/C'd and isn't any hotter than normal when I am not using the device due to CPU governors and what not, and its only marginally hotter than it is when at the stock clock speed. Prolonged heavy use takes a toll on the battery, due to the heat its creating. Also don't let the little bit of heat increase stop you from O/C'ing your device. Many manufacturers use the same cpu with different clock speeds, EX Snapdragon S3 chip is used in the EVO 3D @ 1.2GHz, and the HTC Rezound @ 1.5GHZ from the factory. This is done to reduce power consumption on power hungry phones or to extend the life of a cpu that has proven itself reliable(such as in the example of the Snapdragon S3)...it also helps to market devices without spending more on development.

Good adwise! :good:

This is all very good advice. A lot of it I knew, but I learned a couple new things as well. Glad to see someone making it more easily available to our community!
Sent from my SGH-I777 using xda app-developers app

Found this same information when researching my netbook battery.Turns out there is a good reason it will sleep/hybernate/power off at 3 percent, can damage a cell. On the upside this one will charge faster.

Thanks for the information.
Sent from my GT-S5360 using Tapatalk 2

Oh god, by "avoiding keep it at 100%" you mean "don't use it constantly while charging", right?
I have a seriously problem.

Wish I could do something about #1. My phone can get pretty hot when I'm using it and I like to do a lot of things like playing games or dling torrents which gets it toasty.
Will definitely unplug before 100% from now on though. Thanks

Jane Shizuka said:
Oh god, by "avoiding keep it at 100%" you mean "don't use it constantly while charging", right?
I have a seriously problem.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yea that's pretty much the gist of it...heavy use while charging creates even more heat than just heavy use or just charging. Since doing the research for this thread I've been doing things a little differently myself. Instead of leaving it on the charger most of the day I charge it at night and use it til about 50% then charge it up to 80%...it may be in my head but I highly doubt it. Doing as I described I have had 1 full charge (from 40% to 100%) and a top off charge (50% to 80%) and my device has been on since yesterday morning (so 36 hours+ with only a 30% top off charge). This is with moderate use, and my phone is currently at 70%...MUCH better than before though.
This guide is still meant more for longer term physical battery care, but it appears to have helped extend time between charges.
zlc1 said:
Wish I could do something about #1. My phone can get pretty hot when I'm using it and I like to do a lot of things like playing games or dling torrents which gets it toasty.
Will definitely unplug before 100% from now on though. Thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Try a different kernel, or underclocking your phone, that should help with the heat.

Thanks, I'll keep this in mind!

Thanks for the advice, but i thought discharge it completely wont do any harm to the battery since the protection circuit will stop at around 3..0-3.4 mV?

ryanshady said:
Thanks for the advice, but i thought discharge it completely wont do any harm to the battery since the protection circuit will stop at around 3..0-3.4 mV?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is about the point the device will cut off, but if you turn it back on like I used to until the device won't turn back on that's when the battery is completely discharged. Battery University goes on to say
Each cycle wears the battery down by a small amount. A partial discharge before charge is better than a full discharge. Apply a deliberate full discharge only to calibrate a smart battery and to prevent “memory” on a nickel-based pack.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Link to article HERE
*EDIT*

i wish there's a way to stop charging once it reaches 85-95% like my laptop...