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Just as I was expecting, Google locking down on open development. (article)

http://www.engadget.com/2011/03/31/google-tightening-control-of-android-insisting-licensees-abide/
Looks like the Honeycomb lockout is just the beginning... It's because so many people complained about Fragmentation..
*le sigh*

I thought this was to get 'early' access to code. If that's the case, then I heartily agree.
Besides, I personally think fragmentation is the single, worst aspect of Android on phones.

Yeah, as long as this is for the manufacturers that are getting early access before the source is released to the public, I think it will be a very good thing.

If this removes the ability of Motorola adding it's "moto-blur" on top of Android, Samsung from adding "Touch Wiz" and HTC from adding "Sense-UI".....I'm all for it!

Maybe I am just a minority when I say I didn't mind fragmentation...
Kinda made each device unique...
I have an evo with sense on it. I have a gtab with launcher pro. and I have a xoom with (motoblur?, honeycomb default?) not sure lol .
But each one is very unique to me and feels like a different device. If everything was the same it would feel like that fruit labeled company
ah well, each their own

To me it's just annoying that their whole marketing game about it being an open dev process is just a crock. That being said, I'm glad we have earlier android source available, and I think it would be just dandy if somehow the devs here took that branch and advanced it further than google could do w/ honeycomb .

akodoreign said:
Maybe I am just a minority when I say I didn't mind fragmentation...
Kinda made each device unique...
I have an evo with sense on it. I have a gtab with launcher pro. and I have a xoom with (motoblur?, honeycomb default?) not sure lol .
But each one is very unique to me and feels like a different device. If everything was the same it would feel like that fruit labeled company
ah well, each their own
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I understand where you're coming from, I just think the manufacturers use their additional code as an excuse when users want to update/upgrade. Samsung seems to have taken a lot of flack recently for their delays.
Then we just have to get these OEM's stop bolting their ROM's / code down.
Personally, Viewsonic has built loyalty for me by not locking down their device and (seemingly) encouraging independent development. Combine with nice hardware, I would buy again paying even more if they would use a little better screen the next time around.

captain_fid said:
Personally, Viewsonic has built loyalty for me by not locking down their device and (seemingly) encouraging independent development. Combine with nice hardware, I would buy again paying even more if they would use a little better screen the next time around.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
By far, the screen is this devices biggest failing. Drove me nuts to the point that I tried rooting a Nook Color. That's a nice screen. However, I took it back, the damn soft key thing was driving me ape....

Understandable....but you can make each device your own without the need of a vendor hacking their code into the android AOSP code. .
Different launchers are available, different home screen setup options are easy enough...
Without worrying about this device needing a moto-blur tested app or an HTC Sense tested app can increase updates and stability of apps. It also removes the apps that "only" work on moto-blur or sense-ui, etc... as that was what the platform the developer was working with and used some of those extra library functions, etc...
Vanilla AOSP is best. Make your hardware/price point stand out and people will flock to it. Let the people decide what they want their UI to look like (via launchers, widgets, and such).
akodoreign said:
Maybe I am just a minority when I say I didn't mind fragmentation...
Kinda made each device unique...
I have an evo with sense on it. I have a gtab with launcher pro. and I have a xoom with (motoblur?, honeycomb default?) not sure lol .
But each one is very unique to me and feels like a different device. If everything was the same it would feel like that fruit labeled company
ah well, each their own
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

therealkired said:
By far, the screen is this devices biggest failing. Drove me nuts to the point that I tried rooting a Nook Color. That's a nice screen. However, I took it back, the damn soft key thing was driving me ape....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed. For the price, though, (especially for all those wooter's out there) it is an amazing device.

Got sad at first as I hate to see any amount of extra control being grabbed by Google. After reading the article again and the comments I became a lot more ok with it. Some sort of quality control over what kind of overlay can be put over stock android sounds fair.

The good part is that it's not a limit for the everyday dev, and even for company's doing things with android that it wasn't intended for...
You could still see a toaster come out with Android 3.1 that is custom skinned... but only after the AOSP dropped would the development be able to begin. You wouldn't have that toaster getting preferential treatment by google and early access to the source.

akodoreign said:
http://www.engadget.com/2011/03/31/google-tightening-control-of-android-insisting-licensees-abide/
Looks like the Honeycomb lockout is just the beginning... It's because so many people complained about Fragmentation..
*le sigh*
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Try reading from more than just one source..http://www.businessweek.com/technology/content/mar2011/tc20110324_269784.htm
Rubin says that if Google were to open-source the Honeycomb code now, as it has with other versions of Android at similar periods in their development, it couldn't prevent developers from putting the software on phones "and creating a really bad user experience. We have no idea if it will even work on phones."
"Android is an open-source project," he adds. "We have not changed our strategy."

Honeycomb + Gingerbread + Google TV = Yummy
Google is looking to bring all the deserts back into one.
With an added topping of Google TV.
This is the best of all worlds, so a bug/feature add goes out to all devices, tablets, phones, TVs, Settops, etc..
Sure it will take them a few months or so to get this done, but I think the wait will be worth it.

Here's the way I feel. There is not a single thing about sense/motoblur/touchwiz that should cause the manufacturer to integrate it into the android code. All of these would work just fine with apps/launchers. If htc wants sense on there devices, program a launcher, dont bogg down the code with an extra 100 megs of useless crap. Make the launchers and apps uninstallable.
This whole thing only forces the manufacturers to make their UI's the way they should have to begin with. I'd say this is better for the community, not worse.

[Misc] future of android.

Would like to start a general discussion here.
Would it be a good idea if Google only use android on their own ( Motorola) hardware?
Take this as current state and not the changes in ice cream.
Currently android is a mess 6 versions of the the os in the market.
Three main ones app makers have to support.
I love aosp so I use cm7 as I missed the nexus one and the nexus s didn't have an SD card.
I have tried touchwiz on a galaxy s. Sense on a hero and desire HD. Motoblur on a dext and defy.
They add nothing all they do is slow down the phone and updates.
Why do company's feel the need to add old ui's ( most are ported from older model phones)
Something I miss from my iphones was updates on all devices as the same time, no waiting around for a manufactor to mess around with it,then a network to spoil it even more, then for me to get it after a slow roll out.
So maybe android needs to take a look at ios and think why do app devs like it more? Why do normal users like it more?( XDA users are not normal users)
I would like one of three things to happen.
1- all android phones are aosp.
2- added UI are installable as an option not bundled into the phone.
3- Google to only release phones for purity.
Would like to see peoples thoughts on this.
And also if you like a UI why do you like it? what do you think it adds?
I repair things I am not a writer so hope its coherent enough to get the jist.
Sent from my Tablet

HTC, Samsung, Moto, etc... they put those UIs on to dumb down the OS. Make it simple. Simple sells.
Simple UI plus a Powerful OS = great sales!

But sense adds even more settings and more to the lockscreen more everything.
Motoblur seems to need a blur account then you need your Google account for market.
Not that simple to me.
Touchwiz just seems to change things not add or take away.
Sent from my Phone

All of those make it simple. How do you add to the lock screen on stock Android?

vetvito said:
All of those make it simple. How do you add to the lock screen on stock Android?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can't on stock its a simple unlock or mute
Sent from my Phone

What makes apple so "great" in most customers eyes is the simplicity. I love android just for the fact that there are so many ways time customize it it's ridiculous. Example: apple had to release almost 5 generations of the iPhone just to try to keep up with the android.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App

aurgerman said:
Example: apple had to release almost 5 generations of the iPhone just to try to keep up with the android.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not sure I agree with that.
Android only really took over apple when android got to 2.2( not everyone even has that yet)
Ios is very rock soil and before ios4 didn't really crash on me. I have only started noticing problems since ios4.
And with the customization with our phones there is a limit to what you can theme on stock rom without root.
Installing cydia on ios devices you get loads of themes and changes some of them are even better then android visually.
Sent from my Phone

Are you sure ^ ? 2.2 - 2.3 is on 85% of Android devices right now.

Let's keep in mind that all these companies need to distinguish themselves from their competition. Consider all the competing phones based on, say, the ARM A8 platform. With similar core hardware under the hood running the same underlying OS, the interface is simply the best place to make a given model noticeably distinct to the average consumer.
Google may not be thrilled with platform fragmentation, but I'd wager that the various royalties / licensing fees / brand recognition opportunities / whatever more than make up for it. Going full-turtle would be bad business. Just my 2 cents...
Sent from my SCH-I500 using xda premium

iammodo said:
3- Google to only release phones for purity.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Coming soon from Google: AryanOS, locked down tighter than **** Cheney's butthole to guarantee purity!
/Godwinned
Sent from my SCH-I500 using xda premium

vetvito said:
HTC, Samsung, Moto, etc... they put those UIs on to dumb down the OS. Make it simple. Simple sells.
Simple UI plus a Powerful OS = great sales!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So true.
Also, Google, Moto, Sammy, and HTC don't fight back enough with carriers, mainly Verizon, against bloat. Verizon would probably say "To hell with Android then" if they did, since they don't have as much leverage as the iPhone and Apple.
Jazz is also right. If every manufacture had stock on their phones, you wouldn't know which to choose since there would be no difference. Only buyers, like us, that actually care about the speed of a phone, and the ram and rom and all that jazz would know the differences, but average users wouldn't. Hell, my sister, who is only 21, doesn't understand the difference between a Droid and an Android phone, she assumes that every phone that runs Android is a Droid...like my aunt's Evo. (lol)
I actually like Sense, especially Sense 3.5. I think it makes Android look a little nicer, especially if you don't want to root or use custom roms. Touchwiz is also kinda nice, but it's really just the launcher that is changed. Blur is a piece of doodoo though. Can't even install the Facebook app onto my X2 because of Blur's useless Facebook integration that works like hell. Tells me everything I don't want to know, and nothing that I do.
I seriously don't see the point of bloat anyways. If the app is already installed on my phone and I never use it, what is the difference between that and it not being on my phone entirely. If I wanted the dang app, I would've clicked the Verizon tab in the market and downloaded VCast or VMusic. Best answer is probably that Verizon has some stupid person in HR or whatever deciding on what is preinstalled on the phone, instead of the actual consumer. (Then again, I don't see the point in a Facebook phone as well..)

Thanks
Enviado desde mi SM-G925F mediante Tapatalk

Its like looking into a time machine , i remember iOS3 & 4 when it was as simple as jailbreak.me man it used to be so easy :/

Androids Future

It seems Apple is in the lead of this whole patent war nonsense winning against HTC for patents of things like clicking numbers and maps from a message, although HTC has pledged to modify their devices to remove any sort of infringement things just aren't looking good, I mean the iPhone is a nice device and everything but I can't imagine being trapped in that box Apple puts people in, Although HTC makes a great deal of Android powered phones its obvious the main Target is Android itself, The way things are going Im just wondering will there be a future with the Android we all know and love

I live in New Zealand. I just saw a major electronics chain advertising android phones for $109 (about $80 USD). This is in a developed, but isolated, country. Android has a future!!!

Lol it'll be fine since there are still plenty of educated folk around who don't buy Apple s***.

^SO true. Well said.

Why is Apple doing this????? We android users will cut and eat Apple... Long live Android....
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA App

Unfortunately, in singapore, not many people is buying android phones. Reason? All iPhone/iPad users in singapore think that ALL APPLE products are the best, THE END.
And that is very sad if u own a android phone here. Example: Get a SGSII or Sensation XE in singapore and u tell your friends that your phone is better then the iphone and they keep coming up with rubbish excuses.
Sick and tired of this idea that iPhone is the best, cuz its NOT.
Pls samsung or htc, come up with something that will kill the iPhone.

Yes, but one has to think what if HTC cannot sale anymore phones in the US, that's a large collection of Android devices, I would guess Samsung would suffer here aswel, and Apple are just a bunch of sleezy sons of b%?#*$

The SGS2 kills the iPhone, the sensation, the rezound, all kill that little thing, in all fairness the iPhone has good build quality that's all Apple does is makes things look good, what can the iPhone that Android cant? Not the case vise versa people are just being blind all we need is a good looking device that's feels like its real and not plastic and then we win everything

relldroid said:
Yes, but one has to think what if HTC cannot sale anymore phones in the US, that's a large collection of Android devices, I would guess Samsung would suffer here aswel, and Apple are just a bunch of sleezy sons of b%?#*$
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The injunction only applies to HTC phones running android 1.6-2.2. Gingerbread, honeycomb and Ice Cream Sandwich are not affected, so it is hardly a set back.

heck even Gingerbread 2.3 are unaffected
which is basically all the new phones since late 2010 LMAO!

Ok now Apple has just been awarded an app switching patent, this is not good and states my point that things aren't looking up for us

Funny enough, I still don't fully feel that (at least Samsung phones) Android has that true comfortable multi-tasking. Holding home, for instance, bring up a recently used menu rather than currently running. Going to main screen, then to task manager, then to an open app of choice is a little clunky IMO.
So IMO, Android needs to adapt that true alt-tab style way to browse actually running apps. Nokia had this for ages.

If the Android is so much better than all the others ,then why even care about them ??

gielsgaard said:
If the Android is so much better than all the others ,then why even care about them ??
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Because Apple knows Androids better so they're trying to sabotage it by this patent war to restrict us from the way we use our device and even keep manufacturers from selling them, that's seems to be the plan anyway

Skv012a said:
Funny enough, I still don't fully feel that (at least Samsung phones) Android has that true comfortable multi-tasking. Holding home, for instance, bring up a recently used menu rather than currently running. Going to main screen, then to task manager, then to an open app of choice is a little clunky IMO.
So IMO, Android needs to adapt that true alt-tab style way to browse actually running apps. Nokia had this for ages.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Honeycomb and ICS changed this ...there's a app switching button
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using xda premium

Yea the app switching/task killer is fantastic in ICS. I use it all the time. Great for quick multitasking. You swipe to close kinda ala PalmPre style (they swipe up). Notifications can be removed one at a time CM7 style (swipe to remote).
Apple iOS doesn't hold a candle to Android functionality. You can start to see this when the last Apple update stole most of it from Android. Split keyboard, pfft. Notification Center, pfft.
IMO, let them keep pulling the best ideas from one another until they are both the same great product.
Next iOS update = iWidgets

The future of Android is 3rd pace behind WP8(or whatever the next version will be called) and iOS unless Google can solve the performance and update problems plaguing Android. Android fans can cry all they want about Apple and MS suing various Android OEMs, but fact is Android infringes on a million patents and "open" buzzword isn't a valid defense in the court of law. Android was originally designed to mimic Blackberry until Schmidt realized that iPhone was the future and now Google is working on ripping off WP7 people hub features so I wouldn't be surprised if more lawsuits are ahead once ICS becomes more popular.

iWidgets lol, but I wish Google had a patent for the notification bar Apple clearly ripped it off of android all while they claim vise versa, as for the wp8 comment I think the real argument deals with apple, seeing how wp7 was never really popular, well from what I know, people seem to favor what they know over then what they don't, so IMO wp8 would be number 3

THE PROBLEM WITH ANDROID THAT NEEDS TO BE FIXED - OEMs

This is what i think the real and biggest problem with android is, the battle is not with apple, their os or their phone. The actual problem is this-
"Google has done an extremely awesome job with jelly bean, the 'project butter' has really changed the Android experience, experience is fast and ultra responsive, devices dont lag when u turn them on or when u wake them from sleep. Google Now is pretty instant and gives some delightfully satisfying answers which the software is all about, offline voice typing is also pretty accurate, fast and an actual step forward with voice typing, the animations are wonderful, the lockscreen is simple and easy to use and its pretty fast, and what to say about notifications they are just a treat to use.
But all of what google has done is waste, total waste.
Cause OEMs wont be able give JB to their devices. Why? Because they will be busy to make stock JB look ugly, they will be busy to just change the way the UI looks so that their device can look be different no matter if its uglier than stock, they will be busy to add stupid features like 'direct call' when the call button is just their above the messages(I MEAN ITS JUST ONE FREAKING TAP ON THE CALL BUTTON AS ITS JUST RIGHT THEIR, U R LOOKING AT THE SCREEN ANYWAY SO U CAN JUST PRESS THAT FREAKING BUTTON TO CALL THAT PERSON), features like 'Tap to Top' (CAN'T U JUST FLICK UR FINGER ON THE SCREEN TO SCROLL BACK TO TOP, IT TURNS OUT THAT U CAN BUT OEMs HAVE TO ADD THESE FANCY FEATURES TO SHOW THE WORLD THAT THEY CAN DO FANCY 'CODING'), they have to add fancy and weird lockscreen. I know some features are important to add for ur company like various camera settings that google don't add cause they simply dont feel the need of those settings, BUT WHY THE HELL OEMs HAVE TO ADD THEIR FREAKING CUSTOM UGLY SKINS AND USELESS FEATURES.
I think google should do something to stop this madness, i see tons of bulls*** on internet just to compare the iphone and android. Most of the comments is people saying that they have older version of android on their device and 'not the one shown in the video' but on iphone they have latest software that is even in 'iphone4s' so they still think iphones are better. It ALL ABOUT UPDATES, GOOGLE WORK REALLY HARD ON ANDROID AND THE RESULT IS THAT MAJORITY OF ANDROID DEVICES ARE STILL ON '2.3.3.
Its pretty dissapointing to see how idiotic OEMs behave about updates, skins and fancy features. I hope the google PDK help OEMs to give faster update.
Some comapnies are still struggling to push ICS to their old devices and JB is out, they are busy in working on their new devices and some few people from their team work on OS updates to old devices, and the process is so slow because they are busy in adding ****ty skins and features.
P.S. Other OEMs should learn from HUAWEI, they also wanted to add some features that they feel are useful to their ICS phones, but they didnt ****ed the UI, they have their file manager, their cloud services, some additional camera app features in their ICS phones but they dont **** the UI."
This is what i think, i was pretty angry about OEMs and updates so i shared all my thoughts on a g+ post and this quote is the same g+ post.
Here is my g+ profile- https://plus.google.com/117638526643371847672/posts

I think/hope Google is having this very revelation, since they are supposedly releasing some more Nexus devices in November. I know I'm waiting to see if one of those devices is a slider, as the rumor goes. I'm definitely with you on this!

You are absolutely right. Maybe not every OEM's ROM is bad, but they shouldn't try to make things better because it takes a lot of time and usually makes the system look ugly. That makes Android different on almost every manufacturer's device...
Sent from my E15i using XDA Premium App

One thing that I have decided that I am just going to buy devices that come under Google's NEXUS program. That way even if I may get not the latest and greatest hardware, I am still assured that I will get updates for at least 2-3 years and instant updates is what we are talking about.

Feel You
Hahahahahha
Anger is good
you were right about every single word
OEMs ruin the Android
trying to make it better
while the only thing happening is Android getting S*** taste instead of vanilla taste
well
on my side
i would prefer if the Stock android was available to all phones beside the OEMs one
in that way we have a choice
also
the Android pure Rom is much better than any other
i came to that after a lot of flashing
---------- Post added at 11:26 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:17 PM ----------
yogi2010 said:
I think/hope Google is having this very revelation, since they are supposedly releasing some more Nexus devices in November. I know I'm waiting to see if one of those devices is a slider, as the rumor goes. I'm definitely with you on this!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Slider +1:victory:

Haha, I also was getting myself worked up the other day thinking about carriers: I'm sure they also have a lot to do with how long updates take to come out. And, they get you on a 2-year contract, and then you're lucky if they support the device with updates for even 1 year!

I'm hoping PDK begins to lock down a bit of what they can do. Also, Carriers are a huge problem too. They don't want you to get updates.
Sent from my LG-E739 using Tapatalk 2

You know I see a lot of people thinking that all OEM do is make it look ugly ( to be honest all the OEM and ICS default themes look like crap)
But they do alot more. Take the SGS3 for example. All the nice software that made people excited about it would not be there if OEM didn't add their spin. All the nice features people enjoy wouldn't be there either. I mean if all that stuff didn't matter then people would be running a nexus as it is pure android.
Sent for a corner cell in Arkham

zelendel said:
You know I see a lot of people thinking that all OEM do is make it look ugly ( to be honest all the OEM and ICS default themes look like crap)
But they do alot more. Take the SGS3 for example. All the nice software that made people excited about it would not be there if OEM didn't add their spin. All the nice features people enjoy wouldn't be there either. I mean if all that stuff didn't matter then people would be running a nexus as it is pure android.
Sent for a corner cell in Arkham
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I understand what u mean, i have also mentioned in op that many OEMs feel the need of some features that stock android doesnt have and they can add and they should obviously add them but amount of these features are really low, most of the features we see are just fancy features that show that they can also 'code'.
I know a bit about android ICS (stock) as i make themes for theme engine and i made roms earlier. Its divided into two parts or two UIs, one is the dark part or the dominating part that we see across ICS, the grey backgrounds with blue text, other is the light UI, that is the white backgrounds with blue and black text. I am also not a big fan of they grey part of the UI but the white part is just wonderful. Also no OEMs' ui i have seen is better than stock ICS UI so they are clearly making it worse.
I hope google go full on with their white/light UI in next version of android.
Also i agree to the fact that many required features that a consumer wants these days with software these days are lacking in stock android like some settings, options and features in camera app, that actually all consumers these day want. I have seen many nokia users who still buy nokia phones cause they have these small features to mess with in camera app. There are many things that android team have not thought of added in stock android, and i think the main reason for that is the fear of people declaring their OS as 'complicated' and non-user friendly.

What worse it can get. Now Gnexus may get banned.

From now on Google is going to allow OEMs to gain access to upcoming versions of Android sooner than the general public so that they can get updates out sooner.
OEM skins annoy me as well. Most people care more about the apps than the OEM skin and all these differences between carriers default skins creates some fragmentation. OEM bloatware that can't be uninstalled also annoys me but at least with ICS apps can now be hidden without rooting.

Good point.

spunker88 said:
From now on Google is going to allow OEMs to gain access to upcoming versions of Android sooner than the general public so that they can get updates out sooner.
OEM skins annoy me as well. Most people care more about the apps than the OEM skin and all these differences between carriers default skins creates some fragmentation. OEM bloatware that can't be uninstalled also annoys me but at least with ICS apps can now be hidden without rooting.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But still, Google is doing so that OEMs are ready to push updates along with Google. If Google is gonna give them new versions earlier we can assume they will give 1-2 months earlier and they will still be working on it so they will also give new source code later maybe 10-20 days earlier. So OEMs like Samsung or HTC who take 5-7 months for an update will still not be able to catch up with Google's announcements and updates.
Sent from my GT-I9000 using xda premium

I agree and disagree.. I never used stock roms until i purchased the droid razr. I know blur makes it look better and also realize that motorola has a **** ton of bloatware that i have to freeze but i've been happy with gingerbread and now the ics stock roms. I do however think that needs to include an option to root the device on the configuration when you first setup the device. I think it shouldn't have locked bootloaders or things like that because it is linux underneath the nice ui and you should be able to mod it the way you like without having to hack everything. Long story short, most stock roms do look like crap and are bloated but some do a good job.
Sent from my DROID RAZR using xda premium

Another thing I forgot about is carriers, they need to get their hands out of the software. My broadband ISP doesn't care what updates or OS I am running, they just provide me internet.
Ideally we would get all software upgrades from Google sort of like Windows, but I'm not sure if this is possible with Android. At least just let us update direct from the OEM, carriers shouldn't have to approve updates.

Guys support me and others who are with me and retweet #OmlyNexus and #****AndroidOEMs .

The OEMs don't care what you think, because they want you to run THEIR software - which they will be putting on their phones instead of Android eventually.
That's why Google is pushing their Nexus line to the next level, they know this to be true.
Look up Tizen and read about what Samsung is planning on doing.
With the open source nature of Linux, mfg's don't care about Android. That's why they are getting their customer's used to their "flavor" of Android, whether it be Sense UI or TouchWiz. They aren't spending all this time and money so that their developers can learn to make Android better.. they're getting ready to launch their own projects.
Google knows their time is limited as far as Android being the only major Linux player in the mobile phone business, and it's coming faster than people realize. Firefox, Tizen, Ubuntu.. just watch.
Half of these Android users won't even be on Android in two years, because they are loyal to HTC or Samsung, not Google.
Hence, the Nexus line.

ingenious247 said:
The OEMs don't care what you think, because they want you to run THEIR software - which they will be putting on their phones instead of Android eventually.
That's why Google is pushing their Nexus line to the next level, they know this to be true.
Look up Tizen and read about what Samsung is planning on doing.
With the open source nature of Linux, mfg's don't care about Android. That's why they are getting their customer's used to their "flavor" of Android, whether it be Sense UI or TouchWiz. They aren't spending all this time and money so that their developers can learn to make Android better.. they're getting ready to launch their own projects.
Google knows their time is limited as far as Android being the only major Linux player in the mobile phone business, and it's coming faster than people realize. Firefox, Tizen, Ubuntu.. just watch.
Half of these Android users won't even be on Android in two years, because they are loyal to HTC or Samsung, not Google.
Hence, the Nexus line.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually u r a bit wrong here. As people are getting more informed and educated about android they are getting to know it, once they know and love android. They won't buy a new Samsung device with tizen or bada in it. I live in India, people here are slowly starting to know about android. And as u all know India is not one of the developed countries, still if people can like and know android and be loyal to it then why can't other countries' people do the same. We are going into a new era, its not about hardware anymore, firmware comes first. Most of the companies are able to produce good hardware and mostly on a similar level, what matters is the software and OS.

bhu1 said:
Actually u r a bit wrong here. As people are getting more informed and educated about android they are getting to know it, once they know and love android. They won't buy a new Samsung device with tizen or bada in it. I live in India, people here are slowly starting to know about android. And as u all know India is not one of the developed countries, still if people can like and know android and be loyal to it then why can't other countries' people do the same. We are going into a new era, its not about hardware anymore, firmware comes first. Most of the companies are able to produce good hardware and mostly on a similar level, what matters is the software and OS.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'll have to respectfully disagree here.
When the Samsung GS4 or the next HTC flagship device comes out, no one is going to care if it's running Android or not, except die-hard Android fans. All they will care about is the new features that the phone offers. And the mfgs are smart, they will make their platform compatible with Android apps, allow Google Market (and others). Look at Amazon, guarantee they will have their own Linux dist. as well eventually
and in regard to "We are going into a new era, its not about hardware anymore, firmware comes first"
Uh, I don't think so. Minus the Nexus crowd, nobody buys their next phone because it is going to have JB, they buy it because it's going to have the newest/fastest dual/quad core, XXMp Camera, the newest 'smart' feature, the bigger screen, etc. Nobody ran out to buy the GS3 because it has ICS...
XDA is about 1-2% (if that) of Android users. And even on XDA, half of the users don't know enough about Android to even matter. Maybe it's somewhat different in India, but my guess is the people you are referring to are just starting to understand what Android/Linux really means, so that isn't really relevant to this discussion.

ingenious247 said:
I'll have to respectfully disagree here.
When the Samsung GS4 or the next HTC flagship device comes out, no one is going to care if it's running Android or not, except die-hard Android fans. All they will care about is the new features that the phone offers. And the mfgs are smart, they will make their platform compatible with Android apps, allow Google Market (and others). Look at Amazon, guarantee they will have their own Linux dist. as well eventually
and in regard to "We are going into a new era, its not about hardware anymore, firmware comes first"
Uh, I don't think so. Minus the Nexus crowd, nobody buys their next phone because it is going to have JB, they buy it because it's going to have the newest/fastest dual/quad core, XXMp Camera, the newest 'smart' feature, the bigger screen, etc. Nobody ran out to buy the GS3 because it has ICS...
XDA is about 1-2% (if that) of Android users. And even on XDA, half of the users don't know enough about Android to even matter. Maybe it's somewhat different in India, but my guess is the people you are referring to are just starting to understand what Android/Linux really means, so that isn't really relevant to this discussion.
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I don't think a die hard fan of a flagship phone from Samsung or HTC is gonna buy the new flagship phone if the company changes the OS. I know people care about hardware but that doesn't mean they go totally mad about it, not looking the software at all. Btw, play store access is only for Google/android phones.
Also, nobody bought Gs3 cause it just had a quad core or it had a 8mp camera. If Samsung had bada or maybe android 2.1 on it then believe me it would have been samsung's worst selling phone.
Edit: Will u buy a new i7 3rd Gen laptop if it had windows 2000 and a restriction that u can't change it??? For same price that u buy a normal i7 laptop or even higher.

Android marketing and the fragmentation argument

I just saw an ad on TV for an android device on one of the big us carriers (I forget which one) and it was really bad. It made me realize something I've never agreed with before: that indeed android fragmentation is a hinderence.
Hear me out. Obviously being an active xda member I'm pro-android, but most people with android devices aren't on xda and wont root or even use a different launcher. So that is why I realize carriers like Verizon or whoever have to show generic commercials with no or little focus on the actual operation system. Don't get me wrong, I'm not sticking up for the carriers, they are the ones that take forever to update android versions. But they don't have to. That's the "beauty" of android.
But this has never been more of an issue than right now, I argue. Android 4.2.x is excellent and beautiful. It is the first time an iPhone user could try android and actually feel like it could be in the same competition as iOS in terms of looks and general UI. Meanwhile only a very tiny percent of android users have the latest version.
So to bring it back around to the commercial I saw, which goes for pretty much all android commercials I've ever seen, they do not display android at all! Its always generic futuristic music and background fx and distractions. Meanwhile iOS always shows a closeup of the phone with a mere finger navigating the os.
The ironic thing is that android is better now! But carriers take months or a year to update so they can only advertise their ****ty versions of android which are always stale at the time so instead they just show the phone dancing to dubstep music in front of lightning. They should be showing how Google Now is already way better than siri, how the notification drop down was started by Android (taken by iOS) and is now beautiful and functional, and how the recents button has become essential, not just usable.
There should be a SHORT grace period for carriers to update to the newest version of Android. Only then will they realize that their biggest asset isn't their ability to have 20 different android phones, or their attempt at theming a ROM (sense, touchwiz), but you actually have the best operating system out now! You just don't have the latest version because you're a phone network company and not a software development company.
But I put the blame on android because surely they are able to have a bit more control over how the big carriers manipulate their os? Why wouldn't a company like Verizon want to display the freshest os and advertise that they have the newest version of android and will always be this first to update because they don't change a thing? They would advertise that if Google had some sort or mandate on update time periods. Then android wouldn't always be thought of as the poor mans iOS .
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus

The problem is, I don't think the average user - the one you're talking about - cares about "updates". They're just something annoying that happens and you have to restart your phone for a while. They don't care if it has the "newest" Android OS, just that it does what they want - this is the rest of my family feels, and even some of my friends who ARE interested in tech.
My dad couldn't give a crap if he has ICS or JB and wouldn't be able to tell the difference. If you put 4.2 in front of him, I doubt he could tell you the difference without spending half an hour hunting it down - and after that, I would question if the changes are anything he would actually care about. That kind of a user doesn't really WANT fast change - they care that things are familiar and easy to use, they don't want to have to re-learn parts of their phone in a few months - that's one thing I can give to iOS - as boring as it is, it's well, the same.
People have always said that one particular iteration of Android is when it's "finally ready to take on iOS". I think ICS is fine in that regard. iOS is so stylistically "stagnant" that Android really doesn't have to do much to match it. The advantage of iOS is that it's always the same, that it's not changing, that you can upgrade your phone hardware and still have everything work exactly the way you knew.
"Constantly updating" appeals to tech geeks who love learning new things and better ways to use them - and that's what the Nexus line is for - that's what flashing ROMs is for. People that want that find it.
Basically, your average Android phone shopper is Windows, not Linux. They're there because they want a phone that fits their needs and price-point - something Apple isn't offering. Sure, some people are Windows people for other reasons - but we're talking the average person who just wants a computer they can afford that "just works".
A good example is my mom - I just helped her buy a tablet. She was a little afraid of the idea of an Android tablet because she had no brand familiarity. She'd seen people using iPads to do what she wanted, and was worried because she'd never heard of ASUS and better knew Samsung as an appliance-maker. These ads, the most important thing they can do is just get people to recognise the name. There have been studies done on this, and it's true - getting people to know your brand's name is one of the best things you can do. That way, the "average Joe" goes into the store and thinks, "Hey, that's Samsung - I've heard of that" and the human brain tends to go, "I've heard of that, so it must be good" - true or not. They aren't looking at the specs and comparing, they're looking for a device they can trust. Trust starts with familiarity. The iPhone came from a company that already had name-recognition, but they grew that into a much larger market by using exclusivity and ease of use. It's like with liquor - people see an expensive liquor and assume that it must be a better liquor. Simply jacking up prices has totally worked for some brands to gain success. I'm not even kidding. People do this with expensive purses and jeans and crap, too - even if it's all made in the same exact Chinese factories.
Um.
Sorry for the novel.
tl;dr : Our brains are often illogical

sd0070 said:
Android 4.2.x is excellent and beautiful. It is the first time an iPhone user could try android and actually feel like it could be in the same competition as iOS in terms of looks and general UI.
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Android has been able to compete in looks and general UI since 4.0 IMO, and easily since 2.2 with Sense. Smoothness is a completely different factor, but the actual look and feel of Android has been decent for a while. iOS isn't even a UI anymore, it's an app launcher and that is all. You can't do anything at all in iOS outside of the apps, which is frankly pathetic. iOS works as Apple wants it to, Android works like you want it to.

As a developer I do think Android fragmentation is a huge issue. I agree that Android 4.0+ is nice looking and has some very nice API's however developing Android applications that run consistently accross different devices is very difficult. I find more and more that a good portion of my code ends up being wrappers and reflection calls to support API's and classes not found in previous Android versions. For example, If I want to add media player lock-screen controls to my application it's not a problem in Android 4.0+ but the class isn't available in versions below 4.0. So, what am I supposed to do? Do I release a version to the play store and say my application supports lock screen controls ONLY if you run a specific version of Android? That certainly won't ecourage people to use the application. Just my opinion.

I agree it can be a problem for development.
However, I think it's reasonable to say, "this feature will only work on 4.0+" - people are used to that, if you have a Windows 98 machine still, I hope you're not expecting to be able to run everything a Windows 7 machine could, for example. I see things like designations requiring XP/Vista/7, et cetera on packages - I don't think it's unreasonable that at some point Android is the same - you can only reasonably support so far back because at some point it's just not worth your time.
If it's possible to implement below 4.0 and it's worth your time to make it happen - that's the cost of business to decide if it's worth it or not to support the older devices based on what your market looks like.