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Hi everyone,
I am new here, I hope I get the xda-dev etiquette right, if not please tell me.
I am thinking about getting a TF700T as a replacement for my current (really old) notebook [I do normal computing on a desktop]. I will briefly describe what I had in mind and would be grateful for any comments on that. Please note that I am new to the whole Android thing, but that I am an experienced unix hacker, so I hope to learn the stuff quickly.
Why dualboot?
- it will replace a laptop
- for most things android will be the right thing, but in certain situations I want a full unix operating system
Which Android?
- I want a mod that has minimal amount of non-free software and good performance
- I don't mind if everything doesn't work perfectly right away and I don't mind twaeking around, but it should work somehow in the end
- I want encryption (is supposedly available in stock ICS already)
- I don't need any Google-Apps, I plan to use f-droid for applications
=> I thought about CM9 or CM10
Which second OS?
- Obviously GNU/Linux
- frequent updates and bleeding edge software
- no gimmicks, no useless stuff
=> Debian SID ARM?
What are your general thoughts on this?
Has anyone tried dual booting the TF700(t) yet? I read sth about an Ubuntu-dualboot on the TF300...
What are your thoughts on my choice of mod? Is it the right thing for my usecase?
What are your thoughts on my choice of Linux distribution? Did any of you see a native Debian ARM on a recent tablet?
Is there a recommended reading list for people who want to dive into this whole thing and not just follow step-by-step instructions to unlock/root/reflash their device? Like information about general boot-up process, partitioning etc
Thank you for your help!
h?2 said:
Hi everyone,
I am new here, I hope I get the xda-dev etiquette right, if not please tell me.
I am thinking about getting a TF700T as a replacement for my current (really old) notebook [I do normal computing on a desktop]. I will briefly describe what I had in mind and would be grateful for any comments on that. Please note that I am new to the whole Android thing, but that I am an experienced unix hacker, so I hope to learn the stuff quickly.
Why dualboot?
- it will replace a laptop
- for most things android will be the right thing, but in certain situations I want a full unix operating system
Which Android?
- I want a mod that has minimal amount of non-free software and good performance
- I don't mind if everything doesn't work perfectly right away and I don't mind twaeking around, but it should work somehow in the end
- I want encryption (is supposedly available in stock ICS already)
- I don't need any Google-Apps, I plan to use f-droid for applications
=> I thought about CM9 or CM10
Right now, we dont have an unlocked bootloader and as such we dont have roms. But when we do get them, CM9/10 would be an excelent choice since they're fully open source and google apps are optional. Pretty much any rom you find will support encryption since its a core feature of ICS.
Which second OS?
- Obviously GNU/Linux
- frequent updates and bleeding edge software
- no gimmicks, no useless stuff
=> Debian SID ARM?
Again, because we lack an unlocked bootloader, you cant run native linux yet. The closest we can get is a chroot environment, but its not flawless. Namely, Android has no native X server support, so if you wanted to run X applications the only way to do so would be through VNC which is kinda slow. Fast enough for text and menu heavy stuff, but dont even think of video or gaming.
Looking at the OG Transformer and the Transformer Prime as precedent though, I'd be surprised if we didnt get native linux at some point. Probably some flavor of Ubuntu, but if that runs I figure it wouldn't be that difficult to get Debian running.
What are your general thoughts on this?
Has anyone tried dual booting the TF700(t) yet? I read sth about an Ubuntu-dualboot on the TF300...
I'm actually planning on doing the same thing, sans no google apps. My old laptop is kinda heavy, so I relegated it to desktop duty and used an HP Touchpad for a while in its place. It worked decently, and I figure the TF700 will do a much better job from form factor alone.
The version of Linux on the TF300 or other Transformers wont work on the TF700 as the hardware is slightly different.
What are your thoughts on my choice of mod? Is it the right thing for my usecase?
Depends entirely on what you want to use your tablet for.
What are your thoughts on my choice of Linux distribution? Did any of you see a native Debian ARM on a recent tablet?
The Motorola Xoom and HP Touchpad both have nice looking debian ports. You're probably looking for hardware a little more recent though, I'm not really sure what your options are. Debian is a nice distribution with pretty good arm support, you cant really go wrong with it.
Is there a recommended reading list for people who want to dive into this whole thing and not just follow step-by-step instructions to unlock/root/reflash their device? Like information about general boot-up process, partitioning etc
I don't have an answer here... I'd actually like to know this myself!
Thank you for your help!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What I could answer, is in bold.
Jotokun said:
What I could answer, is in bold.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That was an extensive and quality answer. Nothing more to add, except that the OP is doing fine. Don't worry too much about etiquette; as long as the question posed is sincere, the harshest that could happen is your post being moved to another forum.
We don't bite (at least, not that hard).
Welcome!
Jotokun said:
What I could answer, is in bold.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you very much for the complete answer! I wasn't aware that the bootloader is still locked, while itsunlocked on the other transformers... Have there been any announcements or rumors from ASUS on if/when the unlock tool will arrive for the Infinity?
MartyHulskemper said:
We don't bite (at least, not that hard).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good to know
So no further reading hints? Maybe I should ask this one again in the general Android forums?
h?2 said:
Thank you very much for the complete answer! I wasn't aware that the bootloader is still locked, while itsunlocked on the other transformers... Have there been any announcements or rumors from ASUS on if/when the unlock tool will arrive for the Infinity?
Good to know
So no further reading hints? Maybe I should ask this one again in the general Android forums?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not yet, but the other Transformer devices got theirs about a month after launch, so we'll probably see one around mid to late August.
Please don't get a tablet to replace a notebook. If you must do so, please get an ipad instead so that when you come back to ***** about how your tablet doesn't feel like a laptop, it will be the iFans' problem not ours.
goodintentions said:
Please don't get a tablet to replace a notebook. If you must do so, please get an ipad instead so that when you come back to ***** about how your tablet doesn't feel like a laptop, it will be the iFans' problem not ours.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its called realistic expectations. For lightweight tasks it should be just fine. Obviously you're not going to compile code, edit video or play Crysis on it. For web browsing and lightweight office documents, it'll be fine. You also missed the part where he said he wanted to dual-boot which would indeed make it more of a true laptop functionality wise.
Jotokun said:
Its called realistic expectations. For lightweight tasks it should be just fine. Obviously you're not going to compile code, edit video or play Crysis on it. For web browsing and lightweight office documents, it'll be fine. You also missed the part where he said he wanted to dual-boot which would indeed make it more of a true laptop functionality wise.
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Click to collapse
Even with dual boot, at best it will feel like a netbook. Ever since the transformer first came out, I've seen dozens of people whine about how their transformer didn't feel like a laptop. Heck, I saw this even when the ipad was the only tablet in town. New ipad users would whine and whine and whine that the ipad didn't feel like a laptop. They bought the tablet with the attitude of using it like a notebook, and then the huge disappointment hits.
Just wait and see the same OP come back a couple months later whining to us how no matter what he tried he couldn't get his infinity to act like a notebook. Like I said, I've seen this before.
as the seconds OS, i'd love Windows 8...or RT
polish_pat said:
as the seconds OS, i'd love Windows 8...or RT
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Click to collapse
Win8 wont ever run because its made for x86 cpus, but someone might be able to hack WinRT onto it. I'll admit it'll probably be cool if it happens... but the locked down environment would be a bit of a deal killer for me.
goodintentions said:
Even with dual boot, at best it will feel like a netbook. Ever since the transformer first came out, I've seen dozens of people whine about how their transformer didn't feel like a laptop.
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Click to collapse
A Netbook experience is good enough for me. Like I pointed out, I do have a Quadcore-8GB-RAM Desktop that I use to work productively. Right now I have a DualCore-1.6Ghz-32Bit-Notebook, for mobile use, which has poor battery life and takes long to go on and off, and it is slowly falling apart (flickering screen once in a while). I don't even mind the performance on the device, I worry more about weight, long boot-up time, 1h20min battery life.This device and use-case I hope to replace.
Do you really think I will be dissappointed by the Infinity?
To sum up, what is important to me (many +s => more important):
- mail, browsing, instant-messaging ( +++ )
- contacts and calender (with sync) ( +++ )
- use a terminal / ssh ( +++ )
- not having to worry about battery life and cables, fast on and off ( +++ )
- watching videos while lying on the sofa ( ++ )
- looking at fotos on a nice screen ( ++ )
- reading some pdf files ( ++ )
- hacking some latex or some other small bits of code (can be compiled remotely aswell) ( + )
I couldn't care less about Gaming, Flash-Applications and fancy interface animations (I hope I can deactivate those if they slow things down).
I thought the Transformers would be pretty good at this. Especially the foto-thing with the nice screen resolution and all the mobility stuff, because, well its a tablet with a keyboard
I was mostly worried about the hackability of the device, i.e. being able to adapt the operating system to my workflow and such (thats why I am mostly interested in dualboot, because I know I can tweak a Debian to behave like I want it to). [1]
But if you guys think the transformer really is not good for my use cases, please tell me!
Thanks!
[1] The only slight worry I had about the hardware, is maybe the RAM not being to enough for regular Linux usage (really, considiring how inexpensive RAM is today, and how expensive the other stuff they put in, they could easily have put 2GB in the infinity and charged 10€ more).
h?2 said:
A Netbook experience is good enough for me. Like I pointed out, I do have a Quadcore-8GB-RAM Desktop that I use to work productively. Right now I have a DualCore-1.6Ghz-32Bit-Notebook, for mobile use, which has poor battery life and takes long to go on and off, and it is slowly falling apart (flickering screen once in a while). I don't even mind the performance on the device, I worry more about weight, long boot-up time, 1h20min battery life.This device and use-case I hope to replace.
Do you really think I will be dissappointed by the Infinity?
To sum up, what is important to me (many +s => more important):
- mail, browsing, instant-messaging ( +++ )
- contacts and calender (with sync) ( +++ )
- use a terminal / ssh ( +++ )
- not having to worry about battery life and cables, fast on and off ( +++ )
- watching videos while lying on the sofa ( ++ )
- looking at fotos on a nice screen ( ++ )
- reading some pdf files ( ++ )
- hacking some latex or some other small bits of code (can be compiled remotely aswell) ( + )
I couldn't care less about Gaming, Flash-Applications and fancy interface animations (I hope I can deactivate those if they slow things down).
I thought the Transformers would be pretty good at this. Especially the foto-thing with the nice screen resolution and all the mobility stuff, because, well its a tablet with a keyboard
I was mostly worried about the hackability of the device, i.e. being able to adapt the operating system to my workflow and such (thats why I am mostly interested in dualboot, because I know I can tweak a Debian to behave like I want it to). [1]
But if you guys think the transformer really is not good for my use cases, please tell me!
Thanks!
[1] The only slight worry I had about the hardware, is maybe the RAM not being to enough for regular Linux usage (really, considiring how inexpensive RAM is today, and how expensive the other stuff they put in, they could easily have put 2GB in the infinity and charged 10€ more).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry to push this, but I am really undecided after your previous comments and after having bought na Android phone that doesn't really make me happy software-wise.
Does anyone have more thoughts on this?
Thanks.
The TF700 running Android is fine for all of these and in my opinion better than netbook running Windows, but it's far less comfortable to do some pro Office stuff on it, although not impossible. I think you'll be fine for these, especially with the FHD screen (I read many pdfs and I like it much better on my Infinity) and a rooted device (ssh, term), offline sync (esp. with Google) is also the best under Android IMHO.
The bootloader can be unlocked now, but you'll have to do some research yourself for the Linux capabilities there.
h?2 said:
A Netbook experience is good enough for me. Like I pointed out, I do have a Quadcore-8GB-RAM Desktop that I use to work productively. Right now I have a DualCore-1.6Ghz-32Bit-Notebook, for mobile use, which has poor battery life and takes long to go on and off, and it is slowly falling apart (flickering screen once in a while). I don't even mind the performance on the device, I worry more about weight, long boot-up time, 1h20min battery life.This device and use-case I hope to replace.
Do you really think I will be dissappointed by the Infinity?
To sum up, what is important to me (many +s => more important):
- mail, browsing, instant-messaging ( +++ )
- contacts and calender (with sync) ( +++ )
- use a terminal / ssh ( +++ )
- not having to worry about battery life and cables, fast on and off ( +++ )
- watching videos while lying on the sofa ( ++ )
- looking at fotos on a nice screen ( ++ )
- reading some pdf files ( ++ )
- hacking some latex or some other small bits of code (can be compiled remotely aswell) ( + )
I couldn't care less about Gaming, Flash-Applications and fancy interface animations (I hope I can deactivate those if they slow things down).
I thought the Transformers would be pretty good at this. Especially the foto-thing with the nice screen resolution and all the mobility stuff, because, well its a tablet with a keyboard
I was mostly worried about the hackability of the device, i.e. being able to adapt the operating system to my workflow and such (thats why I am mostly interested in dualboot, because I know I can tweak a Debian to behave like I want it to). [1]
But if you guys think the transformer really is not good for my use cases, please tell me!
Thanks!
[1] The only slight worry I had about the hardware, is maybe the RAM not being to enough for regular Linux usage (really, considiring how inexpensive RAM is today, and how expensive the other stuff they put in, they could easily have put 2GB in the infinity and charged 10€ more).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I personally think its great for those use cases. I am a developer and I use it for remote development all the time via SSH.
I would not buy it if you expect to run Debian or any other Linux distribution on the tablet natively. It is more difficult to get Linux running that it would seem. This is especially true if you want a responsive UI because 2D accel is usually difficult. Without 2D acceleration then the already slow CPU will be bogged down just trying run the display. All that said, it is quite possible that we may get Linux running well on the TF700(I plan to work on this myself at some point) but I wouldn't count on it.
I was in the same boat as you but I actually find I rarely want/need a true GNU Linux set up on my Transformer. Much of what I would have used I wind up doing it via SSH. If you really needed to do it locally you could use a chroot.
dalingrin said:
I would not buy it if you expect to run Debian or any other Linux distribution on the tablet natively. It is more difficult to get Linux running that it would seem. This is especially true if you want a responsive UI because 2D accel is usually difficult. Without 2D acceleration then the already slow CPU will be bogged down just trying run the display. All that said, it is quite possible that we may get Linux running well on the TF700(I plan to work on this myself at some point) but I wouldn't count on it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It looks like (binary ) drivers for X11 are available from nvidia and on their way into Debian:
http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=634100
So UI should be responsive with both 2d and 3d accel...
I was in the same boat as you but I actually find I rarely want/need a true GNU Linux set up on my Transformer. Much of what I would have used I wind up doing it via SSH. If you really needed to do it locally you could use a chroot.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have a device now, and I am not too happy with the software, e.g. there is no proper Free Software email client. K-9 mail is only designed for phones and the tablet version by the same people is proprietary.
I definitely want to persue the native dual boot plan. If you are also interested in this, maybe we can team up?
Other than that I am still waiting for CM builds, although I am unsure if they will actually improve the experience.
The hardware of the tf700t is really great, though, I absolutely love the display, the keyboard is ok, too and battery life is top notch.
It's probably not what you want.
This may look like a rant, but I am writing this more as a cautionary tale so others can avoid making the mistake I did.
I'm the kind of person who obsessively researches everything before buying. When I bought the TF700, I made a very thorough search for features and drawbacks. I was aware that the RAM was not upgradeable, and that was fine by me. I saw the wifi and microSD slot issues the prime is plagued with - wifi coverage being a top priority for me along with battery life, and a safe SD card slot crucial if I was going to have just 32GB of internal storage), and I concluded the Infinity was a safer choice, even if I didn't care for the better screen. I was aware the processor had a different architecture, but linux runs on ARM and so does windows 8. What I was not aware of, because I did not even think it could work like this, is that this not a computer.
I really can't stress this enough. This is not a computer. There's no plain old bios, no freedom to partition your drive as you wish and installing whatever OS you damn well please. After plenty of bad experiences with warranties, I won't risk voiding it to unlock the bootloader (and a two-year warranty at that - the joys of being european), and even if I did, all I've recently read on dual booting gives me the impression of it being awkward and cumbersome to use - no friendly neighbourhood grub configuring, and way more firmware flashing than I'm comfortable with.
If you DON'T want to risk voiding your warranty, expect plenty of headaches trying to get linux running inside android , a non upgradeable linux image, and an unusable graphical interface. What was said about it being slow but okay for menu heavy stuff? It's not. Not, at least, if you plan on using a programming IDE like eclipse, it isn't. I spent the whole day today looking for VNC alternatives and trying to get RDP or X11 Forwarding to work (there is a basic X server android port which works with connectbot, after all), but getting the X server to start from the mounted ubuntu image has proven to be beyond my knowledge.
In short this has proven to be for me just an expensive web browsing toy, definitely more expensive than what I can afford if it's not going to be a true workstation. The worst part? It's a pretty awesome toy at that, and if fnac will let me exchange it, it will be pretty hard for me to part with it. I still love the TF700 for what it is, but I can't afford this and a new computer.
At first this looks like a laptop, quacks like a laptop... but won't really swim or fly. So, if you need more than web browsing, movie watching and document editing, save yourself the trouble and the hurt.
I disagree with the people saying that you would not be happy with the TF700.
It is obviously true that the Infinity is not a laptop. It's not even a "proper" netbook, as most people would assume a netbook has an x86 processor. Saying that it will outright not satisfy someone is illogical, though. Just because h?2 mentioned that he wishes to replace a laptop doesn't mean that (s?)he is immediately not going to be able to accomplish the tasks that he planned to use a laptop for with the TF700.
I had a standard sort of Asus EeePC netbook for a few months and then began playing with Android tablets. I ended up settling on the original Transformer tablet with its keyboard dock. The things I was using the netbook for were immediately taken over by the Transformer, and after having not used my netbook for 4 months, I just gave it to my mother. The tablet was good enough for browsing the web (and with Chrome browsing has gotten significantly better than it had been when I first got the tablet), staying on top of email in almost real-time, music, my video library, Netflix and Hulu, and keeping track of my servers via SSH.
I have settled on some apps that I'll suggest to you for some of the things you are trying to accomplish:
Maildroid - This is the only e-mail client that meets all of my needs - Free
Better Terminal Emulator Pro (BTEP) - This is an amazing terminal client and SSH client... worth every penny!! - $3.99 (USD)
Chrome - Every Android browser had at least one issue that I hate. Chrome has changed that, and I use it exclusively - Free
TeamViewer - This is one of the easiest to use remote GUI clients available, and it works with Linux and Windows - Free for non-commercial use
TeamViewer isn't perfect... it isn't free open-source software, but it gives me fantastic control of my Windows PC without forcing my session to log off when I log in remotely with remote desktop. Remote desktop on Win 7 Ultimate does strange things and does not allow multiple users to log in the same way it does on Windows Server 2008 R2. TeamViewer allows me to take advantage of my tremendously powerful home desktop PC (with a Core i7-3930K) and all its virtual machines when I need to do some real computing.
BTEP is the absolute best terminal and SSH client program that I have found, and I have tested pretty much every one that was available a year ago. It allows you to use the tablet itself as if it is a minimalist GNU/Linux machine, which comes in handy more often that you might think, assuming you are used to the Linux command line. The SSH client is also great, and supports key pair authentication. I IRC from my Linode (a Linux VPS company) VPS, and BTEP allows me to bind the volume and a few other buttons to normal keyboard buttons. I can use the volume buttons to send the key bindings for F1 and F2, which are bound to previous and next window in IRSSI. It is useless for most people, but the fact that they put the thought into supporting that tells you something about their forethought when developing this software. It is one of only a very few apps that I decided were worth spending money on.
With the combination of TeamViewer and BTEP, I have access to all the computing and network resources that I could ever need. I often use TeamViewer if there is a pressing reason to use Firefox on my desktop rather than the tablet's mobile browser. I can also remotely work with LibreOffice if I need to do anything that I don't feel Polaris Office can handle. I don't even have the temptation to bother installing Ubuntu on my tablet because I simply don't need that functionality. I can get everything done that I need using Android and the apps available in the Google Play market.
So, yeah, a tablet is not a laptop, but sometimes a tablet is all you really need. It sounds a lot like h?2 doesn't need much more than a tablet with a nice physical keyboard. Tweaking the tablet to run or dual-boot Debian is something that may not even need to be done, but he can certainly take on that challenge because he might find it fun!
IT Wannabe;32653963Tweaking the tablet to run or dual-boot Debian is something that may not even need to be done said:
Certainly, but don't forget the bit about losing the warranty if you unlock the bootloader. I for one don't like gambling hundreds of euros that way.
You raised an excellent point there: if one needs to do some actual development but doesn't mind a) requiring a second machine always connected and b) requiring to always be online in order to work, then it's okay. That is not my case though. Even if I don't require a great deal of computing power, I do require a true workstation, and the ability to work offline. If those are dealbreakers for the OP, he will indeed be better off avoiding making the mistake I did.
Oh - and from my experience tweaking, much like cooking, stops being fun once you have no other choice but doing it. (Right now, for instance, I'm tearing my hear out getting the wifi to work again after rooting. I guess I'll just reset everything to stock and return it to fnac before my month is due.)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, T-Mobile US finally announced the next higher-end QWERTY phone, and it looks to be a disappointment ...
http://www.tmonews.com/2012/09/t-mobile-announces-the-galaxy-s-relay-4g-qwerty-keyboard-and-all/
Running on their HSPA+ 42Mbps network, the Relay 4G sports a full 5-row sliding QWERTY keyboard, 1.5GHz dual-core Qualcomm Snapdragon S3 processor, 800 x 480 Super AMOLED display, 5 megapixel rear camera, 1.3 megapixel front-facing camera, 1GB of RAM and more.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Considering the rumors originally called for a 720p screen and an S4 processor, there are bloggers everywhere already taking a **** all over this phone. And who can blame them? With these specs, this looks very much like a device that should've been released at least a year ago.
But wait! I'm not done yet ... There's something very interesting on Samsung's website that shows the specs for this device:
http://www.samsung.com/us/mobile/cell-phones/SGH-T699DABTMB-specs
Processor Speed, Type // 1.5GHz, ARMv7, MSM8260A
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Click to collapse
The MSM8260A? That's not an S3 chipset folks, that's S4! Now granted, it's very easy for someone to have made a mistake on the website- maybe they meant to put MSM8260 and not MSM8260A. That one little letter makes a HUGE difference though. David of tmonews.com is trying to get clarification from T-Mobile. Even if he can't get a for-sure answer, the phone is out in a week, so we'll know then.
Maybe us QWERTY lovers won't get a 720p screen yet, but maybe, JUST MAYBE, we can enjoy a phone with an up-to-date processor. Fingers crossed!
On top of everything else it's ugly
Eh, I wouldn't say it's ugly. Maybe not beautiful, but not ugly. Besides, I could give a **** about looks as long as it's a 5-row qwerty phone that is useable and performs well with decent specs. The processor will make the difference between disappointment and decent.
Sent from my SGH-T989 using xda app-developers app
It's not the best looking phone I've ever seen, but I'd be willing to give the keyboard a shot.
It doesn't matter, the 5mp camera was such a blow to me that I crossed it off immediately. Screen is also still too small, will there ever be another qwerty to compete with the 4.3 inch photon q?
Sent from my DROID2 using xda premium
I miss having a keyboard sometimes. If you get a huge enough screen (like the gs3) for example and use it in landscape mode to type its not all that bad! I think I'm over having a keyboard now. Thanks gs3!
Should be quad core
Just going to make the phone bulkier and heavier. Not for me
LOL, this was moved to Q&A? I guess technically the title of the thread IS a question, but that was rhetorical, as I have both of the possible answers already there. The point of the thread was more to discuss the possible processors ... oh well, mods will be mods. Gotta use them powers, right? And who can be bothered to actually read the post before moving it on a huge site like this?
Anyway, after having tried both the One S and the Galaxy S II, I can safely say I prefer a phone with a slightly smaller screen and a keyboard. It would've been nice if Samsung could've put a qHD screen in there at least, but I can make due with my usual 800x480. And just think- if the spec page is right, this thing will be as smooth as butter with the S4 only powering this low a resolution! Can't wait to test drive it <3
Oh, that reminds me- I'm planning to go into a T-Mobile store to take a look at one next week. If we don't get a definitive answer on the SOC by then, what app can I use to easily identify it? There ya go, now this thread belongs in Q&A Thanks, guys!
Well, nevermind! T-Mobile just confirmed that we have a S4 chip in this baby! Now to start requesting a forum for this phone and feigning surprised anger when it doesn't get one
Well does anyone know if it works properly in the European network? The frequencies working bode well! I'm trying a smartphone with keyboard. If I had not seen this phone fortuitously ... I would have bought a droid3. Droid4 is lte and here it does not work!
I hope it will be possible to buy it without a contract for import. I think that will not come in Europe. sigh
We benchmarked one today and it got 5100 in quadrant and on es taiji it got 56 fps. Its defiantly the S4. Its smooth as hell too and the keyboard is really easy to use.
Projectsk26 said:
We benchmarked one today and it got 5100 in quadrant and on es taiji it got 56 fps. Its defiantly the S4. Its smooth as hell too and the keyboard is really easy to use.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the info
w00t!
Picked this phone up today at a local T-Mobile store. I had to go to two stores to find one in stock.
Already rooted it.
[email protected]:~/relay$ sudo ./adb shell
[email protected]:/ $ su
[email protected]:/ #
Using Odin 3.07 I flashed the SGS3 CWM image. The LCD in recovery doesn't work, but adb certainly does! After that I had root, it was easy enough to adb push a su binary over, then copy it to the system partition.
The interface for the phone feels very gimmicky, I hope to put some kind of AOSP or CM on it.
Went to a T-Mobile mall store, they had five in stock for opening day, and I was the second buyer by 2pm. I agree with the slightly cheaper feel of the Galaxy S Relay 4G vs the G2, but the keyboard is a lot more spacious and I'm really digging the 5 rows and real 4-way arrow keys. And hardware-accessible curly braces!
With the stock out of the box device, I was not able to reproduce Cyvillian's simple "su" root from adb shell, but perhaps I need to first run a utility -- Cyvillian, can you volunteer how you got the su binary onto the device?
Nitpicks that I wouldn't return the device over:
1) A few apps have problems with widget size: Pure Messenger Widget, Weatherbug, Hanping Chinese Pro. They seem to get marked as being one row higher than they should, and the widget ends up floating in the middle of a larger-than-needed space with no vertical resizing ability. For example, a 1x1 widget ends up taking 1x2 space, as does a 4x2 widget takes up 4x3 space.
2) The power key is hard to access when the slider is open, and it barely protrudes enough to locate and press it by touch. It might be tough for a gloved hand to wake it back up without closing the slider (yes I have a pair with conductive glovetips).
3) There are some special text entry functions for the control keys (tested in GMail client), but it doesn't all make sense. Shift+left/right does texting highlighting a character at a time. Alt+left/right == home/end. Alt+up/down == pgup/pgdn. Shift+del == delete (not backspace). Alt+del and Shift+alt+del both erase the entire current line of text. That's all great stuff, and then you get to these weird behaviors. Shift+alt+up/dn both do the same thing, which is to select all text to the left of the cursor, and all previous lines to the top of the text box. Shift+alt+right will select all text on the current line only. But shift+alt+left will erase your entire current line of text, and replace it with a semicolon! Shift+enter == enter, alt+enter does nothing, and shift+alt+enter highlights everything from the cursor to the end of the current line.
4) The voice recognition keyboard button is poorly placed right next to the Enter key.
5) I agree with previous posters that the screen washes out about the same as the G2 in bright daylight, and that the slide action has to be applied in a perfectly horizontal motion to get a smooth open. G2 owners will need a little retraining, but keep in mind that the G2 is just as picky about how it gets opened...
XDA admins, when will this new phone get its own forum? Perhaps move this thread there?
How about spending a nickel on a sticker?
While its great that its been confirmed by Samsung/T-Mobile/Qualcomm, that the Relay has an S4 processor.
It would have been worth the $.05 in printing and labor to put a sticker on the brand new box covering S3 to correctly read S4.
They put a giant sticker on the box that says "$50.00 restocking fee". Why not fix one of the key features printed incorrectly?
Projectsk26 said:
We benchmarked one today and it got 5100 in quadrant and on es taiji it got 56 fps. Its defiantly the S4. Its smooth as hell too and the keyboard is really easy to use.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Since the S4 is a quad core...this phone is a quad core, right?
EpicMikeNC said:
Since the S4 is a quad core...this phone is a quad core, right?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
no.
S4 comes in dual and quad core flavours.
this is dual.
also, there are no quad core qwerty sliders.
Braccoz said:
no.
S4 comes in dual and quad core flavours.
this is dual.
also, there are no quad core qwerty sliders.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Drat. Well thanks for the answer. :good:
Trying to decide to get this or the S4 with a bluetooth keyboard. Though the Relay 4G not having a mass storage option bothers me. Though I suppose you can take the SD card out and put it in the computer to add media that way.
Not sure if you saw it, but Engadget has a post today about the Infinity.
http://www.engadget.com/2013/02/17/hwyc-transformer-pad-infinity/
Fix the memory issue, USB 3.0 on the dock, better camera, stereo speakers and speakers on the dock. Maybe a wireless charging pad. AND FIX THE QUALITY ISSUES!!!!!!!!!
Sent from my ASUS Transformer Pad TF700T using Tapatalk HD
I think the quality control is the biggest issue here. But as for the tablet, ideal world ; tegra 4 2gb ram and real stereo sound XD
Sent from my Xperia S using XDA Premium HD app
Better build quality concerning the docking system, stereo speakers on the front side of the tablet, better storage (not necessarily more (the amount of RAM seems fine) but faster and more reliable).
Ahh...
I don't know...there's always higher, smarter, bigger, better...
Probably:
6 month no questions asked warranty
Rubberized back and edges
Not quite so thin
Full sized SD slot on tablet
Full sized USB 3.0 capable port on tablet
Charge thru USB port with any 5 volt USB brick
12 MP low light capable camera
Removable back for battery replacement
front-facing speakers and windowed multitasking would make me pretty happy, aside from the obvious lag fix.
fortunz said:
front-facing speakers and windowed multitasking would make me pretty happy, aside from the obvious lag fix.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They make one of those already its called a Samsung galaxy note 10.1
Sent from my EVO using xda premium
scataldo721 said:
They make one of those already its called a Samsung galaxy note 10.1
Sent from my EVO using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, but it would be nice anyway to make a fully loaded tablet known as the TF700 to be able to include such features from the Galaxy Note 10.1. I can't stress enough how much I want to be able to get windowed multitasking on this tablet so college life could be of much convenience.
Pretty much what I want to change is already summed by most of you who posted in this thread. lol Better camera, front facing speakers, more RAM, multitasking, etc.
Since everyone has already mentioned almost everything that should be fixed about the tf700, let me add a different note: how about the newly introduced Ubuntu for tablet? The idea behind it is pretty awesome, one OS for all devices, from phones, tablets to desktops. If Canonical can pull this off, it will create a new future for Linux.
Storage obviously,
Nvflash or even better fastboot support
And a better connection between tablet and dock.
Make it thicker and include the following:
larger internal battery
real USB connector on the tablet itself
put all connectors in one place (bottom preferably)
"rubberized" finish (like my DroidX2)
More, faster RAM
I've never been a fan of any integrated flash memory, those chips fail, make it replaceable.
FULL SIZE SD slot on the tablet itself.
put decent speakers in the keyboard dock, f the ones on the tablet itself. the only thing that EVER had good built-in speakers were those giant rear-projection big-screen TVs.
2.4ghz and 5ghz WiFi (an external antenna connector would be AMAZING too)
enough of these proprietary dock connectors, break it down to multiple simple PROVEN designs. wanna have something special for a dock, make it surface contacts and not something that penetrates the chassis of the device... this is just as dumb as crApple and Scamsung's designs.
However, I do LOVE that this thing is made of metal and takes abuse very well (It still blows me away that people complain about them falling apart, maybe I got lucky, maybe the WW sku tablets are held to a higher standard than the US sku? cause I have ABUSED the hell out of mine and it has not given me any grief from a physical hardware standpoint. It has been through extreme heat, extreme cold, it gets dropped on hard surfaces (I use it as an ALLDATA reader through VNC when I'm workin on vehicles and it looks as beat up as your average shop's snapon brick)
I/O issues fixed would be a huge priority number one. I can't even transfer files on to a USB flash drive, everything freezes up, it's rediculous.
Other than that, I'm very happy with it. I'd take a USB 3.0 port, give me wireless A, bluetooth 4.0 and front facing speakers if I had a choice.
wifesabitch said:
I/O issues fixed would be a huge priority number one. I can't even transfer files on to a USB flash drive, everything freezes up, it's rediculous.
Other than that, I'm very happy with it. I'd take a USB 3.0 port, give me wireless A, bluetooth 4.0 and front facing speakers if I had a choice.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You still having I/O issues with Cromi?
Soul TKR said:
You still having I/O issues with Cromi?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's a hardware problem you can make it better with tweaks but it will never go away fully.
Nebucatnetzer said:
It's a hardware problem you can make it better with tweaks but it will never go away fully.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Damn
scataldo721 said:
They make one of those already its called a Samsung galaxy note 10.1
Sent from my EVO using xda premium
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
At which point I'd be posting in a "how would you change the GNote 10.1 thread" with "1080p and a sleek wired keyboard dock with bonus battery life". Except not really, because I wouldn't have bought a 149 ppi tablet in the first place, even if it did have a real dock. Windowed multitasking is a lot more practical with a decent resolution, and a lot more useful to me personally with my trusty keyboard.
Soul TKR said:
You still having I/O issues with Cromi?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I do, at least transfering to a USB stick. Doesn't matter what file explorer I'm using, it freezes up the device.
Tried using different flash drives, same result.
wifesabitch said:
I do, at least transfering to a USB stick. Doesn't matter what file explorer I'm using, it freezes up the device.
Tried using different flash drives, same result.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Which kernel are you using?
Windowz 8
sbdags said:
Which kernel are you using?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Whatever the default option is (I'm on the lastest version, just haven't updated my sig).
I had this problem but I even unlocked, nothing has really changed for me.
has anyone attempted building their own android (arm cpu) pc? i imagine it'll be a lot more flexible than what's on the market.
Yep and still working on it, see the links in the signature. I've a guide and a few scripts to make additional modifications easier.
I also saw you had a question on connecting a Bluetooth USB to Android TV box. Can you be a bit more specific and informative with your questions? Perhaps version numbers and other info to nerow down what hardware you're playing with and steps you've already tried. Likely it's a driver issue.
Sent from either my SPH-D700 or myTouch3Gs
Debian Kit/QEMU Linux Install guide for all android devices that I'm writing:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2240397
Now have working Installers for ARM Java 7 JDK + Maptools + jMonkey
I have never thought of. lol!
brookeaidan said:
I have never thought of. lol!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It works great for some uses and considering some of the good devices from a year or more ago are fairly cheep it's a low cost way of computing with some fun extras. Just picked up a replacement Epic 4G for less than $50 with shipping and it runs everything I throw at it... for the most part.
Just got a USB on the go (otg) adapter, now just saving up for the Y splitter and then I'll be able to plug a keypad and mouse into my epic, from there I'll be looking into cheep 10"+ screens and a way to power it all. From there it'll be easy to case it all into my old briefcase and have a portable PC made of an old cellphone that runs for days with the amount of left over space I may end up putting a bunch of them (cellphones) linked together so they'll share processing power.
Eventually all this will end up in the guide I've been writing and portable cloud servers will be an easy process to build and play with. I've been reading up on Openstack and a few others to try out.
If I get people backing me I may end up incorporating a projector into the mix and show how to set up a media center off the same set up. Which would allow for easy portable mass entertainment. I've been following developments in laser pico-projectors which aren't to expensive and have great battery life. Furthermore for testing / "proof of concept" I've an old DPL projector that requires a new bulb and USB to VGA adapter to play with what I'm planning.
By the end of this build the project should cost a few hundred dollars but should provide much in the way of new development in mobile computing applications and fun/entertainment for others.
Most of the parts are very cheep, less than $10, but a few are a bit spendy; devices off ebay <$70, keyboard and mouse <$50, USB adapters <$10 each, a larger screen is a bit variable but shouldn't cost more than $100 or a pico projector for around $200 for a variable screen size 5" to 100"
I've been working on the debugging and software side of things for sometime now only need a few more parts to make it all one unit.
Let me know if ya all want to help out or have design/feature requests
Sent from either my SPH-D700 or myTouch3Gs
Debian Kit/QEMU Linux Install guide for all android devices that I'm writing:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2240397
Now have working Installers for ARM Java 7 JDK + Maptools + jMonkey
Hi,
Has anybody found a good clamshell keyboard that would fit the Pixel C? I mean keyboards that have a hinge at the back where you fit the tablet and then can close it like a notebook, and, most importantly, change the angle any way you see fit.
My old Asus TF101 had one, my old Asus ZD 300C too: http://www.amazon.co.uk/ASUS-ZenPad...F8&qid=1458037706&sr=8-2&keywords=asus+zd300c
Currently I am using on the Pixel C a Caseflex one (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Caseflex-Bl...&qid=1458037593&sr=8-2&keywords=caseflex+ipad) that I had for an iPad Air 2 (that is now back at Apple), it fits in the hinges, but is about 1.5cm too tall, does not go to sleep when I close it, and the Apple keyboard is weird.
So I am looking for a clamshell keyboard either for the Pixel C (don't think there is one yet), or a universal one for Android. Heck, I barely need the keyboard as such, I'd settle for a stand with a hinge that I can put on my belly/torso then adjust the angle (I've been bedridden for 1.5 months with 2+ to go). A folio type won't work within these constraints.
Are you avoiding the official Portfolio Keyboard for any reason in particular? That or the metal keyboard would most likely fit your requirements and can be bought direct from Google's website:
Metal Keyboard: https://store.google.com/product/pixel_c_keyboard
Folio Case Keyboard: https://store.google.com/product/pixel_c_folio_keyboard
The folio type keyboards, as well as the official one (not exactly folio, more like the logitech one) have many "problems" as far as I'm concerned:
They have 1 or at best 2 angles, compared to anything between 0 and 130+.
I can't imagine lying down and keeping a folio type keyboard properly balanced on my torso/belly, nor rolling on one side without it falling apart
The ones that look like the official one cannot be opened or closed as easily and quickly as a notebook-type clamshell KB
Besides they cost 100€+ more than the clamshell types, which typically go for about 30€. That's way too much money for too much inconvenience.
Fair enough, I just didn't see any reference to the official ones in your opening post so thought I'd suggest it
I use mine for business when I'm sat at a desk so I just USB hub and keyboard it. I have a folio case which keeps it at more-or-less the right angle.
I loved my TF101, if the Pixel C had the dock of the TF101 this would be the perfect device!
I'm reviving this instead of making a new thread. Has anyone found anything yet? I found a bunch on Amazon for the iPad 4 and I noticed that the Pixel C almost has the exact dimensions of the iPad 4.
iPad 4: 241.2 x 185.7 x 9.4 mm
Pixel C: 242 x 179 x 7 mm
I think something like this would be awesome, it would be even better if it had a trackpad, but I rarely use the one on my current bluetooth keyboard anyway.
I have the official Folio keyboard case, but only use it when travelling since it lacks a full keyboard.
Neofit26 said:
The folio type keyboards, as well as the official one (not exactly folio, more like the logitech one) have many "problems" as far as I'm concerned:
They have 1 or at best 2 angles, compared to anything between 0 and 130+....That's way too much money for too much inconvenience.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Out of interest have you used or played with the official Metal Keyboard?
If it just costs to much that's fair enough however mine never leaves the tablet now and once you get used to the magnetic snap it is very quick to setup.
It works at pretty much any angle I could want and also due to the solid case will balance the Pixel anywhere.
Much like the situation you describe I do have it lying on me in bed etc.
Lastly it matches the Pixel perfectly and protects the screen although there is obviously no protection to the back of the device etc.
I got the keyboard as I wanted to use it from some work stuff as well however as above I never have them apart as I find it so practical.
Bluetooth issues have been resolved now and the connection I experience is very good.
Let me know if you want to know anything else about it but from owning one for a year or so from release I am very happy with it.
The metal keyboard from google is very nice. The magnetic attachment is VERY strong. There is no way it would ever fall apart when using it to type unless you are really trying to separate it. You could probably drop it on the ground and it would stay together. You can set it at any angle from vertical to flat. Its convenient as you can attach it to the screen like a clamshell or you can attach it to the back of the tablet.
You do need to align the magnetic layout with the top of the keyboard being attached to the bottom of the tablet. It will stick the other way as well but nowhere near as strong. When using it as a clamshell it is small and looks very nice.
I was thinking of picking this one up for when I need to do more typing on my Pixel.
That looked perfect until I realized it wasn't a case and there's no real way to secure the tablet, which scares me since I mostly use it on my lap and not a table.
Volvoash said:
Out of interest have you used or played with the official Metal Keyboard?
If it just costs to much that's fair enough however mine never leaves the tablet now and once you get used to the magnetic snap it is very quick to setup.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I actually have the Folio keyboard but the problem is that it lacks "less frequently used" (escape, ` ~ | \ { } etc...) keys and I partially use my tablet to interface with my Linux server over SSH and not having those keys is a real pain in the butt. To remedy that, I purchased a full-sized bluetooth keyboard with a trough that the tablet sits in, but the problem is that it's not easily portable.
I fear my only hope will be to either wait until someone releases a good spec'd Chromebook with a detachable screen, or buy a Microsoft Surface and remove secure boot now that the key has been leaked (by Microsoft! hahahha) and install either Android x86 or full-blown Linux. The latter would be preferable since the Surface 4 can be a little beast but they also cost over a grand which in the grand scheme of things is only about $400-$500 more than the Pixel and you get a massively more powerful system.
Yeah I get that. I SSH quite a bit and need to | to grep or include items and it means I have to keep pressing the '...' button to bring up the software symbols.
At the end of the day its not my main work device so it suits me fine but I can imagine it being annoying if you try and use it for that.
Although a lot of people think my Pok3r keyboard is stupid but I am now just used to Fn'ing' keys and sometimes find myself trying to do it on my tenkeyless at home
We have shortcuts
Volvoash said:
Yeah I get that. I SSH quite a bit and need to | to grep or include items and it means I have to keep pressing the '...' button to bring up the software symbols.
At the end of the day its not my main work device so it suits me fine but I can imagine it being annoying if you try and use it for that.
Although a lot of people think my Pok3r keyboard is stupid but I am now just used to Fn'ing' keys and sometimes find myself trying to do it on my tenkeyless at home
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Any reason you don't use the on keyboard shortcuts? https://support.google.com/pixel/answer/6326992?hl=en
... + O or P for []
... + shift + O or P for {}
... + = for \
... + shift + = for |
... + 2 for `
... + shift + 2 for ~
... + 1 for escape
tyman4444 said:
Any reason you don't use the on keyboard shortcuts? https://support.google.com/pixel/answer/6326992?hl=en
... + O or P for []
... + shift + O or P for {}
... + = for \
... + shift + = for |
... + 2 for `
... + shift + 2 for ~
... + 1 for escape
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Only because when I first looked them up they didn't work on a UK Pixel C keyboard. Logged a call with Google support and they were like, ah well.
And trying them now in Google Keep they don't work for me.
So either there is a setting I'm missing or they only work on a US layout etc
Volvoash said:
Only because when I first looked them up they didn't work on a UK Pixel C keyboard. Logged a call with Google support and they were like, ah well.
And trying them now in Google Keep they don't work for me.
So either there is a setting I'm missing or they only work on a US layout etc
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Fair enough. I mean, they aren't as great as real keys anyways. They do not function in some apps, specifically RDP. Pulling up the software keyboard is a pain too.