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This is just a PSA to all you vicious Android fanboys on this forum that hound anyone who asks the question "what phone should I get", especially when one of those options includes an iOS device or a WP7 device.
So let me get this started. I love Android. But Android is not perfect. Take a deep breath, and say it with me again, out loud.
"Android is not perfect." Was that too hard? If so the following explanation is for you.
Ever since Android first came out, people were hailing it as the iPhone killer. But in reality? It's really not. It may be getting there, and may be getting there quickly, but that's not that point.
It may be a surprise to many of you, but there are actually other human beings outside of XDA that use smartphones. Human beings that are not interested in rooting their phones or spending a lot of time completely customizing them or pushing them to the limit. These human beings want their phones to work when they need them, and that's all. Whether these phones are iOS, Android, or Windows Mobile/7 phones is completely irrelevant to them.
Except, it actually is. But see, not in the way most of you seem to think it is.
People shop for phones nowadays because the have an end they need to reach and they need the means to get to that end. Whether it's something as simple as checking an email message or quenching a thirst to play a game, they take into consideration what is the quickest, most hassle-free way to do this. This requirement is not because they are stupid. Most XDA users seem to think that anyone off XDA just buys iPhones because they are uneducated about "the true power of Android" and all that jazz. Guess what? That's not the case.
Yes. Here at XDA, we can do a lot with our phones. We root them, we build custom ROMs for them, we use features that were locked before, or get versions of our OS that aren't out yet.
But please be damn sure you understand that we are the minority. We will always be the minority. Your experience here doesn't define the mobile landscape, it only improves your personal experience with your phone. Just because you took a few hours to root your phone, find the perfect custom ROM, and settle down with it doesn't make the average Joe who just bought an iPhone (because it does what he wants easily and has all the apps he likes) a stupid user.
Here is the meat of this newsflash; Android wouldn't be here if it wasn't for iOS. (Going further, iOS wouldn't be there without Windows Mobile, and etc etc etc until we reached the very first man who asked 'why can't I see my email from my phone'). Apple took a chance on what people wanted, and realized they had something. They built an OS that was based on the ideals of OS X; simple, straight-forward, good looking, and well received. And so began the App and Data revolution. All of a sudden, the idea of having mobile data became real. These wonderful delicious little things called "apps" made the mobile world much more exciting than it had even been before. And so Apple hit a goldmine, and the mobile landscape had been painted. These apps were well-designed, fun, informative, useful, and people liked them so much, they started to buy paid apps. Apple knows how to market to people, and there success showed.
So then. Android.
Android was birthed out of the idea that Google could cash in on this app world. You may think the intentions were noble, with the idea that it was some pipe dream in the same way linux was; completely open mobile platform. After all, if Apple could have the success with a closed system, Google obviously could rock the world with an open one.
But it's not. Android, or at least what most people come to think of as Android these days, is not "open". It's open to phone manufacturers, and carriers, but that's it. It' snot open to the end user. Why else do we have locked down features, closed-source OEM skins that hinder future firmware upgrades? Why else do we have carrier-controlled Market restrictions? Why do some phones not ship with developer tools, or the ability to install from unknown sources?
Let me be frank. I love Android, but Android is a mess. It's a mess of a bunch of wonderful ideas that would have shined like nothing else in the perfect world, but a mess that didn't anticipate a simple fact; businesses like to make money.
The truth of the matter is that we don't have freedom with Android. Every little part of it has a restriction we need to bypass. Do you buy an expensive high end phone, or a cheaper low-end phone? Will you still be able to play those cool games on that low end phone? Will it get software updates? Is it safe from malware? Buying an Android phone has become the same as trying to buy a Windows PC.
It suffers from the same problem that Microsoft does when compared to Apple's line of computers. Apple builds its hardware AND its software, so they interface with complete precision and function. People with iPhones don't need to worry about security updates, or whether their phone will be obsolete. Apple may release a new phone every year, but the point is that those phones are made to last, both in terms of hardware and software. They even went the next step further and made the iPod touch, which gave phone users who weren't ready for smartphones a taste of what it was like.
My Sprint Hero came out on October 11th, 2009. The iPhone 3GS came out in June of the same year. Both were priced around the same amount, but what stands out to me the most when I think back to when I tested both that year? The fact it took Google this long to make an operating system which took ages to mature enough to be used by HTC to make a phone that STILL could not even give me a smooth web browser, something that the very first iPhone was able to do. Games on the Hero sucked in comparison to the 3D games that were playable on the iPhone.
Now then, Android smartphone hardware has advanced to a significant level, but the point of this whole rant is that Google has always been following in Apple's footsteps in the mobile world, and it's going to be that way for some time.
Be a bit humble about the begginings of Android and what it's become, and for f***'s sake, be a bit mature than just saying "LOLOLOL APPLE SUCKS GG GET ANDROID".
Because it's the rest of the world outside of XDA that defines the success of these mobile platforms, because I hate to say this, but you and I are not part of that outside world of mobile phone users, and we never will be.
The truth is, no one can really say what the "perfect" mobile OS is. All we can do is say what works best for us or what we prefer, but when we state it as fact, as though it's not arguable, that's when we become the fanboys that we so dearly hate. Just keep that in mind.
Opinions welcome, fanboyism from either side not wanted at all. Congrats on finishing this post.
Excellent post. Would read again.
Great things said there. I can see a point in it. But still, I don't either see Ios higher as Android since Ios is a mess too. Let me just take this simple statement. Music on a Ipod/Iphone needs to be converted from the computer to the device, you can't random download a song(on the device) from Internet and play it. Same as the file exploring.. if you want to search for a file, you find a file in some folder like: im/af/on/ar/qr, or just some folders which are messy, and the file types are unknown for the computer. All those small things give me the excuse to stay at Windows Mobile. Simply cause we can download music files and play it, simply cause there is great development on it, simply cause it can be customized how we want it.
Cool story bro
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d12unk13astard said:
Cool story bro
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Good job. That must have taken some serious thought to come up with.
This is something I 100% agree with.
When I had a Samsung Moment, I had problems galore with it. Keyboard wouldn't type, horrible support, and the big network lockup. Mind you, a network lockup where you can't call out to anyone is against FCC laws. But just to get some type of damn support for the thing, I almost had to root it. And I'm sorry, but I shouldn't have to depend on an online community for support for a phone when the carrier and manufacturer of the phone should be doing that. What the hell is the point in buying the phone and paying damn near $70 a month if I can't use the damn thing?
Let's also talk about performance of the Moment and how unoptimized it was. The Moment uses the same SoC found in the Iphone 2g, and 3g. The only difference, stock 2g and 3g SoC is 600 mhz, clocked down to about 422 mhz for battery, while the Moment was 800 mhz. Both arm11 cpu cores. The Iphone 2g and 3g despite having almost half the clocked frequency of the Moment, was smoother and had actual hardware support and acceleration. Even this day, Samsung still does not have proper hardware support for the SoC being used in the Moment, Intercept, Transform, Spica, etc etc.
If done right, Android is pretty awesome I'll admit. But if I want a phone to work, I'll get something that actually works.
big advantage of android, but also a weakness:
it works well on many devices, but its not optimised for the spezific hardware of each phone...
gosualex said:
big advantage of android, but also a weakness:
it works well on many devices, but its not optimised for the spezific hardware of each phone...
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Good understanding
I love android because I love to tinker. Nothing could ever change my mind short of the os aging. I will say this flaws or not I refuse to give apple my money. So it's either wp7 or android.
My words to live buy if I can't hack it I don't want it. Just my 2cents
Sent from my A500 using XDA Premium Apps
I would agree iPhones support is a lot longer no network changes added, updates can brick the phones though.
Android need some love. Fragmentation. Networks slow to update. Ui 's being to sluggish to update the phone to higher levels.
All android phones should be aosp no extras from makers or networks.
Love my cm7/miui.us phone but most people would want to flash it or know how to. They would just think might as well get an iPhone.
Just my feelings. I own apple computers. Custom built pcs android phones had iPhones I still use an iPod touch in the kitchen as you can get the best speaker docks for them. Use what works best for the situation.
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Android security warning !!
I think android is the best system, but its very insecure if you let it on stock and don't secure it, root it, get rid of some apps and optimize it.
Did you know that a normal app with all permissions can get all your data?
-gps location
-contacts
-logs
-screenshots
-hidden camerashots
-sms/mms
-emails
-photos
-etc
BELIEVE IT OR NOT, THIS IS FACT !!!
There was a test in germany, where a developer made a app with all the rights to do the things above and send them hidden in the backround to a specified server to that he had access. So he could read and see all the things above and it was even updating immidiatly after a new sms or something came in and the testuser who installed it had no clue at all and was shocked when they told it to her.
The App itself was just making photos with a black censor stripe in the eyes and it seemed that it never could do that, but all the real action is going on in the backround.
By the way, he sayd it was very easy and many apps could do that and most of them really do that.
And what I know, many of you don't know or don't care and spread all your information to some companys that like to have them alot. And they allways want more.
Maybe you should spread this information by quoting this post or linking to it, because many people don't like to be ripped of their information.
Or do you like it, when someone is standing close to you and listens all what you say to your friends, when you have a private conversation ? I think not!
check out my signature also.
and be safe!
edit: i think i should post this as a new thread!
Great post, good read!!
Hard to say any mobile OS is perfect. But the world of mobile OS is developing quickly in recent years.
Haven't played extensively with Android and IOS. Currenly, I still think IOS is more polish. Android definitely have a lot of features and I am looking forward to where they take the OS to in the future. It seems like it's an OS that has a lot of support and has had to "grow up" really rapidly.
I actually agrer with everything in this post. Fact is the best technology in the world is technology that is stable, works, and allows the user to complete what ever task is needed.
Last night it was decided my wife and I are switching to verizon why? Cause the wife wants IOS and I am more partial to android and BB and thats the only carrier that has all 3.
Now to add on what was already said I think google needs to pick one manufacture purchase them then do exactly what apple does marry the hardware amd software together to get rid of what can be a problematic OS simply cause with some manufactures android is worse then on others.
Sent from my SPH-P100 using XDA App
(•.•) said:
I think android is the best system, but its very insecure if you let it on stock and don't secure it, root it, get rid of some apps and optimize it.
Did you know that a normal app with all permissions can get all your data?
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You give apps on an iphone or WM phone permissions to do these things too right, so this is a more general problem in the new mobile world...
BTW, I like you're post LiquidSolstice, you could almost call it a fact, it's not that the one is better than the other. It's just that they are different and the majority of people likes easy and simple...
I agree with alot of what LS mentions in the first post. My wife is one of those who could really care less about rooting, overclocking, mem management, or even what version of Android she is using for that matter. She just wants to be able to send that text without the keyboard "hicupping", or to make that phone call without the dialer lagging, etc. I like Android, but I don't like Google's.. well let's say "less than kosher" business practices and corporate involvements. I think a big point to remember is that there will always be people like us that get a huge kick out of toying with electronics. For some, it's a hobby, for others, a career. With that being said, there will also always be those doofies that get on sites like this one and annoy the living crap out of you. Everything needs to be taken in stride, and though there are those who appear to be clueless on a subject, always remember that we all have to learn somehow. Knowledge is not obtained through osmosis.
Android feels like a permanent beta. I prefer iOS for simple tasks plusSbsettings is unmatched. WP7 seems more like a feature phone, it doesn't tell you 'I'm smart.'
I mostly agree
I don't think the problem with android is really the fact that more than one company is involved in developing phones for android. The problem is that those companies, (OEMs & carriers) have been given way to much freedom to decide not only what processor & RAM the phone would have but to put their "stamp" on android. I think the blame for that partially falls on Google for not putting a stop to OEMs & carriers putting their bloatware on phones. Google has been asked multiple times to do something about the "fragmentation" issue & they've refused, so ultimately they are partly responsible for the "mess" android has become.
tsaxda said:
I don't think the problem with android is really the fact that more than one company is involved in developing phones for android. The problem is that those companies, (OEMs & carriers) have been given way to much freedom to decide not only what processor & RAM the phone would have but to put their "stamp" on android. I think the blame for that partially falls on Google for not putting a stop to OEMs & carriers putting their bloatware on phones. Google has been asked multiple times to do something about the "fragmentation" issue & they've refused, so ultimately they are partly responsible for the "mess" android has become.
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Well, carrier "bloat" --I put that in quotes because the current three major skins bring much needed features to Android (whether or not the execution is done well or not is a different argument)-- isn't quite what's killing it, it's the time spent optimizing the hardware for Android.
Android gets slapped on as many devices as possible and then sold as a low end affordable smartphone, and that's the issue, but that's the essence of Android at the same time.
ZeGuitarist said:
Excellent post. Would read again.
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+1 Outstanding post. Completely agree.
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13579_3-5...s-study/?part=rss&subj=news&tag=2547-1_3-0-20
to summarize, the article claims that the iOS app store generates more revenue for developers because people are more likely to buy there.
problem is, this article, and others like it, ignore the glaring flaw in their reasoning: revenue from sales is not the only source of revenue for an app developer. ad based revenue models area ctually very lucrative, proof of this can be easily seen from Google's success, and Facebook's success: their entire business model is nothing but ad based revenue!
in fact, ad based revenue is more lucrative in the long term than sales are, because with app sales, the dev gets revenue once, the first time a person buys the app, and then nothing from that customer ever again. but with ad based models, the dev gets money every time a person uses the app, as they get they revenue from a pair of eyes watching the screen.
so then, why does the app store have lots of sales, when the Market has only few sales? what's the difference? the reason is, iOS is not always connected tot he internet, and therefore cannot always receive ads to display, or transmit back user data. true, the iPhone is always on, and the iPad is almost always used at home on a wifi connection, probably 80% of the time at least.
the problem here, is the iPod touch. it's a highly mobile device (thinner than even the iPhone) and has access to all the same apps. it's also very popular. so, any iOS app developer choosing between releasing a free app that's ad based, and a premium app, will have to consider all the millions of iPod users without an internet connection with which to transmit ads over. the dev would be unable to make any money from them, and even if ads were preloaded, there's no guarantee that the user would turn on the app when their wifi is on later to be able to send user data back, confirming the ads were actually seen (especially since it's an on the go device, so people aren't using it at home that much). so that would be millions of downloads the dev would never see money for, unless that person eventually gets an iPhone or iPad, and its a gamble whether they actually would, or when.
Android, however, doesn't really have that problem. there never really was an iTouch style Android device except for the Galaxy Player, which wasn't even available in America (the largest market) until about a month ago. on top of that, until Honeycomb debuted, Google restricted official installation of the Market app itself to only cellular equipped devices, so even if you buy one of those cheap craptablets from CVS pharmacy or Borders running Android 2.1, you can't download Market apps, and therefore aren't relevant to the dev's business model.
it's also worth pointing out here, that the ad based model is better for consumers, too. not only do they get the products for free, they also are more liekly to receive updates in the future. after all, the dev with an ad based model makes money when people continue to use the app. so if the dev updates his app regularly with new features and levels, the user is more likely to continue using/playing or start again after a lull. which means the deve gets more money all the time, and the user gets new entertainment or utility all the time, for no more cost or very little. No more buying sequel after sequel.
For example, look at Angry Birds. it was one game, and was successful as a premium app on iOS. 2 sequels were planned and released; around this time, it came to Android. and Rovio did something different: they released it for free, as an ad based app. and wouldn't you know it, after that happened, there were no more sequels. yet the levels keep getting added and added and added to each game. compared to the original levels in the first game, there are now probably enough levels to fill 10 or 15 games, yet they keep adding them to the same games. they do this every time people tend to finish the last level pack and stop playing, then they add another and it starts up again.
all very interesting info quoted from Cnet
but what is the point you are trying to get at by opening this topic?
One other reason sales are higher on the App Store: people who buy into the Apple system accept the high premium that comes along with it and generally don't take issue with spending for apps. Part of the mindset coming in with Android is the idea of open, free development and therefore a lot of people sit back and wait for a free version of paid apps to come out. Just part of the different perspectives generally seen in the two markets. Developers who understand this have ad-based apps and still get their revenue, especially the ones who make it quite easy to accidentally click ads =P
There's also the fact that some developers allow you to donate as you like and don't require you to do so directly through the market, so there's more revenue that isn't directly seen as a "paid app" sale.
I dont think Android being open source may much of a difference, if you look at the world as a whole 99.9% of people looking at phones/tablets have no clue what open source even means.
That little 'ITunes' card makes the world of difference. I had an IPAd for 1 year, I spent maybe 20 bucks on apps, I have spent maybe 5 bucks on android apps in a few months. Now if I were to get an Android 50.00 gift card, I bet I would spend that within a month!
These gift cards are HUGE for the younger market where they dont have cell phones and they all have ipods, and starting to get Ipads/Iphones.
Interesting
Sent from my LG-P925 using XDA App
This make sense
I don't know, man. I'm pretty sure that Apple's philosophy is not conditioned by a single, specific device.
With the second part I do agree. Apple users are generally people who are able to pay for more expenses. Especially those who have a few Apple products. If you're willing and able to pay over 1k$ for a laptop, then a couple of bucks for an app is nothing.
There's a third reason why Apple has more app sales: it forces you to link your account to a credit card, so you're automatically set to pay for apps. In the Android market, you have to "detour" to link your credit card to your account.
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For the Android developer point of vue it is most valuable to use the freemium approach instead of the classic app purchase. It seems that the player prefer to play for free and buy something here and there to improve the game experience. A lot of games are doing that out there.
Most Android phones sold are of the buy 1 get 1(sometimes 2) free variety, and virtually all Android users that I know either don't download apps, have no clue that their phone runs Android or pirate apps by side loading. Personally I only bought 1 app in 2yrs of using various Android phones because most of them were far inferior to iOS versions usually sporting awful UI(due to the fact that Android SDK is a joke compared to Xcode).
Phrenks said:
I don't know, man. I'm pretty sure that Apple's philosophy is not conditioned by a single, specific device.
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I'm not talking about Apple's philosophy, I'm talking about the revenue potential for developers for iOS devices. What I'm saying is, the iPod has created iOS's own form of fragmentation. a Large portion of iOS users have an iPod touch that's only occasionally able to receive ads (connected) and even then, it's probably not connected when using most apps, especially games.
I had an iPod touch for 2 years back before I got an Android phone, and I only ever turned on the wifi to use the browser, a few news reader apps while killing downtime at work, and the app store/iTunes. that last one I did only very rarely, and I always turned the wifi off immediately after those uses, with the battery being so weak. I NEVER turned it on during games; in fact, If I was playing a game, I always made sure wifi was off, because so many games drained the battery very quickly, so I had to be especially power conscious.
So, if a dev wants to make apps for iOS, they have to consider that if they go ad based, a large portion of people will not give them any revenue at all due to being not connected to receive ads. that's why developers often charge for iOS apps, yet often make the same apps free or cheaper on Android.
Don't make the mistake of assuming Apple has a smarter philosophy than that; remember, the iPhone and iPod touch were never originally designed to have a downloadable app store to begin with. in fact, Steve Jobs openly admitted that he was opposed to it when his subordinates tried to convince him to allow it. It wasn't until the first iOS devices were jailbroken and hackers created Cydia (well before the official app store) that Apple saw the potential and caved. at that point, they had already released the iPod touch anyway, so they were stuck. Add to that the fact that they didn't really have a division designed to sell and distribute ads for other businesses at the time, and you can see how they weren't really prepared to see what the best long term system would be.
alex2792 said:
Most Android phones sold are of the buy 1 get 1(sometimes 2) free variety, and virtually all Android users that I know either don't download apps, have no clue that their phone runs Android or pirate apps by side loading. Personally I only bought 1 app in 2yrs of using various Android phones because most of them were far inferior to iOS versions usually sporting awful UI(due to the fact that Android SDK is a joke compared to Xcode).
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Really? I wish I knew where I could get two for one as never seen any uk retailer offer a deal like that and would love two for one
Out of curiosity though what is it about android sdk you think is a joke? Its not the sdks fault if an apps ui is bad yet anothers is good or all should be bad.
But back on topic most android users I know prefer free apps with ads so it could be true android users aren't so keen to buy apps whereas iphone is more a lifestyle choice and when you buy into a lifestyle your more likely to be willing to spend money investing in it.
Dave
Sent from my LG P920 using Tapatalk
Removed the OP in protest due to the abusive I endured by some XDA members. In spite of reporting them to the moderates of the forums in question and my views were shared with more members than the abusers one of my threads was closed instead.
To those truly care about technology and its surrounding matters, please accept my sincere apologies for this inconvenience. I will no longer be part of the XDA community. Thank you.
Holy ****, someone here has a massive grudge against Google and Android.
CSharpHeaven said:
Part 2
Applications & Games
The very exaggerated figure (over 400,000) by Google is only to generate market hypes and to give an impression how popular the Android platform is.
The truth is Google has used hundreds of thousands of hopeful individuals with prospect of success to submit anything to fight back Apple's App Store, only in terms of numbers that is. The chance to success, financially, on Google's Play Store is only very small for established vendors and even smaller for individuals when the competition exceeds by vast numbers. Think of the odds in lottery to come to the same conclusion.
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You see, you seem to be making contradictions on your own writing.
They never said 400,000 amazing super duper apps, they said 400,000 apps, no matter what quality.
Spell checker?
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nejc121 said:
Holy ****, someone here has a massive grudge against Google and Android.
You see, you seem to be making contradictions on your own writing.
They never said 400,000 amazing super duper apps, they said 400,000 apps, no matter what quality.
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I'm glad you are not the only XDA member that can read.
what boggles me is that android is the first os that has gotten my trust, for better or for worse. as strange as it may sound, i like updates, i am happy when notifications drop in and i certainly read the changelogs and see what's new. no other OS has ever been able to do that to me. i am using windows at work, macosx at home and linux for website-server stuff. some of these systems are here for decades, and yet they have never really taken care of my needs. i have no trust in them and never had, i click away update nagscreens whenever i see them, i hate when firefox bugs me with it, i dont trust any application, i know they put their dump onto my harddrives, mess it all up from inside, they have brought their own installation/deinstallation scripts and deamons for updates that clog my ram and suck my bandwidth, they are unsigned and unsafe, they spam my screen with popups, i do not know what permissions they require and what api's they call - they do whatever the hell they want. i use them because i have to.
yes, android has kinks and problems, but this is the cleanest OS, from a users standpoint, i have seen and used. my technical background may be lacking but this was my first impression. and because of that i can deal with buggy apps just fine, i either tollerate it or uninstall and search for something works on the market. and for some crazy reason i enjoy it, although i hated it on pc/mac/linux. so in this regard i think the app-market is doing great. it is true of course that the quality from app to app varies alot, but many do have high standards and work flawlessly. i for one think it is good that the android market does not have severe restrictions, because updates can get pushed when a defect is found. you have the opposite on apple and i did read reports that state their apps generally crash more often, which makes absolute sense because each update must go through an odyssey of admittance. bugs itself will always happen, every programmer knows that, but the android market has made sure that we do not suffer from them as much as on other systems. the underbelly of android with its signing-mechanisms, permission-transparency, packet-installer, subtle notifications, etc., all this works for me and im using my desktop less and less for a reason.
molesarecoming said:
what boggles me is that android is the first os that has gotten my trust, for better or for worse. as strange as it may sound, i like updates, i am happy when notifications drop in and i certainly read the changelogs and see what's new. no other OS has ever been able to do that to me. i am using windows at work, macosx at home and linux for website stuff. some of these systems are here for decades, and yet they have never really taken care of my needs. i have no trust in them and never had, i click away update nagscreens whenever i see them, i hate when firefox bugs me with it, i dont trust any application, i know they put their dump into my systems, mess it up from inside, they have brought their own installation/deinstallation scripts and deamons for updates that clog my ram and suck my bandwidth, they are unsigned and unsafe, they spam my screen with popups, i do not know what permissions they require and what api's they call - they do whatever they want. i use them because i have to.
yes, android has kinks and problems, but this is the cleanest OS, from a users standpoint, i have seen and used. my technical background may be lacking but this is the first impression. and because of that i can deal with buggy apps just fine, i either tollerate it or uninstall and search for something works on the market. and for some crazy reason i enjoy it, although i hated it on pc/mac/linux. so in this regard i think the app-market is doing great. it is true of course that the quality of the apps varies alot, but many do have high standards and work flawlessly. i for one think it is good that the android market does not have severe restrictions, because updates can get pushed when a defect is found. you have the opposite on apple and i did read reports that state their apps generally crash more often, which makes absolute sense because each update must go through an odyssey of admittance. bugs itself will always happen, every programmer knows that, but the android market has made sure that we do not suffer from them as much as on other systems.
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Thank you for your inputs. I would like to clarify a couple of things, if you don't mind.
I have never made a comment about the Google Play Store's update process that updates the downloaded applications. Since you did, I do agree with you regarding the advantages you rightly addressed. What I might not agree with you is the trust where my credit card details can be added to the profile Google creates for all the citizens.
My point, that you responded to, was about the inability Android OS has to update itself the way, for example, Microsoft Windows or Apple's iOS can. Also the only thing Android can update on any Android handsets is the Google Play Store app. I found this very unfair when thousands of users, behalf the rest, were campaigning to push their respective manufacturers to release the next version of Android. During such campaign I fell ill from the distress. I cannot recall going through such similar experience in my 20+ in I.T. Believe me, being a software developer I can tolerate high mental pressures but that experience was something else. I don't wish anyone else go through the same experience ever and they shouldn't really.
I've been writing this article with the consideration of the bigger issues. I cannot conclude Android is a good platform based on a small technical convenience when I have vivid visions on what Google is doing with Android and beyond the mobile space.
If my ID suggests I must be a Microsoft's fan then allow me to say to the readers that I have only two Android phones which I use one of them to write my article and this response. Also I use an Android phone as my primary device, using up to three 1930mAh batteries a day. No, I don't watch movies on my phones but listen to music from time to time.
nejc121 said:
Holy ****, someone here has a massive grudge against Google and Android.
You see, you seem to be making contradictions on your own writing.
They never said 400,000 amazing super duper apps, they said 400,000 apps, no matter what quality.
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His name leads me to believe Microsoft Fanboi - C# is a Microsoft language very similar to java - but has enough similarities to be it's own language.
edit - you posted at a similar time to me.
I will read this from now on, but probably won't comment. I enjoy hearing what ppl have to say.
i have to use c# daily in my job, its great, my favourite until now. did you know that google once played with the thought to make it androids base language? read it somewhere. must be a myth though.
---------- Post added at 11:22 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:04 PM ----------
CSharpHeaven said:
I found this very unfair when thousands of users, behalf the rest, were campaigning to push their respective manufacturers to release the next version of Android. During such campaign I fell ill from the distress. I cannot recall going through such similar experience in my 20+ in I.T.
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well, i am certainly pissed that my older handset, the s2, caught a disease called touchwizz recently instead of the modern operatig system i was hoping for. but falling ill? come on, get another phone, an iphone maybe, or if you still have hopes for android a nexus, and all will be fine. i learned my lesson from this, i'll never, ever buy something that is not directly maintained by google itself. i heard some people really loved touchwiz and samsungs efforts, to each his own. i thing its nice though that you have the choice.
1st off, My house is an android powered house and I love the platform. It is only after months of being around my girlfriend and her family as they used android, that I started to really put a finer point on why so many people prefer other OS's (yes i understand Android is grabbing up market share like crazy). this is my thoughts after watching people I know use and leave android, use and struggle with android, and use and love android.
1st off, a list of the things that aren't google fault per say, but pit falls due to there lack of control over the final product.
#1) battery life. Due to varying hardware design and the freedom to do as you please to the OS, manufactures have made some phones with really bad battery life. this coupled with the constant updating a android device can do for any apps and the increase in popularity of cloud service, android ends up with wildly varying battery life from device to device.
#2) Consistency. If someone had a Verizon "droid", they could be using a Sense UI, a moto blur UI, or vanilla android. That's just in that one "brand of phone" alone. People dont adapt well to tech if they aren't big tech fans.
#3 quality of hardware, and I'm not talking about specs. Most consumers only judge the internals on how smooth the final product is. No, I'm talking about, build materials and the screen. There is some junk out there (allot of them have great internals). some of these phones are built like toys with race car parts inside them.
Now for where google is falling short.
#1 marketing. This is amazing to me that an Advertising company would fall short here but they do. Google ads focus on strange things like the ability to unlock your bootloader. Most people have no idea what this means and why they should care. They probably shouldn't care since they will never hack there phones.
also, every time Apple comes out with an "I" product ad, they are doing a real good job of showing how there "new feature" will make your life more fun and allot easier. The funny thing is, they are almost always features that android already had.
This is one of the things I really started to notice as I was surrounded by the non tech savvy android users. I would say, "funny, android already does that, has for a while now". My girlfriend would then ask, "does my phone do that?". Wow Google, you should be the master and telling people about all the selling points of your product.
#2 ease of use. This one may also be an issue with the carriers but I am going to put it in this section. One of the things I again noticed as I helped my girlfriend master here Nexus S 4G was, weird quirks that are not even a stumbling block to a Tech savvy user but almost a deal breaker to the average consumer.
Example: when my girlfriend 1st got here nexus, she hated it, couldn't believe I recommended it. One of her issues that stuck in my mind was the SMS limit. She hated that the SMS would cap her before she was done texing a message. She didnt care if it sent as two messages but she wanted to be able to type one continues message and then send it, letting the software sort it out. So I said, no problem, my phone doesn't do that (galaxy nexus) so there must be a deep setting to control this. As it turns out there wasn't, at least I couldn't find it. So again, I said no problem and down loaded handsent witch fixed the problem and she loved the easy theming. Well along came here ICS update that I had been raving about and her phone started crashing. Turns out handsent was the reason. Again, I said, no problem and downloaded Go SMS witch she loves even more.
That's just one example, in the mean time, 4 people in her family have switched from android to I Phones and don't regret it. I feel that one of them was mainly due to the hardware they chose and the rest is because they didn't have the live in tech help that my girlfriend has ( don't mean that to sound arrogant). My girlfriend loves her phone partly because I fix each issue as it arises and inform her of cool features.
Conclusion: I really think that the the lack of consistency is the other side of the open source double edged sword. this shows it self in software and hardware. It can be as small as the order in witch the bottom buttons appear, and as big as the Sense UI that changes everything a little bit. I also feel that no one besides Verizon in the early days, is really advertising Android well. Even Verizon doesn't do as good of a job showing you how much the phones can do and why you should want these features as Apple does.
Oddly I aggree with most of that, esp the marketing, you know I just found out just how good google voice was the other day... I have had android phones now for 3 years... Lol.
Sent from my HTC One X using Tapatalk 2
funny you should bring up google voice. That was one of the things that I was thinking about when it comes to advertising short comings. It has been a great feature and a solid performer and now with Jellybean, it has every function of Siri, with the performance level I have come to expect from Google voice.
google needs to talk about it in plain English with every day examples of implementation
All of those faults/cons/criticisms can be attributed to just about any device/thing/object/concept that endorses an open-ended nature. The one off the top of my head that fits the OP's bill nearly word for word is Windows (technically Windows is closed-source). The Playstation 3 is a similar concept too. It's got all the nice bells and tech but its advertising sucks.
Google doesn't need to do any advertising, but rather the respective manufacturers. They're the ones that should be selling what Android does for their phones and why people should choose their phones over the others. If there are feature discrepancies from one phone to the other, the manufacturers should work to get those features implemented, that's the real strength of open-source software. It helps a lot if a manufacturer works together with their modding community to make it happen, which in turns makes your product/device more competitive and play on that.
Google caters to the developers because that's what Google is: a developer. That's why Google has their own line of phones: Nexus. Their phones are catered to the developers and well...us XDA'ers. They do a good job at advertising where it matters: recent one being their own conference just a week ago. If it reassures the OP: the rumor that Google plans to expand the Nexus line to more manufacturers is a good thing for us XDAers and friends of XDAers.
alpha-niner64 said:
All of those faults/cons/criticisms can be attributed to just about any device/thing/object/concept that endorses an open-ended nature. The one off the top of my head that fits the OP's bill nearly word for word is Windows (technically Windows is closed-source). The Playstation 3 is a similar concept too. It's got all the nice bells and tech but its advertising sucks.
Google doesn't need to do any advertising, but rather the respective manufacturers. They're the ones that should be selling what Android does for their phones and why people should choose their phones over the others. If there are feature discrepancies from one phone to the other, the manufacturers should work to get those features implemented, that's the real strength of open-source software. It helps a lot if a manufacturer works together with their modding community to make it happen, which in turns makes your product/device more competitive and play on that.
Google caters to the developers because that's what Google is: a developer. That's why Google has their own line of phones: Nexus. Their phones are catered to the developers and well...us XDA'ers. They do a good job at advertising where it matters: recent one being their own conference just a week ago.
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1st off, other companies doing it too, its not a reason to ignore said issue. Also, windows is taking steps to correct the hardware issue and make there OS consistent (for example)
If you think google doesn't "have to" advertise, I guess your right but even companies like 3M who sells many products to OEM's that then sell to the end user (like google) advertise to further there brand and promote the use of there products by OEM's. Also, 3M knows more about the products than any one OEM that uses there products, not to mention, the OEM's that use 3M consider 3M to be one of the reasons there product is good, and will not focus on key points of the 3M element.
Also, look at gorilla glass from corning, another product that isn't sold direct to the end user. They do there own advertising to promote there product and increase brand recognition to better sell there product.
I also disagree that google is a developer selling to developers only. Google nexus 7 is a perfect example of that. The nexus 7 tab is meant to further the "play store" brand, and is being sold at a vary low price point in the hopes that play store sales will make up for it just like the Kindle. I also don't think the Galaxy Nexus is a "developer device" at least, not exclusively.
So does google have to, no. Should they want to, yes.
What would you have Google advertise about that other companies should be doing in their stead? Google has brand recognition already and it's pretty clear by Google I/O that their intended audience isn't the Apple crowd: so who else would there be to advertise to? If the Apple crowd is whom you're referring to: that should be Samsung, HTC, Sony's job to do. What can Google do to help those manufacturers sell their features to the consumer that those companies aren't already doing themselves?
This is where we are going to disagree. Google has brand recognition but Android has far less. Verizon, did the best job and now the "droid" brand has more recognition than "android", many times "droid" is used and the general brand for all android by consumers. I don't think Google should depend on hardware companies to advertise there product. Even windows advertises there software. The OEM's should ALSO advertise but not ONLY advertise.
Advertising that the Galaxy nexus has a "unlockable" boot loader is un needed and doesnt further the brand. 98% of the people who want a unlocked boot loader, knew the galaxy nexus had one before the ad hit the streets.
The fact that apple fans are oviusly not googles target market is or should be false (proven by samsung). Google should be polishing there OS so that more of apple users would be interested. Google will not be able to continue on for ever just appealing to a small market such as the XDA community. OEM's will abandon them if that was the case. Look at the OEM's and there behavior, they are not interested in selling phones to the developer community only, otherwise Motorola would not lock there phones down as they did, or at least they would offer developers unlock tools like HTC has done. HTC is a little more "developer marketed" but lets be real, they still drag there feet when ever they can or feel pressure from the big 3.
That leads me to the Carrier's, they do not want to sell phones marketed to developers that are easily hacked and modded. they want control. Google should want to sell the most units they can within reason. This means helping the developer community with there goals and helping the OEM's and Carrier's with there's. Google should be (and I think they are) trying to make android more marketable to the masses and then lead that marketing campaign by example.
Its like that old saying, "alone with your principles". You can stand here and say that the OEM's should do all the advertising but it doesn't change the fact that they aren't doing what needs to be done and google need to sell product that is dependent on the platform. They are an advertising company so do they sit back and hope HTC and Samsung start talking more about there product and doing more to show how it will improve our lives or should they step in and show the OEM's how its done, at the same time increasing the value of there products
I think a lot of your issues are going to be solved for the mainstream with more Nexus devices rolling out. The other great thing is that as more people start looking at Nexus flexibility and timely updates the more other OEMs will be forced to follow suit if they want to stay viable. It seems Sony and to some extent HTC and Samsung are pretty serious about both the hardware and update side of things so anyone else will just have to play catch-up.
As a whole though some of these things will continue to persist. One of the draws of Android devices is having smartphone abilities without ridiculous cost. There will always be people who want the goodies but don't have a lot of extra funds and those devices will simply be a little behind the curve. With the optimizations coming via Jellybean though OEMs won't have the excuse of claiming that newer versions are too complex for older phones and I would hope that they continue to push updates for a reasonable period.
Stupid post. Why? Because you have no clue what android is. Android is an open source operating system. OEM's take android, and just so you know, they don't need google's consent, and manipulate it the way they want to put on their hardware. Google has no say in what they do to it, how they arrange their buttons, or the UI that they add to it. So your post is more directed at OEM's than google.
lowandbehold said:
Stupid post. Why? Because you have no clue what android is. Android is an open source operating system. OEM's take android, and just so you know, they don't need google's consent, and manipulate it the way they want to put on their hardware. Google has no say in what they do to it, how they arrange their buttons, or the UI that they add to it. So your post is more directed at OEM's than google.
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if you read my post you would have seen I acknowledge that some of these issues are a side effect of open source. They do in fact charge for the "gaps" suite. all hardware sold with gaps on it has paid licensing to Google.
dB Zac said:
if you read my post you would have seen I acknowledge that some of these issues are a side effect of open source. They do in fact charge for the "gaps" suite. all hardware sold with gaps on it has paid licensing to Google.
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So? Google gets no say in how they manipulate the OS. I mean seriously...battery life? How the f*** could that be a google issue?
I spesificly said that wasn't Google's fault, but a short coming of open source
Sent from my HTC One XL using Tapatalk 2
dB Zac said:
I spesificly said that wasn't Google's fault, but a short coming of open source
Sent from my HTC One XL using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
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Sounds like you need an Iphone..
lowandbehold said:
Sounds like you need an Iphone..
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So I have to love it and ignore any and all short coming or be crusified? Ok sounds like a page from apple fanboyism
here, since you will not read the whole thing before commenting, i will post the part you seemed to miss
dB Zac said:
1st off, a list of the things that aren't google fault per say, but pit falls due to there lack of control over the final product.
#1) battery life.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
dB Zac said:
1st off, My house is an android powered house and I love the platform. It is only after months of being around my girlfriend and her family as they used android, that I started to really put a finer point on why so many people prefer other OS's (yes i understand Android is grabbing up market share like crazy). this is my thoughts after watching people I know use and leave android, use and struggle with android, and use and love android.
1st off, a list of the things that aren't google fault per say, but pit falls due to there lack of control over the final product.
#1) battery life. Due to varying hardware design and the freedom to do as you please to the OS, manufactures have made some phones with really bad battery life. this coupled with the constant updating a android device can do for any apps and the increase in popularity of cloud service, android ends up with wildly varying battery life from device to device.
#2) Consistency. If someone had a Verizon "droid", they could be using a Sense UI, a moto blur UI, or vanilla android. That's just in that one "brand of phone" alone. People dont adapt well to tech if they aren't big tech fans.
#3 quality of hardware, and I'm not talking about specs. Most consumers only judge the internals on how smooth the final product is. No, I'm talking about, build materials and the screen. There is some junk out there (allot of them have great internals). some of these phones are built like toys with race car parts inside them.
Now for where google is falling short.
#1 marketing. This is amazing to me that an Advertising company would fall short here but they do. Google ads focus on strange things like the ability to unlock your bootloader. Most people have no idea what this means and why they should care. They probably shouldn't care since they will never hack there phones.
also, every time Apple comes out with an "I" product ad, they are doing a real good job of showing how there "new feature" will make your life more fun and allot easier. The funny thing is, they are almost always features that android already had.
This is one of the things I really started to notice as I was surrounded by the non tech savvy android users. I would say, "funny, android already does that, has for a while now". My girlfriend would then ask, "does my phone do that?". Wow Google, you should be the master and telling people about all the selling points of your product.
#2 ease of use. This one may also be an issue with the carriers but I am going to put it in this section. One of the things I again noticed as I helped my girlfriend master here Nexus S 4G was, weird quirks that are not even a stumbling block to a Tech savvy user but almost a deal breaker to the average consumer.
Example: when my girlfriend 1st got here nexus, she hated it, couldn't believe I recommended it. One of her issues that stuck in my mind was the SMS limit. She hated that the SMS would cap her before she was done texing a message. She didnt care if it sent as two messages but she wanted to be able to type one continues message and then send it, letting the software sort it out. So I said, no problem, my phone doesn't do that (galaxy nexus) so there must be a deep setting to control this. As it turns out there wasn't, at least I couldn't find it. So again, I said no problem and down loaded handsent witch fixed the problem and she loved the easy theming. Well along came here ICS update that I had been raving about and her phone started crashing. Turns out handsent was the reason. Again, I said, no problem and downloaded Go SMS witch she loves even more.
That's just one example, in the mean time, 4 people in her family have switched from android to I Phones and don't regret it. I feel that one of them was mainly due to the hardware they chose and the rest is because they didn't have the live in tech help that my girlfriend has ( don't mean that to sound arrogant). My girlfriend loves her phone partly because I fix each issue as it arises and inform her of cool features.
Conclusion: I really think that the the lack of consistency is the other side of the open source double edged sword. this shows it self in software and hardware. It can be as small as the order in witch the bottom buttons appear, and as big as the Sense UI that changes everything a little bit. I also feel that no one besides Verizon in the early days, is really advertising Android well. Even Verizon doesn't do as good of a job showing you how much the phones can do and why you should want these features as Apple does.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ok let me help you out.
#2: Actually, Droid branding is owned by motorola, therefore they will only be using blur UI.
Marketing: Google is not in the business of advertising an OEM's phone. That is up to the OEM and the OEM only.
Ease of use: Apple owns a patent that breaks up the long text AFTER it is typed. Therefore, it would be illegal for Android to use it. Example invalid.
Conclusion: Verizon sucks.
You really did not point out 1 thing that google has control over in your whole post.
lowandbehold said:
Stupid post. Why? Because you have no clue what android is. Android is an open source operating system. OEM's take android, and just so you know, they don't need google's consent, and manipulate it the way they want to put on their hardware. Google has no say in what they do to it, how they arrange their buttons, or the UI that they add to it. So your post is more directed at OEM's than google.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://www2.macleans.ca/2011/03/14/android-isnt-really-open-its-just-less-closed-than-apple/
Google only cares about advertising (and like to snoop in on what you do, say, what you buy, where you shop, visit, etc... ) of course.
But they do have pretty good control over Android.
lowandbehold said:
Ok let me help you out.
#2: Actually, Droid branding is owned by motorola, therefore they will only be using blur UI.
Marketing: Google is not in the business of advertising an OEM's phone. That is up to the OEM and the OEM only.
Ease of use: Apple owns a patent that breaks up the long text AFTER it is typed. Therefore, it would be illegal for Android to use it. Example invalid.
Conclusion: Verizon sucks.
You really did not point out 1 thing that google has control over in your whole post.
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Click to collapse
1st off, "droid" always running blur was not the point and incorrect. Verizon owns the "droid" name, as it is licensed to them by Lucus Industries. hence the HTC phones under that same brand name. I was commenting on the superior advertizing and Branding that Verizon did. The Droid 1 was a great vanilla phone that did well in a large part, due to advertizing. The verizon campain made "droid" a household name, more so than "Android".
2nd google can advertise features and the OS without advertising a specifice peice of hardware, windows does it all the time. Also, since google does have Google branded harware (nexus), they are in the hardware biz and should advertize aas such.
"Verizon sucks" based on what I can only emagin was your reasoning for this statement, I'm sure all major cariers "suck, not really the point here. Out of all the cariers, Verizon, furthered the android the most in the last 3 years out of anyone. Only now is Samsung beging to be the leader in promoting the android platform.
I agree with you on this, anyone who ask me what phone to get, i personally recommend iPhone UNLESS the guy knows his stuff, i myself LOVE android, been using it for 3 years now but i am software developer and very much familiar with kernels and bootloaders and and and , someone was aksing me the other day, since Android has much bigger marketshare, why everything comes out for iPhone first?
answer is simple, as a developer making things for iPhone is sooooo much easier, you only have "ONE" screen dimension to worry about, you only got 3-4 phones to worry about which 90% of them are similar, now compare this with android phones !!!
and last as everyone mentioned is advertising, personally i think google and all manufacturers do a HORRIBLE job promoting , remember when iCloud came out? nothing new really, just another DropBox, but Apple made such a big deal about it, everyone was AMAZED !!! same with siri, and so many other things,
Personally i think iPhone WORKS, its great for people who dont think outside the box, they want something that WORKS and thats it, they like to be TOLD what to do, how to use your phone , and they follow it.
Android is for thone who like to explore, install custom ROMs , play with OC/UV , etc.
Raul77 said:
remember when iCloud came out? nothing new really, just another DropBox, but Apple made such a big deal about it, everyone was AMAZED !!! same with siri, and so many other things
thats another real good example of, others were 1st but Apple advertizes better
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I actually came from a blackberry, where in convention they make and market their devices.
When I switched to android now essentially Samsung was giving me their flavour of what they call android through Touchwiz and I really hated it.
Google should really take sometime to ensure manufacturers aren't dumbing down the platform for consumers and give users a clear overview of how it can serve them. Which is exactly what Google does with its Nexus.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk 2
I really don't like Apple at all because of their proprietary and self obsessed tendencies. You can't do much of anything that they don't allow you to do. I have been on an Android platform since it came out years ago. That being said I am now producing music and I have been seriously considering getting an Ipad because they have several top notch synth apps and DAW's like Garage Band. The only thing I can find for Android is things that you hit a button and it makes a sound. You can't record into the program or do much of anything. Am I missing something? I would love to stick with Android, but Apple is beckoning me after all these years.
Obviously I am new to the forums, I was discussing this with a guy who told me to come here and if there was a DAW type app you guys would know about it or at least know what is in the works or why it is not coming out.
As a sidenote I have been following this thread on the android Google support forum about this very issue.
If you look up in the android code developers board at code.google dot com /p/android/issues/detail?id=3434 (won't let me post outside links so I had to separate a bunch of stuff .. just fix it to go to the link. it isn't a nefarious link it is google.
Open_Carry said:
I really don't like Apple at all because of their proprietary and self obsessed tendencies. You can't do much of anything that they don't allow you to do. I have been on an Android platform since it came out years ago. That being said I am now producing music and I have been seriously considering getting an Ipad because they have several top notch synth apps and DAW's like Garage Band. The only thing I can find for Android is things that you hit a button and it makes a sound. You can't record into the program or do much of anything. Am I missing something? I would love to stick with Android, but Apple is beckoning me after all these years.
Obviously I am new to the forums, I was discussing this with a guy who told me to come here and if there was a DAW type app you guys would know about it or at least know what is in the works or why it is not coming out.
As a sidenote I have been following this thread on the android Google support forum about this very issue.
If you look up in the android code developers board at code.google dot com /p/android/issues/detail?id=3434 (won't let me post outside links so I had to separate a bunch of stuff .. just fix it to go to the link. it isn't a nefarious link it is google.
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Click to collapse
No suggestions yet?
Weather you need to make music entirely on phone or you have a studio and you just need more functionality with android devices, I think these two apps can help you.
I'm pretty sure you must have heard of FL Studio Mobile, I've been using it for a long time now and I can say it is the best DAW for Android. It has all the features that you will need as a producer. If your phone is powerful enough then you can produce any genre, there's a few things missing though, like orchestral instruments (there's a very few of those), also synths are not like top notch but they does the job if you are skilled, also Auto-Tune isn't that good yet.
Or you could also try Cubasis 3, it has a free demo version on play store, known as the Cubasis LE. This one is way better and powerful in terms of features but the only reason I wouldn't say it as the best one is that
1. It's not available for all devices.
2. It's really expensive.
But if that doesn't sound like much of a problem, you can try Cubasis, it has more orchestral instruments, better synths, better visuals.