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I just saw a post on Anandtech comparing ipad2 and xoom starting a fire-storm of comments. http://www.anandtech.com/show/4216/apple-ipad-2-gpu-performance-explored-powervr-sgx543mp2-benchmarked/1
I looked up the benchmark details for the g-tablet, ipad1 and xoom on GLBanchmark, on cursory examination looks like g-tab compares very well with ipad2 and in some cases out performs ipad2. http://www.glbenchmark.com/compare.jsp?benchmark=glpro20&showhide=true&certified_only=1&D1=ViewSonic%20G%20Tablet&D2=Apple%20iPad&D3=Motorola%20Xoom.
Can somebody cross verify this.
a) I'm not an expert in this field
b) I'm a proud owner of a G-tab so might well be biased .
Note: I have posted a similar comment in anandtech's comment section, but asking it here as this might be a more appropriate forum.
Thanks
What I personally have been seeing, as well as another member on Reddit, the gTab is benching better than the xoom, which would place it still worse than the iPad 2.
Edit: Source link: http://www.reddit.com/r/Android/comments/g3yqw/after_seeing_the_xoom_benchmarks_i_decided_to/
Further edit: Are you looking for a comparison to iPad 2 or the original iPad? You mention both in your post, and the link goes to a comparison against iPad 1.
Sorry for the confusion.
My intended comparison is to ipad2. GLBenchmark still does not have iPad2 in their pull-down selection choices. Anandtech had a table comparing iPad1 & iPad2, so I had to eyeball between the 2 pages and used ipad1 just as a frame of reference.
thanks
No probs. The gTab is fairing well against the Xoom in those benchmarks, but there are some things the iPad can be better at. The gTab doesn't touch the iPad 2 in terms of benchmarks.
To be honest, I wouldn't get bogged down on specifics of benchmarks. While benchmarks can show how well a device can perform, they miss the most important thing. "Does the device work for you?"
Sorry saw the wrong column. yup g-tab no where near ipad2
There are a few things to consider:
The ipad2 is an ipad with a dual core cpu/gpu and 2 cameras, that's really it.
So far, from what I've been reading the ipad 2 graphics whips the tegra 2, however I have no clue how our dual core 1GHz CPU compares to the dual core A5 900Mhz running on the ipad2.
Furthermore, the ipad runs optimized code on optimized hardware...so ios has that bonus over honeycomb in every way. The ipad and ipad2 will always technically SEEM quicker in some respects vs. Android and Honeycomb/Froyo etc. because of that reason alone. Of course, the Gtab is actually faster than the iPad and that's quite visible when running multiple apps or viewing video.
That being said, it really boils down to how their a5 cpu compares to our t2. We know their graphics are faster at the very least. But our CPU may be a bit faster. I'm not speaking in terms of 900Mhz vs. 1Ghz. I'm speaking in terms of the optimized code I'm talking about. The iPad doesn't really need all that much raw power because all the software is optimized to run on it. It's also meant to sip power at that speed. Our t2 sips power by clocking all the way down. Thats the biggest difference.
It could be a situation where apps and cpu intensive processes may start/close and execute etc. quicker/faster for us - but games may look a bit better for the ipad2, as well as swishing around icons and 2D intensive stuff.
If you can put up with itunes, for $100 more you get a tablet that "just works" with a set it and forget it attitude and has 2 cameras. For $399 the G Tablet is a great value and a must have for tinkerers and those who prefer 'freedom' and choice.
Any comparison between both I think will really have to be on a person to person basis at this point; whereas if it were ipad vs. gtab I'd def. recommend Gtab based on power and the ipad based only on a "required" prerequisite of having a "better" screen.
I am not ipad fan as I have ipad for kids and have evo and viewaonic tablet as my android devices.
Love my evo which is the best phone in my opinion, but gtablet does everything well, but the quality of the screen, hardware and thiness of the device and battery life goes to ipad hands down.
Gtablet is really good, but it is heavy and ugly. Apple hardware have always been better looking then their counter part.
I have nice dell xps 1645, but it is still failed in compare to perfectly rectangular MacBook pro which I lust.
It will be always like comparing apple and windows.
Hope honeycomb can close the gap in usability compare to froyo and gingerbread for the tablet.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
rob_z11 said:
I am not ipad fan as I have ipad for kids and have evo and viewaonic tablet as my android devices.
Love my evo which is the best phone in my opinion, but gtablet does everything well, but the quality of the screen, hardware and thiness of the device and battery life goes to ipad hands down.
Gtablet is really good, but it is heavy and ugly. Apple hardware have always been better looking then their counter part.
I have nice dell xps 1645, but it is still failed in compare to perfectly rectangular MacBook pro which I lust.
It will be always like comparing apple and windows.
Hope honeycomb can close the gap in usability compare to froyo and gingerbread for the tablet.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
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I don't understand how Apple products gets all the raves. Before I buy anything I always look at Apple and end up buying something else because I find them too low tech. The grayed out OS on the laptops plus the lower than most laptops on the market specs and closed architecture a real turn off on their laptops. I will take a PC any day with any operating system I choose to put on it and I do get that option. For me electronic equipment is all about having options.
The ipad is a real let down. All icandy, after you get past the screen and giant played out icons--what is this the third or fourth year we are seeing them on everything Apple, how much longer will they rock those tired icons? The swipe to the left and right and up and down could hardly compare to a processor running 3D operations. Spinning 3D carousals, live wallpapers and four to five homescreens. No comparison; if that was all the G Tab did, the benchmark scores would be off the charts or any other OS for that matter.
To each his own, just adding to the conversation. I tried to like Apple products but I just don't find them good enough. Who heard of a hard drive you couldn't yank out after purchase and replace with whatever you wanted along with the other components. I guess the Apple prison system is not for me. Don't want to stop anyone else from enjoying though. For me the cons out-weigh the pros.
Stop comparing Apples and Androids!
Version_3 said it correctly. Find out what works for you and use that.
I have both an iPad1 and G-Tab. Both have pluses and minuses.
For "getting things done" I use the iPad. For entertainment and satisfying my inner geek I use the G-Tab.
There is no use in comparing hardware specs since the operating systems on both are so dissimilar. What needs to be looked at is doing what you like in the manner in which you like it. Comparing the "software" against each other is also fruitless since each person interprets how the software works for them.
My personal observations are as follows:
iPad + iTunes = ease of use
G-Tab + ?? = not as easy
G-Tab + Google Apps = Totally awesome
iPad + Google Apps = unimpressive
iPad + App Store = easy to use and solid software
G-Tab + Market = not intuitive and flaky software
Battery Life = iPad
Camera = G-Tab (not too impressive though)
To each his own.
Note - my wife will not even touch the G-Tab since the days of force closing apps... It made a negative impression on her that wont go away soon... She loves the iPad because it "just works". Android needs to figure out a way to overcome those perceptions.
pgstormblade said:
Version_3 said it correctly. Find out what works for you and use that.
I have both an iPad1 and G-Tab. Both have pluses and minuses.
For "getting things done" I use the iPad. For entertainment and satisfying my inner geek I use the G-Tab.
There is no use in comparing hardware specs since the operating systems on both are so dissimilar. What needs to be looked at is doing what you like in the manner in which you like it. Comparing the "software" against each other is also fruitless since each person interprets how the software works for them.
My personal observations are as follows:
iPad + iTunes = ease of use
G-Tab + ?? = not as easy
G-Tab + Google Apps = Totally awesome
iPad + Google Apps = unimpressive
iPad + App Store = easy to use and solid software
G-Tab + Market = not intuitive and flaky software
Battery Life = iPad
Camera = G-Tab (not too impressive though)
To each his own.
Note - my wife will not even touch the G-Tab since the days of force closing apps... It made a negative impression on her that wont go away soon... She loves the iPad because it "just works". Android needs to figure out a way to overcome those perceptions.
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I also have a gTab running VEGAn beta 5.1.1 as well as an iPad 1. I have to say that you and I have opposite uses for our tablets it seems. While you use the gTab for play and your iPad for "getting things done" I find it difficult to use the iPad for work but rather find the gPad (with the ROM and apps I've purchased) much easier to accomplish work on.
As for iTunes... I find with DoubleTwist I can get by just fine on my gTab. The only time I honestly find myself using my iPad (got it for free from work and they pay for the data plan too) is when I want to keep my 20 month old and 4 year old busy with a Netflix video at the table while my wife and I enjoy a nice dinner out. They LOVE Shaun the Sheep and it keeps them mesmerized. Although I can rip those discs and play them on the gTab it's just simpler to stream Netflix on the iPad for them.
Now for the wife... I bought her a Nook Color since most of what she does is read on it. I've also ripped some "chick flick" dvds for her and put it on her Nook Color and it plays them fine too. And of course, with root she got her damn Angry Birds...
Like most electronic devices, both the gTab and the iPad fill different needs for different people. For me, the iPad is a consumer device where the users consume media (as long as it's not Flash) and the gTab (even with it's faults like the screen) allows me to truly leave my 30 pound work laptop (with charger) behind and still get work done.
In the end, like you said, to each his own...
I guess my 2 cents:
*Software optimization*
*Resolutions*
Neither of which the Xoom or G-Tablet have thats helping them in any way. Honeycomb is no where near what I would call optimized. Plus in my mind when I see a benchmark comparing 1440 x 900 to 640 x 480 I'm sure the fps in the lower will be a bit faster. Yes I am android fan but, I can't say that the A5 is bad or the results are totally farce. Time will tell, maybe a few months from now maybe Nvidia / Google will get their crap together before we see the Tegra 3's with the left out hardware.
Plus doesn't the Xoom have 27 native open gl extensions and the gl benchmark only found 21?
Ahhh benchmarks drive me crazy, they start wars.
Speaking of issues such as tap n tap slowing the tablet down to a crawl and FC, viewsonic is not a small company. Why in the world didn't their testers pick these things up?
goodintentions said:
Speaking of issues such as tap n tap slowing the tablet down to a crawl and FC, viewsonic is not a small company. Why in the world didn't their testers pick these things up?
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Excellent question and I went to the tap n tap website which was an eye opener. Why in the world would they choose this for a device with so much hardware promise?
Good thing for them buyers were able to see past the bad decision and look at the big picture.
Software is changeable and hardware, particularly, on a device such as this--meaning tablet--is what it is. What you get, is what you get. Pretty much fixed unless you get into add ons and soldering.
Congrats to our Developers for Putting the GTablet back on the Map!!! Heres an article that posted about you guys-----GREAT JOB GUYS!!
The G Tablet hasn't been getting much attention of late, slowly fading into obscurity as newer and fancier slates come floating on down the river. Now, thanks to XDA member pershoot, Viewsonic's Tegra 2 tab has a little extra spring in its step. He's managed to get it running at 1.4GHz (a 40 percent boost over stock) and, with the ability to run CyanogenMod 7, this 10.1-incher is definitely earning a reputation as something of a hacker's delight. Now it's even easier to afford, too, with Amazon knocking the price down to $280. Cheap and tweakable? Really, it doesn't get any better than that.
This was Posted today on Engadget: Again Congrats Guys!!! I really Love my Gtab thanks to you Guys!!!
http://www.engadget.com/2011/04/15/viewsonic-g-tablet-overclocked-to-1-4ghz-goes-on-sale-to-celebr/
I just read that
i just read that with a smile on face... only our great devs could do that
"Love all your devs, and they will love you back"
It's a shame that engadget is such a terrible place. Trolls, fanboys and idiots, at least their comments system anwyays.
Nice to see Pershoot get the credit he deserves, the guy is a monster!
It's about time that Engadget gave the GTAB a nod
Glad to see this, and hat's off to pershoot (and all the other devs here - gojimi, rothnic, clem and the rest) for a job well done.
You have no idea how annoyed I've been at the GTAB's "black sheep" status, there. Good to see some positive press for once.
wow, there are some fanboys douchers on the comments page.
I can't believe there are people calling it "crap" in the comments A sub-$300 tablet with a capacitive screen and the innards that this thing has is crap? Screen can be terrible at the wrong angles, but otherwise it's a hell of a bargain. So much so that I have a very exhausting love/hate with this damn thing, one day I want to get rid of it, next day I say, "Aww, you're not so bad, and you came cheap!"
Damn you, Transformer. Damn you to hell!
most people calling it crap are iFans who can't fathom paying less than $500 for a quality piece of hardware - let alone the idea that someone would WANT to tinker with the software (God forbid someone hacks - King Jobs would have my head!)
We still cannot rest we need to keep on Nvidia and VS until they can give us the drivers. other wise we may get shuffled on the back burner. and left to boil over. if we can get nvidia to give us the drivers we can get our custom roms going much faster then VS can and they seem to see what we are doing anyway and incorporate it into their design.
Xargon321 said:
We still cannot rest we need to keep on Nvidia and VS until they can give us the drivers. other wise we may get shuffled on the back burner. and left to boil over. if we can get nvidia to give us the drivers we can get our custom roms going much faster then VS can and they seem to see what we are doing anyway and incorporate it into their design.
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A gTablet developer mentioned yesterday that Nvidia has already been in contact with them, starting a dialog. So the process has begun.
I just hope it continues.
All good news for grab owners, as this will keep the pressure on for further development! Also with the positive press on the device I think it will keep everyone motivated on all sides! Thanks goes out to ALL devs!
pr0cs said:
It's a shame that engadget is such a terrible place. Trolls, fanboys and idiots, at least their comments system anwyays.
Nice to see Pershoot get the credit he deserves, the guy is a monster!
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Steve Jobs reads engadget they did an article on market watch it is on his reading list. The fanboys are always where there is discussion of other products of those not interested in ianything, like snakes in the garden of eden, wanting others to bite the apple.
This was a sleeper tablet and it was written off early by reviewers who obviously had stock in Apple. For it to be backed up by consumer support and flying off shelves 6 months later what you see is shock and awe on their faces. CNet has revised there GTab video 3 or 4 times, in fact they throw one up on youtube every 15 days with their logo slapped on the screen as hoping to motivate folks to visit the site.
If you have noticed every tablet that has launched that is not ipad is given bad reviews. They will find something wrong with transformer. Yesterday's reviews of Blackberry a first gen product was uncalled for. What happen to neutral reviews? Meanwhile Jobs is patching up problems with ipad 2 by the boatload, a second gen product with little bad press.
edirector said:
Steve Jobs reads engadget they did an article on market watch it is on his reading list. The fanboys are always where there is discussion of other products of those not interested in ianything, like snakes in the garden of eden, wanting others to bite the apple.
This was a sleeper tablet and it was written off early by reviewers who obviously had stock in Apple. For it to be backed up by consumer support and flying off shelves 6 months later what you see is shock and awe on their faces. CNet has revised there GTab video 3 or 4 times, in fact they throw one up on youtube every 15 days with their logo slapped on the screen as hoping to motivate folks to visit the site.
If you have noticed every tablet that has launched that is not ipad is given bad reviews. They will find something wrong with transformer. Yesterday's reviews of Blackberry a first gen product was uncalled for. What happen to neutral reviews? Meanwhile Jobs is patching up problems with ipad 2 by the boatload, a second gen product with little bad press.
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Its funny because of the psychology of the press:
Case 1: Apple iDevice
The iDevice is released with bugs. The press hypes the device, conveniently ignores bugs.
6 months later, Apple releases a patch that fixes the bugs. When the patch is released, the press lauds Apple, the device, and the iOS for all the bugs they fixed and the great support.
Case 2: Android device
An android device by Manufacturer A is released with bugs. The press hypes the device, conveniently ignores bugs.
**2 weeks later, the bugs are fixed by the dev community.
Press criticizes not just Manufacturer A, but the device, Google, the android OS (and by extension all android devices) for a flaw that can "only be fixed if you hack your device and void the warranty." The iFans descend to attack android and suggest that iOS is better than Android because Apple fixed the bug instead of hackers (conveniently ignoring that it took Apple 6 months to fix the iDevice bugs vs the 2 weeks the community took to fix the android device bugs).
6 months after launch, Manufacturer A releases a patch that fixes the bugs that were addressed by the community months ago. Nothing appears in the press because they have moved on to hype and then attack the newest generation of android devices. In attacking the newer devices they point out the unresolved bugs and compare to the lack of bugs from the iDevice (released over 6 months ago), neglecting to point out that the iDevice was also launched with bugs and features older and slower hardware. For the rest of the story go (back) to **.
dfin13 said:
I can't believe there are people calling it "crap" in the comments A sub-$300 tablet with a capacitive screen and the innards that this thing has is crap? Screen can be terrible at the wrong angles, but otherwise it's a hell of a bargain. So much so that I have a very exhausting love/hate with this damn thing, one day I want to get rid of it, next day I say, "Aww, you're not so bad, and you came cheap!"
Damn you, Transformer. Damn you to hell!
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Took the words right out of my mouth. I think it will be easier to decide once the Transformer release date and pricing is officially announced. Can't beat the price of the G Tab but I think I'd be willing to pay the extra money for a good screen and honeycomb if all the rumors are correct.
They are all doing news items about "ipad killers" and list the usual suspects, (Xoom, HP Touchpad, Galaxy Tab), but none of them mention the best selling non-iOS tablet....
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-15087056
So my questions to them (and Asus)
Why should I believe anything techy they tell me, if thjey don't know who the REAL contenders are, rather than simply looking towards to best known contenders.
And to Asus, Why aren't you boasting about your sales figures? We know you have been SELLING 600k+ units every month since March, and can easilly embarrass Samsung, Motorola with more impressive sales figures, so why hold back? (i'm guessing you can't afford to upset either of these companies, as AsusTek has strong dealings with them).
CrazyPeter said:
They are all doing news items about "ipad killers" and list the usual suspects, (Xoom, HP Touchpad, Galaxy Tab), but none of them mention the best selling non-iOS tablet....
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-15087056
So my questions to them (and Asus)
Why should I believe anything techy they tell me, if thjey don't know who the REAL contenders are, rather than simply looking towards to best known contenders.
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Wait, you mean to actually pay attention to the main stream media.
That's your first mistake.
This bugs the crap out of me as well. The media (both mainstream and tech) keeps saying that there's no "successful" tablet other than the iPad, when I'm sure Asus is perfectly happy selling 1-2 million units (if not more) of the Transformer. And really, by harping on the iPad as the "only successful" tablet, the media contributes to a self-fulfilling prophecy--how many people want to buy an unsuccessful product?
It's a bit like how election results can't be reported until after polls have closed. People change their votes based on who's winning...
It's just propaganda. They want the majority of the masses to believe that the iPad is the number one contender. The consumer makes the choice on whether to believe it or not based on what knowledge he or she has on the tablet market. If you've done your homework and researched it then you would know that the Apple has mostly marketing backing it's iPad. The real tech savvy person knows the difference and can make a reasonable choice.
Leave it to mainstream media to cloud your mind of the real possibilities. I never have liked Apple despite how thin they can make there products. pfttt...
<petergriffin> You know what grinds my gears? </petergriffin>
Every time someone new sees my Transformer, the FIRST words out of their mouth are "oh, is that an iPad?"
EVERY time.
I guess it just shows how ridiculously successful Apple's marketing department is.
nightwulf said:
<petergriffin> You know what grinds my gears? </petergriffin>
Every time someone new sees my Transformer, the FIRST words out of their mouth are "oh, is that an iPad?"
EVERY time.
I guess it just shows how ridiculously successful Apple's marketing department is.
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I think the problem is, Apple have virtually unlimited money to push their products, and the more they spend pushing them, the more they sell and they then have even more money.
It's a upward spiral, where Apple and Microsoft have dominance, they can dominate even more. Microsoft is the worst, their money comes from Windows, but they use it to break new sectors with inferior products (Xbox, Windows Phone 7 etc).
i agree when family members see me with my Transformer they say oh you got a ipad too, i let them play with it and at first they are like how did you get your ipad to do this...then i get to tell them that it isnt a ipad, which they should have known by the look of it but i never said my family is smart they think the ipad is the only tablet on the market....but long story short i already converted two my family members to transformers from ipads due to widgets alone.
I was talking to an iPad2 owner yesterday at Changi airport, he saw me using my Transformer, and then asked me what it was, and if it was less than £1000!!!! On the TV they had just shown another Android tablet with a keyboard (Lenovo I believe).
I said it was less than an iPad2 including the keyboard dock, and it had 18 hours of battery life, a proper keyboard and no iTunes lock-in.
He told me the iPad was his first Apple purchase, and could not believe how he was already locked into everything Apple and nothing was actually his.
I got the impression he was going to sell it and get a Transformer when he got back.
First to the market gets the name. How many people had a portable cassette player that was always referred to as a "Walkman".
Oh crap, I just showed my age.
^ oh so true!! apple is a huge media whore but hey, that tactic sure works wonders on herding all the sheep.
crollison said:
First to the market gets the name. How many people had a portable cassette player that was always referred to as a "Walkman".
Oh crap, I just showed my age.
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What's a cassette?
LOL... jusk kidding.
But that's true... like Kleenex.
Everyone as "is that an iPad?", I hate that. But the have the mindshare when it comes to name recognition. I mean come one iPad (like iANYTHING) is fairly easy to remember (especially if you already familiar wit iPads and iMacs). Asus Eee Pad Transformer just doesn't roll off the tongue as easy.
The Galaxy Tab 10.1 has some mindshare due to the sucess of the Galaxy S line. More importantly it get alot of comparison to the iPad because it so thin (thinner than the iPad even). Besides it is a nice device with a sexy design.
Yes the Transformer deserves more recognition but it is popular with those that do research and are more tech savvy. It is is talked about a bit on the tech sites.
---------- Post added at 11:31 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:21 AM ----------
uploder said:
^ oh so true!! apple is a huge media whore but hey, that tactic sure works wonders on herding all the sheep.
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Yes, all the iSheep.
Here is another "expert"...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/busin...ablet-mauler/2011/09/29/gIQAghKl7K_story.html
"there is still no real competitor to the iPad 2,” Ticonderoga analyst Brian White said in a note to clients today."
LOL, it's a shame you can't physically shake these idiots and wake them up. They are creating a self-fulfilling prophecy. There won't be anything that is a real competitor to the iPad2 until they wake up and realize there already are some.
Don't think apple is above paying for their 'news'.
I believe the Transformer gets pushed aside for two reasons:
No affiliation with any wireless network providers (as the Xoom and Tab do with companies like Verizon)
Like it or not, wireless broadband is the way of the future. With the exception of Apple none of the hardware manufacturers have the marketting budget to push their devices. Thus, the tablets that "debut" on Verizon/AT&T/whathaveyou are pushed into public visibility. Mainstream media exists to tell the public what they already know or what they want to hear, and there's great advertising revenue in these devices.
It's actually quite impressive that Transformer has generated as much sales as it has. It's honestly a testament to how massive the "techie" community has gotten, as that's the demographic.
Raw spec comparisons always place the Xoom and Tab ahead of the Transformer
Somehow when any reviewer (Engadget, Gizmodo, etc) compares the devices, the Transformer gets left at the bottom. I'm not really sure why that is, as from a usability standpoint, the Transformer kicks the crap out of all competitors. Generally these reviewers focus on ONE point of interest and hold that as the determining factor. The screen is frequently this pivot point. Apparently the Transformer's screen is VASTLY inferior to that of the Galaxy Tab or Xoom, but I don't see it. I've gone to the Verizon store with my TF and compared them all....they all look the same, and neither of the other two match the capability and usefulness of my tablet.
I'm not particularly stressed. There's a huge community behind this device, meaning there will always be neat things to play with. Since Asus was so profitable with these, they'll continue supporting it and pumping out new iterations (which is proven by the 4-core Kal-El iteration announced almost immediately after the TF shipped.)
It's propaganda. That's all it is, plain and simple. Look at the meaning of the word 'Propaganda' and then relate it to what your seeing. It fits like a key.
Propaganda is a form of communication that is aimed at influencing the attitude of a community toward some cause or position so as to benefit oneself.
As opposed to impartially providing information, propaganda, in its most basic sense, presents information primarily to influence an audience. Propaganda is often biased, with facts selectively presented (thus possibly lying by omission) to encourage a particular synthesis, or uses loaded messages to produce an emotional rather than rational response to the information presented. The desired result is a change of the attitude toward the subject in the target audience to further a political, or other type of agenda.
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This is exactly what your witnessing and you will continue to see more and more 'Mainstream Media' advertise this claim.
Just ignore it. It's bull****. You! The tech savvy person knows the difference and that's all that matters.
Well, by that definition, marketing and advertising is propoganda. Of course these companies want to convince you to buy their product. That's why they built the product.
Your consternation is probably over the partial views of the media, which isn't news (pardon the pun), but definitely disconcerting. All I can say is get your information from as many sources and perspectives as you can, and always question the driving force behind every source.
AcIdC0R3 said:
It's propaganda. That's all it is, plain and simple. Look at the meaning of the word 'Propaganda' and then relate it to what your seeing. It fits like a key.
This is exactly what your witnessing and you will continue to see more and more 'Mainstream Media' advertise this claim.
Just ignore it. It's bull****. You! The tech savvy person knows the difference and that's all that matters.
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Whilst I can understand crap ****e like Engadget, Gizmodo, Slashgear and the like who need advertising revenue from the highest bidder (i.e. Apple) to survive, the BBC link I originally posted is funded by UK licence fee payers and SUPPOSED to be informed, impartial and unbiased, but unfortunately they are some of the biggest Apple fanboys around, with almost every week, they Apple loving writers are spewing out Apple psalms like it's the new religion, their Focus magazine and BBC Click programs are more of the same.
I posted about this recently on another thread:
rickatnight11 said:
These arguments fall upon the deaf ears of fanboys. It goes both ways. There are plenty of Android die-hards (myself included) who don't want to hear any arguments against the ecosystem they love.
The only rational arguments come from a usability or ideological standpoint. Here are two examples:
Ideological - I don't believe a manufacturer should have any control over what software I put on or what I do with my device. My device is a tool, which should conform to my needs, not the other way around.
Usability - I only use this device for these three tasks, and since the alternative does not have support/apps for these particular tasks I prefer them to the competition.
If you are rationally choosing your ecosystem, the only logical arguments fall under these two categories. Otherwise you're simply buying into a brand, and thus you can't make any logical arguments.
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Because the mainstream media and the "tech writers" consist of morons. It's hard not to laugh when you're reading this drivel, like the eighteen articles I've read comparing the Kindle Fire to the iPad and hypothesizing whether it will be an iPad Killer. They're not even comparable, they're not even in the same market. I'm just in shock at how any sane rational person can compare a 7-inch tablet to a 10.X inch tablet at completely different price points and with completely different ideas (Fire is sold at a loss, not a profit because its intended to sell Amazon services hard to make up for the $25.00 loss per unit).
So when you see people comparing the Kindle Fire to the iPad and calling RIM's Playbook a failed "iPad killer" (when it hasn't even tried to kill the iPad), you begin to denounce the bull**** they call a story. They like to generate controversy by using buzzwords like "iPad killer". The mainstream media isn't out to do any fair coverage, it's out to throw in buzzwords and junk to generate hype and readership. Can you expect any fair coverage from that kind of machine? Not in the slightest.
rickatnight11 said:
I believe the Transformer gets pushed aside for two reasons:
No affiliation with any wireless network providers (as the Xoom and Tab do with companies like Verizon)
Like it or not, wireless broadband is the way of the future. With the exception of Apple none of the hardware manufacturers have the marketting budget to push their devices. Thus, the tablets that "debut" on Verizon/AT&T/whathaveyou are pushed into public visibility. Mainstream media exists to tell the public what they already know or what they want to hear, and there's great advertising revenue in these devices.
It's actually quite impressive that Transformer has generated as much sales as it has. It's honestly a testament to how massive the "techie" community has gotten, as that's the demographic.
Raw spec comparisons always place the Xoom and Tab ahead of the Transformer
Somehow when any reviewer (Engadget, Gizmodo, etc) compares the devices, the Transformer gets left at the bottom. I'm not really sure why that is, as from a usability standpoint, the Transformer kicks the crap out of all competitors. Generally these reviewers focus on ONE point of interest and hold that as the determining factor. The screen is frequently this pivot point. Apparently the Transformer's screen is VASTLY inferior to that of the Galaxy Tab or Xoom, but I don't see it. I've gone to the Verizon store with my TF and compared them all....they all look the same, and neither of the other two match the capability and usefulness of my tablet.
I'm not particularly stressed. There's a huge community behind this device, meaning there will always be neat things to play with. Since Asus was so profitable with these, they'll continue supporting it and pumping out new iterations (which is proven by the 4-core Kal-El iteration announced almost immediately after the TF shipped.)
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I only take issue with one thing: The Xoom's screen sucks. Otherwise I agree with you for the most part.
The only area I see Android tablets selling is the mid range ($150-$300) where most of the devices are heavily subsidized by the oem - tablets like Kindle Fire, Nexus 7, Nook Color etc. And Apple will soon enter this segment too.
On the high end, Apple has massive economies of scale. There is simply no way for other oem's to get the same part pricing and compete with a $499 iPad Retina or $399 iPad 2. All the Xooms, Galaxy Tab's and Transformer's have terrible sales. There will soon be a new competitor in Surface.
On the low end, there are a number of cheap Chinese tablets in the ~$100 price range which aren't really competitive.
It doesn't help that Google totally ignores tablets. The Play Store has no section for tablets, its hard to find apps, and developers have completely ignored Android tablets as well (due to low sales). Every day the situation is getting worse.
I just googled this question
Seems like there is never going to be a large market for a mobile OS tablet.
We have the Nexus tablet coming soon that will address the issue of Google not doing much for tablets. The Kindle Fire has done well even though its heavily skinned. The iPad like other Apple products are sold at a higher price/margin since people believe that paying more for a popular brand means a better experience. Android tablets will have a hard time competing if they are sold at the same price as the iPad.
If Apple made a 7" tablet they would be going against Steve Jobs, the guy who helped bring that company back from near bankruptcy in the late 90s. Apple would have a hard time making a 7" tablet for $199 if they wanted to keep their high profit margins of around 50% on the iPad. Amazon sells the Kindle Fire right near cost as a media consumption device.
Yes.
I would say yes. ICS was created for a more diverse line of products and I think consumers will react well to a well priced ICS tablet. :laugh:
I've played around with my brothers Ipad a lot and after buying my transformer prime, I can't really imagine going back to an ipad if given the choice.
I think they will be successful but not until the shine wears off on the ipad.
I doubt that.. iPad is still you're best bet for everything you need for a good, all around tablet.. and the majority of people would choose the iPad instead..
The only way android tablet could succeed is on cheap alternatives.. the next Google tablet looks promising.. sure it won't make any profit for Google but at least they could gain market share..
Swyped from my GT-i9100
non standard is the issue for android tablet
samsung have proprietary ports for charging etc. Once they come up with a micro usb charger port Note tablet, definitely it will boost market.
iPad you cant copy from a camera or SD card, android you can do that .. companies are not exploiting these areas. They have to go in a similar standard phone like in mobiles. atleast 1080p etc.
I guess it all really depends on the end consumer.
I've seen a lot of people using tablets.
I'd personally only use one for taking notes in lectures though at school.
They seem fun
There is a section on the Market for tablets...
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- Swift -, formerly known as IrishStuff09
Lots of market segments to consider, and I know I don't represent the mass market. With that in mind - I've been on the fence about getting a tablet for the past several months, and I'm finally seeing more and more instances where it would make sense for me. I've spent time with a few Android tablets and with iPads. First impressions - iPad displays are gorgeous and the UI is incredibly smooth and lag free. I tried a few Android tablets that had nice displays - just not quite as dramatically clean and crisp as the new iPad, and I also noticed some very minor stutter and hesitation as I swiped my way around the UI. Very subtle differences - but the iPads just generally felt a bit more polished.
I also found the iPad UI annoying after having been using ICS with Apex launcher on my Galaxy Nexus for 7 months. I love the flexibility of Android. If somebody gave me an iPad, I wouldn't throw it away...but I'd strongly consider selling it to get a high end Android tablet instead. Similarly -- maybe even more strongly -- I've looked at and tried numerous iPhones, but went happily with a Galaxy Nexus instead the week they became available on VzW. I'd make the same decision today. All the more reason for an Android tablet - same UI, same ecosystem, same apps, great synergy. But again - I probably represents a narrow segment of the market.
If we can really see $200 Android tablets that are smooth and well presented, I think they can definitely make a dent in the iPad market. The difference in price could be enough to sway a good chunk of the market.
I have big hopes for the nexus tablet. I don't know if the specs published on the web are true, but for that price the tablet is a gift lol. I'm really thinking in buying a tablet and the nexus 7 may be my choice. And if the price is good I'm sure it will cut a big slice from ipad's market share.
Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk 2
I have a gtab 2 7" and it is successful for me in that it does everything I want and it was cheap. Most people that have tired it out really like the smaller size and like it, but it's not an iPad so they would never consider purchasing one. It is just the way it is for right now.
I'm not sure what it would take for an Android tab to be as successful as the iPad but I honestly don't think it will ever happen, at least in the mainstream.
ipads are cheaper than most Gtabs. For example, the new iPad costs a bit more than galaxy tab 7.7.
As a Flyer owner, my only gripe is that the amount of apps available for Android tablets pale in comparison to Apple. There never seemed to be a lot available for Honeycomb. Whether that changes under the ICS tablets is yet to be seen.
GrandAdmiral said:
As a Flyer owner, my only gripe is that the amount of apps available for Android tablets pale in comparison to Apple. There never seemed to be a lot available for Honeycomb. Whether that changes under the ICS tablets is yet to be seen.
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A lot of that has to do with the proportion of market share. Most Android devices are phones so most developers still only develop for phones. As apps are redesigned for ICS they play better with tablets I've noticed.
If 7" 16GB is $199 and 32GB $249 then in near future, 10" 16GB b/w $299 - $349 would be a terrific price :good:
iOS "Power/Jailbreak" user here. Just got rid of our iPad 1 (too slow). Tablet-less now. Decided to jump iOS ship on my phone to day (HTC One X Plus). Based on reading I think Jelly Bean represent maturation of Android to point of iOS Jailbreak users like me being ready to jump ship (although I'll still recommend iOS to simple users - parents/wife, etc.)
Kids want iPad 3 (Apple was selling for $379 refurb 16GB - we don't use it for movies so storage not an concern). Read reviews on Nexus 10 and TF700. TF700 seems to be overall the better product, especially considering price brand new is now $428 on Amazon compared to $499 for Nexus 10 (32GB models) and TF-700 can be converted to essentially an ultrabook eliminating the need for a second laptop for my kids. Lots of people obsessed with specs these days, especially pixel count (reminds me of digicam megapixel wars.) so Nexus 10 is the "new hot thing" (My tablet has more pixels than your iPad, Na Na Na Na Na Na) But I'm leaning towards TF-700. Sorry for being so wordy - let me get to the point:
Any iPad 2/3 users here that can comment on they comparative experiences with the TF700? I realize the tablet-centric app selection is thinner in the Android world, so far. Phone apps scaling to Nexus 7 wasn't too bad I hear but little concerned about going from iPad to TF700 or Nexus 10 as far as tablet apps go. I checked the apps we had on iPad and 80% of them were there but there's no indication on Google play if the version was designed for a tablet or not.
BIG thing drawing mean to Jelly Bean is user profiles. Despite what Apple thinks or hopes, our household can't afford an iPad for every member in the house! I hear Jelly Bean 4.2 is support user profiles! Hurray. But I assume not for the TF700 since that came out several months ago.
I see on Engadget today that Jelly Bean 4.2 Binaries releases on ASOP. So realistically, how much longer before I can run Jelly Bean 4.2 with user profiles on a TF-700? Or is it a moot point because people think we'd be better off with an iPad 3 or Nexus 10 given our usage (kids use it 80% of the time for games/web browsing/tablet apps - I use it 20% of the time for web browsing)
Even if Nexus is better choice, seems silly to pay out the nose on day one before anyone other than Google is offering it. Seems holiday competition once other retailers have it should bring price down a little. Benefit of TF700 being around though is I can go used on Ebay and if no like, get my money back.
For the love of me, buy a nexus 10. If you really want a tf700 I will sell you mine just pm me. This is only 3 weeks old but I cannot make it into a ultrabook replacement . I bought a MacBook and now need to sell the infinity. It's great but Tue only nice thing is the screen. I think the tegra 3 chip is just not enough to multitask. Profile switching is cool I have an app that does it between work and play apps
jazee said:
iOS "Power/Jailbreak" user here. Just got rid of our iPad 1 (too slow). Tablet-less now. Decided to jump iOS ship on my phone to day (HTC One X Plus). Based on reading I think Jelly Bean represent maturation of Android to point of iOS Jailbreak users like me being ready to jump ship (although I'll still recommend iOS to simple users - parents/wife, etc.)
Kids want iPad 3 (Apple was selling for $379 refurb 16GB - we don't use it for movies so storage not an concern). Read reviews on Nexus 10 and TF700. TF700 seems to be overall the better product, especially considering price brand new is now $428 on Amazon compared to $499 for Nexus 10 (32GB models) and TF-700 can be converted to essentially an ultrabook eliminating the need for a second laptop for my kids. Lots of people obsessed with specs these days, especially pixel count (reminds me of digicam megapixel wars.) so Nexus 10 is the "new hot thing" (My tablet has more pixels than your iPad, Na Na Na Na Na Na) But I'm leaning towards TF-700. Sorry for being so wordy - let me get to the point:
Any iPad 2/3 users here that can comment on they comparative experiences with the TF700? I realize the tablet-centric app selection is thinner in the Android world, so far. Phone apps scaling to Nexus 7 wasn't too bad I hear but little concerned about going from iPad to TF700 or Nexus 10 as far as tablet apps go. I checked the apps we had on iPad and 80% of them were there but there's no indication on Google play if the version was designed for a tablet or not.
BIG thing drawing mean to Jelly Bean is user profiles. Despite what Apple thinks or hopes, our household can't afford an iPad for every member in the house! I hear Jelly Bean 4.2 is support user profiles! Hurray. But I assume not for the TF700 since that came out several months ago.
I see on Engadget today that Jelly Bean 4.2 Binaries releases on ASOP. So realistically, how much longer before I can run Jelly Bean 4.2 with user profiles on a TF-700? Or is it a moot point because people think we'd be better off with an iPad 3 or Nexus 10 given our usage (kids use it 80% of the time for games/web browsing/tablet apps - I use it 20% of the time for web browsing)
Even if Nexus is better choice, seems silly to pay out the nose on day one before anyone other than Google is offering it. Seems holiday competition once other retailers have it should bring price down a little. Benefit of TF700 being around though is I can go used on Ebay and if no like, get my money back.
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Actually, the current version of Android on the TF700 should support multiple users. You'd just have to do it from the command line and it might be buggy, I don't know for sure as I have not tried it yet. I don't know about the Nexus 10 or the iPad3, but I've been pretty happy with my TF700. While updates will certainly come faster to Google tablets, ASUS does give us updates as well.
Last I checked, you could expect an Apple mobile device life cycle of about 30 months for OS updates. Google has only recently made a requirement for vendors to release updates for 18 months and that doesn't guarantee much as vendors do not have a deadline to release updates; however, if you don't mind flashing ROMs on your tablet, the good folks at XDA make some great ROMs long after support for a device is dropped.
Edit: Apparently Apple removes features its latest versions of iOS when it releases them to older devices. Google/Android vendors do not do this.
Also, one minor note, you can't transform the TF700 into an ultrabook but rather a netbook. The dock to do that is from $130 - $150 last I checked.
The command for adding users to a TF700 ( you must be root):
# pm create-user <username>
To get a list of users and their ids ( you must be root):
# pm list-users
To remove the user ( you must be root):
# pm remove-user <1, 2, 3 ... n>
Do NOT remove user 0.
Thanks to zanderman112 for his thread at http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1807751 .