Related
I've been seeing a lot of hostility & berating in the Kaiser forum lately. A lot of it stems from noobies with posts about things that have already been resolved, or about fearfully wanting to flash a new ROM.
A lot of the people with the really advanced CE knowledge are always busy & subtracting from their time affects all of us because they have less time to innovate & create.
I was thinking what if we created a new Sub-forum for Noobies with issues or with a desire to flash, but not the knowledge. We could have a few people there as Mods or some sort of assistant mod as a clearing house for the noobies that are coming everyday.
This could be a introduction to XDA & a way for the Noobie to learn good community principles & basic beginer knowledge. Learn how to post, search & where & how to find the information they need. A way to break them in, with a few patient people helping & guiding them.
If there were more serious issues you would then only have one or two persons bugging everyone else, (& the gods like Oli, Jocky, Dutty, Chainfire, & all the others I'm forgeting) instead of every noobie with the same question every day.
I am up for doing something like this, I've learned a lot here, & I'm sure one or two others would also be willing to give some of their time to make this place better.
With the tools available through IM & File Sharing thru MSN Messenger, I think we could cut the number of duplicate posts, & flame responses in half easily making it easier for everyone to find the information they need.
What do you think?
1. Is a noobie flashing & problem sub-forum a good idea?
2. Are you willing to help out & give back?
Yes and Yes
Every forum goes through this crap whenever a new flashing starts. Just realise that you were a noob once and get over it.
Just ignore noob posts if you don't want to help them.
That won't fix the problem. Why? The n00bs that post repeatedly answered questions don't read...and if they don't read then they'll post in the wrong forum because they "didn't know any better"...
This comes back to the same thing I've said all along...you can't fix stupid. Yes, we were all n00bs at one point. In many ways we will always be n00bs because tech changes so fast. But the majority of us take the time to read and research a bit to make sure the question hasn't been asked or to make sure we have all the information we need before embarking on the addictive ride of ROM Flashing. The ones that aren't willing to do that will most likely not bother asking questions in the n00b forum...they'll just post away in the Upgrading forum without a care in the world.
I understand the frustration with seeing so many of us lose it and unleash the fury of a thousand flames upon the unsuspecting n00b...and I apologize for my part in that...sorta...because I think they do deserve to have their brains bashed in by a slice of lemon wrapped around a large gold brick for not reading...
Agree with jarek91, can't fix stupid, just have to hope that they evolve quick enough to not be a consistent nuisance or hope they end up on the darwin awards email.
well, if we keep ignoring, soon, we'll get tire and stop coming here because the forum is flooded w/ noob questions (those questions have been answered numerous of time). They start the question with "I've searched, but could NOT find anything" eventhough the answer is in the stickies just above their questions.
BTW, before you criticize me, GSLEON3, or anyone for supporting the new sub forum for newbie, remember that, this forums is xda-developers, we develop and share knowledge. We welcome noob, but dont want to spend too much time with noob questions (most of the time I ignore )
xultar said:
Every forum goes through this crap whenever a new flashing starts. Just realise that you were a noob once and get over it.
Just ignore noob posts if you don't want to help them.
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I DO REALIZE THAT! I'm talking about centralizing it & am willing to help. I don't think that this is part of "Every Forum", this is the Kaiser Forum & includes the best & brightest from XDA. So why not make it a different forum, set it apart from the others & make it a better community through helping others. I think this would not only help the noobie, but everyone as a whole would benefit because the upgrading forum would be less cluttered making the search function actually usable to the new guy that doesn't undestand how to narrow his searches.
I understand about not reading, but they'd learn quickly if they see they only get answers if they go to the big bold "NOOBIES START HERE" forum. Especially if there's a sticky that says "Your post WILL be DELETED unless".
GSLEON3 said:
I understand about not reading, but they'd learn quickly if they see they only get answers if they go to the big bold "NOOBIES START HERE" forum. Especially if there's a sticky that says "Your post WILL be DELETED unless".
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There was a stickie?
Which is exactly how that would be met. (So I'm a pessimist...)
We've all asked "n00b" questions, and we should be allowed to do so. If you make a forum called "n00b questions" the same people who don't read the stickies will STILL post in the main forum, and say they didn't see the "n00b questions" forum.
It's unavoidable, and the best thing we can do is help the people who ask these questions by telling them to search, but also providing them the answer, so that they learn and get their answer.
met3ora said:
We've all asked "n00b" questions, and we should be allowed to do so. If you make a forum called "n00b questions" the same people who don't read the stickies will STILL post in the main forum, and say they didn't see the "n00b questions" forum.
It's unavoidable, and the best thing we can do is help the people who ask these questions by telling them to search, but also providing them the answer, so that they learn and get their answer.
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Click to collapse
I still ask dumb questions from time to time. My intent is not to slam the new guy, quite the opposite actually. I'm talking about a sub-forum where they can find the answer & a little support to some of the most common questions & issues that arise when entering the world of Flashing & Upgrading.
A place where a few willing people can hook up with the new comer & use tools klike IM & filesharing to walk the new guy through flashing & problem solving, kind of hands on instruction where you can walk the timid newcomer through his issues while using the tools to show him, through his own action, how to figure things out. Again, a sort of less advanced clearing house of sorts. Not a place of punishment for being new, but more of a "Welcome to XDA, figuring this stuff out can be fun & exciting, let me show you how" type of a place.
I like the noobie, & I really like the noobie that has a "I think my phone is bricked" challenge. I just think it would be a nice touch to have a place for the new guy to go where he could not just find the answers, but the reasoning behind them.
I also know that many don't read the stickies, but people do read the forum headers, the name of the forum & sub-forum, & if they saw "This is the place to get answers about how to flash & fix flash issues, that is where he's gonna go. Everybody else has been here long enough to know that if they have a major contribution, where it should be posted.
It would be like tiered service, most noobie problems are similar & can be handled there, if something more advanced pops up, or a bug detemined to affect many, then the mod or admin bumps it up to the next level.
Oh, & mcmexican you think everyone's an idiot
Maybe this is material for a new thread, but...
I think we should use a new wiki.
1. The wiki software used here is pretty bad.
2. The wiki here takes up bandwidth.
Using something like wetpaint.com (there are many others) provides a place that's different from here, using someone else's bandwidth.
Also, they have easier-to-edit wiki's. I think the more attractive, organized, and navigable the wiki is, the less newbie problems we'll have.
nevermind...
I think the subforum sounds like an excellent idea. I'm not nearly an expert but have done some flashing and so on and would gladly help out if I have the time. Only problem as I can see is that it will be hard to draw the line between the "noob forum" and the regular one.
i am trying for ten minutes to put my thoughts into words...English is not my native language. i hope i am gonna be able to make myself understood...
here is how to do it:
1. create something like a gate or tunnel where newbies have to go through. some thing, where they cant right away post something. they can read.
and if they want to post a tread, they have to go through some kind of selection menu or so. just like on ebay when you want to sell something.
so lets say someone wants to post a tread, there is a selection of main toppings they have to go through. and so on. till they get automatically redirected to the answer of what they were going to ask in the first place...
they are forced to go through some kind of multiple choice thing...
2. i think its super annoying when someone like dutty brings out a new ROM and you want to read through it, to find out what might be wrong with it, just to read a million people saying: cool man, thanks dude blablabla.
don't get me wrong. i love his ROMs. but i should sent him a pm or create a poll thing so people vote on how much they like it. his treads reach easily 2000 replies. 1900 are thank you notes...
thanks dutty,
georgios
I agree. The same people not searching the forums, nor reading stickies, the Wiki, or any FAQ's will post in the regular forums anyway. I think when you get some of these people new to the forum there is so much information they get overwhelmed and just ask in the first place they find.
In another forum I'm a member of we have people asking Verizon questions in the AT&T forum, people asking about CDMA phones in the GSM forum, and such. We really divided it up... there are separate forums for each carrier, and forums for each of the major device manufacturers, then there's the Motorola forum with the Razr subfourm, and then there's the CDMA models and GSM model subforums under that. The vague questions still come... "I want to hack my phone, how do I do that???" When you finally get them to reply back with the model and carrier they have they have almost always posted in the wrong forum.
I guess what I'm saying is that it sounds like a good idea, but the problem will still be there, and seem even worse, because those that post first and read the FAQ's later (If at all) will be posting in the main forum anyway.
-Jay
I am a brand new guy to the board and have only had my Tilt little over a week and have really enjoyed testing and learning all this stuff that a ton of you guys have already mastered. I like the idea of giving us new guys a area where we can try and hash things out ourselves. When you are new you don't mind if guys ask the same questions you just ask 10 mins ago, but I know that must be a pain in the butt to some of the more skilled and seasoned guys around here. I believe if you just leave us on our own where we can go back and read what you guys have already posted for us and then come back and ask questions that we might still have between ourselves then we will figure it out soon enough and lets face it, that is how we all learn. Just my 2 cents, but please make sure you pros do stop by and check on us ever so often so we don't blow up the mobile phone world.
Thanks,
JMan
I like the sub-forum idea. Just to point out, Modaco does something like this... they have a beginner forum. Not that xda has to be like Modaco, but there is a precedent for this...
Absolute Beginners
New to Windows Mobile? New to MoDaCo? Lost and don't know where to start? Post in here and a member of our team will point you in the right direction, and move your post to the appropriate area!
http://www.modaco.com/forum.html
You could make people who like to direct and assist others as the moderators of this forum to act as traffic cops... so to speak. This will leave the cooks to focus on doing great ROMs.
I have a question for a Mod or Admin if they read this... maybe the search problem is a admin setting problem. Can someone verify that vBulletin Search to FULLTEXT inside the admincp of vBulletin?
There are also ways to embed google search into the forum:
http://www.vbulletin.org/forum/showthread.php?threadid=171042
why not create a new one?
I'm new to the forum, and honestly did not fully understand the title of the forum till now - that the forum was primarily for hard core developers. Given the success and ease of Google, we find a gold mine like xda, and fall in love.
So since there is a Kaiser, Kaiser upgrading, and Kaiser Accessories, why can't there be a Kaiser for rookies (took me a while to figure out what what a noob was). That might be a way for us lesser ones ( juniors) to talk, and the genius's out there (seniors) dont subscribe ! Then u would have every right to FLAME anyone on the upgrading forum. Plus we may be more willing to jump in and answer without the guru's watching.
my 2 cents
I think a noobie forum is a good idea. I too have seen alot of hostility towards "stupid" or repeat questions. While I am not exactly a noobie, I still have a dumb question every now and then, that's just the way it goes when one is learning I guess. I often can't find things when I search, when you are very new this is especially hard, because sometimes you don't even know what to search for.
I have received excellent help here from many kind people, and just don't know what I would have done without this forum. But even I, who am not a COMPLETE noobie, got made fun of the other day by a poster, because after reading something several times, I missed something on a page. The poster not only posted twice to point out my stupidity, but even took the time and energy to create a photoshop graphic to show what an idiot I was for missing the information. I thought it was sad that attitude was taken. I ALWAYS go out of my way to help others, with what limited knowledge I have. I often receive PMs of can you help me..., and I try my best to explain things as clearly as I can.
I totally understand that there are many here, who are way too advanced for questions like "how do I make my today look like yours?" And I would never expect them to spend time answering, when there time would be much better spent on more advanced things (and I'm not being sarcastic at all, I really do completely understand more advanced members should spend their time on more advanced things). There are some of us here with some knowledge able to help those with simple questions, so I'd say maybe people who are bothered by others posts, could just ignore the dumb questions. LOL, I've never even flashed a ROM (too chicken and broke to void my warranty), but I sure can put together a great looking and functioning Today screen. An I surely know how to install every tweak and cab to make my phone function as efficiently as possible. And, I will be more than happy to answer questions of that caliber
Maybe a noobie forum could cut down on some of the hostility, and we could help out beginners. I for one would be more than willing to answer any questions that I am capable of answering, and leave those who are more knowledgeable to deal with the hard stuff
OK so i know this is the wrong forum, BUT I came across this and wanted to "bump" it so to speak. This was posted by kyphur in 08 and in a mods sig now. Please read and adhere to the spirit of the post. It is RIGHT ON!!!
I think what a lot of people forget is that this is not a "make my phone neat & kewl" place.
As implied by the name this is technically a Developers forum/community.
Now what does that mean? Well first off it means that there is an expectation that if you are here then you want to customize your device but rather than just installing something that someone packaged you want to understand how it works and maybe even enhance it yourself.
When I first came here with a Blue Angel it was a different environment. PDA Phones were not embraced by the general public because of the expense and complexity (I paid over $400 for my BA). A $400 phone 4 years ago was expensive, today the Tilt is $300 after rebates but with inflation & the rise in the cost of other devices and the fact that there are other sources out there giving them away for $150 our neat bit of kit has become popular with mainstream users.
Now we have a flood of new users who are asking not "How can I do this myself" but more like "Give me the quick fix" without caring to understand the process. See if you read the threads then you get to experience the learning process, you see how the issues were investigated and confirmed. Then you get to watch the different attempts at resolution and learn why some failed while others worked. That is called Development.
The NooB backlash is coming from users who have walked in the development shoes and is directed mainly at those who don't care for the journey but just want the end result or destination.
As a Development Forum we are just as much (if not more) about the journey. I've read so many comments like "I don't have time to read all of the threads" or "I don't care how it works, just that it does". These very statements are contrary to the heart & soul of XDA-Devs and that is why the backlash is so strong.
Let me be very clear on this: IF YOU DON'T CARE ABOUT UNDERSTANDING THE JOURNEY THEN YOU PROBABLY SHOULDN'T BE HERE IN THE FIRST PLACE.
XDA-Devs is about developers & hackers helping each other and working together to get the most out of our devices by understanding them better than most.
XDA-Devs is not about helping everyone who wants a "Kewl bit of kit" make their phone better than the guy next to him.
Now do we go kicking users off who never contribute anything, NO. We tolerate it to an extent. Where the toleration ends is when these users start diluting the usefulness of the forum by repeating the same questions over and over again.
You ask us to understand your position. Well if you want to benefit from our experience and time then I think it is only fair that you understand our position.
Maybe you can recommend an alternative site for people who just want the newest tweaks and software.
the idea is not that only developers should be looking at this site, but that this is a place where developers communicate with each other and the beneficiaries of their work. This is not the place for someone to post threads about general questions about how to use or mod their device. This is a place that will develop the capabilities of the android platform if it is allowed. Developers WILL abandon this forum if it becomes a bulletin board or a technical support site.....and if you need a question answered, there are other forums on THIS site to address those.
Agreed 100%. While developing for the Windows mobile, I also got the same thing. I would post a thread and WARN people of a certain things and tell them how to fix it. Then I'd get 30 pages of "geeze, you broke something. how do you fix it?" That gets annoying real fast. I would love it if this forum forced people to take a test before they could post in the development sections... Before that, they should only be able to post in the regular sections.
One thing that really bugs me is the fact that the newbs don't want to search but don't realize that they take OUR time to search FOR them. No one knows everything. Every developer on this site searches and learns. I know that if you put together all the time that I've spent on this site JUST researching and searching, it'd be MONTHS and MONTHS of non-stop, no sleep searching and researching. So why can't the average person search for 2 minutes? Is their time worth more than my time?
/rant - while talking on the phone so it might not make sense...
Pinesal said:
Maybe you can recommend an alternative site for people who just want the newest tweaks and software.
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There are thousands, but essentially all they do is copy stuff off here.
Like the post said, if you just want to root your phone so it can do 'cool stuff' and not give a **** about how the damn thing works then maybe you shouldn't be modding your phone (that wasn't aimed at you btw, just 'people' in general the market place is made up of 99% 'these people' who don't/can't read and it's pretty irritating.)
Agree with the post 100%, fantastic
we sadly are living in the (ME) world
there is such a huge gape beetween the 10-19 generation and 20-29
10-19 generation is living in such an easy world, they never had to blow into their nintendo cassettes , know how heavy a quantum bigfoot is or what RTFM mean's
You said it, this is in the wrong forum.
You're not an admin and although you can spend your time here (and pretty much all of your posts) reporting out-of-place threads, you're still not an admin.
People always wonder into communities and it always takes a while to learn the way things work. Mickey is doing a good job on closing and moving threads that are unrelated to development.
With that said...
Reported.
Agreed. It's really, really, really, really getting to me. I wish OP's had semi-moderator power. They could at least delete all necessary posts and ban that user - if required- for a certain amount of time from their thread only.
jubeh said:
You said it, this is in the wrong forum.
You're not an admin and although you can spend your time here (and pretty much all of your posts) reporting out-of-place threads, you're still not an admin.
People always wonder into communities and it always takes a while to learn the way things work. Mickey is doing a good job on closing and moving threads that are unrelated to development.
With that said...
Reported.
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ughh, no i'm not an admin, and no almost all my posts, or the majority, or a half are reported threads, but i do try to help out the mods when i can. they are not on all forums at all times and can use the help, and they have said as much.
Oh thank you thank you! People here should want to understand why thing the work as they work. Not just want their phones to look cool.
As it you wouldnt know it, i have been with xda for years well since the titan came out. before that i was modding an ipaq and of course the old palms. everyonce in awhile i lose interest and move on only to come back when i have something new(major a.d.d). i do write java as well as c and even c++(so on) i typically find this place useful to try stuff out and even set up my own custom rom just for me. i dont post because i can google. while i have many of my own questions i would like answered i simply dont ask most of the time(such as using micro kernels and modding app2sd to make the os have two options sd in or out. however the problem is not the generations or age difference or anything like that. its social systems outside of xda. posting a reply used to mean an answer or something useful. now its normal to simply post "great job". thats nice and all but maybe instead of complaining about it we should come up with a new system that improves xda. like a sorting system or sub thread system and set up catagorys for our replys. like thumbs up would be for the "good job". i know its hard to keep everyone happy but this is a forum first, a forum has design problems when you get the number of people xda has. use advanced search it helps a lot. a sorting system with requirements for certain catagorys would help devs. its not easy modding and getting it right and you cant do it alone. xda is the help even if its not your phone sometimes others have solutions too. such as winmo users putting android on their phones(yes i did it too my old titan for fun). things i learned and other devs learn can help us and vice versa. i have yet to find bad technology only poorly thought out ideas that could have been. which is why we mod.
p.s. wtf is up with palm and blackberry ads all the time.
Most of those kids just want the answer or fix in the next 3min. with perfect steps or a patch that supposedly will fix and hack their device,after that they´ll never show up.
All they want is to show off without bothering to read.
I totaly understand. I do feel sometimes that certain devs do get a bit annoyed with people who just want to fix the phone and not understand. I'm not linux or coding wiz. But whe I got here in may I was one of the people who just wanted me phone to be better than urs. I still have that to some extent but I have developed more of a "how and what is causeing this issue" attitude. I try to contribute as best as I can. Helping out over at q&a as best as I can. I enjoy xda and without my days would be more boring than what the are now. I dunno I guess I'm just rambling. Bottom line is I have tried to correct my attitude toward modding. Hell I even post my email so users can drop a line if they need help.
i am 20 and i fondly remember blowing into my nes super nes and genesis games.
i am pretty new to XDA. when i first found this site all i wanted was a quick fix. now i am getting more intrested in the actual dev aspect. i want to be able to create my own rom eventualy. yes i do find myself asking stupid questions and getting some foul responses but in my opinion no question is a stupid one. only the one not asked. yes alot of people just want a fix but there are new users who want to learn. like me. so i appreciate the help i have recieved from most members. and i alwasy appoligise for my stupidity. so dont get down on all noobs because alot of us want to learn and the only way to is to ask.
saprano614 said:
i am pretty new to XDA. when i first found this site all i wanted was a quick fix. now i am getting more intrested in the actual dev aspect. i want to be able to create my own rom eventualy. yes i do find myself asking stupid questions and getting some foul responses but in my opinion no question is a stupid one. only the one not asked. yes alot of people just want a fix but there are new users who want to learn. like me. so i appreciate the help i have recieved from most members. and i alwasy appoligise for my stupidity. so dont get down on all noobs because alot of us want to learn and the only way to is to ask.
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nobody is getting down on noobs. ONLY the site users who FAIL to post questions and general comments in the correct forum
jaaronmoody said:
nobody is getting down on noobs. ONLY the site users who FAIL to post questions and general comments in the correct forum
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Just want to make a statement befor someone did.
I thank you for this post. I came to this forum a long time ago I have learned quite a bit and appreciate everything that is done here. There are very skillful people that are on here and I wish I had the amount of skill then thesemodders, hackers, developers etc... have I keep my mouth shut unless i feel there is some thing that i know how to answer, i have never complained about a single rom i simply research what can be done to change for fix it, all answers rely in a search somewhere either here or google. I just wish other people would do the same then we would be able to prevent a 300+ page threads where only about 25 pages are worth anything.
look at the amount of posts from someone who knows they are barley able to contrubute(but do what he can) and been here this long. compared to people who have been here dont have much to contribute but love to post everything that comes to thier minds.
Join Date
22nd October 2006
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samygent said:
we sadly are living in the (ME) world
there is such a huge gape beetween the 10-19 generation and 20-29
10-19 generation is living in such an easy world, they never had to blow into their nintendo cassettes , know how heavy a quantum bigfoot is or what RTFM mean's
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
HEY!
im 18 and clearly remember blowing into those damn games to make them work. but when they worked, so much fun i still think theyre better than the crappy xbox and ps3 games of today... but thats just me. lol
pleeease yall! let's keep THIS thread on topic! LOL!!
i want to get involved in the community and help bring great things to this device and any other that i can. i have a degree in computer information systems, do systems imaging, and know enough to get by, tweak, and customize, but linux was never taught to me . it is pretty straight forward. i understand the concept, language, and most of the commands, but i am not a programmer by trade. i do know that you don't even have to actually know a lot of languages because, in many cases, there is another program that you can tell what you want to happen and it will write the base language for you. if somebody can point me in the right direction and/or give me a task to help them with, i would love to do so.
thank you
don't mean to sound ignorant. just wanna help.
That's a fantastic attitude, and welcome to the doubleshot forums.
The MT4G Slide Compendium is a sticky at the top of general here, and is a great starting point to familiarize yourself with the doubleshot forums. It has links to a lot of the relevant threads scattered around here, as well as some explanations of terminology and so forth. It's designed to help orient you with everything we have going on here.
Here is a link to my Guide Index, which is a collection of tutorials and such i've put here and is also in my sig. The bottom of the post has links to a lot of information about the device off-site, manufacturer and so forth.
One of the best things you can do if you aren't contributing code is to contribute documentation. How to do basically anything you want to do is spread out all over XDA as a whole. If information can be referenced and concentrated here into the MT4GS sub-forums, it would make it easier for people to develop for the device.
Not having to scour XDA at large to figure out how to do something, and someone taking the time to explain how to do it here and provide links to track down more information is always helpful.
I know in searching XDA to learn how to do these things, it's been helpful for others to have been making summaries and guides on how to do them - sharing it here paves the way for others who come behind you and want to learn how to do what you're learning.
And if you aren't interested in posting guides on how to do the things you've learned, then just taking the time to answer questions people ask on the board about the device if you know the answer is a way to be helpful. The longer you hang out here, the more you learn, and the people coming behind you are curious too.
The longer you hang out here, too, you come to learn where information is and in what threads - you can direct newer people by answering questions with links to the relevant threads or posts since you already know what they are. It only takes a few minutes to track down the information if you have a good idea of where it is.
Because XDA is pretty much where we figure out a lot of the new stuff, the board grows randomly, and information gets scattered with pieces here and there in threads to solve problems and such. When people ask questions you can link to the scattered pieces and by doing so it helps index everything we are learning.
Basically, the desire to help is all that you need and these are some ways people can do so without in-depth technical knowledge. You're probably combing the boards learning things anyway, so when people have similar questions explaining what you know helps us all.
We all have different ways of learning, so sharing how you did can teach others new methods and ways of doing beyond just how to do the specific thing itself.
It sounds like you are as excited about all this as some of us are here, and with a device like the doubleshot in your hands I don't blame you.
Any questions just ask, as long as you aren't posting random questions in the dev sections it's all good.
Once again, welcome to the MT4GS forums, you'll have a blast with us here.
Edit:
Kernel stuff is in C flavor language, Android stuff itself is mostly Java, and if you don't have the program Notepad-plus-plus you should pick that up for making mostly all of your general coding edits on the computer with.
Thank you. I am excited. My first device that I toyed with was an htc leo 1024 (us), so I had an edasy entry into the world just because there are so many resources available for it. I will start by posting a couple of guides about things that I know were difficult to grasp/follow when I first started. Thank you very much for the directions and taking the time to post them and reply to me. Time to study...
Sent from my myTouch_4G_Slide using XDA App
That's fantastic.
This is my second Android device, first phone - the other one is a Nook Color.
Much like how you say having a lot of dev interest in the device you came from helped you (and man, does it ever) the advantage the Nook Color had was it's unbrickable. It boots from the MicroSD first, before internal memory, and you can run a self-contained copy of Android from the MicroSD card.
I got a chance to break it in so many different ways, (who needs a build.prop ... let's just delete that) and all I had to do was pop out the memory card and flash a fresh copy of CM7 onto it.
The internal memory is still the stock Barnes & Noble skinned operating system, hasn't been rooted or anything, yet I was still able to get the full-on Android experience in a safe play zone.
Coming to this phone, it's taught me ahead of time what I can and can't mess with before bad things start to happen, and it's a lot easier to play with this stuff if you know where the lines are. The ones you get in trouble if you cross.
It really wasn't until I got my hands on this device that I started to get into a lot of dev work on Android - but now i'm having an absolute blast with it and this device is pretty impressive.
I can't wait to read about what tricks you've picked up along the way, i'm always looking for an opportunity to be educated. Take some time and see what we've got laid out here, in some cases you may be able to add to existing threads instead of making new ones for duplicate topics.
The MT4GS is what, 6 months old now? We'll keep getting more people in here as they come to their upgrades or get warrantied up to this device. I'm eagerly awaiting more devs to end up in our corner of the forums, i'm curious to see what kind of cool things people can make the device do.
The more information we have organized and mapped out about the device and how to do things with it, the easier it gets for people who come behind because they don't have to re-invent the wheel just to get something done.
It's mind boggling to me how much i've learned in the past year here at XDA, especially in the last few months. It's all because people take the time to sit down and explain how they've done the things they've done and are excited to share their discoveries.
Having this device since before root was viable, i've watched this section of XDA grow from literally just a handful of threads into what it is now - pretty soon we'll have a majority of the resources right here for people to just show up and get work done with minimal fuss.
I know my dev time is hit or miss, sometimes I have days on end, other times not - one way i've been trying to help when i'm not around is leaving how-to's and guides behind me that people can reference while i'm gone.
There's still a whole lot that I haven't even gotten into yet, and i'm very appreciative of people taking the time to share some cool discovery or trick that's made their life a lot easier.
(sometimes I ramble a bit, especially when on boring conference calls)
I came to XDA to learn how to do some fun stuff with my Nook Color, and maybe learn how to write apps for the market. Here I am writing ROMs and nowhere close to putting any apps in the market. With the library of knowledge that XDA is everytime I sit down at the keyboard I learn something new, I wish i'd found this place a long long time before I did - it feels like home.
that's pretty cool about the nook color. i may have to pick one up to play with. i'm sure there are all kinds of neat things to be figured out (and easily implemented) with a device that boots from an external source before the internal.
i got pretty lucky with my hd2. as soon as i saw that there was a way to do it, i had to figure it out (of course). however, instead of reading all of the instructions and bulletins on correct procedure, like an intelligent person... you can probably guess where i'm going with that... and VIOLA! an expensive paperweight.
i was very lucky that phone is setup the way it is and for resources like you and some of the other devs and especially the others that learned by trial and error and took the time to post their experiences.
In an attempt to not step on the lawn, I am going to try and make my first post useful to other noobs, regardless of my own ability level.
I see that others have made a "my first phone" thread in other sections using search, and I did not notice one in this forum yet. I don't know if this post will make it past muster or not, or if it will be the same as other kinds of posts, but the way I see it, it would be rad if I came to xda/htc/attonex and found a post identical to this one, that had started a couple months ago. Alas, time travel isn't available.
My problem is that I am literally experiencing this phone as my first smartphone ever, and I am too ignorant to even know what a good question is. So I find myself with a quandary. On the one hand, I am tech savvy enough to know that my phone is capable of more than at&t/htc wants to let on, and I know that there is this sea of people that know a lot about this stuff. On the other hand, I don't even know what phones can really do, why I would want it to do those things, or how to go about learning the smart and safe way to do those things without fear of "bricking" my new toy.
It's really daunting to look at this forum for a noob. I need some good info on android as well as good info on my phone, and just browsing the forum for the last few days has led me to more questions and more complex questions before I have the basics, and I feel like that's going to get me in trouble here.
If people could do the following in response to this post: point me in the right direction for informative posts/websites/forums/etc on android, specifically basic OS functionality & rooting basics for people who do not understand/use linux; point me to informative beginner oriented (not just reviews or w/e, but basics) posts/websites/forums/etc on the at&t1x, specifically anything that is not on the htc site or the at&t site, which is basically my understanding level right now; if i ask stupid questions about your thought-out posts in here and i totally miss your point, please be patient with me; point me to apps and app stores, I have only used the play store - I know there is more out there, but freaked out about viruses and stuff.
I know I'm asking for a lot of hand-holding, but I promise that after the movie we can make out if you want. I'm not stupid, but I am certainly ignorant about androids. HALP.
YouTube is you friend, there are some great walkthroughs on there. Along with read,read,read. Welcome to XDA, ENJOY your time here, you are off to a very advanced start, great phone choice along with grea first post...the force is strong with this one:thumbup:
Sent from my HTC One X using Tapatalk 2
@MichaelHaley
You wouldn't happen to be from Buffalo New York would you?
Sent from my Rooted Hox
What I did when I started was just look at posts and any word or anything at all that I didn't understand i just Googled it. I learned alot like that.
Sent from my HTC One X using XDA
http://droidlessons.com/
E.Cadro said:
@MichaelHaley
You wouldn't happen to be from Buffalo New York would you?
Sent from my Rooted Hox
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nope. California.
bradleyG said:
What I did when I started was just look at posts and any word or anything at all that I didn't understand i just Googled it. I learned alot like that.
Sent from my HTC One X using XDA
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't have a problem with understanding words, but thanks.
filthyfnj24 said:
droidlessons - link which i can not post yet
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is the kind of stuff I'm looking for, I figure people here would know which ones like this are quality vs. time wasters. This level and slightly above is about where I'm at. Thanks a lot.
MichaelHaley said:
Nope. California.
I don't have a problem with understanding words, but thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't think he meant basic words. But stuff like adb shell. Asop. Root. S off. S on. Just to name a few. If you don't know this basic words, your time here will be a pain.
Sent from my HTC One XL using XDA
tae_254 said:
I don't think he meant basic words. But stuff like adb shell. Asop. Root. S off. S on. Just to name a few. If you don't know this basic words, your time here will be a pain.
Sent from my HTC One XL using XDA
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Lists of useful words and terms are awesome! Thanks! Please add!
MichaelHaley said:
Lists of useful words and terms are awesome! Thanks! Please add!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're still missing bradleyG's original point. If there are esoteric terms you don't understand, just Google them. This will help you out:
http://bit.ly/KSfCM7
Boom. That was easy.
Seriously, Google is your friend, as is the XDA search. You're not going to think of a question that hasn't already been answered at length on XDA. Maybe not for the One X, specifically, since the device is so new. But for general Android stuff, just doing a general search using the XDA function, of Googling will probably get you an answer within a few minutes. For that matter, just spend some time browsing through the General, and Q&A forums, and reading the threads that look of interest to you. In no time at all, you'll have some decent working knowledge. The learning curve may look intimidating from where you are. But don't worry, its really not that bad. Seriously, just a few hours of reading on XDA will probably put above the knowledge level of the majority of smartphone owners.
If you are truly stumped after searching and reading on your own, post a question in Q&A. But do your due diligence first. Simple reason for this is that the forum would become useless if it was clogged up by every single question that beginners think up.
And welcome to the club. The One X is a helluva first smartphone.
redpoint73 said:
You're still missing bradleyG's original point. If there are esoteric terms you don't understand, just Google them. This will help you out:
http://bit.ly/KSfCM7
Boom. That was easy.
Seriously, Google is your friend, as is the XDA search. You're not going to think of a question that hasn't already been answered at length on XDA. Maybe not for the One X, specifically, since the device is so new. But for general Android stuff, just doing a general search using the XDA function, of Googling will probably get you an answer within a few minutes. For that matter, just spend some time browsing through the General, and Q&A forums, and reading the threads that look of interest to you. In no time at all, you'll have some decent working knowledge. The learning curve may look intimidating from where you are. But don't worry, its really not that bad. Seriously, just a few hours of reading on XDA will probably put above the knowledge level of the majority of smartphone owners.
If you are truly stumped after searching and reading on your own, post a question in Q&A. But do your due diligence first. Simple reason for this is that the forum would become useless if it was clogged up by every single question that beginners think up.
And welcome to the club. The One X is a helluva first smartphone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ai ai ai. Thanks for the help dude, but my whole point is that I don't even know enough to know what kinds of questions I should be having. Once I get started, I can use forum searches and google well, so for specific questions I will need very little help. I'm just not coming up with any questions.
Picture me sitting there, staring at the phone, hoping it will do something, looking puzzled when it doesn't, and then start posting links.
I see what you're saying. What you are asking for is really too broad a topic to write a guide or anything like that. As a start, just try looking through the threads in the various forums. Development subforum has mods (modifications) and stuff along those lines. The Themes and Apps subforum will give you some ideas on some cool apps and widgets. You'll quickly get a good idea of what possibilities are out there. And trust me, plenty of specific questions will pop up in your mind soon enough.
Since you are brand new to the smartphone world, apps is a good place to start. Just Google around for best Android apps and see what interests you. Even the Play Store has some issues with malware and other malicious software. But these are usually less popular apps, made by shady software developers. If you read up on best apps at reputable websites like PCMag, Gizmodi, CNET, you shouldn't go wrong. The more popular, tried and true apps tend to be very safe. Lots of the best functionality of smartphones is through apps, so this is a good place to start.
My advice would be to use the device for a while, and see what it can do running stock before you think about rooting and other mods. Unless you are looking at specific mods (removing bloatware or adding back some of the things that AT&T removed like FM radio and flashlight) you probably shouldn't be considering root just yet.
Android Central is a good website with lots of information that you should find interesting if this is your first android device. They have put together a really good android dictionary which is found here: http://www.androidcentral.com/dictionary
They also run an android a to z series on their blog which has a ton of info and goes a little more in depth than just giving definitions.
Enjoy your phone, for a first smart phone you picked a serious winner! There are a few quarks (which are all outlined pretty well in this forum) but for the most part this phone is great.
bradleyG said:
What I did when I started was just look at posts and any word or anything at all that I didn't understand i just Googled it. I learned alot like that.
Sent from my HTC One X using XDA
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Cant beat this advice. Read everything, assume your questions has already been asked. The more you read, the more questions you'll have and then the more reading you'll want to do to find the answers. This website is really a PHENOMENAL resource, but I find myself constantly googling terms/comments/procedures that I dont understand. I'm quite technologically inclined but relatively new to the android world and have only been using XDA for a couple months. However, I find myself mostly only posting on very topical threads. For the hardcore technical research and development, I prefer to sit back and just read about the amazing work that the developers are doing. Welcome!
I'll second what everyone else said. I was where you were a few months ago. Though I came from four years on iOS, I was an Android noob. I've been reading and browsing xda and other sites just trying to get my bearings. It's very intimidating at first, but you've just got to start somewhere. Start reading, trying to get the general gist of things before worrying about the exact terminology. Bit by bit things will start sounding familiar, and you'll have some context to start framing your searches. Really, they're not kidding about 99.99% of noob questions being already answered somewhere; you've just got to know the right way to ask.
Just be patient and don't give up. Three weeks into my One X ownership, I'm rooted and gradually getting some confidence in modding my phone. (I was an experienced iOS jailbreaker, but life is different over here in a lot of ways.)
redpoint73 said:
You're still missing bradleyG's original point. If there are esoteric terms you don't understand, just Google them. This will help you out:
http://bit.ly/KSfCM7
Boom. That was easy.
Seriously, Google is your friend, as is the XDA search. You're not going to think of a question that hasn't already been answered at length on XDA. Maybe not for the One X, specifically, since the device is so new. But for general Android stuff, just doing a general search using the XDA function, of Googling will probably get you an answer within a few minutes. For that matter, just spend some time browsing through the General, and Q&A forums, and reading the threads that look of interest to you. In no time at all, you'll have some decent working knowledge. The learning curve may look intimidating from where you are. But don't worry, its really not that bad. Seriously, just a few hours of reading on XDA will probably put above the knowledge level of the majority of smartphone owners.
If you are truly stumped after searching and reading on your own, post a question in Q&A. But do your due diligence first. Simple reason for this is that the forum would become useless if it was clogged up by every single question that beginners think up.
And welcome to the club. The One X is a helluva first smartphone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is exactly what I meant. There is no all powerful guide that will teach you everything you need to know. It takes time to learn all these things and only diligence will prove to give you what you need. I remember when I first got my g1 I didn't know anything. I started looking for mods/hacks I could do to it and stumbled upon xda. Then I found out about rooting so I looked up stuff about rooting like what are the benefits of it, the risks, and tutorials. Then one thing leads to another rooting leads to ROMs and kernels, kernels lead to overclocking, etc. You'll soon be an expert and have advice to give other people. The more you read, the better. But you will never get to a point where there is nothing new to be learned, you will eventually make a habit of looking up different things after you do it for so long. Just stick with it and you will get the hang of it.
Sent from my HTC One X using XDA
redpoint73 said:
I see what you're saying. What you are asking for is really too broad a topic to write a guide or anything like that. As a start, just try looking through the threads in the various forums. Development subforum has mods (modifications) and stuff along those lines. The Themes and Apps subforum will give you some ideas on some cool apps and widgets. You'll quickly get a good idea of what possibilities are out there. And trust me, plenty of specific questions will pop up in your mind soon enough.
Since you are brand new to the smartphone world, apps is a good place to start. Just Google around for best Android apps and see what interests you. Even the Play Store has some issues with malware and other malicious software. But these are usually less popular apps, made by shady software developers. If you read up on best apps at reputable websites like PCMag, Gizmodi, CNET, you shouldn't go wrong. The more popular, tried and true apps tend to be very safe. Lots of the best functionality of smartphones is through apps, so this is a good place to start.
My advice would be to use the device for a while, and see what it can do running stock before you think about rooting and other mods. Unless you are looking at specific mods (removing bloatware or adding back some of the things that AT&T removed like FM radio and flashlight) you probably shouldn't be considering root just yet.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes thank you for that, I know that apps are about my speed right now but my sights are set UP!! Hehe. I really was trying to figure out about the flashlight and FM radio already, but couldn't find a setting in the phone. Is that a root thing? I also hate bloat ware, even if i can disable it, i know MOG Radio & AT&T IdiotWare is there, just taking up space, and it bugs the hell out of me! I also want to do things like check out vanilla android so I can know what sense is, but i understand that requires a bootloader? Which I am reading about.. but that seems like some pretty advanced stuff.. I'll get there hopefully.
bmolloy said:
Android Central is a good website with lots of information that you should find interesting if this is your first android device. They have put together a really good android dictionary which is found here: http://www.androidcentral.com/dictionary
They also run an android a to z series on their blog which has a ton of info and goes a little more in depth than just giving definitions.
Enjoy your phone, for a first smart phone you picked a serious winner! There are a few quarks (which are all outlined pretty well in this forum) but for the most part this phone is great.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes thank you very much, this is exactly the kind of specific stuff I'm looking for, not that general advice isn't great too!
bradleyG said:
This is exactly what I meant. There is no all powerful guide that will teach you everything you need to know. It takes time to learn all these things and only diligence will prove to give you what you need. I remember when I first got my g1 I didn't know anything. I started looking for mods/hacks I could do to it and stumbled upon xda. Then I found out about rooting so I looked up stuff about rooting like what are the benefits of it, the risks, and tutorials. Then one thing leads to another rooting leads to ROMs and kernels, kernels lead to overclocking, etc. You'll soon be an expert and have advice to give other people. The more you read, the better. But you will never get to a point where there is nothing new to be learned, you will eventually make a habit of looking up different things after you do it for so long. Just stick with it and you will get the hang of it.
Sent from my HTC One X using XDA
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think I may have come off more adversarial to you than I meant to.. I wasn't trying to minimize what you said.. Of course research is essential, and I plan to not bug you guys with stupid questions as much as possible.. I'm just trying to build a repository of reference for complete noobtards like me here in this thread so it's all in one place. When I have specific questions about terms and things I will of course employ due diligence before I bring that stuff to the community, but like I said, I'm not even there yet..
OK so I have a question that I tried to search for and came up with nil. Every so often, when I run this or that program, or sometimes on start up, some of my icons do one of two things: 1.) they lose the text under the icon, 2.) they lose the text under the icon and the icon turns into the generic android icon.
Wutdo?
MichaelHaley said:
OK so I have a question that I tried to search for and came up with nil. Every so often, when I run this or that program, or sometimes on start up, some of my icons do one of two things: 1.) they lose the text under the icon, 2.) they lose the text under the icon and the icon turns into the generic android icon.
Wutdo?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Restart/ force close the launcher. Or get a new launcher like go or nova.
Cryosx said:
Restart/ force close the launcher. Or get a new launcher like go or nova.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I feel like a complete tard, but after searching and finding nothing, I can't figure out how to do what you're saying.
Cryosx said:
Restart/ force close the launcher. Or get a new launcher like go or nova.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Is that just like the proper way to say restart the phone?
I've been an XDA user for a few years now, and for the most part I have found it to be a great source of help and information across a wide range of devices and platforms... up until recently.
I have always had a strong interest in mobile phones/devices. And when I got my first smart phone in 2008 my interest was piqued further. I am not a developer, and I don’t intend on becoming one. I am a user. I love customization, apps, games and everything about smart phones (started on Winows Mobile, and I now use Android).
The way I understand it… XDA was started as a developer’s site/forum… for developers. Over the years it began to evolve into a non-exclusive community. Anyone could ask for help on any range of smart phone topics – which I thought was great.
Lately it seems that XDA has been trying to get back to their roots… that is to say, they are trying to make the forums more developer exclusive. I can only say that is a bad thing from a selfish stand point. Of course if I were a developer I might take issue with my forums being flooded with non-developer related (and therefore… irrelevant) threads and posts. I am in no position to criticize the site managers about what type of site they wish to run and how they want to run it. But XDA is becoming useless to me. It is becoming increasingly difficult to find help on non-development related topics.
So… Can someone please recommend another (more user-orientated) site? I like to ask questions on a range of topics; some device specific, some about how to use apps, some game hints, some general android queries, app recommendations, etc. Is there a better forum for a user like me?
Thanks for any help.
I used to frequent http://www.teambamf.net/ when I had my HTC Thunderbolt, Yea, it was my first smart phone.
They do a lot with Samsung phones, you might want to take a look and see what they have to offer.
CharlesTheMan is willing to help anyone who asks, they're good guys.
If you can't find what you want there, just ask, they can tell you what you need to do and recommend where to go if they can't answer your questions.
It always pays to search for different alternatives, I work in an IT department as a programmer, systems network analyst and a webmaster.
Don't always use the same search engine, change up, use Bing or Dogpile or many others to find what you need.
I can spend hours researching for what I need, there is so much out there now you just need to learn "Where To Look", per say.
Good luck and remember, if you don't find what you are looking for, look somewhere else!!
G.
Hi G,
Thanks for taking the time to reply. I almost always do a pretty extensive google search before coming hear to post. I rarely use bing or anyother search engine before coming here to ask... will certainly give it a go.
Thanks again.
I don't think there's another forum as great as XDA
but if you could be more specific or if you like MIUI rom, you can find everything about it here miuiandroid[dot]com
retslagoon said:
I don't think there's another forum as great as XDA
but if you could be more specific or if you like MIUI rom, you can find everything about it here miuiandroid[dot]com
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
hi retslagoon,
I do not have any particular question at this time. But thanks for your reply.
One issue I have with 'being specific' (and I think I might find this hard to explain) is that I can spend quite a bit of time typing out a questing/post (and trying to be clear and specific), while wording correctly; only to have it be ignored - for whatever reason. So the entire exercise ends up being a waste of time.
I do not know why so many simple questions get ignored on these forums, there could be a range of reasons (either because people don't know the answers to them, or because people don't bother to read them; I also wonder if it is due to the fact that some of these unanswered questions are not at all development related and therefor are intentionally ignored to teach the poster a lesson about posting on a development forum).
Eitherway, XDA is not satisfying my search for help/advice and information.
Thanks again.
[email protected] said:
hi retslagoon,
I do not have any particular question at this time. But thanks for your reply.
One issue I have with 'being specific' (and I think I might find this hard to explain) is that I can spend quite a bit of time typing out a questing/post (and trying to be clear and specific), while wording correctly; only to have it be ignored - for whatever reason. So the entire exercise ends up being a waste of time.
I do not know why so many simple questions get ignored on these forums, there could be a range of reasons (either because people don't know the answers to them, or because people don't bother to read them; I also wonder if it is due to the fact that some of these unanswered questions are not at all development related and therefor are intentionally ignored to teach the poster a lesson about posting on a development forum).
Eitherway, XDA is not satisfying my search for help/advice and information.
Thanks again.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My experience is that often threads are unnecessarily started: A quick Google-search before in most cases would have given the answer(s) requested. At least if the issue(s) is/are device independent. So you must not wonder a post istn't replied.