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Why the Tegra2 shouldn't keep you from the Nexus S.

http://smartphonebenchmarks.com/for...ion-samsungs-implementation-of-arm-cortex-a9/
^^^^^^
I'm sick of hearing people cry omg Tegra2 awesome. NO. It's great, but it's not going to make the Hummingbird obsolete. The Hummingbird has a better GPU. Balance it out and you get unnoticeable performance gains from a Tegra2. Not to mention the Tegra2 phones are coming out with Froyo which simply put doesn't have dual core optimizations, so in the end, it might even be SLOWER than the Nexus S.
What you should be waiting for is the Snapdragon and OMAP dual cores as well as the Orion. But these won't be out for a while, so why not get the Nexus S?
It's either or in this case. Don't choose a Tegra2 phone because it's a Tegra2. Choose it because it is the right phone you want, that will get upgades when you want, and is on the right carrier you want. Get a Tegra2 or a Hummingbird, that's all I have to say. They're about equal.
Just sick of the overpraise that the Tegra2 gets when we already have that power in the Nexus S.
NVIDIA - they went from ARM11 (Tegra 1) to Cortex A9 (Tegra 2), skipping Cortex A8 design altogether. Tegra 2's CPU core will be competitive but its GPU appears to be weaker than even PowerVR SGX540. Heck, even Qualcomm's Adreno 205 may outperform this GPU. On the plus side, Tegra 2 is already available on the market NOW, and smartphones based on Tegra 2 will appear during Q4 of 2010. (Read this article for more details on Tegra 2). Samsung, LG and Motorola have announced their intention of producing phones based on Tegra 2 so far.
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Power SGX540 = Hummingbird.
By no means am I saying to not get a Tegra2. All I'm saying is to not avoid the Hummingbird because you think the Tegra2 is that much better or something.

Right on anderoid! Love hummingbird but I think I must have something wrong inside me. Kind off topic but I've had a siezure before and some epileptics electromagnetic field messes up semsitive electronics. After my workhorse 2 year old g1 I've had about 16 phones since then. 6 vibrants, 4 mytouch4g and warrantying my 5th and soon to be 6th sns. Granted not all problems have been pure hardware but these bleeding edge phones seem to be either fragile or sensitive.
That said, I love the nexus s. I loved humingbird in my vibrant and the awesome codecs but rfs and touchwiz and lag fixes drove me nuts. The nexus s on paper is amazing. Once you skin the outside or put a case, the scratch issue is pretty null and its such a clean beautiful phone. Cheap feeling? My ass. And it doesn't look anything like an iphone. The speed and battery life of hummingbird is amazing. Once google polishes gingerbread, especially gpu drivers or apps that jive better with it, I think people will regret passing it over. I've never had any slowdowns with it and dungeon defenders with no hacks or oc runs flawless.
Tegra 2 might turn out amazing but after tegra one was such a non starter (did it even make it into a phone?) And the gpu (nvidias pc meat and potatoes) not being as strong as an 8+ mo hummingbird, it seems to be a very short lived "king" if it amounts to that. I might end up very wrong but we will have to see what they bring when they finally go retail. The fact that the atrix needs a 1900mah battery scares me a bit. Maybe its needed for the extra ram and motoblur stuff, or extra resolution, but does anyone else not think it will get better battery life than the iphone4 or even the sns?
Sent from my HTC Dream using XDA App

If you're that desperate for a Tegra branded chip, hang onto your Nexus S until next Christmas and go for a quad core Tegra 3...

Jayrod1980 said:
Right on anderoid! Love hummingbird but I think I must have something wrong inside me. Kind off topic but I've had a siezure before and some epileptics electromagnetic field messes up semsitive electronics. After my workhorse 2 year old g1 I've had about 16 phones since then. 6 vibrants, 4 mytouch4g and warrantying my 5th and soon to be 6th sns. Granted not all problems have been pure hardware but these bleeding edge phones seem to be either fragile or sensitive.
That said, I love the nexus s. I loved humingbird in my vibrant and the awesome codecs but rfs and touchwiz and lag fixes drove me nuts. The nexus s on paper is amazing. Once you skin the outside or put a case, the scratch issue is pretty null and its such a clean beautiful phone. Cheap feeling? My ass. And it doesn't look anything like an iphone. The speed and battery life of hummingbird is amazing. Once google polishes gingerbread, especially gpu drivers or apps that jive better with it, I think people will regret passing it over. I've never had any slowdowns with it and dungeon defenders with no hacks or oc runs flawless.
Tegra 2 might turn out amazing but after tegra one was such a non starter (did it even make it into a phone?) And the gpu (nvidias pc meat and potatoes) not being as strong as an 8+ mo hummingbird, it seems to be a very short lived "king" if it amounts to that. I might end up very wrong but we will have to see what they bring when they finally go retail. The fact that the atrix needs a 1900mah battery scares me a bit. Maybe its needed for the extra ram and motoblur stuff, or extra resolution, but does anyone else not think it will get better battery life than the iphone4 or even the sns?
Sent from my HTC Dream using XDA App
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THANK YOU, WELL SAID...I was explaining this to someone the other day and it just wasnt making sense to them for som reason

Well you have the right spirit but little miss informed. What you fail to see is it has dual die so 2 proc thread can run each at 1ghz compared to 1 die 1ghz. I love how Samsung folks always has to bring the GPU in it whats your point? SGX540 is slightly by very small margin wins against Adreno 205. So does that mean NS can hold its ground with MT4G it has better GPU following your argument? No why due to higher memory that is allocated at faster speed.
But I myself would be waiting for Qualcomm to deploy dualcore for me thats when its serious business. Far as Samsung device goes it is already obsolete this is not rant of any from if you want to be head in the Tech world then you better have money for the changes which you will be required every 4-6months.

Jayrod1980 said:
Right on anderoid! Love hummingbird but I think I must have something wrong inside me. Kind off topic but I've had a siezure before and some epileptics electromagnetic field messes up semsitive electronics. After my workhorse 2 year old g1 I've had about 16 phones since then. 6 vibrants, 4 mytouch4g and warrantying my 5th and soon to be 6th sns. Granted not all problems have been pure hardware but these bleeding edge phones seem to be either fragile or sensitive.
That said, I love the nexus s. I loved humingbird in my vibrant and the awesome codecs but rfs and touchwiz and lag fixes drove me nuts. The nexus s on paper is amazing. Once you skin the outside or put a case, the scratch issue is pretty null and its such a clean beautiful phone. Cheap feeling? My ass. And it doesn't look anything like an iphone. The speed and battery life of hummingbird is amazing. Once google polishes gingerbread, especially gpu drivers or apps that jive better with it, I think people will regret passing it over. I've never had any slowdowns with it and dungeon defenders with no hacks or oc runs flawless.
Tegra 2 might turn out amazing but after tegra one was such a non starter (did it even make it into a phone?) And the gpu (nvidias pc meat and potatoes) not being as strong as an 8+ mo hummingbird, it seems to be a very short lived "king" if it amounts to that. I might end up very wrong but we will have to see what they bring when they finally go retail. The fact that the atrix needs a 1900mah battery scares me a bit. Maybe its needed for the extra ram and motoblur stuff, or extra resolution, but does anyone else not think it will get better battery life than the iphone4 or even the sns?
Sent from my HTC Dream using XDA App
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Don't get me wrong, I love my Nexus S. Having had an Epic and an Evo I can easily say this is the most powerful phone I've ever owned; a fact that the people in the epic IRC like to try and dispute as we've established a stable 1.5GHz OC and they've never gone over 1.2GHz.
I love the graphics power it possesses and I definitely love that my friends with iPhones get jealous of how gorgeous the screen is and how blazingly fast the phone runs, even bone stock. However, I do have a few qualms:
I remember when the Nexus one came out. I still had a dumbphone but I had started looking at phones to get and then I found the Nexus One. It was by and large the most powerful phone on the market, nothing else even came close. Being on T-Mobile had given me access to the HTC Dream (G1) and the HTC Magic (MyTouch 3G) and neither of those phones were even close to what the Nexus One could do. Sadly, I was on a family plan and I couldn't afford to buy it off contract so I settled for a MT3G.
The memory of it faded and I had a chance to get off of my Family Plan on T-Mobile and join my wife on Sprint (who were going to be getting the Epic 4G) so I did it. Of course, it was a massive upgrade from my MT3G but I never particularly liked it. Eventually, I traded my Epic for an Evo and it was great. Not as fast or as powerful but I still quite enjoyed it. Then again, I had a chance to leave Sprint (I'd been very unhappy with them from the start) so I went back to T-Mobile and having read a little about the Nexus S I decided to buy one for both myself and my wife.
Again, don't get me wrong, I absolutely love it and so does my wife, but really when it comes down to brass tacks the Nexus S is pretty much a Vibrant without TouchWiz and with a NFC chip and a LED flash. The 'WOW' factor I had with the original Nexus just isn't there.
Is there anything wrong with the Hummingbird chip? Absolutely not. Its the most powerful processor in any phone on the market in the US without a doubt. But the Nexus line, to me, should be the pinnacle of Android performance. It should be the shining example of what the platform can do and where its going (like the Nexus One did with the Snapdragon and its eventual acceptance into most high-performance phones) and not feel like a re-badged five month old phone even if that phone is one of the best on the market. Had Samsung held off a little bit and made the Nexus S a dual-core phone I think it would easily usurp the Motorola Atrix from its lofty throne but as it stands it feels (and seems to be selling) like an afterthought.
Now, I'm still on the fence about these Tegra2 phones. Of course the gadget-whore in me wants to run out and buy one but the sensible part of me wants to see how they run and see how badly they eat battery life (as I'm sure no one can dispute they will). Will I eventually get one? Its more than likely, but I can't say when as I'm pretty happy with the Nexus S and I really like that updates are pushed out from Google and not a carrier or a manufacturer focused on selling more new handsets and less on supporting the ones they've already sold. Only time will tell.
That's just my two cents though.

I typically buy every new phone that comes out to try them and see if I liked it more them my blackberry bold 9700.. I would always end up selling them on ebay bc I didn't find much to love about them (i.e.- g2, vibrant, mt3g, g1 etc), after buying the nexus s, I was hooked. I had a nexus 1 for about two months and then sold that. It cracks me up to hear all the people already downing this nexus s. this phone is solid. I won't be switching to another phone unless it is pure google, no sense or touch whiz, and accompanies higher data speeds. A dual core would be nice , but until that happens, my nexus s is what I'm sticking with!
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA App

The simple fact is Tegra 2 and the Hummingbird wont stand a chance against Qualcomms dual core processors. Android at this point in time is more optimised for Qualcomm and being an owner of the Desire HD and Nexus S i can tell you the desire HD is much smoother even with its HTC Sense bloatware. But i can't stand waiting for updates so i gave it to my sister. But my advice would be don't get any Tegra 2 devices and just wait for the big guns (qualcomm)!

nice GPU is nice, but GPU is mostly for games......for kids....you kids wanna play some games, get yourself an xbox or some ****....

bratfink said:
The simple fact is Tegra 2 and the Hummingbird wont stand a chance against Qualcomms dual core processors. Android at this point in time is more optimised for Qualcomm and being an owner of the Desire HD and Nexus S i can tell you the desire HD is much smoother even with its HTC Sense bloatware. But i can't stand waiting for updates so i gave it to my sister. But my advice would be don't get any Tegra 2 devices and just wait for the big guns (qualcomm)!
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Agreed, as when Qualcomm drops it thats when you know its serious business. Terga2 for the time being will hold the crown and make no mistake Hummingbird does not stand a chance against it.

Orion is going to be the fastest duel core chipset in 2011. The cpu can clock close to 2 ghz per core. Will have the same features that Qualcomms have that allow high linpack benchmarks (but not real world improvements). The hummingbird has always been the faster cpu atthe same mhz then Qualcomms cpus. Orion chipset is using a quad core gpu that performs better then xbox 360 gpu. I can not find any duel core that out performs these specs.

LOL?
shep211 said:
Orion is going to be the fastest duel core chipset in 2011. The cpu can clock close to 2 ghz per core. Will have the same features that Qualcomms have that allow high linpack benchmarks (but not real world improvements). The hummingbird has always been the faster cpu atthe same mhz then Qualcomms cpus. Orion chipset is using a quad core gpu that performs better then xbox 360 gpu. I can not find any duel core that out performs these specs.
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Wait? The hummingbird has always been faster cpu at the same Mz then a Qualcomm? Lets think about where your getting that idea..
The Hummingbird deffinitly outperforms the Nexus 1, Htc Desire etc etc which btw are all 1st gen yet i agree have the same 1Ghz clock speed. But still in cpu extensive tasks the 1st gen qualcomms are still not that far behind. Looking at the 2nd gen qualcomms however such as the HTC Desire HD we see the cpu out performing the Hummingbird and only been let down my an extremely marginal difference in the GPU performance. So forget about spec sheets and look at real world usage. Grab yourself a HTC Desire HD with a gingerbread rom (what i had) and a Nexus S and see for your self which wins. Im sorry but Samsung are ****, Google is the only good thing about the Nexus S, but thats good enough for me.

shep211 said:
Orion is going to be the fastest duel core chipset in 2011. The cpu can clock close to 2 ghz per core. Will have the same features that Qualcomms have that allow high linpack benchmarks (but not real world improvements). The hummingbird has always been the faster cpu atthe same mhz then Qualcomms cpus. Orion chipset is using a quad core gpu that performs better then xbox 360 gpu. I can not find any duel core that out performs these specs.
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honestly i always thought that the first gen snapdragon, such as the nexus one, outperformed the current hummingbird CPU in a lot of certain types of computational tasks/tests. cpu vs cpu, its very close, the hummingbird doesnt have that much of an advantage. it does have a much better GPU, which is where it shines.
so i'd imagine if the first gen snapdragon is nearly matching current hummingbird, then imagine what second gen snapdragon dual core, smaller die, will do. (i understand hummingbird dual will also come out, but just saying it will still be close).

RogerPodacter said:
honestly i always thought that the first gen snapdragon, such as the nexus one, outperformed the current hummingbird CPU in a lot of certain types of computational tasks/tests. cpu vs cpu, its very close, the hummingbird doesnt have that much of an advantage. it does have a much better GPU, which is where it shines.
so i'd imagine if the first gen snapdragon is nearly matching current hummingbird, then imagine what second gen snapdragon dual core, smaller die, will do. (i understand hummingbird dual will also come out, but just saying it will still be close).
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The second-gen snapdragon is the processor in the G2 and the Evo Shift 4G, isn't it?

shep211 said:
Orion is going to be the fastest duel core chipset in 2011. The cpu can clock close to 2 ghz per core. Will have the same features that Qualcomms have that allow high linpack benchmarks (but not real world improvements). The hummingbird has always been the faster cpu atthe same mhz then Qualcomms cpus. Orion chipset is using a quad core gpu that performs better then xbox 360 gpu. I can not find any duel core that out performs these specs.
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Actually, to expand upon this, the Orion will have a Cortex A9 which actually has "the same features that Qualcomms have that allow high linpack benchmarks," along with more features not found in the Snapdragon.
To be more specific, the Snapdragon has elements of speculative execution with branch prediction, which is most important area in which it differs from the Cortex A8 reference design. This causes its floating point performance (very important in 3D calculations) to be very high. Unfortunately for Qualcomm, though, even the Adreno 205 falls short in terms of performance. Thus, even though the Scorpion CPU core in the Snapdragon is better at 3D than the Hummingbird's Cortex A8, the Snapdragon's GPU is so castrated that it's much slower in games overall. As a side note, the Cortex A8 in the Hummingbird actually has 2 times the L2 cache compared to the reference A8 design.
The Cortex A9 in the Tegra 2, on the other hand, supports full out of order execution (in addition to speculative execution and branch prediction found in the Snapdragon's Scorpion CPU core). This yields roughly 25% higher IPC compared to the Cortex A8, which is why the CPU section of Tegra 2 benchmarks seem to be roughly that much faster than our Hummingbird. Benchmarks have been mixed for its GPU, as I pointed out here, though that could have been due to a higher screen resolution or immature drivers.
Bottom line is that while the CPU will be ~25% better per clock cycle than our Cortex A8 (when only using one core), its GPU is roughly on the same level--sometimes performing better, sometimes worse. Another thing to remember is that since the Hummingbird uses a PowerVR architecture, it is tile-based deferred rendering. This basically means that fillrate and memory bandwidth are much less of an issue than they are in traditional rendering methods.
What will differentiate Tegra 2 though (in my humble opinion) is software tailored for its strengths, which is what Tegra Zone will likely bring. Sure the Hummingbird's fast, and perhaps even better for GPU rendering, but the code optimized for the Tegra 2's GPU may perform better on a Tegra 2 than on our possibly-faster SGX 540.

Relax, just wait until all that Tegra 2 phones released.
Certainly there will be some reviews, comparisons, benchmarks, etc.
In the mean time, enjoy your Nexus S. It is fast enough for current apps that are available You don't need dual core to run Angry Birds
Then we can wait the next Nexus 3 !

kolyan said:
nice GPU is nice, but GPU is mostly for games......for kids....you kids wanna play some games, get yourself an xbox or some ****....
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Err what? GPU relates to the smoothness in transitions of the home screen, the smoothness of the browser, the smoothness of everything. It's not just about games good sir. Compare screen swiping with a live wallpaper on G2 vs Galaxy S on stock Launcher2 and prepare to see why GPU matters.
Or use a phone that doesn't even have a GPU. Like a Wildfire. Then throw it out the window.
Going further, you can't count Quadrant 3d scores on the Nexus S because it doesn't render properly due to Gingerbread incompatibility.
The other reason the Optimus 2x scores higher is the i/o part. If we do the same ext4 lagfix that is probably built into the 2x we get the same i/o as it, and about the same Quadrant, maybe a little lower due to the GPU not running properly ever on Quadrant with Gingerbread.
As for CPU, yes the Tegra2 will be better. It's an A9. However the differences will be subtle at best until the end of 2011 when things are optimized for the Tegra2, which by then both the Qualcomm and Orion god processors will be out.
As far as processing power between the Hummingbird and Snapdragon, it definitely is more powerful than the Nexus One's processor, and GPU knocks it off it's feet.
As for the 2nd gen Snapdragon vs Hummingbird, they're probably about equal processors. The GPU gives the Hummingbird the edge and you will notice it if you take a Live wallpaper and compare Launcher2.apk screen swipes on a G2 vs Nexus S. It is very nudgy on the G2, but smooth on Nexus S.
What causes the Snap Dragon to score so high in Linpack for instance is the FPU aka float processing unit which isn't really worth caring about when it comes to every day tasks.
But yes, the Tegra2 will definitely be a bit more powerful than the Hummingbird. But it won't be tons tons tons rapejob over 9000. This is why Google released the Nexus S with the Hummingbird without second thought.

kenvan19 said:
The second-gen snapdragon is the processor in the G2 and the Evo Shift 4G, isn't it?
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well yes, i was referring to the original snapdragon in the nexus one. i think the snapdragon in the G2 and evo shift is just the same snapdragon CPU with an improved GPU. so there's kinda 2 separate topics, CPU vs CPU, and then the GPU vs GPU. i believe the hummingbird and snapdragon CPU vs CPU is rather close, sometimes the snapdragon beats it, sometimes the hummingbird does. then add in the GPU, i believe the hummingbird GPU is better than the new snapddragon adreno. not sure by how much though.
but an example of why it's important for the GPU to actually be taken advantage of in code, the nexus s web browser doesnt seem to be using the GPU properly, so relying soley on CPU vs CPU, we see the nexus one perform BETTER on some types of web pages as the snapdragon seems to be either coded properly, or it is just better for those certain types of tasks. basically my opinion is snapdragon is a better CPU, but the hummingbird has the better GPU.

Edited... I was ranting very off topic

The Nexus S really looks great, but I have doubts if I should really buy it when it's available in Germany/Austria or Switzerland...
The point is I start studying software development in the autumn 2011 and can't afford a new phone each year and would use the phone for about 2 years.
So my question is:
Will I have fun with this phone (as a developer) for the following 2 years or should I buy a more powerful phone?
Note: Currently I have a Nokia 5800 and I definitely want a new one because the bugs are annoying even with ported C6-Firmware it is not really satisfying...
thanks you very much!

[Q] Dual core phones… advantages?

So we all remember when dual core CPUs for computers first became mainstream back in about 2004… Everyone had to have one but almost no software was written to use them. So it was almost all bragging rights and no real world performance. Then 1 to 2 years later when software did come out that could take advantage of multiple cores those first dual cores CPUs were obsolete and a joke.
Will the same thing be true with dual core phones or will they be useful right away? Can Android currently utilize dual cores?
And this is not a guy with a single core phone trying to feel better about it. I have an old droid 1 and am ready to buy a new phone now; I am all but set to wait for the Bionic but I'm questioning if the dual core will really mean that much when it’s out.

Theres absolutely no advantage. they're nothing more but a placebo effect and all of the hundreds of benchmarks showing the brute strength of dual cores are fake. you're better off buying a first gen snapdragon like the toshiba tg01, xperia x10, nexus one, etc., or sticking with your droid pro. don't buy into the hype. id say wait until we have an octa-core THEN it'll be worth it.

HawkStream said:
So we all remember when dual core CPUs for computers first became mainstream back in about 2004… Everyone had to have one but almost no software was written to use them. So it was almost all bragging rights and no real world performance. Then 1 to 2 years later when software did come out that could take advantage of multiple cores those first dual cores CPUs were obsolete and a joke.
Will the same thing be true with dual core phones or will they be useful right away? Can Android currently utilize dual cores?
And this is not a guy with a single core phone trying to feel better about it. I have an old droid 1 and am ready to buy a new phone now; I am all but set to wait for the Bionic but I'm questioning if the dual core will really mean that much when it’s out.
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As of right now, only in some small circumstance with certain games. I say wait until Android is really ready to utilize dual core and for second gen hardware. Right now it's mostly hype and bragging rights....
Sent from either my Nexus S, N1 or telepathically using two tin cans and some string.

Hmm. I want the Incredible 2!

Um, hate to break it to you, but Android is multi core optimized in the first place, so dual cores will have a pretty major impact on the flow and operation of the OS itself.

op has a very good point.
Goodthing I can be content with my HD2 for a few years.
IMO it's really for the games, and I'd rather play hi def games on my computer at home.

sonsofblades said:
Um, hate to break it to you, but Android is multi core optimized in the first place, so dual cores will have a pretty major impact on the flow and operation of the OS itself.
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Yes. True. But as of now no apps (with the exception of the Tegra Zone (whatever) none are taking advantage. It really still is only bragging rights. Maybe in the next
year when everyone else catches up.
Sent from either my Nexus S, N1 or telepathically using two tin cans and some string.

wattttttttt

Android 3.0, the kernel itself lacks true understanding of both cores. It can see them, and code can be launched to either available CPU thread, but it is as yet not managing those threads, and the queue manager launches ALL applications to core 1 regardless of its load. It manages threads on core 1 just fine, but it does not manage core 2. (This explains my point perfectly quote from a poster on ars technica)
Sent from either my Nexus S, N1 or telepathically using two tin cans and some string.

lude219 said:
Theres absolutely no advantage. they're nothing more but a placebo effect and all of the hundreds of benchmarks showing the brute strength of dual cores are fake. you're better off buying a first gen snapdragon like the toshiba tg01, xperia x10, nexus one, etc., or sticking with your droid pro. don't buy into the hype. id say wait until we have an octa-core THEN it'll be worth it.
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you might be right

* pats his thunderbolt* meh I'm perfectly satisfied with this one.
Sent from my HTC Thunderbolt.

Well,there is much more to dual-core chipsets than just the CPU itself.Much more powerful GPUs,faster or dual-channel memories(RAM),larger RAM,usually a BETTER CPU(Not mentioning the second core,rather the fact that the cores themselves are evolutions of the single core ones) and the list can go on.Don't just hear only about the two CPU cores,that's a small piece of the mosaic.

The core count dilemma

I had an iPhone 3GS. After I lost it now I have a HTC Desire.
My contract is expiring in a few months time and looking for another phone that will last me another 2 years. If I am going to use the phone for another 2 years, the hardware has to be up to the task. However I have problem with the latest crop of dual cores Android phones.
- LG Optimus 2x (despise the fake iPhone UI)
- Samsung Galaxy S II (despise the fake iPhone UI)
- Motorola Atrix (not available here)
- HTC Sensation (considering the Incredible S, not sure if it is rootable)
I could probably use a third party home screen for the Korean phones, I have tried most of them out there, IMO none of them are perfect. Zeam is not buggy, but doesn't scroll very smooth. Launcher Pro is very smooth, but occasionally pause to re cache (keep in memory doesn't quite work). ADW's elastic effect (so is Launcher Pro's) sometimes doesn't show up. IMO their features are superior in quantity but not in quality compared to vanilla Android or HTC's Sense.
On my Desire the AOSP ROMs tends to not fully utilise the hardware like the camera. I hope there are good AOSP ROM for them.
The phones that actually attracted me are:
- HTC Desire Z (has keyboard)
- SE Xperia Arc / Pro (Gigantic screen and pretty / has keyboards)
- Nexus S (I can imagine using it unrooted)
However they being all single core are kind of a side step from what i have now and worry they might get a little long in the tooth.
I considered the iPhone 5, on most aspect iPhone 4 is very nice to me, but it doesn't allow me to do simple things like USB file transfer, which is important to me. I also have a few Linux PC that doesn't do iTunes.
Thoughts?

There's no dilemma; buying a single-core in 2011 is downright stupid.

I bet my thunderbolt will give those dual core phones a run for there money...

liquid0624 said:
I bet my thunderbolt will give those dual core phones a run for there money...
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other than the LTE speed, it can't touch a dual core. thats so stupid that its beyond comprehension. do you also prefer a single core pentium4 over an i7?

lude219 said:
There's no dilemma; buying a single-core in 2011 is downright stupid.
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I wouldn't say it's stupid. Single-core devices will be pushed downmarket quickly and be more accessible. But I agree, anyone who tells me that a single-phone is a range-topping device is just trying to get a laugh

theomega said:
I wouldn't say it's stupid. Single-core devices will be pushed downmarket quickly and be more accessible. But I agree, anyone who tells me that a single-phone is a range-topping device is just trying to get a laugh
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I dont think economy of scales has anything to do with single or dual cores, but rather that's the natural progression of electronics. Every handset will go down eventually toward their End-of-Life (EOL) cycle before they're replaced with newer ones.

lude219 said:
other than the LTE speed, it can't touch a dual core. thats so stupid that its beyond comprehension. do you also prefer a single core pentium4 over an i7?
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Dude you don't have to be offensive.
Besides the gap between a dual and single core snapdragon is no where near between a processor today and one from a decade ago.
I don't play games, but I expect smooth UI. So the hardware is only part of the equation. As much as I like my Desire it is not as smooth as an iPhone 4 which is similarly spec'ed.
But if a dual core is what it takes to get that kind of smoothness on Android I'll pay for it. But once I paid for it I expect it to deliver as a package and not bogged down by some third rate software. Which is why I considered the Nexus S, which is as clean as it gets. The new Xperia line seems not bad from what I have seen even though they are single core.
Although the dual core Xperia will be a killer. But SE's history of software update may be a cause for concern.

lude219 said:
I dont think economy of scales has anything to do with single or dual cores, but rather that's the natural progression of electronics. Every handset will go down eventually toward their End-of-Life (EOL) cycle before they're replaced with newer ones.
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We are in agreement but thats not what I meant to suggest lol. Having dual-core phones at the subsidized $200-300USD top end will force carriers/manufacturers to price down single-core devices to occupy lower price points regardless of how competitive they are on performance.
OP - Looking at all the hands-ons lately with the Atrix, G2x, SGS2, etc. it seems like having 2 cores amounts to a fairly dramatic difference in smoothness of the UI. I guess the question is what constitutes "smooth enough"

[Q] Most badass GPU and CPU in da world; Expert Knowedge please :)

I've been doing quite a bit of research on GPU's and CPU's in phone's/tablets lately. And I have a few unanswered questions that I can't seem to find an answer for.
1: What's the best chipset available for mobile phones and tablets right now? This link cleared quite a bit up for me, it does a fairly indepth comparison for both GPU and CPU performance between the Qualcomm S4, Tegra 3, OMAP 4470, and the Exynos 4212. And I dont want the 'Well this is better because it has more jiggahertz". Shut up, that's not what I need. I need something more indepth. If studies on individual GPU comparison can be provided, please drop a link. I'd like to know these things very well.
2: What individual GPU is currently the best? I realize the Ipad3 came out with with a graphics chip that's supposedly superior to the Xbox/PS3's. However I take anything Apple says with a grain of salt, they're notorious for shooting flaming BS out of their rear. However based on the little bit of searching I've done, the Adreno GPU's seem to be ahead of their time. I previously thought the Mali 400 GPU in the Exynos chipset was one of the best, but apparently it's outdated. Again, links to tests/studies/comparisons would be appreciated.
3: What's the deal with the ARM chips? Are the A5's, A6's, A11's, (and whatever other A chips out there are), some standard CPU developed by ARM and licensed out to all manufacturers to use in their chipsets?
4: What alternatives are there to the ARM CPU's? Most chipsets I research seem to be using a Cortex A9 chip.
5: What's the difference between the A5, A6, A9, etc. From what I've seen the higher numbers are the newer models, but I feel like that's a very shallow definition. If that is true, why does the newest iPad only use an A5x chip for it's quad core rather than an A9 or something of the sort.
6: Is the chipset in the iPad really the fastest out there? Personally, I can't really stand apple products; let alone the rabid fanboys and the obnoxious advertisements they put out. I can recognize that they very often gloat about their products and overexaggerate; like how they said the dual core in the iPhone 4s is the fastest out there, yet from what I've read the A5 is the worst performing dual core out there. Is the GPU in the tablet really superior to the Xbox? And is the processor really able to outdo the Tegra 3?
If you're able to answer any one of these, even exclusively, that would be appreciated. I just like knowledge

MultiLockOn said:
I've been doing quite a bit of research on GPU's and CPU's in phone's/tablets lately. And I have a few unanswered questions that I can't seem to find an answer for.
1: What's the best chipset available for mobile phones and tablets right now? This link cleared quite a bit up for me, it does a fairly indepth comparison for both GPU and CPU performance between the Qualcomm S4, Tegra 3, OMAP 4470, and the Exynos 4212. And I dont want the 'Well this is better because it has more jiggahertz". Shut up, that's not what I need. I need something more indepth. If studies on individual GPU comparison can be provided, please drop a link. I'd like to know these things very well.
2: What individual GPU is currently the best? I realize the Ipad3 came out with with a graphics chip that's supposedly superior to the Xbox/PS3's. However I take anything Apple says with a grain of salt, they're notorious for shooting flaming BS out of their rear. However based on the little bit of searching I've done, the Adreno GPU's seem to be ahead of their time. I previously thought the Mali 400 GPU in the Exynos chipset was one of the best, but apparently it's outdated. Again, links to tests/studies/comparisons would be appreciated.
3: What's the deal with the ARM chips? Are the A5's, A6's, A11's, (and whatever other A chips out there are), some standard CPU developed by ARM and licensed out to all manufacturers to use in their chipsets?
4: What alternatives are there to the ARM CPU's? Most chipsets I research seem to be using a Cortex A9 chip.
5: What's the difference between the A5, A6, A9, etc. From what I've seen the higher numbers are the newer models, but I feel like that's a very shallow definition. If that is true, why does the newest iPad only use an A5x chip for it's quad core rather than an A9 or something of the sort.
6: Is the chipset in the iPad really the fastest out there? Personally, I can't really stand apple products; let alone the rabid fanboys and the obnoxious advertisements they put out. I can recognize that they very often gloat about their products and overexaggerate; like how they said the dual core in the iPhone 4s is the fastest out there, yet from what I've read the A5 is the worst performing dual core out there. Is the GPU in the tablet really superior to the Xbox? And is the processor really able to outdo the Tegra 3?
If you're able to answer any one of these, even exclusively, that would be appreciated. I just like knowledge
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
1. Dunno right now, it's always changing. I hear the new Qualcomm processors with the new Andreno gpu are supposed to be the ****, but it's not out yet so who knows. The iPad 3 currently has not had any real world tests done yet, we need to wait for release. It is basically the same A5 chip as the iPad 2 but with the PSVita's gpu thrown in.
2. *sigh* The iPad 3 is not more powerful than an Xbox 360. It is better in I believe one aspect (more memory), but this has very little impact on performance/graphics quality. This is Apple shooting wads of **** out it's arse, or whoever made the claim. It's actually using the same GPU found in the PSVita, which we all know is not as powerful as a PS3/Xbox360. However, the PSVita is also using a quad core cpu, whereas the iPad 3 is using the same dual core A5 as the iPad 2, so technically the PSVita is superior. You also have to consider how many more pixels the gpu has to power on the iPad 3's display. While high res is nice, it takes more power to render it.
3. ARM creates a base chip for companies to slap their own GPU's and name on. The naming structure is pretty self explanatory.
4. All CPU's currently in tablets/cellphones are a variant of the ARM. A Cortex A9 is still an ARM chip. This will soon change when Intel releases their tablet/phone chips.
5. You're right, higher numbers do mean newer modeling. I don't know all the exacts, but with the newer ARM series you get higher and/or more efficient clocks, generally some battery savings, and in some series support for more cores. Apple's labeling of their chips has nothing to do with ARM's, it's their own naming scheme. The A5x is just what Apple calls their version of the ARM processor.
6. I believe atm the iPad 3 has the fastest chipset in a tablet..for now. It won't take long for it to be overtaken by other companies, there's so much in the works right now.

speedyink said:
1. Dunno right now, it's always changing. I hear the new Qualcomm processors with the new Andreno gpu are supposed to be the ****, but it's not out yet so who knows. The iPad 3 currently has not had any real world tests done yet, we need to wait for release. It is basically the same A5 chip as the iPad 2 but with the PSVita's gpu thrown in.
2. *sigh* The iPad 3 gpu is not more powerful than an Xbox 360. It is better in I believe one aspect (more memory), but this has very little impact on performance/graphics quality. This is Apple shooting wads of **** out it's arse, or whoever made the claim. It's actually using the same GPU found in the PSVita, which we all know is not as powerful as a PS3/Xbox360. However, the PSVita is also using a quad core cpu, whereas the iPad 3 is using the same dual core A5 as the iPad 2, so technically the PSVita is superior.
3. ARM creates a base chip for companies to slap their own GPU's and name on. The naming structure is pretty self explanatory.
4. All CPU's currently in tablets/cellphones are a variant of the ARM. A Cortex A9 is still an ARM chip. This will soon change when Intel releases their tablet/phone chips.
5. You're right, higher numbers do mean newer modeling. I don't know all the exacts, but with the newer ARM series you get higher and/or more efficient clocks, generally some battery savings, and in some series support for more cores. Apple's labeling of their chips has nothing to do with ARM's, it's their own naming scheme. The A5x is just what Apple calls their version of the ARM processor.
6. I believe atm the iPad 3 has the fastest chipset in a tablet..for now. It won't take long for it to be overtaken by other companies, there's so much in the works right now.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the reply. It seems weird to me that Apple would rename a CPU to something as similar to one that would already exist, A5x as to A5.

MultiLockOn said:
Thanks for the reply. It seems weird to me that Apple would rename a CPU to something as similar to one that would already exist, A5x as to A5.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Because Apple is the type of company to step on someones feet like that, and then sue them later on for copyright infringement. Damn the confusion, Apple starts with A, so will their processors.

speedyink said:
Because Apple is the type of company to step on someones feet like that, and then sue them later on for copyright infringement. Damn the confusion, Apple starts with A, so will their processors.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yeah, apple just simply buy a technology and re-label them, make patent and troll others. so for comparison, apple doesn't count. Also these handheld chipset can't be compared with consoles, consoles have more proccessing power like more RAM bandwidth and polygons.
Anyway.. based on my experience, mali400 exynos has a butterly smooth performance for both UI and 3D graphics. I've tried both Gingerbread GNote and my SGS2.
on the other hand, Google did a great job with TI OMAP for it's Galaxy Nexus, pure HW accelerated 4.0.3.. with very little glitch, but I believe it's software issue.
IMO if you wanna buy a fast and smooth device, follow the current Nexus spec (at least similar) like GNexus, Motorola RAZR, etc. I've seen Tegra 3 4+1 Transformer Prime but never hands-on it. as far as i seen, UI and 3D performance are stunning. 1 extra core advantage is for low power mode when doing light proccessing and standby mode. Today hardwares are fast enough, drivers and OS optimisation are very important thing if you want everything run smoothly.
cmiiw, sorry for bad english

lesp4ul said:
yeah, apple just simply buy a technology and re-label them, make patent and troll others. so for comparison, apple doesn't count. Also these handheld chipset can't be compared with consoles, consoles have more proccessing power like more RAM bandwidth and polygons.
Anyway.. based on my experience, mali400 exynos has a butterly smooth performance for both UI and 3D graphics. I've tried both Gingerbread GNote and my SGS2.
on the other hand, Google did a great job with TI OMAP for it's Galaxy Nexus, pure HW accelerated 4.0.3.. with very little glitch, but I believe it's software issue.
IMO if you wanna buy a fast and smooth device, follow the current Nexus spec (at least similar) like GNexus, Motorola RAZR, etc. I've seen Tegra 3 4+1 Transformer Prime but never hands-on it. as far as i seen, UI and 3D performance are stunning. 1 extra core advantage is for low power mode when doing light proccessing and standby mode. Today hardwares are fast enough, drivers and OS optimisation are very important thing if you want everything run smoothly.
cmiiw, sorry for bad english
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Click to collapse
I kmow what you mean. Im extremely happy with my galaxy s2, I cant say I ever recall it lagging on me in any way whatsoever. Im not sure what makes the droid razr and galaxy nexus comparable to the s2. From what Ive read Omap processors tend to lag and consume battery, and the mali 400 is better than what either of those phones have. Id say its ICS but the razr still
Runs gingerbread

I was hoping for some more attention in here :/

I agree, omaps are battery hungry beast. Like my previous Optimus Black, man... i only got 12-14 hours with edge (1ghz UV smartass v2, also ****ty LG kernel haha). Same issue as my friend's Galaxy SL. I dunno if newer soc has a better behaviour.
Sent from my Nokia 6510 using PaperPlane™

Quad Cores on HOLD for the US (AT&T).

It seems that there are a few carriers out there still having a hard time working with the advancements of Quad-Core devices and though the processors being used (Tegra 3 chips) aren't what we're use too (Snapdragons) there are a few carriers worried about whether or not they will be able to write software right away either.
HTC One X phone gets quad-core CPU -- except in U.S.
Progress doesn't come without a price and in the case of the new HTC One X smartphone, the price of running on AT&T's 4G LTE network in the U.S. will be a downgrade from a quad-core processor to a dual-core CPU.
The HTC One X will sit at the top of a new line of One smartphones, which the Taiwanese electronics maker showed off for the first time at the Mobile World Congress event in Barcelona.
The One X will sport a huge 4.7-inch touchscreen with 1,280 x 720 pixel resolution, 32 gigabytes of built-in storage, 1 gigabyte of RAM and an 8-megapixel/1080p rear camera. It'll also run Google's Android Ice Cream Sandwich operating system, topped with HTC's Sense user interface.
And when it begins to arrive at retailers in April, the One X will be part of a growing trend in Android handsets that feature quad-core processors, except for the U.S. variation, which will be called the One XL in Asia and Australia.
The U.S. version, which will be sold by AT&T, will ship with a 1.5-gigahertz, dual-core Qualcomm Snapdragon processor rather than the quad-core Nvidia Tegra 3 processor. Dual-core is still plenty fast, but the difference is a bit disappointing as there are no quad-core phones sold here yet.
The reason for the CPU switcheroo is that Nvidia's processor lacked compatibility with AT&T's 4G LTE hardware when the One X was being developed. As first reported by CNet, phones with quad-core Tegra 3 chips and AT&T 4G LTE capability will arrive eventually, but the timing was off for the One X.
Another major feature for the One X and One XL will be the inclusion of Beats Audio, which HTC says will offer a better listening experience for music, videos and games. After all, what's the point of a $300-million deal with Beats By Dr. Dre if Beats Audio technology doesn't make it into your flagship phone?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Story found here for more information and further links:http://www.latimes.com/business/tec...hanks-to-att-4g-lte-20120227,0,6217626.story
Personally my concern is that T-Mobile is picking up the One as well and even though T-Mo doesn't support LTE service this can still put us T-Mo customers at a disadvantage if the devices come to us as Dual-Cores. I've had my MT4G for a while now and though I got it for cheap money it's getting old as any phones life depletes in our community fairly fast considering the amount of flashing we all do, but with this being an option for the carriers including our own this might effect the cost between the Quad and Dual versions.
Well lets see where this puts us in a month or so but for now it looks like I'm buying a new extended-life battery online somewhere till the dust settles.
Example of what it should be.... But with a SD card slot....
HTC One X is an exquisite device that boasts the best of what current mobile technology has to offer, housing an NVIDIA quad-core Tegra 3 processor and featuring Android 4.0 with the HTC’s Sense 4.0 UI.
Other features of the HTC One X include:
Dimensions: 134.4 x 69.9 x 8.9 mm, 130 grams
Micro SIM
4.7″ HD LCD screen, with gorilla glass protection
1280×720 resolution
1.5 Ghz quad-core NVIDIA Tegra 3 processor
1 GB RAM
32 GB built-in memory, no microSD slot
8MP rear camera with ImageSense, 1.3MP front camera
WiFi 802.11 b/g/n
NFC support
1800 mAH battery
Beats Audio integration
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

Interesting find I too wonder how all of this will turn out. I'd rather get it unlocked with quad. But I'm 14 and don't have that money haha.
Sent from my Sense 4.0 Glacier using XDA Premium.

invasion2 said:
Interesting find I too wonder how all of this will turn out. I'd rather get it unlocked with quad. But I'm 14 and don't have that money haha.
Sent from my Sense 4.0 Glacier using XDA Premium.
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Click to collapse
Well the concern is that all of these devices were to come solely as Quad Cores and there was a specific price point for it because of that, carriers in the US are known for changing the price point because they can get customers to pay the original price of the Quad Cores for the Dual Cores.
This pushes the price of the Quads up a little hitting our pockets and they realize our community will go after the better of the two, I think HTC should have just forced the carriers hand to work on the quad cores instead of giving them the option of downgrading the hardware.

Well T-Mobile is moving to LTE...invasion, I feel you pain bro, I wish I had enough money to buy an unlocked quad core but I would rather go to college lol. Anyway, I heard the quad core isn't better than the snapdragons
Sent from my HTC Glacier using XDA

invasion2 said:
Interesting find I too wonder how all of this will turn out. I'd rather get it unlocked with quad. But I'm 14 and don't have that money haha.
Sent from my Sense 4.0 Glacier using XDA Premium.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're 14?
And I'm in college and don't plan on spending that type of money on a phone ever, I'd much rather buy a tablet, which I will soon be doing. Going for the new Asus tabs as soon as they come out.

Orical said:
It seems that there are a few carriers out there still having a hard time working with the advancements of Quad-Core devices and though the processors being used (Tegra 3 chips) aren't what we're use too (Snapdragons) there are a few carriers worried about whether or not they will be able to write software right away either.
Story found here for more information and further links:http://www.latimes.com/business/tec...hanks-to-att-4g-lte-20120227,0,6217626.story
Personally my concern is that T-Mobile is picking up the One as well and even though T-Mo doesn't support LTE service this can still put us T-Mo customers at a disadvantage if the devices come to us as Dual-Cores. I've had my MT4G for a while now and though I got it for cheap money it's getting old as any phones life depletes in our community fairly fast considering the amount of flashing we all do, but with this being an option for the carriers including our own this might effect the cost between the Quad and Dual versions.
Well lets see where this puts us in a month or so but for now it looks like I'm buying a new extended-life battery online somewhere till the dust settles.
Example of what it should be.... But with a SD card slot....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Don't be fooled by the number of cores a phones has. The AT&T One X has a next gen S4 Dual-core cpu which is based off the ARM A15 core unlike the Tegra 3 which based on ARM A9 cores. The Qualcomm S4 Dual-core are as fast and in some cases faster then Tegra 3 4+1 cpu's due to the newer chip design. Its not a downgrade by any means.
T-mobile is getting the One S. That particular phone has always been specked with the S4 Dual-core cpu and will be HSPA+ 42 capable.

How many times will I have to write it... It just means that your average journalist is no less stupid than your average customer, and can't do a basic research. It might be forgivable for customers, some of which are just 14-year-old kids with no understanding of anything, but it's less forgivable for journalists who should at least pretend having a brain.
Here's a comparison between dual-core S4 and quad-core T3 by Anandtech:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/5563/qualcomms-snapdragon-s4-krait-vs-nvidias-tegra-3
Looks like Tegra3 will have a hard time even trying to keep up.
And the funniest thing is that One S, if HTC won't cripple it intentionally, will be way more powerful than One X - because it will have both the CPU speed advantage and, with lower resolution, GPU advantage.
Plus, it's VERY old news already.

Jack_R1 said:
How many times will I have to write it... It just means that your average journalist is no less stupid than your average customer, and can't do a basic research. It might be forgivable for customers, some of which are just 14-year-old kids with no understanding of anything, but it's less forgivable for journalists who should at least pretend having a brain.
Here's a comparison between dual-core S4 and quad-core T3 by Anandtech:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/5563/qualcomms-snapdragon-s4-krait-vs-nvidias-tegra-3
Looks like Tegra3 will have a hard time even trying to keep up.
And the funniest thing is that One S, if HTC won't cripple it intentionally, will be way more powerful than One X - because it will have both the CPU speed advantage and, with lower resolution, GPU advantage.
Plus, it's VERY old news already.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its not worth it....

smooth3d said:
Don't be fooled by the number of cores a phones has. The AT&T One X has a next gen S4 Dual-core cpu which is based off the ARM A15 core unlike the Tegra 3 which based on ARM A9 cores. The Qualcomm S4 Dual-core are as fast and in some cases faster then Tegra 3 4+1 cpu's due to the newer chip design. Its not a downgrade by any means.
T-mobile is getting the One S. That particular phone has always been specked with the S4 Dual-core cpu and will be HSPA+ 42 capable.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My intention of posting this is to show how the market is effected over a network of carriers and manufacturers when product is effected by the investment through marketing and demand, as it's stated in the main post the chips were not going to work with the software planed for them so in turn they changed the device to run a better core (though half of what was originally advertised) to prevent having to re-write the framework.
If the case were specific to the fact that the Tegra chips were going to be the problem then why not pony up for the quad core snapdragons and boost the price for the device as they always have in the past, it's not like they're worried about what their going to charge the consumer as that's never been the case. Personally I would have just waited for a contract deal and weighed my options when it was time, I'm not one to just run out and buy something just because the "Advertised public hype" says it's the best thing since sliced bread I wait to see what happens after the lust settles to get the facts.

Quad-core Snapdragons were not on the market yet (and you can see that there are no devices with those scheduled to arrive at the time of release for One X/S), thus they couldn't be utilized, making your point void. AFAIK, Qualcomm's competitor to T3 is dual-core S4, and this is what the device manufacturers will be choosing from, until the quad-core phone-oriented S4 will arrive. The current 8064 is not suggested for LTE phone configuration - read this article, it'll help to understand, why:
http://gigaom.com/mobile/qualcomm-no-quad-core-phones-at-mwc-but-well-have-something-better/
The carriers had their choice, and chose what they thought would suit them the best, considering the time-to-market, the potential performance/battery life differences etc. That some journalist thinks their choice was wrong - doesn't necessarily mean that it is.

Jack_R1 said:
Quad-core Snapdragons were not on the market yet (and you can see that there are no devices with those scheduled to arrive at the time of release for One X/S), thus they couldn't be utilized, making your point void. AFAIK, Qualcomm's competitor to T3 is dual-core S4, and this is what the device manufacturers will be choosing from, until the quad-core phone-oriented S4 will arrive. The current 8064 is not suggested for LTE phone configuration - read this article, it'll help to understand, why:
http://gigaom.com/mobile/qualcomm-no-quad-core-phones-at-mwc-but-well-have-something-better/
The carriers had their choice, and chose what they thought would suit them the best, considering the time-to-market, the potential performance/battery life differences etc. That some journalist thinks their choice was wrong - doesn't necessarily mean that it is.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Obviously there's a miss communication on how marketing works here, even though they may not have had the option previously doesn't mean they don't have it now. Point is valid. Now that I think of it the Snapdragons have been around for the minimum of a year and the Tegra have been used for twice that and if you read the what you posted it doesn't say the tegra cant do it but it states that it would do it poorly draining battery. I agree with you on that but your missing my point entirely which is with the options they have their going to use other reasons to charge the consumer for over looked issues they can and have the ability to change now.
And another thing though it seems to be old news too you others still have yet to see it, this is why people don't post anything they read anymore because some people have no problem trying to shoot down anything posted before a discussion actually produces anything constructive.

Either I don't understand what you're talking about, or you don't understand how the market works - and I'm leaning for the 2nd option. For marketing to have something to show off and plan on, you have to have the actual HW (phone, that is) in the final readiness stage, which means that the HW has been developed for at least 1/2 year ahead of that time. 1 year from CPU manufacturing to phone sales is very good, 9 months is INCREDIBLY OUTSTANDING. Having the CPU ready at point X in time doesn't mean it can be used at that point - it means it can be used at the very least 9 months from that point. There are NO other phones and NOTHING to choose from 9 months ago - but the 2 choices you see now. The only other choice would be to skip international phone launch and wait until either T3+LTE modem combo of some kind is made functional (which could be already done, but we're talking 9 months time ahead, yes?), or to wait until Qualcomm prepares its quad-core for phones (which could also be already done, but again, 9 months ago it wasn't). So, let's see, what would you choose - participate in worldwide launch and use an equally powerful (if not even more powerful) version of the phone sporting LTE support to boot, which nobody else gets, or skip the launch. Oh well, let me think, a very hard choice, is it.
What also causes me to doubt you know what you're talking about, is the fact that Snapdragon-based phones have been around Android since Jan 2010 (Nexus One), and Tegra chipset saw first wide use only in its 2nd version, in Jan 2011 (Optimus 2X), a year later, and a couple more months till it was officially available in US. So it's actually 2 years of VERY widespread use for Snapdragon vs 1 year of spotty use (more tablets than phones - barely 2 phones or so, Atrix and Optimux 2X) for Tegra 2. Just the opposite of what you wrote.
For having smart discussions, there is a small prerequisite - both sides should know what they're talking about quite well. On this board, such a situation is rarely encountered. So sometimes it's better that people don't just run here posting everything they saw somewhere on the internet - especially if it's a 2nd-grade non-professional article in "business" section of some newspaper, and not a professional analysis article on one of the dedicated HW and Android-related sites.

Jack_R1 said:
Either I don't understand what you're talking about, or you don't understand how the market works - and I'm leaning for the 2nd option. For marketing to have something to show off and plan on, you have to have the actual HW (phone, that is) in the final readiness stage, which means that the HW has been developed for at least 1/2 year ahead of that time. 1 year from CPU manufacturing to phone sales is very good, 9 months is INCREDIBLY OUTSTANDING. Having the CPU ready at point X in time doesn't mean it can be used at that point - it means it can be used at the very least 9 months from that point. There are NO other phones and NOTHING to choose from 9 months ago - but the 2 choices you see now. The only other choice would be to skip international phone launch and wait until either T3+LTE modem combo of some kind is made functional (which could be already done, but we're talking 9 months time ahead, yes?), or to wait until Qualcomm prepares its quad-core for phones (which could also be already done, but again, 9 months ago it wasn't). So, let's see, what would you choose - participate in worldwide launch and use an equally powerful (if not even more powerful) version of the phone sporting LTE support to boot, which nobody else gets, or skip the launch. Oh well, let me think, a very hard choice, is it.
What also causes me to doubt you know what you're talking about, is the fact that Snapdragon-based phones have been around Android since Jan 2010 (Nexus One), and Tegra chipset saw first wide use only in its 2nd version, in Jan 2011 (Optimus 2X), a year later, and a couple more months till it was officially available in US. So it's actually 2 years of VERY widespread use for Snapdragon vs 1 year of spotty use (more tablets than phones - barely 2 phones or so, Atrix and Optimux 2X) for Tegra 2. Just the opposite of what you wrote.
For having smart discussions, there is a small prerequisite - both sides should know what they're talking about quite well. On this board, such a situation is rarely encountered. So sometimes it's better that people don't just run here posting everything they saw somewhere on the internet - especially if it's a 2nd-grade non-professional article in "business" section of some newspaper, and not a professional analysis article on one of the dedicated HW and Android-related sites.
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Click to collapse
Wow how's that high perception of yourself. Im actually surprised how easy it is for you to judge a top paid news publicist. I'll just leave the rest for you to continue your rant on how well educated you are and how well business does for you.
I'm not some kid with nothing better to do than sit around and rant, I saw the post which I placed as a reason to see what people thought, it shows the type of people that come on line though.

"Top paid publicist" is paid to make news items, not objective analysis. Objective analysis mostly doesn't interest people, it doesn't play with their emotions (which is usually a prerequisite for creating interest). To make interesting news, you need to forcibly inflate just about any issue you're writing about, in such way that would steer people's emotions. This is exactly what you're seeing in the newspaper.
And yes, being a "top paid engineer" that happens to work in this industry, makes you kinda judgmental. I understand that you don't have valid arguments left. OK then.

hmm tmo updated their account app to support android 4.0

Bangincrazy said:
hmm tmo updated their account app to support android 4.0
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Lol, old news. I said this in one of the dev threads about a week ago. This means some device, whether it's the sensation about to update or the one s is about to come out on T-Mo soon, will give us official ICS on T-Mo, meaning we're going to get wifi calling for ICS finally.