Since HTC has not yet provided the source code for the updated kernel (2.6.29-bc0d2cff) that ships with the 2.1 update, I'm putting up this thread to document my requests that they provide it. Once again, they're giving me the run-around.
Request 10USCW22ENA001190
Per the terms of the HTC Legal Agreement on my HTC CDMA (Sprint) Hero, Section 4 (End User License Agreement), I am formally requesting the source code for the Linux kernel 2.6.29 as installed on my phone. I have installed the recent Android 2.1 upgrade, and it does not appear that HTC has published the required source code yet.
As the Linux kernel is licensed under the General Public License (GPL), anyone distributing this software must also provide the source code used to compile the software. Any delay in doing so is a violation of copyright.
The specific version of the software being distributed in the HTC Hero (Sprint) Android 2.1 update is as follows:
Kernel version:
2.6.29-bc0d2cff
[email protected] #1
Thank you for taking the time to post this source code, and making sure that HTC is fulfilling its open-source (and copyright law) obligations.
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Click to collapse
First reply from Philip (North America Support (Tech))
Hello Chris, Thank you for taking the time to write us. I understand that you need the source code for the 2.1 version of the Sprint Hero. Rather than getting into a semantics debate of the device being under the Apache License or the GPL, I will just state the facts as they are. The department that you are in contact with is HTC Technical Support; we do not have any part of posting the source code, nor do we have information as to when it will be posted. However, when the source code is available you will be able to find it at developer.htc.com. Thank you for your patience in this matter. If you have any other questions, feel free to contact us again. You can find additional support at support forums at community.htc.com. There is also a customer satisfaction survey for you to take if you are interested. Philip HTC Technical Support www.htc.com www.twitter.com/htc
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...and my response:
There is NO issue of "semantics" regarding the licensing and source code request I made. The Android platform is licensed under the Apache Software License, while the Linux kernel that the phone runs on is licensed under the General Public License (GPL). I made a very specific request for the Linux kernel source code, which is unarguably licensed via the GPL.
This is very clearly documented in HTC's Legal Documents bundled with the phone. Also clearly documented is the fact that this is the department I am to contact in order to be provided with the source code. Please read the Legal Documents bundled with the HTC Hero (Sprint), consult with a Supervisor, and let me know whether or not HTC will be complying with their End-User License Agreement. If the terms of the End-User License Agreement differ from what is provided with the phone, I would like a copy of the new document.
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Click to collapse
For what its worth, the Legal Documents I am referring to can be accessed by visiting "Menu"->"Settings"->"About phone"->"Legal information"->"HTC legal"->"4. End user License Agreement"
Nice dude!
Way to push them using their own EULA.
I look forward to seeing how this unfolds
Legal department would probably respond better to pressure.
18. Notices. HTC may give you all notices (including legal process) that HTC is required to give by any lawful method, including by posting notice on the Site or by sending it to any email or mailing address that you provide to HTC. You agree to keep your email and mailing addresses current and to check for notices posted on the Site. You agree to send HTC notice by mailing it to HTC’s “Address for Legal Notices” which is:
HTC Corporation
No. 23 Xing-Hua Rd.
330 Taoyuan City
Taiwan, R.O.C.
Attn: Legal Department
With a copy to:
HTC America, Inc.
13920 SE Eastgate Way, Suite 400
Bellevue, WA 98005
Attn: Legal Department
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Click to collapse
My original response to this thread was going to be "not another thread like this...", but then I read your replies to them. I like how you're handling it so far and how you're using their own rules against them
Welcome to round 2 everybody! Hope it doesn't take as long as it did last time. How bout we send them a transcript of the last kernel request thread.
I am glad to see this going again. Like Mrbiggz said, maybe it wont take as long this time.
They released the Eris source like a week after 2.1 was pushed out to their phones.
Wonder why the delay.
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Sent from my Android phone.
Prolly cause they are pissed about last time. We were relentless and now they want to make us pay for it. LOLOL
cmccracken said:
For what its worth, the Legal Documents I am referring to can be accessed by visiting "Menu"->"Settings"->"About phone"->"Legal information"->"HTC legal"->"4. End user License Agreement"
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Click to collapse
After a quick look there, you may also want to send your request to "customer service" as that's where they state to contact in my phone. I'm running a 2.1 rom (Fresh) and don't know if that info varies any or not. At any rate, a good support person would have "not gotten into the semantics of it" and given you this information, or looked into it further and let you know that. I'm not sure if contacting CS would get you any further or not...
FAIL on the part of this HTC support person...
jporter12 said:
After a quick look there, you may also want to send your request to "customer service" as that's where they state to contact in my phone. I'm running a 2.1 rom (Fresh) and don't know if that info varies any or not. At any rate, a good support person would have "not gotten into the semantics of it" and given you this information, or looked into it further and let you know that. I'm not sure if contacting CS would get you any further or not...
FAIL on the part of this HTC support person...
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Click to collapse
I did go to "Customer Service". Their "E-mail Support" option is the same place as the Tech Support system. Apparently the rep doesn't know what his job is.
I love this. Their own legal team is leading to their downfall.
fortune82 said:
I love this. Their own legal team is leading to their downfall.
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I can't take full credit for this approach. The last go-around, I repeatedly had a member of the Google Android team suggest that I "read the legal docs" on the phone. I think I finally caught what he was saying between the lines.
In reality the haven't released the code to us because there is a giant sectionof comment in the kernel source that says. and I qoute - "... this line of code is horribly written and would allow for a buffer over run kernel exploit for elivated privledges (i.e. ROOT/TOOR) if a hacker happens to notice the null pointer called *thisIsNotAnExploitLoopHole ..." It then goes on to show the code that can be used to exploit it, but that got lengthy.
@OP, very well put. Let's hope for a 2.1 Kernal release very soon.
Well looks like its going to be another battle with them to get this out, I'm in again and will post the responses that I revive.
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Sent via the XDA Tapatalk App
We need to start a pool and see how long it takes. I bet at least a month based on the fact that sprint some how will slow down the process.
cmccracken said:
I did go to "Customer Service". Their "E-mail Support" option is the same place as the Tech Support system. Apparently the rep doesn't know what his job is.
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Ah, gotcha. Something I did not know about that made me look like a total newb... Oh wait, I AM newbsauce!
I'm with Kcarpenter in that they wouldn't want to let it out now to give the devs here access to an exploit that woudl give us root!
ricersniper said:
We need to start a pool and see how long it takes. I bet at least a month based on the fact that sprint some how will slow down the process.
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Click to collapse
I don't see it happening until after it's rooted.
Related
So I figured I would document my attempts at getting HTC to release the CDMA Hero kernel source. Hopefully everyone else can document their attempts as well.
Today, 12-30-09, I contacted HTC through email and was in conversation with a gentleman named Tony. He informed me I should call them. I called them and spoke with a gentleman named Fam. After being on the phone for a half hour he informed me that the CDMA kernel was licensed under the Apache license. Obviously this did not make sense so I asked why the GSM kernel would be licensed under GPL and CDMA under Apache. He stumbled over his words, not giving me an answer. He said to check developer.android.com for the information he found but I wasnt able to. I think it's a bunch of BS. Anyone else have better or different experiences?
I emailed them a few days ago & got:
Code:
Dear,
The HTC Customer Service Representative that has been handling your message would like to know if your question has been successfully answered. You can reply to or close your question by visiting:
http://ContactUs.htc.com/wFrmMailLogin.aspx
Ticket Number : [ 09USCW52ENA000753 ]
If you do not respond to or close your question within 15 days, it will be closed automatically.
Sincerely,
HTC
We are unable to receive replies to this email account. Please visit us at www.htc.com if you have any questions or need further assistance.
New Response From [ Mario (North America Support (Tech)) ]
Dear Customer,
Thank you for contacting HTC!
Unfortunately HTC has not released the source code for the CDMA Hero. We have no information on future releases.
We suggest checking our website periodically for updates.
Sincerely,
HTC Support.
Customer Information
Name
Telephone
Email Address
Country United States
Inquiry Information
Inquiry Type Technical Support
Inquiry Description I would like to request the kernel source for the CDMA based Hero. I know the GSM based Hero source has has been released, but I want/need the CDMA based source.
Issue Date & Time
2009/12/23 08:03
chuckhriczko said:
After being on the phone for a half hour he informed me that the CDMA kernel was licensed under the Apache license. Obviously this did not make sense so I asked why the GSM kernel would be licensed under GPL and CDMA under Apache.
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The Linux kernel is most definitely NOT licensed under the Apache license, obviously. I believe much of Android is, however. Perhaps Tony referred to the kernel by mistake.
In my opinion this is getting rather serious. Code is to be available upon request IMMEDIATELY once a shipping GPL-based binary is out (for sale or otherwise). It is not optional for HTC as it is not their code! They are build a business on the backs of thousands of developers who gave their hard work to Linux in good faith. Apart from this copyright infringement, it pretty much defeats the whole purpose of an open source OS, leaving us to hack our phones device-by-device rather than making changes that can benefit everyone.
I have written to them several times before...and I must admit that my most recent contacts have done away with the please's and thank-you's. I think chuckhriczko is right to start documenting our contacts.
Where did all the GSM people send their complaints to?
where do we send these complaints?
I'd like to join in.
surrealbliss said:
where do we send these complaints?
I'd like to join in.
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HERE
This silly game is pissing me off
If the GSM Hero source is released it makes no sense for the wait. I e-mailed HTC and will post when I receve a reply.
I just e-mailed them with the help from 5tr4t4s comment here (just changed a few words around).
Here is my e-mail to them
I am writing you in an attemt to get the linux kernel that should be available upon request, BY LAW!!!!
I believe much of the Android os is, however the Linux kernel is most definitely NOT licensed under the Apache license.
In my opinion this is getting rather serious. Code is to be available upon request IMMEDIATELY once a shipping GPL-based binary is out (for sale or otherwise). It is not optional for you(HTC) as it is not your code! You are a business built on the backs of thousands of developers who gave their hard work to Linux in good faith. Apart from this copyright infringement, it pretty much defeats the whole purpose of an open source OS, leaving us to hack our phones device-by-device rather than making changes that can benefit everyone.
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If and when i get a reply i will update with their response.
this is what i got.
Hello Justin,
The source that we have available for the HTC Hero can be found at developer.htc.com. The Android operating system does not fall under the GPL but under version 2 of the Apache License agreement (Apache2). Under the Apache2, HTC is required to give the source code of the operating system that was modified to work on the phone. Any closed source files that are part of a program that is installed on and not part of the operating system are allowed to be removed from the source code that is provided by the Licenser. The file you are trying to find by referencing the GPL is a closed source file that is provided by Sprint to “install” the settings of the network into the phone so the software of the phone can communicate properly with the hardware of the phone. Therefore, the source kernel that we provide on our developer website follows the Apache2 guidelines. You may contact Sprint to see if they host a different kernel for the Sprint Hero or you can go to the Android Developer website for more information on Android. I have listed below the Android Open Source Licensing FAQ website, an article that is suggested to by the Android developers on why they chose Apache2 over the GPLv2, and a link to the Apache2 Terms and Conditions.
http://developer.android.com/guide/appendix/faq/licensingandoss.html
http://arstechnica.com/old/content/...se-the-apache-software-license-over-gplv2.ars
http://www.apache.org/licenses/LICENSE-2.0
Philip
HTC Technical Support
www.htc.com
WTF?!?
justinisyoung said:
Hello Justin,
The source that we have available for the HTC Hero can be found at developer.htc.com. The Android operating system does not fall under the GPL but under version 2 of the Apache License agreement (Apache2). Under the Apache2, HTC is required to give the source code of the operating system that was modified to work on the phone. Any closed source files that are part of a program that is installed on and not part of the operating system are allowed to be removed from the source code that is provided by the Licenser. The file you are trying to find by referencing the GPL is a closed source file that is provided by Sprint to “install” the settings of the network into the phone so the software of the phone can communicate properly with the hardware of the phone. Therefore, the source kernel that we provide on our developer website follows the Apache2 guidelines. You may contact Sprint to see if they host a different kernel for the Sprint Hero or you can go to the Android Developer website for more information on Android. I have listed below the Android Open Source Licensing FAQ website, an article that is suggested to by the Android developers on why they chose Apache2 over the GPLv2, and a link to the Apache2 Terms and Conditions.
http://developer.android.com/guide/appendix/faq/licensingandoss.html
http://arstechnica.com/old/content/...se-the-apache-software-license-over-gplv2.ars
http://www.apache.org/licenses/LICENSE-2.0
Philip
HTC Technical Support
www.htc.com
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Um, the Ars Technica article he links even states the kernel is released under GPLv2, such BS.
gu1dry said:
Um, the Ars Technica article he links even states the kernel is released under GPLv2, such BS.
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yeah... i was wondering if that guy even read what he linked to. probably googled some random **** and just linked it.
gu1dry said:
Um, the Ars Technica article he links even states the kernel is released under GPLv2, such BS.
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wtf is wrong with them. Its like pulling teeth with these people to get what we paid for
I am not a legal person at all so I'm not going to debate if what they are doing is legal or illegal.
Buuuttt.. i do want to add my opinion. From my experiences with linux and gpl and whatnot.... I think HTC should have the right to keep the portion of code they worked on closed source. Show what they modified but not how exactly they modified it.
Just because you change or add code to an software base that's open and free doesn't mean your work gets donated to the world. I belive you should willingly open your code, but not be legally forced into doing so.
There are plenty of companies out there that release what they use in a very similar fasion, roku and apple to name a few. They don't release the source of the portion they modified but they tell you what they modified.... and post the source of what was modified, *before* the made the changes.
http://www.roku.com/support/gpl_rdvp
http://www.opensource.apple.com/release/iphone-312/
unless you're a lawyer.... making claims or demanding something from a big company like this... I belive alot of people will be kind to know that you're probally just talking out your butt. No offence to anyone that stands behind open source.... but I hear alot of backyard courtroom talk like this in my field of work and I just smile and nod the entire time, and take heed no to take anything they say too seriously.
If you make a claim, expecially when it comes to legal stuff, make sure you bring it with the quotes references & citations of where exactly someone is breaking the law.
justinisyoung said:
this is what i got.
Hello Justin,
The source that we have available for the HTC Hero can be found at developer.htc.com. The Android operating system does not fall under the GPL but under version 2 of the Apache License agreement (Apache2). Under the Apache2, HTC is required to give the source code of the operating system that was modified to work on the phone. Any closed source files that are part of a program that is installed on and not part of the operating system are allowed to be removed from the source code that is provided by the Licenser. The file you are trying to find by referencing the GPL is a closed source file that is provided by Sprint to “install” the settings of the network into the phone so the software of the phone can communicate properly with the hardware of the phone. Therefore, the source kernel that we provide on our developer website follows the Apache2 guidelines. You may contact Sprint to see if they host a different kernel for the Sprint Hero or you can go to the Android Developer website for more information on Android. I have listed below the Android Open Source Licensing FAQ website, an article that is suggested to by the Android developers on why they chose Apache2 over the GPLv2, and a link to the Apache2 Terms and Conditions.
http://developer.android.com/guide/appendix/faq/licensingandoss.html
http://arstechnica.com/old/content/...se-the-apache-software-license-over-gplv2.ars
http://www.apache.org/licenses/LICENSE-2.0
Philip
HTC Technical Support
www.htc.com
WTF?!?
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Click to collapse
So it looks like they said the same thing to you as they said to me. "Philip" contradicted himself saying that the kernel is HTCs closed source code (which it is not) but then goes on to say that Sprint must release the kernel? If it's closed source why would Sprint have it? Because it's not. I actually went the other route to avoid the Sprint issue. I told the guy I had a Droid Eris and asked for the kernel knowing full well it is the same kernel for both phones. The guy avoided the Sprint issue but still held onto the "closed source" bs. So with that it appears they will never release the source code. If this is the case what legal action could we bring against them. I love HTCs phones but, being a linux guy, it disgusts me how they are trying to benefit from the open source movement but not give back. It's like if Canonical didnt release Ubuntu's source code. It's international law!
If these attempts don't get resolved this could be something the eff might get involved in. Just a thought at least.
http://www.eff.org/
Bnick007
johnsongrantr said:
I am not a legal person at all so I'm not going to debate if what they are doing is legal or illegal.
Buuuttt.. i do want to add my opinion. From my experiences with linux and gpl and whatnot.... I think HTC should have the right to keep the portion of code they worked on closed source. Show what they modified but not how exactly they modified it.
Just because you change or add code to an software base that's open and free doesn't mean your work gets donated to the world. I belive you should willingly open your code, but not be legally forced into doing so.
There are plenty of companies out there that release what they use in a very similar fasion, roku and apple to name a few. They don't release the source of the portion they modified but they tell you what they modified.... and post the source of what was modified, *before* the made the changes.
http://www.roku.com/support/gpl_rdvp
http://www.opensource.apple.com/release/iphone-312/
unless you're a lawyer.... making claims or demanding something from a big company like this... I belive alot of people will be kind to know that you're probally just talking out your butt. No offence to anyone that stands behind open source.... but I hear alot of backyard courtroom talk like this in my field of work and I just smile and nod the entire time, and take heed no to take anything they say too seriously.
If you make a claim, expecially when it comes to legal stuff, make sure you bring it with the quotes references & citations of where exactly someone is breaking the law.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
With more commercial OSS licenses such as BSD and Apache. But GPL is a viral license of sorts. If you add to the kernel your derivative work automatically becomes GPL, its designed this way for this very reason.
I'm just speaking about the Kernel.
Basically what you need to ask for is the modifications done to the Kernel that falls under GPL. You are NOT interested in the OS as a whole but just want the kernel source for the CDMA Hero as the GPL dictates.
More info here.
johnsongrantr said:
Just because you change or add code to an software base that's open and free doesn't mean your work gets donated to the world.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's exactly what it means, actually. Go read the GPL.
And after some research I'm doing the reference you did not provide, "Go read" isn't really a solid argument. But you are all correct it appears.
"the underlying Linux kernel is licensed under version 2 of the Free Software Foundation's General Public License (GPLv2)"
http://arstechnica.com/old/content/...se-the-apache-software-license-over-gplv2.ars
"The GPL is an example of a powerful copyleft license that requires derived works to be available under the same copyleft. Under this philosophy, the GPL grants the recipients of a computer program the rights of the free software definition and uses copyleft to ensure the freedoms are preserved, even when the work is changed or added to"
"GPLv1 said that any vendor distributing binaries must also make the human readable source code available under the same licensing terms"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNU_General_Public_License
"the biggest change in version 2 was to introduce a "Liberty or Death" clause - the clause that says if somebody uses a patent or something else to effectively make a program non-free then it cannot be distributed at all"
http://fsfe.org/projects/gplv3/fisl-rms-transcript.en.html#liberty-or-death
ok so I wrote HTC and this is what I said, I would like some feedback before I send it, let me know what I should change:
Let me start off by stating that I love the new Hero that I have, You all have done a great job in producing this phone.
Now let me get to the point of this email. HTC chose to make and develop an android phone, when doing this HTC has accepted to the current licensing laws. Now I know that you (HTC) will probably respond that your version of android is licensed under Apache2. Whether or not it is, does not make a difference, as I am not asking for HTC's source of their distribution of android, I am only asking for the kernel source, which falls under the GPL licensing no matter which way you look at it. Let me give you source to look at.
http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/COPYING:
Now in section 2B of the GNU Licensing Terms and Agreements it states:
"You must cause any work that you distribute or publish, that in
whole or in part contains or is derived from the Program or any
part thereof, to be licensed as a whole at no charge to all third
parties under the terms of this License."
Section 3B states when distributing the kernel (which you did when you sold the cellphones) you must:
"Accompany it with the complete corresponding machine-readable
source code"
Now whether or not HTC wants to distribute the kernel source, does not matter; By law you are required to release your KERNEL source. So we (the owners of the CDMA SPRINT HERO) will give HTC ten days before we make this issue publicly known, which could lead to.... Well we all know what it could lead to.
Thank you for your time,
We hope you will make the right decision,
Samuel R. Barthelemy
One of the thousand CDMA HERO OWNERS
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Click to collapse
wasupwithuman said:
ok so I wrote HTC and this is what I said, I would like some feedback before I send it, let me know what I should change:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is good man. It is does the whole good cop bad cop thing by being nice yet firm and you let them know within ten days we would do something. Here is the thing though. We need to make sure we do something after ten days if they don't do anything. Can anybody actually make something happen in ten days? Because if we tell them that and nobody does anything and we dont do anything then they will just see these emails as idle threats that simply clog their inbox.
Dear Forums,
As we all know, the key to having a truly customizable device is having the source for their builds, and as we also all know, Viewsonic has not released the source code for their Gtablet.
If we all find the correct email to contact, much like all other companies they will be pressured into releasing the source to the community.
Let's get this done.
LETTER
Dear Viewsonic,
We are aware your company has directed many customers calling for technical support to the gTablet sub-forum of xda-developers
http://forum.xda-developers.com/forumdisplay.php?f=841
Please consider listening to what the community as asking for.
By using the Linux Kernel in your device you are required by the Free Software Foundation's General Public License (GPLv2) to release the source code for the kernel. If there is any proprietary software involved in said code, then you have the right to protect your investment, and not include that with the source release.
We are entitled to the source to change our tablets in the way we see fit with the full understanding that when we modify our tablets software we remove ourselves from any sort of warranty you may offer.
Furthermore, we would like an open dialog between with your developers concerning the software which is shipped with the gTablet. It well known among the community that the return rate for the gTablet is unnaturally high. The version of Android developed by Tap n Tap does not provide a positive user experience for the average user. By this time you should be aware of such feedback coming from the main distributors of the gTablet, Sears and Staples. This situation will only continue to get worse as detailed professional reviews of this product begin to circulate around the Internet. One such review I am referring to will be posted to Anandtech.com in the next few days.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4054/first-look-viewsonic-gtablet-and-tegra-2-performance-preview
Barnes and Noble has released a Software Development Kit as well as source code to enable the community to make the Nook Color the best product it can be.
http://www.barnesandnobleinc.com/press_releases/2010_oct_26_nook_developer.html
Please follow their example. By working together we can make the gTablet a real competitor in the burgeoning tablet marketplace.
Sincerely,
The gTablet Community from xda-developers.com
I'll second that. Not sure what we can do, but they should be reminded.
Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using XDA App
Viewsonic's main website has a support tab that you can send inquiries. Do you think it would get to the right place if we used that?
The email avenue did not work for me
xmr405o said:
Viewsonic's main website has a support tab that you can send inquiries. Do you think it would get to the right place if we used that?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I tried using the email tech support method for the web site; got this response back:
Dear Mr. Walker,
Thank you for contacting ViewSonic Technical Support.
I apologize but as much as I wanted to assist you with it, the product that you are inquiring about is handled by a different technical department.
You may contact them by calling 1-866-501-6405 between 8am-5pm PST, Monday through Friday.
If you have other technical concerns, feel free to contact us again. Thank you for giving us the opportunity to assist you.
Sincerely,
Josef
ViewSonic Technical Support
(800) 688-6688 (USA)
(866) 463-4775(Canada)
[email protected] said:
I tried using the email tech support method for the web site; got this response back:
Dear Mr. Walker,
Thank you for contacting ViewSonic Technical Support.
I apologize but as much as I wanted to assist you with it, the product that you are inquiring about is handled by a different technical department.
You may contact them by calling 1-866-501-6405 between 8am-5pm PST, Monday through Friday.
If you have other technical concerns, feel free to contact us again. Thank you for giving us the opportunity to assist you.
Sincerely,
Josef
ViewSonic Technical Support
(800) 688-6688 (USA)
(866) 463-4775(Canada)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Go for it. it has to drop sooner or later. the more pressure from the community, the better. I'll drop them a line as well.
I get the feeling that instead of taking the time to lock the device down like is done with phones and other android devices, they decided they will just not release the code and hope to stall out mods that way.
TheMongol said:
I get the feeling that instead of taking the time to lock the device down like is done with phones and other android devices, they decided they will just not release the code and hope to stall out mods that way.
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Click to collapse
That'd work, except for the fact that it's against the GPL, and that'd be breaking the law. They have to make it available, it's just a matter of pressuring them into doing so sooner than later.
just sent off my second email to viewsonic regarding the gtablet (along with a note telling them to fwd the email accordingly). i will let you guys know if i get a response.
Just called in. They are taking people's contact info that say they are android developers (they started doing that today) and they said they are not doing it to track us or anything like that, but to contact us...like say...when the source is released.
Everybody, call. Emailing isn't going to get you anywhere.
I informed them that they will legally have to release source under GPL, he said he will be passing that up to the developers. It sounds like we may be getting somewhere, but we need to call...the more the merrier. It sounds like they have a small call center so its not how many times you call, but how many different people call at this point.
myndwire said:
That'd work, except for the fact that it's against the GPL, and that'd be breaking the law. They have to make it available, it's just a matter of pressuring them into doing so sooner than later.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh yes indeed. But that doesn't mean people won't try to get away with things from time to time. Perhaps they are not even aware. I know I am going to call and ask soon even though I just started developing on android.
I called them today, as well - good bunch of people over there and a pleasure to talk with them.
I'm serious - in a world of reps in third world countries speaking broken english and working off a script, the VS reps are a breath of fresh air and Viewsonic should be commended for that alone. I put in my usual request to please release the source and I was told that they will pass it onto the development team.
I don't expect anything to come from it, but they do know who I am and who we are, so I'm hoping that VS management throws us a bone once they realize what a mistake it was adding that TnT layer.
roebeet said:
I called them today, as well - good bunch of people over there and a pleasure to talk with them.
I'm serious - in a world of reps in third world countries speaking broken english and working off a script, the VS reps are a breath of fresh air and Viewsonic should be commented for that alone. I put in my usual request to please release the source and I was told that they will pass it onto the development team.
I don't expect anything to come from it, but they do know who I am and who we are, so I'm hoping that VS management throws us a bone once they realize what a mistake it was adding that TnT layer.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree. The guy I talked to was pretty cool. He also said that the developers are being very persistent about keeping TnT in place. Very nice to talk to someone that can actually speak English
scsione889 said:
I agree. The guy I talked to was pretty cool, and even he came out and said xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx. He also said that the developers are being very persistent about keeping TnT in place. Very nice to talk to someone that can actually speak English
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Watch out, they read these forums, don't want to get the poor guy fired!
jacindc said:
Watch out, they read these forums, don't want to get the poor guy fired!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
x2 on that! Rule of thumb - if you write something here about a conversation with CS, assume that their management might read it and how that would look.
Just spoke with Mike @ Viewsonic gtablet support. First, they are very nice! Second, Mike said that they are working on a release, but no date yet. Finally, Mike said that they would be posting it to viewsonic.com/gtablet website (and to also check xda-developers.com for other updates).
They also took my e-mail address - hopefully to send out a blast when they are finally able to post it.
BTW, Mike - thanks!
I also have to echo others who have posted here - Thank you, Viewsonic, for having people who can speak English!!
I figured I would do my part as well. I called & spoke to a tech who said they were not releasing it & have no plans to do so. I said its linux based & the GPL says they have to release the source by law. He said they dont support changing the operating system. I said Android is linux based & falls under the GPL. He then transfered me to a senior tech who said:
Tap n tap is proprietary & therefore it doesn’t fall in the GPL. He said the TNT is also horrendous & they want to protect the tap n tap ‘investment’ which is why the source wont be released. They did not ask for my information aside from my first name for the conversation we had. He basically said they were not going to release the source regardless of how many people called. The only way to get it is to sue the company & force them to do so. Obviously, I am not looking to spend more money just to get the source. He knows that, the company knows that & until someone bucks up & hires an attorney, viewsonic doesn’t care.
He did say that they did get a number of calls, he feels for me, he said others have rooted it but tough titties (my summary).
RichTJ99 said:
He basically said they were not going to release the source regardless of how many people called. The only way to get it is to sue the company & force them to do so.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Boy, did my blood pressure just skyrocket.
RichTJ99 said:
I figured I would do my part as well. I called & spoke to a tech who said they were not releasing it & have no plans to do so. I said its linux based & the GPL says they have to release the source by law. He said they dont support changing the operating system. I said Android is linux based & falls under the GPL. He then transfered me to a senior tech who said:
Tap n tap is proprietary & therefore it doesn’t fall in the GPL. He said the TNT is also horrendous & they want to protect the tap n tap ‘investment’ which is why the source wont be released. They did not ask for my information aside from my first name for the conversation we had. He basically said they were not going to release the source regardless of how many people called. The only way to get it is to sue the company & force them to do so. Obviously, I am not looking to spend more money just to get the source. He knows that, the company knows that & until someone bucks up & hires an attorney, viewsonic doesn’t care.
He did say that they did get a number of calls, he feels for me, he said others have rooted it but tough titties (my summary).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the info.
What I don't understand is why is it that HTC is bound to GPL in that it must release source for its devices even though the majority of HTC devices has the proprietary software, Sense?
I don't think having proprietary software on a device exempts a company from conforming to GPL.
i think they must be new to linux or HTC is very used to dealing with Linux.
The senior tech was sympathetic but was firm in repeating the company plans. Heck their twitter page sais the same exact thing.
It makes me wonder if I should return it.
RichTJ99 said:
i think they must be new to linux or HTC is very used to dealing with Linux.
The senior tech was sympathetic but was firm in repeating the company plans. Heck their twitter page sais the same exact thing.
It makes me wonder if I should return it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree- without source, the gtab won't be able to experience its full potential especially if Viewsonic thinks anyone likes tapntap. Makes me wonder if I should return mine even though (outside of a few annoyances) I really like the device.
Viewsonic has to release source. Their device is Linux based with a proprietary software user interface just like HTC devices. This is ridiculous.
As a community, is there anything we can do to get HTC to expedite source release?
I went to the Android BBQ last week, waited in a 20min line, to ask their "dev" representatives about this. They literally told me no one can answer that question, when I asked who can answer me. Really, really sad.
I have been told Twitter is one way of getting their attention, but that seems like an exercise in futility.
Does anyone know how to properly harass them? Has anyone received any feedback form them of late?
I wish we could find the way to apply the right pressure to make this happen!
I'll show them my boobs.
How about everyone in the MTS4G forums calls them several times?
If you're willing to pony up $50 I'll draft up a letter in Word and send it to you. You can have your lawyer (hence the $50) print it out on his letterhead and mail it to them. If they decline you sue for your $50 and start a class action.
I'd do it myself but I don't have $50.
Col.Kernel said:
If you're willing to pony up $50 I'll draft up a letter in Word and send it to you. You can have your lawyer (hence the $50) print it out on his letterhead and mail it to them. If they decline you sue for your $50 and start a class action.
I'd do it myself but I don't have $50.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My mom is a lawyer and I know several other that probably wouldn't mind sending it, shoot the letter my way
arcticwolf8 said:
My mom is a lawyer and I know several other that probably wouldn't mind sending it, shoot the letter my way
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
They will want to massage it I feel certain, because IANAL.
But the gist is that Android is released under the GPL, which states that the source code MUST be released no later than the binary. I'll look up chapter and verse, try to draft up something semi professional looking, and PM it to you.
Hope your letters work
Sent from my MyTouch 4G Slide using xda premium
ekoee said:
I'll show them my boobs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Are you male or female? Can you post a picture?
arcticwolf8 said:
My mom is a lawyer and I know several other that probably wouldn't mind sending it, shoot the letter my way
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry for the delay, I've been sick as a dog. Here is the relevant portion of the GPL;
3. You may copy and distribute the Program (or a work based on it, under Section 2) in object code or executable form under the terms of Sections 1 and 2 above provided that you also do one of the following:
a) Accompany it with the complete corresponding machine-readable source code, which must be distributed under the terms of Sections 1 and 2 above on a medium customarily used for software interchange; or,
b) Accompany it with a written offer, valid for at least three years, to give any third party, for a charge no more than your cost of physically performing source distribution, a complete machine-readable copy of the corresponding source code, to be distributed under the terms of Sections 1 and 2 above on a medium customarily used for software interchange; or,
c) Accompany it with the information you received as to the offer to distribute corresponding source code. (This alternative is allowed only for noncommercial distribution and only if you received the program in object code or executable form with such an offer, in accord with Subsection b above.)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My letter would probably read something like
Dear HTC <insert name of correct person>,
While other parts of the Android operating system are released under the Apache license the Android kernel, being Linux, is released under the Gnu General Public License version 2.
Your failure to release the source code with the binary puts you in violation of Section 3 which states;
3. You may copy and distribute the Program (or a work based on it, under Section 2) in object code or executable form under the terms of Sections 1 and 2 above provided that you also do one of the following:
a) Accompany it with the complete corresponding machine-readable source code, which must be distributed under the terms of Sections 1 and 2 above on a medium customarily used for software interchange; or,
b) Accompany it with a written offer, valid for at least three years, to give any third party, for a charge no more than your cost of physically performing source distribution, a complete machine-readable copy of the corresponding source code, to be distributed under the terms of Sections 1 and 2 above on a medium customarily used for software interchange
You have done none of the above.
You have 14 days from the receipt of this letter to comply or <insert appropriate leagalese for "explain to a judge WTH you are taking up time in his courtroom" here>.
Respectfully,
<your name>
And all the associated formatting, etc, that goes into a formal legal letter.
Obviously this should be sent Certified Mail, return receipt requested.
I got their attention using their Customer Service Satisfaction Survey.
I replied to the generic e-mail I received with the suggested text.
let's see if we can get the ball rolling
I wonder if we can get the Better Business Bureau involved somehow. It seems like a long shot but they are screwing the end user (us)
Sent from my myTouch_4G_Slide using XDA App
Its possible. If htcs bureau rating is decreased it would look bad on them possibly.
Sent from my Senseless Doubleshot using xda premium
dung8604 said:
I wonder if we can get the Better Business Bureau involved somehow. It seems like a long shot but they are screwing the end user (us)
Sent from my myTouch_4G_Slide using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good idea. However, since HTC doesn't deal with their customers directly (but rather through the carriers as a proxy), it might be better to apply pressure to T-Mobile through both the BBB and Visa/MC.
Of course the downside to that is that TMo has plausible deniability. I dunno, does HTC take Visa/MC? Might still work to go that route on them if they do.
I'm not well versed enough to even have a clue what you're talking about lol. Anybody with lawyer friends in this area want to lend their opinion?
Sent from my myTouch_4G_Slide using XDA App
Same old bul****
HTC will typically publish on http://developer.htc.com or htcdev.com
the Kernel open source code for recently released devices as soon as
possible. HTC will normally publish this within 90 to 120 days. This
time frame is within the requirements of the open source community.
Please visit http://www.htcdev.com/contact if you wish to contact our
development team directly about the issue.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My reply was not really calm and relaxed: I basically said that we (the open source comunity) are not happy and that, even if we were, it is still a violation of the GPL2
My guess: I will be ignored
---------- Post added at 11:17 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:14 PM ----------
I will let our corporate office know of your complaint. As soon as the
information is available we will release it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
QED
PS: what the hell "this message is too short please add 10 or more character??????"
Etn40ff said:
My reply was not really calm and relaxed: I basically said that we (the open source comunity) are not happy and that, even if we were, it is still a violation of the GPL2
My guess: I will be ignored
---------- Post added at 11:17 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:14 PM ----------
QED
PS: what the hell "this message is too short please add 10 or more character??????"
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its a xda issue. Ive encountered it a few times.
Sent from my Senseless Doubleshot using xda premium
Col.Kernel said:
If you're willing to pony up $50 I'll draft up a letter in Word and send it to you. You can have your lawyer (hence the $50) print it out on his letterhead and mail it to them. If they decline you sue for your $50 and start a class action.
I'd do it myself but I don't have $50.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
actually 4gs has better camera
that's why i choose it
izhyc said:
actually 4gs has better camera
that's why i choose it
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
..............
Wrong thread reply?
Source has been released:
http://www.htcdev.com/devcenter/downloads
HebrewToYou said:
Source has been released:
http://www.htcdev.com/devcenter/downloads
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm downloading both over the air through Tmo 4g and my home network. As soon as I get it i'm going to start combing through it - I expect i'll be losing a lot of sleep over this starting right now (and i'm A-okay with this!)
Le Pan Tablet is a awesome and cheap tablet. But after talking with my fellow group members over at Le Pan Group, we've hit a stone. We need the source code. Now we've had insiders who tried too obtain the source code, too no avail.
Now let's take an offensive turn, and start requesting it in the hundreds.
Step 1. E-mail the two address attached.
Step 2. Don't let them blow it off.
Step 3. Please put in your discussion in quote on here.
Keep Pressuring!
Jasmine
[email protected]
Shawn
[email protected]
Rules
1. Don't be offensive; We won't get anywhere.
2. Quote what's happening on your e-mail
3. Good luck.
If you're looking too create a template or find one. Visit Le Pan Group
Case #1133
Kleine eightynine XDA on 12/11/2011 12:44:31 AM
Hey, l am a developer looking too work with the Le Pan Tablet some more. But ran into problems with propriety. Im wondering, are you going too release it? Or has it been released? Can some information be released?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Will post more updates when they're available.
Kleine89,
I really admire what you guys are trying to accomplish here. I completely understand and I'm on the same side; unfortunately this isn't the way to do it.
Customer service and technical support is currently run by me training a small team. In fact, I think I just replied to one of your cases lol. We are already swamped with phone calls and cases so this would just increase our workload.
The thing is that we don't have the source code; if I personally had it myself I would probably quietly give it to one of the developers here. It's all up to the software team overseas to release it or not. I've already sent emails to them asking about it and they are discussing it. Seems like they are worried about some copyright issue.
Really sorry to pop your bubble here but please do not flood the support emails with cases regarding the source code. What you could do however, is email these two people asking for it:
Jasmine
[email protected]
Shawn
[email protected]
They are higher up and have direct communication to the software team. As always, please stay professional and respectable.
I'm completely on your side guys; lets get that source code.
Good luck!
nehinbin said:
Kleine89,
I really admire what you guys are trying to accomplish here. I completely understand and I'm on the same side; unfortunately this isn't the way to do it.
Customer service and technical support is currently run by me training a small team. In fact, I think I just replied to one of your cases lol. We are already swamped with phone calls and cases so this would just increase our workload.
The thing is that we don't have the source code; if I personally had it myself I would probably quietly give it to one of the developers here. It's all up to the software team overseas to release it or not. I've already sent emails to them asking about it and they are discussing it. Seems like they are worried about some copyright issue.
Really sorry to pop your bubble here but please do not flood the support emails with cases regarding the source code. What you could do however, is email these two people asking for it:
Jasmine
[email protected]
Shawn
[email protected]
They are higher up and have direct communication to the software team. As always, please stay professional and respectable.
I'm completely on your side guys; lets get that source code.
Good luck!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sounds good nehinbin - I'll shoot both of them an e-mail.
Honestly it's bull**** because they are using open-source software. Technically it's illegal to keep it hidden away like that. I'm not good on all the legalize and crap but XDA TV and devs here have explained it very well for other companies that tried to do this and they ended up cracking with enough pressure. Hopefully we can get them to the same.
Don't worry though, I'll be totally professional in e-mailing them and won't state where I got the addresses from as I think anyone else who helps with this cause should as well.
Thanks for all your help!
nehinbin said:
Kleine89,
I really admire what you guys are trying to accomplish here. I completely understand and I'm on the same side; unfortunately this isn't the way to do it.
Customer service and technical support is currently run by me training a small team. In fact, I think I just replied to one of your cases lol. We are already swamped with phone calls and cases so this would just increase our workload.
The thing is that we don't have the source code; if I personally had it myself I would probably quietly give it to one of the developers here. It's all up to the software team overseas to release it or not. I've already sent emails to them asking about it and they are discussing it. Seems like they are worried about some copyright issue.
Really sorry to pop your bubble here but please do not flood the support emails with cases regarding the source code. What you could do however, is email these two people asking for it:
Jasmine
[email protected]
Shawn
[email protected]
They are higher up and have direct communication to the software team. As always, please stay professional and respectable.
I'm completely on your side guys; lets get that source code.
Good luck!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thank you for your response. Will do. l've changed the guide line now. Sounded like you did. By the way, you've never offended me once, you've been a great help!
Thank you all for respecting my request.
The source code is indeed something that they are legally required to release.
Feel free to send multiple emails on different email accounts. The more pressure they receive, the more they will realize how important it is for them to release it. While you at it, you can also request the ADB drivers and other things.
I have tried them a few time already. The answer I have got is that they don't release source code. What I have got now is I have found the serial port on the 30 pin connecter. Omap3 uses xloader and uboot and will try to boot from external sd card first. I will build my own xloader and uboot and try it out.
Sent from my LG-C900k using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
Hey OP. Might want to remove this thread before we anger nehinbin. He's been pretty good about getting out what he can. If he gets more, I'm sure he'll filter it out to us. When this thread expands over time, some may not read those "important" pleas made earlier.
I'll do what I can.
Since I'm all but a lawyer, as well as a professional writer, I'd be happy to draw up a template, or something more formal, requesting such release, if I am provided, by others here within the ascribed forum, with the background documentation, or links thereto, related to this non-conforming company's obligation to do so.
You get the idea.
you guys mentioned the LePan Group a couple of times. How do I join?
I own a TC970 and would be happy to help. I have experience testing and reporting about roms on my Motorola Droid 1.
Just visit my signature or the link. That's the group. Join and done.
Sent from my MB860 using XDA App
The real designer company is Innocomm, from Taiwan. Maybe we should put some pressure on them.
cas_xp said:
The real designer company is Innocomm, from Taiwan. Maybe we should put some pressure on them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That'll be tough too crack though.. Damn..
I think the key is to not give up, hopefully with enough pressure and TC979 coming out soon, they'll release the source for the TC970 since they aren't manufacturing anymore from what I understand.
Keep the pressure on everyone.
Not just kernel source, but also Uboot(iboot) and x-loader(iloader) source, even they rename it.
Here is the link for violation GPL:
http://http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-violation.html
http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-violation.html
Fix of broken link. One too many http's.
Kleine89 said:
Just visit my signature or the link. That's the group. Join and done.
Sent from my MB860 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've tried accessing the group from several threads already and keep getting an invalid social group page. Am I doing anything wrong?
cas_xp said:
Not just kernel source, but also Uboot(iboot) and x-loader(iloader) source, even they rename it.
Here is the link for violation GPL:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Farscaper said:
Fix of broken link. One too many http's.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I thought android was released under the Apache license. So the advice for gnu violations may not apply. It may be better if there were some similar but Apache specific directions on how to deal with violations.
Edit: sorry I'm a new user so I can't be trusted to post links, even in quotes
Android is under Apache license, but it is based on Linux kernel, which is under GPL
sockbot said:
I thought android was released under the Apache license. So the advice for gnu violations may not apply. It may be better if there were some similar but Apache specific directions on how to deal with violations.
Edit: sorry I'm a new user so I can't be trusted to post links, even in quotes
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sent from my TC970 (Wi-Fi) using XDA App
I gave it a try with both emails and mentioned the possible GNU violation.
If any luck I will post back here.
So I've been attempting to get HTC to comply with the GPL license and release the source code for the One S (one x needs it too), and I got the standard 90-120 day response. However, this isn't acceptable, as that's 90-120 violations of the GPL license, which requires that they provide it to you upon request, not "in 90-120 days".
I've responded to them again, reminding them of their duty to lawfully abide by the terms. I urge each of you to do the same, and in a calm, collected manner.
I'm not sure where your open source community requirements came from, but with all due respect, 90 to 120 days is not acceptable. I think it's important that I point out to you HTC's lawful obligation to abide by the terms of the General Public License (GPL) v2, as the Linux kernel that HTC uses for its Android phones requires that HTC release its source code immediately. As this device has now been released in at least 2 countries, HTC must follow that obligation, and in a timely manner. 90 to 120 days is in no way a timely manner, and accounts for a significant percentage of the device's realistic life as a current HTC product.
If you'll note in the GPL v2 License, there is no 90-120 day grace period for releasing source code. If HTC has provided the Linux kernel binary to any single customer (in this case, it has been delivered via many HTC One S's), then HTC is obligated to provide a copy, upon request, of that specific source code (in this case, the T-Mobile USA HTC One S). Section 3 of TERMS AND CONDITIONS FOR COPYING, DISTRIBUTION AND MODIFICATION makes clear note of these terms.
HTCdev.com has been a definite improvement on HTC's stance regarding source code distribution and openness, but there is much work that is needed to be done. In particular, the timeliness of providing source code is still troubling. HTC makes great phones, but still has a duty to the open source community. There is certainly something to gain by abiding by these terms and distributing the source code to the community. Many technology enthusiasts and developers are eager to get their hands on the code and make their own improvements. The HTC One V model, which has been released alongside the One S and One X, already has its source code posted on the HTCdev website. However, the One S and One X (all variants) are STILL lacking, and each day that HTC delays is a willful violation of the GPL.
I respectfully request that you release the source code for my device in a timely manner. It would be in the best interests of both HTC and the open source software community, and can only serve to strengthen HTC's relationship with the community.
Thank you kindly.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, looks like they're eager to play ball, and I don't mean that in a good way. Any of you EU folks care to remind them that the device has been out over a month over there across the pond? The more pressure the better.
Dear Nick,
I appreciate your input concerning the availability of the kernel source codes for our Android devices. I realize that you are eager to get the source code for your device; but this device is a recent release in the US market. I would recommend you keep an eye on the HTC Developer website for further source code release information.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well written that !!
Mind if i copy and paste it ? and re send it to them ?
Sure, my letter is "open-sourced" . Feel free to modify and make any improvements. They're trying to use the excuse that it's a recent release, yet you EU guys have had it for several weeks now, so I'm interested to see how they'll respond to you. Make sure you use your EU model in your letter.
The thing that kills me is that they think that 90-120 days is acceptable. That's 3-4 months. In 3-4 months, HTC will already be over 50% complete with some sort of new phone, and the One S will no longer be in its youthful stages. When a phone lasts you 2 yrs on average, 90-120 days is a significant period of time. One of the things that attracts developers to a phone community is the availability of the source code. Until then, interest will continue to remain what it is now.
Oh man, my first post here. Coming from a Legend, stuff's new
So, I guess I'll translate that WoT and write it to the german HTC Support, let's see their response!
bump.
bump. maybe we could get this stickied until they release the code? Its currently a major development issue.
How long does HTC usually need to respond? Sent my request yesterday, let's hope they'll get the code to the devs as fast as possible ._.
I received a response in about 2 days.
phin586 said:
I received a response in about 2 days.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Telling you to please wait 90-120 days? If so, respond back, remind them every single day is a willful violation of the GPL license. If they've distributed the kernel in binary form to ANY SINGLE CUSTOMER (as it is on the phone), then they're obligated to provide the source code for that specific binary. And we've got plenty of binaries out in the wild, in both the EU and US, and under multiple versions.
HTC is playing games once again, and their approach to developers is once again becoming a joke. I don't understand what's so difficult about following the rules.
Sometimes they'll even play the "it's not in a readable format" card. Only problem there is -- if it's not readable, then how on Earth did they develop it? It's gotta be readable in order to make it in the first place.
Let's see what the german support has to say about this
I'd love to see my One S being S-Off. I want that stock ICS
@nickmv, Of course I did. Hopefully it helps.
---------- Post added at 11:31 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:26 PM ----------
Oh. I also reported the violation to gnu.org
I suggest you all do the same.
http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-violation.html
bump.
Keep hammering them, folks.
nickmv said:
bump.
Keep hammering them, folks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Someone needs to link this thread in the one X forum
Sent from my HTC One X using XDA
Once I get my hands on my very own One S tomorrrow I will contact the Dutch HTC. Even though I dont dislike sense at all development is in everyones best interest!
Sent from my GT-S5660 using XDA
Ah, my generic reply...
Thank you for your reply. I understand your concerns with the situation John, but rest assured that we will release the kernel source within 90 to 120 days John. We thank you for your patience while awaiting the sources to be posted, and thank you for being a part of the HTC community.
If this answers your comment or question, please click here to complete the process.
To submit another comment, please click here.
Sincerely,
The HTCDev Team
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ok so i emailed them yesterday and this is their reply
Thanks for contacting HTC.
Reagrding your email about One X kernel source code, HTC are currently in the process of providing the HTC One X and One S Kernel Source Codes via the HTCDev website.
We have already uploaded the One V code and hope to provide the One X and One S very soon. Please keep checking the HTCDev site, http://htcdev.com, over the coming weeks for the source codes you are after.
I hope this information meets with your approval, please don't hesitate to reply if you require further assistance.
Let me know if I have successfully answered your question, please click here to complete this.
To send a reply to this message, please click here.
Sincerely,
Jason
HTC
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have replied to that above message with this.
Thanks for the quick reply, However i do not understand why it is taking HTC so long to release this, The One S has been available for several weeks now, It was released before the One V and yet the Kernel source code for that phone is available.. The android community is open source, And with HTC delaying the release of the source code is breaching the conditions mentioned in the GPL. You have the code otherwise the phone wouldn't have been released, So why cant you just release it immediately? Why are you delaying it ? The longer HTC hold it, The slower development for this device is, Which is not fair on people like me who want to speed development up for this device. Telling me that the codes will be released 'in a few weeks' is barbaric I would like an estimated time frame. The main thing i want to know is why you haven't released it already. Thank you
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
EDIT: Their reply to the above is:
Dear aaron maher,
Thansk for your reply.
I do appreciate your need for this data, but am not permitted to enter into speculation or personal discussion.
We have to wait for the Dev teams to upload it to the website, I can only apologise this is causing you frustration.
Please be assured, it is something there working towards and will be avaiable there soon.
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I find that extremely rude ! dont you ??
azzledazzle said:
Ok so i emailed them yesterday and this is their reply
I have replied to that above message with this.
EDIT: Their reply to the above is:
I find that extremely rude ! dont you ??
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Absolutely. Gotta remember, half of this is complete bull****. At least they're not going overboard and pulling the "it's not in readable format" crap.
azzledazzle said:
Ok so i emailed them yesterday and this is their reply
I have replied to that above message with this.
EDIT: Their reply to the above is:
I find that extremely rude ! dont you ??
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Yes, quite rude, I assume this person is the Jason who replied your first email. He must have not been trained properly regarding what customer satisfaction means nor how to reply in a professional language without copy/paste existing answers.
However, just don't piss off because of this, I have had the "honour" to visit one call centre (not HTC) and chatted to the senior manager in CS department and the front line support staff. It is a common problem that the front line customer service staff most of time do not know exactly what they are talking about nor have enough knowledge to answer non-standard question. I assume the team replying email is the same. So basically unless they ask their manager your question, you won't get satisfied answer. However, they won't because it will show that they are lack of knowledge and directly affect their appraisal.
Shame... but do send email to them so they will eventually understand how to satisfy this question.
Keep hammering at them guys!