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This is more of a rant but I'm wondering how many people agree with me. I've been looking at current and upcoming phones to replace my ageing Wizard. It really sucks that manufactures of Windows Mobile phones can't come up with some new creative designs for ease of use instead of the typical PDA form factor!
I was playing with the Blackberry Perl recently and thinking to myself it would be an awesome form factor for a WM phone. The text entry is awesome on the Perl, much faster, easier on the fingers and you can type text pretty fast even with one hand. I had someone who was using it for a while type a paragraph to see how fast he could go and he blew me away. The number pad also makes it easier to make calls when you need to do it by hand instead of using Voice Command. If only it was running Windows Moble and had a touch screen. Even better a bigger screen and a slide out number pad.
Is it just me or do other people wish there was a phone like that. So far I'm looking at the HTC Trinity to replace my Wizard but I hate the form factor. It's just not easy to use with one hand even with the wheel. I was looking at the TyTn but I find I can type a lost faster with the stylus then with the keyboard on my wizard and it's pretty useless making calls quickly with the numbers on the keybard. Even the Treo keyboard sucks compared to the Perl's keyboard which uses two characters per button making it less finger movement.
If only someone could release something with the features of the Trinity in the form factor of the Perl. Samsung has come close they have a nice form factor with a slide out number pad, and someone could easily right software to emulate the Perls predictive text entry but unfortunately their devices are TriBand (I'm in North America) and are lacking in features.
I really wish someone would release a phone like I mentioned above!
Samsung i760, nuff said
Not bad Raven2000, I'd still like a Blackberry Pearl style number pad/entry but this exactly the kind of phone I'm looking for. Perfect in every way except last time I checked, it's TriBand meaning it's missing 850 band for North America
what about the Treo 750?
What about ASUS P525?
Not sure if its quad band, but it has the right form factor, as well as WIFI.
And I agree with you. PDA phones don't really need full QWERTY, specially since they come with built in T9 app anyway. The "phone pad" is the way to go.
TheBrit: Treo 750 still lacks features and square screen resolution (too small) but even if I could live with that, it's keyboard is about as useless as the wizards. It's amazing that everyone copies this design, it was amazing when there was nothing else to compare to it but it's really showing it's age.
levenum: This one is a possibility, I've been considering it, speed wise and screen size is good, wish it would be a little updated in the other specs (bluetooth ect)
What I really wish for is something like the O2 XDA Stealth or Samsung i760 in Quad Band and HSDPA. But the perfect phone would be something like this with a Blackberry Perl style number pad (2 letters per key)
I second levenum. Asus P525 is really what I like and I am seriously thinking of replacing my Jasjar with the P525. If only it was 3G and had EDGE the decision would have been much easier on me.
I think that the Asus P525 is one of the best devices but I still think the Hermes is the best device.
What I want is a ppc phone that has a screen around 20cm x 10cm that has vga res x 2 (ie like 2 screens together). I do not need the power of a tablet so a ppc device is perfect. The small phones are all nice but not that practicle for computing or video. I know that umpc's are going to do this kind of job, but I think the price is too high. To go with this fantasy would be a ppc version of evc++ compilers so I could do my programming anywhere (ie at work instead of working).
The Asus P525 looks like a good phone and has a nice design but the specs aren't all there. I'd still like something with a slide out number pad like the Samsung i760 with close the featueres of say the HTC Trinity, or at least have HSDPA along with the current gerneration features of a pocket pc.
shoey5 said:
I'd still like something with a slide out number pad
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
O2 Stealth - but again the other specs aren't all there...
Well I wish the O2 phones were at least quad band, people outside of North America are so lucky. In North America the biggest feature manufactures look at is the colour of the phone. I guess as long as people keep buying pink razers it won't change.
I was looking at the Asus P525 as a possibility but unfortunately and just as I expected when I saw the keyboard, a lot of people say the little joystick between the number 2 and 5 keys make it a big hinderence. I guess HTC and other manufactures don't use Cell Phones because it's hard to see how they can see their designs being perfect as phones since they keep releasing the same formfactor with each generation. I guess all the phone manufacturing execs are walking around with Pink Razers
Well you can never satisfy everybody. Personally, I am very pleased with my Jamins, form factor (though as I wrote before the phone pad sliding or not is a good idea).
I actually got to play with a 525, though for only a brief time and I must say that the joystick is no real bother. Certainly not a reason to give up on this phone if other specifications are close or matching your needs.
levenum, I agree with you, can't ever be 100% satisfied. Here's the problem, I love my Wizard but based on using it, I've come up with a short list of must haves.
The number pad I find to be crucial, it's the one thing I miss about having a plain phone. I use Voice Commander and love it, could never use another phone without it (BTW, VC 1.6 with actual BT Support is out) But there are times when it's handy, you're driving and someone gives you a number (Voice Commander isn't always accurate) or you have to type a quick SMS. It's a lot easier to do with one hand and not even looking at the phone when you have a number pad. The touch screen number pad just doesn't cut it for this type of use.
I've been using Push Email another thing I can't live without anymore and I type a lot of emails. The Wizard and other long slide out keyboards suck, they are two big for two finger use. I can type faster with the Fitaly SIP (great application) and the stylus. So the numberpad and SmartKey entry method like the Blackberry Pearl would make the device more usable for emails. It would even be better than the sqished down keyboard of the Treo and Samsung phones. Less keys for 2 thumbs the better.
Quad band in a phone is something I need because of the phone networks where I live.
HDSPA is also something I'd like to see as my carrior is impleneting it this quarter.
Other than that, I can sacrifice a lot of things. Just kills me that these companies keep releasing the same Pocket PC form factor when I hear a lot of people saying they wish they had something that was more useable one handed.
When the X1 was first announced, I was all over it. Then the Touch Pro with TF3D was announced, and I thought... the X1 is too 'raw' compared to the 'slick' Touch Pro, so Touch Pro for me!
Then I tried the FUZE (AT&T's Touch Pro) and I was disappointed in a few areas where I was not expecting to be disappointed (details below).
So, as it stands today, I am leaning back toward the X1 over the FUZE (TP). But it's a close call, and I'm still undecided. Here’s why:
1. Xperia hardware looks like a device that I would be proud to be paired with. In other words, just like Apple, Sony understands that a gadget can also be a fashion accessory. That’s a 2-fer in terms of value-add.
2. I have found the FUZE to be too heavy and bricky to be really pocket-friendly. This was a major disappointment when I checked it out at AT&T last week! I was all ready to buy the FUZE when I realized that it would take a serious adjustment to have that kind of weight and thickness in my pocket. It remains to be seen how I feel about the X1’s weight and thickness (since it's not released yet in the States). But, in terms of the specs published, the X1 looks to be about .5oz lighter than the FUZE. NOTE: The FUZE for some odd reason seems to be .5oz heavier than the Sprint Touch Pro and the HTC Touch Pro. No idea why.
3. The X1 has more hard buttons on the front panel, and more easily pressed hard buttons on the front panel. I have heard serious complaints about the “up” arrow on the X1 d-pad, but I will have to see for myself if that is insurmountable. I have played with FUZE, and the front panel buttons are not confidence-inspiring. I feel like it’s a negotiation with each press of the dpad.
4. The absence of the g-sensor on the X1 is stunning, and quite disappointing. What a huge bummer. What the heck was Sony thinking? G-sensors = cool + fun. Xperia = cool+fun. What am I missing?
5. The FUZE is about $175 w/plan on AT&T, and the X1 will be around $700 retail in a few weeks (with coupons, etc.). Yikes, that’s not a marginal difference in price, is it? I’m not sure I can justify a 4x price difference for a phone that is about 1.5x as good. Or, can I? Well, it’s like buying clothing: I can spend $200 on a shirt or $10 on a shirt. They both cover my torso about as effectively, but which one do I want people to see me paired with? This goes back to the gadget-as-accessory frame.
6. Panels. I figured they would be a dead platform as soon as 09, but the new facebook panel could be a game-changer. It shows how Panels could be the equiv to iPhone apps! Will panels have market mojo? What incentives are Sony peddling for developers to get on board? What kind of penetration can panels have if limited to only 1 device? Very chicken/egg situation here, and kind of a risk for X1 owners if they are relying on panels to breathe life into WM6.1.
7. TouchFlo 3D on X1. If this really ends up being portable to the X1 with 100% functionality and no bugs, then the X1 ends up being the more flexible device of the two. But 100% compatibility seems to be a ways off still, for many good reasons. Conversely, it is highly unlikely for several reasons that the TP would ever get panels. Sure, they might be portable over to the TouchPro HD, but that’s not the TP/FUZE, is it?
8. Keyboards. I’ve read some horrific reviews of the X1 keyboard, but they’ve been scattered and not consistent. So, I guess I’ll have to wait to actually try one myself to see how bad it really is. I tested out the FUZE keyboard, and I know it gets rave reviews, but coming from my HTC S710/Vox, I found the lack of space between the keys troubling. I’m sure I’d get used to it, but it seems like the X1’s layout (with spaces between keys) is more like my S710’s layout, which I find quite comfortable to type on. I am quite concerned about the lack of tactile feedback on the X1 keyboard, though. If there’s no feedback, then what’s the point of a hardware keyboard? Again, reviews have not been satisfactory around this aspect of the X1, so I’ll have to wait to see for myself.
9. Touchiness. I found the FUZE to be fiddly with touch sensitivity. Too often, a swipe was interpreted as a select, which was quite annoying. I've read that the X1 has a better touch experience, but that will be something I'll have to xperience myself, I guess.
10. Screen rotation. OK, big minus for X1 to have no G-sensor, but big plus for X1 for its apparent "instant switch" technology between landscape and portrait modes! I've seen some videos and it's quite impressive in Opera. One of the reasons why I 'dread' to go to my slide-out keyboard on my S710 is due to the lag. It's just painful to wait. If there were no "wait tax" on using the slide-out keyboard, I might go to it more readily.
11. Dpad+ features. The FUZE has the circular zoom thang, and the X1 has the glidey thing. No idea which is preferable. Both are interesting in their own way.
So, this is where I am right now re: X1 v. FUZE. To be honest, I am kind of looking for excuses to cheap out and get the FUZE just so I'm not spending $700 on a friggin phone. But the thickness and weight are things that I'd have to adjust to.
Does anyone have any thoughts/comments/additions to this analysis?
Jon
[cross-posted on Xperia X1 and Raphael forums so I can get both viewpoints]
I too was stuck between the X1 and Touch Pro. But I think the X1 hideous. The specs are pretty much the same but you lose the G sensor and only gain .2in of screen. But the 3in screen is narrower then the TP so it looks smaller when your looking at the phone the in one hand. But they keyboard is what really killed it for me :-(.
I just returned my Xperia and should have my Fuze from Amazon tomorrow. I loved everything about Xperia except the buttons below the screen. I just couldn't accept that quality on a $700 phone. I got Fuze only as a short-term toy as it cost me only $100 after $25 rebate from Amazon. I plan to sell it as soon as I see something more impressive. Maybe N97, or an Android phone. Whatever it is, it should have 3G on AT&T as I am stuck with AT&T for 2-years.
My experience with Xperia in 2-weeks:
Tried all kinds of customizations from XDA including TF3D, spPanel skins, Youtube, XperiaTweeks, etc. In the end, I discovered Xperia out the box with just the following customizations makes it a beast of a phone if the front buttons don't bother you as much as they bothered me.
1. XperiaTweaks has to be the best. It lets you customize some little annoying things with Xperia like increasing font size, sorting contacts by FirstNames, default panel on startup
2. Blackstone Keyboard
3. Youtube installed as a panel
4. Facebook Panel
I was totally impressed by TouchFlow3D as a panel as it has a WOW factor to it. But, each day I found myself going back to the Sony Ericsson Panel that I customized with weather, e-mails, RSS feeds, calendar, etc. Eventually, I made that as the default panel to start by Xperia using XperiaTweaks. Eventually, I un-installed the TF3D's as the Landscape fix program I installed for TF3D seems to be causing problems with my phone when I slideout the keyboard.
Some issues (some minor) I had with Xperia.
1. I could not reconnect to the Bluetooth of my GPS unit in my car if I stepped away for a short time with my phone. This didn't happen with my W910 phone. To get the Bluetooth work I had to restart my Xperia and even the GPS unit all the time.
2. Build quality of the buttons below the screen.
3. Sometimes I found myself sliding out the keyboard as I was holding the bottom part of phone hard.
4. Hard to select menu's with finger. Ended up getting used to D-pad.
5. The Picture ID on my W910 shows a picture that covers almost half the screen and I can easily see while on Xperia the picture is about the size of a penny and is almost useless. The call logs also show the names so tiny and is almost impossible to go through the call logs while driving.
I would go for the Touch Pro
The best phones I have ever had were Sony Ericssons (T637, P910a) and I too lusted after an Xperia but...
1. SE is dying or dead already
2. SE and HTC are, reportedly, parting ways
3. There isn't and won't be enough units running the panels interface to make it attractive for developers to bring apps
So, if you spend the $ on the Xperia, you'll be sitting on the sidelines, watching windows mobile for VGA developers aping the cool apps coming for the iPhone and wishing that more than just a small percentage would work on your SE.
Just my $0.02.
TouchPro vs. X1
I too was lusting after the SE X1 after it was announced (about a year ago) and said "that is my next phone".
I read website after website with videos, reviews/previews, etc.. and I couldn't have been more excited for "my phone" to be released here in the states.
Well....it came time for a decision a few months ago and the X1 still wasn't widely available in the states so I waited....and waited. Delay after delay from SE and the comparisons for the TouchPro and X1 were starting to trickle out and they weren't looking good for the X1. Yeah, the panel interface was amazing if utilized proficiently but the interface was laggy. The phone was expensive and the keyboard was terrible.
I was coming from a Hermes (8525) so I was fairly pleased with my existing keyboard and once I saw the Sprint version of the TP I was hooked. The keyboard is brilliant. For someone who emails/txt dozens of times/day the new TPO keyboard is a HUGE time saver. Long gone are the days of softkey input for special commonly used characters "@", "(", ")", etc.. This just made for a more streamlined user experience. The X1 is restricted by having only four rows of keys. The same as my Hermes.
Yeah, the X1 has the panels and that gorgeous screen (and it is beautiful!) but with the exact same internals I see no real world benefit in owning one.
Just my opinion.
JC
I'll offer my insight point by point as I feel qualified to respond...
JonDeutsch said:
2. I have found the FUZE to be too heavy and bricky to be really pocket-friendly. This was a major disappointment when I checked it out at AT&T last week! I was all ready to buy the FUZE when I realized that it would take a serious adjustment to have that kind of weight and thickness in my pocket. It remains to be seen how I feel about the X1’s weight and thickness (since it's not released yet in the States). But, in terms of the specs published, the X1 looks to be about .5oz lighter than the FUZE. NOTE: The FUZE for some odd reason seems to be .5oz heavier than the Sprint Touch Pro and the HTC Touch Pro. No idea why.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
FUZE size is a bit awkward at first...I switched to it from an iPhone, but after about 3 days it was only natural. In a way, I always liked a bit larger / heavier phone because you know its there. Every smaller / skinnier phone i've had (compared to the fuze or 8125) I often felt naked with even when it was in pocket.
JonDeutsch said:
3. The X1 has more hard buttons on the front panel, and more easily pressed hard buttons on the front panel. I have heard serious complaints about the “up” arrow on the X1 d-pad, but I will have to see for myself if that is insurmountable. I have played with FUZE, and the front panel buttons are not confidence-inspiring. I feel like it’s a negotiation with each press of the dpad.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Fuze dpad is very awkward at first...but it becomes second nature in no time flat - i have no problem navigating in the dark at this point.
JonDeutsch said:
4. The absence of the g-sensor on the X1 is stunning, and quite disappointing. What a huge bummer. What the heck was Sony thinking? G-sensors = cool + fun. Xperia = cool+fun. What am I missing?
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bummer that its missing - but at the same time, theres no real item that the fuze is taking advantage of it with so far. beyond the wow factor of labyrinth for about 5 minutes....
JonDeutsch said:
5. The FUZE is about $175 w/plan on AT&T, and the X1 will be around $700 retail in a few weeks (with coupons, etc.).
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damn thats expensive...
JonDeutsch said:
8. Keyboards. I’ve read some horrific reviews of the X1 keyboard, but they’ve been scattered and not consistent. So, I guess I’ll have to wait to actually try one myself to see how bad it really is. I tested out the FUZE keyboard, and I know it gets rave reviews, but coming from my HTC S710/Vox, I found the lack of space between the keys troubling. I’m sure I’d get used to it, but it seems like the X1’s layout (with spaces between keys) is more like my S710’s layout, which I find quite comfortable to type on. I am quite concerned about the lack of tactile feedback on the X1 keyboard, though. If there’s no feedback, then what’s the point of a hardware keyboard? Again, reviews have not been satisfactory around this aspect of the X1, so I’ll have to wait to see for myself.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The keyboard feels cramped at first, but you adjust in a very short amount of time....again, several days and you wont think twice of it...probably? lol
JonDeutsch said:
9. Touchiness. I found the FUZE to be fiddly with touch sensitivity. Too often, a swipe was interpreted as a select, which was quite annoying. I've read that the X1 has a better touch experience, but that will be something I'll have to xperience myself, I guess.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I had the same problem with the stock rom...however, with tf3dconfig tweaks (or registry edits directly should you so choose) it responds MUCH nicer and I no longer run into these problems. There may also be a small degree of "self training" on this one.
JonDeutsch said:
11. Dpad+ features. The FUZE has the circular zoom thang, and the X1 has the glidey thing. No idea which is preferable. Both are interesting in their own way.
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Click to collapse
circle zoom is no iphone multitouch, but it works pretty damn well with opera in my experiences. Also nice for text size in messages etc.
I think from your feelings, you may be best off getting the fuze and using it for a while, and maybe picking up a used X1 down the line. That said, ive never even got to hold an X1...but i have trouble imagining its worth 2-4x the price of the fuze. But...if its really a fashion / toy thing to you - you could very well feel differently.
While some may argue you should have no initial complaints with a device - and that may be true, but it isnt the reality today with 99% of phones for 99% of people - its sort of expected you have some gripes with some aspects. That said, most of your feelings seem spot on with things that I initially pandered about but soon adjusted to. I was just happy to have service in my living and travelling area again (goddam iphone...)
I also think kitsVA, dgduris, and jcotterman all hit very VERY valid points on the software side of thigns, so I will not bother getting into that.
good luck in whatever your decision may be!
I went through this dilemma too. I calculated that I would save around $200 if I went for a used TP rather than a used xperia. With $150-200, you could get an unlimited data plan for a year, or buy a working GPS, etc. etc.
The touch pro isn't bad if you don't wear tight pants. I have a wallet which is much larger in dimension than my TP! I come from a very thin razr I once fit in my pocket and the change didn't both me.
Good luck with your choice!
What do you think?
There aren't much changes compare to the HTC Touch Pro... It's a real turn off for me. I don't even feel like I want to change phone.
- Different Design (I prefer the diamond back cover)
- The Tilt is back (YAY!).
- Bigger Screen, 3.6" instead of 2.8", and it's thinner
- It's Heavier than the HTC Touch Pro
- Processor "Qualcomm® MSM7200A™, 528 MHz" Instead of "Qualcomm® MSM7201A™, 528 MHz" (Same Speed thou)
- Memory and RAM are the same (Disappointed)
- Faster Download Speed, Europe/Asia: 900/2100 MHz (no America yet, but I'm sure they will come up with something)
- Camera is the same (so disappointed)
I was so eager to change phone from the Tilt to Touch Pro, but not to this phone... Except for the bigger Screen. The Good new is the phone seem to be cheap. So is it time to sell my Fuze yet?
Join this Facebook group if you have nothing else to do
Youtube review
And additionnaly, there's no more D-PAD.
That's the same reason why I didn't go for the Touch HD.
I don't understand this "everything touch" trend.
I love the touchscreen, but I like being able to use the D-PAD for gaming, scrolling through list items and then "right clicking" an item, etc.
mysterd said:
And additionnaly, there's no more D-PAD.
That's the same reason why I didn't go for the Touch HD.
I don't understand this "everything touch" trend.
I love the touchscreen, but I like being able to use the D-PAD for gaming, scrolling through list items and then "right clicking" an item, etc.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
x2.
I hate not having a D-Pad. What if I don't want to smudge up my screen? A D-pad is a must-have for me.
I replaced an iPhone and a Tilt with a Touch Pro (Fuze) and I *really* miss the larger screen of the iPhone and the ability to tilt the screen. From everything I've read, I will be buying a TP2 as soon as it's available in the US for less than a fortune. Slingplayer will look fabulous on it, I'm sure.
The "everything touch" trend is real easy to understand. iPhone. Period. If it wasn't for Apple, I'd probably have gotten a new one instead of opting for a Fuze. But since Apple insists on treating iPhone users as if they're retarded, I moved on.
I love the bigger screen design but would miss the D-pad, love the tilt (but it is another thing to break) but i dont like the lack of new features (camera the same, same processor speed, same ram, same memory???) seems like they are tryin to pull a iPhone 3G on us... same phone minor improvements
How well do you suppose the camera will function? Do you think we will be able to learn anything from the Touch Pro 2 camera code/functionality that will help us improve the original Touch Pro camera?
pandaboyy said:
- Camera is the same (so disappointed)
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camera is not exactly the same as it wont have a flash, even more disappointing.
the tilting screen is a great thing, as i really miss the tilting screen of the tilt (kaiser)
Not worth it for me...
For me it's simple...
SAME camera (with no 30fps video)
+ SAME processor speed
+ SAME RAM
+ NO enhanced graphics
+ NO fixed GPS lag
----------------
Waste of $$$
Even when and IF they come out with a US 3G model, my money will be staying in my wallet.
And it's stil on WM6.1, so disapointed.
I'm getting bore of my Fuze, I want to change to a new phone, but there isn't any good reason for me to do so... I'm so bored
For me, the return of the tilt screen and a large screen itself make it worth my money. The camera is nothing to me, I use a real camera anyway. What price marks are we seeing for this phone?
While I appreciate the bigger screen, I am not sure how responsive the device would be with higher resolution and same processor since we all know HTC doesn't believe in video acceleration / drivers in business phones.
TP2 is the reason my TP will live longer in my pocket, plus I am looking for other brands (AGAIN).
WHERE IS MY D-PAD!?
...and why limit it to 3.2MP when every other model has 5?
...and where is the flash!?
No thanks.
KevinACrider said:
For me, the return of the tilt screen and a large screen itself make it worth my money. The camera is nothing to me, I use a real camera anyway. What price marks are we seeing for this phone?
Click to expand...
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I don't care much about camera either, but I care a lot about the speed. However, i agreed with you for the big screen...
Anyway, to answer your question about the price, this website is selling it for $750, which I think it's reasonable for a new phone. Check before you buy, I think it only works for Europe and Asia so far.
The bigger screen and the Tilt feature are big pluses for me, but the lack of D-pad is just weird. Also, I have a strong feeling that 2009 and 2010 will reveal alot of amazing devices from other manufacturers...plus HTC might release somethign else that is better. I currently have a Fuze and I think I will just wait. I want to see how WM7 pans out. I sold my iPhone for $400 and I'm saving the money for something that really deserves it. If I still had my Tilt, I would probably upgrade to the TP2, but from a Fuze to a TP2 doesn't make much sense to me.
Well...HTC lost me on this TP2. Not this time...
I honestly like the first Touch Pro more. I don't like the roundedness...I prefer sharp angles. It looks too fat lol.
I love the new Tilt design, it looks more tilted, but I personally prefer the diamond sharp on the back of my Fuze. And the USB slot look too UGLY, it's just coming out too much. I take back what I said about the Camera, I do use the camera on my device a lot lately, mostly because of the fast upload to Facebook.
Join this Facebook group guys...
Seeing the big screen on this youtube, really make me want it now
Gimme your advice about the D-PAD problem : what do you use instead of it, for example for gaming and so on ? I mean, if you want to control some game emulator, do you use on screen buttons ? As the current devices are not multitouch (I don't want to speak about some well known IwannabeaPHONE), i don't think these are suitable for proper gaming.
Maybe the simple answer is "I don't use my device for gaming...".
What do you think ?
"Some" emulator programs allow onscreen virtual Dpads... but without multitouch, you'll be unable to simultaneously press onscreen buttons.
All games are different though. Some are simply point and click games which don't require a dpad. Others work well without a Dpad.
Most games will flat out be impossible to use.
I came from the Samsung Epix with its Optical Dpad/Mouse... to the Fuze for the Dpad. I later found that the Dpad isn't really a Dpad... but a touchscreen with optical sensors (which is why the Dpad on the fuze sucks; but at least it is a functioning dpad).
I swore my next phone will have a physical dpad and a jog wheel.
player911 said:
I swore my next phone will have a physical dpad and a jog wheel.
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I'm surprised how few WM devices have a jog wheel; my last one was a FSC Loox 720 and a jog wheel was one of its major positive points back then. It hardly seems like it would be an expensive or difficult control to add, but I guess it's not free and so there's something for HTC to gain by not including one.
I also prefer the diamond back of the Touch Pro, not that the Vario IV has it anyway though (not clear why they had to change that).
Interesting device imo:
http://samsung.letstalk.com/product/product.htm?prId=35487
Running WinMo 6.1
It is not a phone , so in my opinion we have far better alternatives here on the board..
Please note, this device is not a phone and does not come with voice capability.
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Phen0m said:
Interesting device imo:
http://samsung.letstalk.com/product/product.htm?prId=35487
Running WinMo 6.1
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Click to collapse
if that was voice capable i would be all over it.
it has a microphone built in, so it could has the potential to be used as a phone as well. All that it needs is an app that would allow you to use voip
I've been lurking these boards for a long while (HP iPAQ hx4700 power user usually looking for cooked WM6.1 ROMs), but now I'm compelled to chime in for once.
We need more devices like this. NOT a traditional phone (we have way too many of those now), WiMAX if you want to subscribe to use it, large WVGA screen, only 450 US$ unsubsidized where most unlocked phones of this caliber are 600 US$ or more and with smaller screens...I could go on. (And having Windows Mobile 6.1 instead of 6.5 doesn't worry me at all because of these here forums.)
My hx4700 is getting long in the tooth; 64 MB of RAM does not cut it anymore, and it just can't run WM6.1 all that well, let alone WM6.5. This is the replacement device I've been looking for, so long as I can make sure that I can use it in portrait orientation. (All of the images I've seen of it are in landscape.)
I do not have a smartphone; I'm not even allowed to have one, or at least have one and use the phone bits. Why should I be forced to pay the premium for a phone modem I'll never use, and also suffer from the other disadvantages of the smartphone trend, like devices that have midget-sized screens to accomodate what would be considered an acceptable phone size? It wasn't until a few years ago that Windows Mobile smartphones in general could even stand on par with the HP iPAQ hx4700, or the Dell Axim X50v/X51v, or other such devices, and they were still way more expensive! (The HTC Universal was more the exception than the rule in terms of specs, but HTC has consistently failed to bring back that design...)
Show me a Windows Mobile smartphone with this basic size, form factor, and large WVGA screen, similar internal specs, and only a 450 US$ or less price tag WITHOUT SUBSIDY/CONTRACT, and maybe then I'll change my mind.
^^ Fragger, i have the Mondi & i absolutely love it! I'll go into detail or answer questions if you have any.. but this device would be a great to any winmo users lineup..Large screen/res, great keyboard, dedicated D-Pad, HDMI-out, GPS etc etc..
Also, its nearly the same size as an iphone, with a larger screen and physical keyboard:
4.8 x 3.03 x 0.63 5.8oz
4.5 x 2.4 x 0.48 4.8oz
Only downside so far is not having a community, as i would love to get WinMo 6.5 on this thing.
You have one now? Great! Now brace yourself for the questions...
-How's battery life? One of the things I like about my current hx4700 is that it's very long-lived, even on the stock battery.
-It does go into portrait mode like every other WM device, right? If so, can you set it up to be more like the HTC slider phones in the sense that closed keyboard = portrait, open keyboard = landscape?
-Built-in GPS, huh? Guess I may not need my Bluetooth GPS receiver (MTK-based, 5 Hz refresh rate, solar-charged), then. How's the initial acquisition time, accuracy, reception, and general latency? (I remember hearing a lot of complaints about lag on the integrated GPS on HTC Touch Pros. Different device, but I'd still hope that I wouldn't have that issue.)
-The format support sounds pretty robust out of the box, which is especially great since it has HDMI-out. Are you content with just Samsung's media player, or have you felt the need to break out TCPMP for certain files?
-Going along the lines of HDMI-out, I take it that it can output at least 720p over it with an H.264/AVC-encoded file and not have any dropped frames?
-The "great keyboard" bit sounds like it has good tactile feedback and a good layout, which is reassuring. Is there anything I may not catch about it at first glance? (For instance, while I doubt it has this feature, I really would like it if I could capitalize letters just by holding the key down instead of hitting Shift first. Never seen that trick implemented outside of the Palm Tungsten|C, and it really cuts down on the redundant keystrokes.)
-Does the build quality feel good throughout the device? Solid feel, no loose parts? Tight slider mechanism? That sort of thing?
-How does the digitizer feel? It's obviously resistive, but some resistive digitizers feel harder or softer than others.
-How could Samsung give out a specs list and NOT mention how much RAM (program memory) it has? Since you have it, you could probably give me an accurate figure. (I'm expecting at least 128 MB by now, but the more, the merrier-especially if it matches or exceeds the 288 MB on the HTC Touch Pro!)
-Can I get the normal Today screen in case I want to use PocketBreeze and/or iLauncher like I do on my hx4700? (The latter, I may be able to do without if Samsung customized it right, but I have to have PocketBreeze for easy PIM access.)
As for the lack of community, give it some time. The device just released, and even in spite of the general disinterest due to it NOT being a phone (actually one of the more compelling reasons for a few of us), I'm sure that someone with the skills has one and is working on how to flash a custom ROM onto it so we can enjoy some WM6.5. (I mean, the hx4700 and the Dell Axim X50v/X51v are still getting lots of attention in the Upgrades, Modifying, and Unlocking forum despite not being phones! Who's to say that the Mondi can't get that kind of love once someone opens the door?)
Some this stuff i will have to answer when i get off, but:
-How's battery life?
Thus far seems very good thus far & charges fast via usb or wall. I haven't done a full drain yet, but seems to be roughly 5 hours or so(this is watching video via orb)
-It does go into portrait mode like every other WM device, right? If so, can you set it up to be more like the HTC slider phones in the sense that closed keyboard = portrait, open keyboard = landscape?
Theres an option to auto-rotate in opera(accelerometer built-in), but i cant find an actual button that locks it in to portrait/landscape. The screen also doesnt auto rotate when u move it.
-The format support sounds pretty robust out of the box, which is especially great since it has HDMI-out. Are you content with just Samsung's media player, or have you felt the need to break out TCPMP for certain files?
I havent used samsungs media player only Kinoma thus far, but the video and audio output is very good imo(im not an audiophile however), the other device i own along these lines is the Nokia N810, and the sound on here is far superior.
-The "great keyboard" bit sounds like it has good tactile feedback and a good layout, which is reassuring. Is there anything I may not catch about it at first glance? (For instance, while I doubt it has this feature, I really would like it if I could capitalize letters just by holding the key down instead of hitting Shift first. Never seen that trick implemented outside of the Palm Tungsten|C, and it really cuts down on the redundant keystrokes.)
The tactile feedback is very good as well.. there is a slider that lets you control the strength.. however you cant just turn it on for the keyboard, its either on or off. The key's(hardware kb) cannot be capped by holding it down as theyre double mapped to symbols as well. There is a dedicated caps key though(on the hardware keyboard)
-Does the build quality feel good throughout the device? Solid feel, no loose parts? Tight slider mechanism? That sort of thing?
Build quality is superb, feels like a high quality smartphone.. good weight, smooth, no squeaks etc.
-How does the digitizer feel? It's obviously resistive, but some resistive digitizers feel harder or softer than others.
The screen feels similar to an HTC device.. soft, but not TOO soft, its also pretty accurate.
-How could Samsung give out a specs list and NOT mention how much RAM (program memory) it has? Since you have it, you could probably give me an accurate figure. (I'm expecting at least 128 MB by now, but the more, the merrier-especially if it matches or exceeds the 288 MB on the HTC Touch Pro!)
256 mem/4GB storage + MicroSD slot
-Can I get the normal Today screen in case I want to use PocketBreeze and/or iLauncher like I do on my hx4700?
Yes, set the Today screen to Windows default or Windows 6.1. There is also a dedicated "Home" key on the screen bezel that shoots you right to your desktop.
Anything i haven't answered above, i will when i get home later! There is also a blog on the front page of Pocketables.com that may answer so of these questions and more.
And yeah i'm hoping we can get a community of some capacity going on this device.. WM 6.5 on this hardware will be outstanding.
Oh, speaking of buttons, which ones can you rebind? And of those that can be rebound, how many let you press-and-hold for a different function? (For example, all of my hx4700's face buttons have a press function and a held function. Rotation is one of the held functions.)
As for no capping with a press-and-hold on the thumbboard because of symbols, that's no excuse because the Tungsten|C's thumbboard also has symbol mapping on all the letter keys, which had to be used with a shift/Fn button-that is, unless Samsung set it so that held keypresses trigger the symbols rather than capitalize letters. (Most thumbboards I've seen on pocket devices just repeat a letter when you hold the key down. I don't see much point in that.)
256 MB of RAM? That's enough for WM6.5 and then some! I could easily have a Web browser with a few tabs, media player, SoftMaker Office, and who knows what else going on at the same time with that much...
Normally, I'd complain about the microSDHC slot pretty hard, but the 4 GB of internal storage helps offset that and my largest full-size SD card is only 2 GB. (I only have one microSD card, and it's just 1 GB. Wouldn't really add anything significant.) In short, I could easily cram most of my music and videos on the internal flash alone. (What I don't like, though, is that they only have 90 MB or so set aside for apps. I'd like to see that doubled, perhaps even tripled so that I can have more apps installed there simultaneously, even if it does infringe on the rest of the storage mapped like a memory card. (Also, you can pass off the bulk of internal storage as a USB drive out of the box, right? No ActiveSync/WMDC needed?)
All in all, though, I'm beyond sold at this point. I just need 450 US$. (It'll probably be at least a month before I can afford it, though, and that's if I succeed in selling the hx4700 and all of its accessories for around 200 US$ or more.)
Oh, speaking of buttons, which ones can you rebind? And of those that can be rebound, how many let you press-and-hold for a different function?
Camera(short/long press)
IE explorer button(short/long)
Message(short/long)
Thats by default. I use an app called AEbutton plus that lets me remap everykey to my liking
And so far its a been a good purposeful purchase.. Office looks great on the screen, and kinetic scrolling is enabled throughout the entire o/s somehow(i dont remember 6.1 having kinetic scrolling in explorer etc. on my phones.)
Kinetic scrolling is also present in the Alkor RC 2.2 WM6.1 ROM for the hx4700. I don't know exactly where it came from, but it seems to be standard fare on new Windows Mobile devices. (I just wish I could disable it only in Resco Explorer 2007 and leave it on everywhere else, because it makes multi-selection difficult.)
Oh, almost forgot about the camera, since I'm not used to having one of those on a pocket computer. How's the quality, both for stills and video recordings? Is the camera button double-detent like on dedicated cameras (push it lightly for autofocus, push it down all the way to actually shoot)? Not common on devices like this, but I'm pretty sure one of the HTC phones (Kaiser/Tilt?) had just that.
I can just see myself with one of these right now. Does just about everything fairly well, can come with me where the TC1100 (Tablet PC) can't, and when Clearwire expands the Atlanta coverage to the point where I'm covered at home, I may end up with a VoIP phone and mobile information terminal down the road whenever I can afford the subscription, not to mention the possibilities with WMWifiRouter.
Finally, you said Kinoma. Free version, or pay version? Never experimented with the WM versions, but I did buy Kinoma Player 4 EX for the aforementioned Tungsten|C so that I could stream video over Wi-Fi with it. (It would be nice if they offered a discount for platform switches like that...)
orb3000 said:
this forum is for HTC devices only.
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the thing looks good, but it's huge.
It's truly smaller than you think.. as i said.. it's not much bigger than an iphone:
http://www.pocketables.net/2009/07/samsung-mondi-size-comparisons.html
Phen0m said:
It's truly smaller than you think.. as i said.. it's not much bigger than an iphone:
http://www.pocketables.net/2009/07/samsung-mondi-size-comparisons.html
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your right, not as bad as i had assumed. don't think it will fit in my pocket though.
wonder what it looks like next to the Tp2.
-It does go into portrait mode like every other WM device, right? If so, can you set it up to be more like the HTC slider phones in the sense that closed keyboard = portrait, open keyboard = landscape?
Found a simple program that rotates the screen instantly
-Built-in GPS, huh? How's the initial acquisition time, accuracy, reception, and general latency?
It's very average.. in the route 66 program the locks are pretty swift, on googlemaps, livesearch(bing) they're very slow. I'm about to try igo and iguidance.
How's the quality, both for stills and video recordings? Is the camera button double-detent like on dedicated cameras (push it lightly for autofocus, push it down all the way to actually shoot)?
The camera is either exactly like the Touch Pro's or slightly below that.. it's not great by any stretch and has no flash unfortunately. The upside is that there are two of them on board for skypeing, videoconferencing, webcam shows etc.
Finally, you said Kinoma. Free version, or pay version? (It would be nice if they offered a discount for platform switches like that...)
Pay version via trialpay: http://kinoma.com/play/
Whatever trial you signup for, just cancel it before the trial period ends.
The only thing that Samsung Mondi's got going for me is the large screen and that it's capable of fitting in the pant pocket.
so its not a phone, but it has a mic? :/
sightpress said:
so its not a phone, but it has a mic? :/
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No traditional radio onboard, but it can be usable as a VOIP phone.
And I'm thankful that there isn't a traditional phone radio onboard to jack the price up with something that I don't need. (If it did have the phone radio, it would cost 600+ US$ unsubsidized easily, not 450 US$.) VoIP is the future anyway, especially when WiMAX coverage starts spreading out.
Another question: how does it handle apps that aren't made for the extra width (generally 320x240 or 640x480)? They just run letterboxed, right? (Anything based on the standard Windows Mobile UI would just have extra dead space, I know that much.)
I still haven't been fortunate enough to use one, and I'm still well short of affording one, but I'll scrounge up the cash somehow. (I just need to find a willing buyer for my old Tungsten|C and my hx4700. Won't get me there all the way, but it'll help a lot.)
Mondi
I got the Mondi after looking for something like it for two years. I needed the largest possible pocketable screen plus hardware keyboard for a couple applications I run and resistive stylus for Chinese handwriting input. Mondi fit most of my needs perfectly and I've found I even do most of my voice calling using Mondi+voip. The only thing I hesitated on before buying and still don't have an answer for is how much of the XDA stuff I'll be able to take advantage of given this is a WM Classic device and Samsung Touchwiz-2 instead of HTC. Does anyone know whether I'll be able to use any of the WM 6.5 stuff from XDA or does having "Classic" put me out of luck?
BTW, I paid $359 for mine which is around what an iPaq 211 goes for.
My understanding is that while there is some optimisation for finger use in WM6.5, there are other parts of the OS that are still best suited to a stylus. For example accurately selecting text in Word, or selecting a range of cells in Excel.
One of the reasons Apple took so long to come out with copy/paste in the UI is because they knew they had to make it work with a fat finger.
My point is that I wonder how wise it is to combine a capacitive screen with WM6.5 on the Leo. I'm sure it will work fine with the basic stuff, particularly in TF3D applications. However, if I can't easily use a finger for everything, then it's going to be a real pain either struggling to touch accurately with a finger or carrying around a capacitive stylus that I'll just lose after a couple of days.
What do you reckon?
How optimised? The short answer is "not very". By default, the WM6.5 finger-friendliness is only skin deep. A few clicks and you'll quickly find yourself back at the ancient ugly stylus-designed interface from 2002.
TF3D makes things much, much nicer, but no matter how much you customise WM, there are many applications designed only for stylus use. Pocket Informant, for example, is a very useful PIM - but is difficult to use with only fingers. Many, many pieces of third-party software out there are the same. Really only a few applications are truly designed for fingers rather than stylus.
This is a problem that WM can't really fix. It's just a byproduct of the OS's age - it's been around in various forms since at least 2000. For the most part, applications written 5 to 10 years ago still work on modern WM devices. This is compounded by the fact that modern WM phones are still shipping with styluses.
I suppose if WM7 requires finger-friendly support, then things will improve considerably from third-party software companies. But until then, things are pretty dire.
microsoft fired their director for windows mobile and is putting a fire under its mobile division's ass to make winmo7 a homerun. microsoft isnt sleeping on this anymore, expect big things next year for windows mobile...
I have a Touch Pro2 running a 6.5 ROM and I actually find that, in combination with the large WVGA screen, I rarely need the stylus even in applications made for previous versions of WM. Though TouchFLO helps, even when disabled I can still navigate without a stylus. However, occasionally finger precision isn't enough and I need the stylus, but for the most part, 6.5 is actually pretty finger friendly.
However, the 6.5 Build can make a huge difference with how finger friendly the ROM is, so it's not terribly accurate to say that all 6.5 builds are finger friendly when the features of different builds are so diverse.
Windows 6.5? Not very. Practically not at all. The outside is different but the insides are almost identical to 6.1
HOWEVER 6.5.1 is VERY finger friendly. There is a lot of difference and you can expect a lot more finger friendliness with the future builds of windows mobile.
I am really looking forward for more detailed reviews about Leo, especially working with tiny UI elements, which are still there in WM 6.5. Actually, the changes of 6.5 are minor and it is not nearly as touch optimized OS. And in all of this hype about Leo no one talks about how we are going to work without stylus on this device. There already are a couple previews and some videos with a lot of "wow’s" about the first capacitive screen with multi-touch zoom in WM, but no any word or demo about using Excel or some other application that has many small buttons or things to click, drag and move. And aren't exactly these apps the real power of WM not the useless fancy weather effects, beautiful scrolling gallery (out of use for more than 20 pics) or multi-touch zoom only in few apps? I am not sure if the capacitive screen is an advantage or at least not for Windows. Nevertheless, soon we’ll see if I’m wrong (hope I am ).
martoto said:
And in all of this hype about Leo no one talks about how we are going to work without stylus on this device.
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Well with my current 2.8" screen (Touch Pro) I genuinely can't remember the last time I had to get the stylus out to do anything. Moving to a device with over 2x the screen size, I can't see there being a big problem. Sure I'll be using more of my finger and less of the nail, but a >2x bigger screen should more than compensate for that!
That said, resistive is still probably going to be the technology of choice for smaller screens, especially since for a while at least MS plan for smaller(/cheaper) devices to stick with 6.x instead of 7.
As for 6.5's general finger-friendliness, it's ahead of 6.1 in some places but the difference isn't that big. 6.5.x is where the action is on that front, and at least we enthusiasts will be making the most of that, even if the average buyer won't be. Well, we'll be making the most of it until we first get the v7 leaks
mr_Ray said:
Well with my current 2.8" screen (Touch Pro) I genuinely can't remember the last time I had to get the stylus out to do anything. Moving to a device with over 2x the screen size, I can't see there being a big problem. Sure I'll be using more of my finger and less of the nail, but a >2x bigger screen should more than compensate for that!
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You can't use a nail at all on a capacitive screen, only skin.
I have a Touch Pro2 (3.6" screen) and I have to say that I use the stylus all the time - Opera 9.5 would be totally unuseable without it, and any time you start using a Windows app with radio buttons and checkboxes, the stylus is far easier. That would even more true if I couldn't use a fingernail for added accuracy compared to a finger. It remains to be seen how much difference WM6.5 and production Opera 9.7 make to that.
I for one, just don't know what Microsoft is doing with this half arsed attempt of a finger friendly OS,
They are shipping 6.5.....the OS looks like one of the worst put together it looks very very rushed (we know its not...they've had more than enough time)
HTC with thier TouchFlo is a far more elegant solution.
Microsoft can stick 6.5 where the sun don't shine....
No such thing as a finger friendly Microsoft OS...yet
mr_Ray said:
Well with my current 2.8" screen (Touch Pro) I genuinely can't remember the last time I had to get the stylus out to do anything. ...
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A very simple example with app that every WM has - the mobile Excel. Open a new file and try to change the row height without using a stylus or a nail. It is possible but not near as easy, isn’t it? On a twice bigger screen, the row border will be almost the same thickness. So here a bigger screen won't help. Just imagine that you need to work with a similar interface every day. Now, tell me is there anything that can be done with capacitive screen but cannot with resistive? Don't get me wrong, I know that if you work only with fingers, capacitive screens are far better. But here we have windows mobile, and for these users that often leave the TouchFlo to use the true power of windows, the lack of possibility of precise pointing on the screen could be a big issue.
martoto said:
A very simple example with app that every WM has - the mobile Excel. Open a new file and try to change the row height without using a stylus or a nail. It is possible but not near as easy, isn’t it? On a twice bigger screen, the row border will be almost the same thickness. So here a bigger screen won't help. Just imagine that you need to work with a similar interface every day. Now, tell me is there anything that can be done with capacitive screen but cannot with resistive? Don't get me wrong, I know that if you work only with fingers, capacitive screens are far better. But here we have windows mobile, and for these users that often leave the TouchFlo to use the true power of windows, the lack of possibility of precise pointing on the screen could be a big issue.
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I never claimed that my usage was a template for every other person on the planet, and would never think to do so. For *me* capacitive has a few advantages over resistive, and likewise a few disadvantages, it pretty much comes out as a wash. I'd stil be as happy with the HD2 if it had a resistive screen.
My use of Excel on the go is purely simple data entry or just viewing. There are also other ways to resize than clicking on and dragging a line a pixel or two wide. I also recognise there are many people who would find such things infuriatin with *their* usage patterns, applications, and habits.
This whole issue really highlights Microsoft's biggest issue in Windows Mobi... er Windows Phone today. It's a stylus-based PDA OS trying to be a finger-based phone OS. The heritage is based entirely in yesterday's PDAs - where it was fantastic for the job and thrashed PalmOS in the marketplace.
However there's been a gradual change in usage of the OS from PDAs to phones, and the underlying systems just haven't adapted to the changes. The UI today is much the same as it was in 2002. If you want your OS on a modern smartphone where people want to pull their phone out of their pocket and tap and slide with their fingers, you just can't get away with an interface and screen tech from a 2002 PDA.
Be one or the other - create a side branch for the dwindling userbase who want a PDA or PDA/phone if you have to - but the core of the OS itself if you want it on a phone - just has to adapt to survive.
Thanks for everyone's thoughts. It seems to me that if WM6.5 is not fully optimized for finger use, which it's not, then HTC really shouldn't combine it with a capacitive screen. Simple as that.
Moandal said:
Thanks for everyone's thoughts. It seems to me that if WM6.5 is not fully optimized for finger use, which it's not, then HTC really shouldn't combine it with a capacitive screen. Simple as that.
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Well, that's a large part of the reason for TouchFLO/Sense UI, of course; WM6.5 by itself isn't sufficiently finger-friendly, but with the HD2's customised UI on top of it, it is (in HTC's opinion, anyway).
But is it just where the balance of their expertise and development lies? One looks at the HTC Leo and it looks like an android device.....lots of hardware supported under Android, but not under WM.....and the whole thing kludged together to work on an operating system with built in short term obsolescence.
It seems to me that we are in a transition period. Hardware too sophisticated for WM 6.5, but development of WM7 and Android not yet complete.
I think WM is a dead duck until (and maybe beyond) WM7, and the inroads that other systems can make between now and it's release will probably give an indication of the future direction of mass market smartphones.
Given the apparent inability of Microsoft to deliver a satisfactory platform for ordinary users and developers alike, and Androids success in doing exactly that (although still early days), I see it going only one way for the mass market.
I've bought my last WM phone (I think). It was Blackstone.
in short like only 1 or 2 have already said.... 6.5 is not
6.5.1 [aka towards wm7] is very much finger optimised.
if u guys are not clear, then only the versions which have start buttons on bottom are 6.5.1 and can be used with one hand. 6.5 its a mixed bag and u have to use both hands sometimes.
atifsh said:
in short like only 1 or 2 have already said.... 6.5 is not
6.5.1 [aka towards wm7] is very much finger optimised.
if u guys are not clear, then only the versions which have start buttons on bottom are 6.5.1 and can be used with one hand. 6.5 its a mixed bag and u have to use both hands sometimes.
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What's the big difference between 6.5 and 6.5.1 then? I wouldn't have though a 0.0.1 version change would be much different. Also which version does the HD2 have? The specs I've seen say it's got 6.5.
Windows has really lost it's way. They need to pick a path tha makes sense and stick to it.
The way I see it there are two camps. the iPhone is for entertainment and the blackberry is more business oriented. Why they are going after the iPhone is beyond me. The pocketpc was an awesome business tool and they are trying to evolve it into an iPhone.
Look at Blackberry, most of their phones have no touch screen. They have a trackball! Yikes! But that works for business...
I routinely use my phone for powerpoint presentation, I use excel, I am an original PPC user and they are making the product stylus unfriendly and removing the hardware buttons...
I have the TP2 and I would trade in the touch screen for a scroll wheel, and a d-pad...
I don't think Windows can win against the iphone. They should go after blackberry...
I think there's 2 things here.
Windows Mobile as an OS needs a lot of work IMO. The current hardware is so capable but still windows manages to be sluggish at times. This needs to be fixed, it should be rewritten for the ground up for the more capable modern hardware, better resource management, using all resources to make the thing go as smooth as possible.
Then for the interface ... well ... it's all in the name 'Pocket PC'. It's like a small computer, it even has a startmenu etc... that's how it was build. Devices changed though, and now we need finger friendly interface with eye candy and 3D.
Let's hope that Windows Phone 7 will be as good and revolutionary as Windows 7 for desktop. And let's hope that we won't have to buy a new phone to run it
Moandal said:
Also which version does the HD2 have? The specs I've seen say it's got 6.5.
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6.5.1 hasn't been released yet and won't be until somewhere around February. I wouldn't be surprised if the HD2 gets a 6.5.1 upgrade, although there's no guarantee. If you don't mind installing a "cooked" ROM then it may be available sooner in beta form.
I had no trouble using my big nail-less thumbs on 6.1. WinMo 6.5 is better but not much different. You want something better install the 6.5.1 ROM. I've been using it for the last month and it's the most finger freindly version of WinMo.