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I been using the iphone today.....what a smooth operator...everything just flows...the page animations the opening of applications...the look and feel, the way touch works. The typing (mind you Cooteks Touch and icontact is on par with it )very impressive...it even takes batter pictures than the cruise and its only got a 2meg camera...using my cruise everything is laggy....I cant wait for the drivers or update. If people like larna and others can do wonders to the speed of applications then what the hell are original developers and manufacturers doing. I say thank you for this forum...If HTC/Microsoft had been thorough as Apple was with the iphone the cruise/WM would be a different beast altogether.
I think Microsoft must be going through what Mercedes and BMW went through when the first Lexus model came out and caught them sleeping.
Nice phone the iphone but very limited when compared to ours....but things could change.
I think much is about WM. And dont forget, Apple spend all their ressources to get their OS running on one Hardware. WM runs on hundreds of different Hardware.
Be sure, if the people at MS would optimze WM only for the Touch Cruise it would run much smoother.
I think a capacitive Display would help much. I'm often not sure if pressing a soft button worked. That makes working on it feeling laggy (beside slow program starts).
The WM developers have ignored any work on the UI for years. Now they got payback, the WM UI looks like an ugly Windows 95 UI and is totally outdated.
You can see that a smooth UI is possible by looking at pointui.
But do not forget the WM advantages.
All the availabe software, for example WMwifirouter.
That on iphone? I think it will never be...
Agreed....I can only fault Microsoft in Slow Deveopement....whereas the Manufacturers trying to make everyhing generic compatible instead of optimizing....now if they even aimed for the latter, no only would our devices be useably versatile, they would be decently fast and efficient.
We can only hope that WM7 will better developed for touch and hopefully not a memory hogger ...aka Vista.
On June 2008 the rumor say we will have a 3G Iphone + integrated GPS + open SDK. All for not more than $500 USD.
Nobody will touch the touch cruise with a stick at that point (unless the price will be reduced to $250, or something close). So I believe we're going to see new phones from HTC pretty soon.
This is s stupid discussion really The iPhone is a completely different concept than Win Mobile. The real question is: Why do you use Win Mobile? If it's for the coolness factor than iPhone is the much better alternative. If you want productivity than forget the iPhone It's that simple.
This is s stupid discussion really The iPhone is a completely different concept than Win Mobile. The real question is: Why do you use Win Mobile? If it's for the coolness factor than iPhone is the much better alternative. If you want productivity than forget the iPhone It's that simple.
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With the SDK, the iPhone could potentially have all the important software of the WM. What company wouldn't want to make their mobile software compatible with the iPhone (with millions of users worldwide).
Noam23 said:
With the SDK, the iPhone could potentially have all the important software of the WM. What company wouldn't want to make their mobile software compatible with the iPhone (with millions of users worldwide).
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I hate to say it but I think he's right.
I can and only will speak for myself, even though that may be the case for everyone else as well; but I use a WM based device because of the software. While the iPhone is faster, better looking, smoother flowing...as of right now it is locked down and requires hacks just to browse the file system!!
TheOnly1 said:
This is s stupid discussion really The iPhone is a completely different concept than Win Mobile. The real question is: Why do you use Win Mobile? If it's for the coolness factor than iPhone is the much better alternative. If you want productivity than forget the iPhone It's that simple.
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If you are reffering to the current iPhone, i would have to say you are DEAD on. However, if the new one lives up to what people are saying about it (an SDK, gps, 3g),
Then apple would have successfully created something that achieves both outcomes: A cool device with a fast, smooth flowing UI WITH functionality and productivity.
remoh said:
I think much is about WM. And dont forget, Apple spend all their ressources to get their OS running on one Hardware. WM runs on hundreds of different Hardware.
Be sure, if the people at MS would optimze WM only for the Touch Cruise it would run much smoother.
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Click to collapse
Actually, it is up to the OEMs, not microsoft, to optimize windows mobile for each of their devices. This is where HTC fails time after time in my mind.
Microsoft gives them every opportunity to implement things accelerated graphics, among other things. HTC does not do it!!
And then has the audacity to blame the customers for buying devices based on their chipsets instead of what is actually implemented (or NOT implemented -- LOL).
Since my last HTC purchase of the Touch Cruise, which cost me almost $900 I am extremely upset and dissapointed, not to mention disillusioned. The kaiser and the TC could have been great, but HTC did not want them to be -- they are slow, clunky, unresponsive at times, and i don't see why HTC even put a camera on them 'cause the pictures and video are better left not being captured at all.
If the new iphone lives up to it's promises, i see no reason to ever purchase, nor use another htc product ever again. That is the thing though...Apple is one of those companies I just do not trust and/or like....but just having the possibility of a device like the new iphone will keep my interest peaked!
If everything goes as planned, I believe that mobile developers will definately take advantage of the SDK.
While it will take many months for all the developers out there to create good applications, it will happen.
I'll actually go as far as saying that iPhone software will in fact exceed that of WM software in the future -- Provided that apple releases a decent sdk and does not place absurd restrictions on developers.
Think about it...how long have WM devices been out for...and what is their popularity?
Compare that to how long the iPhone has been out for, and it's popularity...
While currently they are for two completely different concepts;
one for user friendly every day usage, and one a "business" device...
apple seems to be combining both concepts into something that I would consider a "dream" device that I have been waiting for from HTC to put out for years now.
I thought that the TC would in fact be something closely resembling my "dream" device -- And after I actually used it and saw all of the problems with it first hand, I quickly recognized I was completly wrong.
Let's see if Apple can successfully accomplish what HTC has consistently set out to -- and subsequently failed to do so many times.
If they can pull this off, I will definately consider myself a proud iphone owner / user.
i have to admit the only reason i did not buy an iphone its because i did not want to switch to at&t and evryone where i work has one. i just wanted something different so i bought the touch cruise. i am regreting it even as i type. 700plus usd down the drain. when the new iphone is out this summer i am definitely getting one and switching to at&t
i wish i could get my hands on one of the htc developers. i would beat the life out of him. for real. i am mad and pissed. even the clone iphone, the hiphone which i saw with my own two eyes and held in my hands is better than touch cruise. its only 200usd
There are a lot of Touch user using WM device not having too many complaint. I like UI and build of iPhone, but I never forget the experience what smart phone of Nokia and Sony Ericsson running in Symbian. People will just imagine what Apple will enhance the iPhone and offer what we have used in WM device. Just like people asking why manufacturer not offering VGA device. Why don't have a look of the delay of Sony Ericsson X1? Keep an eye on what Apple implement the SDK into their iPhone and software developer introduce program, and to compare what we have with WM device. Looking forward to have a device running in X OS with VGA display with weeks of power with plenty choice of softwares .... and lastly without lag. Just like years ago we are looking for a VGA WM device. Manufacturer like HTC will make such device if it can.
Are you guys serious about the Touch Cruise camera being poor? It has one of the best cameras I've ever seen on a mobile, save for the lack of flash.
-3 Megapixels
-Autofocus
-Excellent macro mode (try taking a picture of anything close up (~3inches) with this vs. a normal camera under normal lighting...TC holds its own, or better yet take a picture of something close up and compare those results to those of an IPhone)
-Auto switch to night mode in poor lighting (remember camcorders with night mode also exhibit lag in night mode, but normal cameras don't lag as they don't use a night mode since they have a flash!)
I must agree with Sonus on the camera. I actually printed out some pictures I took with my TC and they were pretty much OK on paper.
i do believe the tc is a very good device with advantages and disadvantages same as the iphone.
the thing that annoys me most (also while writing this text) the input lags in the touch keyboard or other apps, e.g. switching the t9 language is so crappy - once i click the triangle next to "20", it takes to 5 seconds open the dialogue it similar with other apps.
the good things are:
100% customization
tons of apps - navigation, wlm etc
lastly, i have see the iphone hanging - it could not connect immediately to wifi
I'm positive Apple is not going to put HTC out of business on June 2008, when the 3G iphone is supposedly coming out.
HTC will definitely release formidable competition on fall 2008, probably the dream machines we always wanted to have. My only complaint is that the Touch Cruise / Kaiser have the hardware to be much of that "dream machine", but aren't so because HTC doesn't think it is necessary since these products are competitive enough as it is, in today's market.
I agree with the only1.
Just think of it in business terms, the iphone and touch cruise are aimed at different markets. HTC could probably produce a iphone type device but why should it. HTC devices are more business orientated and sold as such, they are not (imho) trying to compete with consumer based ideas and what looks sexy when playing music or videos. They are aimed at different markets.
If people want a device to look good show off pictures and videos and play music they buy a iphone, for gods sake its a ipod touch that makes calls, so no comparison.
If people want to do all of the above and have a device that can be used as a great business tool buy a touch cruise.
Okay there are some faults but they will probably be fixed on the next device but that too will have its shortcomings and we will give out **** about it and compare it to the newest goddam wonderful iphone, jphone, kphone or whatever with hdtv or can make coffee but thats life. I know we paid big money for what we have but for jaysus sake its "not ****en dark". i.e. you could see what your were buying.
Just my opinion.
A bit strong maybe but thats life.
I dont know what you guys have done to your devices to make the camera so good, but unless i am taking pictures outside when it is sunny out, it will NOT come out clearly at all -- it is very distorted and grainy, not to mention it slows down to a crawl! I have a sony cybershot 2.1 MP camera from 2002 that takes better pictures than a TC cam -- and it cost about 150$ 6 years ago. When its dark or indoors, the LCD on the cybershot doesn't slow down to 1-5 FPS.
Now people say that the TC is a business device and that's true.
But, I for one am sick of trading off functionality for performance on the business devices produced from HTC.
Why can't it be both at the same time?
Unfortuneately, I did go in the dark on this one. Before I bought the TC I didn't research the video driver problems.
I only looked at the specs, researched the chipset and thought I was getting something that would (at least) out perform my PPC-6700 that I purchased over 3 years ago. I was wrong. I don't think HTC will go out of business...not at all, but i DO think that alot of people are in a similar boat that I am in...betrayed by HTC and will continue to hold a grudge against them, and subsequently switch to someone who can provide something better in the future...hopefully, that can be Apple...but I definately have some doubts to say the least, considering what the current iPhone came out as -- a Media player with a phone on it.
PseudoReal said:
switching the t9 language is so crappy - once i click the triangle next to "20", it takes to 5 seconds open the dialogue it similar with other apps.i
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OMG, i have the SAME problem...it is the WORST!!
you have to tap the stupid triangle like 50 times just to get it to switch.
It's an atrocity. Devices from 3 years ago do not even have this problem.
Business device or not, this is just plain unacceptable.
Unless there is a fix for this problem, or I am doing something wrong and do not know about it?
How many ppl have similar experience?
I have that same problem. Takes multiple clicks and major lag to get the input keyboard to show up. The reason I have to chance keyboards is I often use Opera 9.5 and for some reason none of the Touch keypads work with it, so I have to switch them (I think that's another problem could be related to Opera still being beta). Also every once in awhile I can't get to the PocketCM keyboard and instead get the lame Windows default one. But that also is another problem.
Back to the lag, every once in awhile I will get lag here or there, e.g. will click on the task manager on the top right and not get anything, keep clicking around with no response. Then all of a sudden all the clicks take effect and I will see the task manager menu open and close in succession real quick.
All in all it's a good device, great functionality, just a few quirks here or there. Maybe it's time to hard-reset or flash a new ROM that might solve some of these things, who knows.
Oh forgot, as for the camera lag with the low FPS in low light conditions, check out this thread:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=365345
HTH
thanks for that... the "trick" described in the first post does increase the response by 10 fps or so, but the thing is, the picture quality also goes down...its a lose/lose situation i guess lol...I also noticed that there is a new .dll fix on the HTC E-club, but only for the kaiser. I tried to login but it says theyre doing maintainance right now, so I can't check if there's anything released for the TC...even so I doubt there is
but my issue is, and always has been..why should i need to do all of these tricks and patches for a device that costs as much as the TC does? I shouldn't. No one should.
also another thing that came to my mind...people and HTC say this is a "business device"...so i was thinking, wouldn't business users want their devices to be MORE responsive than a media player / cool trendy "sexy" device?
I mean when you need to wait 5 seconds and tap the screen multiple times to play a music file, it's not really that big of a deal...it's an annoyance yes but it doesn't result in you losing work time..or a loss of productivity
but when you need to tap the X button 5 times to close out of a document and switch to your email...or taking notes and browsing web pages for work related stuff...or trying to switch between SIP's...and having to wait because the device lags worse than windows 95...it becomes a loss of productivity...
even if it's only seconds, those seconds add up, and the annoyances stock pile into one big ball of rage for me at least, heh.
I do admit that my own foolishness and quickness to buy a new device is partly to blame here. I should have looked into it more. But I also think that HTC holds a good part of the blame as well.
hopefully the geniuses here can come up with some good fast custom roms that will deal with these issues...i won't hold my breath waiting for this patch to come out from HTC at the end of the month. I'm doubtful that it will do anything at all.
I am a WM user for 4 years now. My first device was Magician, second one is Polaris and the next one will be Iphone 3G.
I love HTC, they make perfect phones and the price does not bother me, neither lack of video drivers does. I always admired all the latest technologies they include in their phones (3MP camera, 3G+HSDPA, GPS, etc..).
The only thing I don't like in HTC is ... MICROSOFT WINDOWS. I hate using stylus. It is absolutely not user-friendly.
Now, with HSDPA and GPS in Iphone I am willing to sell my polaris. Just after 5 months of using! I used my magician for 3 years before and thought I will keep my new one for another 3 years. But I give up now. I want to buy a brand new Iphone now. Never used apple products before (even Ipod).
So, my question is - do you guys know any forum similar to this one (technical), but related to Iphone stuff?
Thank you for answers and sorry for leaving you in advance.
I understand and do myself feel that we are being cheated, but i say you should search google with " iphone discussion forum" and that search will lead you rightto one, i have seen a few, i dont have an iphone,(i might get one when the video calling gps one comes out.) but i do browse to see what iphone users azre getting up to with there devices.
g oogle is your best friend.
Mate, don't do it. The new iPhone only has a 2 Meg pixel camera, and you'll be tied into some ghastly price plan for life. Wait for the Raphael, which is personally my Holy Grail of phones. Ah, a real keyboard. soooo yummy
I agree about Windows Mobile, it sucks. And the new HTC Flo nonsense looks rubbish aswell, but you know....
Apple announced NOTHING exciting (appart from MobileMe, where the HELL is windows contact/calendar over-the-air synching without Exchange????). But still they gave ir a huge launch. 3G and GPS - big deal!
or the new Samsung i900 Omnia http://www.gsmarena.com/samsung_i900_omnia-2422.php seems to be very interesting device. I propebly sell my polaris and buy a Iphone or this Samsung. In some way im to bored with the htc policy with their devices, first i have the Trinity and waited if htc could atleast make a wm6 update on trinity..but now way..then Polaris with this driver issue forexample. Polaris may be my last htc device. The only thing which is very good to have a Htc device is this forum or the hole xda developers www site
I'll wait and see what can Android bring out of my Polaris... I like the design of the polaris, and with Android it'll be better... and more finger friendly...
madinga said:
Wait for the Raphael, which is personally my Holy Grail of phones. Ah, a real keyboard. soooo yummy
...
Apple announced NOTHING exciting (appart from MobileMe, where the HELL is windows contact/calendar over-the-air synching without Exchange????). But still they gave ir a huge launch. 3G and GPS - big deal!
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I definitely would not say that the Raphael is the Holy Grail of phones. In fact it is far from it. The raphael is just a Kaiser with a flush screen and prettier touch flo. Big deal, nothing new.
Now I am a huge WinMo fan, but I can still say that the iPhone while it may not be a Holy Grail either, it is still the standard to which all high end phones are being held. It is far from perfect yes, but nonetheless it is the current standard. I'd venture to say that the majority of us that aren't switching b/c we are waiting for some little details in the form of functionality that we've enjoyed with our HTC phones. For some that may be 3G and GPS, for other such as myself 3rd party apps (VOIP!!!), and better bluetooth support (A2DP and tethering). For you that is clearly
windows contact/calendar over-the-air synching without Exchange
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Apple is getting closer and closer to closing in on its list of inadequacies with the iPhone, HTC on the other hand is not (and yes I realise that may be b/c they are tied down to WinMo 6.1).
I don't see any WinMo phone coming anywhere near where I or I would assume most of us want until Windows Mobile 7 is released. Windows Mobile 6 is just too slow, too small button oriented, too menu driven, and too lacking innovation (seriously, the UI is pretty much the same as its been ever since WinCE days back in 2000 or earlier).
well Raphael got vga over kaiser but then with smaller screens not everybody may notice
the thing that wm got going for it is lots of programs free ones and comercials ones
vs. iphone and android but with time it's not a good sleeping pillow for ms
kinda funny that while the pc world is unhappy with the current ms offering of vista
and want the next thing windows 7
pda owners are unhappy what wm6.1 can offer vs. the compatition so they want the next thing windows mobile 7
wonder if ms will release them at the same time :S :O
i love windows mobile and will not buy iphone. i was just in an att store today and the guy told me besides the phone being slash by half. u have to pay a huge fee to sign up for service. somewhere over $100. he said it would better serve u if u already had an iphone and wait for an upgrade rather than buying the new one.
as for htc. i am done with them. i wish i could find one of the developers and kick there ass. i am moving to another maker as soon as one catches my interest.
Yeah seriously WM6 is a dated wack ass looking piece of work. All this Touch Flo nonsense is just HTC trying to give their devices a fresher look. Otherwise you'd be staring at that boring ass Today screen that doesn't look good in the ads. Even Apple had to use a screenshot of WM in their keynote speech at WWDC '08 as a joke (how background apps run). This is in addition to the ActiveStink comment, which might be warranted, but I digress.
Point is, it does need to be seriously freshened up as an OS which is what WM7 is all about. However that's still a ways away. Plus barely any WM phones out there have gesture sensors or multi-touch screens anyway. Actually I don't know any that have both. 2 things the iPhone has had since last year. I am also curious as to what Android will bring to the Polaris, but I'm fed up with this dated WM6 OS (and lack of drivers).
omaga said:
or the new Samsung i900 Omnia http://www.gsmarena.com/samsung_i900_omnia-2422.php seems to be very interesting device. I propebly sell my polaris and buy a Iphone or this Samsung. In some way im to bored with the htc policy with their devices, first i have the Trinity and waited if htc could atleast make a wm6 update on trinity..but now way..then Polaris with this driver issue forexample. Polaris may be my last htc device. The only thing which is very good to have a Htc device is this forum or the hole xda developers www site
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Hey, what's the point? Omnia is just another WinMo ****! If you consider WinMo - Polaris is the best thing to buy! IMO.
yallow said:
Hey, what's the point? Omnia is just another WinMo ****! If you consider WinMo - Polaris is the best thing to buy! IMO.
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Yes ofcourse omnia is a wm phone. that wasnt my point. The point was how htc treads us comsumers, selling unfinnish products, you buy a expensive phone and things are missing in the phone which will be upgrade in the NEXT model. I like win mobiles no doubt about that and now im thinking Symbian vs Win. Sorry to say but did you read the Omnia spesifications at all? much better that Polaris?
Omnia kick ass with polaris from that point of view
Guys I have both the Orbit 2 and the first gen Iphone and both have there advantages.
However these are being eroded with Iphone 3G, namely GPS and 3G data access.
I have to admit the interface on the iphone is simply incredible, fast and accurate glass screen that does not scratch. it is an absolute joy to use.
is is intuitive at performing ANY function were the Orbit you have to think about what you are doing and then some. The interface on the Orbit is clumsy at best, whilst typing is a joke compared to the iphone, it's keyboard is a joy to use, I can type faster on it than I could achieve on my blackberry.
and to boot the build quality of the iphone is leagues ahead of the HTC product.
The facts are WM6.whatever is slow, cumbersome and needs the update now.
I will still use my Orbit2 as the PC modem function is superb but once the iphone 3G comes is released I would have to say it will get a lot less use.
Honestly. I was an huge fan of Symbian phones. Now the Polaris is my first WM device and I really like it. After a couple of customizations the device is "fingerfriendly" and I can't remember when I was using the stylus the last time.
But this is not the point. I prefer the Polaris all over the IPhone (3G) because...
... I like to change my battery on my own
... I like to send MMS
... I like to have at least an 3 MP camera on board
... I like to decide to customize the software on my own
... I like to decide who my operater of choice is
... and so on
and compare to the first IPhone the new one is build out of plastic, has still the same "features" and the "innovation" is nothing new.
I am waiting for the Raphael to exchange it with my Polaris. It gives me the freedom I used to have and the hardware features I prefer.
I can answer all those must haves apart from change battery as yes, just 'get an unlocked iphone' it gives you all those features.
Even the 2Mp camera on the iphone is comparable to the Orbit 2 3Mp.
However in the end everybody to their own.
Simply put IMO the Polaris is not finger friendly at all, the crappy plastic screen that scratches too easily is very un-responsive unless you use a stylus which defeats the object of having a touch screen phone.
I will admit the Polaris is a feature laden beast that has many strong points, but its operational method and UI cannot even come close to the Iphone, it is like comparing Mac OSX Leopard to Windows 95, the difference is that great.
mikee5402 said:
I can answer all those must haves apart from change battery as yes, just 'get an unlocked iphone' it gives you all those features.
Simply put IMO the Polaris is not finger friendly at all, the crappy plastic screen that scratches too easily is very un-responsive unless you use a stylus which defeats the object of having a touch screen phone.
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I can give you a much bigger list of things that you probably can't do even with a jailbroken iphone.
As for a screen that scratches, are you using a protector on there? Shouldn't be getting any scratches. I've heard others that don't use a screen protector and say they aren't getting any scratches either but i'm not willing to take the risk.
i dont really like the iphone's interface.. is.. bored.. maybe with a lot of graphic effects but is just VERY SIMPLE.. many programs for windows mobile can emulate that.. but iphone will never do what windows mobile does..
ORGANIZE..
because is not the same to have a folder for each thing than use a scrollable screen for all..
you should realize once and for all that there are different perfect phones for different people.
i love my polaris.. because it's a small, light device, with GPS and 3G ability.. which i will start using soon.
while other people prefer bigger screens they can buy 3.5inch screens.. i can't stand it.. but the iPhone 3G is good for them.
while i like having a modular operation system.. even tho windows mobile is not perfect, other people love having everything built in, such as in the iPhone. some other people don't mind about GPS.. .. i do.
but there isn't one best phone.. there are a few... depending on the needs of every individual.
What about the Sony Ericsson Experia X1. At first glance, I think it's more powerfull than the Iphone 3G, HTC Diamond (and variants), and the TC. It's WM based, 800x408 resolution, small, light, and works in the US.
yallow said:
I am a WM user for 4 years now. My first device was Magician, second one is Polaris and the next one will be Iphone 3G.
I love HTC, they make perfect phones and the price does not bother me, neither lack of video drivers does. I always admired all the latest technologies they include in their phones (3MP camera, 3G+HSDPA, GPS, etc..).
The only thing I don't like in HTC is ... MICROSOFT WINDOWS. I hate using stylus. It is absolutely not user-friendly.
Now, with HSDPA and GPS in Iphone I am willing to sell my polaris. Just after 5 months of using! I used my magician for 3 years before and thought I will keep my new one for another 3 years. But I give up now. I want to buy a brand new Iphone now. Never used apple products before (even Ipod).
So, my question is - do you guys know any forum similar to this one (technical), but related to Iphone stuff?
Thank you for answers and sorry for leaving you in advance.
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Don't forget... it'll be made by HTC!
And biig display is worth nill if not supported by applications.
Except if your main goal is to have nice media reproductor combined with phone
Touch Pro looks like killer device ATM...
Bodisson said:
Don't forget... it'll be made by HTC!
And biig display is worth nill if not supported by applications.
Except if your main goal is to have nice media reproductor combined with phone
Touch Pro looks like killer device ATM...
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Click to collapse
In general, I agree with you that higher resolution need to be supported by the apps. However, I've also go an Imate 6150, and I used to have an ETEN x800, and I can tell you that even though most of the apps didn't make the best use of the real estate, that the text was much more readable, colors were sharper, icons looked better, etc.
If it weren't for the crappy ROM that comes with the Imate, I would be using it now. And unfortunately, the hacker community for Imate devices isn't as developed as it is for HTC devices.
Of course the other downside to VGA (or higher) is higher power consumption.
Dave
Time to move to the dark side (3g iphone)
Ok guys I’ve been a follower of windows mobile now for the last 5 years. Xda, vario 2 & kaiser. But now the 3g phone is upon us I really think its time for us all to move on to a much superior phone and os. Microsoft have totally neglected the windows mobile platform that apple take very seriously. Microsoft even has to rely on a 3rd party developer in opera to release a browser that’s half usable!
Ok I admit the htc diamond, touch pro and Sony xperia do tempt me to stay with windows mobile but even with the fancy 3d interface they can’t hide the fact that it’s still using the very annoying and laggy 6.1 platform.
I’m constantly having problems with freezing on all my handsets and yes before you ask I always make sure I have enough free memory. It also totally pissed me off how htc treated us Kaiser Users with not supporting the device with 3d drivers does it really have 3d acceleration? One of the main reasons I chose this phone over the iphone was because I thought developers would start using the 3d capabilities.
Browsing the internet on the iphone is a total joy with the large screen and even though its only 0.7 inches bigger it feels huge compared to 2.8 Ok so the new diamond has a vga display 640x480 compared to the iphone 480x320 but it doesn’t matter how large the resolution is if we have to cram everything onto a small 2.8
And moving onto internal memory. How the hell do htc expect to compete with iphone with only giving the diamond none expandable internal memory of 4gig? Rofl jokers! How much does it cost them to put an extra 4 gig in to at least compete with the iphone 8gig? Maybe £10 extra considering 8gig micro sd cards only cost £20?? Talk about cost saving and maximum profit! I would love to have at least 16gig so I don’t have carry 2 devices, phone+mp3 player.
Ok sorry guys if I sound angry its just that I used to really love the windows mobile platform and I’ve not totally decided yet if I will get the iphone as I really don’t want to commit to 18 month contract with o2 in the uk and I know for a fact if 12 months time a new better version of iphone will be released
I have lots of hope for windows mobile version 7 and future htc devices but I really don’t want to wait that long before I can upgrade. But then again if I get a diamond or xperia then maybe I can just upgrade the rom to version 7 in the future? Gosh so much to think about! Getting a new phone has never been so complicated with so many dilemmas! Hehe
Anyway I better end this before I go on all night and ask you guys what’s your opinion of the new windows mobile phones there software and how they compare to the iphone?
dont let the door hit you on your way out.
my friend my ony bit of advice would be to think about which fits you better iphonies or winmo devices then make your decision from that. i think its almost like comparing a taxi and a police car they appear to be the same but are meant for two totally different things. the difference that i know is that winmo phones targets mostly business types and iphonies are for a more general consumer and about that gb thing iphonie was meant to be used also as an ipod winmo devices arent really meant to be used as zunes they do have some of the capabilities though as far as whether they should be headed in that direction is a whole different can of worms i hope that made a little since and good luck with your decision my only question is if you may be on your way out the door on to iphonies why in the h e double hockey sticks would you join a winmo based community lol your 15 mins?
Prodigal Son
We'll see you back here in a couple of months once you're bored out your face with the iphone...While your enjoying the music,pictures and the touch screen on you iphone , we'll be developing real useful things for our mobile devices....C'mon You know this already......
navymarvin said:
i think its almost like comparing a taxi and a police car they appear to be the same but are meant for two totally different things. the difference that i know is that winmo phones targets mostly business types and iphonies are for a more general consumer and about that gb thing iphonie was meant to be used also as an ipod winmo devices arent really meant to be used as zunes they do have some of the capabilities though as far as whether they should be headed in that direction is a whole different can of worms i hope that made a little since and good luck with your decision my only question is if you may be on your way out the door on to iphonies why in the h e double hockey sticks would you join a winmo based community lol your 15 mins?
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Wow! What a long sentence!
navymarvin said:
my friend my ony bit of advice would be to think about which fits you better iphonies or winmo devices then make your decision from that. i think its almost like comparing a taxi and a police car they appear to be the same but are meant for two totally different things. the difference that i know is that winmo phones targets mostly business types and iphonies are for a more general consumer and about that gb thing iphonie was meant to be used also as an ipod winmo devices arent really meant to be used as zunes they do have some of the capabilities though as far as whether they should be headed in that direction is a whole different can of worms i hope that made a little since and good luck with your decision my only question is if you may be on your way out the door on to iphonies why in the h e double hockey sticks would you join a winmo based community lol your 15 mins?
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Click to collapse
Yea i agree, winmo devices are def. more business oriented while the iphone is just for anyone that can use a phone...and plus it's apple!
you yourself call it the "darkside", so i dont think that be a good move...winmo is the "force"
I think its funny you just joined, and your first post is this...
I'm right there with you though, kaiser (tilt) is gone as soon as the 3g iphone is out.
I love everything winmo can do, but iphone does it out of the box. Atleast what I want it for, except mms(wtf?).
There will be tons of apps out for it soon enough, and im sure plenty of them will do the same type of things winmo can do.
caned said:
Time to move to the dark side (3g iphone)
Ok guys I’ve been a follower of windows mobile now for the last 5 years. Xda, vario 2 & kaiser. But now the 3g phone is upon us I really think its time for us all to move on to a much superior phone and os. Microsoft have totally neglected the windows mobile platform that apple take very seriously. Microsoft even has to rely on a 3rd party developer in opera to release a browser that’s half usable!
Ok I admit the htc diamond, touch pro and Sony xperia do tempt me to stay with windows mobile but even with the fancy 3d interface they can’t hide the fact that it’s still using the very annoying and laggy 6.1 platform.
I’m constantly having problems with freezing on all my handsets and yes before you ask I always make sure I have enough free memory. It also totally pissed me off how htc treated us Kaiser Users with not supporting the device with 3d drivers does it really have 3d acceleration? One of the main reasons I chose this phone over the iphone was because I thought developers would start using the 3d capabilities.
Browsing the internet on the iphone is a total joy with the large screen and even though its only 0.7 inches bigger it feels huge compared to 2.8 Ok so the new diamond has a vga display 640x480 compared to the iphone 480x320 but it doesn’t matter how large the resolution is if we have to cram everything onto a small 2.8
And moving onto internal memory. How the hell do htc expect to compete with iphone with only giving the diamond none expandable internal memory of 4gig? Rofl jokers! How much does it cost them to put an extra 4 gig in to at least compete with the iphone 8gig? Maybe £10 extra considering 8gig micro sd cards only cost £20?? Talk about cost saving and maximum profit! I would love to have at least 16gig so I don’t have carry 2 devices, phone+mp3 player.
Ok sorry guys if I sound angry its just that I used to really love the windows mobile platform and I’ve not totally decided yet if I will get the iphone as I really don’t want to commit to 18 month contract with o2 in the uk and I know for a fact if 12 months time a new better version of iphone will be released
I have lots of hope for windows mobile version 7 and future htc devices but I really don’t want to wait that long before I can upgrade. But then again if I get a diamond or xperia then maybe I can just upgrade the rom to version 7 in the future? Gosh so much to think about! Getting a new phone has never been so complicated with so many dilemmas! Hehe
Anyway I better end this before I go on all night and ask you guys what’s your opinion of the new windows mobile phones there software and how they compare to the iphone?
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Click to collapse
I-Phone= Fun device for people who want to be told what to do (and yes it does kick Windows Mobile device in functionality from here to India).
Win Mo Phones= Not being told what to do
I my friend am not a replicant.
Is this person trying to advertise to us or what? First post ever is this?? Have fun with your still limited iPhone. Forget about internal memory, my 160MB is more than enough for all my apps with over 50 left, I'll use an 8GB SDHC for all my music and movies, and if I want more memory, I'll use another! But, can anyone honestly tell me why this phone might be better? This new model pretty much hits the bottom of the list on what our devices have been doing.
Moving On...U were never Here! Good Luck if U ever have to replace the battery!
It’s funny how some people look on the iphone as the evil enemy without even giving it a chance. You see the same in many other formats, Intel vs amd, ati vs NVIDIA or even the Xbox 360 vs ps3. Some people pick a side and follow it almost like a religion even when the product is totally out done by the opposition. Intel vs amd is a good example. Why would anyone buy an amd processor at the moment is beyond me lol but they still do! amd kicked arse a few years back I must admit.
I’m still very tempted to try the touch pro as it looks a very nice phone that can be expanded to 8gig with micros sd but I guess lots of damage was done with all the problems I had with my Kaiser. Let’s hope roms of the htc diamond improve and we get a nice speedy interface similar to the iphone.
I didn’t mean to make this post sound like a I hate windows mobile I think Microsoft’s only just realised how important this market is so I have high hopes for windows mobile 7 and new htc devices in late 2008 early 2009 and the new NVIDIA apx2500 chip looks amazing! Check this out!
The CPU integrates an Ultra Low Power GeForce GPU that supports both OpenGL ES 2.0 and Direct3D Mobile, to provide sophisticated 3D interfaces. The design, based on the ARM11 750MHz processor, will be built on a 65nm manufacturing process and sport 256KB of level 2 cache.
According to the company, the APX 2500 device can play 10 hours of video or 100 hours of audio from a single charge of an iPhone-size battery.
Perhaps controversially, the APX 2500 CPU will only support Windows Mobile. Humber confirmed that this was a marketing, rather than technical choice. "We feel that Windows Mobile is placed for real growth right now
If only we had windows mobiles devices with this chip now as it really would kick the iphones ass!
I was once torn as you but now with the touch pro on the way, we will have everything we ever needed! The touch flo will be perfected, the ram, the mhz, the keyboard... Finally an interface (touchflo 3d) that is smooth! (we hope better than the diamond) And I'm sorry to say as many of you are GSM lovers including myself, if the touch pro hits the Sprint CDMA network with REV-A, That baby is gonna blaze with apps like youtube, and video streaming like sling box, etc, etc. better camera with flash, same size as tilt (almost) which was a great size for what it was packing! I truly feel that the touch pro will open the doors wide open for WM in 2008. Carriers like at&t and sprint would be fools not to pick this device up. I am sure it will be a hit any all the major carriers will have it. You will see!
iPhone is an iPhone and Windows mobile phone is a windows mobile phone. Stop comparing between WM devices and iPhones. WM devices are great but sometimes it tends to hang every now and then. iPhone seems to be too sweet but then it doesn't over the versatility of a phone (unless you're more into multimedia oriented ). flame me if you wish , its just like comparing apples and oranges together.
I am in the same situation as Caned's. I, too have been a windows mobile believer for as lomg as I can remember. I started with Casio cassiopeia, then a HP Ipaq, then a Blue Angel, then a Wizard, then a Hermes and now with a Kaiser for 10 months or so. I must admit the OS has barely been improved over the past err... 10 years (!), I agree with Caned it has been neglected by MS and I am now fed up of it. IE is appalling, and although there are alternatives to IE, they tend to run in a sluggish way (Opera Mobile) or have serious limitations (OperaMini, for example).
To Apple's credit, the iPhone has changed the way people view and use their phone, and although its market share is very low (Apple is not even among the top 5 mobile manufacturers in the US where its popularity is atits highest), it led mobile phone manufacturers to reconsider what a mobile phone stands for.
For the first time in 10 years I am now thinking of leaving WinMobile and switching to an alternative with a much more user-friendly, attractive OS. The iPhone 3G fits the bill. I never thought much of the iPod when it was released, but I won a nano recently and I must admit I am impressed.
The only thing that stops me from queing on 11/07 outside a O2 store here in the UK is the inability to use the iPhone as a 3G modem with my laptop. I can live with all other limitations of the phone (cant send MMS, camera of only 2MP, text forwarding) and the various ways in which the iPhone delivers a superior user experience relative to HTC phones. WM6.1 was supposed to improve WM6 which was (supposedly) better than WM5 which itself was (supposedly) better than WM2003SE and WM2003. Comparing WM2003 with WM6.1, I can hardly see the difference..!
Sorry guys, but talking to some who defected to the iPhone from winmobile do not regret the switch. Lets see what comes next, but it is time for MS to put its money where its mouth is and deliver a product that, finally matches the user experience delivered by competitors.
On the "lighter side" of things, I remember going to the "dark side" of winmo from my palm lifedrive, because I only wanted one device. So, I guess "ds" is a matter of perspective. Symbian, or android, anyone? jk, I like wm6.1 for now
i've been using wm for like 8 years now. the only time i moved to "the dark side" was when i tried out the nokia n95. but as per my signature below, i saw the light and moved back to wm =)
Uh, you will be missed..
This seems like a reoccurring post here. My original response to a similar thread:
The iPhone is still just for the 12 and under crowd and hippies too dumb to understand WM based phones. We will always need the iPhone for the same reason we will always need the big tag on the hair dryer telling us not to use it in the tub!
I have to agree with Caned here, whatever is released by HTC etc is just the same old windows mobile skinned up. Until v7 with multi touch comes out and the devices are built to support it then I think its time to look elsewhere for a while - probably an N96 in my case. I have no doubt that I'll be back for another WinMo device but I don't think it will be before the huge overhaul that M$ have been promising for months/years. The only aspect that makes WinMo vaguely usable is that people here write such amazing additions for it and give us access to ROM updates that networks etc don't want us to have.
In short, M$/HTC started a great trend for devices that cover all needs, unfortunately M$ slowed development and the competition (Apple/Symbian) have caught up/overtaken.
Am I the only one totally disappointed in the handsets that are coming out with Windows Phone 7.5? Who are they trying to sell the 3.x screens to? Munchkins? The screen size on the "new" HTC Titan is good but the rest of the specs on the screen are not. Look at the specs on the HTC Amaze and the Samsung Galaxy S II - THIS is what Windows Phone should be shipping on! Not this leftover crap from last years rejects. Hard to compete if you don't even try!
Well, screensize is a matter of personal preference. Millions of iphoners can attest to that.
I, personally, won't pass judgement on the Titan's screen until I see it in person.
Based on what you've posted, I'd recommend either waiting for Nokia devices or take a look at Samsung Focus S when it hits.
Although, I do agree that OEMS have been less than forthcoming with their cutting edge devices thus far. The Venue Pro could have been such an animal had it not had a myriad of issues early on.
Okbye.
yes because every single android device has monster specs and doesn't try to market to different audiences increasing share and permeability...
seriously this iteration is Microsoft and OEMs using different market points to create presence and alternatives
Dual core is next year, so either wait or not buy it...it's that simple
I think the screen sizes between 3.5 and 4.0 are awesome :-D just the way I want the screens to be;-) still hoped for some dual core, but wp is designed especially for one type of processor, so It's probably therefore it is still singlecore
sent with love from me to you
domineus said:
yes because every single android device has monster specs and doesn't try to market to different audiences increasing share and permeability...
seriously this iteration is Microsoft and OEMs using different market points to create presence and alternatives
Dual core is next year, so either wait or not buy it...it's that simple
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Click to collapse
The problem is Microsoft thinks that WP7 sales were slack because the handsets were too expensive. The reality is the handsets were a year (or more) out of date before they hit the shelves. They were pushing 3G phones with a series 1 CPU and no FFC in stores next to high end 4G phones with all the accessories. Now all we have are these puny low res screens on underpowered phones! Shameful!
What is this ridiculous obsession with 'power' and screen size?
I personally don't give a flying proverbial about anything with a screen size over 3.5", because it's just TOO BIG. It can't be used with one hand and frankly it's not necessary, I have a tablet for media and it does a MUCH better job.
And this ridiculous obsession with dual-core this and thousand-gigabyte that. When WP7 runs just as quickly on a 1GHz single core processor as Android runs on a 1.6GHz dual core, it just plain IS NOT NECESSARY. It's a PHONE for christs sakes. Hell Windows 7 can run on less power than that perfectly well.
And if you need 64 gigabytes of media on your phone, then you need to get yourself an actual media player. I don't know of anybody who actually NEEDS more than 8Gb of space on their phone - until WP7 I only ever had a 2Gb MicroSD.
Sorry, yes, it's my opinion, but frankly this specifications rubbish is getting out of hand. People don't buy Android because they know what it does - most people don't have a clue what Android is, they just know it's generally good and there's a stupid number of apps. They buy it because they're told to buy it by the salesman.
With the pace at which WP7 is catching up, with the right marketing it'll start to bring out significant followers. The key thing is getting devices out there and NOT letting operators/independents STOP stocking them. That needs people to want them - and a healthy budget for subsidy. Give a salesman more commission for a WP7 device than a theoretically 20-times better Android, and I can practically guarantee 90% of people that day will walk out with the WP7. And if WP7 doesn't need anywhere near the hardware expense, then there can be more budget for that if the OEMs play their cards right.
andrewkeith5 said:
Cut for size
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I just wanted to come to this thread and say: Amen, brotha.
You couldn't have explained it better.
Xodium said:
I just wanted to come to this thread and say: Amen, brotha.
You couldn't have explained it better.
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Thanks! You can probably tell that little rant has been brewing up for quite some time reading some of the posts on here!
mlococo said:
Am I the only one totally disappointed in the handsets that are coming out with Windows Phone 7.5? Who are they trying to sell the 3.x screens to? Munchkins? The screen size on the "new" HTC Titan is good but the rest of the specs on the screen are not. Look at the specs on the HTC Amaze and the Samsung Galaxy S II - THIS is what Windows Phone should be shipping on! Not this leftover crap from last years rejects. Hard to compete if you don't even try!
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I agree. Guess what's going to happen when iPhone 5 hits? Long lines and a sellout.
Guess what's going to happen when the second generation of WP7 phones hit? Short lines and overstock.
mlococo said:
Am I the only one totally disappointed in the handsets that are coming out with Windows Phone 7.5? Who are they trying to sell the 3.x screens to? Munchkins? The screen size on the "new" HTC Titan is good but the rest of the specs on the screen are not. Look at the specs on the HTC Amaze and the Samsung Galaxy S II - THIS is what Windows Phone should be shipping on! Not this leftover crap from last years rejects. Hard to compete if you don't even try!
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Click to collapse
I sort of agree, but only a little. For WP7 to be successful, they need to push out some hardware that blows people away. Not necessarily in specs, but in design. The new Focus S or whatever it will be called is pretty impressive, but they need to stop developing behind the curve and start innovating on some hardware. Maybe that's MS's plan with Nokia and the newly signed HTC and Samsung contracts. I know that WP7 will outperform a dual-core Android with nothing more than a few generation past snapdragon, but why not throw in a dual-core anyway? My Focus is buttery smooth 99% of the time, but a dual-core and some extra RAM will speed up app loading immensely.
andrewkeith5 said:
What is this ridiculous obsession with 'power' and screen size?
I personally don't give a flying proverbial about anything with a screen size over 3.5", because it's just TOO BIG. It can't be used with one hand and frankly it's not necessary, I have a tablet for media and it does a MUCH better job.
And this ridiculous obsession with dual-core this and thousand-gigabyte that. When WP7 runs just as quickly on a 1GHz single core processor as Android runs on a 1.6GHz dual core, it just plain IS NOT NECESSARY. It's a PHONE for christs sakes. Hell Windows 7 can run on less power than that perfectly well.
And if you need 64 gigabytes of media on your phone, then you need to get yourself an actual media player. I don't know of anybody who actually NEEDS more than 8Gb of space on their phone - until WP7 I only ever had a 2Gb MicroSD.
Sorry, yes, it's my opinion, but frankly this specifications rubbish is getting out of hand. People don't buy Android because they know what it does - most people don't have a clue what Android is, they just know it's generally good and there's a stupid number of apps. They buy it because they're told to buy it by the salesman.
With the pace at which WP7 is catching up, with the right marketing it'll start to bring out significant followers. The key thing is getting devices out there and NOT letting operators/independents STOP stocking them. That needs people to want them - and a healthy budget for subsidy. Give a salesman more commission for a WP7 device than a theoretically 20-times better Android, and I can practically guarantee 90% of people that day will walk out with the WP7. And if WP7 doesn't need anywhere near the hardware expense, then there can be more budget for that if the OEMs play their cards right.
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hey buddy, please correct your words...we didn't say that WP7 running on single core is slow,please get us right...the reason why we want dual-core is more future proof...
future proof,read it again...microsoft has disappointed me twice since I just love WP7 like you,1st is the HTC HD2 and it can't run a real or proper WP7 due to microsoft don't want to support it.Then,i went for Mozart just for wp7,and now Microsoft says that only one major update per year, therefore, I don't think mozart is up for the next update no new feature,secondary camera, gyroscope for better augmented reality, kinect integration&etc....
So, get us right,before you write man...everyone knows that WP7 is fast on single core,but no future proof...not everyone is rich a$$ and able to buy new mobile phone every year. We want something can last for at least 2 years.
Specs > Design. If Nokia ships phones with Titan/Focus S specs they will not be able to attract the amount of conversions they need.
What Microsoft needs is conversions, not turnover.
Conversion: Android/iOS/WebOS/BB users switching to WP7.
Turn-Over: Us upgrading because we want more up-to-date handsets.
Android got where it is because it was able to convert a ton of Windows Mobile/BB/WebOS and even some iOS people to Android, not through turn-over.
Cute phones don't make those people come to WP7, when the internals are a year or more behind the competition. It's not just about power. Newer SoCs allow for LTE and faster HSPA+ data connections (this is why T-Mobile is using a Qualcomm instead of Exynos in their Galaxy S II). It allows for high-def Video Chatting. NFC. WiFi Direct. Bluetooth 3.0, etc.
Keep in mind, a lot of those features were on phones a year ago.
Microsoft's hardware specs have really held OEMs back. Part of the reason why Advertising for WP7 is so bad is cause the carriers and OEMs are really struggling to find a story to tell. The handsets, even if the design is nice, simply won't have that with the way Microsoft keeps the OEMs on that leash...
And with users come more and better dev support.
I've spend the better part of 3-4 days going through the app market and there's hardly any non-game apps worth installing (outside of some obvious ones, of course). Hardly any of them have been updated to Mango, and there are apps that I paid for which haven't been updated in ~6 months...
Yes, WP7 has to catch up. Software isn't the only way they need to catch up. They need to catch up with device specs as well.
The 4G phones coming to AT&T are 14.4 Mbps HSPA+ devices. The Galaxy S II on AT&T is a 21 Mbps device. T-Mobile's Galaxy S II is a 42 Mbps device, I doubt the Radar 4G will be above 14.4 unless they use an SoC we don't anticipate. The Price of the phones didn't have anything to do with the slow uptake of WP7 on release. The state of the OS had everything to do with that. It's one thing to be told something. It's another thing for people to see what it really performed like when they went in the store (and by performed, I'm not talking about raw speed).
Even now that Mango is out. So little apps are taking advantage of its new features that they need to really push for developers to get on the ball to updating their apps and supporting them. To a consumer trying devices out in a carrier store (only choice for a lot of them, since most of their friends don't have WP7 devices), a lot of Mango's changes seem purely cosmetic because of that. Microsoft haven't even updated most of their own apps on the marketplace for Mango...
N8ter said:
Specs > Design. If Nokia ships phones with Titan/Focus S specs they will not be able to attract the amount of conversions they need.
What Microsoft needs is conversions, not turnover.
Conversion: Android/iOS/WebOS/BB users switching to WP7.
Turn-Over: Us upgrading because we want more up-to-date handsets.
Android got where it is because it was able to convert a ton of Windows Mobile/BB/WebOS and even some iOS people to Android, not through turn-over.
Cute phones don't make those people come to WP7, when the internals are a year or more behind the competition. It's not just about power. Newer SoCs allow for LTE and faster HSPA+ data connections (this is why T-Mobile is using a Qualcomm instead of Exynos in their Galaxy S II). It allows for high-def Video Chatting. NFC. WiFi Direct. Bluetooth 3.0, etc.
Keep in mind, a lot of those features were on phones a year ago.
Microsoft's hardware specs have really held OEMs back. Part of the reason why Advertising for WP7 is so bad is cause the carriers and OEMs are really struggling to find a story to tell. The handsets, even if the design is nice, simply won't have that with the way Microsoft keeps the OEMs on that leash...
And with users come more and better dev support.
I've spend the better part of 3-4 days going through the app market and there's hardly any non-game apps worth installing (outside of some obvious ones, of course). Hardly any of them have been updated to Mango, and there are apps that I paid for which haven't been updated in ~6 months...
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Click to collapse
Very true. My sentiments exactly.
Part of it is good: They've added a lot of integrated functionality that reduces the need to install 3rd party apps. Shazam is useless on WP7 for me, for example (just one example).
Part of it is Bad: There are a lot of good apps on other platforms that seem like they don't care, and apps that were released early on, like Twitter/Birdsong that seem to have fallen out of support. Maybe the dev of Birdsong made enough cash and don't feel the need to update the app anymore?
Board Express Pro hasn't updated their app in forever as well, and that's a $3 app.
IMO, if you don't plan on supporting your app in the marketplace, it shouldn't cost anything. I have tended to ignore paid apps (don't even consider them, and don't even look at them) now unless they're a reputable app from a reputable developer. I'll buy BeejiveIM if it comes to WP7, I'll buy TapaTalk if it comes to WP7. If I had to do it again, I wouldn't buy Birdsong or Board Express Pro.
My days paying for apps are numbered. It's the developers' fault, too.
I think a lot of Microsoft's initial goal was Conversion of non-smartphone users. I don't have anything to prove it, but I wouldn't be surprised if a large amount of Android's marketshare comes from mid/low range devices.
N8tr,
Weren't you the one upset in an older thread that "all the apps are mango" and you couldn't use them because mango wasn't officially released yet... And now your upset that not enough apps are mango...
Sent from my SGH-i917 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App
mlococo said:
The problem is Microsoft thinks that WP7 sales were slack because the handsets were too expensive. The reality is the handsets were a year (or more) out of date before they hit the shelves. They were pushing 3G phones with a series 1 CPU and no FFC in stores next to high end 4G phones with all the accessories. Now all we have are these puny low res screens on underpowered phones! Shameful!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
oh yes and the incredible spec'd devices that were on windows mobile were blockbusters in the market
Microsoft again will lose money if this is all about a specs war, and specs weren't the reason why android was (and is) successful. It's a part, but not the complete package.
Android is diverse enough to reach several different price points to be pawned and given away for pennies. In America, that's important. The only one that feels the need to compare the specs is a bunch of idiots like you and me to see who has the bigger e credit
And I bet anyone on xda devs has done that once
But guess what? We're a growing population, but we are still a blip in comparison to the mass consumer. Go on, ask anyone if spec's matter. To many the answer is possibly, but when a person is selling a phone, they don't say
Hi this phone has a 1.5 gig dual core qhd screen.
They dumb it down to make it sound nice. If you speak techie 24x7 selling a phone, not many sales occur. Again, its about the casual customer.
That said, looking at the price points for android devices that are priced and have similar hardware to windows phone, windows phone does provide a far greater out of box experience. That matters, and it is a large reason why many ditched windows mobile and palm in favor for the iphone flavor in 2007.
Windows Phone has to be popular, and that is a key deterrent in both apple and android's success. This year is the year of getting Windows on equal footing with Android and apple in competitive pricing. Next year is popularity, and ironically, a lot of users will be looking to renew their contracts in America...that matters too
In other words
wait or use a different phone if you're after specs...It's what I used to tell my customers all the time
munkeyphyst said:
N8tr,
Weren't you the one upset in an older thread that "all the apps are mango" and you couldn't use them because mango wasn't officially released yet... And now your upset that not enough apps are mango...
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Click to collapse
I don't know about N8ter, but I complained before the official release, when Microsoft was pushing Mango updates into the marketplace, and their policy was that any app updated to Mango caused the NoDo version to be locked (no more updates allowed). We didn't know how long it would be until the official release, and we didn't know how many NoDo apps would be dead-ended in the interim.
But now Mango is officially out, and Microsoft has admitted that their policy was a bad idea and reversed it. So now everyone wins. People with Mango can get Mango apps, and people with NoDo can continue to receive updates (at least until their numbers are so few that it no longer makes sense).
andrewkeith5 said:
What is this ridiculous obsession with 'power' and screen size?
I personally don't give a flying proverbial about anything with a screen size over 3.5", because it's just TOO BIG. It can't be used with one hand and frankly it's not necessary, I have a tablet for media and it does a MUCH better job.
And this ridiculous obsession with dual-core this and thousand-gigabyte that. When WP7 runs just as quickly on a 1GHz single core processor as Android runs on a 1.6GHz dual core, it just plain IS NOT NECESSARY. It's a PHONE for christs sakes. Hell Windows 7 can run on less power than that perfectly well.
And if you need 64 gigabytes of media on your phone, then you need to get yourself an actual media player. I don't know of anybody who actually NEEDS more than 8Gb of space on their phone - until WP7 I only ever had a 2Gb MicroSD.
Sorry, yes, it's my opinion, but frankly this specifications rubbish is getting out of hand. People don't buy Android because they know what it does - most people don't have a clue what Android is, they just know it's generally good and there's a stupid number of apps. They buy it because they're told to buy it by the salesman.
With the pace at which WP7 is catching up, with the right marketing it'll start to bring out significant followers. The key thing is getting devices out there and NOT letting operators/independents STOP stocking them. That needs people to want them - and a healthy budget for subsidy. Give a salesman more commission for a WP7 device than a theoretically 20-times better Android, and I can practically guarantee 90% of people that day will walk out with the WP7. And if WP7 doesn't need anywhere near the hardware expense, then there can be more budget for that if the OEMs play their cards right.
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I couldn't agree more, I think 16GB is plenty for almost all needs
MartyLK said:
I agree. Guess what's going to happen when iPhone 5 hits? Long lines and a sellout.
Guess what's going to happen when the second generation of WP7 phones hit? Short lines and overstock.
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because of the fact that all the iNaives out there don't know better. people need to stop holding Microsoft to a higher standard than google and apple. the iOS5 betas so far have been unstable on the iPhone4 when compared to mango, also apple may not even release the iPhone 5 but more of a rehash of the iPhone 4,I've seen ur trolling on pocketnow over the mango update and u are just plain wrong, ur just mad because mango doesn't include ur precious Google- integration.
N8ter said:
The 4G phones coming to AT&T are 14.4 Mbps HSPA+ devices. The Galaxy S II on AT&T is a 21 Mbps device. T-Mobile's Galaxy S II is a 42 Mbps device, I doubt the Radar 4G will be above 14.4 unless they use an SoC we don't anticipate. The Price of the phones didn't have anything to do with the slow uptake of WP7 on release.
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and this matters how? at&t,tmobile and vz all have data caps, what good is 42mbps when u can't even use them without being slowed or overcharged?
andrewkeith5 said:
What is this ridiculous obsession with 'power' and screen size?
I personally don't give a flying proverbial about anything with a screen size over 3.5", because it's just TOO BIG. It can't be used with one hand and frankly it's not necessary, I have a tablet for media and it does a MUCH better job.
And this ridiculous obsession with dual-core this and thousand-gigabyte that. When WP7 runs just as quickly on a 1GHz single core processor as Android runs on a 1.6GHz dual core, it just plain IS NOT NECESSARY. It's a PHONE for christs sakes. Hell Windows 7 can run on less power than that perfectly well.
And if you need 64 gigabytes of media on your phone, then you need to get yourself an actual media player. I don't know of anybody who actually NEEDS more than 8Gb of space on their phone - until WP7 I only ever had a 2Gb MicroSD.
Sorry, yes, it's my opinion, but frankly this specifications rubbish is getting out of hand. People don't buy Android because they know what it does - most people don't have a clue what Android is, they just know it's generally good and there's a stupid number of apps. They buy it because they're told to buy it by the salesman.
With the pace at which WP7 is catching up, with the right marketing it'll start to bring out significant followers. The key thing is getting devices out there and NOT letting operators/independents STOP stocking them. That needs people to want them - and a healthy budget for subsidy. Give a salesman more commission for a WP7 device than a theoretically 20-times better Android, and I can practically guarantee 90% of people that day will walk out with the WP7. And if WP7 doesn't need anywhere near the hardware expense, then there can be more budget for that if the OEMs play their cards right.
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Who are you to decide what screen size is good for me?
"IS NOT NECESSARY" - who gave you the right to decide what is necessary? Don't be a smartass
Righty, my HD2 is about to go to where all good phones go when they meet their maker, the African sub-continent
Yup its time has come, the USB socket seems to no longer except data connections, (probably broken PCB/tracks) and the digitiser has started to act erratically
as much as id like to get out the soldering Iron and replace the digitiser it doesn't cost that much more to get a new one.
So I guess im coming here to pick your brains and gather up what the community feels is the best options
So the choices above are
get a cheaper HD2 and wait out for the WP8 device launch when I could then choose to get a cheaper WP7 device or get a WP8 one
Keep the king of all phones the HD2 and shell out on brand spanky new one
Nokia 800(cheaper)
Nokia 900(would rather)
Titan (cheaper)
Titan II (Would rather)
Something else, perhaps a Smaller HD2 comparable gem
Ive put those 4 on because im interested in what the general feeling of the community is on them, obviously the 900 and the Titan II are better but I suppose the question is, for those that know is it worth the extra money?
In terms of spec I don't care, they are all good, but if your suggesting another one then 3.7in is the absolute minimum screen size and CPU spec around that of the 3 year old HD2 is acceptable, I don't play games so a 1GHz snapdragon is ok and around 512MB of RAM is fine too, the HD2 has a bit less which is fine. screen size is what's important
Im aware those newer ones are not as mod able as the HD2, but apart from web based XAP installing I don't do that much on it that needs the Full unlock so would I miss it...I dunno, side loading some of my custom XAPs would be handy I guess....
One last thing, yes I can and have researched them, but im open to suggestions and im more interested in what you guys have experienced with them, good or bad. We XDAers tend to know out stuff a lot more than the average review site!
sooo..... over to you great chaps and lasses, what do you think?
I loved my HD2 and would still be using it if it wasn't for the social integration that wp7 holds, No going back now, But if you can pick up a cheap HD2 for now then surely its the better option being what ur familiar with and knowing wp8 hopefully has some nice surprises to look forward to later in the year.
I've got an LG E900. It works smooth, but has so many little flaws, that I would go for a cheap HD2. I don't know about the Titans. But after using WP7.5 I wouldn't consider to buy a new WP device which isn't capable of WP8.
Maybe you get an used WP7.5 device cheaper than an HD2 and consider this as an opportunity to test WP. Because I guess Android isn't perfect either, but you know of its flaws and there aren't any surprises. Like when I've got my first call. WP vibrates, then rings, then vibrates. When I wanted to change this behaviour I considered myself lucky of being able to at least choose a different ringtone.
OtoTheBear said:
But after using WP7.5 I wouldn't consider to buy a new WP device which isn't capable of WP8.
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That story is not over yet Microsoft just kept quit and that's it...
Anyway, I'd buy another HD2. It's already quite cheap and still the best. And when WP8 hits the stores, I'd buy a shiny new phone with new specs (second gen devices have not made a big jump but WP8 is hopefully going to catch up with android handsets).
The HD2 will always be nice (even when you got a new phone) as you can really, really play with it.
thanks guys, Its looking like a return to the king moment with half the vote suggesting getting a cheap HD2 and waiting for 1st gen WP8 devices to see what happens.....
Ok, ive had another thought, now there doesn't appear to be any development on this one but its unlockable to deploy xaps, I don't think its full unlock but as I said im not too bothered.
So, the phone im talking about, is the Samsung Focus s
From all information that I can gather its pretty good, all beit has a plastic feel about it, anyone have any additional thoughts on the matter?
ive got a day to decide before my phone will probably pack in, USB socket just fell off the PCB all together such an undignified end to the HD2 3 year reign
Well that's sad - but even the hd2 is not invincible
I think Samsung makes pretty decent phones (I played around with an omnia 7 and galaxy s2). The only downside is that they feel really cheap and shaby as you said.
Don't know what you're paying for it, but if it's really cheap, I'd buy it. Otherwise I'd stick with an HD2 and wait for the WP8 release.
chabun said:
Well that's sad - but even the hd2 is not invincible
I think Samsung makes pretty decent phones (I played around with an omnia 7 and galaxy s2). The only downside is that they feel really cheap and shaby as you said.
Don't know what you're paying for it, but if it's really cheap, I'd buy it. Otherwise I'd stick with an HD2 and wait for the WP8 release.
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well ive gone with the Samsung Focus S imported from the states, the screen size was the deciding factor, combined with the fact that dev unlock is fairly straight forward and interop isn't much harder. Titan was just too big, and the 800 was too small and inconsistent with what I was expecting, the 900 would have been great if I could have got one cheep, the Focus S ticked all the boxes bar the slightly plastic feel to them
theres sweet bugger all going on in development so perhaps ill try give something back to the community and learn a bit from the Gods on here
The HD2 is still holding in there, if I squash the whole lower portion of the phone very hard and remove the battery to charge it, it still kinda works, it just doesn't want to die