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I'm an advanced user of a WM device (Elfin,WM6.1) for half a year now, and after the iPhone price drop, and the ever growing developer support for the device I'm having doubts on the usability and flexibility of a WM device. Lets face it, the WM core isn't fit for todays users needs, and the 6.1 upgrade just fixes ever so slightly the performance (that should have been there since WM5), and a few bugs, but don't enhance the possibilities or usability of any phone. I wish, that the 'new gen' HTC phones, Raphael and Diamond would support WM7, but I highly doubt it since, WM7 is supposed to use multi touch, which those devices don't have.
Again, why am I having doubts? I'm looking to upgrade my Elfin, and while the Diamond/Raphael have amazing hardware on them (better than the iPhone 3G even), they don't have the software to use it all hence they are useless(?) upgrades.
What's your take on this? Please be as objective as you can be, that means no fanboyizms.
Do you think that Diamond and Raphael will be WM7 compatible?
I dont think Diamond or Raphael will support WM 7 because of the lack of multi touch screen.
Current Windows Mobile isn't the best solution but still it's the most powerfull today. I really hope they will join Smartphone and Pocket PC platform in WM 7 because current control of PPC devices using just one hand is a pain.
I'm glad I'm not the only one feeling this way too. Developer support is huge. Multi-Touch is the future of mobile or even electronic devices in general. Price wise, $199 is tempting but a $10 hike in the data plan makes up for the price drop (AT&T anyways). Usability is even, touch or multi-touch. WM6.1 is as dated now as the Palm OS for me. The GUI for the Diamond and Touch Pro gives me hope that you can do anything with WinMo and hopes for WM7 (maybe a second gen Diamond).
Touch Pro for me.
Mayby there's hope yet for WM7 on Diamond/Raphael or even older devices. MWg is said to be the first to have a WM7 device, and the Zinc II and Atom V have single touch screens. So it may be possible that WM7 will support both touch and multitouch devices. Is either that, or there will be a major change in hardware of WM7 devices which I rather doubt.
Enstriel said:
. . . I'm having doubts on the usability and flexibility of a WM device. Lets face it, the WM core isn't fit for todays users needs, and the 6.1 upgrade just fixes ever so slightly the performance (that should have been there since WM5), and a few bugs, but don't enhance the possibilities or usability of any phone. . .
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I personally don't understand why you say that - it fits my needs pretty well, and I am one of "todays users". But, I am not one of the users that is wowed by the whole touch experience - I like using my stylus. It is quick and efficient, for me.
I understand you expressing that you don't think it fits your needs, but please don't lump all of "todays users" together. There is room for many different modes and models, to fit individual use.
I personally hope that the current trend towards the touch experience doesn't put the stylus interface out to pasture. Try using a complex spreadsheet in a clinical environment - IMHO a stylus interface does a much better job for such situations.
cushcalc said:
I like using my stylus. It is quick and efficient, for me.
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Yes! Finally somebody who agrees. Utensiles and tools were invented for a reason.
Hey guys, would you recommend the HTC G1 or the Touch Pro? I already have the G1 but am about to get the AT&T Fuze and am wondering which one I should keep? I really really like the G1's screen and it's legibility in sunlight and capacitive touch screen. But what I like about the Touch Pro is the TV output and Windows Mobile OS. I also have a Tilt that I am trying to get rid of but still keep because of the GPS. I have iGuidance 4 nav software for Windows Mobile but there doesn't appear to be any nav software for the G1 that is not based on data yet. What should I do?
johnny13oi said:
Hey guys, would you recommend the HTC G1 or the Touch Pro? I already have the G1 but am about to get the AT&T Fuze and am wondering which one I should keep? I really really like the G1's screen and it's legibility in sunlight and capacitive touch screen. But what I like about the Touch Pro is the TV output and Windows Mobile OS. I also have a Tilt that I am trying to get rid of but still keep because of the GPS. I have iGuidance 4 nav software for Windows Mobile but there doesn't appear to be any nav software for the G1 that is not based on data yet. What should I do?
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Fuze has better build quality, winmo, pressure sensitive screen... G1 has the opposite of those, take your pick. I prefer Android myself, so I'm waiting for a phone to come to AT&T with it, but the Fuze is a damn good device.
G1 Or Touch Pro
lets see, they both have their pro's and cons, but if it were me I would go with the touch pro, owning a kaiser and g1 I would have to say they both have their pros and con's but, android is still in its infancy as it is, and even though its an awesome OS its not really as robust as I would like to be... so that didn't help at all so let me break it down the way I see it
HTC Touch Pro
Pro's: (No Pun Intended)
windows mobile 6.1 OS is well developed
more ram and rom, arguably running faster
vga resolution screen
Cons:
no capitavie screen like you mentioned
washes out in sunlight again like you mentioned
not as crash free as android
little more pricey
G1
Pro's:
android os almost crash free
very simplified os no frills
can see in sunlight
capative screen
Con's
few customization options
slower less ram (subjective the android os doesn't need nearly as much resources as winmo)
qvga resolution screen
Sorry if it sounds one sided, but to me the touch pro definitly has the edge up for now because it has the OS that is matured as it is and seems to have the most dev support, personnaly myself, owning the afore mentioned machines, they both definity have their ups and down's I will like wise soon be upgrading to the touch pro, but I will not be throwing my g1 out because in a year or two in my opinion the android platform could very well bypass and clean house with the windows mobile os... so yeah my 2 yen on the subject hope that helps.... (sorry about the bad sp I just switched over to the google chrome browser and I haven't quite got the spell check figured out yet)
Hahaha I agree with all but 1 thing... Did you really say "few customization options" when talking about an open source OS? In WinMo everything has to be skinned or covered up, in Android you'll be able to dig deep, rip its heart out and change the things you don't like. Maybe fewer customizations NOW, but I don't plan on upgrading phones every 6 months (although I do anyways).
toche toche very true, I should have said currently few customizations, but you are correct in the future there will be no chance of survival....
Yeah even though Android is still in it's infancy, I have a good feeling that it is going to mature real quick and hopefully be really nice and I really want to stick around for that. I am so torn between the two. I really want GPS NAV because I got lost alot, however I also use my phone a lot outdoors so screen visibility is a concern. Tmobile's 3G band used to be a concern but not so much anymore because they don't allow the use of the Tzones $6 a month plan anymore so I don't really care if I have to stick with EDGE. The glass capacitive touch screen is just so nice. Oh man decisions decisions. Price is not too much of a concern because I have a friend who is willing to sell me a Fuze for practically the same price as the G1.
Then why not get both ;P they are both definitely awesome phones, ulitmatly, I think in the end you will be happy with either or, It just depends ultimately how long your willing to wait..
Hahah, I wish I could keep both, I plan on selling one to use the money to buy a phone for my sister or dad. Dad has been using crappy phones ever since I can remember and I kind of just want to give him something nice to use, even though he will probably beat it up badly.
My understanding is that while there is some optimisation for finger use in WM6.5, there are other parts of the OS that are still best suited to a stylus. For example accurately selecting text in Word, or selecting a range of cells in Excel.
One of the reasons Apple took so long to come out with copy/paste in the UI is because they knew they had to make it work with a fat finger.
My point is that I wonder how wise it is to combine a capacitive screen with WM6.5 on the Leo. I'm sure it will work fine with the basic stuff, particularly in TF3D applications. However, if I can't easily use a finger for everything, then it's going to be a real pain either struggling to touch accurately with a finger or carrying around a capacitive stylus that I'll just lose after a couple of days.
What do you reckon?
How optimised? The short answer is "not very". By default, the WM6.5 finger-friendliness is only skin deep. A few clicks and you'll quickly find yourself back at the ancient ugly stylus-designed interface from 2002.
TF3D makes things much, much nicer, but no matter how much you customise WM, there are many applications designed only for stylus use. Pocket Informant, for example, is a very useful PIM - but is difficult to use with only fingers. Many, many pieces of third-party software out there are the same. Really only a few applications are truly designed for fingers rather than stylus.
This is a problem that WM can't really fix. It's just a byproduct of the OS's age - it's been around in various forms since at least 2000. For the most part, applications written 5 to 10 years ago still work on modern WM devices. This is compounded by the fact that modern WM phones are still shipping with styluses.
I suppose if WM7 requires finger-friendly support, then things will improve considerably from third-party software companies. But until then, things are pretty dire.
microsoft fired their director for windows mobile and is putting a fire under its mobile division's ass to make winmo7 a homerun. microsoft isnt sleeping on this anymore, expect big things next year for windows mobile...
I have a Touch Pro2 running a 6.5 ROM and I actually find that, in combination with the large WVGA screen, I rarely need the stylus even in applications made for previous versions of WM. Though TouchFLO helps, even when disabled I can still navigate without a stylus. However, occasionally finger precision isn't enough and I need the stylus, but for the most part, 6.5 is actually pretty finger friendly.
However, the 6.5 Build can make a huge difference with how finger friendly the ROM is, so it's not terribly accurate to say that all 6.5 builds are finger friendly when the features of different builds are so diverse.
Windows 6.5? Not very. Practically not at all. The outside is different but the insides are almost identical to 6.1
HOWEVER 6.5.1 is VERY finger friendly. There is a lot of difference and you can expect a lot more finger friendliness with the future builds of windows mobile.
I am really looking forward for more detailed reviews about Leo, especially working with tiny UI elements, which are still there in WM 6.5. Actually, the changes of 6.5 are minor and it is not nearly as touch optimized OS. And in all of this hype about Leo no one talks about how we are going to work without stylus on this device. There already are a couple previews and some videos with a lot of "wow’s" about the first capacitive screen with multi-touch zoom in WM, but no any word or demo about using Excel or some other application that has many small buttons or things to click, drag and move. And aren't exactly these apps the real power of WM not the useless fancy weather effects, beautiful scrolling gallery (out of use for more than 20 pics) or multi-touch zoom only in few apps? I am not sure if the capacitive screen is an advantage or at least not for Windows. Nevertheless, soon we’ll see if I’m wrong (hope I am ).
martoto said:
And in all of this hype about Leo no one talks about how we are going to work without stylus on this device.
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Well with my current 2.8" screen (Touch Pro) I genuinely can't remember the last time I had to get the stylus out to do anything. Moving to a device with over 2x the screen size, I can't see there being a big problem. Sure I'll be using more of my finger and less of the nail, but a >2x bigger screen should more than compensate for that!
That said, resistive is still probably going to be the technology of choice for smaller screens, especially since for a while at least MS plan for smaller(/cheaper) devices to stick with 6.x instead of 7.
As for 6.5's general finger-friendliness, it's ahead of 6.1 in some places but the difference isn't that big. 6.5.x is where the action is on that front, and at least we enthusiasts will be making the most of that, even if the average buyer won't be. Well, we'll be making the most of it until we first get the v7 leaks
mr_Ray said:
Well with my current 2.8" screen (Touch Pro) I genuinely can't remember the last time I had to get the stylus out to do anything. Moving to a device with over 2x the screen size, I can't see there being a big problem. Sure I'll be using more of my finger and less of the nail, but a >2x bigger screen should more than compensate for that!
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You can't use a nail at all on a capacitive screen, only skin.
I have a Touch Pro2 (3.6" screen) and I have to say that I use the stylus all the time - Opera 9.5 would be totally unuseable without it, and any time you start using a Windows app with radio buttons and checkboxes, the stylus is far easier. That would even more true if I couldn't use a fingernail for added accuracy compared to a finger. It remains to be seen how much difference WM6.5 and production Opera 9.7 make to that.
I for one, just don't know what Microsoft is doing with this half arsed attempt of a finger friendly OS,
They are shipping 6.5.....the OS looks like one of the worst put together it looks very very rushed (we know its not...they've had more than enough time)
HTC with thier TouchFlo is a far more elegant solution.
Microsoft can stick 6.5 where the sun don't shine....
No such thing as a finger friendly Microsoft OS...yet
mr_Ray said:
Well with my current 2.8" screen (Touch Pro) I genuinely can't remember the last time I had to get the stylus out to do anything. ...
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A very simple example with app that every WM has - the mobile Excel. Open a new file and try to change the row height without using a stylus or a nail. It is possible but not near as easy, isn’t it? On a twice bigger screen, the row border will be almost the same thickness. So here a bigger screen won't help. Just imagine that you need to work with a similar interface every day. Now, tell me is there anything that can be done with capacitive screen but cannot with resistive? Don't get me wrong, I know that if you work only with fingers, capacitive screens are far better. But here we have windows mobile, and for these users that often leave the TouchFlo to use the true power of windows, the lack of possibility of precise pointing on the screen could be a big issue.
martoto said:
A very simple example with app that every WM has - the mobile Excel. Open a new file and try to change the row height without using a stylus or a nail. It is possible but not near as easy, isn’t it? On a twice bigger screen, the row border will be almost the same thickness. So here a bigger screen won't help. Just imagine that you need to work with a similar interface every day. Now, tell me is there anything that can be done with capacitive screen but cannot with resistive? Don't get me wrong, I know that if you work only with fingers, capacitive screens are far better. But here we have windows mobile, and for these users that often leave the TouchFlo to use the true power of windows, the lack of possibility of precise pointing on the screen could be a big issue.
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I never claimed that my usage was a template for every other person on the planet, and would never think to do so. For *me* capacitive has a few advantages over resistive, and likewise a few disadvantages, it pretty much comes out as a wash. I'd stil be as happy with the HD2 if it had a resistive screen.
My use of Excel on the go is purely simple data entry or just viewing. There are also other ways to resize than clicking on and dragging a line a pixel or two wide. I also recognise there are many people who would find such things infuriatin with *their* usage patterns, applications, and habits.
This whole issue really highlights Microsoft's biggest issue in Windows Mobi... er Windows Phone today. It's a stylus-based PDA OS trying to be a finger-based phone OS. The heritage is based entirely in yesterday's PDAs - where it was fantastic for the job and thrashed PalmOS in the marketplace.
However there's been a gradual change in usage of the OS from PDAs to phones, and the underlying systems just haven't adapted to the changes. The UI today is much the same as it was in 2002. If you want your OS on a modern smartphone where people want to pull their phone out of their pocket and tap and slide with their fingers, you just can't get away with an interface and screen tech from a 2002 PDA.
Be one or the other - create a side branch for the dwindling userbase who want a PDA or PDA/phone if you have to - but the core of the OS itself if you want it on a phone - just has to adapt to survive.
Thanks for everyone's thoughts. It seems to me that if WM6.5 is not fully optimized for finger use, which it's not, then HTC really shouldn't combine it with a capacitive screen. Simple as that.
Moandal said:
Thanks for everyone's thoughts. It seems to me that if WM6.5 is not fully optimized for finger use, which it's not, then HTC really shouldn't combine it with a capacitive screen. Simple as that.
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Well, that's a large part of the reason for TouchFLO/Sense UI, of course; WM6.5 by itself isn't sufficiently finger-friendly, but with the HD2's customised UI on top of it, it is (in HTC's opinion, anyway).
But is it just where the balance of their expertise and development lies? One looks at the HTC Leo and it looks like an android device.....lots of hardware supported under Android, but not under WM.....and the whole thing kludged together to work on an operating system with built in short term obsolescence.
It seems to me that we are in a transition period. Hardware too sophisticated for WM 6.5, but development of WM7 and Android not yet complete.
I think WM is a dead duck until (and maybe beyond) WM7, and the inroads that other systems can make between now and it's release will probably give an indication of the future direction of mass market smartphones.
Given the apparent inability of Microsoft to deliver a satisfactory platform for ordinary users and developers alike, and Androids success in doing exactly that (although still early days), I see it going only one way for the mass market.
I've bought my last WM phone (I think). It was Blackstone.
in short like only 1 or 2 have already said.... 6.5 is not
6.5.1 [aka towards wm7] is very much finger optimised.
if u guys are not clear, then only the versions which have start buttons on bottom are 6.5.1 and can be used with one hand. 6.5 its a mixed bag and u have to use both hands sometimes.
atifsh said:
in short like only 1 or 2 have already said.... 6.5 is not
6.5.1 [aka towards wm7] is very much finger optimised.
if u guys are not clear, then only the versions which have start buttons on bottom are 6.5.1 and can be used with one hand. 6.5 its a mixed bag and u have to use both hands sometimes.
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What's the big difference between 6.5 and 6.5.1 then? I wouldn't have though a 0.0.1 version change would be much different. Also which version does the HD2 have? The specs I've seen say it's got 6.5.
Windows has really lost it's way. They need to pick a path tha makes sense and stick to it.
The way I see it there are two camps. the iPhone is for entertainment and the blackberry is more business oriented. Why they are going after the iPhone is beyond me. The pocketpc was an awesome business tool and they are trying to evolve it into an iPhone.
Look at Blackberry, most of their phones have no touch screen. They have a trackball! Yikes! But that works for business...
I routinely use my phone for powerpoint presentation, I use excel, I am an original PPC user and they are making the product stylus unfriendly and removing the hardware buttons...
I have the TP2 and I would trade in the touch screen for a scroll wheel, and a d-pad...
I don't think Windows can win against the iphone. They should go after blackberry...
I think there's 2 things here.
Windows Mobile as an OS needs a lot of work IMO. The current hardware is so capable but still windows manages to be sluggish at times. This needs to be fixed, it should be rewritten for the ground up for the more capable modern hardware, better resource management, using all resources to make the thing go as smooth as possible.
Then for the interface ... well ... it's all in the name 'Pocket PC'. It's like a small computer, it even has a startmenu etc... that's how it was build. Devices changed though, and now we need finger friendly interface with eye candy and 3D.
Let's hope that Windows Phone 7 will be as good and revolutionary as Windows 7 for desktop. And let's hope that we won't have to buy a new phone to run it
Moandal said:
Also which version does the HD2 have? The specs I've seen say it's got 6.5.
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6.5.1 hasn't been released yet and won't be until somewhere around February. I wouldn't be surprised if the HD2 gets a 6.5.1 upgrade, although there's no guarantee. If you don't mind installing a "cooked" ROM then it may be available sooner in beta form.
I had no trouble using my big nail-less thumbs on 6.1. WinMo 6.5 is better but not much different. You want something better install the 6.5.1 ROM. I've been using it for the last month and it's the most finger freindly version of WinMo.
Hi guys, so i've had a great run with my HTC Touch Pro, i've been using it for more than a year now but now I feel like it's just too slow and lacking a lot of stuff that i wanted. I've been around the scene long enough, and have tried out several custom roms already, and the only ROM that actually makes this phone run smoothly is the EnergyROM, but even so, it's still slow and laggy. The currenty EnergyRom i'm using is the March 31st 2010 build, so yes i'm very up to date.
I've installed tons of tweaks and apps on it (even pirated ones) and have pushed this phone to its limits, but i feel that it's just not very powerful and i'm losing my interest in it, so i decide to sell it and go for an upgrade.
To be honest, i don't think Windows Mobile is any good at all, so i'm trying not to go for any Windows Mobile device. I'm thinking of going for the Nokia N900 coz it's such a beast, and its multi-tasking is awesome, but the lack of apps for it just makes me think twice about getting it.
On the other hand, i kinda wanna go for an Android phone, but so far there aren't any Android phones with a slide-out keyboard (not that i know of), and i only want phones with a keyboard.
Please don't recommend me an iPhone either, i've owned one and hated it. I do have an iPod Touch and it's jailbroken so all the stuff i can do with an iPhone, i can do it on my iPod Touch, just without the phone capabilities.
Lastly, i'm kinda considering to go for the HTC Touch Pro 2, but then it's not so much of an upgrade coz it's got an older processor than the Touch Pro and just has a bigger screen. Is it actually smooth or fast?? And the battery life just sucks on these devices....I would appreciate more info from someone that has actually upgraded from the Touch Pro to the Touch Pro 2, coz it will be more accurate. I kinda hate the look of it though, it doesn't look as sexy as the Touch Pro...
so ya i dunno, can anyone recommend something?
Depends on what you are going to use your phone for!
But I personally did have an HTC Touch Pro and I did not like it very much! Mostly besouse of the lacking drivers!
My recommendation if you like nokia and Symbian, go for the Samsun Omnia HD i8910!
Why?
Becouse it is the best phone I have ever owned, it is just nothing else that can match this beast performance and hardware wise!
Not to mention the great 8 MP camera with 720p HD recording!
The built quality is just great, I have droped it several times "outside", and there is not a scratch on it!
It has no hardware keyboard, but the capacitive screen makes up for it very good!
Hope it helps!
branko.savic said:
Depends on what you are going to use your phone for!
But I personally did have an HTC Touch Pro and I did not like it very much! Mostly besouse of the lacking drivers!
My recommendation if you like nokia and Symbian, go for the Samsun Omnia HD i8910!
Why?
Becouse it is the best phone I have ever owned, it is just nothing else that can match this beast performance and hardware wise!
Not to mention the great 8 MP camera with 720p HD recording!
The built quality is just great, I have droped it several times "outside", and there is not a scratch on it!
It has no hardware keyboard, but the capacitive screen makes up for it very good!
Hope it helps!
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thanks for your reply. To be honest, i was also interested in the Samsung Omnia 2, i know that the Omnia runs very well, i can't remember exactly but it runs better than the Touch Pro and Touch Pro 2, i think it has a 300% higher performance gain? And maybe it runs or performs faster than the iPhone as well, i can't really remember.
But the thing is, i just don't like phones without any sort of keyboard or keypads.....i LOVE phones with keyboards, i can type super fast on it, but i just hate touch typing using soft keyboards......
that's why when i had my Google Nexus One, i gave it away for free after using it for about a week. Don't get me wrong, i love Google Android and Nexus One is a VERY VERY good phone, but i just don't like the feel of touch typing....i'm just not used to it.
That's why i don't wanna go for the Omnia or Omnia 2, or what you suggested, coz there's no keyboard.
I feel that the Nokia N900 is a good choice coz the multi-tasking is very smooth and fluid, and runs extremely well. I've seen tons of videos of it running tons of applications without lag, up to 35 in fact. And it has a keyboard so that suits me too.
I can't exactly describe it, but i want a phone that is first of all, very smooth and fast in performance. I don't want any sort of lags at all. Touch Pro lags quite a lot, it's slow to be honest, and Touch Pro 2 isn't much of an upgrade either. I want to be able to multi-task very easily, like switch between a game, to an app, to text messaging etc. If you watch the Nokia N900 videos, you'll know what i'm talking about, it's VERY SMOOTH.
But then again, i want the phones to have a rich community and fanbase supporting it, i.e have tons of apps and custom roms or tweaks development for it, just like XDA is for Windows Mobile, that's why i like this site a lot.
Nokia N900 is using the Maemo 5 operating system, and it's still very new so not much is developed for it, so i'm a little worried there. But it is very powerful as it can run OSX 10.1 (i can't remember exactly) and emulate several emulators already, as well as playing Starcraft etc on it, so it's a very powerful device.
But i just need more options and opinions....
oh and i don't really care about cameras or taking videos etc, i just care about the use of applications and multi-tasking, and just overall the software performance etc...
The n900 isn't very smooth at all at least when compared to the nexus one, HD2 or iPhone. It has got the best browsers though with full flash 10.1 support.
Another phone you might want to take into consideration is the Droid.
Toss3 said:
The n900 isn't very smooth at all at least when compared to the nexus one, HD2 or iPhone. It has got the best browsers though with full flash 10.1 support.
Another phone you might want to take into consideration is the Droid.
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so performance wise, it's not smooth? That's odd because from what i've seen on the dozens of Youtube videos, it runs REALLY smooth, it's one of the few phones out there that can actually multi-task properly. The iPhone doesn't even have the multi-task functions (unless you jailbreak it and install the multi-task apps), and it'll only be officially getting it when the OS 4.0 comes out for it. But even then, only the newer GEN will be able to support multi-task, so it's not smooth at all because it's a pain in the ass to press the home screen all the time. Like i said, i've owned an iPhone before and jailbroke it myself, and with the tons of tweaks and apps i've installed, it made my life 10x better compared to other people with their un-jailbroken iPhones, but even still it's a pain in the ass to use it. I also have an iPod Touch so i'll just stick with that, so ya i just thinks iPhone sucks as a phone for multi-tasking, it's not smooth at all.
The Droid looks ugly so i never liked it.
...
slide out keyboard how. normal slideout there are multiple variants, depending on gsm/cdma.
most affordable id say is the dream. goes for 100-150 on ebay. i bought one a few days ago, still waiting on the nurse to send it so i cant vouch how good it actually is.
cheapusenet said:
...
slide out keyboard how. normal slideout there are multiple variants, depending on gsm/cdma.
most affordable id say is the dream. goes for 100-150 on ebay. i bought one a few days ago, still waiting on the nurse to send it so i cant vouch how good it actually is.
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i'm not sure i understood what you meant in the first sentence. What i mean by slide-out keyboard is like the HTC Touch Pro, Touch Pro 2, Nokia N97, Nokia N900 etc.....that's what slideout keyboard is.
HTC Dream looks ugly and screen too small.
lg eve looks better than the dream, but the screen is only 3" and it's resistive screen. Also it's android 1.5.
I am on the AT&T network in the USA and I cannot leave it. My old phone was an HTC Fuze (HTC Touch Pro I think is the general term) and I loved it. The only issue I had with it was that it was a bit on the slow side and it lacked a 3.5mm jack, but I didn't really care. I loved it's slide out QWERTY keyboard. I loved Windows Phone. I loved it. Then the touch screen started to go bad (as if it was always being touched by something) and it being an old phone I decided to get a new one. I got an iPhone 4. I hate it. WM 6.5 let me customize my home screen so that I could see all my upcoming calendar appointments right there when I look at the home screen. The iPhone requires you to drag the top of the screen down. This may seem trivial to some, but I'm hugely scatterbrained and it really helps. There were other aspects too like the QWERTY keyboard, the ability to put emulators on it (I played Pokemon Blue on my phone), and things like that. I can't do that on my iPhone currently. Oh yeah! The built-in Stylus was also amazing! I just loved that phone.
Here's what I'm looking for in a phone:
AT&T Carrier (must-have)
Windows 7 (at least WM phone)
Slide-out QWERTY Keyboard (no Blackberry style or that wierd Vertical Slide for tiny buttons)
Stylus/Big enough Screen (if stylus, must be built-in like the Fuze, not peripheral)
Good performance (I'm referring to emulation. I played PSX games on my HTC Fuze, but only RPGs due to slowdown and lack of sound. I would like to be able to play emulators, especially SNES emulators, without slowdown and with sound smoothly)
3.5mm Headphone Jack (not a requirement, just a nice have that my old phone didn't)
What do you recommend? When I saw the HTC 7 Pro, I was in love. Then I found out it's not available for my carrier. Is the LG Quantum really the best phone for me? It technically meets my specifications, but there's something about it that I don't like. What about the LG eXPo? That caught my attention a while ago. Can that be end-user upgraded to WM 7 or 7.5 and meet my requirements?
note: I want to avoid Jailbroken/Unlocked phones if possible. I don't like fiddling with that stuff myself, and I don't want to trust some random ebayer to have done it right. I am definitely capable of learning, but I don't take unnecessary risks.
Doesnt the US version of HTC 7 Pro work on ATT network? 7 Pro and the LG are the only WP devices with landscape keyboard, then there is the Dell Venue Pro with vertical slider.
The only HTC 7 Pro released in the United States is for Sprint and is called the "HTC Arrive." I was not aware it could even be unlocked for usage with AT&T.
Im not sure is it possible to unlock and use at ATT's network, Im in Europe and dont know about US networks. Im sure if you will search you will get the answer. 7 Pro is a great device, I love it. The OS runs so smoothly, that Im sure that the LG with same specs will be a good device also, but I would go for the HTC if anyway possible.
Lotus1 said:
I am on the AT&T network in the USA and I cannot leave it. My old phone was an HTC Fuze (HTC Touch Pro I think is the general term) and I loved it. The only issue I had with it was that it was a bit on the slow side and it lacked a 3.5mm jack, but I didn't really care. I loved it's slide out QWERTY keyboard. I loved Windows Phone. I loved it. Then the touch screen started to go bad (as if it was always being touched by something) and it being an old phone I decided to get a new one. I got an iPhone 4. I hate it. WM 6.5 let me customize my home screen so that I could see all my upcoming calendar appointments right there when I look at the home screen. The iPhone requires you to drag the top of the screen down. This may seem trivial to some, but I'm hugely scatterbrained and it really helps. There were other aspects too like the QWERTY keyboard, the ability to put emulators on it (I played Pokemon Blue on my phone), and things like that. I can't do that on my iPhone currently. Oh yeah! The built-in Stylus was also amazing! I just loved that phone.
Here's what I'm looking for in a phone:
AT&T Carrier (must-have)
Windows 7 (at least WM phone)
Slide-out QWERTY Keyboard (no Blackberry style or that wierd Vertical Slide for tiny buttons)
Stylus/Big enough Screen (if stylus, must be built-in like the Fuze, not peripheral)
Good performance (I'm referring to emulation. I played PSX games on my HTC Fuze, but only RPGs due to slowdown and lack of sound. I would like to be able to play emulators, especially SNES emulators, without slowdown and with sound smoothly)
3.5mm Headphone Jack (not a requirement, just a nice have that my old phone didn't)
What do you recommend? When I saw the HTC 7 Pro, I was in love. Then I found out it's not available for my carrier. Is the LG Quantum really the best phone for me? It technically meets my specifications, but there's something about it that I don't like. What about the LG eXPo? That caught my attention a while ago. Can that be end-user upgraded to WM 7 or 7.5 and meet my requirements?
note: I want to avoid Jailbroken/Unlocked phones if possible. I don't like fiddling with that stuff myself, and I don't want to trust some random ebayer to have done it right. I am definitely capable of learning, but I don't take unnecessary risks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OK, first off, there's a huge difference between Windows Mobile 6.5 and Windows Phone. I'm really surprised you liked WM6.5, because it was always slow and annoying to me. I am even more surprised you had a bad experience with the iPhone. While I am completely devoted to Windows Phone, I still think the iPhone is a solid phone.
About phones, AT&T definitely has the best Windows Phones. While the Quantum is its only keyboard slider, I would reccommend you reconsider your keyboard requirement. ALL Windows Phones are smooth/fast, have the 3.5 jack, and have reasonably big screens. All Windows Phones also have an awesome on-screen keyboard. WM6.5 phones are not capable of upgrading, and I don't even think AT&T sells them anymore.
By the way, I've had the HTC Arrive, and it's a good phone, but the new AT&T devices are thinner, faster(as in processor), and have 4G LTE.
My recommendations?
1. The Nokia Lumia 900 - $99 on contract
I have it currently, it's awesome. 4" screen, 4G LTE, beautiful hardware.
2. HTC Titan II - $199 on contract
I almost picked it over the 900, but its $100 more and doesn't have Nokia's exclusive apps. It does have a bigger screen though, and some say a better camera.
---------- Post added at 01:42 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:40 AM ----------
Forgot to mention, a stylus will NOT work with any Windows Phone, as they use capacitive (multi-touch) screens. Also, emulators are partially supported on Windows Phone, I think there are a couple on the marketplace, but it seems like they are always dealing with trademark/copyright issues.
If you really want the 7 Pro, you can order one online from Europe (there are various online stores that will ship overseas). It should work with AT&T's 3G, though I recommend that you double-check the bands it supports just in case, and of course make sure it's SIM-unlocked. You'll have to pay full price, and AT&T doesn't appear to offer any plan discount even if you bring your own device instead of getting a subsidized one (yet another reason I think they're a crap MO, but I assume you have your reasons...)
Do not get the Arrive; it is a CDMA-only phone and is completely incapable of connecting to a GSM network like AT&T uses. The 7 Pro as sold in Europe (and possibly elsewhere) is GSM.
Let me further explain why I loved my Fuze (HTC Touch Pro)
It was slow (ish), but not that slow. I had removed all the bloatware from mine and a few tweaks and it was only noticeably slow when doing certain non-typical tasks. This was a non-issue for me except for 2 problems: I could not play SNES games and I could not play PSX games with zero slowdown.
How I used my phone:
Organizer/PDA with contacts and a calendar. The customizable home screen that displays all upcoming appointments is great, as was the calendar system. I'm scatterbrained and it really helped me. Iphone's lack of customizability in this area sucks.
As a flash drive. I always had a usb to micro usb cable in my backpack and so I kept all my schoolwork on it as well as anything I needed. There's an app for it so my iPhone can have similar functionality, but it's not nearly the same.
As a game device to while away the time. I had PSX JRPGs on it, the original Pokemon games, Zelda, Mario, etc. These were all emulator based games from my childhood. This is strait up impossible on the iPhone without jailbreaking, which I won't do, and also means I basically require the slide-out keyboard as touch-screens work poorly with emulators.
Lastly, I stored music on it, but never really used it as an MP3 player because it lacked the 3.5mm jack.
From what everyone is telling me, and from what I've learned about how Windows Mobile 7 is not a PocketPC based operating system, I'm most likely to leave it for android. I strongly dislike operating systems that don't allow for 3rd party apps without prior approval. That's one reason I hate the iPhone. The others are the lack of a touch screen and the lack of a customizable home screen. The way I currently use my iPhone, except for a few features it's nothing more than a browser enabled phone because it simply can't do what I want it to do without jailbreaking.
I guess the phone to get for me is the Samsung Captivate Glide since Windows Phones don't really have what I'm looking for.