Related
This topic has been floating around the forums for a long time now. For as long as chefs been cooking, they’ve been trying to cook their “perfect rom.” Well…unfortunately they can’t do it by themselves. They need some help from us…so this thread is for any and all feedback we may all have as users, to offer to our chefs in order to achieve our goal.
Keep in mind guys, we’re all different people, we all require different things. Let’s keep our thoughts realistic and respectful. We’re use to 3 types of roms….Full, Medium and Light (lite.) Let’s see if we can offer up a somewhat standard model and set of applications for each type of rom.
But not just apps….lets break this down to CE builds..OS tweaks…radio performance…visual preferences…..EVERYTHING!!!!
also (i know this is gonna cause an outbreak!....) if there are any outstanding issues you've been having with all coked roms across the board...feel free to mention....The more we're all aware of something the better the chance it will be addressed!
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((Results and conclusions))
-For the most part, we can all agree certain apps should not be cooked in because they're updated too often.
======================================================================================
((Topics and issues))
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*well i can't edit the poll...so we'll have to do this the hard way. So we have the "to be cooked or not" apps figured out. Next is the model in which the roms are produced. Like i said before...theres usually 3. Lite, Medium and full. We need to define the roll and specs of each and what they contain. Sound Off
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At the request of mr.dutty i've added a poll. Im not sure if i can do this, but i'll try to switch it up everyday with a new subject everyday or so.
* = current topic
almost was going to warn you to get some flame retardant clothing at first glance. However after reading a bit more it does not seem to be a bad idea, assuming it can be kept free from garbage. Ill put some thought and contribute what i can but not a bad idea.
A few things I look for in a cooked ROM -
Hardware keyboard performance: We're talking about a device that features a very nice full hardware keyboard, and roms should take this into account. I've encountered roms that have laggy keyboard entry, other weird keyboard entry problems, and some which work beautifully.
Careful which apps are cooked in: If an app is likely to get updated frequently, it's my opinion that it shouldn't get cooked into a rom (unless, of course, it's a PITA to install in the first place). There'd be no point cooking PointUI's Home into a ROM, as it gets updated a lot. Also, the legality of any cooked in App should be considered. For example, I'd love to see a rom that's got Opera Mini cooked in and ready to go as the default browser, which is a lot of fiddling around and hard work, rather than a rom that uses the NOT FREE Opera Mobile.
Screen Rotation Speed: Some ROMs have managed to achieve near instant screen rotation speeds, others have not. It'd be great to know what settings affect this, and cook them in.
Options: I hate Large Start Menu. I love the fact that you can easily turn it off without any side-effects. I love the fact that Quick Menu gets cooked in, but you have the option to not use it (I'm firmly in the "loving quick menu" camp though, at the moment).
Most important: Speed. I really don't feel like this device is performing quite as well as it could do. I think we could get there - I think there's still some exploring to do, and at some point there'll be a major breakthrough.
Maybe this thread is the start of all of that?
Thank you For starting this as this will alow us to find out from different individuals thier own opinions and also from different chefs as to how we can maximise the best performance out of this baby kaiser.
At the moment Im trying different stuffs
I don't know to much about this stuff, but in my last month of looking at these forums.. I think a lot of people use these
- Pocket Core Media Player
- SOme form of Registry Edit
- Task Manager (Detialed one, WTask i think it's called?)
- Pocket Screen
- Office (obviously)
- Note pad (love it)
- Touch Settings
- Query Analyzer (maybe not for everyone..)
- Slide 2 unlock (better to get that yourself probably now that I think about it)
- Schapps advanced config 1.1
- KaiserTweak
- Total Commander looks pretty usefull
- Some sort of FTP program
- I wish there was some app for linking HTC favorites in the cube to their contact record (give you option of calling,e mailing, etc, instead of a quick call)
Not very advanced stuff, but stuff I hav efound pretty usefull that i never knew about.
swtaltima said:
almost was going to warn you to get some flame retardant clothing at first glance. However after reading a bit more it does not seem to be a bad idea, assuming it can be kept free from garbage. Ill put some thought and contribute what i can but not a bad idea.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
lol no worries man. i got my suit bag unzipped and waiting!
i guess i'll give it a go....
me myself...I prefer a Full rom. but it seems very unrealistic as to what’s in a full rom or not. I’ve been talking to dutty a bit about this and he wanted me to get some ideas and get back to him….so I guess this is the place to get it all together. For those of us with a tilt…we all know how fat the shipped att rom was. But the funny thing is…it wasn’t slow at all! This is what sparked my thoughts. How about…a full rom = a bloated rom! But not bad bloated….good bloated. I’m talking about any and all those little apps we all know and love. Such as….group sms…call firewall…opermini (files provided to set as main browser…I think that should be left up to the user,) tom tom...quick menu….Live search and all other live apps, all HTC current apps and dialers….ect ect. I wanted to include slide to unlock, point ui and pocket cm…but these apps are updated too often to cook in….but non the less would be great for a full rom. I believe the cooks can find a way to make a rom like this work!
For a media rom….pretty much the rom…plus all the htc goodies we’re all used to. And the the rest of the inessentials….things like flash lite…youtube already cooked in....ect ect. It should be kept clean and nice.
A lite rom?....nothing! lol…lite roms are for those of us who like to tinker ourselves or just don’t use a damn thing on the phone…so I think it should be just the os! And call it a day.
I think we need to add a poll of some sort to vote on what apps should be included in each rom so we can observe, study and compare what individuals use in thier roms and what they dont like.
dan13l said:
A few things I look for in a cooked ROM -
Hardware keyboard performance: We're talking about a device that features a very nice full hardware keyboard, and roms should take this into account. I've encountered roms that have laggy keyboard entry, other weird keyboard entry problems, and some which work beautifully.
Careful which apps are cooked in: If an app is likely to get updated frequently, it's my opinion that it shouldn't get cooked into a rom (unless, of course, it's a PITA to install in the first place). There'd be no point cooking PointUI's Home into a ROM, as it gets updated a lot. Also, the legality of any cooked in App should be considered. For example, I'd love to see a rom that's got Opera Mini cooked in and ready to go as the default browser, which is a lot of fiddling around and hard work, rather than a rom that uses the NOT FREE Opera Mobile.
Screen Rotation Speed: Some ROMs have managed to achieve near instant screen rotation speeds, others have not. It'd be great to know what settings affect this, and cook them in.
Options: I hate Large Start Menu. I love the fact that you can easily turn it off without any side-effects. I love the fact that Quick Menu gets cooked in, but you have the option to not use it (I'm firmly in the "loving quick menu" camp though, at the moment).
Most important: Speed. I really don't feel like this device is performing quite as well as it could do. I think we could get there - I think there's still some exploring to do, and at some point there'll be a major breakthrough.
Maybe this thread is the start of all of that?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
point ui makes for a good debate....the reason i would cook it in is because it comes with its own update client. so even if an older version is cooked in....or an update is available a day after the rom is cooked....you just need to go into update and that will take care of that. but i do agree with the idea of frequently updated apps should be avoided.
the screen roatation is another one....i agree. i've seen it vary from rom to rom even within dutty's camp. maybe the cooks can unite and nail that one down.
I've been using different ROMs over the last month or so and what I normally go for is the lite ROM with all the performance updates. Then I add my own apps to it. From the ROMs that have applications cooked into it I may use 80-90% of it which I find is not good for me and I think this holds true for most, if not all users. Everyone has different taste/needs.
Maybe a ROM with just the OS and performance/optimization tweaks and leave the rest up to the users. They can find the cabs for everything so why bother to cook it in. The other thing with cooking in the apps if is if the app gets an update a new ROM is needed.
Or just cook your own ROM. There's enough info within the forums to make your own ROM and include whatever apps you want.
Maybe the focus should be on optimizing the OS and leave the apps to the choice of the user.
ecltech said:
I've been using different ROMs over the last month or so and what I normally go for is the lite ROM with all the performance updates. Then I add my own apps to it. From the ROMs that have applications cooked into it I may use 80-90% of it which I find is not good for me and I think this holds true for most, if not all users. Everyone has different taste/needs.
I think make a ROM with just the OS and performance tweaks and leave the rest up to the users. They can find the cabs for everything so why bother to cook it in. The other thing with cooking in the apps if is if the app gets an update a new ROM is needed.
Or just cook your own ROM. There's enough info within the forums to make your own ROM and include whatever apps you want.
Maybe the focus should be on optimizing the OS and leave the apps to the choice of the user.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I cooked a lot of roms but always stick with the full rom, Reason is i could take out 50mb of programs out of a rom and This doesnt give me that equvalent space and also performance sometimes are un-stable, thats my own opinion.
I think there is a halfway line with how much goodies you can install in a rom to please most people
ecltech said:
I've been using different ROMs over the last month or so and what I normally go for is the lite ROM with all the performance updates. Then I add my own apps to it. From the ROMs that have applications cooked into it I may use 80-90% of it which I find is not good for me and I think this holds true for most, if not all users. Everyone has different taste/needs.
Maybe a ROM with just the OS and performance/optimization tweaks and leave the rest up to the users. They can find the cabs for everything so why bother to cook it in. The other thing with cooking in the apps if is if the app gets an update a new ROM is needed.
Or just cook your own ROM. There's enough info within the forums to make your own ROM and include whatever apps you want.
Maybe the focus should be on optimizing the OS and leave the apps to the choice of the user.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
all good points...i tend to agree with you. but lets not forget we're dealing with people who dont know how to hard slp...refuse to read through 30 pages of posts or even use teh search feature. so a full features rom will always be needed.
rzanology said:
all good points...i tend to agree with you. but lets not forget we're dealing with people who dont know how to hard slp...refuse to read through 30 pages of posts or even use teh search feature. so a full features rom will always be needed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is true. For a full featured ROM I think a based ROM might be better versus cooking in many apps. Here's a list that I think can be a good starting point for a base ROM. Some utilities, tweaks, visuals, etc. The rest can be managed by the user.
- Advanced Config
- GPS Test
- HTC Album
- HTC Camera (new version)
- NotePad
- Registry Editor
- Pocket RAR
- Office w/OneNote
- PDF Viewer
- psShutXP
- QuickGPS
- Total Commander
- NetCF 3.5
- ClearTemp
- KaiserTweak
ecltech said:
This is true. For a full featured ROM I think a based ROM might be better versus cooking in many apps. Here's a list that I think can be a good starting point for a base ROM. Some utilities, tweaks, visuals, etc. The rest can be managed by the user.
- Advanced Config
- GPS Test
- HTC Album
- HTC Camera (new version)
- NotePad
- Registry Editor
- Pocket RAR
- Office w/OneNote
- PDF Viewer
- psShutXP
- QuickGPS
- Total Commander
- NetCF 3.5
- ClearTemp
- KaiserTweak
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
agreed. can we all agree this should be a common app set?
rzanology said:
agreed. can we all agree this should be a common app set?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thats almost what I got apart from pdf viewer which i left out for user preference with adobe reader
the most popular apps don't have to be cooked into a ROM. every ROM can be a light or medium with everything else added as shared backup files using Sprite or SPB Backup. in another thread, some folks expressed reservations about my idea of Backup Install Packs, but i still think it could work. and no one would be forced to use them. it's something at least worth trying.
after flashing a new ROM, the ROM cooker or someone else could install demo versions of the most popular apps (HTC apps, Resco, SPB, SBSH, Opera, Palm Messaging, Kaiser Tweak, TCPMP and the plugins, etc.) onto their devices. They can then make a backup of their devices and make that backup available to other users. Then if someone installs the identical ROM, they could simply install the entire backup of those applications to their own devices. Users can keep the apps they want and register them with their own serials. They could then uninstall the rest.
that would be my idea. keep all ROMs medium and lite and let users customize them to full status with backup install packs.
PointUI drove me nuts, was nice and pretty, but in the way. Then again, I don't like the Cube either. Perhaps if I set up the cube I'd use it more, mainly for the contacts though - I don't use WMP or HTC's, I use TCPMP.'
I love the apps Dutty has, especially WKTask with its launcher and battery bar, quickmenu is awesome (without the large setting).
PocketCM has asked that it NOT be cooked in so...
IMHO a ROM should be usable for as much user as possible.
For one person S2U2 is a must-have application, but others just don't like it.
So a stable, fast and clean ROM should be the best for everyone.
Everyone can add his favorite apps, or don't add apps if you don't like them!
Just my opinion. (Of course I always go for the LITE variant, cause I just don't use a lot of apps)
What I would like to see:
Pretty much the default set of apps and tools in the stock ROM. Some of general use like pocketrar could be integrated but not much more.
Larger page pool.
What I absoltely don't want to see:
Too many UI changes, trial versions, bloated battery status apps and such.
Basically I just want the latest radio, OS and default apps all in one.
Stuff that's not likely to get upgrades for quite some time like the flash player and flash lite could preferebly be integrated but other than that I don't like too much tweaking, I just want the latest versions of the default stuff and then I do my own modifications and tweaks from there.
thanks for setting this up!! But i agree should install from CABs
No, They're updated too often to even think about cooking into the rom!
We need 1 stable EMPTY ROM. And cabs what have been edited for working on the 1 stable empty rom.
First and foremost, my hats (the whole rack of 'em) off to all the chefs in their respective kitchens. I've personally been a silent, yet happy customer for quite some time, and have been checking the forum daily for the next flash.
However, I've found that different ROMs will, obviously, have their list of capabilities and limits. Some support SIP better than others, some can't run iGo, etc. Mostly I flash, then find out during my installations, etc., and by that time I'm too lazy to flash back and just live with what I have. I would probably not flash ROMs that didn't support iGo and SIP if I knew that up front.
Having that in mind, I thought we could (as a group of continous beta testers and their respective gurus) try to formulate what would be a "check-list" for ROM releases, thus allowing the newbies (that don't know what to expect) and the old bees (buzzing along from ROM to ROM) to pick the right ROM flavor.
An example would be:
ROM Details
=========
ROM Name / Version: xxxx (Dutty's ..., Schap's ..., etc.)
CE Version: xxxx
Radio Versions Supported: xxxx ( So we know what we should have before flashing )
Based on: HTC WWE Release xxx (So we know if we got the new "hardware acceleration, etc")
Compatability
=========
SIP: [Not/Is] Supported, configured by ...
Skype: [Not/Is] Supported
iGo v7: Works out of the box / Requires removal of HTC Home
iGo v8: Not Supported
etc.
Thoughts about what this should include?
- SiteLister
Well I'm gonna jump on this first since chances are others won't be very nice about this thread
Not that I think your idea is a bad one, but to be honest most cooks already provide this information when they release a ROM.
If application compatibility isn't listed then the first 20 posts will bring it out....
If what you are asking is to compile a whole list of all these ROMs in one place. OK, good idea...but no one is going to do it for you.
If you like the idea...do it youself, or at least make a good start. Putting a post out like this is more likely to draw animosity since you are asking others to provide information that has been put out there numerous times. Good idea or not, you should make the initial effort and if you build something nice, people will contribut and thank you. Otherwise, they will just flame...
In addition, the Wiki would be the best place to do this.
not to say that this is a bad idea but there is one major flaw with the idea, most chefs cook for themselves and then release. with that said most of the chefs do not sit and try every possible application that can be put on your Kaiser, if you want to know what roms work with what applications and you also want to be the first to flash it and have the latest then you just have to try it for yourself. if you don't mind waiting you can wait a few days for the members that do use the programs you use to see if they say it works. i personally like to take a rom cooked by a chef, dump it and recook it for myself with the cabs my UC would usually install into the rom where i want them to be. sorry if this seems like a **** response but as far as i can see there is no way for the chefs to tell you what does and doesn't work and that's why we have threads after the rom release for people to tell others what does and doesn't work.
tubaking182 said:
not to say that this is a bad idea but there is one major flaw with the idea, most chefs cook for themselves and then release. with that said most of the chefs do not sit and try every possible application that can be put on your Kaiser, if you want to know what roms work with what applications and you also want to be the first to flash it and have the latest then you just have to try it for yourself. if you don't mind waiting you can wait a few days for the members that do use the programs you use to see if they say it works. i personally like to take a rom cooked by a chef, dump it and recook it for myself with the cabs my UC would usually install into the rom where i want them to be. sorry if this seems like a **** response but as far as i can see there is no way for the chefs to tell you what does and doesn't work and that's why we have threads after the rom release for people to tell others what does and doesn't work.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Most of this is true... however I don't think he is asking the chef's to do anything different, it just looks like he wants an encyclopedic reference of all ROMs and their features. Again, good idea...but just do it if you want it. Others will contribute if they find it worthy, if they don't...then oh well, at least you learned for yourself.
sitelister said:
An example would be:
ROM Details
=========
ROM Name / Version: xxxx (Dutty's ..., Schap's ..., etc.)
CE Version: xxxx
Radio Versions Supported: xxxx ( So we know what we should have before flashing )
Based on: HTC WWE Release xxx (So we know if we got the new "hardware acceleration, etc")
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Im hip to this.. well mainly must of us do that already in one form or another just not in that pretty format
sitelister said:
Compatability
=========
SIP: [Not/Is] Supported, configured by ...
Skype: [Not/Is] Supported
iGo v7: Works out of the box / Requires removal of HTC Home
iGo v8: Not Supported
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Not a bad idea, however this would require us to manually test a billion pieces of software in order before giving it out.
Now how about a better idea, someone should start a kaiser wiki page on bug fixes, etc... In all of my beta roms when someone points out an issue i will ask them to provide a link for a fix if i dont know it already, i actually do this for a couple of reasons.
1. it helps promote interactivity between forum members and helps to get people communicating, etc. This also helps to hinder the n00b factor and provides links for other people.
2. it provides me reference point, before i release each beta i go through the previous threads and make sure that i have fixed everything that was broken prior.
sitelister said:
First and foremost, my hats (the whole rack of 'em) off to all the chefs in their respective kitchens. I've personally been a silent, yet happy customer for quite some time, and have been checking the forum daily for the next flash.
However, I've found that different ROMs will, obviously, have their list of capabilities and limits. Some support SIP better than others, some can't run iGo, etc. Mostly I flash, then find out during my installations, etc., and by that time I'm too lazy to flash back and just live with what I have. I would probably not flash ROMs that didn't support iGo and SIP if I knew that up front.
Having that in mind, I thought we could (as a group of continous beta testers and their respective gurus) try to formulate what would be a "check-list" for ROM releases, thus allowing the newbies (that don't know what to expect) and the old bees (buzzing along from ROM to ROM) to pick the right ROM flavor.
An example would be:
ROM Details
=========
ROM Name / Version: xxxx (Dutty's ..., Schap's ..., etc.)
CE Version: xxxx
Radio Versions Supported: xxxx ( So we know what we should have before flashing )
Based on: HTC WWE Release xxx (So we know if we got the new "hardware acceleration, etc")
Compatability
=========
SIP: [Not/Is] Supported, configured by ...
Skype: [Not/Is] Supported
iGo v7: Works out of the box / Requires removal of HTC Home
iGo v8: Not Supported
etc.
Thoughts about what this should include?
- SiteLister
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah configuration management then maybe ISO accreditation................
Flash, enjoy, read, explore, reflash again and again.
Remember this isn't someones job its their hobby that they share.
Remember to say thankyou every now and then.
Thanks
usually it's the base rom that isn't compatible with the software. Most chefs just take the base rom and strip it out to remove bloated software and add in their own personal software. There are some chefs that go out of their way and add in the necessary dlls and files to make certain software work, but it is really difficult for chefs to do such a thing. Maybe a specific thread for each software to work on a particular rom would be helpful.
Thanks for your replies, y'all.
To be clear (and I can see where I may have not been there), I was fishing for interest. The next thing up would be to set it up in one format or another (Wiki, whatever) - I'm just not usually for building something before there is a market for it. When I said "we could" I meant it would be something that people could contribute to (myself, amongst others), in a format better appealing than, or more appropriate than those 105-long pages mostly containing praises, bashes, and little information (there's quite the picking to do when you're actually trying to decypher what a ROM's capabilities are).
If there is an interest, I'd be happy to put in the initial effort, but I'm also fishing for content requirements - that is, I've put forward some kind of basic format, but what other information would cause people to make a judgement? what kind of apps are important, etc.
Quick replies:
bengalih - I'm hanging on the fact that people are, inherently, nice. Hopefully at a higher ratio in this forum .
tubaking - Agreed, most users will give the feedback back to the cook or the forum. I'm actually not asking anyone to do more work than they already are. My thoughts are that the feedback is sometimes lost in (or hard to gather from) the forum. Fixes are also all over the place (for example - the iGo version compatability thread). I believe it's because the tool is incorrect (discussions).
bengalih - Agreed.
shogunmark - Sounds good. Wiki then as the solution? - Possibly have one page per release, and a summary in a top-level page that contains a comparative table?
halon - I'm sure I don't say it enough --> THANKS!
thomassster - I believe that the concept is good, but you're back to trying to nitpick for each application you're interested in, in hopes that people organize it in that fashion. Additionally, you're still back into reading a bunch of acknowledgments, accreditations and bashes (which take up a good chunk of the forum content).
... Thoughts?
inconsistencies in "support"
This is a good idea (or a bugzilla-type thread/wiki) and as ShogunMark stated in his first post, the first 20 posts (pages!) bring out the main probs. the only issue there is that some posters inevitably state that something or everything is working for them (perfectly) out of the box, while others experience major dysfunction, creating a confusing morass of info.
How bout a survey page - everyone votes for what works or not?
Cheers-
Yes this sounds like a good idea for someone as a side project to document in the wiki. But really most of this information can be found in the first 20 to 30 posts. And most roms, are quickly superceded by another new version. So if you want to do it, I am sure someone will read it. But asking the chef's things like does IGO work or Skype, If they don't use them they should not be expected to test them...IGO who cares if it works or not, only the people that use it..not everyone..
SO if you want to create a wiki page with this info; go ahead and do it and maybe someone will read it...Maybe good idea, but it will quickly be outdated.
*** PLEASE READ CAREFULLY BEFORE INSTALLING OR FLASHING ANY SOFTWARE POSTED IN THIS THREAD ***
The software posted here is for TESTING purposes only, The Polaris Android Linux development team or any of the posters of software or links to software on this thread, take absolutely no responsibility or liability for damage caused by the result of installing or flashing software or links to software found on this thread - correctly or otherwise, you do so on the sole understanding that you do so at your own risk. A final version will be posted on completion of a version 1 kernel at which point testing and support for the kernel will be moved to a suitable thread. Please do NOT post support questions on this thread - this is a development thread ONLY.
Development work is sometimes done in the irc channel: #htc-linux. To follow the latest developements please read the daily logs which can be found at: http://irclog.iclem.net/?chan=htc-linux&day=13
Lastly, Please do not use bad language in your posts, I have my little girl with me most times and do not need her to read such things. Appreciate your understanding.
Update: We now have a few threads devoted to userspace (system images), This is a KERNEL DEVELOPMENT thread which is starting to get too big for devs to follow. The purpose of a good development thread is to serve as an archive and a blueprint for future developers and that is hard to do when you have hundreds of non-related posts. I have therefore asked the moderator to move all non-kernel posts to their appropriate threads.
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01-09-08 - new link to files for working wifi
http://www.4shared.com/dir/19593527/3cb53c3a/sharing.html
24-07-09 - If anyone is interested in making themed system images, he's posted this link to help you learn how to do it:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=471586
19-07-09 - New kernel with changes from Vogue branch released. I am currently testing radios and resolutions. List of resolutions from kaiser thread
15-07-09 - A revival in our development as meant we are now catching up with the other devices with development on the project. Thank you to all who donated to the purchase of development Polaris that will be used by vilord, from vogue forum to help us with the project.
Current developers:
Life02 - Fixed GPS, Working on Battery issues.
Vilord - On holiday, now in possession of a Polaris. Also working on Bluetooth.
Newbie16 - Fixed Wifi - need to add irq's.
05-07-09 - New 1.5 ION build of Android for the Vogue has been reported to work well for the Polaris and can be found on the Google Vogue repository. The new 1.5 builds are noticeably also faster and smoother than previous builds. Some troubleshooting info can be found at the Androidhtc website for these builds (thanks freddycs). APN details can be found on Wikipedia - (thanks Mormy)
Things that do NOT work at present:
Bluetooth - No - Working partially for Vogue
Wifi - WORKING! *NEW* - thanks to a lot of effort by my friend Newbie16 - thanks mate
Camera - No - Working for Vogue
GPS - now working thanks to life02! - Well done my friend
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A new thread for budding designers has been set up by Venigo, (thanks matey!) who will lead the design side of the Polaris Android project (kind of makes you a little emotional thinking we're at that stage where we can start thinking about wallpapers and themes doesnt it?) Thread can be found here: Polaris Linux Android - Wallpapers, Themes and Icons
UPDATES: - Please check the WIKI for up-to-date progress updates here: Android on Polaris WIKI (Thanks excogitation)
NEW TESTING AND BUG THREAD ANNOUCEMENT:
marcelkordek has kindly started a thread for testing and bug reporting as we now have an almost usable Android image which can be found here: Polaris Android Project - Testing and Bug Reporting The thread will also be used to provide updates on the progress of the Android kernel as well as providing feedback to the devs on the latest posted images. Please ensure that the Testing and Bug Reporting thread is used for reporting user experiences and enable to keep the development thread cleaner and make life easier for the devs, whom you will all agree are doing an excellent job to support our beloved device.
18/1/09 - Working Radio with calls at last! Audio and SMS still not working but GPRS does but with a bit of fiddling.
16/1/09 - SMD code is nearly fixed by DZO, Rogro82 will be making a new image soon. Most of the development at this time is being reported in the Kaiser forum: UPDATED!!! - Google Android and Linux for KAISER!! as DZO was sent a Kaiser and he is working on the issues on it.
5/1/09 - DZO is working to bring the Kaiser and Polaris branches together so that the kernel will work on all our devices. Waiting to see what changes are made.
1/1/09 - Rogro82 uploaded a "booting" 1.0 SDK along with source files and instructions (below). Although this is very much a work-in-progress, it is the first bootable version of the 1.0 SDK for the Polaris.
11/12 - DZO and rolk worked out some changes that may help us resolve the SD Card stability issue. Dwaradzyne posted up a Zimage with the changes for testing.
CPLD Handbook
GPIO Manuals
LATEST FILES USED FOR DEVELOPMENT:
1/1/09 - Latest files are packed in this archive - to boot simply unpack to the root of your sd card and run haret (included).
A big THANK YOU to Rogro82 for getting the 1.0 SDK booting on the Polaris
Enjoy!
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
FIRST POST
I'll start with another simple question I cant find an answer to:
WHY CANT WE JUST PORT THE G1 ROM TO THE POLARIS?
#2 reserved for update
I will try to search too
I will try to put as simple as possible. Building a ROM requires combinig two parts:
1. Kernel/drivers part.
2. Applications and stuff.
In case of Windows Mobile part 1. in practice always comes from official HTC Polaris ROM. Part 2 comes from other official HTC ROM (could be other phone) and it can be modified by cooker.
We do not have a full working Polaris Android ROM, and we cannot just cook without part 1. Part 2 is available as Android sources are open.
The reason why we did not have 3d driver working on Polaris immediately after first Diamond ROM was available is that part 1. is not transferrable from one model to another.
Part 1. in Android is Linux kernel. We must get involved in Linux kernel developement for Polaris to bring Android to our phones.
why do we always want our phones to look like other phones. why cant we just be unique. we are windows mobile. TOP DOGG. i like windows mobile theme especially when its black. i like g1 but the design looks ancient. its not 2008 more like 1998
dortyboy said:
why do we always want our phones to look like other phones. why cant we just be unique. we are windows mobile. TOP DOGG. i like windows mobile theme especially when its black. i like g1 but the design looks ancient. its not 2008 more like 1998
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
absolutely agree. Copying iPhone was fun the first 2,3 months. Why not trying to develop really good apps with nice UIs and make own ideas into real interfaces for throttle launcher, M2D etc etc - posibilities are nearly endless.
i absolutely agree. i havent seen not one cool program thats actually usefull in our daily life for windows mobile not since i had a treo way back.
programs like directory; that could look at your number and tell u the owners name and adress
stuff like that. maybe tell u when zip code the call is coming from. useful programs. not the crappy programs that just try to make your phone look pretty.
thats why people go to iphone, the programs are useful in peoples daily life but not windows mobile
Here we go
ROM download :
Code:
http://rapidshare.com/files/155612986/Android_dump.rar
I think its a probleme with the boot loader and some part of the android code which isn't public
Have look here :
Code:
http://www.limofoundation.org/en/limo-press-releases/limo-foundation-statement-on-the-google-android-g1-handset.html
dortyboy said:
why do we always want our phones to look like other phones. why cant we just be unique. we are windows mobile. TOP DOGG. i like windows mobile theme especially when its black. i like g1 but the design looks ancient. its not 2008 more like 1998
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Are you new to the mobile device world?
We are not trying to get it to "look like the G1". We are talking about using a completely different operating system.. lol.. and you are talking about a black windows mobile theme and how the hardware of the G1 looks ancient.. lol..
Oh.. and "being unique" in this case would be having Android on a non G1 phone.. that would be unique. Windows mobile is not unique.
m.schmidler said:
absolutely agree. Copying iPhone was fun the first 2,3 months. Why not trying to develop really good apps with nice UIs and make own ideas into real interfaces for throttle launcher, M2D etc etc - posibilities are nearly endless.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Developing apps and trying to use resource hog throttle launcher is nothing close to having a brand new stable device operating system.
m.schmidler said:
absolutely agree. Copying iPhone was fun the first 2,3 months. Why not trying to develop really good apps with nice UIs and make own ideas into real interfaces for throttle launcher, M2D etc etc - posibilities are nearly endless.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe we can develop better apps under Android?
Look at the apps currently available for iphone - hopefully Android will get better market penetration than Windows Mobile, and, because it's open source it opens up a whole range of possibilities for developers.
I say if it can be done, it should be done!
dwaradzyn said:
I will try to put as simple as possible. Building a ROM requires combinig two parts:
1. Kernel/drivers part.
2. Applications and stuff.
In case of Windows Mobile part 1. in practice always comes from official HTC Polaris ROM. Part 2 comes from other official HTC ROM (could be other phone) and it can be modified by cooker.
We do not have a full working Polaris Android ROM, and we cannot just cook without part 1. Part 2 is available as Android sources are open.
The reason why we did not have 3d driver working on Polaris immediately after first Diamond ROM was available is that part 1. is not transferrable from one model to another.
Part 1. in Android is Linux kernel. We must get involved in Linux kernel developement for Polaris to bring Android to our phones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for the idiots guide dwardzyne!
So that very clearly explains the kernel level requirement.
OK. Second question:
With regard to part 1 - Kernel/Drivers - Can we convert the vogue version since it seems to have the most work done to it? What would need to be done to it to make it work?
imfloflo said:
I think its a probleme with the boot loader and some part of the android code which isn't public
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
a boot loader :
Code:
http://www.denx.de/wiki/U-Boot/WebHome
bally3 said:
Thanks for the idiots guide dwardzyne!
So that very clearly explains the kernel level requirement.
OK. Second question:
With regard to part 1 - Kernel/Drivers - Can we convert the vogue version since it seems to have the most work done to it? What would need to be done to it to make it work?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Indeed kernel developement for Kaiser and Polaris is based on Vogue work. It slowed down because of SD stability issue.
dwaradzyn said:
Indeed kernel development for Kaiser and Polaris is based on Vogue work. It slowed down because of SD stability issue.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I believe the sd card issue has been resolved on vogue and they've moved onto other things (camera etc). but it seems like its the end of the road for the Polaris - apart from rumors that someones supposed to be sending a kaiser or a polaris to dzo for him to work from. This kind of points to that dzo is the only person on xdevs capable of working at kernel level with a kaiser or polaris?? That cant possibly be true - can it?
bally3 said:
I believe the sd card issue has been resolved on vogue and they've moved onto other things (camera etc). but it seems like its the end of the road for the Polaris - apart from rumors that someones supposed to be sending a kaiser or a polaris to dzo for him to work from. This kind of points to that dzo is the only person on xdevs capable of working at kernel level with a kaiser or polaris?? That cant possibly be true - can it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
He already has the knowledge... He wants to share his knowledge, if someone send him a Kaiser or Polaris, and will make it work... I thought there were plenty of users willing to send there old or half bricked kaiser or polaris... but still nobody send him one... as far as I know...
Nobody keeps nobody up to date in the kaiser thread... So I really don't know what is going on... But they still don't have a decent fix for the DMA (SD-Card read/write) problem (as far as I know).
Porting the G1 rom isn't a possibility, you first have to have drivers for our device, since we haven't got a driver to read/write to the internal memory (not the RAM), it still cannot boot .
I hope this project will really come of the ground finally... It's half way there... but still not finished (if you ask me, due to miscommunication and not working together of users, because they all want to be the first who got it working to show off with it... (so they are all working on the same piece of code, which is a waste of time if you ask me)).
Maybe one of us can contact DZO, check what he needs to continue our development. Because without the SD-Card driver we can't continue...
dubbeld00 said:
Maybe one of us can contact DZO, check what he needs to continue our development. Because without the SD-Card driver we can't continue...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'll contact him, I dont think there are many users who would just send a device worth a couple of hundred euros to a complete stranger though many would tell you they would at the time. With the P3D driver their was only one person who was willing to loan a unit for development - and that was only because they were in the same country. I was asking for ages before that.
is their any other way we could help him? surely the internal workings of a polaris rom coupled with the specs could be used if dzo would do what NuShrike did on the p3d driver which was tell us to try things he worked on? I'm sure there would be willing volunteers including myself who he could talk through it on the forums or on the #android room.
I can't offer to donate my polaris as its the only mobile I have.. but I would be more than willing to try things out on my xda or provide any other help possible to get this project moving.
Hopefully one day a fully working Android will be a reality on polaris
Let me start by praising this forum. You're all members of an incredible community. I just purchased my first mobile device (besides Sega's Game Gear and the original Nintendo Game boy, if you'd be liberal enough to put these in the same category), the hTC Raphael (AT&T's Fuze more precisely), and you guy’s have got me really excited about this technology.
Excuse me for continuing off topic, some background information may help you to answer my questions.
I’m really into technology, I’m always learning more about web standards, xml, hardware engineering, open source development, and computer science in general. I have a small computer lab in my house comprised of desktop systems dating from 1994 -2005. Due to financial limitations I don’t usually buy new equipment. As a hobby I sell and repair computers, and I’m really into web development (SVG has been my main interest for a while). I’m a very novice programmer, taking my first baby steps into Java though I’ve briefly used C++ and I’m fairly fluent in Javascript.
Let’s get back to the Fuze already! Heh.
So I’d obviously like to customize the Fuze to my liking, and I’ve been doing my homework. I bought the device because of its support for SVG, VPN (for my home network),WIFI (the university I’m attending has a large WIFI network), and Opera Browser. I just tried out tyguy’s forum post, http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=3042587#post3042587 , yesterday. After some customization (rhedgehog's Raphael Tweaks, adding support for zooming with the scroll wheel in opera, screen rotation via accelerometer, My_Flash3_1) I realize that I’m pretty disappointed with the device. It seems to be running slower than ever (I used the default rom w/ the bloat ware for a week), my email had broken (probably because of Sprite Backup restoring ‘personal information’ w/out ‘system files’, luckily nightbird’s post, http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=412438 , linked me to the software that fixes this ‘can’t view my inbox’ issue), the TF3D Music Library changed for the worse, but I’m not here to complain. Tyguy’s post was adequately informative, and a great start for beginners like myself.
At this point you’re probably saying “What is your question, and what does this have to do with BlenderPocket?!”
So.. I understand that the graphic rendering support of the Fuze is less than what some would like (probably due to the Qualcomm Chipset). Pauloke’s Diamond VR Hologram v2.02 runs on my Fuze, but at a frame rate of 0.17FPS. I’ve read up on Hard-SPL by Raphael Elite Team, Raphael Elite Project’s RC2 ROM, Aruppenthal’s RRE ROM, and Monx’ ROMeOS2. I’m cautious to try flashing, but I have an insurance policy, so I’ve decided to try Raphael Elite Project’s RC2 ROM.
On to the questions!
Has anybody tried BlenderPocket on a Fuze? http://russose.free.fr/BlenderPocket/ This would be an ideal application for my device.
Do those of you ‘in the know’ think that the rendering support of the Raphael could handle this app? The system requirements for BlenderPocket are quite low.
Which ROM’s effectively enhance rendering support for OpenGL, MD3DM, SVG Graphics? / Is there a ROM you would recommend for my Raphael? (after reading my autobiography, lol ) I understand that these are complicated issues involving Qualcomm proprietary drivers, I'm just trying to catch the most up to date information on Raphael graphics development.
I understand that there are some issues with the Fuze keyboard. Blender, among other apps, require input configuration from hard keys.
Where might I find information about mapping keyboard keys to apps (specifically pertaining to the Raphael)?
Where might I find a table of the hard key codes (ie: PAD_00x01)? http://russose.free.fr/BlenderPocket/?q=node/22
Does the ‘HTC Fuze Keyboard Fix.cab’ fix the keyboard issues I’m speaking of (the issue some have noted about not being able to configure keyboard keys as input to emulators and the like), or just adjust for the AT&T keyboard layout?
While on the topic of emulators.
Has anybody successfully run FPSEce on their Raphael? Sonhy claims that it works great on his system, http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=2642151#post2642151 . Others complain of keyboard and rendering issues. It would be incredible to use this device for work and play, a PS1 emulator would be ideal for play time. :-D
Thanks in advance for any advice or answers to my questions. All advice is appreciated.
Also in advance I apologize for any duplicate questions, I’ve spent a week combing the forum and these are some questions that I’m left with.
I am more than willing to donate my time to testing and development as well as money (what little I have of the stuff) when I'm better educated on who's hands it belongs in.
EDIT: After installing the Dimond Ati Drivers I now have 16.67 Average FPS during execution of Pauloke’s Diamond VR Hologram.
Now if only I could figure out this button mapping. I'm trying out ButtonFinder.exe
[email protected] said:
Which ROM’s effectively enhance rendering support for OpenGL, MD3DM, SVG Graphics? / Is there a ROM you would recommend for my Raphael? (after reading my autobiography, lol ) I understand that these are complicated issues involving Qualcomm proprietary drivers, I'm just trying to catch the most up to date information on Raphael graphics development.
I understand that there are some issues with the Fuze keyboard. Blender, among other apps, require input configuration from hard keys.
Where might I find information about mapping keyboard keys to apps (specifically pertaining to the Raphael)?
Where might I find a table of the hard key codes (ie: PAD_00x01)? http://russose.free.fr/BlenderPocket/?q=node/22
Does the ‘HTC Fuze Keyboard Fix.cab’ fix the keyboard issues I’m speaking of (the issue some have noted about not being able to configure keyboard keys as input to emulators and the like), or just adjust for the AT&T keyboard layout?
While on the topic of emulators.
Has anybody successfully run FPSEce on their Raphael? Sonhy claims that it works great on his system, http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=2642151#post2642151 . Others complain of keyboard and rendering issues. It would be incredible to use this device for work and play, a PS1 emulator would be ideal for play time. :-D
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The htc fuze keyboard fix only fixes the keyboard layout if you use a touch pro rom which has different keyboard layout. Most roms here are touch pro roms, so you will need this for correct layout. I noticed on that emulator thread there was a link to this keyboard mapping for games,http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=2703133&postcount=3
I've tried a few of the roms here, Da_G's is very good if you don't want to use the touchflo3d UI. With touchflo, the ROMeOS roms are hard to beat, although NATF and Proven roms worked well for me also. Choose one and flash, you'll be much happier with your fuze once you do as they are all huge improvements over stock rom.
Thanks Showaco. I had also seen Dilta's KforRaphael.CAB (Thanks Dilta!) Just hopeful that a more permanent fix to the issue could be developed. May be my first venture into programming for the Raphael.
We started a new section on our site called " Meet the Developer " and thought it would be a good idea to post it out here as well.
In the 1st Episode we chat with Jörg Michel , most of you guys would have come across some of the fantastic apps he was released for Windows Mobile like G-Alarm, G-Profile, G-Invaders, etc
In the 2nd Episode we chat with Alfonso Presa , who is the developer of Throttle Apps ( ThrottleLauncher, ThrottleLock , etc )
We had to split the interview in to 2 parts coz of the word limit.
Meet the Developer - Ep 1 : Jörg Michel [part-1] [part-2]
Meet the Developer - Ep 2 : Alfonso Presa [part-1] [part-2]
Meet the Developer - Ep 1 : Jörg Michel - Part 1
We had to chance to chat with Jörg Michel the developer of apps like G-Alarm, G-Profile, G-Invaders and more. Jörg has created some great apps with beautiful UI that is finger friendly too. You can find all his apps at his website http://ageye.de. I want to thank you for taking the time to chat with us here at 1800PocketPC.com. Well lets get in to it…
Tell us a bit about yourself
First of all: Hello to everyone who takes the time to read about my thoughts… It may not be worth it so please don’t blame me
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My name is Jörg Michel, I’m currently living in Ulm/Germany but have grown up in the near of Oettingen/Bavaria where the good beer comes from (I really like it). I’m 24 years old and I’m currently studying medicine in my 10th of 12 terms.
Tell us a bit about your apps ?
My first apps were the games Caver and G-Invaders… Nothing much to say about them. These are very basic and poorly designed games with an online high score feature which is probably the best of it
G-Alarm is an alarm clock which has probably more features than any other alarm tool and is also one of the most reliable clocks. It still has some problems on old devices which quickly run out of memory but I’m currently developing a new graphic engine which hopefully improves the memory usage.
G-Watch should combine three different aims: a stopwatch, a countdown timer and a GPS tracking function. Of course you don’t need a GPS device or have to use the stopwatch if you just want to have a countdown timer in the kitchen.
G-Light can help you to decrease battery consumption by dimming the backlight according to the ambient light. Of course you need a supported device which owns a light sensor (HTC Diamond, Touch Pro, etc.)
G-Profile is my newest tool which can manage your device (e.g. set the volume and ring tones, turn on/off phone radio, wifi, or bluetooth, and so on) according to your needs. It can activate the profiles by time, when an appointment occurs, when you connect something to your device (e.g. headset, ac power), when your phone is in a specified cell and so on…
How did everything start?
Well, everything started by getting my new HTC Diamond some months ago (I think it was June 2008) and looking for some tweaks and new software for it on xda-developers.com because I was disappointed by the performance and look&feel of the ROM (1.34?). I stumbled upon the sensor API of Koushik Dutta who is by the way one of the most important guys for Windows Mobile programming - he brought the access to the sensors which opened the doors for so many tools.
I remembered playing the game “Cave Run” lots of years ago on my Palm and I thought about extending the great accelerometer example of Koush to a “Cave Run” clone without even knowing how to program in C# or .NET Compact Framework…
As you may know I succeeded and Caver got soon playable. Afterwards I had lots of ideas for new games and G-Invaders was born.
After some weeks I thought of doing some serious stuff and started to develop G-Alarm because I was so disappointed by the Windows alarm clock and also a heavy sleeper…
It started really bad, lots of bugs (I just think of the severe bug where G-Alarm didn’t stop at the time change because of daylight saving) but it soon grew and now I’m pretty proud of it .
Whats WM device do you own and use?
I own an old HTC Prophet which I don’t use anymore and my HTC Diamond.
What sites do you usually hangout on?
My first site for PocketPC related topics was xda-dev and I still think it is a very good source for every owner of a PocketPC. But I really like other sites as PPC-Geeks as well and also write on the German forum www.handy-faq.de. And of course there is 1800PocketPC.com
How can we contact you ? ( twitter, facebook, etc )
I don’t twitter, facebook, myspace or whatever. I still don’t think that everything which is in the internet and gets widely used is a good invention - but that’s my own opinion…
You can contact me on my page (www.ageye.de), my forum or blog.
Are you going to list your apps on the WM MarketPlace ?
To be honest, I haven’t heard much about the new WM MarketPlace yet… Is it already available? If so, where can I access it?
If the conditions are good I will list my apps on it - for free, of course…
What are your thoughts on WM MarketPlace ?
As I said, I’m not an expert for MarketPlace related things but I’m not sure what to think about it, yet…
First of all: I don’t like Apple and its products. I think they have a bigger monopoly in many sections than Microsoft ever had but will never get accused. I think it is a cheek to sell music player at a really high charge without shipping the software or even an AC adapter. If Microsoft would only allow to play .wma files on Windows they would have to pay - Apple may force you without consequences to not use .wma files on their iPods…
As you can see I’m not a big fan of Apple, but the iPhone has brought some good and fresh ideas to the mobile world and I also like the idea to access the latest software on a marketplace.
I’m just curious if some big Windows Mobile software development companies can buy better search positions when you try to find e.g. an alarm clock. Microsoft would be stupid to list e.g. G-Alarm on the first place which is free when it could earn a commission for helping to sell commercial software.
So I’m looking forward on how it’s going to work. Hopefully my tools have a chance…
Any plans to expand to other platform like Android , iPhone ?
As you can read and see in my blog I’m currently working on a graphical interface which is completely independent of Windows Mobile’s controls and I have it nearly finished.
I don’t know how the mobile world will look like in a few years but I’m prepared to port my software to other platforms.
Meet the Developer - Ep 1 : Jörg Michel - Part 2
We know this is an ongoing project but how long did it take from the drawing board to your initial release of G-alarm ? What was your motivation to develop it ?
The main benefit for me (which may be a curse for the users) is the fact that I share my new tools and features immediately with the users. Of course there have occurred a lots of bugs but because of the great community helping me to find them and proposing new ideas especially G-Alarm could grow like hell.
So it takes only a few days from the idea to the first public release.
My motivation:
1. The built-in alarm clock didn’t satisfy me
2. I had a lot of time
3. I got really angry when trying to find a good alarm clock. There are so many software companies which just publish crap for a lots of dollars. There are only a few which create high quality, good looking and finger friendly tools (the number increases, thanks to the competitors). Besides the fact that I needed the help of the community, teasing other commercial software developers was a big argument for me to keep the software free
What are the future plan for your apps ?
I’ll release G-Watch 0.6 in the next few days which already uses my new graphical “engine”. Afterward I’ll create a new tool called G-Center (I’m not really happy with the name) which covers all installed ageye-tools (incl. export/import settings function) and maybe also be a customizable start center other apps as well.
After that I’ll probably come back to G-Profile or to G-Alarm. G-Profile definitely needs some new options (the so called “advanced profiles”) and G-Alarm needs the new engine…
What are some of your favorite apps ?
I’m using S2U2 and HomeScreen++ which also demonstrate that freeware may be better than any commercial tool. The Opera browser receives my biggest respect. It brought a quantum jump to Windows Mobile.
New WM devices have some amazing hardware like accelerometer which you have used very well in G-Alarm, its said Touch Pro 2 has a proximity sensor are you cooking up some ideas to exploit these ?
I think it’s a very good idea to have a proximity sensor. HTC’s approach with the light sensor to recognize when you have your phone put at your ear to turn off the backlight is somehow ridiculous…
I don’t have any ideas yet what to do with the proximity sensor - first of all I would need such a phone and users with ideas
When you consider the number of lines of code, which of your app is rated the highest and which one is the lowest?
Of course, I’m proud of G-Alarm. My download counter reached 450.000 downloads within about 6 months which is soooo awesome (of course you have to substract partial downloads, etc.).
The development of G-Alarm has driven me crazy a lot of times - Windows Mobile is such a ungrateful operating system (thanks to all the different vendors with their different opinions on how to customize Windows Mobile).
But now I’ll hope that especially G-Watch and G-Profile catch up… G-Light is somehow my stepchild. The idea has a great potential but I somehow lost the interest in it…
Did you create all the graphics yourself or did someone help you with the look-and-feel of your application?
I’m a poor designer… a very poor designer… Daniel Bergmann (aka expo7) does all the graphics for me! He is a really great designer who creates so professional graphics that I could take a bow in front of him every single day…
A tip for everyone who is interested in programming for Windows Mobile:
I develop my tools with C# using .NET Compact Framework and some native C++ - I haven’t bought a book to learn it. All you need is an idea for a project, a good sample on how your desired language works (for me it was the sensor API of Koush) and time to try a lot of code until it works as it should. It is really easy! If you have an idea, try it!
It was great chatting with you Jörg, good luck with your studies and the WM development. Looking fwd for the new G-Watch and G-Center. May be some of our readers can suggest an alternate name for G-Center.. G-Pack ???? G-Alarm is definitely one of the best WM software out there and I am sure I am not the only one who thinks so.
blocked for future use
nice website!
Meet the Developer - Ep 2 : Alfonso Presa - Part 1
Today we chat to Alfonso Presa who has given us some great apps like ThrottleLauncher, ThrottleLock, etc. People who are in to customizing the look and feel of Windows Mobile would have definitely come across ThrottleLauncher. You can find all his apps on his website : throttlelauncher.com. Thanks for chatting with us mate.
Tell us a bit about yourself ?
I’m Alfonso Presa (aka. APBilbo) from Madrid, Spain. I’m 27 years old and I work on IT. Currently I’m on a project in a multinational bank working on web development over Fatwire.
Tell us a bit about Throttle Apps?
To be honest I never intended to start a “big” project like ThrottleApps… It most of happened on the run . It all started one day when I was trying to customize my Herald (around December 2007)… I was searching for the perfect freeware UI and I realized that there where lot’s of great apps out there but none of them was complete. rltoday was customizable but very hardly and themes where fixed to the point that you have to change the files to suit it to your needs, MortButtons was a perfect launcher but it was fixed to some buttons in a grid layout, the cube was very cool but very limited in space (only 9 contacts, only 9 apps, etc), HTC Home was good but functionality was fixed. I thought, hey I just want a simple kinetic scrolling row of icons… what a good chance to learn C#! Then I released a proof of concept app on XDA and people started asking for clocks, registry info, etc… An that’s how ThrottleLauncher was born .
About ThrottleLock, I seen someone’s post at XDA asking if it was possible to make something like the Android lock for Windows Mobile… I though… “Hey! that can be funny!!”… and there it is!
What mobile devices do you own and use?
All ThrottleApps where developed for my “little” Herald but I got an Omnia i900 recently. I always test my apps on both of them.
How can we contact you ? ( twitter, facebook, etc )
I’m not a fan of IM applications or social networks… I prefer forums and email
(I feel I’m starting to get old… I’m sticked in the old technology). I’ve a facebook account though , but I just check it from time to time. You can always find me at my web’s forum…
Are you going to list your Apps on the WM MarketPlace ?
I will have to see which conditions does Microsoft offer in order to get your app listed. I don’t like how microsoft handle homebrew developments… if you want your software to be distributed without the user to get a warning about unknown software provided you have to send your app and pass through “Microsoft’s controls”… If that’s a precondition to get my apps published there I will definitely not do it…
What are your thoughts on WM MarketPlace ?
From the user’s point of view I think it’s a great idea to have a software catalog where you can access and download with just one click (just like linux systems has the apt catalog). Though I think this can kill the new developers creativity and will give Microsoft the complete control over WM software… If they don’t like it or if it’s against their policy they can remove it and no one will ever known of it’s existence… May be I’m a little bit paranoid here :-D.
Any plans to expand to other platform like Android , iPhone ?
Some time ago I started porting ThrottleLauncher to Android platform but I didn’t have too much time for it and that project is currently abandoned… Any way I like developing mobile apps and I don’t discard developing for those platforms someday if ever I get a device to test on . May be when 1.0 arrives… who knows .
How many hrs a week do you spend on WM development ?
Depends on the week… but it may be arround 20/30 hours… I also have to provide support and documentation for the apps ;-).
How many hours have you put into ThrottleLauncher ?
Many many more than my girlfriend would have liked . It has been about a year and a half of work so I guess it may be arround 1200 hours.
Meet the Developer - Ep 2 : Alfonso Presa - Part 2
You have made customization and skinning of your apps a high priority, how has the user response been ?
To be honest I expected more interest on my app from theme designers as ThrottleLauncher currently is capable of almost anything… though the lack of themes may also be my fault as there’s not too much documentation for ThrottleLauncher’s theme development. I’m working hard this days to write some tutorials that are available from my web. My target is to make ThrottleLauncher the first choice for theme designers when they have an idea… Then users will hopefully understand how powerfull ThrottleLauncher is ;-). At this point I have to say that there are many great designers (like Rumball, Paul de Groot, Zoltair Wright, m.schmidler, blazingwolf and much more) that have helped me to turn ThrottleLauncher in what it is and are working to make it the best UI ever .
ThrottleStorage is a unique application , how was the user response to that ?
I think ThrottleStorage is a great tool that provides a functionality that Windows Mobile definitely lacks, specially with the small internal memory that devices currently have. As an app it’s not so appealing as ThrottleLauncher or ThrottleLock and users will use it when they need it. I think it’s a great tool for ROM cookers to include on their ROM’s.
What are some of your favorite apps ?
If I’ve to choose one, it will be TaskMgr without any doubt. None of my apps would have been possible without this little handy tool. Definitely a must have for every developer. Other apps I really like are MostScripts, S2U2 (but I use ThrottleLock… sorry a_C
), S2P and TouchCal.
What are your favorite development tools and Language?
For WM I use C# and C++ over VS2005 and I really like how flexible and simple things can become by using that app and that languages, though…. I think the most powerful and flexible language is Java (I use to develop using Eclipse platform). Also CVS/SVN is a must have in order to develop applications.
New WM devices come with better hardware like accelerometer , proximity sensor, etc are you cooking up some ideas to exploit these ?
ThrottleLauncher currently has support for accelerometer . I plan to release some updates of the themes that will allow users to choose this as an option so they can scroll rows just by changing the orientation of their devices. Note that this support is still experimental…
Have you worked on any commercial apps ?
No I’ve not .
The new version of ThrottleLauncher has a skin to mimic the iPhone, Android, Palm Pre and WM7 did you develop these yourself ?
I’m not a good designer so most of the graphics used on the themes are provided by other people. WM7 theme was almost 100% developed by Paul de Groot and I only made some tweaks over it. For the Palm Pre I’ve only made the layout as the icons where provided by Cpeacha. Android was enterily designed by me… but it doesn’t have too much built in graphics . iPhone icons where taken for several places arround XDA, the base of that theme was initially dones by Gullum and continued by Blazingwolf.
Throttle Launcher has grown to a fantastic UI for Windows Mobile users and is close to version 1.0 , what can we expect in the future?
I’m starting to work on a PC .NET application that will allow users to visually create themes for ThrottleLauncher. This way designers will find a lot more easy to implement their creation in ThrottleLauncher. Also I have to make some experiments on 3d effects by using the gsensor. Probably ThrottleLock will be the first to use this feature.
Fantastic, the PC application is sure to be a hit and with the documentation on skinning on the way I am sure more people will be creating new and exciting skins for your apps. ThrottleLauncher has definitely come a long way from when it was first released, congrats on that and good luck with the apps in the future. Once again thanks for chatting to us @ 1800PocketPC.com