October 19th - Sprint first to offer HTC Touch Pro - Touch Pro, Fuze General

Full article available @ CTIA Fall 2008. For those of you who don't want to follow the link, the post is copy/pasted verbatim below.
Unlike last week's slip up, Sprint managed to keep this bit of news under wraps and announced on the opening day of CTIA Fall 2008 that it will offer the HTC Touch Pro starting October 19. The ultimate replacement for the Sprint HTC Mogul, the Windows Mobile 6.1 smartphone will go for $299.99 with a two-year contract and after rebates.
The Touch Pro is similar to the HTC Touch Diamond for Sprint but has three major differences: 1) the smartphone features a slide-out full QWERTY keyboard; 2) it has expandable memory; and 3) the 3.2-megapixel camera has a flash. Of course, with the built-in keyboard, the Touch Pro is also slightly thicker and heavier than the Diamond, measuring 4 inches tall by 2 inches wide by 0.7 inch deep and weighing 5.3 ounces. On front, there's a 2.8-inch touchscreen with a 262,000 color output and 640x480 pixel resolution that allows you to interact with the 3D TouchFlo interface.
For the business user, the Touch Pro offers a full range of wireless options: EV-DO Rev. A, Wi-Fi, Bluetooth with A2DP support, and GPS. To complement the latter, the smartphone works with the Sprint Navigation for real-time, turn-by-turn driving directions. The usual Windows Mobile suspects are there, including the Microsoft Office Mobile Suite, Direct Push Technology, and Internet Explorer Mobile. The Opera browser is also installed on the device.
Entertainment and multimedia goodies include the aforementioned 3.2-megapixel camera, support for Sprint TV and the Sprint Music Store, and an HTC-developed YouTube application. There's 512MB of ROM and 288MB of RAM and a 1GB microSD card will be included in the box.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A picture accompanied the article showing Sprint's interpretation of the Touch Pro (see image below). First off, I see noticeably rounder corners and a softer gray coloring as opposed to the glossy black finish I've seen in non-carrier-branded photos. It looks like the numbers remain at the top row of the keyboard, which is a good sign for some. However, sadly the front-facing camera has been removed and the Sprint logo now sits in it's place. When compared with the T-Mobile MDA photo from http://htc-raphael.com/, they look remarkably similar except for some keyboard differences both in color and function keys (it was hard to tell using the Sprint picture below, even with Photoshop to enlarge/enhance it) and the front-facing camera which seems to be staying on the T-Mobile model. Only time will tell, until then here is some good news to tide you over.
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According to pictures posted at phonemag, Sprint may also be offering the Touch Diamond model with a red backplate. No word if they have plans to release the Touch Pro model with the same color scheme.

I read that Article this morning... Here's some better photo's of the pro.

ugliest piece of branding atleast make the keys yellow too!

Thank you for the improved pictures, I was looking for those this morning but I guess I caught it to soon after it was published to find any decent ones.
I really expected the symbol key markings to be in the "Sprint Yellow" color.... but the Red is an interesting contrast.
Does anyone else think the touchscreen area is a different color gray than the touch key area? The d-pad area reminds me of a nail polish color called "Blue Fox Chrome", it looks like a bluish tinted chrome shimmer which seems really out of place with the polished and matte jet black finish the rest of the chassis has. Perhaps they could have picked their colors a bit better. I doubt it's just the camera angle because it is noticeable in every picture from different angles.
I hate to say something really girlie but..... I wouldn't buy that model for the sole reason of the color mismatch between the chrome blue fox and the black matte. I'd rather one that's the same color throughout, it just seems sexier and more technologically appealing. Also, it really disappointed me they went with the smooth backplate as opposed to the "faceted diamond" style backplate.

Engadget Mobile has a hands-on:
http://www.engadgetmobile.com/2008/09/10/hands-on-with-sprints-touch-pro/
I must say, one thing I like that I like is the metallic frame that surrounds not only the screen but also the keyboard. Not so much that it's polished and attracts more fingerprints, but the metallic frame surrounding the screen on my Europe/Asia GSM TouchPro feels very solid and it would've been nice to have the same build surrounding the keyboard.
Too bad my needs for such an expensive device are first and foremost GSM+HSDPA.

fhsieh, I had read somewhere that the Euro/Asia GSM models had a stainless steel frame inside them for durability and the "firmer" feeling but the US providers were going to replace that with a cheaper plastic polymer frame to help reduce costs in hope their customers wouldn't notice.
Somewhere I have to find the link that tells what US provider uses what material for the interior framing of the Touch Pro.

Well despite being plastic, my Touch Pro does feel very sturdy so it may very well have the stainless steel frame internally.
But I still think an external frame to match the one surrounding the screen would be a nice touch

I ended up gathering the info from a bunch of sources, but the breakdown is roughly as follows, I listed the frame type and weight for those I could find information on for comparison:
HTC Touch Diamond (unbranded)---> (110g)
AT&T Touch Diamond -------------> (110g)
Sprint HTC Victor (P3702)-------> Aluminum Frame (115g)
Verizon HTC Diamond ------------> Stainless Steel Frame (110g)
O2 XDA Ignito ------------------> (110g)
T-Mobile MDA Compact IV --------> (98g)
HTC Touch Pro (unbranded) ------> Stainless Steel Frame (165g)
AT&T FUZE ----------------------> (165g)
Sprint HTC Herman --------------> Aluminum Frame (150g)
Verizon HTC Raphael ------------> Aluminum Frame
O2 XDA Serra -------------------> (165g)
T-Mobile MDA Vario IV ----------> (165g)
Judging by past experiences with stainless steel and aluminum, I've always found aluminum to be the lighter of the two. My hypothesis is that the Diamond models of weight 110g are all stainless steel framed while the 98g weight MDA Compact IV has an aluminum frame like that of its Sprint cousin "Victor". If I apply the same logic to the Touch Pro, then I am to assume the unbranded, AT&T, O2, and T-Mobile models have the stainless steel frame while the Sprint and Verizon cousins have the aluminum frame. I could find no information about the AT&T model or any of those released in Europe/Asia other than O2 which is readily available. I will try to update as more information becomes available.
Sources:
phoneArena, IntoMobile, pocketnow, PDAdb

OK a couple things here piss me off.
A. They took the camera in the front off Why the hell would you do that...( pointless to replace it with sprints crappy logo beecause they couldnt find anywhere else to get free advertisement the right in front of your fn face everyday)
B. they cheapen everything now dont they with the aluminum frame from a steel one... i don't mind an extra 15 grams as long as it can be 40 percent stronger.
C. They ass-pry there crapware into every phone they sell making it even more pointless to use as by day 2 of use its already running like a 1920's T1...
D. I can go on forever but this is the last one for now. I understand about smudges but who gives a crap... the back plate looks like someone should burn it alive... wtf were they thinking about on a phone that originally had its beautiful diamond prism on the back but instead spint smooths out the world with the fact that they feel necessary to make there phones disgusting and weaker then they are from release...

To everybody complaining about the lack of front camera, I can almost guarantee they did that to save on manufacturing costs, not just so they could find a place for their logo. Afterall, they are offering it for $299 with contract. The unlocked version is like, what, $700-$800? Sure, the phones are a loss-leader to lock you into a two year contract, but they still want to make them as cheap as possible to reduce the initial loss, or they'd just be screwing themselves. If they can save $20 on each phone by excluding a camera, they will jump at it.
This is a powerful phone. $300 for what is basically a miniature laptop is a hell of a deal.
As for the bundled crapware -- yea, I could do without, but at least it fits the theme of the phone now. The puke-yellow default theme for the Mogul was just horrendous. The yellow highlights in TF3D actually look pretty cool. I never liked the "flip" clock on the original Diamond, so I'm glad sprint got rid of that.
So, the moral of the story is: if you want a virgin HTC device, buy unlocked. If you want a cheaper version and don't mind a missing front camera (I don't) and metal/glossy case, buy the vendor version. Personally, I thought the glossy prism looked pretty bad. But that's just me. everybody has differnet tastes. I think the Diamond's back on Sprint is perfect -- elegant and professional.
As for nuking the bundleware, well, that's what XDA is for. ;-)

Looking forward to get that Sprinttheme ripped from the Sprint Pro to our HTC originals

Related

TyTN II Review From India

Blue Print:
Processor:
Qualcomm® MSM 7200, 400MHz
Operating System:
Windows Mobile® 6 Professional
ROM: 256MB
RAM: 128MB SDRAM
Dimension:
112 mm (L) X 59 mm (W) X 19 mm (T)
Display:
2.8 inch, 240 X 320 QVGA TFT-LCD display with adjustable angle and backlight
Network:
HSDPA/UMTS: Tri-band 850, 1900, 2100 MHz
HSDPA: Up to 384kbps for upload and 3.6Mbps for download
UMTS: Up to 384kbps for upload and download
GSM/GPRS/EDGE: Quad-band 850, 900, 1800, 1900 MHz
Device Control:
Finger scrolling and panning
Connectivity
Bluetooth® 2.0
Wi-Fi®: IEEE 802.11 b/g
HTC ExtUSB™ (11-pin mini-USB and audio jack in one)
GPS antenna connector
Camera Main camera: 3 megapixel CMOS color camera with auto focus
Second camera: VGA CMOS color camera
Audio Built-in microphone and speaker
Battery 1,350 mAh rechargeable Li-polymer battery
Standby time:
Up to 350 hours for UMTS
Up to 365 hours for GSM Talk time:
Talk time:
Up to 264 minutes for UMTS
Up to 420 minutes for GSM
Up to 120 minutes for video call
Expansion Slot microSD™ memory card (SD 2.0 compatible)
AC Adapter Voltage range/frequency: 100 ~ 240V AC, 50/60Hz
I got my HTC TyTN II two weeks back. It was a gift from my close friend. You gotta be lucky to have a friend like this. It was in fact a surprise me. He got the Demon looking black box to office and he gave that to me all of a sudden. It was wrapped in poly ethene cover. I could find no clues of what he is giving. Finally the suspense broke when I saw the black box with the HTC logo and then I thought that "Boy that would be a Kaiser". We've been discussing about Kaiser for quite sometime and its salient features.
It was just a WOW feeling and words couldn't explain how I felt. It was a sexiest piece of a phone. The glossy finish to the front and the mat finish to the back was a deadly combination of look and feel. Especially the answering keys were glimmering with the silver finish. At the outset the look and feel of the phone was breath taking. The color combinations took its major contribution. Thanks to HTC's designers to put a sexiest piece of innovative technology on earth.
I had a HTC Prophet before. I got the same level of excitement and happiness as I got a year back when I first held my Prophet, this time in fact the excitement was a bit more because of the sliding key board with the "Wind Chime" sound which was a hair rising experience. For a long time I was just gazing at the marvellous piece without doing anything on the phone. One was due to the surprise which is quite obvious and secondly due to the look and feel and the features of the wonderful innovation.
I was astonished looking at the size of the mobile, I placed both Prophet and TyTN II side by side and I was comparing the thickness of the phone, not much of a difference could I find having the sliding key board in my in TyTN II where as that was not there in Prophet. To have a keyboard to that size was a remarkable achievement on the size reduction to the device. It is so compact. The sliding key board has a sensor to it so that it based on the light available in the ambience the back light for the key board is active, which is a good feature to save battery power. The key board key is in tact that being a non key board user for the past one year I was able to type in easily without much of huzzles. The only point which keeps worrying me is that the soft keys are not bound properly, it is loosely packed to the base, I'm scared whether that would wear off on the long run . I checked with the dealer and he told that all pieces have the same problem. Not sure whether any body else has the similar problem. The tilt feature till 40 degrees vertically is a innovative feature and next time around you don't have to peep into the mobile, all you have to place the device on your desk, slide the key board and tilt the screen to your ease and see what's there on the mobile screen. This feature gives you a comfortable feature of watching a movie placing the device on your table and you dont have to worry about a cradle for your device isn't it just cool . Plug in the ear phones, tilt the screen and watch your favorite movie on your device at your table.
There were days I use to worry about dumping softwares into the Prophet but time isn't the same , now I got the TyTN II where I don't even have to worry about the memory having 256 MB Internal Flash, 128 MB RAM. Having installed close around 15 different softwares it is just stable and it does not break down. In the past two weeks to my rememberance I would have done a soft reset once or twice. Couldn't believe that I have a stable windows based mobile device at hand. I was a bit uncomfortable with the placement of stylus, got used to looking at stylus in the top right corner for an year whereas I got to look to the right bottom of the device. The SIM card deck is just been brought outside the battery casing and placed beneath the sliding screen in a way is good that you don't have to open the battery casing often, if there's going to be any problem with SIM card. To the other side, looking at the security of SIM card, you just have to unlock the SIM case and take the SIM out, it is as easy as that.
The reception of radio is fine, comparing my previous device I just feel that the sound is bit enriched. Moreover the volume control is not just a sliding button to the side of your device instead it is a wheel which gives much more in ease of operation. It also acts like a scroll wheel for the other applications and you need not take out the stylus and scroll for what you are searching for. By pressing the scroll wheel, the item which is selected gets opened. Indirectly the probability of you pulling out the stylus gets minimised with TyTN II.
Having an on board GPS built in, it proves the real power of it. Say bye bye to external GPS receiver to your device. It is in deed is in built in the device, just rocks. The reason I say that it is powerful is that, I have installed VITO Navigator II and my friend had installed the same in his Dopod U1000. In Dopod U1000 we were doing all sort of funny actions to trace satellites , we were holding the U1000 just right above our heads so that device could plot some satellites and the maximum we could find is only 4 and comparing that, TyTN II having the in built GPS could easily trace 9-12 satellites. I couldn't probably enjoy the practical features of GPS being in Chennai - India and I hope in the coming days it would be really useful.
The On/Off button in the device, is placed to the surface of the side. It would have been better if the button would have been a bit projected so that user need not search for the button and every time I have to Switch On/Switch Off the device it is a bit difficult to perform the operation as it is to the same surface level of the casing. Moreover in the night it is really difficult in the dark to Swith On/Switch Off the device, First is to plot where the button is and secondly to press it correctly. Most of the time I land up pressing the casing of the device thinking that the button is there. It would have been really useful if there could be a back light option for the On/Off button.
A little bit of disappointment towards the battery life. My talk time for a day would be normally an hour on an average and this is spanned across the day (not a continuous talk time) and I perform basic operations on the device and normally I don't watch movies and listen to music. The battery last for only 1.5 days max, where as for the same operations Prophet use to last for two full days and at times even a bit longer.
The touch response is really awesome and it is just that smooth that you don't have to strain with the stylus for any operations.
The color reproduction in this phone is amazing. It really has the vibrant colors in it. I've kept only half the brightness but still it is producing good results. It would be have still better if TyTN II is equiped with a VGA Screen instead of QVGA screen. But with the same Battery (1350mAh), QVGA is the optimum screen resolution.
The 3 MP camera has just proven its caliber. The picture quality is really good and even the videos. The videos taken are just smooth and the transition is just a remarkable break through. The enhanced sound quality makes you feel good to listen to more and good songs and I have installed Pocket Player and having the equalizer set, I could really feel the clarity of sound coming from the speaker. Listening to the same music with the same equalizer setup in Prophet is just out of question. I hope it is just a boom for the music lovers to listen to music in their PPC. The mat finish to the base of the mobile is also a worrying factor, I'm a bit sceptical whether the surface could easily get scratches due to mobile handling and which in turn could spoil the look of the fone.
Plus:
Screen tilt till 40 degrees.
Slide Keyboard.
On board GPS.
Enhanced Memory capacities.
The Micro SD card has a cover to it, which prevents dust getting into the device.
Buttons made compact and in correct placements.
Good sound clarity.
Good pictures off the 3MP camera.
Usage of stylus is minimized having the scroll wheel.
It’s a truly global device. It will work anywhere in the world.
Minus:
Mat finish for the base of the device prone to get scratches very easily, which spoils the look of the device.
Soft keys on the sliding key board is not bound properly to the board.
On/Off button takes an extra care to perform the operation.
SIM card casing provided beneath the sliding screen seems to be a bit insecure considering the security aspect.
No VGA Screen
Pictures Below...
Pictures of TyTn II
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Good One
Good Review Mate !
nice one mate..keep it up
Helmi's ROM work great and Destinator 6 as well
Hey there fellow Indian......
hey,nice review there.....i felt the emotion
Iv been lookin to buy the kaiser for some time now....just hav a few questions bout its use in india....
1) Wut maps r u using for GPS navigation?....r there ne shortcomings?
2) How r the headphones in the bundle?
3) Is HTC india supporting the TYTN II ?
Mera Bharat Mahan
Great review bro.. man, feel like buying kaiser.. btw, what about that 40 degrees tilt thing, is it firm enough?
ncex said:
Great review bro.. man, feel like buying kaiser.. btw, what about that 40 degrees tilt thing, is it firm enough?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes its firm
I bought mine from Singapore and am using it in Bangalore, India. The phone came with Mapking software pre-installed with one free map. That was cool. THe portion of the phone that scratches quite easily is the camera cover on the battery door. My phones a month old with several scratches on it already and I baby my phone quite a bit(No using a screen protector on a part of it). Installed a screen protector(first thing I always do with my touch screen phones.)
HTC India does not support the TyTyn2 since it has'nt been laucnhed here. If you want to buy it you'd need to get it on the grey market or import it yourself.
Its an amazing phone. prefer it to anything else available on the market at the moment. It being my first Windows based phone I really doubt I'd use anything else again(coming from EZX-Linux and UIQ previous to that).
Regards,
Akshay
Hey mines 1st Windows phone & never going back to sybian again
Hey tell me do u guys Use GPS in india is it maped yet ?
How much is it in grey market ?
Im a Indian in US, so was wondering how it worked there
I have aTilt got it for $299 with contract, worth it
aksd said:
I bought mine from Singapore and am using it in Bangalore, India. The phone came with Mapking software pre-installed with one free map. That was cool. THe portion of the phone that scratches quite easily is the camera cover on the battery door. My phones a month old with several scratches on it already and I baby my phone quite a bit(No using a screen protector on a part of it). Installed a screen protector(first thing I always do with my touch screen phones.)
HTC India does not support the TyTyn2 since it has'nt been laucnhed here. If you want to buy it you'd need to get it on the grey market or import it yourself.
Its an amazing phone. prefer it to anything else available on the market at the moment. It being my first Windows based phone I really doubt I'd use anything else again(coming from EZX-Linux and UIQ previous to that).
Regards,
Akshay
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
@vader
All the mahor cities are mapped reasonably well. When I was using the Motorola E6, Ihad a hloux GPS system to go with it, ran MGMaps with offline maps and downloaded GMaps of the entire South INdia so it worked almost everywhere, highway mappings are of the major roads only, while detailed maps of only the big citites are available. THe Bangalore map provided by MapKing is reasoably ok, but you cant use the route fix since the one-ways etc. keep changing week after week. But to know your position its more than sufficent.
I have no idea how much its in the grey market, but in Singapore I paid 750USD for it. Its the TyTyn2 and not the Tilt. I suppose if it is avialable in the grey market should be around 1000USD.
Hope this answers most of your questions
God bless ya man
Yes you did
The Tilt is same as Tytn II just some less software
& no front cam, cos in USA Service providers dont support it
aksd said:
@vader
All the mahor cities are mapped reasonably well. When I was using the Motorola E6, Ihad a hloux GPS system to go with it, ran MGMaps with offline maps and downloaded GMaps of the entire South INdia so it worked almost everywhere, highway mappings are of the major roads only, while detailed maps of only the big citites are available. THe Bangalore map provided by MapKing is reasoably ok, but you cant use the route fix since the one-ways etc. keep changing week after week. But to know your position its more than sufficent.
I have no idea how much its in the grey market, but in Singapore I paid 750USD for it. Its the TyTyn2 and not the Tilt. I suppose if it is avialable in the grey market should be around 1000USD.
Hope this answers most of your questions
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I know , but to hear you guys out there payed 300$ for something I paid 750 makes my stomach burn , therefore I stress on the difference, I have a front cam....you dont naaaah naaah na na naaah .
But seriously its one heck of a phone, if it had the USB host function as well as TV out and an FM Radio(although I dont use any of those function, well mayeb the USB host one I'd likke to use), it would have made it a godsend
aksd said:
I know , but to hear you guys out there payed 300$ for something I paid 750 makes my stomach burn , therefore I stress on the difference, I have a front cam....you dont naaaah naaah na na naaah
But seriously its one heck of a phone, if it had the USB host function as well as TV out and an FM Radio(although I dont use any of those function, well mayeb the USB host one I'd likke to use it would have made it a godsend
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I think Tv out is all it cant do
U can search the fourms should find something on USB host function
as for an FM Radio
here it comes with a 3 day Trial Xm radio
& below is a Link to Hack it
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=309844&highlight=mobi+tv
Hope it helps
Reload Kaiser brush it up
And brush it with Kaiser tools on this link
http://www.4shared.com/dir/8165638/7d4b1590/Kaiser_cabs-Reload.html
You guys gotta check the destinator 7 thingy from Satnav, it rocks on my TYTN 2 and is way better than the mapking that came along with the phone, GPS fix within a minute and comes along with a one india integrated map...really good directions and stuff
I don't work work for Satnav...I work for a company that gives me access to xda at work
The Reaper said:
You guys gotta check the destinator 7 thingy from Satnav, it rocks on my TYTN 2 and is way better than the mapking that came along with the phone, GPS fix within a minute and comes along with a one india integrated map...really good directions and stuff
I don't work work for Satnav...I work for a company that gives me access to xda at work
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I was using destinator before I flashed with the newer roms. Destinator seems to crash all the time on my Tytn II. It goes down and takes the task bar with it. Haven't been able to figure out what causes this... but loved it though.
Mapmyindia is also quite good, but stuck with landscape mode in that.
My brother has a TyTn II and all i can say (compared to my eten g500+..............................) is that this pda deserves some serious respect, even by the newest HTC Touch Pro.
guptadh said:
I was using destinator before I flashed with the newer roms. Destinator seems to crash all the time on my Tytn II. It goes down and takes the task bar with it. Haven't been able to figure out what causes this... but loved it though.
Mapmyindia is also quite good, but stuck with landscape mode in that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Strange...i dont have any such probs with destinator..
any of you guys check out this funny thing caller "Virtual Caller"??? It's a real life saver when you want to fake a phone call or sms and walk out of a boring meeting
Here's the LINK

**Touch Dimond PRO2** "NO" 5MP :(

I hope this is not any where esle, I was trying to find to make sure this is not a second post. Sorry if it is.
Check this out............Touch diamond Pro2
emember that leaked HTC 2009 roadmap? Well, it turns out, that thing was pretty spot on. HTC has just gone and announced updates to their ever-popular handsets, the Touch Diamond and Touch Pro. The Touch Diamond2, as you might have guessed, is the new Touch Diamond. It adds a larger display (3.2″ WVGA with touch sensitive zoom bar), a new and improved TouchFLO 3D and 5 megapixel camera. All in an updated and refined exterior casing.
Here’s where things get really interesting, though… We were lucky enough to get some hands on time with the Touch Diamond2 and Touch Pro2, but oh boy, the Touch Pro2 really stole the spotlight. We’re talking about Windows Mobile phone of the year and it’s only February! The Touch Pro2 is a mash-up of the TyTN II, the Touch HD, and the Touch Pro (yes, the tilting screen is back). It has a huge 3.6″ WVGA screen, one of the best QWERTY keyboards we’ve ever seen, a brand new TouchFLO 3D (it includes HTC’s Straight Talk which combines all communication into a fluid UI. Think Palm Pre-esque) and a really cool feature that activates the speakerphone when the phone is flipped upside down. Oh yeah, there’s a mute button on the back of the device for when you want to mute the conference. Awesome. Sadly the camera did not get upgraded to 5 megapixels (something that really would have absolutely sealed the deal) but there’s always the Touch Pro3. Nokia N97, what? (check it out here)
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Bugger. I've only just cleared the credit card after buying the pro.
Engadget review here - http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/16/htc-touch-pro2-is-awesome-in-ways-the-touch-pro-never-could-be/
edit - your thread title says yes 5mp, should read no 5mp! It's still a 3.2mp camera.
Hmmm, I still think I'll wait for the first WinMo 6.5 phones to come out, and you can bet HTC will get in there early. I prefer the idea of a native touch OS to a stylus OS with a touch GUI slapped on top of it.
Apart from the conference call stuff (which I wouldn't use), the only thing that appeals is the bigger screen (which I believe Tomtom 6 won't run on due to the WVGA resolution?) and the keyboard tilt. Neither are quite worth the upgrade costs.
WinMo 6.5 is due out, what, Q2? Same time as the Touch Pro 2?
holy crap! the TP2 looks awesome. dammit htc, why did you guys come up to a successor so soon!!
Jim Coleman said:
Apart from the conference call stuff (which I wouldn't use), the only thing that appeals is the bigger screen (which I believe Tomtom 6 won't run on due to the WVGA resolution?) and the keyboard tilt. Neither are quite worth the upgrade costs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
+1
Come on guys. We have to show HTC that we are not ships. They gave us a 3,6 screen and an old fashion style (TyTN II) and they expect us to give 700 euros for this?
They do not even fix Touch Pro (1) GPS problems.
This is just marketing. We need new (working) technology.
By the way this is the answer to my email for Pro 's GPS problem which I recieved Feb 5th 2009 (!!!)
Thank you for contacting HTC Europe Technical Support. Please accept our sincere apologies for the delay in our reply to your email dated <29/9/2008> as we were facing some technical issues with our systems.
With reference to your inquiry regarding HTC touch pro, Gps issue, you must contact Tomtom to know the compatible version of totmotm with your device.
Do you realy think we have to upgrade?
also disscussed in the news http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=483293
no dpad is not cool
yeah, missing dpad. essentially a touch hd with keyboard...
hopefully multitouch?
THE GRIZZ said:
also disscussed in the news http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=483293
no dpad is not cool
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The dpad on the current Touch Pro is very difficult to use - if they've replaced it with a suitably usable alternative such as full touch-scrolling in all apps (including Excel!) then that may be an improvement.
The blurb says TouchFlo 3D goes "deeper" into the OS so maybe this is exactly why they've dropped the dpad.
I need a mop for my keyboard.
My thoughts:
1. First thing I thought was: I wonder if there will be some way to buy this from AT&T without breaking my contract? I mean, what do they do for people who got a 2-year contract with the original iPhone, and then a year later they want the new iPhone?
2. Longer battery life and a bigger screen are very welcome.
3. I hope that keyboard is a mock-up. Also, I can't imagine using a non-Fuze keyboard, let alone one of those 3-row keyboards most phones have, but it's just way too convenient to have all those punctuation marks available top row.
4. I wonder when this phone will reach stateside.
5. I wonder why the phone's specs aren't improved?
6. I wonder why it's not all-black. It better just be a mockup.
7. Almost Touch HD-sized screen, and the TYTTN II tilt *drools*
But really, it took an entire year for the Touch Pro to come out in the states, so who is really banking on this thing coming out by Summer? And what will AT&T do when I'm willing to give them 300 more dollars for the Touch Pro II, and I still have a contract?
Sure, it's not the improvement we'd all have made. Not more RAM, not a better processor, or drivers... but it's still an improvement over the Touch Pro (unless that isn't a mockup keyboard, in which case I may cry over the colour scheme and the fact that there are LESS KEYS on that phone than the existing Touch Pro) and I'll take it. Plus, the front-facing D-Pad is a pain to use anyway that I just open it up and use my Keyboard D-Pad.
Brendo said:
...hopefully multitouch?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I doubt it, Apple hold a patent on multitouch, that's why the Google G1 doesn't have it - Google are too cosy with Apple to risk upsetting them. I wonder if HTC have the balls......
Nah.
Anyway, multitouch necessitates using two hands. It's not all that.
freco said:
+1
Come on guys. We have to show HTC that we are not ships. They gave us a 3,6 screen and an old fashion style (TyTN II) and they expect us to give 700 euros for this?
They do not even fix Touch Pro (1) GPS problems.
This is just marketing. We need new (working) technology.
By the way this is the answer to my email for Pro 's GPS problem which I recieved Feb 5th 2009 (!!!)
Thank you for contacting HTC Europe Technical Support. Please accept our sincere apologies for the delay in our reply to your email dated <29/9/2008> as we were facing some technical issues with our systems.
With reference to your inquiry regarding HTC touch pro, Gps issue, you must contact Tomtom to know the compatible version of totmotm with your device.
Do you realy think we have to upgrade?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agree with you
I like the chipset change to 7200A as might get vga video recording but bummer for the still 3.2mp camera. And miss the led light too. (the emergency lights didn't function at work during the 2003 north(east) america blackout)
I originally posted my response over at PPCGeeks so this will be short since I am on my Touch Pro...
This phone most likely wont come CDMA as it simply doesnt offer much improvements over the Touch Pro... If it does I wont be buying it.
The hardware is all the same except a worsened shell. No D-Pad a cramped keyboard to say a few...
Any TouchFlo enchancements will be cooked into TouchPro roms since the hardware is basically the same we can expect it to perform well.
I will hold out for WM 6.5 or 7 and a device with more RAM and a faster CPU. Hopefully better battery life too.
I think the TP is awesome spec wise, but an upgrade needs to have better specs. Otherwise why upgrade?
HANDS ON VIDEOS
I'm fallin' in love... no kiddin
looks nice but missing a few things here and there. the LED light is a big deal for me and the tp2 doesn't have it. the keyboard style also reminds me of the omnia and that's a no-no.I also noticed the 4 hardware button to be a ton smaller... that is kinda worrysome sinceit makes it harder to press (atleast for me). lastlythe tilt function. as far as i have heard, the at&t rep and various ppl have told me that the tilt function on the tytnII actually makes the phone more vulnerable. the rep told me that customers come in with a completely snapped in half tilt after accidently dropping it when it's tilted.
so that's my 2 cents. Unless the really upgrade the hardware I probably will be using this guy (tp2,aka fuze) for a long time.
Where is the camera's flash, website specs don't mention it and square next to camera lens is a button.
mtbmtbmtb said:
Where is the camera's flash, website specs don't mention it and square next to camera lens is a button.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is gone... That is a mute button or something useless...
I wonder if HTC actually does any market research on their target consumers or if they are just taking wild stabs in the dark figuring we'll just buy whatever they ship?
As seriously, this phone is in no way worth $600+USD over the Touch Pro.
They could have AT LEAST offered beefier specs somewhere. Where is the more RAM or faster CPU? Where is the return of some hardware buttons that I and a lot of others complain about loosing?
All they do is shrink the KB? Are they saying the "5 row keyboard" they advertised to death on the current TP was a failure? Who did they ask? As the phone hasn't been on the market long enough to get complaints up to carriers then back up to HTC...
Ah well enough venting for me. I won't be buying it. As I said earlier, I'll just get a cooked rom with any enhancements I like (if I like any as I hate Touch Flow 3D and have it all turned off on my TP).
http://www.engadget.com/photos/first-hands-on-with-the-htc-touch-pro2-with-video/1361020/
HTC TOUCH PRO2
The TP2 has:
- No D-Pad (Do you really trust on a WM GUI without a DPAD ? )
- No Camera Flash.
- Bigger
- Heavier
- Almost the same hardware.
- no TF3D Landscape "as seen in the engadgetmobile video (link above)".
- Really, really, really ugly look (Like the OldSchool Tilt ).
A part from the bigger screen, and some new "tiny" software options (conference... lol) that can be easily ported ( Is it necessary ???) I see nothing pushing me to buy something like this ~ $700 crap.
So HTC, are you serious ???
Oh yes, and I think this device will have an excelent graphic performance as well as other Qualcom devices like Diamond and TP.... let me laught
Cheers
what i am liking is the new landscape TF3D cant wait to have that ported to the TP
and its not just verizons it has all the tabs they just reorient themselves

Are There Any Good Front Facing Qwerty Devices?

My Samsung BlackJack II aka i617 has kicked the bucket and I'm using my old Moto Razr until I find a replacement. I'm not inquiring you to search google for me, I just would like to know if you know any that are decent. I want another Front-Facing QWERTY device, but I can't think of many that are 'Smartphones' and of that form factor except for these few I have below:
Samsung OmniaPro B7330--------------------------Palm Treo Pro
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I'd prefer it to have a Touch-screen (not a requirement though) and must have fairly modern specs. Also are there any Android phones that meet this requirement? I willing to take recommendations for all OS's as long as it's fairly customizable.
Unfortunately, touchscreen devices with a frontal qwerty keyboard are terrible.
The Samsung Epix is a decent touch screen device. It has a stylus and optical navigation pad that can be used just like a laptop mouse pad (meaning their is a mouse cursor). However, the keyboard is ridiculously terrible and unintuitive.
There is also the Palm Pixi which has a keyboard and touchscreen right in front of you. However, the keyboard is very, very minimalist and small. The keyboard is also very bad.
There really are no good devices with a frontal keyboard and touchscreen interface. At least, not yet.
Luckily, their is a new Sony Ericsson phone coming out real soon. It's called the Sony Ericsson Aspen. It will not by amazing in terms of technical aspects because the processor is presumed to be around 500 megahertz, which is slow for a Windows Mobile device. But from my experiences with qwerty keyboards on phones like these, the Sony Ericsson Aspen will have a pretty good keyboard.
If you really need the quick access and efficiency of a smart phone keyboard, I highly suggest you to purchase a Nokia E-series device or a BlackBerry device. These phones lack the touchscreen, but they excel in this form factor. Windows Mobile and Touch Screen phones do not excel in this form factor.
I suggest the Nokia E72, it is fast and efficient with a great keyboard. However, the BlackBerry 9000 or the BlackBerry 9700 have an even better keyboard.
So here is a quick summary:
According to the form factor that you're looking for, Touch Screen devices have terrible keyboards and are inefficient. However, Nokia E-series devices or BlackBerry Bold Series devices tend to have the better keyboards and are designed to work really well with their operating system.
Just know this if you decide to listen to me: Nokia E-series devices have a good non-touch screen operating system. BlackBerry devices are designed for email and messaging and have the best of the best keyboards with this form factor, but I think that the operating system is a bit boring and lack software development.
Thanks for the reply poetryrocksalot. I was considering the Pixi Plus, but the only models available so far are CDMA and i need a unlocked phone.
When I said fairly modern specs, I meant a phone that didn't have hardware from 2006. I just neeed something that was faster than my previous phone, the Samsung i617. Also what I meant was that I would like something with a touch-screen but it's not biggy if it doesn't.
krjcook said:
Thanks for the reply poetryrocksalot. I was considering the Pixi Plus, but the only models available so far are CDMA and i need a unlocked phone.
When I said fairly modern specs, I meant a phone that didn't have hardware from 2006. I just neeed something that was faster than my previous phone, the Samsung i617. Also what I meant was that I would like something with a touch-screen but it's not biggy if it doesn't.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The Nokia E72 has a ARM 11 600 MHz processor, 5 Megapixel camera, Modern Look, Decent RAM considering the average RAM size for Symbian devices, LED Flash, 3.5 mm headphone jack, active noise cancellation microphone technology, up-to-date S60 Series 3rd Edition OS (considering the fact that it came out fairly recently), a microsd card slot, accelerometer, optical trackpad, FM Radio receiver, Digital Compass built in, flashlight integration.
BTW, of all of these devices, the Nokia E72 has the best camera (except for the Sony Ericsson Aspen).
The Palm Pixi Plus has a 2 Megapixel Camera, no FM Radio, no flashlight integration (you need someone to develop software and it isn't out yet), no microsd card and only 8 gb of memory for now, no digital compass built in, no active noise cancellation, and the OS is in it's infant stages
The only thing that makes the Pixi modern over the E72 is that the Pixi is a touch screen device. Furthermore, it's 2010 and the Sony Ericsson Aspen hasn't even came out yet, but it is a disappointment to see that it has 3 megapixel camera.
I am really against purchasing a Palm Pixi plus. By purchasing this, I think that you are basically saying: "I don't really care about the front facing keyboard, I just care that it has a capacitive touch screen and a fun interface". If this is your priority than I really hope you purchase a WebOS device with atleast a 3.5 inch diagonally long screen.
By the way, the Nokia E72 has been praised for being one of the fastest Nokia device out there right now. Symbian devices do not need as much CPU as windows mobile devices, so the processors are usually ARM processors around 400 megahertz. Even the Nokia N97 has a 400 megahertz CPU. The E72 is an exception.
HTC Trophy.... But it aint out yet.
adamdon89 said:
HTC Trophy.... But it aint out yet.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wow, I can not believe I totally forgot about this device. I should have mentioned it.
However, there are some things to mention. This image is fake rendition by an unofficial artist
Here is the link and some proof: http://pocketnow.com/tech-news/recent-htc-trophy-image-looks-good-but-fake-artist-render
Here is the actual image that was leaked: http://www.techdigest.tv/HTC Trophy.jpg
I am looking forward for HTC to implement the artist rendition!!!!!!!!!!!
Don't forget the Maple, I love it's keyboard, although the HTC inner circle which is heavily hyped on it isn't that great, but it has no touch screen
cmstackar said:
Don't forget the Maple, I love it's keyboard, although the HTC inner circle which is heavily hyped on it isn't that great, but it has no touch screen
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Right!
HTC Maple
It´s one of the best options for bar smartphones
http://pdadb.net/index.php?m=specs&id=1782&c=htc_snap_s521__captain_htc_maple_100
Please don't get the HTC Maple. It's very low end.
I suggest waiting for the HTC Trophy to be officially announced or for the Sony Ericsson Aspen. Or get the successor to the E72 if it comes out.
Completely disagree
Have you had one?
or you just talking light
It´s one of the best actual options
Trophy looks nice but it´s not here today for sale
Here the low end specs:
http://pdadb.net/index.php?m=pdacomparer&id1=1826&id2=1782
Thanks for the reply. I've decided that I'm going with a windows standard device, because their cheap and simple then I'll upgrade to Windows Phone 7 or Android later this year. But the problem is that now I'm stuck choosing between the HTC Snap and Samsung OmniaPro B7330. They have similar specs, except that the OmniaPro has a Bigger Screen, More Ram & Rom, a higher res camera, and It's cheaper everywhere i look. Here's a link to the comparison: http://pdadb.net/index.php?m=pdacomparer&id1=1826&id2=2032
Is HTC's software good enough to waiver the samsung better spec and lower price tag.
Hopefully this will be the successor of Samsung i780/Epix.
http://wmpoweruser.com/?p=15101
krjcook said:
Thanks for the reply. I've decided that I'm going with a windows standard device, because their cheap and simple then I'll upgrade to Windows Phone 7 or Android later this year. But the problem is that now I'm stuck choosing between the HTC Snap and Samsung OmniaPro B7330. They have similar specs, except that the OmniaPro has a Bigger Screen, More Ram & Rom, a higher res camera, and It's cheaper everywhere i look. Here's a link to the comparison: http://pdadb.net/index.php?m=pdacomparer&id1=1826&id2=2032
Is HTC's software good enough to waiver the samsung better spec and lower price tag.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wouldn't say that the software is much better, but the keyboard is phenomenal on the snap, 2nd favorite keyboard on any mobile device. And if the keyboard is anything like Samsung's other models, it will be decent, but not great
I'm really optimistic about the Samsung Pivot. If the device we're seeing now is the actual release model, than I would definitely get it. It reminds me of the Nokia E61 (terrific keyboard!).
This is the Samsung Pivot:
This is the Nokia E61:
Horrible designs indeed...
poetryrocksalot said:
Unfortunately, touchscreen devices with a frontal qwerty keyboard are terrible.
The Samsung Epix is a decent touch screen device. It has a stylus and optical navigation pad that can be used just like a laptop mouse pad (meaning their is a mouse cursor). However, the keyboard is ridiculously terrible and unintuitive.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Have you owned the Epix? I have, and it is a very good device. I had it for 2 years, never had a problem like everyone else says. I had mobile shell on it for a bit running fine, then switched to manilla 2D with real vga. The keyboard was great, much better than flat keyboards. I typed faster than anyone I knew could on other phones, I even used to type up notes in class.
However it has been discontinued, so the chances of getting a new one are very slim. It just didn't have the appeal and didn't sell, but with windows 6.1, maybe a possible official 6.5 upgrade(doubtful since it was discontinued, however ms website says april 2010), and everything an htc device has except for a g sensor and a perfect touch flo. I liked it, too bad mine decided to stay in my pocket when I went for a swim. HTC Touch Diamond 2 in 3 days wooohoo
brunodemelo said:
Have you owned the Epix? I have, and it is a very good device. I had it for 2 years, never had a problem like everyone else says. I had mobile shell on it for a bit running fine, then switched to manilla 2D with real vga. The keyboard was great, much better than flat keyboards. I typed faster than anyone I knew could on other phones, I even used to type up notes in class.
However it has been discontinued, so the chances of getting a new one are very slim. It just didn't have the appeal and didn't sell, but with windows 6.1, maybe a possible official 6.5 upgrade(doubtful since it was discontinued, however ms website says april 2010), and everything an htc device has except for a g sensor and a perfect touch flo. I liked it, too bad mine decided to stay in my pocket when I went for a swim. HTC Touch Diamond 2 in 3 days wooohoo
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I do not own the device but I have handled the device and typed on it every time I have the chance when I see one. The keyboard is terrible.
The BlackBerry on the other hand is very, very good.
I bet you really like Windows Mobile...well if the Samsung Epix had the keyboard shape and form of a BlackBerry, than I am pretty sure that you are would like your Epix even more.
Anyways, sources say that the Samsung Pivot will be like the successor to the Epix. Fortunately the keyboard is like old E61 keyboard which is a keyboard that is actually better than the new E72 keyboard.
I understand that the Epix keyboard have a more honest feedback (meaning that you are certain that you clicked a button), however, the keys are very firm. You really need to press a little on the keys for the input. Firm keys prevent typing fast. Productivity takes a bit more time on these keyboards. The E72 and the BlackBerry have less firm keys meaning that speed typing is permissible.
Also, the best way to test keyboard is to do a speed run typing on the Epix and the BlackBerry 9700. That is what I did. The results are that I am less likely to make a typographical error on the BlackBerry 9700 than the Epix when I typed the same sentence at full speed.
poetryrocksalot said:
I do not own the device but I have handled the device and typed on it every time I have the chance when I see one. The keyboard is terrible.
The BlackBerry on the other hand is very, very good.
I bet you really like Windows Mobile...well if the Samsung Epix had the keyboard shape and form of a BlackBerry, than I am pretty sure that you are would like your Epix even more.
Anyways, sources say that the Samsung Pivot will be like the successor to the Epix. Fortunately the keyboard is like old E61 keyboard which is a keyboard that is actually better than the new E72 keyboard.
I understand that the Epix keyboard have a more honest feedback (meaning that you are certain that you clicked a button), however, the keys are very firm. You really need to press a little on the keys for the input. Firm keys prevent typing fast. Productivity takes a bit more time on these keyboards. The E72 and the BlackBerry have less firm keys meaning that speed typing is permissible.
Also, the best way to test keyboard is to do a speed run typing on the Epix and the BlackBerry 9700. That is what I did. The results are that I am less likely to make a typographical error on the BlackBerry 9700 than the Epix when I typed the same sentence at full speed.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I guess that is the case for you. It is different for everyone, and each and every person gets used to their phone's keyboard in a few days. I can't just pick up a blackberry and hope to do a fair speed test as I am used to the Epix. Only way to find out would be someone who has never typed on either phone.
About the pivot, that thing is quite ugly. It might have a better keyboard but thats pretty much it over the Epix, and some more memory.
Chinese Blackberry clone with WM 6.1 Pro
http://www.nowsupplier.com/new-w088...one-quad-band-single-card-gps-wifi-p-378.html
This device has a keyboard and WM professional, I dont think it has a touch screen, but it looks to be a good cheap device, although it lacks 3G. Quad-band GSM and GPRS, with WiFi and TV antenna.
Just my two bits.
adamdon89 said:
HTC Trophy.... But it aint out yet.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree and it's coming soon! You can pre-order it here:
http://www.mobilecityonline.com/wir...c&utm_term=HTCTROPHYBKEU&utm_campaign=froogle

OMG Surface Pro 3

I've just seen Surface Pro 3 event and... i love it, i want it... i must sell my Pro 1 and buy it.
What do you think about SP3 guys?
And its 3:2 screen instead of 16:9?
I like the 16:9 screen ratio better.
The surface pro 2 is still a powerful product regardless, but imo the thing holding them back is the policy of selling the keyboard separately.
im keen to find out if the new bluetooth enabled surface pro 3 pen will work with the surface pro 2. Im definitely considering selling off my surface pro 2 to upgrade to the 3.
julz said:
im keen to find out if the new bluetooth enabled surface pro 3 pen will work with the surface pro 2. Im definitely considering selling off my surface pro 2 to upgrade to the 3.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
New pen is NTrig not wacom so will not function on a pro 2.
I was disapointed about no mention of RT at all!
Loved the way that Pro 3 looks though. I have looked at all the press on it. Great looker. But way out of my price affordability at this time. I'll make do with my 1'st gen RT with 64gbs for a while. I might keep my eyes open for a bargain, I only paid $160US for mine on ebay. WIth all the stuff I've done to mine I might, maybe be able to resell for $200US, then sit and gamble for a pro 2. "Sigh" always the best man never the groom...lol
I don't know why they switched from Wacom to ntrig for the stylus.
One thing I like about my Surface Pro over my friends Sony duo 13 is that if I just want to draw 1 or 2 lines or a few words I can use the pen from my Note 3 if I the surface pen is not in easy reach.
Other than that, I like the surface pro 3. New stand looks like it will be better for writing and drawing. I do a lot of annotating on pdfs and use a combination of keyboard and pen.
Sent from my SM-N900 using XDA Free mobile app
The active stylus can give better precision. Wacom is nice and works well in most cases, but on very high-density displays - such as the Surface Pro 3 has - its minimum resolution is several pixels across.
It will be interesting to see how users feel about the size over time. After I went from a 11" to 13" MacBook Air I really missed the carry ability of the 11'. Although the Pro 2 is heavy and thick, somehow the 10" size just seems right to me.
microsoft surface pro 3
Microsoft Surface Pro 3
short video of the Microsoft surface pro 3 from the webs
The thing I like the most about the Surface Pro 3 is that it doesn't make me want to replace my Surface Pro 2. The screen size is larger, which wasn't what I was looking for when I originally bought the SP2. The only highlights for the form factor that I would have liked over it is the thickness and weight.
i wish they just waited for broadwell they probably could have made thinner
MS needs to sync its release cycle with Intel's. 1st-gen Surface & Pro also had the same problem, of using previous-gen SoC that makes them obsolete even before release. For premium devices, which the Surface lines aspire to be, the target audience is early adopters who expect to have the latest tech. Intel's Mountain Llama (the Broadwell reference design) was impressive in its Computex debut, and SP3 won't fare well in the inevitable comparison.
The kickstand + keyboard cover combo also hasn't fared well. One sign of a good design, aside from selling well, is when competitors copy it. I don't see any OEM copying the keyboard cover, preferring instead to stick to more conventional "detachable" design eg Asus' Transformer series, which works better for fast typing.
This latter has its own issue of being top-heavy, thus needing to add counterbalance weight to the keyboard dock and increasing overall weight. Intel's ref design avoids this by not putting the docking point at the edge of the dock, thereby creating an "outrigger" that prevents tip-over. Most aftermarket keyboard docks for iPad use this setup. Its other advantages: lighter than conventional detachable, more rigid than MS' design and being more "lapable," and works in portrait. One improvement would be to add an adjustable hinge.
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I see SP3 having a short shelf life, and not just because of the obsoleted SoC. If MS sticks to its new spring release cycle for Windows as rumored, then Win9 should see a corresponding Surface launch, along with Office Touch, about 10 months from now. The i3 and i7 versions of SP3 won't ship until end of August, which gives them about a 7-month shelf life.
e.mote said:
The kickstand + keyboard cover combo also hasn't fared well. One sign of a good design, aside from selling well, is when competitors copy it. I don't see any OEM copying the keyboard cover, preferring instead to stick to more conventional "detachable" design eg Asus' Transformer series, which works better for fast typing.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agree on syncing new Surfaces to Intel's processor releases, but totally disagree on the kickstand and covers. I love being able to just flip the cover up to make more room on my desk, flip it down when I need to do some work, or use the tablet upright without a keyboard at all - keeping something up just for reference, watching a movie, etc.
I totally don't get all the focus people put on how the kickstand works (or doesn't) on the lap. In the past 20 years, I don't think I've used a laptop on my lap more than dozen times. On a desk, I'd take a kickstand over a traditional notebook any day. It's also nice that you get both a keyboard and cover in what? 3-4mm?
For people who prefer something closer to a traditional laptop, there's plenty of choices, I really the Surface retains the kickstand.
As for the Pro 3, I see it much the same as the original Pro - some nice features but just not enough to make me want to buy one. The processor has already been mentioned, the switch away from the Wacom pen, and I actually prefer the smaller screen on the Pro 1 and 2. I could be tempted by a Pro 4 or maybe 5, but my 2 is serving me perfectly well for now.
>totally disagree on the kickstand and covers. I love being able to just flip the cover up...In the past 20 years, I don't think I've used a laptop on my lap more than dozen times...
"I like it"/"works for me" isn't an argument.
>I totally don't get all the focus people put on how the kickstand works (or doesn't) on the lap
Lap use is one instance in the spectrum of computing use mobility. At one end of the spectrum is usage while walking, ie with a phone. Next is using the device while standing. After that, is sitting without a desk (ie lap use). Then, sitting with a desk. Finally, sitting with a desk in a pre-determined location (ie a desktop PC).
By not being able to use the device well while sitting and without a desk, the Surface is even less mobile than a laptop for high-speed typing. That's why MS was so persistent with the "lapability" argument, which was shot down by the majority of reviews of SP3, from journalists and bloggers who do need that mobility.
>It's also nice that you get both a keyboard and cover in what? 3-4mm?
Thinness is visually appealing and is a selling point, but ergonomically it doesn't matter. For a tablet, which is a handheld device, weight and shape are what counts. For a keyboard, thinness affects more important things, like key travel, which affects typing speed. The Surface type cover is an inferior keyboard for typing, even by the relatively low standard of laptop keyboards.
>I really the Surface retains the kickstand.
Archos tablets have had the kickstand for many years, and it was never a big deal (read: not a selling point). Anyway, it's not a matter of having or not having a kickstand, but how to have the display at a desired angle with the least hassle. For decades, the clamshell form was the least hassle. MS' kickstand design hasn't proven to be an adequate replacement. Of present designs, the one in the above pic is IMO the most efficient.
e.mote said:
Of present designs, the one in the above pic is IMO the most efficient.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
for once, and this is a rare occasion, I actually agree with you.
My laptop rarely if ever touches a desk. Had a guy round with his surface RT and frankly it was absolutely useless as a laptop replacement ergonomically (we'll ignore software) in the places I use my laptop.
e.mote said:
"I like it"/"works for me" isn't an argument.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I didn't *just* say "I like it", I gave specific examples of where the kickstand is adventitious.
e.mote said:
Lap use is one instance in the spectrum of computing use mobility. At one end of the spectrum is usage while walking, ie with a phone. Next is using the device while standing. After that, is sitting without a desk (ie lap use). Then, sitting with a desk. Finally, sitting with a desk in a pre-determined location (ie a desktop PC).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ok, so what's your point? Every device trades some proficiency in one area to gain some in another. If an individual's use case requires a significant amount of "lap use", that should steer them in the direction of devices that prioritize that type of use. That doesn't make a device that prioritizes another area wrong, it simple makes it potentially the wrong device for that that person. And I say potentially because I've made a point of using my Surface on my lap to see what all the fuss is about, and I don't see the issue. Perhaps it doesn't work quite as well as a traditional hinged notebook with a rigid keyboard, but for all but the most demanding of needs, it works just fine.
Personally, the minor trade-off in proficiency for lap use is far outweighed by it's increased abilities elsewhere - as I mentioned, using it on a table/desk/counter/hood of a car/etc without the keyboard at all, being able to flip the cover up to save space while the device remains standing, etc. Again, if an individual can't accept that trade-off, then the Surface simply isn't the best device for their needs.
e.mote said:
By not being able to use the device well while sitting and without a desk, the Surface is even less mobile than a laptop for high-speed typing.
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Click to collapse
And by being able to use the device upright without a keyboard, the Surface is more useful than a tablet, so what's your point? If high-speed typing on one's lap is a primary concern, then they should be buying a dedicated notebook or a convertible that uses the hinged, clamshell design with a rigid keyboard. As I said in my previous post, I simply don't understand this mindset that says the Surface HAS to function AS WELL AS a traditional notebook. No, it doesn't. Thankfully, there's any number of other systems on the market that do prioritize that use case.
e.mote said:
Thinness is visually appealing and is a selling point, but ergonomically it doesn't matter. For a tablet, which is a handheld device, weight and shape are what counts. For a keyboard, thinness affects more important things, like key travel, which affects typing speed. The Surface type cover is an inferior keyboard for typing, even by the relatively low standard of laptop keyboards.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thinness is directly related to weight and shape, so to say thinness is nice, but weight and shape are more important is just being disingenuous. And again you're laser focused on absolute typing performance, which is fine, but it simply makes the Surface not the right device for you, it doesn't make the Surface the wrong design for everyone.
e.mote said:
Archos tablets have had the kickstand for many years, and it was never a big deal (read: not a selling point).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've had several Archos products over the years, and trust me, there's ample reasons their products weren't big sellers. I generally like their overall designs and concepts, but they have a knack for always undermining the whole device with one or two painfully sub-standard components, be it a terrible screen, resistive touch input as opposed to capacitive, etc.
e.mote said:
Anyway, it's not a matter of having or not having a kickstand, but how to have the display at a desired angle with the least hassle. For decades, the clamshell form was the least hassle. MS' kickstand design hasn't proven to be an adequate replacement. Of present designs, the one in the above pic is IMO the most efficient.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'll agree there, the original Pro's single angle was pretty restrictive, and the Pro 2's two angles is barely more than adequate. I haven't found it to be an issue, but I can see that some would. I think the only features of the Pro 3 that I find compelling are the new kickstand and the thinner/lighter design.
But returning to the actual design, I'll absolutely agree with everything you said as it pertains to making the device better for someone who needs A- absolute typing performance, and B- has the frequent need to use the device on their lap. Absolutely, a rigid keyboard with equal to greater weight to the display and a strong hinged design would make for a better lap typing experience. And I'll again say that there's any number of systems that offer exactly that - from dedicated laptops to convertibles that use the rigid clamshell design. None of this makes the Surface's design wrong, it simply makes it the wrong device for those individuals, just as dedicated notebooks and rigid, clamshell convertibles are the the wrong device for my needs.
The market is big enough for multiple form factors - not every device needs to share a single overall design, because not every person has precisely the same needs. The market already has countless rigid clamshell type devices, please let those of us who don't prioritize high-speed typing on our laps have our ONE device that best fits our needs, ok?
Without having done a painful amount of digging, please allow me to butt in for a moment and ask, ate there any threads here dedicated to development or tweaking of the sp3? I just got the i7 512 model to use as the heart of a semi portable recording studio (a good amount of real-time number crunching) and was looking to get the most I can out of it. So far, with the little benchmarking and playing with Undervolting a little, I haven't seen this chip do any thermal throttling and haven't gotten any real increase in benchmark. It seems this thing is pretty damn efficient. I came across an article where people were getting major increase in benchmarks by Undervolting but with the i5. (less voltage, less heat, more time at "turbo" less fan noise - ideal for audio production) Well, hey before I REALLY start rambling, if anyone has any resources or suggestions I'd be much obliged.
Sent from my 831C using XDA Free mobile app

Next qwerty phone? Photon Q is getting old for today's apps...

Hello guys,
Has anyone found a phone worthy as a successor to the Photon Q? At this point I'm willing to give up SD card, removable batteries and camera button just to get something that has a keyboard, root and can run the basic apps like firefox, messenger, gmail, play store, calendar, adobe reader and youtube without random freezes/pauses in the UI.
Already spent 3 years using a nexus 4 and 5 and I've pretty much "disappeared" from people's lives because I couldn't bear to use any form of touch screen keyboards.
Are people like me condemned to go extinct from the world of mobile computing?
My next phone will be Blackberry Priv. Faster enough, better screen, qwerty, Android. It has all I need (for now at least).
Yeah I'm not too much of a fan of the Priv for a couple of reasons:
- No root and locked bootloader spells a short life for this very expensive machine, no custom roms, no remove bloatware, no adaway etc... Root and bootloader unlock are pretty much what keeps android customizable and open source for the end user...
- Vertical slide out keyboard vs horizontal, only 4 rows, abuses the alt and sym keys to hit numbers and special characters, dpad is 100% analog. Never mind trying to do emojis or working in an ssh terminal, might as well use hacker's keyboard.
- Bugged screen drivers, doesn't use Amoled principles to turn off pixels, results in battery drain, although this might have been fixed in the latest update.
With that said, I'd be willing to try one out if BB unlocks the bootloader and the price falls under 400$CAD for a used unit.
I didn't know it's root-locked. You're right that it may render the device unusable in quite a short time. But if not Priv, then what?
This is such a sad question.
The Moto Z's interchangeable back-panels look pretty promising. I find it hard to believe that there's a bigger market for a projector than for a physical keyboard...
https://www.motorola.com/us/moto-mods
Even just using the breadboard dev kit with a 3D-printed back and a donor keyboard from an older phone could work for a one-off.
http://developer.motorola.com/products/mdk
Apparently there are clip-on bluetooth slider keyboards for iPhone (https://www.amazon.com/iNNEXT-Ultra-Thin-Slide-Out-Bluetooth-Backlight/dp/B01DZJUI18). I've been trying to find something similar for a current-gen android phone but haven't been having much luck.
There's the keyboard + case, but one of the nice things about the slider is being able to hold it while typing and not needing a surface to keep it stable...
If anybody's found something I've missed, I'm sure I'm not the only one feeling the pains of obsolescence...
The z looks promising - especially as it is modular, as most manufacturers it would seem want to just simplify their manufacturing process, it would mean making a generic touchscreen phone, and then batches of accessories to suit demand. Very smart idea.
Repairs/upgrades would be a hell of a lot easier also, just replacing the component that fails, or swapping the accessory for a different task.
Sent from my XT897 using XDA Free mobile app
The main issue of Photon Q for me is the lack of support for the European LTE bands (the most important for me is the 800Mhz band).
In my country, the 3G coverage by HSPA is quite poor and no mobile network operator is expanding its 3G at all any more, the only new coverage efforts happen in LTE.
The Moto Z (Force) looks quite promising. To be honest, I'm simply waiting for a MotoMod qwerty keyboard to appear, and I'm declaring my xt897 dead. Though the Z's camera bump seems to complicate the eventual hw keyboard mod execution.
Let's see what the future will bring us.
Thanks kabaldan for noticing the Moto Z.
I already gave up for another hardwarekeyboard-smartphone and have nearly decided for a OnePlus 3 (6GB RAM edition).
But I think it is better to buy a phone which *might* get an "acceptable" keyboard than none at all. So I guess I will wait a bit longer for the Moto Z.
I'm seriously considering buying a slider bluetooth keyboard for a different phone and then adapting it to fit a current-gen phone. It's not quite as ideal, but most of the slider jobbies for the iPhone are pretty cheap and simple; they have a case part that attaches to the phone, and then the keyboard slides along rails on the case. So I could replace the case portion with a 3D-printed case sized to fit a current-gen phone and the rails for the keyboard. The downsides would be not necessarily having the right android keys (though those have been largely missing since I stopped using my Epic 4g) and it probably wouldn't autodetect when the slider was deployed. It'll probably taking rooting and some keyboard driver hacking to get it all working right, but maybe it'll be a good enough fix when I'm done in like six months...
DIY qwerty phone
GDorn said:
I'm seriously considering buying a slider bluetooth keyboard for a different phone and then adapting it to fit a current-gen phone...
It's not quite as ideal, but most of the slider jobbies for the iPhone are pretty cheap and simple; they have a case part that attaches to the phone, and then the keyboard slides along rails on the case. So I could replace the case portion with a 3D-printed case sized to fit a current-gen phone and the rails for the keyboard. The downsides would be not necessarily having the right android keys (though those have been largely missing since I stopped using my Epic 4g) and it probably wouldn't autodetect when the slider was deployed. It'll probably taking rooting and some keyboard driver hacking to get it all working right, but maybe it'll be a good enough fix when I'm done in like six months...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I did that with Xiaomi Mi4C and iPhone 6 keyboard case. If you like smaller phone then you might want to consider Z5C/X Compact and iPhone 5/5S/SE keyboard case.
I know this is an old thread but I just saw this from a Network World article "How Moto Mods went from concept to product." Paul Fordham, lead mechanical architect on the Moto Mods design team says: "We built a battery module that had a full QWERTY keyboard inside. I could show it to you; it's almost like a slider type concept for people who like the tactile feel of a real keyboard. We had all these different ideas that we hadn't even partly developed."
So, it looks like they've at least looked at the idea. I've posted in the Lenovo forums too. Maybe some of us somehow can wake them up to make this a reality. I am grateful for all of the work done on the Photon Q, it still does a good job with all of the tweaks, but I think all of us Q owners could use a newer phone.
bmccrary said:
I know this is an old thread but I just saw this from a Network World article "How Moto Mods went from concept to product." Paul Fordham, lead mechanical architect on the Moto Mods design team says: "We built a battery module that had a full QWERTY keyboard inside. I could show it to you; it's almost like a slider type concept for people who like the tactile feel of a real keyboard. We had all these different ideas that we hadn't even partly developed."
So, it looks like they've at least looked at the idea. I've posted in the Lenovo forums too. Maybe some of us somehow can wake them up to make this a reality. I am grateful for all of the work done on the Photon Q, it still does a good job with all of the tweaks, but I think all of us Q owners could use a newer phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've been watching the Z also, and have read that thread.
This would be the single best Mod they could release, & I'm currently debating whether to buy a Priv & sacrifice the 5 row keyboard side-slider, or take a chance on the Z in the hope that they (or others) will release a slider keyboard.
Snapping off a keyboard, & replacing it with the speaker mod, or camera or something else - eg, going out & not needing the bulk of the keyboard, so slap on a styled back, or extended battery.
Maybe later you need to write a work email, so slap on the keyboard & type like a demon again. I'd probably purchase an extra keyboard just to have a spare at a convenient location - eg car glovebox.
I'd also buy a Z for the missus, then all the Mods would get a decent use. Extended batteries, camera, speakers, covers, style backs, prob even get the projector, just to have a full set!
All this..... just waiting for the keyboard Mod.
Sent from my XT897 using XDA Free mobile app
Sadly, there's still no sign of a keyboard attachment for the Moto Z. You'd think that with Motorola being the last manufacturer to produce a hardward keyboard (both the Photon Q LTE and the Droid 4), they'd have made one for this dev device.
Flash-A-Holic said:
I did that with Xiaomi Mi4C and iPhone 6 keyboard case. If you like smaller phone then you might want to consider Z5C/X Compact and iPhone 5/5S/SE keyboard case.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good afternoon. As far as I understand, it can be done with any of the Xiaomi Mi4. The main thing is that the dimensions of the housing and the location of the cameras have been the same. Please make a photo of how you do mount the keyboard to the phone cover?
I do not expect anything new from the keyboard of the Motorola (
Plus one for a newer keyboard phone. Running CM13, I've had unsolvable problems with my (old, 2006) BT car interface staying connect while I simultaneously use AD2P via a separate BT receiver via the stero AUX in. The other aggravation is that with CM13, I cannot flash nandroid backups when I break my XT897's screen (which happens 2x-3x per year), so I have to reconfigure from scratch.
For those two reasons, I keep being tempted to switch back to stock (BT stack that tolerates multiples connections better w/ my setup), and easy NANdroid backups and sprint activation codes, etc/
BUT, then I try stock and wait 10-15 full seconds for an app to open. Much gratitude to the CM guys and whoever picks up ball from them and runs with it.
My latest problem w/ CM13 is I can't take advantage of the free international roaming in Mexico-- can't get global data to work (either problem with the CM13 settings menu, or with sprints OTA activsation of the the (sprint internal) SIM.
Let us know if anyone finds a qwerty android (I tried the priv, and too big, too hot running stock), and thanks for everyone's contributions to this great community.
schmandroid said:
The z looks promising
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Click to collapse
Yes it does.
https://www.neowin.net/news/behold-...-slider-moto-mod-that-may-stir-some-nostalgia
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The Solutor said:
Yes it does.
https://www.neowin.net/news/behold-...-slider-moto-mod-that-may-stir-some-nostalgia
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh thanks God! It would be great if it becomes true!
Here is the link to the indiegogo compaign. I hope a lot of us Q users will sign up!
https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/physical-keyboard-slider-mod-for-moto-z/coming_soon

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