Database Info

Touch Cruise Review

Here are the review contents (posted at OnTheGoSolutions.com)
More photos and extended comments after two weeks of use are still to come. Check back later to this thread.
This phone has impressed everyone who has seen and held it.

That was a good 'teaser' review. I read it earlier on your post in the General and thought it was excellent for the size. And as always we want more so I can't wait for more
Couple of questions re driving:
1. How does the GPS perform at motorway speeds (if you had a chance to try it) say between 55-70MPH?
2. Does the mirror-like finish bother you, whilst driving, i.e. bright city lights or a high beam from a car behind?
Cheers.

And another question. Since this is also a Qualcomm same as the TyTn II what about the behaviour of the drivers and their incompatibility for video playback. Has HTC corrected the problem or issued just another half-cooked device.

real pictures prototype and production unit
http://smartmobilegadgets.wordpress.com/2007/08/04/htc-pxxxx-polaris/
enjoy

srmz said:
And another question. Since this is also a Qualcomm same as the TyTn II what about the behaviour of the drivers and their incompatibility for video playback. Has HTC corrected the problem or issued just another half-cooked device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am not aware of the video playback problems with the TyTnII. I will try to read more about this.
I have tested video playback with the Cruise and it seems reasonable for a 400 MHz device. I also have the Qtek 9000 (HTC Universal) at 520MHz and the Dopod U1000 ( HTC Athena) at 624MHz. Both are VGA devices. I have a test video, a full length movie, which is encoded for 640x480 resolution. All 3 devices running WM6 and WMPlayer run this video reasonably well. The Cruise has at times a slightly noticable lag with lip sync. This comes and goes during the movie, but is not that distracting. There were no issues with lockup or freezing. Playback was tested in full screen. I re-encoded the video for 320x240 and the sync issue was gone. I find that encoding is a major part of perceived playback problems. Perhaps this should be the topic of a different thread.
Bottom line, it looks like the Cruise palys back video fine.

Abbsta said:
That was a good 'teaser' review. I read it earlier on your post in the General and thought it was excellent for the size. And as always we want more so I can't wait for more
Couple of questions re driving:
1. How does the GPS perform at motorway speeds (if you had a chance to try it) say between 55-70MPH?
2. Does the mirror-like finish bother you, whilst driving, i.e. bright city lights or a high beam from a car behind?
Cheers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I ran the GPS for a full 70 mile commute, side by side with a BMW iDrive Nav. Apart from the different softwares projecting slightly different routes, the positional differences were negligible. Speed, bearing, distance and locations were spot on. By the way, I got home at the same time on both devices!!! I'm not sure what you have experienced with other devices at motorway speeds, but with the software I use and with this phone, no problems.
As for the mirror finish, I don't have a need for a car cradle since my vehicles have integrated BlueTooth and Nav already installed. I would imagine that in the right circumstances, the mount position, the direction of travel, view of the sun, etc..., could temporarily create a glare porblem. I would think this to be a random and obscure issue, no worse of a cure than slightly adjusting your review mirror up or down if the lights behind you are a problem.
By the way, since you live in the UK, why be overly concerned with the three days of the summer that have direct, bright sun??? ( I lived in Leeds for three years )

@finesse asks these Questions:
1. Can you please take and post some pictures?
2. Have you experienced any problems with video playback & driver problems like the Kaiser?
3. Do you need to download gps info for the gps to work?
4. What is your opinion on the processor so far? battery killer? omap 200mhz on steroids?
5. Since you been using the phone for a while now, what are your pro's and con's?
Answers:
1) One new photo is attached. Is there something particular you want to see in a photo? Apart from the front face, it is pretty much what you expect to see.
2) See post above on video playback, no problems for me with this
3) Not really sure of your question on downloading GPS info, but the phone did not come with GPS software. I added Ostia by PharosGPS for my testing. This works exceptionally well with any PDA / phone I have evaluated.
4) I think the processor is superb. The phone is far more responsive than the original HTC Touch with the 201 MHz OMAP. I would not even think to play video on that one. In my experience, 400 MHz is near the bottom end for good video. As for the battery, I'm getting through the work day and still having 40-50% left with normal use (whatever that means). The battery is 1350mAH compared to 1100 mAH on the original Touch.
5) I will stand by my initial review for now as far as the pros and cons are concerned. No hidden downsides have imerged. I did not specifically state it but Touch Phones are fingerprint magnets (duh). So far though, not a scratch on it.

Hi Raskell,
You know I may be asking for too much but could you do a test for me. Can you please check what data transfer speeds can the Cruise reach with the EDGE network. Please note EDGE and not 3G. I am asking this as my TyTn II cannot get higher than 100 Kbs. When I place the sameSIM in my Touch, I can reach 200 Kbs. I have done these tests repeatedly but always the Touch is almost twice as fast compared to the TyTn II. Actually this is one of the reasons that I now want to dispose off my TyTn II and get the Cruise instead.
My only fear is that since both have Qualcomm processors and if my problem is because of the Qualcomm processor then changing to the Cruise may not be my solution.
I shall be extremely obliged and appreciate your help.

Speeds
@srmz
Using http://bandwidthplace.com/speedtest
HSDPA - 492kBps average of 3 tests 492/507/478
Edge - 208kBps average of 3 tests 178/239/208
Both tested using Opera Browser and nothing else running in the background.
(From my location with 2 bars of signal showing)
Hope this helps.

Thanks for the speed tests. I am sure I will get one as soon as it is available in my country. Thanks once again

Is the screen viewable under bright sunlight?
Hi Raskell,
There was the debate on the "transflectiveness" of the Kaiser screen. What is your experience with the cruise. How is the screen readability outdoors compared with proven true transflective screens? I am not an expert in these terms, but I simply want to know if you have to squint to read the screen under bright sunshine

victoradjei said:
Hi Raskell,
There was the debate on the "transflectiveness" of the Kaiser screen. What is your experience with the cruise. How is the screen readability outdoors compared with proven true transflective screens? I am not an expert in these terms, but I simply want to know if you have to squint to read the screen under bright sunshine
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is another thread over in the General area titled HTC Cruise is Here which was started before the Polaris was added. This phone is easily readable in direct sun and has also been tested beneath 250W Metal Halide bulbs at 6 inches, bot 20,000Kelvin (blue) rated and 13,000Kelvin (white) rated. The screen remains clearly viewable. I see no problem with this phone, unlike my HP digital camera which disappears under a flashlight!

Thanks for the info.
raskell said:
By the way, since you live in the UK, why be overly concerned with the three days of the summer that have direct, bright sun??? ( I lived in Leeds for three years )
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I live in London. We get few more days

raskell said:
By the way, since you live in the UK, why be overly concerned with the three days of the summer that have direct, bright sun??? ( I lived in Leeds for three years )
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is more to do with driving in dusk/dawn.
And if your car has a cream interior like mine then the problem becomes very pronouncing...

raskell
Thanks for taking time to do your review!!
1 more question....
Have you got used to not having a ''windows'' and ''ok'' button?
raskell said:
@finesse asks these Questions:
1. Can you please take and post some pictures?
2. Have you experienced any problems with video playback & driver problems like the Kaiser?
3. Do you need to download gps info for the gps to work?
4. What is your opinion on the processor so far? battery killer? omap 200mhz on steroids?
5. Since you been using the phone for a while now, what are your pro's and con's?
Answers:
1) One new photo is attached. Is there something particular you want to see in a photo? Apart from the front face, it is pretty much what you expect to see.
2) See post above on video playback, no problems for me with this
3) Not really sure of your question on downloading GPS info, but the phone did not come with GPS software. I added Ostia by PharosGPS for my testing. This works exceptionally well with any PDA / phone I have evaluated.
4) I think the processor is superb. The phone is far more responsive than the original HTC Touch with the 201 MHz OMAP. I would not even think to play video on that one. In my experience, 400 MHz is near the bottom end for good video. As for the battery, I'm getting through the work day and still having 40-50% left with normal use (whatever that means). The battery is 1350mAH compared to 1100 mAH on the original Touch.
5) I will stand by my initial review for now as far as the pros and cons are concerned. No hidden downsides have imerged. I did not specifically state it but Touch Phones are fingerprint magnets (duh). So far though, not a scratch on it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

finesse said:
Thanks for taking time to do your review!!
1 more question....
Have you got used to not having a ''windows'' and ''ok'' button?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes that's something I am worried about... I like the Touch Cruise but not the choice of removing so many hardware buttons... I don't want to use my fingers for everything!
I have a Trinity and I use the "windows" and "ok" buttons heavily... actually the Trinity has even a second "ok" button on the left side but I don't use that very often.
Edit: oh well... I have noticed that the two soft buttons have gone too!

raskell said:
There is another thread over in the General area titled HTC Cruise is Here which was started before the Polaris was added. This phone is easily readable in direct sun and has also been tested beneath 250W Metal Halide bulbs at 6 inches, bot 20,000Kelvin (blue) rated and 13,000Kelvin (white) rated. The screen remains clearly viewable. I see no problem with this phone, unlike my HP digital camera which disappears under a flashlight!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Strictly judging from your hands-on comments and I've read them all attentively, I think Polaris is THE device to put every other, including the iPhone, to shame. Congrats to you for a magnificent device and perhaps HTC if production models are anything like yours.

Is the battery the same as that of the Kaiser?
raskell said:
There is another thread over in the General area titled HTC Cruise is Here which was started before the Polaris was added. This phone is easily readable in direct sun and has also been tested beneath 250W Metal Halide bulbs at 6 inches, bot 20,000Kelvin (blue) rated and 13,000Kelvin (white) rated. The screen remains clearly viewable. I see no problem with this phone, unlike my HP digital camera which disappears under a flashlight!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks Raskell for the information.
I would also like to know if the battery is the same as that of the Kaiser. I see on expansys when I looked up the touch cruise accessories that it is the same as that listed for the kaiser

More Bandwidth testing data
Using http://utilities.globequest.com.ph/
Cruise (Edge & IExplorer) -> 605 Kbps (469/661/667)
Cruise (HSDPA & IExplorer) -> 746 Kbps (726/779/733)
Cruise (HSDPA & Opera) -> 145 Kbps (148/143/143)
Cruise (WiFi - phone off) -> 712 Kbps (724/680/733) **Using AT&T DSL and LinkSys WRT54G router**
This particular test site seems to be better configured for IExplorer. The prior test data from bandwidthplace would not run with IE. It is offline today so I can't retest.
Bottom line => Touch Cruise cruises the internet.

@finese
wrote: raskell
Thanks for taking time to do your review!! 1 more question....
Have you got used to not having a ''windows'' and ''ok'' button?
Answer: Not much to get used to, I never used them with my other devices.
If you really must have a button, the main action in the jog wheel acts as the 'OK' button. You can also configure GPS/Messaging button to be the 'Start' button. So they are there if you really want them.

I-Mate Ultimate 9502. Kaiser Killer?

I imagine in a similar way to many people in these forums I had hit a brick wall on PDA functionality. I was was waiting for Kaiser to be THE all in one and just as I was about to buy one I discovered the shortcomings. So, having sold my TyTn and bluetooth, solar GPS receiver I brought an Athena. Wonderful piece of kit but in the end it had to go as it was just too bulky.
Having heard that the 9502 was imminent I brought an HP 9515 to see me through to it's realease.
Two weeks ago I placed a pre-order for the 9502 with Powerupmobile as stock was due on the 24th and to my surprise (and slightly disturbing swelling in my manhood) it arrived last Friday (18th April) so I have had a weekend to play.
Out of the box the overriding feeling was 'heavy'. TyTn was ABS plastic but this is (and I stand corrected) magnesium alloy encased. Personally I find that comforting...remember when B&O put lead weights in their remotes to make the quality more tactile?
Runinng WM6 which we are all familiar with there are no real surprises except to say that the 640x480 screen IS beautiful!
Down the left hand side you have JOG Wheel and 'OK' button (very blackberry and very friendly) as well as a shortcut button to the wireless comms. The charging/hardwire comms facility (mini USB) is also present this side rather than on the southern aspect.
Down The right hand side is a '+' and '-' rocker switch for volume etc, voice memo and camera activation buttons as well as a 2.5mm stereo jack.
The stainless steel telescopic pointer is housed to the top right whilst the power button is on the top, horizontal face of the unit.
The face of the unit has buttons for MESSAGING, INTERNET, START, OK, RECEIVER UP AND DOWN and a FOUR WAY THUMB PAD + SELECTOR BUTTON. To access the MicroSD HC slot you have to remove the rear battery case, but not the battery itself.
Right
Left Back
Top
Bottom
Screen up
Battery exposed
On arrival I loaded all my usual software and all has worked fine with one exception...it seems that after using TomTom6, quitting the application and letting the unit timeout, it will not reactivate on the standard power depress. I have had to soft reset. I will make I-Mate aware of this.
-------I have subsequently discovered that this is a one off and the unit is being swapped out- 22-04-08-----------
All comms functions are manually startable so you have to remember to enable the GPS radio prior to starting your satnav software.
In much the way as TyTn an Kaiser the screen can be pushed to reveal a full QWERTY keyboard (though the numerics are still FN dependant) and the keyboard is backlit depending on the ambient lighting conditions.
The screen behaves more like a Samsung phone inasmuch as it 'flicks' up and down.
The reason I didn't buy Kaiser was because of the video playback problems dirctly attributable to the drivers for the Qualcomm hardware. What is ironic with the 9502 is that it is Qualcomm based but at 320x240 video plays back just fine. Using TCPMP to watch Star Wars Episode III with TCPMP in 'Raw Frame buffer mode' the movie was totally watchable. I will test 640x480 when I get time.
The GPS is easy to set up (on COM9 at either 5,400 or 115,000 baud) with more channels (and therefore more accuracy) than any other PDA I have used with an inbuilt receiver. The cold start time is between 15 secs and one minute depending on the normal constraints. There is no 'Quick GPS' facility.
I haven't been able to test HSDPA yet but all the radio's seem to give good reception so there's no reason to assume that throughput will be anything other than expected.
So, Kaiser Killer? For me, yes without doubt but don't forget this luurvely piece of kit hast only just been released. It WILL get better.
Now, who makes it?
PS if anyone wants me to test it anyway or wants more info, let me know.

Amazing!
Wow! This is one nice phone. I've been disappointed in my touch dual for some time now (eventhough Its not been too long since I bought it!) and been looking for a replacement but none of the phones I've seen look as 'sleek'.
I may just look into this one more.
I see that this one also has the same qualcomm chipset. What is the video playback like?
Does it have bad lag like all the other htc qualcomm pdas (like the touch dual)?
Does it slow down when you keep the screen pressed?
One more thing....I cant see it from any pictures, but is the screen beveled or is it flush with the sides?

Awesome. I've been wanting one of those since they were announced. After this little review you posted, I might think about actually getting one. Thanks

That be a bezelled screen me lad.

Duplicate post.

Duplicate post

Using TCPMP to watch video there were initially problems with a huge amount of frame ripping. This was quickly resolved by switching to from DiractDraw to GDI codec and upping the buffer to 4mb. This was at 320x240. Will try reformatting to 640x480 asap but I don't hold out a lot of hope that watchability will be as good.
Don't know what you mean by 'keep the screen pressed'.
It is indeed a bevelled screen surround.

Why does every new device got to be the "Kaiser" killer?
Also, what is with the internet and email buttons being by the ear speaker at the top? Everytime I answer a call I'm going to open an email.

By way of an update to the issue with TomTom6, it turns out that my unit is faulty. At random it won't come out of standby. Completely unpredicatable and unrelated to TomTom, it transpires. PowerupMobile.com have organised a direct swapout so hopefully it's just a bit of bad luck. Bodes well for Powerup Mobile though. I was concerned that as they were nearly £100 cheaper than expansys the service might not be as good. Great response from their tech guy/guys too.

If you put your phone yo your head with that kind of sustained pressure your in for serious ear problems.
Kaiser killer cause it's less money, a better product out of the box (4 x the screen resolution) and it all works as it's supposed to (with the exception of mine which is, of course, a one off problem). HTC have long been repackaging the same hardware and charging more and more for it with little increase in functionality. I was a hardened HTC fan as my PDA record shows, but to tout a unit as the most powerful of it's type, hike the price and then turn out a unit which is effectively a TyTn with a GPS and a video problem isn't too customer focused...stockholder focused perhaps; to then refuse to sort a DRIVER problem....firmware no less...tends to put one off. In my humble opinion, if a 'Kaiser Killer' comes along and forces HTC to turn out better products at a more competetive price, I'll be back with them.
Oh yeah, and it's a catchy title.

i´m also interested in this phone.
could you please upload some pics taken with the camera. best would be in dark light and with text.
thanks

Eurosportler said:
i´m also interested in this phone.
could you please upload some pics taken with the camera. best would be in dark light and with text.
thanks
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Will do. Give me 24 hrs though. By 'with text' I assume you mean a text imprint overlaid direct?

yes, that is what i meant with "text"
thank you for the fast response.

Could you please tell us how responsive is this device compared to the kaiser lets say. I mean do you have any problems of it being slow? I am asking because VGA screen resolution is sometimes a burden for processors and there are some examples of "slow" VGA devices.
Do you have memory leaking problems? I have heard a lot about the considerably low 30mb free RAM after a reboot, but if it remains there after starting and closing programs, I don't believe it is an issue.
Finally, could try to make some benchmarks and post the result. Try to use SPB or sktools so that there are comparable results.
Sorry for the long request message, but I seriously thinking of buying this device, and it is good to know some things before I finally decide.
Thanks!

I hate to burst your bubble, guys but since the technical specs(incl. CPU) are pretty much the same as on the Kaiser(HTC TyTN II), don't you think that i-mate just put Kaiser technology into a different(yes, nicer) outfit?! Just my 2 cents worth...

@P996: yes but you are missing the VGA spec which is something "different" to what we have seen up until now. Moreover, if imate has actually managed to use the processor efficiently so to cope with the VGA resolution demands, that we are talking about something completely new, considering the size and offers (GPS, wi/fi, VGA, keyboard). I don't think there is something similar in the market now and all its offers are called new technology.
@edenc: sorry but I have on more question . I have also read some comments about battery life. Do you think it is ok, or it might be an issue? How does it compare again to the kaiser lets say?

Diamond killer???
lol
just read the thread.. sorry

Oh its completely a Kaiser Killer. Everything about it is better. All my mates who have a Kaiser want my 9502, but the video drivers are still shockingly bad (sorry to sound like a broken record). I never even considered a Kaiser - it seemed like a downgrade from the Hermes in terms of the features that I regularly use.
The 9502 can play perfect qvga video, but it looks rubbish on the VGA screen. Other than that (and no SDHC support) this is, in my opinion much better than anything that is currently on the market, and will be until the X1 comes out.

ya. cant wait for X1 with 3" 800x480 WVGA!
compare to that fake diamond at 2.8" VGA 640x480! haha

you may also want to repost your article to http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=351788

Considering Orbit 2...a few questions

I currently have a Blue Angel and I'm considering upgrading to an Orbit 2.
How would the performance compare between the 2? They're both 400MHz, but I just wondered how the Qualcomm is compared to the XScale?
Apart from the video driver issue, are there any other problems with it? I'd mainly be usig it for a phone, and running Tomtom.
Thanks!

Seriously... Don't bother!

LOL...it's that bad?
Can you explain why?

You will miss your qwerty. I don't know your Blue Angel, But my TC (i think all PocketPCs) has a delay when somebody calls you. Your phone will ring/vibrate after the one who calls you hears the first ring. So if somebody just gives you a call with one ring (bip) you won't hear it! Is it the same in your case, or mine is special? Maybe somebody else with TC can confirm/infirm this...

Yea, mine sort of have that sort of dealy.
I don't use my QWERTY keyboard anyway so that's not a problem.

the_scotsman said:
LOL...it's that bad?
Can you explain why?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just everything about it...
The build quality is terrible. Feels like a new hobbyist threw it together in 5 mins.
It seriously underperforms compared to my Old SE P990i and older XDA's
The modifications o2 have made to the software are rubbish.
I'm miffed I didn't hold out for the SE X1i

^ In your opinion, yes its not perfect, the screen is less than ideal but the build quality is great I think. Much better than my old SE P series phone which used to creak whenever squeezed etc and the flush screen is better than orbit 1
But I would hold out for the Diamond

I want the built in GPS, and the Diamond prices ae too much for what it is...
Any other decent HTCs with built in GPS?

the_scotsman said:
I currently have a Blue Angel and I'm considering upgrading to an Orbit 2.
How would the performance compare between the 2? They're both 400MHz, but I just wondered how the Qualcomm is compared to the XScale?
Apart from the video driver issue, are there any other problems with it? I'd mainly be usig it for a phone, and running Tomtom.
Thanks!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've just switched from a Hermes/Tytn to the Orbit2. HardSPL'd it and installed the WM6.1 that's been floating about here and installed TomTom.
Losing the keyboard is a bit annoying (on screen is usable, but nowhere near as good) - but I realized I very rarely typed anything and smaller sized massively outweighs it.
GPS works very well - especially as Quick GPS which really does work.
Downsides:
Lost keyboard.
Upsides:
GPS - now just not having to lug around and charge my BT GPS module, but now much faster and lets me do all manner of stuff (geo-tag photos with a reg tweak), GPS trackers allowing me to see where I've been in google maps blah blah.
Much better camera - not so much the 2M -> 3M change - but AUTOFOCUS.
SMALLER - now it's not a small phone, but it's not an f'in brick like the last one.
No real difference noticed between the processors. Latest 6.1 I put on my Hermes made it lovely and snappy - and performs exactly the same on the Polaris. Only reservation I've got with the polaris is the screen res (i.e. same old rubbish). Not entirely convinced Hi-res WM is much better though after playign with colleagues PDAs - I've got an ipod touch and THAT is what i'd want somehow wedged into my phone..
In summary, if you want a phone now, I'd definitely get the XDA. If you can wait maybe see how Diamond and 3G iPhone stack up.
#edit - and build quality on my XDA (at least) is perfect. Nice solid feeling thing, love the slightly rubberized case.

Thanks very much for your opinion...I think I might just go with the Orbit 2 after all...a VGA screen would be nice, but I'm happy enough to have the standard one...and it's a little smaller than my BLue Angel so that's always a benefit.

Seriously this is an outstanding device. Software is software and any issues can 99% of the time be sorted with it and normally are, especially when you browse around these forums. Also bare in mind that all these devices now use windows mobile so I don't understand why someone would fault the Orbit 2 over another windows mobile device because of the software it comes with.....anyway the hardware itself is exceptional, I've posted a mini review if you look through my post history and there's plenty of in-depth reviews out there.
Losing the keyboard is a good thing in my opinion. A keyboard isn't necessary, its just as easy (if not easier) to use the software input (my personal preference is a T9 style pad that learns words and is very quick to use with just one hand like a normal phone) and obviously you save on weight and bulk.
The Orbit 2 looks great, is extremely responsive and comfortable to use and in my opinion is the best windows mobile device availible at this time.
Quick edit! - regarding the SW, the rom that the O2 Orbit 2 comes with is actually fine anyway, i've never encountered any issues with it - it would be nice to have the threaded SMS that 6.1 has but aside from that its fine and works great. Cheers!

SOunds like you're pretty damn happy with it then
So the 200MHz processor isn't an issue? Still responds well? Thing like TOmtom run well?

The Orbit 2 has a 400MHz CPU, it was the original Orbit that had 200 -it also has twice the amount of memory. TomTom was perfectly useable on the original Orbit but it noticeably runs smoother on the Orbit 2 - The Orbit 2 is a lot better at managing multiple tasks at the same time.
I was in two minds before upgrading becasue I had the original Orbit and wasn't sure if I'd get my money's worth. I was going to send it back if I wasn't happy with it. I'm more than happy with it though as you can tell! its a great device. You've always got that 14 day cooling period with O2 anyway so you may as well give it a go for yourself.

doh...you're right...I was thinking of the original Orbit.
No 14 day cooling off for me..I'm in Australia so the only way to get at a decent price is eBay.
I think I've been convinced to get the Orbit 2...just a pity it doesn't have VGA...and the diamond will probably be a fair amount more than the Orbit 2

Actually a the Diamond will be cheaper then the Polaris/Orbit2... But my oppinion is that the VGA is too much on a 2.8" screen...

The Orbit 2 is a damn good toy... after tuning the cache and graphic settings..speed was even better than before..
also gps works great...a lot of stuff in a small little case...

I am also happy with my orbit 2, copilot in mo is better then tomtom i have both installed.
I like golive's interface and extra settings plus the website for tracking is a good feature.
The Software available is none stop from here and other sources, unlike the iphone i had that you could only load decentish software if you hacked it..
a couple of minor gripes, the screen is a little shiny for sunny day use and the camera could be alot better.
apart from that i am very happy with it, let hops the diamond touch flo 3d becomes available then that will make this device look great.
the hsdpa speed is great when in the right areas, 50k download speed from my laptop...
the gps seems acurate enough, fast on a warm start as well.
its performance could be a little better but overall its very good.
I would install opera mini as i have found this much better then ie and opera mobile for day to day use.
as for the missing keyboard, try touchpal or the diamond keyboards, also make sure you adjust the sensivity of the screen do a search on here, i think the keyboard is great been software as you can load loads of different types and type quicker with the stylus on some over a flip out keyboard.
the flip out keyboard types can be a little thicker as well you cannot replace or remap keys like a software keyboard so there are plus's and minus's to both concepts...
if you type alot then get a bluetooth keyboard, or a laptop.....
i don't think you will b unhappy with your purchase...

Actually imho any HTC device when just introduced will very rarely be upto my expectation and initially i am always dissapointed,for the first few days,its just a matter of customizing(a heart felt thanks to this forum for teaching us how too) to our personal choice and then i just can't seem to live without them.When i took the Cruise i returned it the next day,very dissapointed with the handset,nothing it could do(and in the factory state it could'nt domuch)was enough,I thought that my Kaiser was far better,then after going through the Cruise forum went and picked it up again,customized it and now wonder how did I ever think negatively abbout this handset,I just love it the feel of it in my hand and also the perfomance,ended up keeping both the Kaiser and Cruise without regrets.

HTC Touch Pro Owners' Poll

Hey guys,
Although I am not among you, I think it would be extremely helpful/eye-opening to conduct a poll of all current HTC Touch Pro owners who have had their device for enough time to make an initial assessment of the device's quality. That means probably at least a week--but use your own discretion. Just a few suggested guidelines:
Don't let the initial euphoria blur your judgment
Think for a few moments before submitting a vote
Compare, if possible, the quality of the device to, say, that of an iPhone, if you've ever owned one or used it extensively, to provide a point of reference.
I look forward to hearing everyone's input!
-Steve

I think it would be helpful if you clarified what you mean by "device quality". Hardware, software, reception, screen, input, battery, performance, etc. Maybe you're asking for "all of the above", but at least it would help people approach it catagorically -- that way people can speak to specific things that have made an impression on them.

It's the best i've used, and the best there is on the market at this moment. I've shut off TF3D though and replaced it with Mobile Shell. Now using it with great pleasure.

With the exception of the "sleeve" and somewhat slow GPS, I am very pleased with my TP.

Great device, and i bet there is more to come with some updates in the near future. That's the reason I voted Above Avarage.
As far as functionality goes, it has all I want: telephone, mail, internet and navigation. Next to that there is a lot of software out there.
A few quircks here and there ofcourse. Like almost instant fixes with Google Maps...and 15 to 20 minutes GPS fixing time with Tom Tom 7.
Battery life could be better as well
I would have liked to add some today plugins into TF3D, or be able to add new tabs

fhsieh said:
I think it would be helpful if you clarified what you mean by "device quality". Hardware, software, reception, screen, input, battery, performance, etc. Maybe you're asking for "all of the above", but at least it would help people approach it catagorically -- that way people can speak to specific things that have made an impression on them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah; I was thinking about doing a categorical breakdown, but in the end, that would have taken a lot of polls.
I hope this is sufficient.

two big problems:
1. battery consumption
2. signal reception

othersteve said:
Yeah; I was thinking about doing a categorical breakdown, but in the end, that would have taken a lot of polls.
I hope this is sufficient.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, maybe not with the poll, but at least for any comments. I mean everyone has different needs and expectations for the device so it'll be hard to judge the poll accurately without seeing some objective testimony.
But what am I babbling about, here's some of my thoughts:
- Not the most solid handheled device I've had (my old iPaq hx4700 was a tank), but it comes very close and is definitely not a cheap build. Better than the Blackjack and some Blackberries, but I haven't spent very much time with those and I certainly don't know how well the TPro's build will last over time.
- WM6.1 isn't perfect, but then XDA is very active. Plus there are apps for just about anything you need. I spent some time with a Nokia N800, and while it's nice that Maemo is (almost) completely open-source -- which makes for an equally active community -- you're plain out of luck if no one is developing something you need. Namely, the software probably exists on standard Linux distros, but very little of it has been ported to Maemo. This is the same reason I decided not to jump on the Android bandwagon right away.
- Finally, I now have one device that does everything I needed my old devices to do. US phone (Nokia 6300), Japan phone (SE W43S), electronic dictionary (hx4700), internet device (hx4700/N800), mp3 player.
- Same observations as others: GPS is laggy, though not really an issue since I only use it as a pedestrian; battery life isn't impressive. I will probably buy a USB battery pack later.

So far v.happy, just need to solve the backlight issue when in call, and the Sim contacts list.

I've had my TP for almost 3 weeks now - it was one of the first on the market. I have used HTC qwerty based devices for several years now and this is by far the best device. I dearly loved my Tytn II but the hardware in this device is much better.
I own a 3G iPhone also and while this device is definitely a joy to use it is far from ever replacing my TP as my preference business device.
I decided to continue to run the 3D flow against other utilities but it's far from perfect - however developed with the correct user feedback it will be a great tool.
While 6.1 runs quite smoothly on the device the interface obviously lets the device down. I also have had a few lockups but no more than other devices.
The battery is pretty shocking to be honest. I use a scheduler to shut down BT and even the radio stack at night to preserve battery but to be honest if I were going away for anymore that 24 hours I would have to take a charger.
GPS has has been quick to locate a signal but I've encountered issues with TT6 \ and or Googlemaps. I currently run IGO8 and it runs very well.
Finally this device has a half-decent web browser on it - Opera mobile is great. IE mobile is a shambles.
Micro SD is essential - currently running an 8GB card with all my music, apps and vids. No idea why they left it off the Diamond - crazy in my opinion.
If anyone has any quick questions I'd be happy to answer them.

I was hoping by going with a non-American device (which has three times the processor of its American counterparts), I would have a more stable device. Overall, best phone I've ever had. A little disappointed that I need to soft reset every couple of days.
Don't regret it...leaps and bounds over my previous device.

Wow guys, thanks a ton for the feedback so far. This is extremely informative stuff to all of us prospective buyers. Personally, I'll be getting the phone through our Sprint corporate account, but as with everything that's a significant investment I have been trying to read up as much as possible on it beforehand to accurately set my expectations and prepare myself for problems that will need to be solved.
I use SPB Mobile Shell on my Mogul right now, and while I like it, I love the flair of TouchFlo3D... I just hope it is equally useful and quick (so far to that end it seems to be not quite as useful). I think I will try replacing the default contact manager on my Pro with Finger-Friendly Friends provided that will work all right. I also hope that the US release a month or so from now will see additional improvements in terms of software stability and speed (though probably not battery life).
Apart from that, I'm quite excited about everything I have read about the device. And I've always been a sucker for statistics, so having a poll on such an educated and active forum is of remarkable interest.
-Steve

The best device that I ever owned.
Like others I´m having some troubles with the GPS (reception time) and other issues like the screen going of of on a call.

So far I kinda like it.
Nevertheless I'll vote in the pole and give a complete feedback as soon as HTC repairs it (I have a sound problem...)

Hows the sound quality of the internal speaker?
Greetings
LordK

The only problem of the internal speaker is that the volume is a little bit low (compared to my colleagues' blackberrys)

Rated it Above Average!
I am using the TP for 2 weeks now. I've experienced the 'broken glass' screen and the grey-screen once.
The device is pretty quick and TF3D works nice although there are some moment when it does something completely different than what i wanted it to do.
Issues i like to see solved:
- Album cover view in TF3D music tab
- Fix for lag with TomTom
- Battery usage
Things I love:
- Memory
- Speed
- Screen
- Keyboard

I've had mine 3 weeks so far, upgrading from my beloved HTC Universal. It's a great machine but I'm not blind to it's faults, I Like Touch Flo a lot but it's just a thin layer over old ugly windows mobile.
As powerful as it is it just isn't as responsive as an iPhone, way too sluggish, expect the usual windows mobile pauses and spinning wait cursor.
The screen is too small, I liked my big screened Universal but the screen is such high quality it goes some way to making up for being small (it really is crisp).
The keyboard is ok but it's a thumbboard, I won't be knocking out the emails I used to on it. The slide action is distinctly wobbly to me, not bad, but not the decisive slide movement I expected. The onscreen keyboard is surprisingly usable much more so than the bigger IPhone one.
Memory is fantastic, loads of it, I never bother shutting things down which I was always doing on the universal.
Lockups, yup a disappointing number but a definate improvement on the universal.
GPS, not really a problem, it seems fast, but as far as I can see tomtom5 doesn't initialise the built in gps reciever so I start googlemaps, get a fast lock then switch to tomtom I notice tomtom6 has an option for built in GPS.
Lack of headphone socket is a crazy omission, it's driving me crazy and was almost a factor in not buying it, it's only 10 quid for an adaptor but just something else to carry.
The opera browser is pretty good and responsive but the icons it uses are way too chunky considering the screen is so small, talking of chunky, the menus are all pretty huge, I found how to make the start menu smaller but most menus now eg messaging, need arrows at the top and bottom to scroll the duplo vision menus into place. Also needed a hack to get googlemail working and is so small that almost every site needs a zoom to read it whereas I found I could read a lot of sites on the iPhone without zooming.
I also hate the mini sd card being hidden inside the case, it makes changing cards a pain, I'd also rather have an sd card, for the sake of a little bit bigger unit.
I never considered the IPhone because it has no physical keyboard and it was unable to run GotoMyPC but the difference between the IPhone and the Touch Pro is responsiveness, given it's a more powerful machine it's a damning indictment of windows mobile that it's so sluggish.

I just hope that there's an Android rom released for the Raphael. I'll be getting the ATT Touch Pro (or is it still considered the 'Fuze'?) when it's available as I've been drooling over the TP for a long time now. I'll deal with WM6.1 as long as I have to, but I really like Android, and would switch to it in a heartbeat.

veljko.m said:
two big problems:
1. battery consumption
2. signal reception
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Vote 1 from me
Touch flow is nothing to write home about either.
using people favorites and Active Sync hates the photos you asign to them so that becomes a waste of time.

HTC Touch Pro2

What do you think?
There aren't much changes compare to the HTC Touch Pro... It's a real turn off for me. I don't even feel like I want to change phone.
- Different Design (I prefer the diamond back cover)
- The Tilt is back (YAY!).
- Bigger Screen, 3.6" instead of 2.8", and it's thinner
- It's Heavier than the HTC Touch Pro
- Processor "Qualcomm® MSM7200A™, 528 MHz" Instead of "Qualcomm® MSM7201A™, 528 MHz" (Same Speed thou)
- Memory and RAM are the same (Disappointed)
- Faster Download Speed, Europe/Asia: 900/2100 MHz (no America yet, but I'm sure they will come up with something)
- Camera is the same (so disappointed)
I was so eager to change phone from the Tilt to Touch Pro, but not to this phone... Except for the bigger Screen. The Good new is the phone seem to be cheap. So is it time to sell my Fuze yet?
Join this Facebook group if you have nothing else to do
Youtube review

And additionnaly, there's no more D-PAD.
That's the same reason why I didn't go for the Touch HD.
I don't understand this "everything touch" trend.
I love the touchscreen, but I like being able to use the D-PAD for gaming, scrolling through list items and then "right clicking" an item, etc.

mysterd said:
And additionnaly, there's no more D-PAD.
That's the same reason why I didn't go for the Touch HD.
I don't understand this "everything touch" trend.
I love the touchscreen, but I like being able to use the D-PAD for gaming, scrolling through list items and then "right clicking" an item, etc.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
x2.
I hate not having a D-Pad. What if I don't want to smudge up my screen? A D-pad is a must-have for me.

I replaced an iPhone and a Tilt with a Touch Pro (Fuze) and I *really* miss the larger screen of the iPhone and the ability to tilt the screen. From everything I've read, I will be buying a TP2 as soon as it's available in the US for less than a fortune. Slingplayer will look fabulous on it, I'm sure.
The "everything touch" trend is real easy to understand. iPhone. Period. If it wasn't for Apple, I'd probably have gotten a new one instead of opting for a Fuze. But since Apple insists on treating iPhone users as if they're retarded, I moved on.

I love the bigger screen design but would miss the D-pad, love the tilt (but it is another thing to break) but i dont like the lack of new features (camera the same, same processor speed, same ram, same memory???) seems like they are tryin to pull a iPhone 3G on us... same phone minor improvements

How well do you suppose the camera will function? Do you think we will be able to learn anything from the Touch Pro 2 camera code/functionality that will help us improve the original Touch Pro camera?

pandaboyy said:
- Camera is the same (so disappointed)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
camera is not exactly the same as it wont have a flash, even more disappointing.
the tilting screen is a great thing, as i really miss the tilting screen of the tilt (kaiser)

Not worth it for me...
For me it's simple...
SAME camera (with no 30fps video)
+ SAME processor speed
+ SAME RAM
+ NO enhanced graphics
+ NO fixed GPS lag
----------------
Waste of $$$
Even when and IF they come out with a US 3G model, my money will be staying in my wallet.

And it's stil on WM6.1, so disapointed.
I'm getting bore of my Fuze, I want to change to a new phone, but there isn't any good reason for me to do so... I'm so bored

For me, the return of the tilt screen and a large screen itself make it worth my money. The camera is nothing to me, I use a real camera anyway. What price marks are we seeing for this phone?

While I appreciate the bigger screen, I am not sure how responsive the device would be with higher resolution and same processor since we all know HTC doesn't believe in video acceleration / drivers in business phones.

TP2 is the reason my TP will live longer in my pocket, plus I am looking for other brands (AGAIN).
WHERE IS MY D-PAD!?
...and why limit it to 3.2MP when every other model has 5?
...and where is the flash!?
No thanks.

KevinACrider said:
For me, the return of the tilt screen and a large screen itself make it worth my money. The camera is nothing to me, I use a real camera anyway. What price marks are we seeing for this phone?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't care much about camera either, but I care a lot about the speed. However, i agreed with you for the big screen...
Anyway, to answer your question about the price, this website is selling it for $750, which I think it's reasonable for a new phone. Check before you buy, I think it only works for Europe and Asia so far.

The bigger screen and the Tilt feature are big pluses for me, but the lack of D-pad is just weird. Also, I have a strong feeling that 2009 and 2010 will reveal alot of amazing devices from other manufacturers...plus HTC might release somethign else that is better. I currently have a Fuze and I think I will just wait. I want to see how WM7 pans out. I sold my iPhone for $400 and I'm saving the money for something that really deserves it. If I still had my Tilt, I would probably upgrade to the TP2, but from a Fuze to a TP2 doesn't make much sense to me.

Well...HTC lost me on this TP2. Not this time...

I honestly like the first Touch Pro more. I don't like the roundedness...I prefer sharp angles. It looks too fat lol.

I love the new Tilt design, it looks more tilted, but I personally prefer the diamond sharp on the back of my Fuze. And the USB slot look too UGLY, it's just coming out too much. I take back what I said about the Camera, I do use the camera on my device a lot lately, mostly because of the fast upload to Facebook.
Join this Facebook group guys...
Seeing the big screen on this youtube, really make me want it now

Gimme your advice about the D-PAD problem : what do you use instead of it, for example for gaming and so on ? I mean, if you want to control some game emulator, do you use on screen buttons ? As the current devices are not multitouch (I don't want to speak about some well known IwannabeaPHONE), i don't think these are suitable for proper gaming.
Maybe the simple answer is "I don't use my device for gaming...".
What do you think ?

"Some" emulator programs allow onscreen virtual Dpads... but without multitouch, you'll be unable to simultaneously press onscreen buttons.
All games are different though. Some are simply point and click games which don't require a dpad. Others work well without a Dpad.
Most games will flat out be impossible to use.
I came from the Samsung Epix with its Optical Dpad/Mouse... to the Fuze for the Dpad. I later found that the Dpad isn't really a Dpad... but a touchscreen with optical sensors (which is why the Dpad on the fuze sucks; but at least it is a functioning dpad).
I swore my next phone will have a physical dpad and a jog wheel.

player911 said:
I swore my next phone will have a physical dpad and a jog wheel.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm surprised how few WM devices have a jog wheel; my last one was a FSC Loox 720 and a jog wheel was one of its major positive points back then. It hardly seems like it would be an expensive or difficult control to add, but I guess it's not free and so there's something for HTC to gain by not including one.
I also prefer the diamond back of the Touch Pro, not that the Vario IV has it anyway though (not clear why they had to change that).