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switching to smartphone

Hi guys,
I was a long xda owner, got almost all xda models from the first til magician and find it really addictive. But I was wondering since wm2005 won't come out for my magician, not the official one at least so i decided to switch to smartphones. But i really have some humps in this matter. well these are the questions i sum up for u guys kind enough to answer and thanks in advance:
1. What are the main advantage of pocketpc phone over smartphone (beside the touch screen) word and excel (since i never use them anyways)
2. whats the best smartphone to date (i live in asia btw) and its gotta be windows mobile 5 oh and with camera at least 1.3mp and i dont really care if its qvga or anything, just want it small size oh, and if possible not silver please (my mini gets easily corroted since i live in bangkok or jakarta - both are high humid places)
3. Is this a wise decision? my main reason of switching was mainly because of the size (even mini is too big and heavy for me) and now most of the time i never use the stylus and use my finger instead to navigate, or sometimes the buttons.. i really need a one-handed operational device.
thanks for your input guys, i will decide based on your comments. thanks again
::adit

1. more cpu juice and more ram and more applications i guess
2. check out Tornado forum it seem to have much of youre requirements
3. different people different needs different tastes different answers to this question

hey rudegar, thanks for your opinion, yeah i'm looking at tornado right now, but unfortunately its not yet available here in asia, well bangkok... and well different opinions, thats why i created this thread, to know what u think of it, like whats ur opinion if u are given 2 devices, one pocket pc and one smartphone, they both are equally priced the main difference is size or touch screen. For the application, yes I believe that pocket pc has much more apps than smartphones but have anyone ever used them all, I mean productive apps, most pocketpc users uses almost the applications that smartphones also has? well except for games but right now my opinion smartphone has more advantage to its brother, pocket pc. Do I hear other voices? can I be proven wrong about this? thanks you guys...
::adit

I am waiting for the Tornado too. It isn't out anywhere yet and no set release date but people say next month.

well i would get a pocketpc phone over a smartphone because the only cellphone i ever had which were not a pocketpc was a really really really old motorola which dident even have t9
and some programs i know i cant get for smartphones like the hp48 emulator which i love very much so i dont have to carry around my old hp48 as well
so basicly a touchscreen is important for me and
a big screen is also nice
but i dont really know much about the tonado apart from it's spcs which look pretty sweet

I think the difference is that the XDA range are Primarily Pocket PC's with phone functions tagged on, and in many cases, not too well. Whereas a Smartphone is primarily a phone with Pocket PC features.

I think the difference is that the XDA range are Primarily Pocket PC's with phone functions tagged on, and in many cases, not too well. Whereas a Smartphone is primarily a phone with Pocket PC features.

Hi cruisin-thru,
Yes, I believe everyone knows that at the moment, but with microsoft renaming both to be "windows mobile" so i think they're getting to a point where theres no difference between both except for the touch screen (usability) and not the OS or application (functionality). Well as we all know, it quite far from it, but at this moment, u can find most of ppc apps in the smartphone, or similar to it with same functions. Oh btw, i checked out HTC tornado.. its a nice piece of hardware but I didn't like the model for the 'm' or normal version thanks guys...
::adit

The Tornado can also run Pocket PC apps if im correct, but they won't work
perfectly cause of the absence of a touchscreen.
I have to say this, I own a MDA Compact (Qtek S100 ) for almost 6
months now.... and since I bought a W800i to just use as cameraphone, I
haven't touched my MDA Compact. It felt like a huge relieve to finally use
a REAL phone again. I can't explain it, it's just a feeling. Everything feels so
much stable and logical. With the MDA Compact I have a continous feeling
that it could crash any second although that has NEVER happened before. I
had a S60 smartphone before this PPC, but if I ever buy another
smartphone, it'll be something like the Tornado. I made the mistake to be
obsessed by specs and forget about quality. Yeaah, the Wizard will have
WIFI, 2.0MP camera, MP3 player, etc. But this doesn't mean it will work
perfectly or deliver great quality. The W800i's camera is truely amazing,
the MP3 playback kills my MDA Compact's, etc.
Btw does someone know if the smartphone version of WM5.0 again has this
horrible thing that apps don't close and have to be closed by using the
taskmanager?

if the other smartphone versions work that way i would say yes
ms dident announce any changes of such nature with 2005
that i know off anyway

It makes sense to keep the program active for fast switching and is great when multitasking, however it makes no sense when you take into account the memory constraints. It would be nice if the option to exit or minimise to background was an option.

Best WM device for its money?!

Hey there guys,
New to this great Comunity, still new to Windows Mobile.
I'm a tech geek alright, and I love having all the newest tech gadgets around. I've wanted to get a WM phone so many times throughout the last few years but they were always behind in lots of aspects compared to the Symbian ones. Then HTC released its TyTNII with its holy specs, great design and somewhat compact size. This was my phone! Yeah, right! Then I found out about this huge issue with the video performance and followed it for about three monts waiting for a solution either from HTC or XDA. And OK - HTC had some problems with Qualcomm support for its stolen from Broadcomm chipsets whatever. So they released Diamond (and announced Raphael) with a new chipset and "3D GPU" which "processor enhances the user interface". And then again it needs tweaks to make it - not better, but just usable. Then all the other bugs and flaws users say about in this forum.
Can't HTC build a quality device that just works out of the box?! Then leave it to us mostly to customize it and somehow improve its usability!? Man, everyday I read about newer and bigger bugs and flaws. May be most of them will be overcomed thanks to this comunity, but were is HTC with its support for its high-priced devices!?
And again I'm about to leave the idea of having WM phone.
I've looked around for any other brands and models but found none more appealing. What do you think? What's the best WM device I can get in the next few months?
Any opinions are much appreciated.

To be honest, I've grown quite tired of Windows Mobile. I used to like it more, but it seems like I spent way too much time getting things to work. Also, the interface is very user UN-friendly, which makes doing simple tasks like calling someone too time consuming. Then there is the random freeze ups like the one I had today, which caused me to miss 5 calls and no warning lights or anything.
I like the cusomizabilty, but sometimes, I just want something that works right out of the box. Also, performance wise, all of the HTC/WM phones I've used are sluggish. (My mogul, friend's 6700, another friend's Kaiser/TyTnII). The redraw time when you flip out the keyboard is rediculous, specially if you have a few plugins.
Overall, I may give one more WM phone a try, if I am impressed by it at the store. But I doubt it. I just don't see Microsoft doing any innovations since they hold the crown as far as market share goes in the U.S. Maybe when an Android phones comes out...

partyhardy said:
To be honest, I've grown quite tired of Windows Mobile. I used to like it more, but it seems like I spent way too much time getting things to work. Also, the interface is very user UN-friendly, which makes doing simple tasks like calling someone too time consuming. Then there is the random freeze ups like the one I had today, which caused me to miss 5 calls and no warning lights or anything.
I like the cusomizabilty, but sometimes, I just want something that works right out of the box. Also, performance wise, all of the HTC/WM phones I've used are sluggish. (My mogul, friend's 6700, another friend's Kaiser/TyTnII). The redraw time when you flip out the keyboard is rediculous, specially if you have a few plugins.
Overall, I may give one more WM phone a try, if I am impressed by it at the store. But I doubt it. I just don't see Microsoft doing any innovations since they hold the crown as far as market share goes in the U.S. Maybe when an Android phones comes out...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Give blackberry a chance They've never failed me. Infact, I had my HTC Touch Dual for about a month before switching back. lol.

calling someone is too complicated?
1.) hit the green button
2.) start tapping away or choose speed dial
3.) hit the green button
its similar to what other phones want from you in order to know who you want to call. If thats too complicated, you may also try voice commander?
that beeing said, I am very happy with my new i-mate 9502, but I also considered the samsung i780 and it looks like people who bought it are very happy with it, especially with the form factor and performance.
edit: key for me with winMo devices are things like hardware keys, to reach functions quickly, using a good launcher/today setup like pocketplus +
phoneweaver + todayagenda, etc. and a nice hardware keyboard.

partyhardy said:
simple tasks like calling someone too time consuming. Then there is the random freeze ups like the one I had today, which caused me to miss 5 calls and no warning lights or anything.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Calling is simple, one button... de ding "call simon mobile" etc.
The no error message and not getting calls though is an issue i dislike.
I want a "nippy" device we need better hardware to run the software and better software optimisation for the hardware.

i just bought htc touch enhanced couple of days ago, and for the price it's great. Now with the Diamond coming out, htc touch is getting cheaper, but it's great to use nontheless.
Installed some stuff on it, not enough to make it sluggish but enough to make it a pure pleasure to use and i would definitely recommend it.
Prekrasen telefon za tzenata si.

partyhardy said:
To be honest, I've grown quite tired of Windows Mobile. I used to like it more, but it seems like I spent way too much time getting things to work. Also, the interface is very user UN-friendly, which makes doing simple tasks like calling someone too time consuming. Then there is the random freeze ups like the one I had today, which caused me to miss 5 calls and no warning lights or anything.
I like the cusomizabilty, but sometimes, I just want something that works right out of the box. Also, performance wise, all of the HTC/WM phones I've used are sluggish. (My mogul, friend's 6700, another friend's Kaiser/TyTnII). The redraw time when you flip out the keyboard is rediculous, specially if you have a few plugins.
Overall, I may give one more WM phone a try, if I am impressed by it at the store. But I doubt it. I just don't see Microsoft doing any innovations since they hold the crown as far as market share goes in the U.S. Maybe when an Android phones comes out...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But why cusomizabilty has to be at the expense of stability? Is it imposible to have a device that is performing great out of the box and has the potential to get improved usability by applications and custom tweaks? That would be the device for me. Don't get me wrong. I'm no mass user, I would consider myself as a techie business user and as such I need a device that I can rely on from the moment I buy it. I don't have the comfort to spend a small fortune and experiment weeks, even months with tweaking it just to make it work properly. I've always thought of WM as of business devices but I guess I was wrong.

demonizator said:
But why cusomizabilty has to be at the expense of stability? Is it imposible to have a device that is performing great out of the box and has the potential to get improved usability by applications and custom tweaks? That would be the device for me. Don't get me wrong. I'm no mass user, I would consider myself as a techie business user and as such I need a device that I can rely on from the moment I buy it. I don't have the comfort to spend a small fortune and experiment weeks, even months with tweaking it just to make it work properly. I've always thought of WM as of business devices but I guess I was wrong.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Note that the people that use this site are not those that are going to say "my device is great" and then go away... The kind of people here are either those not satisfied, or those that want a little bit more from the hard ware and are not representative of all the device users.
The Diamond is an immensely powerfully device, and even with the UI stacked on top, it ticks away far more reliably than the iPhone (which for me just locked up a lot). If you don't like the UI, disable it and you'll have one of the most powerful WM devices there is...
WM devices don't need tweaking, but this site is devoted to tweaking them. I ran my Prophet perfectly happily on the stock WM5 ROM for over a year, before discovering this site to get it unlocked when the contract ended. I didn't need to tweak it or flash countless ROMs, but I wanted to...

I really hope you're right. I'm gonna wait a little bit more and get the Touch Pro version. It's just all these flaws I read about that stopped me from buying WM the past few years. But I guess I have to give up something to gain something more.

Maybe you want to take a look to the new Samsung. It seems as it's going to be a good device.
http://www.pdadb.net/index.php?m=specs&id=1039

WM6 for the money?
I bought a Dash on ebay and upgraded it to WM6 for $150.00.
I have a Mogul now, but the Dash was way easier to use.

In terms of bang-for-the-buck I think the Samsung i780 takes the cake. It is the most specced out phone in that price category. And if you buy one today it will have the newer firmware so it shouldn't have any real issues.
Oh and calling people on a WiMo phone is far easier than any other phone. Voice Command baby. It's the reason I can't leave the WiMo platform even if there are other great choices like the iPhone, Blackberry or even the all-but-dead Palm Treos. And if you DON'T like using Voice Command come on it's very easy to call someone as mentioned. In fact, back when Nokia had crap for menus and directional pads to get to your contacts WiMo phones had touchscreens that made it really easy in comparison. Today the touchscreen is still easier to use than the various jog dials, joysticks or what not that conventional phones have.

+1 for the i780. It is by far the quickest and most responsive PPC I have ever used, and the form factor is perfect. No rotating screens to wait for, all the keyboard shortcuts you could want, terrific build quality, good battery life, bargain price, and none of the HTC Flo-bloat that turns their machines from reasonable PPCs into lagging, crash-happy iPhone wannabes.

I gotta add a +2 for the I780 as well.
I was holding out for a touch pro myself, in fact i cut out a picture of it and put it on my wall at the office. Iv'e owned quite a few HTC models over the last while as well as a I600, and i gotta say the I600 altho it had less functionality far outshined all but my tytn 2, altho the tytn 2 could not match the I600 im picture quality with the camera.
Last week i was in vodacom shop and saw the I780 demo model, picked it up and played with it for a while and i must say it has been a long time since a phone made me go "wow" , i was totaly amazed at the speed of the thing, the look and feel of it is great, samsung put alot of work into making the menu's just right for any user from beginner to power user. I made up my mind right there and then and bought one on my credit card, that was 7 days ago.
my experience so far :
Proprioty connector sux since i have a bunch of standard usb cables lying around, but still its not a train smash since you get usb cable, car charger, spare battery as well as a seperate portable battery charger as well with the phone.
Speed is AWSOME, 624mhz of power you will definitely notice, i have not found a single movie clip that has once lagged or was out of sinc with video/audio. this phone is really FAST, even when multi tasking it doesnt slow down. i have 2 friends who own tytn 2 and both commented on the speed, they both think i tweaked it to make it faster, they refuse to believe its the stock speed. ofcourse i did not tweak it.
Plenty of memory, i have 152mb free memory space on the phone and i have around 20 apps installed. the phone can also technicaly take up to 32gb cards i have read, altho most users use 1gb-8gb.
GPS is great, i had a bit of problem setting it up as i didnt bother reading the manual etc, but once i figured it out it worked like a charm, it pin pointed me in seconds. google maps work great as well. Garmin XT which comes with the phone is in my opinion far better than tomtom could ever be so i am very happy with samsung's choice of gps software.
Touch pad mouse was what put me off buying the phone in the first place, but after 6 days i find myself using it more than anything else, it was weird to use the first few days but it is second nature now and the phone just wouldnt be the same without it.
the keypad looks really tiny and i have biggish fingers. I dont know why, maybe its because they are beveled quite a bit or something, but i find it very easy and comfortable to use, do yourself a favour and try it on a demo model, you will see what i mean. the phone has a bunch of shortcut keys that sit in all the right spots, thumbs up to samsung for doing a good job there. one thing i would have liked was a jog dial for easy up and down scrolling in opera, I downloaded a app that changes volume up/down to scroll up/down and my problem was solved.
Screen is nice and bright, even in sunlight i dont have a problem. 320x320 at 128dpi is not as bad as everyone makes it out to be. 95% of software out there works flawless at this resolution, since the release of the phone software developers have all been upgrading to support it. its mainly only HTC home that is a problem, but spb mobile which has more funtions works perfect so i am not bothered. I have installed all 20 of my favorite apps and all work nicely so im happy. there are some games that might be an issue tho, but its mostly old titles, every new game being released supports this resolution.
3G. Wireless, HSDPA etc : with my tytn 2 i had 1 bar to my router from the living room, with this phone i have almost full signal, i was really surprised with that. in the bathroom i used to get gprs only with the tytn 2, with this phone i get 3G+. anyway, that is how i have compared it to my old phone and found this one to have far better signal quality.
overall i love the phone, i am convinced i made the right choice. i would have loved a flash to be included with the phone, but other than that i just cant find any flaws.
I cant really comment on battery life as i am still playing with everything alot and using more battery life than i would on avarage, but currently battery lasts me almost 2 full days and trust me, i put it under alot of stress plus you get a second battery with the phone for free. but i estimate 3 to 4 days if you dont put to much strain on it.
O also forgot to mention, video calling worked out of the box much to my surprise. phone came with the E1 rom installed.
Software currently on phone and working perfectly :
Skype
SmS Chat ( threaded sms app )
google maps
Opera
core player
real player
Esmertec Jbed
Advabced config Tools
Adobe reader
Fun contact
Keyswop
Pocket IRC
Pocket Rar
PqzII
Safemode 2
Garmin XT
SPB Mobile shell
WKTaskL
Samsung today plugin
Astraware Casino
Tetris
Machines of war
Flash player
Total commander
Call firewall.
And no i did not install realvga, i am using the default 128dpi resolution i got the phone with.
Anyway, hope this helps with your descision. what you really need to do it test the phone yourself, i warn you tho, once you pick it up you wont want to put it down
In my country the HTC Tytn 2 is selling for R8900, and its already an dated model.
the I780 is selling for R5200 which is ALOT cheaper and this phone blows smoke in the tytn 2's face. so in my opinion this is by far the best bang for buck out there.
Its kinda like buying a 9600gt when everyone else is buying the 8600gts .... just love seeying their faces when they realise they just pissed away a chunk of cash on the wrong thing
If all else fails read this : http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=411053

The best windows mobile device for it's money is undoubtely the HTC Shift, for a mere 1000 dollars you'll get a run-down WindowsMobile OS, but also Vista. So you'll have a hybrid for the price of just a good laptop.
Isn't is great ?

I think the HTC Touch PRO will blow the competition away, seriously!!!
I was a symbian freak for years untill I bought my current device, the HTC S710 "Vox". Before the Vox I went trough several Symbian S60 devices including Nokia 7610, 6630, N70 & N73.
At first I thougt wm was a complete mess... and the UI looked terrible imo... I was also a bit shocked that there was no copy/paste (at least in wm6 standard). In S60 there was a dedicated pencil key used for just copy/paste actions + other stuff..
Things have changed...
Now after using my Vox fox exactly one year there's no way I'd go back to only using symbian S60 again.
Even though I'm only using the non-touch version of wm I've noticed all the advantages of wm compared with symbian S60.
Let me list a few of them:
1. Messaging: Sending SMS & MMS with a S60 device is OK but nothing more, the whole messaging interface in a S60 3d edition device is inferior. It's hard to explain but it's just doesn't compare to what it feels like on a wm device. It's like using a 3310 with a color screen if you know what I mean. Oooold T9 (forget about xt9 with word prediction & etc), the whole interface looks like a joke, and the S60 MMS editor doesn't even have a 3'rd of every options you can find in a standard WM device these days.
2. Email: OMG, If you wanna check your mail on a S60 device you'll be seriously depressed. Reading emails on a S60 device is like reading a standard SMS. You can forget all about HTML email and everything looks incredibly boring. Yes there are some really good 3rd party apps like profimail but still they're no match for the built-in mobile outlook when it comes to displaying your emails.
3. Calendar: There's no comparision here, WM6 calendar thrumps the S60 one, nothing more to say!
4. Contacts: S60 is far far behind, there's so much easier and faster finding a contact in WM6, especially when you can search contacts quickly just by typing there first letters using xt9... And with Live messenger integrated (love it or hate it) with contacts it's a nice addition imo.
5. Office applications: OMG... This is overkill for S60!!! Even WM6 standard edition nowadays includes Office mobile which beatifully renders word, excell & powerpoint files. It's a shame it doesn't allow you to create new documents (on WM6 standard) but that can easily be fixed with a simple patch from modaco forums... S60 includes quickoffice, it's not a bad application at all but documents rendered in quickoffice doesn't even look nearly as good as they do in office mobile.
6. WIFI: No competition here at all... WM is superior in remembering hotspots and connectivity.
7. ActiveSync: Says it all doesn't it??? Nokia have PC Suite, it's a great app but it's no match if you're using outlook... It works ok but doesn't sync everything like activesync does so wm is the winner here as well....
8. Live Messenger: Probably not very important to a lot of people but for me it's very important. With WM6 I can use the native WM Live messenger client completely for free. There's no way to do that on Symbian because MS is charging for using it on other platforms
There's probably more I could add to the list but I must mention all my troubles with wm in the beginning have been solved, I'm using Vito Copy/Paste for the copy & paste issue & I've also added celetask to a hardware key so my phone actually works better in this apartment than I could ever wish four... Of course Symbian S60 also have advantages, like better cameras & video recording, more display colors & better gaming with the new N-gage platform etc... but in the end I think WM is a more advanced & better platform. I think WM is more appealing for geeks & techheads because you can tweak your device to infinity. And I'm still only talking about WM Standard, WM6 PRO is even more versatile.
S60 is fun for a while but in the end it gets boring as hell...

partyhardy said:
To be honest, I've grown quite tired of Windows Mobile. I used to like it more, but it seems like I spent way too much time getting things to work. Also, the interface is very user UN-friendly, which makes doing simple tasks like calling someone too time consuming. Then there is the random freeze ups like the one I had today, which caused me to miss 5 calls and no warning lights or anything.
I like the cusomizabilty, but sometimes, I just want something that works right out of the box. Also, performance wise, all of the HTC/WM phones I've used are sluggish. (My mogul, friend's 6700, another friend's Kaiser/TyTnII). The redraw time when you flip out the keyboard is rediculous, specially if you have a few plugins.
Overall, I may give one more WM phone a try, if I am impressed by it at the store. But I doubt it. I just don't see Microsoft doing any innovations since they hold the crown as far as market share goes in the U.S. Maybe when an Android phones comes out...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Performance issue of WM are device specific. After being a HTC hardcore for many years, and after quite a number of frustating moments I decided to switch.....almost bought myself the new Nokia E71 and abandon WM altotgether BUT - I decided to give it one more try with WM and now it's with a Samsung. And that's how I ended with the i780.
With the i780 (DXHE1 Rom), it's like a rediscovery for me. After getting used to HTC sluggishness and sporadic freeze-ups, I was genuinely astounded by how nimble and steadfast this i780 is. I can recall until now I have not encountered any freeze-ups no matter how I abuse the programs running back to back. Yes some buggy program may screw up but the nice thing is it won't freeze the whole phone unlike HTC devices where a single program fails it will bring down the whole phone.
And for the price, the i780 is a steal. It has all the arsenal one could expect from HTC flagship models yet it cost way cheaper - that is a real deal to me.
If you are done with HTC, don't blame it on WM. Try different make, like i-Mate Arima build or Samsung or even Asus.

Iphone 3G vs Polaris

I am a WM user for 4 years now. My first device was Magician, second one is Polaris and the next one will be Iphone 3G.
I love HTC, they make perfect phones and the price does not bother me, neither lack of video drivers does. I always admired all the latest technologies they include in their phones (3MP camera, 3G+HSDPA, GPS, etc..).
The only thing I don't like in HTC is ... MICROSOFT WINDOWS. I hate using stylus. It is absolutely not user-friendly.
Now, with HSDPA and GPS in Iphone I am willing to sell my polaris. Just after 5 months of using! I used my magician for 3 years before and thought I will keep my new one for another 3 years. But I give up now. I want to buy a brand new Iphone now. Never used apple products before (even Ipod).
So, my question is - do you guys know any forum similar to this one (technical), but related to Iphone stuff?
Thank you for answers and sorry for leaving you in advance.

I understand and do myself feel that we are being cheated, but i say you should search google with " iphone discussion forum" and that search will lead you rightto one, i have seen a few, i dont have an iphone,(i might get one when the video calling gps one comes out.) but i do browse to see what iphone users azre getting up to with there devices.
g oogle is your best friend.

Mate, don't do it. The new iPhone only has a 2 Meg pixel camera, and you'll be tied into some ghastly price plan for life. Wait for the Raphael, which is personally my Holy Grail of phones. Ah, a real keyboard. soooo yummy
I agree about Windows Mobile, it sucks. And the new HTC Flo nonsense looks rubbish aswell, but you know....
Apple announced NOTHING exciting (appart from MobileMe, where the HELL is windows contact/calendar over-the-air synching without Exchange????). But still they gave ir a huge launch. 3G and GPS - big deal!

or the new Samsung i900 Omnia http://www.gsmarena.com/samsung_i900_omnia-2422.php seems to be very interesting device. I propebly sell my polaris and buy a Iphone or this Samsung. In some way im to bored with the htc policy with their devices, first i have the Trinity and waited if htc could atleast make a wm6 update on trinity..but now way..then Polaris with this driver issue forexample. Polaris may be my last htc device. The only thing which is very good to have a Htc device is this forum or the hole xda developers www site

I'll wait and see what can Android bring out of my Polaris... I like the design of the polaris, and with Android it'll be better... and more finger friendly...

madinga said:
Wait for the Raphael, which is personally my Holy Grail of phones. Ah, a real keyboard. soooo yummy
...
Apple announced NOTHING exciting (appart from MobileMe, where the HELL is windows contact/calendar over-the-air synching without Exchange????). But still they gave ir a huge launch. 3G and GPS - big deal!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I definitely would not say that the Raphael is the Holy Grail of phones. In fact it is far from it. The raphael is just a Kaiser with a flush screen and prettier touch flo. Big deal, nothing new.
Now I am a huge WinMo fan, but I can still say that the iPhone while it may not be a Holy Grail either, it is still the standard to which all high end phones are being held. It is far from perfect yes, but nonetheless it is the current standard. I'd venture to say that the majority of us that aren't switching b/c we are waiting for some little details in the form of functionality that we've enjoyed with our HTC phones. For some that may be 3G and GPS, for other such as myself 3rd party apps (VOIP!!!), and better bluetooth support (A2DP and tethering). For you that is clearly
windows contact/calendar over-the-air synching without Exchange
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Apple is getting closer and closer to closing in on its list of inadequacies with the iPhone, HTC on the other hand is not (and yes I realise that may be b/c they are tied down to WinMo 6.1).
I don't see any WinMo phone coming anywhere near where I or I would assume most of us want until Windows Mobile 7 is released. Windows Mobile 6 is just too slow, too small button oriented, too menu driven, and too lacking innovation (seriously, the UI is pretty much the same as its been ever since WinCE days back in 2000 or earlier).

well Raphael got vga over kaiser but then with smaller screens not everybody may notice
the thing that wm got going for it is lots of programs free ones and comercials ones
vs. iphone and android but with time it's not a good sleeping pillow for ms
kinda funny that while the pc world is unhappy with the current ms offering of vista
and want the next thing windows 7
pda owners are unhappy what wm6.1 can offer vs. the compatition so they want the next thing windows mobile 7
wonder if ms will release them at the same time :S :O

i love windows mobile and will not buy iphone. i was just in an att store today and the guy told me besides the phone being slash by half. u have to pay a huge fee to sign up for service. somewhere over $100. he said it would better serve u if u already had an iphone and wait for an upgrade rather than buying the new one.
as for htc. i am done with them. i wish i could find one of the developers and kick there ass. i am moving to another maker as soon as one catches my interest.

Yeah seriously WM6 is a dated wack ass looking piece of work. All this Touch Flo nonsense is just HTC trying to give their devices a fresher look. Otherwise you'd be staring at that boring ass Today screen that doesn't look good in the ads. Even Apple had to use a screenshot of WM in their keynote speech at WWDC '08 as a joke (how background apps run). This is in addition to the ActiveStink comment, which might be warranted, but I digress.
Point is, it does need to be seriously freshened up as an OS which is what WM7 is all about. However that's still a ways away. Plus barely any WM phones out there have gesture sensors or multi-touch screens anyway. Actually I don't know any that have both. 2 things the iPhone has had since last year. I am also curious as to what Android will bring to the Polaris, but I'm fed up with this dated WM6 OS (and lack of drivers).

omaga said:
or the new Samsung i900 Omnia http://www.gsmarena.com/samsung_i900_omnia-2422.php seems to be very interesting device. I propebly sell my polaris and buy a Iphone or this Samsung. In some way im to bored with the htc policy with their devices, first i have the Trinity and waited if htc could atleast make a wm6 update on trinity..but now way..then Polaris with this driver issue forexample. Polaris may be my last htc device. The only thing which is very good to have a Htc device is this forum or the hole xda developers www site
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hey, what's the point? Omnia is just another WinMo ****! If you consider WinMo - Polaris is the best thing to buy! IMO.

yallow said:
Hey, what's the point? Omnia is just another WinMo ****! If you consider WinMo - Polaris is the best thing to buy! IMO.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes ofcourse omnia is a wm phone. that wasnt my point. The point was how htc treads us comsumers, selling unfinnish products, you buy a expensive phone and things are missing in the phone which will be upgrade in the NEXT model. I like win mobiles no doubt about that and now im thinking Symbian vs Win. Sorry to say but did you read the Omnia spesifications at all? much better that Polaris?
Omnia kick ass with polaris from that point of view

Guys I have both the Orbit 2 and the first gen Iphone and both have there advantages.
However these are being eroded with Iphone 3G, namely GPS and 3G data access.
I have to admit the interface on the iphone is simply incredible, fast and accurate glass screen that does not scratch. it is an absolute joy to use.
is is intuitive at performing ANY function were the Orbit you have to think about what you are doing and then some. The interface on the Orbit is clumsy at best, whilst typing is a joke compared to the iphone, it's keyboard is a joy to use, I can type faster on it than I could achieve on my blackberry.
and to boot the build quality of the iphone is leagues ahead of the HTC product.
The facts are WM6.whatever is slow, cumbersome and needs the update now.
I will still use my Orbit2 as the PC modem function is superb but once the iphone 3G comes is released I would have to say it will get a lot less use.

Honestly. I was an huge fan of Symbian phones. Now the Polaris is my first WM device and I really like it. After a couple of customizations the device is "fingerfriendly" and I can't remember when I was using the stylus the last time.
But this is not the point. I prefer the Polaris all over the IPhone (3G) because...
... I like to change my battery on my own
... I like to send MMS
... I like to have at least an 3 MP camera on board
... I like to decide to customize the software on my own
... I like to decide who my operater of choice is
... and so on
and compare to the first IPhone the new one is build out of plastic, has still the same "features" and the "innovation" is nothing new.
I am waiting for the Raphael to exchange it with my Polaris. It gives me the freedom I used to have and the hardware features I prefer.

I can answer all those must haves apart from change battery as yes, just 'get an unlocked iphone' it gives you all those features.
Even the 2Mp camera on the iphone is comparable to the Orbit 2 3Mp.
However in the end everybody to their own.
Simply put IMO the Polaris is not finger friendly at all, the crappy plastic screen that scratches too easily is very un-responsive unless you use a stylus which defeats the object of having a touch screen phone.
I will admit the Polaris is a feature laden beast that has many strong points, but its operational method and UI cannot even come close to the Iphone, it is like comparing Mac OSX Leopard to Windows 95, the difference is that great.

mikee5402 said:
I can answer all those must haves apart from change battery as yes, just 'get an unlocked iphone' it gives you all those features.
Simply put IMO the Polaris is not finger friendly at all, the crappy plastic screen that scratches too easily is very un-responsive unless you use a stylus which defeats the object of having a touch screen phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can give you a much bigger list of things that you probably can't do even with a jailbroken iphone.
As for a screen that scratches, are you using a protector on there? Shouldn't be getting any scratches. I've heard others that don't use a screen protector and say they aren't getting any scratches either but i'm not willing to take the risk.

i dont really like the iphone's interface.. is.. bored.. maybe with a lot of graphic effects but is just VERY SIMPLE.. many programs for windows mobile can emulate that.. but iphone will never do what windows mobile does..
ORGANIZE..
because is not the same to have a folder for each thing than use a scrollable screen for all..

you should realize once and for all that there are different perfect phones for different people.
i love my polaris.. because it's a small, light device, with GPS and 3G ability.. which i will start using soon.
while other people prefer bigger screens they can buy 3.5inch screens.. i can't stand it.. but the iPhone 3G is good for them.
while i like having a modular operation system.. even tho windows mobile is not perfect, other people love having everything built in, such as in the iPhone. some other people don't mind about GPS.. .. i do.
but there isn't one best phone.. there are a few... depending on the needs of every individual.

What about the Sony Ericsson Experia X1. At first glance, I think it's more powerfull than the Iphone 3G, HTC Diamond (and variants), and the TC. It's WM based, 800x408 resolution, small, light, and works in the US.
yallow said:
I am a WM user for 4 years now. My first device was Magician, second one is Polaris and the next one will be Iphone 3G.
I love HTC, they make perfect phones and the price does not bother me, neither lack of video drivers does. I always admired all the latest technologies they include in their phones (3MP camera, 3G+HSDPA, GPS, etc..).
The only thing I don't like in HTC is ... MICROSOFT WINDOWS. I hate using stylus. It is absolutely not user-friendly.
Now, with HSDPA and GPS in Iphone I am willing to sell my polaris. Just after 5 months of using! I used my magician for 3 years before and thought I will keep my new one for another 3 years. But I give up now. I want to buy a brand new Iphone now. Never used apple products before (even Ipod).
So, my question is - do you guys know any forum similar to this one (technical), but related to Iphone stuff?
Thank you for answers and sorry for leaving you in advance.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

Don't forget... it'll be made by HTC!
And biig display is worth nill if not supported by applications.
Except if your main goal is to have nice media reproductor combined with phone
Touch Pro looks like killer device ATM...

Bodisson said:
Don't forget... it'll be made by HTC!
And biig display is worth nill if not supported by applications.
Except if your main goal is to have nice media reproductor combined with phone
Touch Pro looks like killer device ATM...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
In general, I agree with you that higher resolution need to be supported by the apps. However, I've also go an Imate 6150, and I used to have an ETEN x800, and I can tell you that even though most of the apps didn't make the best use of the real estate, that the text was much more readable, colors were sharper, icons looked better, etc.
If it weren't for the crappy ROM that comes with the Imate, I would be using it now. And unfortunately, the hacker community for Imate devices isn't as developed as it is for HTC devices.
Of course the other downside to VGA (or higher) is higher power consumption.
Dave

So long microsoft!

Well it's been a long time coming but I'm finally giving up on microsoft to produce a decent handheld OS. I've used the XDA's since the first one, I've owned an XDA, XDAII, mini, jamin, k-jam and a polaris and I can honestly say that the OS has not improved one iota all these years.
No i'm not going with the iPhone, I'm going to get a simple old nokia and just use a UMPC for any mobile trickery needed.
This is NOT a jab at all the brilliant developers of this community which have carried MS's cash cow all these years on their shoulders - you truly were the ONLY reason to buy a PocketPC.
Here's hoping things improve, but don't hold your breath.
*Polaris eBayed*

I give him 3 weeks.

addicus said:
I give him 3 weeks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
lulz indeed

i give him 4 weeks... hehe

considering the amount of mobile phones he has had with WinMO, it will be a huge shock to go back to a nokia... He will for sure be back soon! Just a crisis like we all have some times...

I´ll stick to WM till Android has a more stable and mature OS
Symbian and Iphone systems never!

Well best of luck with the OS change. We'll be here if you decide to return someday...

I will join this guy as soon as the next Android drops.

Ev0luti0n_ said:
considering the amount of mobile phones he has had with WinMO, it will be a huge shock to go back to a nokia... He will for sure be back soon! Just a crisis like we all have some times...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I went to a nokia after the jasjam aka: tytn. It took me 8 months to come back

I think Defroster has been understood wrongly. As I believe he doesn’t think there is better OS but he just voicing out his disappointments of MS and WinMo improvements.
I have to say I fully AGREE with him on this.
My device history is almost the same. The reason that I bought my first WinMo was to combine PDA with Phone so that I don’t need to carry 2 devices. I paid for my first device (2002) almost 1000USD. Many of my friends and colleagues thought I am crazy to spend so much money.
Yes it was not fully Phone but also not fully a PDA (computer) but I though just hang on for couple months then MS will improve the things tremendously.
But look to the changes/improvement that WinMo has made in last 7-8 years which are in my opinion Almost Nill. However the devices cost still ca.1000USD..
Be frank just for comparison: Do we see any desktop software that has almost the same capability and same UI after 8 years???….but cost the same money??
Furthermore look in to the upcoming WinMO 6.5. I believe it is just ridiculous to put such crap in to the market after 1-2 years development by a Huge Company like Microsoft. Again I don’t see any improvements and Still there is nothing out of the box..
If I would be Bill Gates I would immediately Fire all the WinMo Team. It is unacceptable for Engineering company to rest on a product for more than 8 years and don’t have any major changes. The best example for such behavior is the American Auto Industry.
Ohh well It is well known that if a Company is to large the efficiency of that company compare to middle sized one much much lesser but they DO have longer breath.
Yes Yes I know the bad thing is there are no much better alternatives right now.
However same As Defroster I am considering getting better value for same money (1000 USD) Therefore I am seriously Looking to the new 9-10inch Netbooks like Asus Eee ; Acer aspire, MSI Wind etc. They are costing less than 500 USD (some of them around 300USD) those have Standard battery live up to 8hous. Additionally I am thinking to get one of those simple Smart phones like HTC Excalibur or Cavalier. Yes that would set me back again 8 years but I get better value for my money and can be much more productive then I am with a single expensive toy…

I too totally agree. Microsoft is such a big company and yet it never deliver what a user want or need for so many years! Is it that they have no Competitors for the pass 8 years?
The biggest change I saw was when HTC came out with TouchFlo 3D. Nice cool looking interface, smooth scrolling, Finger friendly, Easy access to messaging, web, ETC. And they are only just covering up the ugly part of microsoft winmo. And HTC did it in just a short time. Even now with the new Winmo 6.5, the Titanium screen looks crappy! The font on the screen are so ugly, the item list covering the whole screen. scrolling thru the list is a torture to my eyes. It scroll the list not the selection!!
I believe with enough time Android will be far ahead.

Let us all cross our fingers than 6.5 becomes a flop.
Don't you remember what happened to the flop we call Vista? The successor Windows 7 has fixed all those bugs and works like a proper OS.
Hopefully a flop will make them realize that they need to take their finger out and actually produce something decent (not saying WinMo is bad or anything).

/me joining the android bandwagon asap. For sure the OS for the future

PPC is too good to be replaced..
I definately won't change back to nokia, SE or any non WM devices..
I need alot of medical softwares.. and those can't provide any decent 1

Ehhh, If you think about it, Microsoft is always going to be a Big Company.

DhaMajoR said:
Ehhh, If you think about it, Microsoft is always going to be a Big Company.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Oh yes! another great comment!
And Cocacola too

orb3000 said:
Oh yes! another great comment!
And Cocacola too
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Okay mister 2000 Posts... Will im at 100 ,
Another genius!

i am fine with the way it looks. if you are unhappy with the software make your own; or find some one else to make some for you.

josefcrist said:
i am fine with the way it looks. if you are unhappy with the software make your own; or find some one else to make some for you.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't either. There are many choices for looks. It can look like nearly anything out there. Flexibility. Name of the game.

everyone has their own point of view,
as for me?
i think its good as long as this forum is up and running
lots of ppl hlps ere so i dun care what microsoft does...

help please upgrade from wm5

hi there,
i have xda exec with wm5 on i would like to upgrade it how can i do it?
and what version of firmware can i put on it?

cybercypher said:
hi there,
i have xda exec with wm5 on i would like to upgrade it how can i do it?
and what version of firmware can i put on it?
current version is os5.1.795 build 14847.2.0.0
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

You could start by reading Wiki section for Universal, aka XDA Exec, it's an excellent, well written resource and has all the information you could possibly need and all the answers to the questions you could possibly have.
The ROMs you might be interested in can be found in their corresponding sections on this forum, each will have a description and list of things included, as well as comments by other members on performance, problems encountered and solutions.

enigma1nz said:
You could start by reading Wiki section for Universal, aka XDA Exec, it's an excellent, well written resource and has all the information you could possibly need and all the answers to the questions you could possibly have.
The ROMs you might be interested in can be found in their corresponding sections on this forum, each will have a description and list of things included, as well as comments by other members on performance, problems encountered and solutions.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi Enigma1nz,
I was just wondering the other day if you had left us, coz ive not heard of you for a while. Did you get a 128 upgrade?
Regards
Jay

responderman said:
Hi Enigma1nz,
I was just wondering the other day if you had left us, coz ive not heard of you for a while. Did you get a 128 upgrade?
Regards
Jay
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am here, of course, where else would I be, hehe. I had my 128Mb for a while, just nothing new came out lately and I resorted to the best combination of ROM+SPB MS3.5+Opera10b and other bits and pieces, the trick was to find the combo where everything worked. Besides, I purchased a semi-broken LG KS20 running WM6.1 and played with that for a while - not bad, especially considering 128/256, but still a far cry from Uni.

Not sure where the Uni is heading now, but it is starting to fade out a bit. I renewed my contract with t-mobile last year and I took a G1 the andriod based machine. Well its good but.......just not got that something that makes a great machine. its got all the features to make it a great machine, and it does as its told, but it spends more time on the side than with a sim card in it. which Rom have you settled with in the end? I liked tomals 8.71, its well finished and it all works. its a shame SRS wow doesn't work on it, coz I like that prog a lot.
Regards
Jay

responderman said:
Not sure where the Uni is heading now, but it is starting to fade out a bit. I renewed my contract with t-mobile last year and I took a G1 the andriod based machine. Well its good but.......just not got that something that makes a great machine. its got all the features to make it a great machine, and it does as its told, but it spends more time on the side than with a sim card in it. which Rom have you settled with in the end? I liked tomals 8.71, its well finished and it all works. its a shame SRS wow doesn't work on it, coz I like that prog a lot.
Regards
Jay
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The thing about SPB MS, as I mentioned more times than I care to be reminded ofmad, is that it removed the necessity for a flash looking ROM, so pretty much any Vanilla is fine, even WM5, if one is keen to keep VC. I had a great time with Tomal's 8-series, in particular 8.2, 8.5 and 8.9, but there were other conflicts, especially with Opera betas, I really liked the look of 10 and it appeared to be somewhat less problematic compatibility-wise than 9.5 and I didn't like 9.7. So once the Opera issue was settled - the rest was a smooth sailing.
As far as SRS WOW is concerned - Tomal's 8.2 was the last version it was running on i think...(have to check on that, not 100%), for other ROMs there is a patched Tomal's version.

I would dearly love for HTC to reconsider the return of the same form factor and size (funny, how so many people were against it in the first place) with updated specs to handle the pressure. Would be a winner for me. These days I tell everyone I have a MINI NETBOOK!!!! with touch screen/pad fold/phone capabilities and they want to cry with envy. All it needs is Shift's specs.
The unfortunate news for those keen on WM7 is that the platform will not support anything made for its predecessors, rendering pretty much everything done so far obsolete within a very short period of time. Only limited support for 6.5 will be offered by Microsoft.

enigma1nz said:
I would dearly love for HTC to reconsider the return of the same form factor and size (funny, how so many people were against it in the first place) with updated specs to handle the pressure. Would be a winner for me. These days I tell everyone I have a MINI NETBOOK!!!! with touch screen/pad fold/phone capabilities and they want to cry with envy. All it needs is Shift's specs.
The unfortunate news for those keen on WM7 is that the platform will not support anything made for its predecessors, rendering pretty much everything done so far obsolete within a very short period of time. Only limited support for 6.5 will be offered by Microsoft.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Its funny how a different discription will sell an object. I was a joiner for my main job, and I was fitting a lady's window and she didn't want me to secure it with screws. she wanted it nailing in (lord knows why) anyway I told her I would secure it with threaded steel dowls (screws) and she was over the moon. so your mini notebook idea doesn't supprise me at all.
I gave up on spb ms as it eats a 64 mb memory to much, but I have plans to upgrade the memory so will go back to it. I recon HTC are following fashon with their phones, they all are the same thing, and one day we may end up with a return to the notebook style. I once bought a wvga tosheba 900, it was the worst pda I have ever owned. It wouldn't even play a video well, so I got a refund. So here I stay with my Uni and my Athena (now that is a big PDA) I seem to remember not having much joy with the srs wow patch, it did funny things to the camera and sound.
Regards
Jay

responderman said:
Its funny how a different discription will sell an object. I was a joiner for my main job, and I was fitting a lady's window and she didn't want me to secure it with screws. she wanted it nailing in (lord knows why) anyway I told her I would secure it with threaded steel dowls (screws) and she was over the moon. so your mini notebook idea doesn't supprise me at all.
I gave up on spb ms as it eats a 64 mb memory to much, but I have plans to upgrade the memory so will go back to it. I recon HTC are following fashon with their phones, they all are the same thing, and one day we may end up with a return to the notebook style. I once bought a wvga tosheba 900, it was the worst pda I have ever owned. It wouldn't even play a video well, so I got a refund. So here I stay with my Uni and my Athena (now that is a big PDA) I seem to remember not having much joy with the srs wow patch, it did funny things to the camera and sound.
Regards
Jay
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
True, I gave up on SRS WOW altogether, actually, the best ROM that worked with EVERYTHING was Tomal's 8.2, can't remember now why I wanted to move to 8.9 so much. Yep, with 128Mb SPB MS is a beauty and if my Uni didn't get enough attention from my friends, it sure does now with all the touch movements and screens shifting, haha. I got it fitted with an iPhone screen protector, took a bit of cutting to size, it's very glossy, so looks very close to those modern netbook screens, the protector is something like $1.20 for a pack of 3 and I don't peel the outer layer off right away, so use it for a few weeks until it gets mucked up, then peel it off to reveal the proper smooth protector underneath, that one lasts for ages and you can't even see it on.
P.S. Would love to lay my hands on Athena... Might advertise for a broken one, always wanted a Shift or similar, don't care about the size, just can't afford the price.

Forgot to mention. HTC is in the middle of court case. Apple is suing for partial Android copyright infringements. Should've gone after Google, really, but HTC is a much easier and smaller target.

enigma1nz said:
Forgot to mention. HTC is in the middle of court case. Apple is suing for partial Android copyright infringements. Should've gone after Google, really, but HTC is a much easier and smaller target.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That is interesting news, I will watch out for that one.
I bought my Athena off Ebay in one of those rash moments, and once I bid I had that "oh ****, what have I done" moments. I remember all day I was wishing to be out bid, but fat chance. but they are dropping in price like a stone now. They are the dogs do-dah's of PDA's and spoil you for screen size, so now the Universal looks quite small screened to me now. The BIG problem with them is the phone, you cant use them to the ear coz they only work on speaker and if anyone is near then they hear the lot, so its bluetooth all the way. most of us use the LG style-I. Its a pen size thing that looks and works like a tiny phone, and leve the Athena in its large pocket or bag. Another great thing is you can plug into the telly, and with a bluetooth keyboard surf the net or watch your films on the big screen. Even the mighty Athena is getting old hat now though, but its down to what you need at the end of the day.
Jay