Database Info

MS Voice Command in latest Dutty

Does anyone know what Dutty changed from his 4/9 release from his 4/1 release in relation to MS Voice Command?
He lists the same version (1.6.19209) in both ROMs. However in the 4/1 ROM incoming announcments do not work over BT and in the 4/9 release they do work.
I would stick with using Dutty's 4/9 ROM (for I appreciate his contributions) however the default SIP in that ROM is just horrendous and to get it to use a different SIP involves having to install two additional "SIP" changer programs, and even when it works my device acts up occassionally just starting to type on it's own and then locking up (happened 3 times after a fresh flash and nothing but trying to install PCM Keyboard based on the info in the thread).
I really need MSVC fully working (with BT announcements) and am most likely going to have to go to a clean ROM since no other ROM seems to have this working, and none of the fixes that are out there can be applied to a ROM that has it cooked in already.
Thanks

There is a patch around for VC fixes the announce bug. A quick Google will turn it up for you.

post location
I would think a senior member would know better then to post a question like this on the main page. Users of this web site should be assigned points doing dumb things like posting questions about specific roms on the main page, or not doing their research. The more points a user gets the lower their rating and leading to the eventual "time out" not being able to post for a determined length of time. But seriously I hate reading over 100 pages of dumb a** posts and repeat questions about the rom that I have chosen to install. Out of 100 pages on this site I think 10 are relevent. I have been on this site for a few months and more as a non member. I don't have many posts because when I have a question I look it up and find the answer instead of relying on others to do it for me.

LOL, nice one guys.

I HAVE known about a VC patch, however it appears to be the same patch that has been around for quite some time. I used it on my 6800 to get VC even working on my device, however it did not fix the announce bug. In addition, since the patch has been available for so long I find it strange that it wasn't included in the 4/1 ROM since this was a well known problem (and apparantly an available fix?) well before that date. Also, from my recollection the "fix" replaces pretty much all of the VC files...which I would think (although maybe i'm incorrect here) cause VC to show a different version number. But, in both ROMs the version # is the same.
As to ALL of your responses...
It is posts like yours that do more to overtake the precious commodity of space that you think exists on this site. It is why when a newbie (or someone who has been around a bit, like myself) has to search through 50 threads to find any type of adequate response, because posts like yours serve to obscure information rather than present it.
It is posts like yours that is what is wrong with this site and prevent it from being as valuable a resource to old and new members alike. If instead of your criticizing and mocking you simply stated the answer (if you knew it conclusively), or linked to a thread where someone else conclusively stated the answer, or simply didn't respond, then we wouldn't have these issues that some of you think are so critically horrible with this site.
If you all took the high road and simply linked to the appropriate thread, then guess what...ALL THREADS ABOUT A TOPIC WOULD LEAD TO THE PROPER ANSWER. Thus, when doing a simple search, it would be exceedingly simple to find the answer. This forum is JUST as cluttered with useless posts like yours as they are with posts like mine. However my post at leasts attempt to gain and share information, where your posts serve to mock, belittle, and obfuscate.
@hvbelton - While I appreciate your seemingly helpful response, it is not much use and serves as more wasted space. Let's assume that as a Senior member I did some basic searches and already had some exposure to the topic but was still confused on some point. It would have been better to provide a link yourself if you are highly familiar with the answer instead of vaguely pointing me in some direction which won't likely give any further focus to what i am looking for.
@mlcohen - I think I address the total uselessness of your post above. Ignore a post if you don't want to respond. Think about the fact that posts like yours (which there are hundreds if not thousands on this site) serve as banal a purpose as you claim my post does.
@P1Tater - I almost don't want to address this response. I'll only say it is sophmoric and serves 0 purpose in a place like this where people are supposed to gather and share information.

@ benga
Nothing was meant towards you. I was just chuckling at what was previously posted. Why is everyone so dad-gum touchy lately?

P1Tater said:
@ benga
Nothing was meant towards you. I was just chuckling at what was previously posted. Why is everyone so dad-gum touchy lately?
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Because nobody hugged them enough when they were little?

P1Tater said:
@ benga
Nothing was meant towards you. I was just chuckling at what was previously posted. Why is everyone so dad-gum touchy lately?
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I am touchy because I am being called dumb and lazy (not doing my research) by a lurker who has given nothing back to this community (hvbelton). I won't state that I have been a MAJOR contributor here. But at least half my posts are to foster valid discussion or give answers to questions I can.
Then in addition to that post, yours serves to further the sentiment by reinforcing it.
If I am dumb or lazy for being legitimately confused by a patch, which replaces ALL the files of a program with versions that are months (if not over a year) older than the current release, AND still displays the same version number, then I admit to it. However there are many as dumb and lazy as myself as this is a hot topic across many forum boards.
Maybe one of you brilliant programmers would like to go into detail about what the specific problem is with even the latest release of VC in Dutty's 4/1 ROM and why incoming announcments still don't work? Please describe in depth as to why replacing the core DLLs with a much older version (and are they also patched?...and why are the file sizes so considerably smaller?) will fix the issue.
If you took your time to add something to the conversation instead of bringing it to a lower level, we might ALL learn something new. I'm sure that 99.9% of those who might have used this fix still don't understand why it works. This is after all xda-developers, not xda-letmegrabsomefilesandjustloadthemonmydeviceandseewhathappens

bengalih said:
I am touchy because I am being called dumb and lazy (not doing my research) by a lurker who has given nothing back to this community (hvbelton). I won't state that I have been a MAJOR contributor here. But at least half my posts are to foster valid discussion or give answers to questions I can.
Then in addition to that post, yours serves to further the sentiment by reinforcing it.
If I am dumb or lazy for being legitimately confused by a patch, which replaces ALL the files of a program with versions that are months (if not over a year) older than the current release, AND still displays the same version number, then I admit to it. However there are many as dumb and lazy as myself as this is a hot topic across many forum boards.
Maybe one of you brilliant programmers would like to go into detail about what the specific problem is with even the latest release of VC in Dutty's 4/1 ROM and why incoming announcments still don't work? Please describe in depth as to why replacing the core DLLs with a much older version (and are they also patched?...and why are the file sizes so considerably smaller?) will fix the issue.
If you took your time to add something to the conversation instead of bringing it to a lower level, we might ALL learn something new. I'm sure that 99.9% of those who might have used this fix still don't understand why it works. This is after all xda-developers, not xda-letmegrabsomefilesandjustloadthemonmydeviceandseewhathappens
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Geesh man have a xanax. It was a freaking chuckle. It's not like i came to your house and had my way with your other half (as long as its of the female persuasion). Chill

thank you in advance

Hi Everyone,
I too would love to hear the solution to this problem. Hopefully some knowledgeable person will share the answer and help us all.
Thanks in advance!!!

bengalih said:
As to ALL of your responses...
It is posts like yours that do more to overtake the precious commodity of space that you think exists on this site. It is why when a newbie (or someone who has been around a bit, like myself) has to search through 50 threads to find any type of adequate response, because posts like yours serve to obscure information rather than present it.
It is posts like yours that is what is wrong with this site and prevent it from being as valuable a resource to old and new members alike. If instead of your criticizing and mocking you simply stated the answer (if you knew it conclusively), or linked to a thread where someone else conclusively stated the answer, or simply didn't respond, then we wouldn't have these issues that some of you think are so critically horrible with this site.
If you all took the high road and simply linked to the appropriate thread, then guess what...ALL THREADS ABOUT A TOPIC WOULD LEAD TO THE PROPER ANSWER. Thus, when doing a simple search, it would be exceedingly simple to find the answer. This forum is JUST as cluttered with useless posts like yours as they are with posts like mine. However my post at leasts attempt to gain and share information, where your posts serve to mock, belittle, and obfuscate.
@hvbelton - While I appreciate your seemingly helpful response, it is not much use and serves as more wasted space. Let's assume that as a Senior member I did some basic searches and already had some exposure to the topic but was still confused on some point. It would have been better to provide a link yourself if you are highly familiar with the answer instead of vaguely pointing me in some direction which won't likely give any further focus to what i am looking for.
@mlcohen - I think I address the total uselessness of your post above. Ignore a post if you don't want to respond. Think about the fact that posts like yours (which there are hundreds if not thousands on this site) serve as banal a purpose as you claim my post does.
@P1Tater - I almost don't want to address this response. I'll only say it is sophmoric and serves 0 purpose in a place like this where people are supposed to gather and share information.
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AMEN BROTHER! I feel the same way. If someone posts something in the wrong section, stop being a thread troll and either contribute to a constructive response, or SHUT THE HELL UP. Send the user a PM and ask them to move it to the right post, instead of filling up valuable space with useless info.
I completely agree, it's useless trying to search for information when you have 50 pages of crap to go through.
*****************
ANSWER:
Ok with that being said (and I know you said you didn't want to use this, but I am posting it for others) here is a link to the thread regarding fixing the announce issues:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=333260&highlight=voice+command+fix
It is working on my tilt, without using the patch. I just had to go into the VC settings (Start > Settings > Personal > Voice Command) Click on annoucements, and select the annoucement method, and uncheck "Only during free time"

Wouldnt it make more sense?

ive been looking over the forums for months now. i see people ask questions. and instead of given anwsers they are slammed because they should of researched first. Why? isnt it easier to just anwser a question than wasting a post saying you should of read first? if most people are like me (and i assume they are) they dont have time to search through thousands of posts just to find a possible anwser to their questions. the rom threads are getting too long 250+ posts average. and very often going on and off topic. so i guess what i am proposing is sub forums. let "Cooks" apply for a sub forum. not juyst any cook. but if they are making an honest to goodness contribution to the community i think it would help find information a lot easier. yes i know the forums have a search feature. but this it can still be difficult to sift throught the information.
so something like
xda-developers > Kaiser > Kaiser ROM development > JossKoss
xda-developers > Kaiser > Kaiser ROM development > Arnyl
xda-developers > Kaiser > Kaiser ROM development > MedKid
any roms a cook makes could have its own thread. and anything in the subforum would pertain to that particular person. now im not saying give one to just any person that half cooks a rom. it could even be based on a threashhold if the rom gets so many posts .. 200. or by votes. or just by the cooks reputation. that way people can post new threads inside the subforums without it getting moved into the thread with thousands of posts.
i dont make the decisions. im just posting something i think would help sort information and make it easier to find. that way if i have a problem with x rom. instead of reading through one thread there is a thread for each problem. then it is easy to see if that problem im having is an issue with other people. and if its been resolved. give the cook mod status of the particular sub forum and they can moderate it themselfs. so if you agree vote Agree on the poll if you dont vote Disagree on the poll.

My friend, although your spirit is so good, but your means doesn't justify your ends. We need more cooks & not three of them. This will make things more unequal. We could have had it in the form of kitchens thread but believe me even that doesn't justify its goal. What if someone like me cooks a ROM & I may have to tell mods to make another sub-thread for me, then do you think I will be able to answer all the threads which will come up related to issues of my ROM? Wonder all things getting messed up. Nothing more nothing less bro. Make it more lean & it will solve many problems. Good Luck bro. Appreciating your suggestions again.

sakshamkatyal said:
My friend, although your spirit is so good, but your means doesn't justify your ends. We need more cooks & not three of them. This will make things more unequal. We could have had it in the form of kitchens thread but believe me even that doesn't justify its goal. What if someone like me cooks a ROM & I may have to tell mods to make another sub-thread for me, then do you think I will be able to answer all the threads which will come up related to issues of my ROM? Wonder all things getting messed up. Nothing more nothing less bro. Make it more lean & it will solve many problems. Good Luck bro. Appreciating your suggestions again.
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Hey bro you wanna drink some natty ice, play some game cube?
on topic... I think it sounds like a pretty solid idea, would help with a lot of the organizational problems.

Cooks come and go! It sure wont make sense to have a sub-forum for them! If you follow xda for a while, you will understand what I am talking about.

What a load of faffing about......
Mods don't get paid and would make more work for them as more to cover.
For all the info people get from XDA is free, so maybe a bit of searching isn't that bad if you want something bad enough you will find it.
Peace.

sakshamkatyal said:
My friend, although your spirit is so good, but your means doesn't justify your ends. We need more cooks & not three of them. This will make things more unequal. We could have had it in the form of kitchens thread but believe me even that doesn't justify its goal. What if someone like me cooks a ROM & I may have to tell mods to make another sub-thread for me, then do you think I will be able to answer all the threads which will come up related to issues of my ROM? Wonder all things getting messed up. Nothing more nothing less bro. Make it more lean & it will solve many problems. Good Luck bro. Appreciating your suggestions again.
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well first off if you are cooking roms to release to the public , then yes you should beable to anwser most questions that arise.
and second as i stated dont just give anyone a subforum only the cooks that truly contribute. only the serious cooks that have proven themselfs.
but the kitcens have truly gotten too easy for just anyone to make their own rom. and this would also help identify who the trusted / established cooks that know what they are doing are.

stylez said:
What a load of faffing about......
Mods don't get paid and would make more work for them as more to cover.
For all the info people get from XDA is free, so maybe a bit of searching isn't that bad if you want something bad enough you will find it.
Peace.
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i also addressed this in my original post
GTZ said:
give the cook mod status of the particular sub forum and they can moderate it themselfs
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GTZ said:
i also addressed this in my original post
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Yes i saw that but Mods still will have to have some control so therefore more work, as not all chefs are online and able to keep threads clean.
To be honest i like it the way it is.
just my 2p's worth.
There has been numerous threads like this generally for the software section to be split... I think XDA is set up the way it is and lets just be happy with the community and wealth of information we have..........

ai6908 said:
Cooks come and go! It sure wont make sense to have a sub-forum for them! If you follow xda for a while, you will understand what I am talking about.
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well what i was saying is give it to the ones that have earned it.
GTZ said:
now im not saying give one to just any person that half cooks a rom. it could even be based on a threashhold if the rom gets so many posts .. 200. or by votes. or just by the cooks reputation.
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if its a well known cook and they have been around for a while i think they have kinda earned it. what im saying would be a little extra work for anyone that would be willing to create the sub forums. it would ultimatly keep roms neater.
you could then have a thread for each rom. build . why should someone read through problems of 21198 then they have been fixed in 21500. there are lots of advantages to adopting this procedure. and very few drawbacks. (yes there are some) . if nothing else lets get some of the cooks opinions.
but i thank each of you for your feedback.

stylez said:
I think XDA is set up the way it is and lets just be happy with the community and wealth of information we have..........
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well i think if we wernt happy with the way it is we wouldnt be here. that doesnt mean there arent things that need improvement this place is constantly growing and its not uncommon for these forums to outgrow the old ways of doing things.
but again i respect your points of view also

It would make more sense for cooks to use a unified thread titling scheme.
For example, the tilt keyboard fix still has a title of [new] or something similar on it when it is years old.
Perhaps a loose standard should be developed so it is easier to find. Note: I spelled out the date so it is obvious to europeans and americans who list them differently. I hate early month dates!!! -----> 4-5-2009 April or May?
[October 15, 2009] - Anryl - WM6.5 25000 - v1

disagree
this is my vote

What are there no mods on duty today ?
Please, not another thread by another noob/ lazy user ? slamming the seniors for telling them to search. Here are the posting rules handed down by our Queen Flar.
1. Search before posting.........this isn't a suggestion or a senior being a jerk or an " unhelpful " post..... IT IS A RULE
2. Please be polite and respect your fellow users.......... the next time a noob gives me a ration of crap about a " wasted post " and " if I can't be helpful then mind my own business " when I instruct him as to the search function and ,as I ALWAYS do, start him in the right direction, I am going to hunt him down and remove his texting thumbs.
4. Post only using a clear subject and message. ........... I swear , if you could type in " help me pleeeeeease " into the search function, it would return over a thousand separate threads . It is this, and the thousands of I tried to search , but it is so haaaaaaard threads, that make searching so hard. Not the lack of information.
I liked it better back in the " old days " when asking a redundant or stupid question or if you were a noob that dared lash out after getting told to search, you would get drawn, quartered, tarred ,feathered and then set on fire. I lurked on this site from Nov until April when I finally joined, because I was terrified to ask a question. And I am fifty times more knowledgeable because of it . If I needed a question answered, I read and search, and search and read and found my answer. Because ALL the answers are here.
The models may change but the questions are all here. It seems now all you have to do is lash out about how unhelpful this place is, or how hard it is to search or how mean all the seniors are for " wasting my time telling me to search, when in the same time they could have just answered my damn question.", and before you know it , you have people falling all over themselves trying to answer this idiot's question. Because we can't have the noobs thinking we are unfriendly.
I have said it before and I will say it again. This is a library , NOT, HTC Tech support. Much as you would not go to the librarian and say give me all you've got on.....................
You ask the librarian where you would begin your search for................ and you go gather the information for yourself. So when a senior tells you to go search and start here, it is because we are following forum rule and noobs should be directed to also. And If that is not satisfactory to them them they should be directed to HTC Tech support because they are of no benefit to this community.
I like the way it was, is and will be. Search read and search some more, it is up to you to find it , not for the rest of us to fall over ourselves making it yet even easier because ...................
GTZ said:
if most people are like me (and i assume they are) they don't have time to search through thousands of posts just to find a possible answser to their questions.
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..........................i'm just sayin..................................
Okay, I have had my rant and vote, Josh, you can close the thread now

I honestly dont think that is a good idea because it would make it harder for new cooks to get there roms out, if a cook really is as good as you describe (which many are) you will find there roms but yes some cooks do upgrade phones and stop cooking and the sub-topic would then start falling apart and then no one will want to delete it otherwse all of that persons roms will be gone (I guess they could just move the threads actually) But still I think it seems unfair to newer cooks becaue the way it is set up now you can see if another rom starts to gain popularity otherwise everyone would only look at the cooks that have the most experiance.
BTW- I dont know how to cook but it sounds fun and I might want to learn someday if I stop feeling lazy lol so yeah thats one of the reasons I think like this but I guess this could be helpfull in some ways

GTZ said:
well what i was saying is give it to the ones that have earned it.
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There is no such thing as that! We all do this forum for free! So people do it when they find time! Once time is an issue cooks do vanish no matter how good they are! Just dont argue, read and enjoy the forum!

Let's appreciate the idea he had on his very first post, but I think We need to change the place of this discussion as well. Great buddy no more words no more options on my part, just ask anyone from senior members & they will tell you why they don't agree with this idea. They know the trend on this forum. Good Luck but I think this topic needs to be moved out of ROM upgrading atleast.

I think its lazy. You are trying to make stuff easier on yourself and make more work for the people poviding us with great ROMs, basically for free. I'm not sure if youve ever modified a forum but its no easy task. This isnt tech support. I have very few posts but thats because most of the questions are answered somewhere around here. If you dont have time to look, maybe you dont have time to flash. The rules are the rules abie by them.
Bottom line, dont make more work for the cooks, who spend hours and hours cooking for free just because you dont want to search.

[b]DISAGREE[/b]
Look at my SIG, especially the WHY ..
If you don't get the spirit, go somewhere else where people are willing to spoonfeed you. This is a developer site, not user site.
I'm not a developer, so what I can contribute is only bug reporting and testing .. and if you're not, have some respect to them, help them by doing more research. 99% of what you're looking for is there.

Chefs that would like to have their own subforum can just have another forum with a link on his topic.
This is exactly what Phoenix Dev Team does...

XDA-Devs board is a like friendly jungle. Just take your time to learn how to navigate through it, this is not that hard.
Flashing and upgrading regularly ROMs and softwares means you do have time for this. So one shall learn to have time to search. Anyway, by reading throught posts, one gets a much better control over his phone as you have more knowledge about this or that, not only a superficial approach, which will undeniably lead to a new thread: I don't get it, it's broken or similar .
Only my 2ct-philosophy...

Reminder about XDA

OK so i know this is the wrong forum, BUT I came across this and wanted to "bump" it so to speak. This was posted by kyphur in 08 and in a mods sig now. Please read and adhere to the spirit of the post. It is RIGHT ON!!!
I think what a lot of people forget is that this is not a "make my phone neat & kewl" place.
As implied by the name this is technically a Developers forum/community.
Now what does that mean? Well first off it means that there is an expectation that if you are here then you want to customize your device but rather than just installing something that someone packaged you want to understand how it works and maybe even enhance it yourself.
When I first came here with a Blue Angel it was a different environment. PDA Phones were not embraced by the general public because of the expense and complexity (I paid over $400 for my BA). A $400 phone 4 years ago was expensive, today the Tilt is $300 after rebates but with inflation & the rise in the cost of other devices and the fact that there are other sources out there giving them away for $150 our neat bit of kit has become popular with mainstream users.
Now we have a flood of new users who are asking not "How can I do this myself" but more like "Give me the quick fix" without caring to understand the process. See if you read the threads then you get to experience the learning process, you see how the issues were investigated and confirmed. Then you get to watch the different attempts at resolution and learn why some failed while others worked. That is called Development.
The NooB backlash is coming from users who have walked in the development shoes and is directed mainly at those who don't care for the journey but just want the end result or destination.
As a Development Forum we are just as much (if not more) about the journey. I've read so many comments like "I don't have time to read all of the threads" or "I don't care how it works, just that it does". These very statements are contrary to the heart & soul of XDA-Devs and that is why the backlash is so strong.
Let me be very clear on this: IF YOU DON'T CARE ABOUT UNDERSTANDING THE JOURNEY THEN YOU PROBABLY SHOULDN'T BE HERE IN THE FIRST PLACE.
XDA-Devs is about developers & hackers helping each other and working together to get the most out of our devices by understanding them better than most.
XDA-Devs is not about helping everyone who wants a "Kewl bit of kit" make their phone better than the guy next to him.
Now do we go kicking users off who never contribute anything, NO. We tolerate it to an extent. Where the toleration ends is when these users start diluting the usefulness of the forum by repeating the same questions over and over again.
You ask us to understand your position. Well if you want to benefit from our experience and time then I think it is only fair that you understand our position.

Maybe you can recommend an alternative site for people who just want the newest tweaks and software.

the idea is not that only developers should be looking at this site, but that this is a place where developers communicate with each other and the beneficiaries of their work. This is not the place for someone to post threads about general questions about how to use or mod their device. This is a place that will develop the capabilities of the android platform if it is allowed. Developers WILL abandon this forum if it becomes a bulletin board or a technical support site.....and if you need a question answered, there are other forums on THIS site to address those.

Agreed 100%. While developing for the Windows mobile, I also got the same thing. I would post a thread and WARN people of a certain things and tell them how to fix it. Then I'd get 30 pages of "geeze, you broke something. how do you fix it?" That gets annoying real fast. I would love it if this forum forced people to take a test before they could post in the development sections... Before that, they should only be able to post in the regular sections.
One thing that really bugs me is the fact that the newbs don't want to search but don't realize that they take OUR time to search FOR them. No one knows everything. Every developer on this site searches and learns. I know that if you put together all the time that I've spent on this site JUST researching and searching, it'd be MONTHS and MONTHS of non-stop, no sleep searching and researching. So why can't the average person search for 2 minutes? Is their time worth more than my time?
/rant - while talking on the phone so it might not make sense...

Pinesal said:
Maybe you can recommend an alternative site for people who just want the newest tweaks and software.
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There are thousands, but essentially all they do is copy stuff off here.
Like the post said, if you just want to root your phone so it can do 'cool stuff' and not give a **** about how the damn thing works then maybe you shouldn't be modding your phone (that wasn't aimed at you btw, just 'people' in general the market place is made up of 99% 'these people' who don't/can't read and it's pretty irritating.)
Agree with the post 100%, fantastic

we sadly are living in the (ME) world
there is such a huge gape beetween the 10-19 generation and 20-29
10-19 generation is living in such an easy world, they never had to blow into their nintendo cassettes , know how heavy a quantum bigfoot is or what RTFM mean's

You said it, this is in the wrong forum.
You're not an admin and although you can spend your time here (and pretty much all of your posts) reporting out-of-place threads, you're still not an admin.
People always wonder into communities and it always takes a while to learn the way things work. Mickey is doing a good job on closing and moving threads that are unrelated to development.
With that said...
Reported.

Agreed. It's really, really, really, really getting to me. I wish OP's had semi-moderator power. They could at least delete all necessary posts and ban that user - if required- for a certain amount of time from their thread only.

jubeh said:
You said it, this is in the wrong forum.
You're not an admin and although you can spend your time here (and pretty much all of your posts) reporting out-of-place threads, you're still not an admin.
People always wonder into communities and it always takes a while to learn the way things work. Mickey is doing a good job on closing and moving threads that are unrelated to development.
With that said...
Reported.
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ughh, no i'm not an admin, and no almost all my posts, or the majority, or a half are reported threads, but i do try to help out the mods when i can. they are not on all forums at all times and can use the help, and they have said as much.

Oh thank you thank you! People here should want to understand why thing the work as they work. Not just want their phones to look cool.

As it you wouldnt know it, i have been with xda for years well since the titan came out. before that i was modding an ipaq and of course the old palms. everyonce in awhile i lose interest and move on only to come back when i have something new(major a.d.d). i do write java as well as c and even c++(so on) i typically find this place useful to try stuff out and even set up my own custom rom just for me. i dont post because i can google. while i have many of my own questions i would like answered i simply dont ask most of the time(such as using micro kernels and modding app2sd to make the os have two options sd in or out. however the problem is not the generations or age difference or anything like that. its social systems outside of xda. posting a reply used to mean an answer or something useful. now its normal to simply post "great job". thats nice and all but maybe instead of complaining about it we should come up with a new system that improves xda. like a sorting system or sub thread system and set up catagorys for our replys. like thumbs up would be for the "good job". i know its hard to keep everyone happy but this is a forum first, a forum has design problems when you get the number of people xda has. use advanced search it helps a lot. a sorting system with requirements for certain catagorys would help devs. its not easy modding and getting it right and you cant do it alone. xda is the help even if its not your phone sometimes others have solutions too. such as winmo users putting android on their phones(yes i did it too my old titan for fun). things i learned and other devs learn can help us and vice versa. i have yet to find bad technology only poorly thought out ideas that could have been. which is why we mod.
p.s. wtf is up with palm and blackberry ads all the time.

Most of those kids just want the answer or fix in the next 3min. with perfect steps or a patch that supposedly will fix and hack their device,after that they´ll never show up.
All they want is to show off without bothering to read.

I totaly understand. I do feel sometimes that certain devs do get a bit annoyed with people who just want to fix the phone and not understand. I'm not linux or coding wiz. But whe I got here in may I was one of the people who just wanted me phone to be better than urs. I still have that to some extent but I have developed more of a "how and what is causeing this issue" attitude. I try to contribute as best as I can. Helping out over at q&a as best as I can. I enjoy xda and without my days would be more boring than what the are now. I dunno I guess I'm just rambling. Bottom line is I have tried to correct my attitude toward modding. Hell I even post my email so users can drop a line if they need help.

i am 20 and i fondly remember blowing into my nes super nes and genesis games.

i am pretty new to XDA. when i first found this site all i wanted was a quick fix. now i am getting more intrested in the actual dev aspect. i want to be able to create my own rom eventualy. yes i do find myself asking stupid questions and getting some foul responses but in my opinion no question is a stupid one. only the one not asked. yes alot of people just want a fix but there are new users who want to learn. like me. so i appreciate the help i have recieved from most members. and i alwasy appoligise for my stupidity. so dont get down on all noobs because alot of us want to learn and the only way to is to ask.

saprano614 said:
i am pretty new to XDA. when i first found this site all i wanted was a quick fix. now i am getting more intrested in the actual dev aspect. i want to be able to create my own rom eventualy. yes i do find myself asking stupid questions and getting some foul responses but in my opinion no question is a stupid one. only the one not asked. yes alot of people just want a fix but there are new users who want to learn. like me. so i appreciate the help i have recieved from most members. and i alwasy appoligise for my stupidity. so dont get down on all noobs because alot of us want to learn and the only way to is to ask.
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nobody is getting down on noobs. ONLY the site users who FAIL to post questions and general comments in the correct forum

jaaronmoody said:
nobody is getting down on noobs. ONLY the site users who FAIL to post questions and general comments in the correct forum
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Just want to make a statement befor someone did.

I thank you for this post. I came to this forum a long time ago I have learned quite a bit and appreciate everything that is done here. There are very skillful people that are on here and I wish I had the amount of skill then thesemodders, hackers, developers etc... have I keep my mouth shut unless i feel there is some thing that i know how to answer, i have never complained about a single rom i simply research what can be done to change for fix it, all answers rely in a search somewhere either here or google. I just wish other people would do the same then we would be able to prevent a 300+ page threads where only about 25 pages are worth anything.
look at the amount of posts from someone who knows they are barley able to contrubute(but do what he can) and been here this long. compared to people who have been here dont have much to contribute but love to post everything that comes to thier minds.
Join Date
22nd October 2006
Total Posts
89

samygent said:
we sadly are living in the (ME) world
there is such a huge gape beetween the 10-19 generation and 20-29
10-19 generation is living in such an easy world, they never had to blow into their nintendo cassettes , know how heavy a quantum bigfoot is or what RTFM mean's
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HEY!
im 18 and clearly remember blowing into those damn games to make them work. but when they worked, so much fun i still think theyre better than the crappy xbox and ps3 games of today... but thats just me. lol

pleeease yall! let's keep THIS thread on topic! LOL!!

A request to all the devs here, about including info in first post.

This NOT ment to be *****ing, I AM grateful for all the great work being done, But i do WISH every single dev could include this in their first post in their ROMs thread:
-What the ROM is based on (HTC framework, ADP, ADP with Sense from Dream, Sense from Hero etc.)
->What works (or not) of:
* LED
* bluetooth
These are common problems with HERO ROMs, and if every dev posted this info, it would be great. For me non-LED= not usable, and for some periods of time (ie. when I'm driving much), so is no BT
->Included apps.
*Especially important are sms-spamming apps such as myfaves - coud be critical to know about.
->recommended compache settings, swapiness etc, what is used in ROM as standard for these values.
We see every Hero-thread filling up with questions about BT, LED, what HERO-version, and what framework, and whatnot. Taking 2mins to post this info could help save so much time,and so much spam/question in the ROM thread.
Apps added/removed and the other stuff is also higly relevant to non-HERO roms.
Again, this is constructive criticism aka a humble suggestion, not an angry demand from some jerk with e-penile problems. (Or so I'd like to believe, at least.)
If anyone has any suggestion as to what other info you would like to see in a ROM announcement? Post it here, maybe we can "help" the devs out by making a complete template we would like them to follow. Input from devs highly appreciated too, ofc.
I know there are toher things that shoul also be listed, such as SPL and radio required etc., although I believe almost everyone includes it. Most devs include most of the items on the list too, but many do not include all of it.
Also, I am sorry for posting this in this category, but this is where the ROMs are posted and the devs can see it.
I hope this thread has its place here. Different people are lokking for different things, and both the user and devs benefit from the user knowing what they get. (It would hopefully limit the number of "spam" questions from users if the first post contained all this information, we know many people are afraid of the search button. Also, it would be easier to wield the ban hammer on people whoe doesn't even bother to look at the simple list in the first post, and waste other peoples time.)
If a dev included enough information, ROM lists with information abut different ROMs would also be much easier to maintain for the good people making them.

It may make things more organized, but it means devs have to update the list, and pay less attwntion to -actual ROM development.
And in my opinion, a little trial and error never hurt anyone.

TermyJW said:
It may make things more organized, but it means devs have to update the list, and pay less attwntion to -actual ROM development.
And in my opinion, a little trial and error never hurt anyone.
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This is TRUE!
I so hope that Hero ROM's on donut are much more snappier! I'm addicted, I want a ROM to use for a few months! Hehe.

Yeah, it would be nice if there was a template developers could follow for posting. It would make thing's so much smoother.
Possibly in the title of the post have;
[ROM] [SENSE] "Title Here"
[ROM] [PULSE] "Title Here"
[ROM] [MOTOBLUR] "Title Here"
[ROM] [1.6] "Title Here"
[ROM] [1.5] "Title Here"

I agree with the OP there are times where i i can't flash 5 different ROMs in a day and i skip over some because of lack of info and screenshots. Maybe the community can build a template that the ROM devs can use?

damnitpud said:
I agree with the OP there are times where i i can't flash 5 different ROMs in a day and i skip over some because of lack of info and screenshots. Maybe the community can build a template that the ROM devs can use?
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Are you thinking about getting back into making themes?

not gonna happen

jubeh said:
not gonna happen
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word im too lazy

they already spend there time developing the roms, i dont think they have the time to make the "proper layout"

Binary100100 said:
Are you thinking about getting back into making themes?
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I have been playing around with some images, made changes for my own phone but haven't done much else. I did just get laid off from my job so if i go the unemployment route you will definitely see me more in these forums. If i can't find a job soon i plan on getting into Java programming(i have a few app ideas) and possibly making my own ROMs. But we have to see where the job market takes me.
To stay on topic, the devs do spend a lot of time dev'n and having a template in a txt file would make posting easier for them. I have made a few threads and i can tell you making a layout for a post isn't that easy and is not much fun. If we can make an empty template that they only have to fill in their info...they would be doing the same amount of work on the post, just easier cause its all laid out for them.
We would need a sticky for it and have the devs vote on it or something.

That's a great idea it would be so much easier plus people won't be trashing threads with dumb ass questions is this for G1? Does this work or does it still do that and so on....
I mean before they upload the Rom they know most of the bugs so just saying known issues r these and that would help and just knowing what's new in the release doesn't help just confuses most of the noobs here...I'm one of them.
A little off topic but I'm a recruiting officer in a PC gaming community and I review clan applications, there were times when main application was down so I just made a sticky Thread with a template of the application to fill up and post it as a new thread
I mean look all of the devs pretty much do that already anyhow, every thread they make look exactly as the other 1 we just need a clean template that they all could use and just made it as a sticky thread and lock it so every1 could use it.

Zarboz said:
word im too lazy
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If you're making a ROM and posting it on xda, you obviously want other people to use it.
If the first post is sloppy and not informative or up to date. Less people will use your ROM. Thus, less people will test it. Therefore, you won't be able to figure out the bugs. If you're sloppy with info, you'll lose, not us.
Something that should be standard:
A proper title like suggested earlier such as [ROM] [1.6 - Pulse] [******]
(none of that [ROM] ***MghtyMax 1.9.1*** "WHAT A FEELING!" stuff....Sorry, but it's just plain horrible.)
Another thing should be a list of features, things that work, things that don't.
Screenshots are also very nice and descriptive. A lot of new users might not know what Pulse, Hero, etc. looks like.
If you take the time to work on a ROM, you have the time to work on a nice looking first post. Don't half ass your work. It makes you look unprofessional.

I agree with the first poster, also MD5 hashes would be nice.

As damnitpud mentions, this would probably make it easier for devs, not harder. This is about *not* forccing them to make the proper layout themselves, but serve as a pre-made basis for them to fill in. In ready made bb-code ofc.
Since the mighty max-rom was brought up, this is noe ROM i did not download and flash immedeatly beacause I couldn't find info about BT working or not. Also would like to know if it were the SENSE from Dream or Hero. And some other details.
As I have time to sit down and flash my phone maybe two days a week, tops, I would like to know what I want to try beforehand. I also don't want to read four hundred post with questions that sometimes are answered in the first post, sometimes in the thread, sometimes not at all. But IF they had been answered in first post - and especially if it were in standard list that all/most devs used, it would be hard to miss it, and save a lot of stupid and/or lazy people nagging.
md5 hashes is absolutely something that should be on such a list, ohnoezmahfone. That is certainly lacking, and quite important for people with a good-for-nothing-ISP or net by 3G modem etc.

Someone make up a template. There will always be someone who will volunteer to do it for the developer.

All great ideas.
Especially for the sake of SEARCH.
Example:
I enter a search for "bluetooth working hero" and up pops 4000 unhelpful results most where 1000 noobs are asking if it works or not without doing the proper research in the prior posts.
An all informative 1st post would reduce this and the unnecessary flaming that follows (also part of results)
Also, it would also be real nice if everyone keep their personal lives to themselves.
Noone cares if your "flashing [other irrelavant ROM] now because BT aint working for Hero yet. This also shows up in results.
If I want you to kno whats on my device, i'll put it in my sig
I know i just made "BT working Hero" one more result longer [4001] but i had to vent. Sometimes searching can be very annoying and cumbersome.
Less results means less hassle for devs and users.
Once again, great ideas

[attention] iron fist anouncement

You've probably read the new Operation Iron Fist going on here: http://forum.xda-developers.com/announcement.php?f=1159
As of now, I will no longer stand for the way some things are going here. If I see ANY trolling, flaming, or disrespectful behaviour, you will receive an infraction on the spot. No more warnings.
Also, offtopic chatter on the development forums is exceptionally high here. This will stop, since I will also infract upon it.
Just one more thing: if you encounter ANY of above mentioned offences, let me know ASAP, instead of foulmouthing about it on the public forum. If I see that, you WILL get an infraction too.
I am sorry for acting this way, but you guys are forcing me to do this.

Sounds good to me, unless "iron fist" translates in reality to Naziism.
There's a difference in insulting people, and trying to contribute and being attacked. I tried to contribute by pointing out that there were several bugs that were fairly severe. If a user doesn't point them out, what's the point of ever releasing anything beyond 1.0 and then closing the thread?
However, there's a small group of users in the community who have resorted to fanaticism, and when someone goes that direction it shouldn't be tolerated. When I get criticized for bringing up a bug, and told I'm a "habitual complainer" how is that supposed to encourage anyone to want to participate in the DEVELOPMENT of anything for any phone? For some reason the Infuse 4G participants who I'm referring to seem really on edge, and speak out (often personally) about anyone who says anything aside from praise.
We're not here to be reassured that the world is 100% good, and that everything everyone says is amazing, we're here to participate in an active development community, be it as a developer, or as a contributing end user. The moment you criticize your user base is the moment you go from being an open community of developers and end users to a system of dictatorship, and closed platformism (yeah, it's a word now because I said so), lol.
To the people who squash anyone who's new, or doesn't know something, or volunteers that they're having a problem and need help, STOP. There's no need to make someone feel bad for asking a question a second time in a 3000+ post thread and then criticizing them for not reading the answer in post 2106 on page 291. There's no need to tell someone they are full of crap when they say they're having internet speed issues, and that since it works for you to your satisfaction that they're obviously less intelligent. There's no reason to tell someone they're wrong just because you disagree with them.
To make this a "community" everyone has to be understanding that everyone has their opinions, and that we're all here to make the phone in whatever thread a better phone.
Without developers, this site wouldn't exist. Without end users wanting mods, this site wouldn't exist. If you continue to alienate anyone who's new and turn this into a fanboy forum, it's just going to send them back to Apple iOS forums and devices. If that's how you want to help turn the mobile community, fine, but personally, I don't.
Bella

True to some extent. But the main problem is this:
NeoS2007 said:
Just one more thing: if you encounter ANY of above mentioned offences, let me know ASAP, instead of foulmouthing about it on the public forum. If I see that, you WILL get an infraction too.
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Most people here think they can say ANYTHING to ANYONE. That's not what this forum is about. It's aimed at development and not discussion. If you feel you should debate in any way, move to another forum.
And you can call my method anything you like, I used to warn everyone before acting, but that's over. You of all people should know that.

I'm not about to take any sides, but Bella, you're completely out of line. Being part of the community is different than creating your own community. This is a group working together towards a common goal. To reach that goal, we must provide detailed, factual and documented information to the dev(s) so that we can enable them to create the best possible releases. I've seen no images, logcat, etc. that was provided by you. Granted, there are several others in the forum not providing these details, but there are several who have provided very specific and detailed information. It took far too long for you to provide this kind of information and it only turned the conversation south. You are not alone, so know I am not singing you out; there were several others who contributed to a negative environment. The reason for my posting this is because you were the only one to come here and plead your case.
That said, this is a community filled with individuals. We all have different personalities and will act and react differently to different scenarios. Hopefully this can be the beginning of a constructive and collaborative effort by us all to truly bring our Infuse to the next level.
I will not retort nor reply, I am simply sharing my views and experiences in this forum so far. The Captivate started off rough, but never reached this level. It won't be easy resurrecting this one from the ashes, but it can be done.

Right, you say I was unable to provide any factual data, yet I responded each time with factual and accurate data that was requested by GTG. I think some people get frustrated because often issues that come up are issues they just don't know how to solve, and often that leads to accusations that the end user is crazy, unintelligent, or just uncooperative, when the case is the opposite.
Clearly in the end I identified a data connectivity issue first (review thread if you like) that's been significant enough for him now to pull the ROM until he can resolve the issue. Rather than fellow members responding with productive comments, they responded in an attacking manor. My point was valid (as vetted by GTG at this point), and for those who weren't having the issue, why pipe in and say there's no problem? Do you take your car to the mechanic and tell him everything is working fine?
Initially I was called a complainer for bringing it to the attention. Unfortunately as a developer you can't expect that an end user is always going to be able to provide the detail you need. If I had the experience and desire to build a ROM I'd do it myself. It's kinda like building a house then expecting to know where to find a pipe junction inside a wall that only you know where it is. There's only so much expectation you can have of the end users.
Additionally, this is not the Google Developers Forum. This is not a forum of official Android releases, this is a hobbyist community of people who want to tinker with their phone. If a developer wants to be in an environment of developing for Google, maybe they ought to apply for a position at google.com/jobs. The ROMs that come out of XDA are great, but we have to realize there is nothing official about anything that comes from these forums.
I think the comment should be changed from "development, not discussion" to development and on-topic discussion. Because if you discourage discussion, it's like discouraging shopping in a mall. Discussion is what makes a forum like this great.
I'll certainly commit to staying on topic in the future.

Have at it neo. Thanks
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I997R using XDA App

Bella, you never provided the data requested. You just compared two modems - this was NOT what gtg asked for. He asked you to compare 2.0.1 to 2.0.2 performance. After looking through the thread, I'm fairly certain never provided this information, you just maintained that you had provided the requested data because of your modem comparison tests.
Perhaps you were under the mistaken impression that 2.0.1 to 2.0.2 was a modem firmware change - if you had opened the update zip to analyze the contents you would see that it was not. There's a reason gtg specifically asked you to compare 2.0.1 to 2.0.2 and not to compare UCKE3 vs UXKG3 modems, and the latter is what you did.
Also, the network connectivity issue was only one of the reasons gtg pulled the ROM. He was trying to be nice, but the poor attitude of many users in the thread was a MAJOR contribution to the ROM pull also. In addition to that, at least two developers have stated either in posts here or on IRC that they are extremely uneasy about releasing any ROM images on these forums because of the poor behavior on these threads. It is also why I currently have a "no support, don't PM me" policy for the kernel I released - it was the only solution to getting experienced users the build that many were asking for without subjecting myself to the painful experience gtg did.

PLEASE have at it! I haven't visited this forum in a few years (iPhone) and now that i'm back with an Infuse this place isn't anything like it use to be.
My 2cents.

Entropy512 said:
Bella, you never provided the data requested. You just compared two modems - this was NOT what gtg asked for. He asked you to compare 2.0.1 to 2.0.2 performance. After looking through the thread, I'm fairly certain never provided this information, you just maintained that you had provided the requested data because of your modem comparison tests.
Perhaps you were under the mistaken impression that 2.0.1 to 2.0.2 was a modem firmware change - if you had opened the update zip to analyze the contents you would see that it was not. There's a reason gtg specifically asked you to compare 2.0.1 to 2.0.2 and not to compare UCKE3 vs UXKG3 modems, and the latter is what you did.
Also, the network connectivity issue was only one of the reasons gtg pulled the ROM. He was trying to be nice, but the poor attitude of many users in the thread was a MAJOR contribution to the ROM pull also. In addition to that, at least two developers have stated either in posts here or on IRC that they are extremely uneasy about releasing any ROM images on these forums because of the poor behavior on these threads. It is also why I currently have a "no support, don't PM me" policy for the kernel I released - it was the only solution to getting experienced users the build that many were asking for without subjecting myself to the painful experience gtg did.
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Understood. I provided what he asked to the best of my ability at the time ... I'd reference my post but I'm not digging through a 3000 message thread, sorry. :-(

Matt-Helm said:
PLEASE have at it! I haven't visited this forum in a few years (iPhone) and now that i'm back with an Infuse this place isn't anything like it use to be.
My 2cents.
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The Inspire and Aria forums were much more friendly, it's not this site, it's just the Infuse forum in general. I had a very positive experience in the Inspire threads

I think it was not the fact that you raised an issue that bothered the developers, it was the manner in which it was raised.
Also, look at it from a developer's perspective - when the thread is filled with posts that clearly indicate that the poster didn't even read the first post of the thread in its entirety (not saying that you did this, but many others did), it gets massively frustrating.
I've never seen so many people completely fail to read/comprehend the first post of a thread as the Infused v2 thread. Even after it was put into the first post as a known issue, we still got reports of HDMI not working every 3-4 pages.
After what could be effectively described only as an all-weekend hack session two weekends ago, everyone's been a bit exhausted/burned out. But everyone keeps demanding MORE MORE MORE!

Entropy512 said:
Also, look at it from a developer's perspective - when the thread is filled with posts that clearly indicate that the poster didn't even read the first post of the thread in its entirety (not saying that you did this, but many others did), it gets massively frustrating.
I've never seen so many people completely fail to read/comprehend the first post of a thread as the Infused v2 thread. Even after it was put into the first post as a known issue, we still got reports of HDMI not working every 3-4 pages.
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I agree 100% ... the only thing I can say is that remember that many people come from iphone, aka the dev team blog, which is much different. On theirs you read from the bottom up. I don't think that's an excuse since XDA uses the globally accepted standard in forums. But yeah, last night there were about 25 people in an hour asking why the links didn't work, lol.

Not really sure if this is on topic or not.... I just looked up "Iron Fisting" and this was the first result http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=iron fisting
Holy cow! The mods/admins mean business!

AdamOutler said:
Not really sure if this is on topic or not.... I just looked up "Iron Fisting" and this was the first result http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=iron fisting
Holy cow! The mods/admins mean business!
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I know my mouth (and legs) will be shut going forward.

Bravo Neo. Bravoooooooooooooo.

Thank you!
Looking forward to seeing a cleaned up forum!
by the way? how do u become an admin?
i spend way to much time on here...even while im at work (because its my job relates highly to this)

AdamOutler said:
Not really sure if this is on topic or not.... I just looked up "Iron Fisting" and this was the first result http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=iron fisting
Holy cow! The mods/admins mean business!
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(removed comment)
looking forward to clean and healthy forum.

I hope I'm not going to make any enemies by saying this, but I can't say I entirely agree with this being an iron fist. So far all that has been done is the Infused v2 ROM thread was locked. On any other forum I frequent they start with punishing the offenders individually, and only lock the thread as a last resort. I didn't see anybody get personally warned and I didn't see anybody get banned, and it really was only a handful that caused problems. I know there were a LOT of people that were posting the same questions over and over, but that can't be helped most of the time. The ones that were bickering and really ruining the thread are still posting happy as can be. I know it sounds like I'm questioning the mod(s) or being ungrateful, but I don't mean it that way. I just feel like we lost the ability to have an important and fun discussion before all the possible options were explored. Now if gtg asked for the thread to be locked then that is an entirely different matter, but I didn't get that impression from reading the last post.
I really do enjoy these forums and always have, and feel like this board is run very well. By this board, I mean the Infuse board. I just wanted to say that I don't know if I entirely agree with the way the infused thread was handled.
EDIT: I wanted to add that I know the mod(s) do this for free in their spare time, and I know that you can't police it 24/7. I really do appreciate your efforts at running this board, and the ONLY thing that I've seen that I take "issue" with is the handling of the Infused thread. Maybe there are things behind the scenes that I didn't see, and if that is the case then I apologize.

The Infused forum is only locked temporarily, as I asked the dev to contact me when his rom is finished.
Thanks for your support people. Just remember to report anything that's offensive/disrespectful/wrong/etc. and I'll take care of it.

NeoS2007 said:
The Infused forum is only locked temporarily, as I asked the dev to contact me when his rom is finished.
Thanks for your support people. Just remember to report anything that's offensive/disrespectful/wrong/etc. and I'll take care of it.
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I did see where it was locked only temporarily. I just wanted to get that off my chest, so to speak. It wasn't REALLY bugging me, but I did get pretty frustrated with how people were acting. It was pretty ridiculous. Like I said before, I really do appreciate your efforts to keep our forums running smoothly. Thank you for your continued presence and work, and for not taking my post personally, (at least I don't think you did ).