Related
Hello, I have lodged a complaint and asked HTC to email me the fact that the X7510 is not fit for purpose.
Let me elaborate. I administer a Microsoft SBS 2003 server. My user/owner of the company asked me to research a mobile device which would synchronise all his Exchange/My Documents items. The HTC X7510 seemed the right choice as it appeared to allow complete synchronisation and had a 16GB storage size. No limitations were mentioned.
I then get the device and find:
1) It cannot synchronise My Documents to the 16GB storage
2) It cannot synchronise his Exchange server mailbox (10GB) 60,000 mail items - crashes
I mean, what's the point? 16GB of what?
Please do not mention 3rd party products as I am interested in an out of the box solution which this HTC is meant to be.
I just though that I would save a few people some time and money by reading this and then they would purchase a laptop.
Probably wouldn't bother with the Shift either if this is what you get.
Thanks.
Adrian.
Adrian,
With respect, an Exchange 2003 mailbox that goes over 2GB is poorly managed and will become corrupted. Microsoft has a utility to specifically deal with and recover Exchange 2003 mailboxes that are over 2 gigs. Get your boss to archive more often!
Addtionally, it is entirely possible to sync almost the entire contents of My Docs, but the question I'd ask is why would you want to?
A business owner would typically have many documents confidential to the business in their My Docs, so it's not a clever idea to sync all that to a portable device. A far better and more elegant solution would be to use SBS's remote workplace and the remote desktop client on the HTC. That way he can even use full apps installed at the office.
Also, I think you may miss the point of the Shift - most people seem to!
DON'T think of it as a phone, or a PDA or a WM device of any kind. It is a UMPC that just happens to have a WM side, so you don't always have to have the whole thing fully booted up. As such, the WM side was NOT intended to be free standing, as on any other WM device, but rather to compliment the functionality of the PC side.
Now some very clever people came up with Shift packs that allow you to "liberate" the WM side, making it far more fully featured, but it still is (in WM terms) a poor cousin to the Athena.
Go get a laptop, you say? Fine, but I suggest first do a needs analysys so you get a device/UMPC/laptop/mainfram/whatever that will actually deliver what you're looking at achieving.
Thanks..
Thanks for your elaborate and Company oriented reply.
My client (actually a friend of mine), I just happen to be an IT consultant, is a lawyer. He needs access to most of his My Documents and also all his emails. Exchange 2003 handles his 9.98 GB mailbox realy well in the office. From his laptop he RDPs over a VPN into the server no bother.
I do not think that a sync schedule which is .5K x 60000 items = 30MB should cause the Advantage a problem. And thats all his mailbox, if I just do 2007 and 2008 then thats 25000 items x 0.5K = 12.5MB.
Also the sync just does not complete - via cable, wireless (pardon the pun) or 3G. Now thats no big deal, just don't sell it as a complete sync solution for MS Exchange.
Also, the country I am in has a maximum ADSL bandwidth of 2MB down 512K up, to which his server is attached via a Cisco router.
RDP from the Advantage is a no because his eyesight is bad.
Thanks again for your constructive reply!
Actually my reply was neither company orientated, nor elaborate. If you wanted elaborate then we can delve into the mysteries of the Jet db technology underpinning Exchange 03, since that will also explain the 2 GB mailbox limit. Instead my reply was technically orientated.
I support amongst other things several Exchange 03 installations. Your friend's mailbox alone is approaching the 16 GB db limit Exchange 03 has (18 to 75 GB on SP2 boxes) and I will categorically state his mailbox is poorly managed.
Remember, WM does NOT sync an entire mailbox, but instead a subset of it. Going by what your client wants no WM device will do the trick. Instead, I suggest using a laptop with offline files and folders enabled. That way he'd have his FULL mailbox and ALL his docs with him.
Tell you one thing, though: the minute I hear my solicitor carries ALL his documents out of the office all the time is the minute I change law firm! The exposure is simply too great.
Iphone 3G, N95 8 GB
Thanks agan for your concise and erudite reply.
I will therefore, after several cooked ROMS and various HTC's, not darken this doorstep again.
I have configured my N95 8GB, and an IPhone 3G to sync this Exchange mailbox succesfully. They do not have the MS Office funtionality my friend requires.
Yes it is SP2 and I will be moving to SBS 2008 as soon as SP1 for SBS 2008 comes out .
The Advantage - It cannot do what it says.
And it costs a bomb.
And you, (well, I'm using you as the corporate HTC/Microsoft Active Sync/Jet Database/etc. figure) still haven't answered why the My Documents folder cannot be sync'd to the 16GB Flash out of the box but rather to the phone memory.
At the end of the day (and especially these credit crunch days) the user wants what the user wants. And what the user wants is a mobile device which has all his documents and all his emails.
The Advantage cannot do that, therefore is not fit for purpose.
"Smart Mobility?"
Regards,
Adrian.
Office 2007
Oh, sorry, I forgot to mention that the users in the office with the SBS 2003 box are running Office 2007.
Thus, were I to use FTGate or MDaemon, or even a local pop account as opposed to Exchange, I could in theory have a local pst (or ost) file up to a size of 20GB. http://support.microsoft.com/kb/830336
And so, if I chose an Advantage, with Office 2007 and a local pst file, ActiveSync could not synchronise all of it.
The Advantage is not fit for purpose. Or is it Windows Mobile that is not fit for purpose?
Probably Windows, 27 Microsoft exams have taught me this.
Don't sell something if it can't do what it says on the tin.
Adrian.
Adrian,
I don't want this to degenerate into a my-daddy-is-bigger-than-your-daddy type of argument. Having said that, I disagree with you on several aspects:
1) The .PST file in Outlook 03 and 07 can be configured to be up to 33 TB (yes, Tera Bytes) in size. The 33 TB limit is NOT defined by Microsoft, but instead is a by-product of the Unicode encoding used in the file, just as the previous 2 GB limit was the result of limitations to the ANSI encoding such files used before. But all this ignores actual mailbox limitations brought into play by Exchange 03. The default maximum size for an Exchange 03 mailbox is 2 GB - imposed by Microsoft. You CAN override this by manually editing the value using the ADSIEdit console, but before doing so I suggest first exploring the reasoning behind the 2 GB limit - there's a great deal of sense in that limit.
2) I'd dearly LOVE to know how you managed to sync a 10 GB mailbox onto an 8 GB Nokia! Perhaps Nokia's discovered a new compression algorhythm that the rest of the world doesn't know about!
3) After you read through various MSDN articles on the 2 GB mailbox limit, and several other dealing with the suggested maximum number of items in each mailbox folder, kindly explain how you managed to sync a 10 GB mailbox over the air, given the number of forcefully dropped connections Exchange would do on a mailbox containing 60 000 mail items.
4) On MY x7510 My Docs lives on the 16 GB flash memory. It is a simple adjustment to make and an oversight on your vendor's part for not making it default. Still, with XP or Vista a default setup will not meet your needs, so why do you expect WM at default values to be perfect for YOUR needs?
5) I've never been described as a corporate HTC/Microsoft Active Sync/Jet Database/etc. figure. Actually I work for myself, although on occassion I employ sub-contractors. I do support as well as software development, integrating Exchange, Active Directory and 3rd party SQL databases, so I've learned a fair old bit about Exchange's insides. Please don't view me as advocate for corporateland, because I'm not.
I understand you're frustrated, mate, but I did not cause your frustrations, so please don't vent it on me. Nobody here dislikes you, and we'd all like you to stay. It is just that I (and I suspect a few others) disagree with your points of view. I happen to love my x7510, far more after Cmonex weaved her magic and got us all to the point where we can unlock our devices and flash newer/better ROMs to it. My device does EXACTLY what I need from it, so in several ways I'm very fortunate.
Then again, my needs were very clearly defined before I got the x7510. I need a hardware keyboard and a large screen capable of at least VGA as I do a lot of support via remote desktop. I like the on-board GPS (although it isn't essential to me) and I'm currently working on a method to allow some of my clients to view (at my discretion) where I am when I'm out and about for them.
I have no less than four Exchange installations at my office, but they're all lab networks, mimicking client setups. For my own mail I use Live mail from Microsoft because it is simple, easy and just works.
Please consider what I'm saying here: I believe your friend is trying to work dangerously far outside of accepted good practise. You can criticise me for saying that, but you cannot alter the facts.
If he was my client I'd get him an Acer Aspire One, or the new Asus Eee PC with Bluetooth, and a 3G USB connection. I'd then set the laptop up as essentially a thin client and have him log on to a machine at his office using remote desktop.
The Aspire One is a nice little toy with a far larger screen than any WM device, and is hugely cheaper than the HTC Shift. It would give him all the functionality he seems to be after, without risking any data falling in the wrong hands.
Agree but disagree.
OK, I must admit this user is pushing the boundaries of the meaning if the word "mobility" but if you are going to sell a product that synchronises with Exchange, surely that means all possibilities for Exchange (or a pst for that matter).
It's like buying a car and finding out that it runs for 50 miles and then stops, which is what happens with the Advantage - it says it has synchronised but hasn't, no errors, failures, nothing.
By the way, it seems it is not a limit on the size of the mailbox but the number of items per folder. I have split his years into months in the inbox/sent folders and I am on 2004 already.
Takes a long time for the initial sync, but once it does it, every subsequent sync flies through, even over GPRS as the looking for changes happens pretty much straight away, it's the processing of the emails which takes the time.
I was joking about leaving the XDA forum - at the end of the day it is not HTC but Windows mobile that is at fault and I have had several HTC's, started with a Blue Angel I upgraded to WM 6.
Thanks for taking the time.
Adrian.
Found this elsewhere here on XDA-Devs: http://www.pdadb.net/index.php?m=pdachooser
Your friend might have some benefit from using that.
losdelrock said:
OK, I must admit this user is pushing the boundaries of the meaning if the word "mobility" but if you are going to sell a product that synchronises with Exchange, surely that means all possibilities for Exchange (or a pst for that matter).
It's like buying a car and finding out that it runs for 50 miles and then stops, which is what happens with the Advantage - it says it has synchronised but hasn't, no errors, failures, nothing.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Now I need to disagree there as well: Not all cars are made equal, either.
It seems to me that you're after a car with the looks of a Lamborghini Diablo, F1 racing performance and handling, space for 8 people and a dog, capable of being driven across the Sahara desert and through the Amazon jungle all with the comfort of a large BMW saloon, all while using only a teaspoon of fuel.
Be a pretty excellent vehicle if it actually existed, but we both know it doesn't, and never will. Now does this mean we should start criticising all car manufacturers, or simply accept some trade-offs when selecting our perfect car?
Dear NanoRuler ,
U rocks , i truly respect you because i have seen many people that are extremely difficult to satisfy yet unable to accept that he or she is difficult to be satisfied . I support u , NanoRuler rules
I prefer the Lamborghini Countach LP500s actually.
Hmm, just did a google on HTC X7510 R.R.P. and this came up:
http://www.cnet.com.au/mobilephones/phones/0,239025953,339285985,00.htm
And so, for that price, or anywhere near what we paid for it, my orginal post on this thread was correct.
A laptop is cheaper and better.
Q.E.D.
Adrian "Lamborgini Countach LP500s" N****
(Surname blanked as I don't want some wierdo turning up at my doorstep with an LP500s and an HTC X7510 attached who has succesfully synced a 60GB Exchange mailbox)
Adendum:
HTC working as well as can be expected, with 1 years emails on it.
losdelrock said:
A laptop is cheaper and better.
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Click to collapse
Laptop and communicator/(mobile computer) - noncomparable models, IMHO... Different sizes, different options...
Why complain
Why did you file a complaint? Lets face it Windows is unstable from the very start. They spent millions developing Vista but nobody wants to use it. If you want something stable, switch to an iphone with an Apple computer.
it is interesting to follow the hype of WP7. i am not a fan of 'early adopter' idea. I am looking for a replacement of my good old HTC touch diamond and still searching some infos regarding WP7 from forums which received several negative feedbacks. I would like to hear from the WP7 power user how i could do the following equivalent tasks in the winmo 6.1 since i use it productively at work and rely heavily on them:
1. Excel Mobile: edit excel file either on the go or on pc to analyse the result graphically and sometimes show it to the client. a sync using mobsync would be done before switching the edit from mobile to pc or vice versa
2. Automatic Call Recorder (ACR): automatically record 2-way call conversation without pressing any button. Useful for recording phone number without taking notes (you could just replay the record many times) or recording directions given by the boss
3. GPS navigation app with offline map and rerouting function: I often lose GSM signal while driving to the clients in remote areas. rerouting is useful if i need to drive to new client which area is unfamiliar and easily to get the wrong turn :-(
4. Sync all outlook + backup SMS data: i am using Activesync for the outlook & PPCPimBackup for the sms. i can get the whole data back from the past to the the latest after the ROM is upgraded e.g. i have 3000+ text messages
5. No data in the cloud - company policy: company data is not allowed to be stored in the cloud whatever the reason. i know it is ridiculous because data could be easily taken if the mobile phone is stolen
6. File explorer: to organise all types of files in the internal storage
nope, wp7 will not fit your needs at all. I would look for a used hd2 if you want newer hardware.
budsant said:
it is interesting to follow the hype of WP7. i am not a fan of 'early adopter' idea. I am looking for a replacement of my good old HTC touch diamond and still searching some infos regarding WP7 from forums which received several negative feedbacks. I would like to hear from the WP7 power user how i could do the following equivalent tasks in the winmo 6.1 since i use it productively at work and rely heavily on them:
1. Excel Mobile: edit excel file either on the go or on pc to analyse the result graphically and sometimes show it to the client. a sync using mobsync would be done before switching the edit from mobile to pc or vice versa
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Has Excel.
2. Automatic Call Recorder (ACR): automatically record 2-way call conversation without pressing any button. Useful for recording phone number without taking notes (you could just replay the record many times) or recording directions given by the boss
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is potentially illegal.
3. GPS navigation app with offline map and rerouting function: I often lose GSM signal while driving to the clients in remote areas. rerouting is useful if i need to drive to new client which area is unfamiliar and easily to get the wrong turn :-(
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Would have to buy an app for this. Google/Bing Navigation isn't offline. I don't think TeleNav is, either. Personally, I would recommend a dedicated GPS system if this is what you need. Nokia phones come with Offline Map capabilities, and there are some apps (may get released soon) which offer it. But it's not a stock function and don't expect Microsoft to offer such a thing in Bing. These things take up a ton of storage space on you device, as well.
4. Sync all outlook + backup SMS data: i am using Activesync for the outlook & PPCPimBackup for the sms. i can get the whole data back from the past to the the latest after the ROM is upgraded e.g. i have 3000+ text messages
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No ( <- forgot that important 2 letter word unintentionally) Sync via USB to outlook. ActiveSync/DeltaSync keeps everything in Sync, anyways. Dunno why anyone keeps that many texts, but Microsoft will roll out Devices.Live.com for WP7 which will allow you to do almost all of what MyPhone offered for Windows Mobile - that includes backing up text messages.
5. No data in the cloud - company policy: company data is not allowed to be stored in the cloud whatever the reason. i know it is ridiculous because data could be easily taken if the mobile phone is stolen
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Company data does not get stored in the cloud. It's sync'd via the Exchange server the same way Windows Mobile, iOS, Android, and Blackberries Sync it. Windows Phone 7 supports Exchange Remote Wipe.
Your camera roll gets automatically Sync'd to SkyDrive, but why would you take uber sekret company photos on a smartphone, anyways...
6. File explorer: to organise all types of files in the internal storage
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Click to collapse
Don't count on it. The OS organizes things for you into Libraries. This really isn't needed that much. I dunno why people keep asking for it when Microsoft made it pretty clear that it isn't coming. WP7 isn't the only smartphone OS that doesn't have a File Manager in it.
@ Thread Title: Productivity is subjective and depends on what the person does on his/her device. You haven't really give anyone a clue as to what you do on you device, so it's hard to tell if it'll be productive to you. All you've done was put a tacky title on yet another "this is what I want for WP7. Is it there, is it coming, why isn't it there, etc." thread.
That may sound a bit harsh. Not intentionally. But that's basically what it is.
Windows Phone 7 is way more productive than Windows Mobile, generally speaking. Anything except maybe Blackberry OS and Symbian^3 is more productive than Windows Mobile.
N8ter said:
Has Excel.
This is potentially illegal.
Would have to buy an app for this. Google/Bing Navigation isn't offline. I don't think TeleNav is, either. Personally, I would recommend a dedicated GPS system if this is what you need. Nokia phones come with Offline Map capabilities, and there are some apps (may get released soon) which offer it. But it's not a stock function and don't expect Microsoft to offer such a thing in Bing. These things take up a ton of storage space on you device, as well.
Sync via USB to outlook. ActiveSync/DeltaSync keeps everything in Sync, anyways. Dunno why anyone keeps that many texts, but Microsoft will roll out Devices.Live.com for WP7 which will allow you to do almost all of what MyPhone offered for Windows Mobile - that includes backing up text messages.
Company data does not get stored in the cloud. It's sync'd via the Exchange server the same way Windows Mobile, iOS, Android, and Blackberries Sync it. Windows Phone 7 supports Exchange Remote Wipe.
Your camera roll gets automatically Sync'd to SkyDrive, but why would you take uber sekret company photos on a smartphone, anyways...
Don't count on it. The OS organizes things for you into Libraries. This really isn't needed that much. I dunno why people keep asking for it when Microsoft made it pretty clear that it isn't coming. WP7 isn't the only smartphone OS that doesn't have a File Manager in it.
@ Thread Title: Productivity is subjective and depends on what the person does on his/her device. You haven't really give anyone a clue as to what you do on you device, so it's hard to tell if it'll be productive to you. All you've done was put a tacky title on yet another "this is what I want for WP7. Is it there, is it coming, why isn't it there, etc." thread.
That may sound a bit harsh. Not intentionally. But that's basically what it is.
Windows Phone 7 is way more productive than Windows Mobile, generally speaking. Anything except maybe Blackberry OS and Symbian^3 is more productive than Windows Mobile.
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Click to collapse
you spent way too much time on that response to someone who obviously has no intention of getting a wp7 device.
But a great response none the less...
nrfitchett4 said:
you spent way too much time on that response to someone who obviously has no intention of getting a wp7 device.
But a great response none the less...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wrong attitude. He wants to know if he can use new OS and do things he needs to do.
doministry said:
Wrong attitude. He wants to know if he can use new OS and do things he needs to do.
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Click to collapse
He could have read any of the 400 reviews on this OS in its infancy and figured that out.
cloudy cloudy
@N8ter: thanks for the explanation. WP7 is connection data intensive, it needs a good data plan
@nrfitchett4: wow, i can feel the heat from your replies. calm down... anyway, i think older gadget such ad hd2 is more suitable for me (though i don't like its battery capacity for the huge display). you are right
@All others: any other opinions ?
my opinion: i get the feeling that without a good network coverage & signal the newer OSes (android/wp7/iphone) will reduce its ability to perform even a simple task. we are getting dependent a lot on the cloud
budsant said:
@N8ter: thanks for the explanation. WP7 is connection data intensive, it needs a good data plan
@nrfitchett4: wow, i can feel the heat from your replies. calm down... anyway, i think older gadget such ad hd2 is more suitable for me (though i don't like its battery capacity for the huge display). you are right
@All others: any other opinions ?
my opinion: i get the feeling that without a good network coverage & signal the newer OSes (android/wp7/iphone) will reduce its ability to perform even a simple task. we are getting dependent a lot on the cloud
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Sorry. Not trying to flame, just a lot of hate threads hear lately. Honestly for what you want to do, an hd2 is probably your best. Mature OS with high end device specs. Extended battery is available if you can stand the hump it will add, or carrying a spare battery is what I did with my tp2.
budsant said:
@N8ter: thanks for the explanation. WP7 is connection data intensive, it needs a good data plan
@nrfitchett4: wow, i can feel the heat from your replies. calm down... anyway, i think older gadget such ad hd2 is more suitable for me (though i don't like its battery capacity for the huge display). you are right
@All others: any other opinions ?
my opinion: i get the feeling that without a good network coverage & signal the newer OSes (android/wp7/iphone) will reduce its ability to perform even a simple task. we are getting dependent a lot on the cloud
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am poweruser of WM considering it's features as top.
And than I bought WP which I use for 3 weeks.
First, it's not true WP7 will not work without data transfer.
Mine works exactly like it should with data off. I mean it requires transfer for the things which need it anyway like email, browser etc.
I don't buy music from the marketplace...
Yes there are some apps which are connection based like translators ect. and I would love to see it offline too.
Now productivity - it's a question of what you really need.
In fact WP7 with Office and OneNote built in is very productive.
I love the platform for it's power and execution.
However I do miss things from WM. Android is unnacceptable UI wise....
So I am staying with WP7 if Microsoft will add more features to it.
If not - it will be tough call.
Now feeling how WP7 works I don't want to step back and everything else FEELS like a step backwards. And I hope I will not be forced to do it.
But my WM6.5 device is still with me ready to come back.
Well Said
doministry said:
I am poweruser of WM considering it's features as top.
And than I bought WP which I use for 3 weeks.
First, it's not true WP7 will not work without data transfer.
Mine works exactly like it should with data off. I mean it requires transfer for the things which need it anyway like email, browser etc.
I don't buy music from the marketplace...
Yes there are some apps which are connection based like translators ect. and I would love to see it offline too.
Now productivity - it's a question of what you really need.
In fact WP7 with Office and OneNote built in is very productive.
I love the platform for it's power and execution.
However I do miss things from WM. Android is unnacceptable UI wise....
So I am staying with WP7 if Microsoft will add more features to it.
If not - it will be tough call.
Now feeling how WP7 works I don't want to step back and everything else FEELS like a step backwards. And I hope I will not be forced to do it.
But my WM6.5 device is still with me ready to come back.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well said. I still have my HTC FUZE, in fact the SIM card I used in my new Samsung Focus was the one I used in the FUZE. I can insert it back into the FUZE anytime I want to. But, even though I used WM for years, and tweaked it, customized it, loaded 4 new Radio ROMs and 5 custom ROMs, I am staying with the WP7 phone. For me, it is smoother, faster, and everything is well integrated. I am looking forward to updates and new features, but for now, it is an awesome experience. I now realize that I had loaded up my WM 6.5.5 phone with a lot of crap I never used and don't miss now. OK, I understand that people want the "right" to load their phone up with "Crap" they'll never use, and some "Crap" they will use, and for those, they'll have to wait on WP7 or remain with WM or some other OS, and that's fine. Personally, I would have loved WM still being upgraded on the latest hardware, I would have stayed with that, I think. But having moved to WP7, I won't go back.
nrfitchett4 said:
you spent way too much time on that response to someone who obviously has no intention of getting a wp7 device.
But a great response none the less...
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Click to collapse
it was time very well spent. N8ter's post answered my questions without me having to make a new thread.
thebranded said:
it was time very well spent. N8ter's post answered my questions without me having to make a new thread.
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+1
its good to see wm users experiences and questions about a possible up/down grade to wp.
very useful stuff.
Touching on N8ter's point on libraries and file managers... If you think about it, those libraries ARE file managers, and are actually more effective than a file manager would be. The only thing, which will be fixed with W8 and Mango working together, is better SkyDrive integration so you have a much easier way of syncing your files. I mean, I honestly have never used my phone as a flash drive, and the only reason I ever used a file manager in the past was for .cab files... Which we don't need any more.
But, I can't wait for SkyDrive to work as it needs to coming up, I think THAT is my most important feature coming considering I'm a student and would make my life significantly easier. I do see an ability to hook up the phone to a PC in the future and Word automatically recognize your Word files on a WinPhone device though... Not as a mass storage, as an additional "library" for files... If you understand what I mean here.
Libraries aren't a file manager. It isn't a replacement, either. There's no control over a library. It's an automatic classification of media on the device based on the media type. You can't take a private file and put it somewhere on the device where it will not show up in a Library, and that's an issue for some people. If you have any private documents/images/videos on your phone, it's hard to let anyone who thinks the phone looks interesting play with it because all of those files are right there in plain sight in the Hubs, so you have to tell them to go to a Carrier store if they wanna play with one. That's not an issue on i.e. an Android phone because you can hide the file in a nested folder and set it so that the folder's files are not displayed in the Gallery.
Also, the lack of a file manager is keeping things like BT File transfer and File Transfer in IM applications out at the moment, and it make sit ridiculously hard to put files on the device and keep them organized.
One of the best features of Android Office applications is their integrated file manager and Cloud Integration.
SkyDrive will be nice, but without a decent file manager Office will still be worthless to me because there's no way I'm putting all my files on SkyDrive. I'm not a conspiracy theorist, but I have 5 computers here and do not need Microsoft to hold my files. I like my stuff to be organized, and I don't want everything on the internet... Skydrive also doesn't have the best file type support for Synching...
Do you back up your camera roll to SkyDrive automatically?
N8ter said:
Libraries aren't a file manager. It isn't a replacement, either. There's no control over a library. It's an automatic classification of media on the device based on the media type. You can't take a private file and put it somewhere on the device where it will not show up in a Library, and that's an issue for some people. If you have any private documents/images/videos on your phone, it's hard to let anyone who thinks the phone looks interesting play with it because all of those files are right there in plain sight in the Hubs, so you have to tell them to go to a Carrier store if they wanna play with one. That's not an issue on i.e. an Android phone because you can hide the file in a nested folder and set it so that the folder's files are not displayed in the Gallery.
Also, the lack of a file manager is keeping things like BT File transfer and File Transfer in IM applications out at the moment, and it make sit ridiculously hard to put files on the device and keep them organized.
One of the best features of Android Office applications is their integrated file manager and Cloud Integration.
SkyDrive will be nice, but without a decent file manager Office will still be worthless to me because there's no way I'm putting all my files on SkyDrive. I'm not a conspiracy theorist, but I have 5 computers here and do not need Microsoft to hold my files. I like my stuff to be organized, and I don't want everything on the internet... Skydrive also doesn't have the best file type support for Synching...
Do you back up your camera roll to SkyDrive automatically?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Bluetooth transfer isn't implemented because Microsoft hasn't yet, not because of any other reason. You could go to any file, or picture, and select Share, and the option could be there, regardless of library. I mean, by that theory, there shouldn't be any method of sharing then. You do it in text messaging at the moment, and in Who's Near Me, it's just the apps haven't implemented them.
If things on your phone are that important, there is a password option. I personally don't let anybody touch my phone. I think my texts are far more 'secret' than any document I can put on my phone, to be honest, but that's just me. I would though like folders in Office to sort out my documents, this may come with the new integration though. I would also like to option to protect the documents as I do on my computer.
As far as putting files on the device, I'm for the whole "only supported files" allowed deal. But, look back at my post, I would like to see something along the lines of: Plug my phone into the computer, open word, and it's there as an extension. Same with other Microsoft applications. Pictures and Music are already done through Zune.
I think I'm also on a different end of the spectrum than you are. Personally I keep all my files on my home network. I also access it remotely. So, full SkyDrive integration would be amazing in my eyes. I'm already at risk connecting to the internet, pretty sure Microsoft can do a better job than me at protecting my files. I already use SkyDrive on my phone through the mobile site too, it's just a hassle in dropping them into the folder I created on my computer, and then downloading them on my phone. This being done automatically would be amazing.
But as far as using it as a storage device for files the phone has no need for, I don't like that idea personally. You have to remember the types of users that are being marketed here. I think something along what I suggested would be best. Security just needs to be upped a little. Let me password protect certain files and I'm fine.
And no, I don't automatically put them on SkyDrive... I think mainly out of habit. But 99% of my pictures go on Facebook the second I snap them. And I use Photobucket quite often... If my Live friends were large in number I'm pretty sure my SkyDrive would be full of public photos.
From all my research on WP7 and HTC HD7, yes it seems very strenuous to do the things we used could do on other 'smartphones' ... Ever since apple came out with the 'app' world... things are being followed(android, Ms).. But what i think is, that with Win 8 on the Horizon, the app world is here to stay, and it shouldn't be a surprise when it will come to, what you can run on your PC, u can also run it on ur mobile... I don't know if such interface has happened with Apple and the Macs and the pods n phones to do that... Google is doing more with chrome to do that with their android... so, will they still have to sit upon other os's to accomplish this or as I think I've heard they are making their own Os... Future stats shows, Apple is on a downhill trend and Android to follow... In reading in MSN today, Android phones are being introduced with viruses, such as the one that will sit on your phone and send all your data to some phone numbers in china... So Android glory days maybe not so great... As the veterans have stood longer then the newbies...
just a thought
I am putting forward the following premise:
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"You can enjoy the joys and wonder of Android without spending a fortune...!"
I now intend to see if this is true!
Thread Purpose:
Provide a discussion area for those of us who are financially impaired, like myself, but want to experience the joys and wonders that tablets and android might hold...
At the moment the thread may also touch on android on mini-tablets (which might also make calls...) and larger tablets (with keyboards...hdds...lcd monitors etc) simply because on a shoestring budget you have to make do with what you have.
I hope to explore ways in which you can use Android it in new and interesting ways without paying out massive amounts on expensive hardware.
I'm not sure if it is totally achievable or not, but I'm sure it will be interesting to find out what you can do for less compared to the expensive options which are out there.
Idea's, comments, thoughts, discussions are all welcome.
The more unusual and interesting the better!
Thread Structure:
This first post will provide an index and links to the main discussion points/topics on the thread.
[Will see how this works!]
Periodically I shall post a new topic to discuss.
23March2011 - Topic One : Show Me The Droid
Method One: Using your existing laptop or PC
Method Two: Using the android emulator (also on your existing laptop or PC)
Method Three: Using your existing phone
29March2011 - Topic Two : A Low Cost Tablet
Part One: Justifying the purchase
Part Two: Android From The Box
Part Three: Passing the grade? (A-E)
Part Four: Passing the grade? (Continued...F-J)
12April2011 - Topic Three : Low Level Basics
Part One: Oh ADB Debugger!
Part Two: The Root Of It All
Part Three: Backups, ROMs and Flashbacks
Part Four: First Time Flasher! (added 1stAug11)
27June2011 - Topic Four: Low Level Interfacing
Part One: Android RS232 I/O
22Sept2011 - Topic Five: Development Tools & Tricks
Part One: Screenshots & Remote Control
Part Two: Scripts & Shortcuts
Side Topics
04May2011 - Side Topic: The Future! Quad core and beyond
02June2011 -Side Topic: Multi-Touch Technology - with No Touch Screen!
Q&A:
crevlthe: Are most apps up-sized to fit the resolution of tablets?
[I'll keep updating this thread every few days]
- please post comments, thoughts and ideas anyway, particularly if topic related.
I would love to hear about peoples thoughts and ideas
(simply reference Topic X:Method X/Step X etc if you want to comment on one item in particular).
Enjoy!
Small Print:
For the following posts I shall try to reference the source websites where possible, however apologies if I get this wrong, please feel free to pm me or post on the thread with any corrections and I'll amend the entry. Regarding images, where possible I shall try to use my own images, but at times this may not be possible. If you find I have used your image and you do not wish it to be used, then simply let me know and I'll change it. Where possible I shall state where the images have come from.
Clearly, the details in the thread are purely discussion and while I try to make them as accurate as possible I can not guarantee this. Damage or loss may occur by following some/all of the instructions, so if you do, do with care and at your own risk, I take no responsibility for your actions.
Topic One : Show Me The Droid
Before you can do anything with Android, you probably want to see it!
This topic will outline various ways you can "get at the driod" without spending anything.
Method One: Using your existing laptop or PC
This was the first way I got to play with Android (a long while ago), and that is using an Android live CD. I used something similar to the live CD from http://www.android-x86.org/ (images taken from site), which allows you to boot your computer with Android.
You can burn the image on to a CD/DVD and boot it cleanly or you can use a virtual machine and boot within that.
With a little bit of legwork, and a compatible computer you can boot from a USB key so you can carry your droid with you.
You can even install it, even dual boot, if you are brave!
While this is a simple and very cheap option (at most it should cost a CD/DVD to burn on), there is one slight problem...most computers don’t have touch, gravity sensors etc etc!
You have a number of options if you are seriously wanting to use this more:
1. You can continue to use the mouse (at least they seem to have a cursor now!)
2. You could probably make use of a large touch-pad (can be expensive, but cheaper ones are around)
3. If you have a small screen you could try adding a touch screen (8-10” touch screen overlay can be quite cheap but you will need to install it yourself and that can be tricky and will risk damage).
Perhaps this method could be interesting to try out as a low cost GoogleTV platform, but there would need to be some work done regarding the control method. Someday I may look into this option in more detail...
Microsoft Kinect not been plugged into to android yet???
Anwser: Yes it has! Ok, shame I don’t have one.
Topic One : Show Me The Droid
Method Two: Using the android emulator (also on your existing laptop or PC)
Of course for the developers out there, there is always the Android emulator which comes as part of the Android development package. Each time Android update the SDK (software development kit) for the latest release of Android, the emulator is updated to run the newest version of Android (this is often the source of early ROMs).
This does allow you to play with the latest Android version as soon as it is out, so you can get a feel for what features are improved etc and you can try out different versions to get an idea about the differences between them. You don't even need to install anything more than the Android emulator SDK if you don't want to write any code, as you can run the emulator separately to the development environment.
However, not only does this have similar control issues (except maybe that you get “soft-buttons”) but it is quite slow even on a fast machine.
(Click Image For Larger Version)
The advantage of course is it opens up a whole world of development options. The google developer site provides instructions for getting set up. Once you’ve jumped through the hoops, you can try it out by having a go at the various tutorial applications.
(Click Image For Larger Version)
Again this is something I may look at in more detail another time (such as getting setup, exploring what you can do with it and perhaps some simple development steps).
Topic One : Show Me The Droid
Method Three: Using your existing phone
You might just have that elusive Android device already, you just don't know it yet!
Clearly this option will vary wildly on the type of device you have and how in-depth you are willing to go. I’ve not managed to find a full list of devices which do support running android but it is safe to say that the “list” is growing all the time.
For me, my Phone is a Windows Mobile Phone, the HTC Blackstone, it’s quite an old device (in relative terms) but it has a good screen (3.8", 480 x 800) and modest processor (528 MHz ARM 11).
Fortunately for me, the XDAndroid group support this device, so I was able to make use of one of the many Android builds on the forums. I’m not quite sure what the current status is of this project, it seems although device specific threads have stopped, there are Android builds going up to 2.2.3...which I’ve had working on my device.
For the blackstone, running android is fairly pain free, since you install the files to your sd-card and if things don’t work out, you just delete them. One key component I required, was ditching (swapping) my class-6 SD card for a slower one (yes, slower!), once I’d switched to a class-2 one, android was up and running nicely.
(Click Image For Larger Version)
However, don’t get too excited yet, as many of the builds will have features which don’t work yet, such as Bluetooth support, camera and in-call voice (you can spend a long time getting the right mix of files for your device to get all these working) and many 3D accelerated games won't work. A lot of progress is being made here (I’ll go into this in more detail another time). Some issues you can live with and some you can’t. Also, if your device (like mine) is not a total powerhouse then you can expect things to run at less than optimal speed. Overall, don’t expect to be replacing your OS with an all singing all dancing Android one this way, unless you have decent device to start with.
All is not lost! By using one of the many dual-boot apps (they simply show a splash screen as soon as possible on power up) allow you to quickly select between your normal Windows Mobile OS and the Android one.
i.e. Gen.Y DualBoot by yozgatg
(Click Image For Larger Version)
This means you can keep a build of Android (or several if you wish) on your SD card and have a play with Android from time to time.
Personally I think this is an excellent option, even if the results aren’t perfect and it’ll probably cost you a fair bit of time experimenting, but the results are totally worth it.
I might revisit this in more detail if people would like me to. Hopefully I can learn a little more about the internals of how it fits together and provide a post on that.
For HD2 users (and some other phones), who are just too spoilt for choice, they can also install Android to their NAND (internal memory). This means they can totally replace the Windows Mobile OS on their system with Android, and because the device is fast, it apparently runs well enough to do so.
Topic Two : A Low Cost Tablet
Part One: Justifying the purchase
First off, the most important bit for this topic, how much does it cost?
I managed to get (buy) it for $90 (£56), including free shipping (limited time special offer).
Note:
I would not recommend this tablet at it's "normal" price of $130, since there are other tablets in that price range which are clearly better.
However, for me, the lower price was key here.
To put it in perspective, the Samsung Tab 7 Inch was £500 here - or $800!
The specs:
Code:
Model: Haipad M701
CPU: Telechip Tcc8902, 800MHz (ARM11)
OS: Android 2.1
RAM: 256MB
ROM: 2GB
Screen: 7 Inch Resistive (800 x 480px)
Ext Ports:
9v Supply
3.5mm Audio
Mini Usb (OTG Host) - hopefully will support Mass Storage devices
HDMI
TF (MicroSDHC)
Size: 192 x 114 x 15mm
Weight: 330g
Extra Details:
Gravity Sensor
Android Market
Adobe Flash (not supported)
Camera 0.3Mp
Wifi 802.11 b/g
My thought process regarding the purchase is this:
1. I really want an Android tablet, I’ve been look at them for months (in fact probably just after the iPad came out). In all that time I’ve lusted after tablet after tablet, but each time it came down to the cost, and the fact that I simply did not have $200/$250/$300 laying around. Throughout that period the number of tablets available have ballooned, the capabilities and specs too. I found myself looking at the affordable tablets, and then looking at the next one up (hdmi), then the next one (10” screen) and then the next one (multi-touch), until I’d priced myself out of my purchase.
2. With the advent of the tegra chips and honeycomb, the price of admission has been bumped slightly (I’d say you are starting at $300 for a low end one (quality of the screen/touch is be compromised - Advent Vega)) - previous to that an A8 based tablet, such as the A81 for around $200-250 was a good deal. To be a serious contender for anything which comes after honeycomb (for the tablet branch), and gaming platform that is developing (of which Cordy is the thin end of the wedge), the power step provided by the Tegra family is a must.
3. Back when I first started looking at tablets, I was in fact considering a very similar device (the X10 and the G10, of which the Haipad M701 is fairly similar).
4. Aside from wanting to use the latest and greatest releases from Android and games etc, there is a need for more modest requirements to be met. Can a basic tablet do this, I intend to find out?
These "modest" potential uses would be:
A: Replace/supplement a poorly designed portable Toshiba DVD player for in-car use, which in my opinion was probably the worst product I’ve ever purchased (despite the quite promising spec sheet) - although obviously I may need to revise this status soon!
B: A Doodle pad, something which my phone gets commandeered for quite often by my off-spring. So a slightly larger screen would be useful for this.
C: Simple Web-browser, most of the time only a quick check on the web is needed, so this may be more helpful than firing up the laptop (which being a work one, dislikes my wifi and network most the time).
D: Music player, either from connected memory for in the car or perhaps from the network.
E: eReader, I’ve read a few books on the Blackstone’s 3.8" screen, so a larger screen would be helpful.
F: Require a device with camera and HDMI at minimum, since this will hopefully provide more options to experiment with (1st build of Android on the blackstone, didn’t have camera support which ruled out things like google goggles etc).
G: USB Host (mass storage), I am hoping that the device will allow me to use external storage devices via the usb, this would be very handy for dealing with camera pictures and videos etc.
H: USB Device keyboard support, I find it very annoying that the Blackstone has no h/w keys, this seriously limits what you can do with it (such as emulation programs etc) as there is no easy way to control things.
I: RS232 Support: Although I seriously doubt it, it would be really useful to get RS232 monitoring running on the device.
J: A development platform for writing android software on and to learn about android.
In Summary:
Overall, aside from the video/USB requirements, I hope that I am not being too ambitious for this device, but clearly I probably am. If/Once I get the device, I shall evaluate it against these requirements and also see what other uses I can put it to. I don’t expect the device to manage all of the uses above (particularly out-the-box), but hopefully it an fulfill at least some of them (even if it takes some custom firmware/modding or even some custom hardware to achieve this) I shall be happy.
For all I know, the tablet may well never turn up...and if it does it could be next to useless (i.e. next to that Toshiba DVD player...). As it happens, one review of a similar device was “expensive paper weight”, I’d estimate it about the weight of a medium sized cup of coffee (without the cup), so might be useful for when we get the fans out in the office this summer.
My purchase timeline:
Purchased tablet on 17th March (estimated delivery 10 working days).
Item shipped on 18th March (estimated shipping 15-20 days).
“Departure from outward office of exchange” 22nd March - Left the source country.
Received item 28th March!
Overall Delivery time: 11days (7 working days).
In return for the excellent shipping, I can say that the item was from PandaWill.
Out of the box review coming soon!
Thread has moved from "General" to it's new home in "Android Software and Hacking General". At first I didn't plan for it to be Android exclusive but as it turns out, it is, so hello to all on this thread.
I am very new to Android, so please be kind!
I hope this thread can be a beginners introduction of some kind, let me know if there are errors or if you would like more information on parts etc.
Regards.
Topic Two : A Low Cost Tablet
Part Two: Android From The Box
Packaged in a retail box:
(Click Image For Larger Version)
- Tablet (thankfully)
- 9volt 1.5Amp Output Power Supply (US plug)
- US to UK plug adaptor (a nice touch, clearly they take notice of the shipping address)
- 2x USB Cable (mini USB to USB male, short mini USB to USB female)
- Basic set of ear phones
- Product dimensions measure exactly as stated in the spec (I’d previously printed out picture of the screen to 1:1 scale based on the measurements).
Although I didn’t expect to get an HDMI cable, I didn’t expect the HDMI port to be a mini one, so it would have been helpful to have included one here (or at least an adaptor).
(Note: The USB car adaptor is not for it and did not come with it, but I thought it helps as a guide for size - it won’t charge by USB).
Charging:
(Click Image For Larger Version)
The first thing I did was to plug the tablet in for a charge, there are two reasons for this. Firstly to check that the power supply is functional and safe (i.e. does not over heat) and secondly for the battery.
If the battery is at a low level, you have to treat it carefully - particularly if was in storage (as it will gradually lose charge over time). Li-ion batteries if drained below their bottom limit, will “crash” their voltage, this causes a lot of damage to the battery and it may never recover fully (or in attempting to do so it may cause excess heat == bad news). You should always avoid switching any device on when the battery is in this state, so always charge just in case before trying to switch on (most electronics should refuse to turn on, but best not to count on it).
For this reason I was pleased to find that the battery was charged to approximately 60-80% (I guess) which is around the recommended storage/shipping level. Also the charger or tablet did not burst into flames, which was nice too!
Turned On:
Switching on the device, immediately the screen shows a colourful splash screen, then some linux penguin/mole, before displaying the normal android boot. Instantly I am pleased that the screen is working! I am also impressed that the screen quality, brightness and colour look quite good.
(Click Image For Larger Version)
60 Seconds later and Android has booted!
I would be interested to know if this is particularly fast or slow (my only comparison is booting the Blackstone Android from SD, which takes about 4 mins). For me, 1 min seems fast enough, certainly as fast as starting windows mobile. For normal use, the device can be put to sleep with the main ([]) button, which is instant on and off.
Screen was already calibrated, and the normal start-up wizard ran for Android.
Pre-Installed Software:
Aside from the standard stuff, you get ES File Explorer, Meridian Media Player, Skype (I’ve not tested that yet), SkyFire Browser, Aldiko eReader, QuickOffice, YouTube App and Android Market. The pre-installed Android Market worked fine, and I was downloading new apps in seconds. There are also some Chinese apps which I’ve not tried, but overall, there is everything to on there to get you started off and enough for you to use it directly out of the box.
Aside from some demo pictures and a video, there was also some video which I guess was taken when they tested the unit, it is a good sign that they appear to have taken the time to check the unit works, calibrate it, check things like the camera are functional etc (not sure if this was Pandawill or the manufacturer, but it was within an office so I suspect the former). At 0.3mp, the front facing camera clearly isn’t amazing, but in reasonable lighting it is good enough to see the subject in question quite clearly (one thing though is it is mirrored - guess for skype use (if that works)).
Out Of The Box Impression:
Overall initial impressions are, the screen appears to be pretty good for the money. Colours are slightly more washed out than a more expensive screen, but not overly so. The resistive touch screen does take a firm-ish touch to use, but again, not overly more than other resistive touch screens.
The size and weight of the unit appears to be nicely balanced, it is easy to hold in a single hand (for an adult) while using it with another (or thumb typing and holding either side). The outside bezel is just the right size that, if you need to, you can hold the edge with your thumb without touching the screen etc. The plastic housing, which is rigid and feels solid, makes the unit feel quite good quality. The piano black finish of the back (like a psp) does attract fingerprints however the screen itself doesn’t, which is great.
Although it was never going to be the fastest Android experience, however the unit does seem to keep up with the operating system fairly well, definitely fast enough to be usable.
The unit feels nice and appears to work well, so far excellent value for money.
Next time I shall evaluate the tablet against my requirements and see how it fares...
Topic Two : A Low Cost Tablet
Part Three: Passing the grade? (A-E)
Crunch time! How does the low cost tablet fare when lined up against my expectations and needs?
Meeting My Requirements:
A: Replacing A Portable DVD Player
Viewing photos, videos and listening to music from the pre-installed samples was easy and the units response was reasonable. There was good video playback of the 720p sample (I expect this was encoded to suit the device obviously), and the photo browser did a nice job of displaying and sorting through the photos. Sound was ok, by no means hi-fi standard but enough to listen to over moderate background noise (sound as good as the DVD player - but can’t really say this is hard). This will take a bit more investigation to determine what formats are supported and from where (local storage, microSD, flash stick, HDD, network, internet etc etc). However, even if videos need to specifically encoded as long as they can be played from a mass-storage device (or at a push the SD card), this should meet this requirement fine (did I mention the old DVD player is terrible...).
B: A Doodle Pad
It took no time at all for my offspring to try this, safe to say the unit passes this test with flying colours. One huge improvement is that the Blackstone touch sensitive call buttons etc were not in the way any more. Still to find the perfect app for this:
On Windows Mobile its My Note by MyLostBlog which is a good balance between clear interface and function (I still prefer 2.1 over 2.6).
(Click Image For Larger Version)
On the DS, Art Academy is favourite (although what it has in features, it lacks flexibility). Also Flip Note is worth a mention, I would love to find a similar app on Android.
Art Academy (art software) / Flipnote (animation program)
(Click Images For Larger Versions)
At the moment the star for Android is AutoDesk’s SketchBook Mobile (perhaps a little complex for younger children to fully do everything but easy enough for them to use and enjoy most of the features, excellent for adult use too!). AutoDesk’s app shows the quality that is possible with Android (although at the expense of lag free response on this particular device), I’m still very impressed and the 7 inch screen makes it all the more enjoyable.
C: Simple Web-browser
First off the lack of flash is annoying, but there is at least “some” flash support (I assume flash lite) from the Skyfire Browser, and even the google browser when it came across an embedded YouTube video it directed it to the YouTube app to play.
Browsing is reasonable, the wifi signal is probably below normal, but if you have a good signal, the browsing speed as comparable to my phone (for me the google browser appeared to be faster, but that might have been down to my wifi signal at the time). Here, multi-touch or at least the dual-touch of the later M701 models would be useful, as Pinch-to-zoom would be helpful. At least with the 7 inch screen the need to zoom in and out all the time is reduced (also I’m sure by experimenting with different browsers and settings the perfect balance will be achievable). It will never replace the desktop for web-browsing, but it is fine for quick searches etc.
Google Browser / Skyfire Browser
(Click Images For Larger Versions)
D: Music player
I’ll hold judgement on this until I find a more flexible app, since I had problems navigating around my music and playing it by folder unless it was on the SD card (I was only using some files I had available, I’m sure it is a lot simpler with correctly tagged albums). Once playing the music though, it managed ok (although it did experience issues if you attempted to “multi-task” and load apps etc while music was in the background - although that may have been the app I was using and/or fiddling around with the usb connections). The quality isn’t the best I’ve heard, but it is sufficient. I think overall, with the right app, the unit will perform this task without issue.
E: eReader
Just by trying the pre-installed Aldiko application, it is clear to see that this unit is great for reading. The text was very clear and easy to read with plenty of text visible and even on the smallest font setting (point 10) you can easily read without issue. The g-sensor rotates the screen as required (hopefully there is an option to turn it off - for reading while laying down [Yes, there is a setting for android generally]). The screen is slightly shiny so would suffer in direct sunlight, however it is reasonable for reading in average lighting. I also tested with a pdf, which displayed ok using QuickOffice, but features such as re-flow (available with Adobe’s reader) would definitely help to fit things on the screen.
[Update: Once I've installed Adobe reader, pdf's are very easy to read, although the lack of resuming where you left off means you have to keep track of page numbers yourself (this is no different to the Windows Mobile version).]
CONTINUED BELOW...
Congrats!
Really great post
enotar said:
Congrats!
Really great post
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks! I should be adding some more later on today.
I'm open for suggestions for topics etc.
Topic Two : A Low Cost Tablet
Part Four: Passing the grade? (Continued...F-J)
Meeting My Requirements (Continued...):
F: Camera & HDMI
As I previously mentioned the camera is not very good, but since it is front facing (it’s located to the right side of the ([]) button) it clearly is not suitable for taking snaps etc. Using google-goggles, the images are just about usable, but it appears the google-goggles app can’t take the pictures directly (you can import pictures which then allows you to take photos using the standard app and open them).
(Click Image For Larger Version)
[Android Logo taken with camera]
I’ve just tested the HDMI (I’ve managed to get a mini-HDMI cable) and after enabling the output via the settings page and restarting, the screen correctly displayed on the TV. Films and games do look good on the TV, although some adjustment to the alignment would be useful. Although you can output in either 1080p and 720p, the resolution is matched to the device 800x480 (although I might be wrong for direct video output), also from first impression, 1080p is lower colour depth than 720p output.
G: USB Host
Ideally the USB connection for host/OTG would be it’s own full size female usb socket (i.e. a normal USB socket) but instead you need to use the USB cable provided which converts the miniUSB to a USB socket. Tested with microSD card reader, flash memory stick (4Gb Kingston), the Blackstone (in mass-storage mode) and even 2.5 HDD which worked even without extra power (I was surprised at this as it is only a generic enclosure with a random laptop drive, however I did not try this with a low battery just in case that did damage). All of which appear under the /scsi/ directory. So far I’ve been unable to find how to “unmount” the drives (you can unmount the sd-card and the internal nand memory via the settings but not the OTG device), so when you disconnect you get “USB Device unexpectedly removed” message.
H: USB Device keyboard support
Using the same OTG cable, plugging in a keyboard was easy and seamless (it just works straight away). In fact, I tested this using a Logitech wireless Keyboard and Mouse and both worked perfectly (aside from the fact the keyboard is about 5 times the size of the tablet). I also tried another USB keyboard, which in the past I've noticed does not work when within DOS on a PC (where the Logitech does), this did not work, but I suspect this is simply the keyboard being slightly unusual. Keeping an eye out for a small and cheap keyboard now.
I: RS232 Support
I attempted this just out of interest but not really knowing what to look for can’t be sure it did anything. I don’t expect this to work without some serious work, but will see what can be achieved if anything. The reason for this is that many low level electronics projects can be controlled/monitored using RS232. In addition to this, I’ve also tried a bluetooth dongle (it has no bluetooth built in), and LAN adaptor, clearly they didn’t magically start working (no doubt the build does not have the correct drivers installed etc), but this is something I will look into.
J: A development platform
At a basic level, I can copy over built APK (android application) files and install them, even the ones which I had issues with on the Blackstone work fine on the device. Developing applications and working directly with the tablet is possible (will look at this in more detail another time), as a development device it is ideal.
The not so good...
Hardware Interfaces:
The single OTG mini usb port is annoying, it would be help to connect more than one device etc and not need to use an adaptor cable.
The mini HDMI, again would be good not to need a special cable for this (at least would have been useful to know ahead of time).
Buttons...no physical home or volume buttons, this does make things difficult sometimes (I believe there are software solutions for this, or options to re-map the keys).
Out-Of-Box mapping is: ([]) is power/screen key, right-side of rocker (with Home Icon) is the menu key, left-side of the rocker (with menu icon) is the back key! Once you get used it, it may be the best layout anyway, will need to experiment.
No Usb charging, from a pure ease of use point of view this would be very helpful, but most tablets don’t support this.
Sticking out of the SDHC card (puts the card at risk of snapping) - later version of this tablet this doesn’t stick out.
Obviously multitouch, bluetooth etc would be nice, but we know that.
The Grey Grey market:
This device “IS” a fake...Real Haipad vs. Fake
I can’t work out though if the unit functions any worse than a real one, all I know is, this one functions better than I was expecting and I’ve not found anything which the originals (if it is a fake) did which this doesn’t (so far).
I've now confirmed this with Pandawill, that the tablet is OEM, not a HaiPad original (at least they 'fessed up to it!). Considering it was sold as part of their own "Fight Against Internet Crime" promotion due to their recent DOS hack attack, it is a little naughty but as you can probably tell by now, I am still very happy with the device, no matter it's origin (but glad it was discounted). Also, the device does function as described by the specs, so other than the manufacturer the rest of the listing is accurate.
The only real issue is that new firmware will be a problem since I can't be sure if it will work or not.
Not all joy and perfection (I’d be mad to expect it):
Most applications appear to work, however, I’ve found that Angry Birds has issues with the surface texture graphics (the text which shows the menus/scores - a pain, but the rest of the game is playable). Apparently later versions such as Rio work fine, this just appears to be a feature of the telechip processor and does this for all HaiPad M701. Since I am not obsessed about Angry Birds (I can stop any-time I want, no really I can...) I can live with it. Also Raging Thunder 2 isn’t playable since I can’t see the menu blocks to select anything, I guess for the same issue.
Most games appear to work fine, such as Air Control, TurboFly 3D (lags sometimes, but not surprisingly since its full-on 3D graphics), Waveblaster (works very nicely, with G-sensor working), Pacific Wings (no g-sensor control). The G-Sensor doesn’t work on some games, but fortunately most have alternative options if that is the case.
It's a mixed bag for games, but fortunately I never intended games to be it's main use and I am quite happy with decent puzzle games etc anyway.
Overall - "A solution for now, but not the future":
The unit runs an ARM11 at 800MHz, with 256RAM, lets face it, it will never do all the graphical gymnastics that the Nvida Tegra 2 processors will perform and doing all but the very basics will probably leave it out-of-breath. Such a device is no laptop or even netbook replacement, but much like the iPod touch, it is a media player with many bonus features (& on a much better budget).
I’m sure as time passes (probably not long either) more and more applications will leave this type of low cost tablet behind, with the pace of processor development at the moment this should really be no surprise at all. But for now, the market is open and the apps are flowing, so I’ll sit back and enjoy them!
Topic Three: Low Level Basics
Part One: Oh ADB Debugger!
One of the first steps in getting properly connected to your devices innards is to ensure you are able to use the ADB (Android Debug Bridge).
The ADB is command-line terminal which allows you to directly control the device and file system of the device (or emulated device) from a PC or MAC.
On the face of it you might wonder why the ADB is of much use, the answer is that it allows a direct route to the entire file system as well as providing debug access directly on target as well as monitor log outputs as programs run. Overall it is similar to ActiveSync for windows mobile. Another reason to have this working is that if your device fails to boot, something messes up your system or say the touch-screen fails, you can use ADB to access everything on the device and also re-flash it. Also you will probably need ADB to root your device (more on that later).
There are a number of guides available for setting up ADB, so I won’t go into detail on them. Personally I followed Google’s own developers guide for setting up the Android SDK (Software Development Kit) since I also intend to write Android software and the ADB is part of that.
However, after a quick search, the following guide appears to cover most of the details.
The UnLocker - How To: SetUp ADB/USB Drivers for Android Devices.
For my device, the ADB driver needed some fiddling around with, since windows would not accept the driver was for my device [Editing the ini file and adding the VID and PID of the hardware didn't help me].
Eventually I found the following (following a tip from SlateDroid): The app PdaNet appears to supply suitable drivers.
I also recommend adding the location of ADB to your system path, so that you can call it from any command-line location.
Once the drivers are installed, check that when the device is connected (and debugging is enabled via settings) that typing “adb devices” from the command-line shows a device).
C:\> adb devices
List of devices attached
0123456789ABCDEF device
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Click to collapse
If you want to write software using Ecilpse you’ll also want to check that it can connect and deploy applications directly to the device for testing.
Within the Ecilpse, under the run menu select “Run Configurations...”, within the Target Tab, the “Deployment Target Selection Mode” must be set to “Manual”.
(Click Image For Larger Version)
This enables the “Android Device Chooser” to prompt when you attempt to run/debug from Ecilpse.
(Click Image For Larger Version)
Build and run your application or a test one and it should now run directly on your device.
There are also a number of GUI apps around which make use of ADB to provide easy ways to manage applications, transfer files etc all without needing to mount and unmount your sd cards to and from the device. At the moment I’ve started using DroidExplorer, even from initial impressions it is clear the features are quite extensive (you could probably write about 20 guides on how to use all of it correctly).
an excellent article overall.
question about the tablets: are most apps up-sized to fit the resolution, or are there a large variety of apps natively designed to run at the bigger resolution?
crevlthe said:
an excellent article overall.
question about the tablets: are most apps up-sized to fit the resolution, or are there a large variety of apps natively designed to run at the bigger resolution?
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Click to collapse
This is an interesting question!
Although my tablet is WVGA which is the same as the blackstone (so I can't test this directly!).
You'd need a much higher resolution device to go beyond the officially supported resolutions, (obviously Android 3.0 supports more).
From what I've read and from doing some app development, apps should scale to fit the screen (if programmed correctly). I've read that some apps don't scale for some tablets, what the root reason is for this, I wouldn't know, since the support is there in the API.
Basically, the android sdk provides various ways to describe the layout of your screens, and they encourage you to use ones which describe them in terms of proportional amounts (for the Linear Layout) or in terms of position of items i.e. to the left of item A (for Relative Layout) etc. The other layouts all work along the same lines, i.e. you don't worry about the size of the screen and calculate each position by hand like you do with windows mobile etc, it is all determined by the API.
You can see the different layouts code here and if you find the ApiDemo APK (I'll post if you like) you can view them. However, you can break all the rules and still use the Absolute Layout, where you return to the good old days of x,y co-ordinates. Even then you can use a values which are relative to the screen size and pixel pitch (see Difference of px, dp, dip and sp in android..) so there really is no reason to hard-code it.
As for graphics, I've not done this yet, but I know this handled if you use "9-patch" png files...they describe them here.
The idea here is that the black pixels around the edge allow the designer to say which bits are fixed size and which bits can be stretched to fit etc. It is a really tidy way to do it I think. Imagine how you'd have to do it otherwise if you created a button image with an icon on which would need to be resized to fit!
Oh, there are also provisions to provide low-res, med-res and high-res versions of the graphical resources, so again everything should scale nicely and look good without the need to scale everything all the time. There shouldn't be any need as such for "large" versions of apps, unless the developer wants to change how the app works by making use of the extra space or if they want ensure the "small" version takes up less space. I'm not sure how it determines which resource to use etc or if they all get installed etc, I've not looked into it.
So as long as the designer of the app has done all this correctly then it "should" scale correctly to whatever resolution. Of course, to claim this is true, they would need to test all resolutions. Fortunately you can manually create high-resolution emulated devices so it can be done but that is not the default.
[Now you mention it though, I shall ensure I test any apps I create at least once in high-resolution, it sounds like a good idea!]
I think this might have been why the retina display didn't make it to the iPad2, it would have required app developers to produce yet more app versions to deal with it and re-do the graphics yet again. Unfortunately I don't know anything about how iOS deals with these things, but you don't get the standard sized app in the middle of the screen or a x2 type option as you do with iPads.
Thanks for posting the question, hopefully it answers it (in theory anyway).
Topic Three: Low Level Basics
Part Two: The Root Of It All
I looked and looked for this information but I couldn't find the clear answers I wanted regarding rooting, so here is the info I was after.
What is ROOT, do I need it?
Rooting your device is not essential, for most the things you do with a tablet you will not need root access. Rooting is the process by which you enable “Root” access to the system’s low level files and hardware, this is achieved by enabling “super user” [Linux term for the highest level access which has higher level permissions to files than a normal user (like an Administrator)] access.
In most cases, apps will access hardware and files through the Android API, but in some cases they may need better control of the hardware than the API allows or access to files which are normally locked.
For this reason these applications require “root” access, typically apps which take screenshots (I assume to allow access to the screen data) and backup programs (I expect to allow access to all your files) are such programs.
Am I Rooted?
One thing I had trouble working out was working out if the device was rooted already or not. The quickest way to find out is to try to use an app which requires root access, if you device isn’t rooted it will tell you.
A good way is to download “Terminal Emulator” from the market (or direct from the author) . Then type: su which stands for Super User! (if your device is correctly rooted the “$” will change to “#” (ideally it will also prompt you for permission to enter superuser mode first - see SuperUser.apk below)).
Other signs you are rooted is to look for the “su” file in /system/bin/ but this will not confirm if the file is set to be executable correctly or in some cases different names are used to make it harder for unwanted apps to locate it.
Can I break/brick my device by ROOTING?
Actually ROOTING the device shouldn’t really cause any problems (since all you are really doing is installing a file which allows you to grant “Superuser” access). However, since ROOTING (by definition) allows entering into “Superuser” mode, this mode does allow you make much more serious changes to the system than you would in a “Normal User” mode (which is the whole point!), so clearly there are some risks involved while in this mode (and you may want to consider how this fits with your warranty). If your device isn’t open, then I suspect the main risk is getting your device into an unlocked state so that you can perform the root process first (since my tablet was not locked in anyway, I don’t know about this aspect).
Once ROOTING is complete, you don’t remain as a “Superuser” but any application is able to use it if they require. For this reason, the Superuser.apk application is typically installed, which detects when a request for “superuser” permissions are made and allows you to accept or reject the request.
The ROOTING process itself is reversible, which you may wish to do if you need to return your device for repairs etc.
How to root?
There are many guides and methods, but I shall take one specific to my tablet (posted by OffWorld on androidtablets.net) and explain each step in detail, since none I found explain what it is you are doing.
First you need to get the latest su and superuser.apk files from here.
Now, connecting the device to your pc, open a command prompt and type:
adb devices
Adb will respond hopefully with your list of devices:
List of devices attached
0123456789ABCDEF device
This confirms your device is attached and adb is able to communicate correctly.
Command 1:
adb shell mount -o remount,rw /dev/block/mtdblock3 /system
This runs adb (the terminal program to your device) and mounts the specified folders with read/write access.
Command 2:
adb push su /system/bin/
This sends the “su” program to the location on the device (note this assumes have the “su” in the same directory as you are running adb from). You can confirm this by navigating to the location on your tablet and see that the file has been transferred.
Command 3:
adb shell chmod 4755 /system/bin/su
This changes the permissions of the “su” file you’ve just transferred [details about chmod].
By using the command: adb shell ls -l /system/bin/su you can see the permissions.
We’ve changed the permissions from -rw-rw-rw- to -rwsr-xr-x, this allows the file to be executed.
Command 4:
adb push Superuser.apk /system/app/
This installs the Superuser.apk package on the device. This is important since this app allows you to control superuser access, rather than just allowing any program to obtain “superuser” rights.
Command 5:
adb shell reboot
Restarts the device.
Following this process, you will have the SuperUser application installed and applications will request Superuser access if they require it.
Note:
You may find for screen capture programs you need to allow permissions automatically or you may only end up with screenshots of the permission screen! Yes that's how I got the above one...
Excellent topic ! i've got the same pad and was wondering if you did find out a good way to completely backup the firmware. I've used Titanium but that's not a complete dump.
JiePieWie said:
Excellent topic ! i've got the same pad and was wondering if you did find out a good way to completely backup the firmware. I've used Titanium but that's not a complete dump.
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Click to collapse
Welcome to Xda!
That was going to be my next topic.
I've just been focusing on my WM development stuff at the moment (new RSSTab in the works), but will return to the tablet after I am done.
I'm not quite sure the best way to back it up yet, I was planning on trying out the ClockMod route, trouble is I'm quite new to it, so a little cautious about doing it before holidays.
I hope to try out some low level interfacing using the usb at some point too, as I've got a development board to play with.
Side Topic: The Future! Quad core and beyond
This time next year, Rodney...
Just saw this, and thought I would share here!
ASUS planning quad-core Tegra 3 tablet
See the two videos which are on the linked page...
Yes that is 2560x1600 resolution, hopefully to go into a 10" retina display.
Simply said, the future of these chips look rather interesting to say the least (no doubt are related to Sony's NGP).
Looking at the video, what we will be able to do with mobile devices will be rather impressive. Combine that with the new touch and perhaps kinect type control technologies as well as improvements with battery capacity/recharge tech, improved clear & colourful screens and things are shaping up nicely.
Boy are we going to have some fun hacking the innards out of them!
It is easy to see that for me, I've made the right choice by not spending lots of money on an impressive and expensive tablet at the moment. Since I'm happy to wait for a better tablet and until then I can have fun playing with my basic one.
Let just hope that the manufactures come up with a decent device, that is able to be hacked and perhaps might even be half decent out-of-the-box.
What is next? Who knows!
It's interesting really since I think that phones are quite close to the point where they have about as much processing power as they need** (perhaps with the exception of ones which include extra connectivity to HDMI/pico projector, keyboards etc). When they are subjected to the confines of a 3.8"/4" screen, you start to hit the limits of usability rather than processing power. Tablets have given the hardware room to stretch it's legs a little and show us what it can do!
**I'm not saying they won't need more in future, but I think perhaps an upgrade won't be as essential or spectacular, as it once was, until they evolve to the next form of course. I suppose the ultimate progression though is the usability of something like a tablet or pc but packaged in the form of a phone or smaller device in some form or another.
The software needs to catch up now though, we need better multi-core programming techniques, far far better privacy protection, and better stability overall. Thankfully hardware gives us the grunt to do this, it just needs to develop and improve to the point where coding can be done at the highest level of abstraction (which allows time to be spent on creative aspects rather than low level code details).
If you want to look even further, the prospect of re-programmable hardware is getting closer. This is where all the single purpose chips (such as video decoders) are replaced/supplemented by ones which can be re-programmed. Not only does this allow for codecs etc to be updated while still keeping the advantage of hardware decoding/coding (i.e. realtime without loading the main processor or drawing lots of power), but some applications could in-theory call in dedicated processing for specific tasks allowing for some amazing performance when performing complex and processor intensive tasks.
Fun times are a-coming!
Bright things are ahead for our fondle blocks, I don't even care too much if they are android or ipad or something else, as long as we can buy it (without selling a leg or two - ok, not iPad then!), program it, play with it and push it to it's limits and beyond!
Side Topic: Multi-Touch Technology - with No Touch Screen!
ZeroTouch 'optical multi-touch force field' makes a touchscreen out of just about anything
I wonder how much this costs to produce, quite a nice solution and ideal as a add-on to current screens. Depending of the cost of each infra-red and LED module it hopefully won't be too much. Imagine getting it fitted to your coffee table at home!
Hi guys,
I've searched this forum and haven't found an answer to my question, so I'm gonna post it here. (Hopefully I did the search right and didn't commit the felony of a double post. )
I'm planning on buying a new phone, mainly because my old HTC Charmer (WM 6.1) doesn't support SDHC cards and the maximum of 4GB of the cards I can use with it is just not enough any more.
So far, I've read quite some disappointing details about Windows Phone 7:
- No more "free" apps (by which I mean apps programmed by someone and offered somewhere, now it's the same sh** as with an iPhone or an Android phone)
- No direct USB-sync, which means you have to send your private information to the cloud in order to sync
- No "real" support for SD-Cards (and getting more storage space is the whole da** point here, otherwise I'm quite happy with my Charmer)
So, basically I thought about getting a second hand HTC Touch Pro II running WM 6.5 AND supporting NORMAL SDHC cards (meaning ALL cards which comply with the standard, not just the ones "certified by Microsoft").
But there might be one killer feature which could make me, well, not really forget, but maybe turn a blind eye to WP7's SHAMEFUL flaws: The new Microsoft Office Mobile. Often, I have some Excel spreadsheets which I need for work at different places. This is the only reason I have to take a laptop computer with me, apart from that my phone would be fine.
Office Mobile in WM 6.1 (or 6.5) couldn't display / make use of all the features the Desktop-Version offered (like extremely complicated formulae or spreadsheets and of course macros), and, moreover, after having worked on and saved an Office document on a phone, the features would even have been removed from the file in the conversion process, so the file was useless on the desktop as well.
Thus, I'm asking the following questions (which surprisingly haven't been answered on the net so far, or am I just too stupid to google it right?):
- Is the Office in WM 7 fully functional, meaning you can work on Excel sheets with the most complicated formulae and macros, or, asked more simple, can you do everything you can do with the Desktop version on your phone as well?
- If it doesn't offer everything the desktop versions offers, does it at least keep everything that was there in the original file after you change and save it on your phone? I mean, even if I can't use macros on the Windows Phone, it might still be helpful to open an .xls file on the phone, make a few changes (which don't require macros), save the file on the phone and after putting it back on a desktop computer having the file "unharmed" (meaning except for the small change I made on the phone everything else is as it was)?
Hopefully, I made my point clear enough, if not, I'm happy to answer questions on what it is exactly that I want to know. I think many users here already having a Windows phone will have tried working on Office documents on their phones and I hope those will share their experiences with me.
Many thanks for reading my post and even more thanks for answering.
Peter
Firstly,in terms of the functionalities of the excel,I don't think WP7 is suitable for you.
Furthermore,personally I prefer USB drag and drop the documents to my device,maybe you can call me old school.I just find the office useless for me since I don't have sharepoint,I don't want create a dropbox account just to upload my file to cloud and download it to my device again and I don't have a data plan.Therefore,until now, I still didn't use the office app once.
In your situation,I think you need an android phone to handle your job this moment,you can just purchase quick office,docs to go,depends on your personal preference.In addition,the only office app available is just microsoft office,no other choices.furthermore,as you said,you want transfer it back to your desktop unharm,therefore it is good to have drag and drop file transfer function rather than rely on dropbox,upload to the cloud and download on your desktop again.
On the other hand,there is no clear information about the mango updates which add more features to the office.So,I'll would suggest you to go with Android or iOS for this moment.
Thank you for the answer.
No more "free" apps (by which I mean apps programmed by someone and offered somewhere, now it's the same sh** as with an iPhone or an Android phone)
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Click to collapse
Free, in cost, there are plenty. Free as in not first checked by MS, kinda but no. You can developer unlock your device and sideload apps. However, that being said, MS are pretty good, they're only blocking apps which don't meet quality control standards (which I think is a good thing) or, somewhat contentiously, are "adult". They're not playing the same game as Apple.
I'm confused by you saying Android though. You can easily download and install programs (apk) on your device from any source (you just have to choose that option in the settings).
Office in Mango is improving - specifically:
1. Better support for formulae
2. Skydrive sync
So, yes, formulae can be created and manipulated in Excel, though I wouldn't say it's a replacement for the real Excel. It certainly can't run macros.
Skydrive is still "in the cloud" however, you're automatically registered to the free account by the virtue of having a live id. I still believe we should have USB file transfer but at least this is better than nothing.
Casey
Hello everyone,
So i thought I would go ahead and chime in with my own experiences and observations of the Asus Transformer (AT). I wanted to write an article that might help others trying to make a decision about replacing their laptop with the AT or maybe asking about a one vs the other. I wanted to stay away from a “VS” conversation and talk more about my experience. The long and short of it, is it depends. I think the AT can augment your business and maybe replace a netbook as a travel computer but i still need my laptop/desktop in the office. However, as you will see I am now using fully when out of the office my AT for all business needs and it works just fine.
Assumptions/Reasons for Buying:
So lets start with the reasons for wanting the AT. I wanted to find a solid replacement for my day to day use of my laptop while out of the office. I wear a number of hats one of which is application development, the other is as a Commercial Real Estate Broker. So needless to say this is for my brokerage business as i am pretty confident that there will be no Visual Studio use on the AT, well with the exception of a remote desktop of some kind. So, that all said what was i looking for? (Lets be honest we all want it ALL right but hey we can settle right?)
1. Email, this was first and foremost. A majority of both my businesses are relying on email as a main form of communication to my clients. Well, i didn't really need a tablet for this my phone handles it just fine, but typing anything longer than a paragraph is tedious , i have big hands and its just not the best experience, that said when i am out of the office most of my email replies are very short and so though i wanted/needed a better way to work with email the phone would have sufficed.
2. Document reading/generation: This one was a sticking point as we all know reading pdfs word docs and such is possible and works well on most devices, again the phone would work, but not for generation. I bought Docs to Go for my phone and it made things better but still no way was i going to get a "Word" experience. I know this is a debate by itself Microsoft "shop" vs opensource etc but lets be real, there is still a majority of the business working world that uses and will continue to use Microsoft office and so we just have to comply. (Yes you will service US Microsoft, resistance is futile)
3. Access to my daily files and work: So i also needed access to all my files and work related information. This was more a business choice than anything, putting information into the cloud, but i also had to think about how i was going to access so i am putting it in as a decision factor.
4. Browser media service: I wanted to be able to browse and access media whether at a clients to show them an article or news clipping or maybe a website etc. I also wanted something for reading surfing while having my morning coffee(We can be all work right?)
5. media entertainment Yes it has to be a "Fun" device to, watch a movie while travelling, or playing a game while waiting on my next appointent so this was on the list though not a major factor, as this gets us into an "apps" war and thats not the focus.
OK so there is more but that covers the major items
Decisions:
So I shopped and shopped borrowed friends ipads and a xoom, I really do like android in a lot of ways, it has its problems but I had an Iphone and was ready for a change. I am not going to bore you with the research but needless to say i chose the AT as my device to put this whole notion of Tablet for business to replace my laptop/netbook for work to the test.
REASONS:
1. Keyboard number UNO i wanted the physical keyboard cant live without it for major typing and work related stuffs. I tried the bluetooth one with the ipad and it wasn't bad, but the extra battery power in the AT was a bit of a topper not to mention all the expansions. ( I do think $150 is a bit much, but in the end, its what makes the Transformer a Transformer right?)
2. Expandability: Up to 64gigs of additional memory i can have a card with all my data a card with movies books music etc this was just too good to pass up. Yes i had already figured out a cloud solution etc but lets face it I wanted the kitchen sink with my device. The HDMI and USB were great additions as well. (A note my laptop took a dump one day and I was able to connect my external mouse keyboard to the AT and easily finish the day and deal with my laptop later)
3. Screen: yes as i mentioned it is going to be a bit of a "Play device" so it needed a great display and i liked this one over the xoom though the galaxy tab 10.1 i compared it next to was sweet and it had a keyboard, but the keyboard had no battery and had a lack of other expansion ports.
4. overall performace: this wasnt really to much of decision factor as all tablets are running tegra 2's for the most part and i wasnt looking at an ipad
THE PURCHASE:
I am putting this in because well it was an ordeal. I bought from bestbuy and got their 2 year replacement plan. Well i am on my 4th tablet and 3rd keyboard. Now I will be honest i wanted perfection and as was pointed out in a previous thread that just ain't gonna happen so really the first keyboard and tablet were it but i wanted a perfect no leak screen and a non discharging keyboard so back to the BB i went, again and again and again. Ok so now i have a series 60 tablet with a 50 keyboard and it all works, some light leaks but nothing that is earth shattering and doesn't bother me(Ok well it does but i got over it) So for those of you who think i just keep returning etc till its perfect, um take it from me, each one was worse, the second keyboard the space bar stuck, the 3rd keyboard was great, it does discharge but not a bad as the first. The tablet, on the second the light bleed was worse than the first and the 3rd one had huge dead pixel/flaws in the screen now the fourth some light bleed but in my opinion perfect as perfect can be. Moral of the story read the forums there are people here who are super helpful and will get you set straight but also be practical. If the little things really are going to bug you and you feel the need to come to a forum and write a post of Why i am returning my AT then its not for you, i knew the snowball i created with being picky and i got over it.
ONWARD!!!!!
OK THE SETUP APPLICATIONS AND PREP
1. First thing I did prior to buying anything was setup my business info and stuff to be accessible via the web. This required its own set of decisions which i wont get into, maybe a blog post about it later, but i migrated my stuff to google apps. (Hey i am going android so using google apps everything should all work right? it's all google, well sort of i will address it later)
a. Files and storage, i actually chose a combination of google docs and Microsoft live(25gigs of free storage how could i turn that down) I moved all the necessary files to the cloud and i was set
b. All my email addresses were migrated to my google apps and i was set there
c. Contacts moved to Zoho (I am debating this choice good for a later discussion)
2. Tested everything using my laptop and a web browser it all worked fine. I ran for about two weeks while i was doing more research on Android tablets apps etc, and I didn't have any issues.
3. Applications
a. Polaris Office/Docs To Go: I already had the later and the former comes with the AT so i was pretty much set for tablet handling of office docs. Its not a perfect solution by any means and would i like to have office on my tablet YES, do i need it not really. If i REALLY need to generate a word doc with high end formatting etc or i need that complicated cash flows analysis spreadsheet i can usually wait till i am back in the office in front of my computer. Remember this device is for travel/on the go and for THAT these apps are fine. (I am hoping they fix the keyboard issues with Office 365 because that will be IT and you will have it all)
b. Evernote became my note software, I REALLY miss onenote its my favorite office program but alas Android does not have support for it, mobile noter is not that great so migrated to Evernote. Evernote works well just takes a little bit to get used to as i had to change the way i organized my stuff, its different from onenote. (One thing i miss big time is pen input. I looked at the HTC Flyer because i really wanted to have the pen/OneNote experience. I found that this was one of those compromises. If i was still in school or in a job where i had to take copious notes in meetings, i would probably opt for a Tablet PC Fujitsu Q550 comes to mind so i could use pen input.)
c. With everything migrated to Google apps email was a snap put my google apps account info in and BAM its all there. I had already got Zoho synced with my contacts in Apps so they came down as well.
d. Using a combination of gdocs and the docs apps above is fine, though i really think google needs to "Finish" their products they have a habit of starting something putting it out there then never finishing or refine it. Google apps had a chance but with Office 365 available for a dollar more its gonna have troubles unless they step up their game. (We can have a google apps vs office 365 debate somewhere else)
e. To access my skydrive i use Sorami which is working well. The bad part is that i have to drag the file to the asus work on it here then push/send it, not ideal but it works. Quick note on collaboration, one of my sticking points on gdocs is that in order to collaborate on it and get all the functionality you have to convert it to a gdoc, i am not to keen on this as usually the conversion of complicated word docs with lots of formatting is horrible, hence Office 365 maybe the answer with the ability to use web apps and edit things in the native .DOC format. In any case its fine for on the go, and truthfully i don't know about others but my needs for generating complicated or highly formatted documents when i am away from my computer are pretty low.
f. For ZOHO i am limited to their mobile website they have an ios app now but android development is lagging, as it seems to with a lot of things, however i am hopeful they will come up with a native android app. I am still shopping on the CRM front so we'll see this may be a non-issue
That's the basics of apps i have the file explorers and a few games and other stuff but that's the basis of the business stuff.
HOW HAS IT WORKED
Now we get into the dirt of the article how did using the AT as a replacement for my daily out of office use workout. in a word GREAT but here is the skinny
THE GOOD:
1. Weight, wow being able to carry around my portfolio folder to hold documents etc and my AT was fantastic.
2. Access, i had access to all my documents when i needed them when i wanted them. (Let me clarify I know the AT is Wi-Fi so i tether it to my Nexus S 4G when i am not in range of a Wi-Fi hence my statement i can access everything) Yes its true i had that with just my phone but on the 10" screen with a keyboard i felt like i could really work with them when i needed and i could draft from scratch some pretty nice letters etc.
3. Email, yes i know we all have this with our phones but as i noted my hands are big so typing anything of length on the phone is tough for me, the AT made this a snap, take a few minutes between appointments to dock with my keyboard which is in my trunk not only does the pad get a top up, which it didn't need but hey some extra juice nevver hurts for that extra round of Angry Birds, and i can type up all notes etc.
4. Worth noting i did need to make a change to a .NET app for a client i was no where near a pc and this needed fixing now, i used splash top logged into my pc launched studio and made the change, was it horribly slow yes would i want to try and work that way HELL NO but was my client beyond happy and will i get a ton more business from him cause his problem was addressed right away OH YEAH. So i can do the same with office docs etc its not ideal but dang in a pinch there are work around’s.
THE BAD: (This i boil down to i would have been fine had i had a pc)
1. Well obviously programming, I did like having my laptop and being able to sit in a Pete's or something and work on some projects that had been lagging. So not being able to do my development is a bit of a downer, but its all about compromise right.
2. I mentioned earlier pen input. I REALLY like Onenote and I am an advid pen user, i replaced all the notebooks and post its around my desk with a Wacom Tablet and onenote. I did a tremendous amount of research, and business organization in Onenote, so putting this on the table as a “Compromise” was difficult. I downloaded EverNote and started taking notes via typing, and it wasn't so bad. Hence, my decision to make the switch. Again if Office 365 shapes up the way I think it will, i will be back in OneNote in a heartbeat.
SUMMARY
So for me the AT system will accomplish what i need and i think will only get better as android and apps mature. Email, doc reading editing and file creation, file access ebooks movies on and on the device is fabulous. For those thinking of going this direction, here are some thoughts. I look at my purchase of 700 which includes my 2 year replacement with BB and I compare that to what i can get in the PC world. Well the New Fujitsu Q550 i believe is about 700 and that is a full slate pc with about 6 hours battery has the stylus for writting runs office including one note (onenote + stylus = Heaven) there are a few reviews out there and this seems to be a nice challenge in the pc arena, if you want a PC for your work. The AT is not a pc so you have to adjust your thinking and try not to compare it to a netbook or pc thats why this is more of a "How i went about using the AT" rather than a vs because truthfully its not fair to compare apples to oranges. After making some changes to the way i do business i am able to successfully use the AT as a replacement for my day to day operations OUTSIDE the office i still have my PC and still use it. I think that moving forward online services like office 365 and google apps will level the playing field a bit to make comparing tablets to pcs a little closer but right now there are things that my tablet does that a pc is really hard pressed to do. Grab from my bag push a button read a book surf the net watch a video the list goes on. Maybe the new pc tablets will sleep/hibernate better and the gap will get closer I don't know. I miss some PC functions once in a while and with Tablets PC’s coming out as light as the Q550 I think the landscape is going to change, but take a look at your situation and see whats right for you. You can read “VS” articles all day but those are simply peoples observations/opinions. Take a step back and decide what you want and then mold your world to it.
Thats my experience please feel free to comment if we want to use this thread as a building block of Business “how to's” for getting people to undertand that tablets and pcs can live together it doesnt have to be an either or thats great. Maybe share some uses/apps things you do to leverage your AT in the work world.
The Rahl (Heh)
Why not use Splashtop HD to remote into your PC to do programming?
RTbar said:
Why not use Splashtop HD to remote into your PC to do programming?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
He did mention that he did remote desktop to his comp for a quick fix. Its def not ideal, especially for a long time.
If you have your code stored on a Linux box, you could SSH into it and use a terminal-based text edit to do it. Yeah, not the most fun, but it takes less bandwidth/power to do.
i had thought about the linux box but truthfully if i need to program i will grab my laptop. My goal was to use the AT on the business side though i am finding new ways of doing things everyday. Though kind of wondering since i dont NEED an AT shoud i wait on next gen Tegra3. Heh yeah that opens the wholebcan of worms "if i wait ill get the newest and the best" youll never buy anything then butbyou cant help but wonder. Heh I think ifthey had some firm dates on tegra3 i might consider but since there are no firm dates ichosetheAT.