I have the plan to get my fingers dirty with building Android ROMs for some older devices to provide them with security fixes and maybe new functions.
After looking around in XDA and AOSP, I think, I'll get a grip on the build process. However, I'm absolutely not clear what it means, if the device vendor has discontinued software updating and proprietary elements are available from an older version only. The example is the Nexus 5, where Google stopped software maintenance with Android 6. Would those older modules be still usable? Am I thinking too complicated?
Instead of upgrading the device to a new Android version, which apparently can bump into limitations like memory etc., would security fixes be backported to older Android versions?
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i know much fuss is always made about devices getting or not getting updates to newer versions of android. but i don't understand why it's as big of a (technical) issue as it is.
android is based on linux, correct? anyone with a linux-based desktop regularly updates the kernel and various system packages without thinking twice. and the devices continue to work fine. i can run any version of ubuntu i want on my laptop, and they all work fine.
the problem with building the android osp for an arbitrary device is drivers, correct? is it because manufacturers don't release the source code for drivers? i can understand it isn't possible to reverse engineer or transfer a binary blob from one system to another.
but, manufacturers have these drivers (of course); why is it so difficult to package their drivers with newer versions of android? the kernel can't change so much that drivers need to be re-written with every version, or it would have died a long time ago.
this isn't meant to inspire flaming, i'm just curious what it really takes to build android for a device (and have it 100% working). if a device existed with 100% open source drivers, would it be trivial to build android for that device? how many proprietary drivers does an average device have? are they standardized at all beyond the ARM ISA?
Updates for Android devices are always rolled by the gadget manufacturer, so every time Google introduces a new update we have to wait till the manufacturer of the device decides to roll it out, this obviously takes a lot of time and puts Android at a disadvantage against Apple and Microsoft.
For a Windows device irrespective of the manufacturer if Microsoft rolls out an update all can avail of that update through windows update. Android also being an open platform like Windows should be able to do the same.
If I have a software CD of Windows 7 I can install the software in any manufacturers PC and use it. I may just need to do some additional driver installation if required.
Why can't Android develop their platform to function in a similar manner so that once a new version of Android is released I can install it it any device and o fcourse put in the specific drivers to make it work if required.
With the approach of Microsoft looking very prominent now for both Smartphones and Tablets, this may just be a warning bell for Android, I hope they have their eyes and ears open.
Would be nice to know the views of others. As an Android user do you feel this would be a good step for Google?
kaus1108 said:
I may just need to do some additional driver installation if required.
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The above is the key sentence in your post. The problem is that without the correct hardware drivers for your specific phone the OS may not be able to boot at all and will certainly have limited functionality - just look at the issues there are with trying to run leaded ICS / JB ROMs on phones that don't have an official version of the ROM available with the correct drivers yet.
The reason that Microsoft is able to push out a new OS and have it (mostly) work on any manufacturers PC, with any hardware, is that all the hardware manufacturers are given alpha/beta copies of Windows to test their hardware on and to allow them to build the drivers well in advance of the OS being released by the guys in Redmond.
Google don't do that. They release the OS immediately they have hardware support and compatibility for their devices - and let everybody else deal with the aftermath
windows is the opposite from open platform!
android is an open platform.
the phone makers are free to use android as they wish, they can decide if to upgrade or not.
google only realeses the source code.
XDA is there for providing the latest update.
My phone was supported by Samsung till Gingerbread. But I got jelly bean from XDA devs just after a week after the source code release.
But it does have some bugs which cannot be solved without Samsung's help.
But if you wanted the fastest OEM updates, buy a Nexus.
But 50% of the people are normal users who do not care about updates and new android versions.
Sent from my GT-S5830 using Tapatalk 2
SimonTS said:
The above is the key sentence in your post. The problem is that without the correct hardware drivers for your specific phone the OS may not be able to boot at all and will certainly have limited functionality - just look at the issues there are with trying to run leaded ICS / JB ROMs on phones that don't have an official version of the ROM available with the correct drivers yet.
The reason that Microsoft is able to push out a new OS and have it (mostly) work on any manufacturers PC, with any hardware, is that all the hardware manufacturers are given alpha/beta copies of Windows to test their hardware on and to allow them to build the drivers well in advance of the OS being released by the guys in Redmond.
Google don't do that. They release the OS immediately they have hardware support and compatibility for their devices - and let everybody else deal with the aftermath
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Thank you for the response and I do agree with what you say and the key to it is that there are certain things that Microsoft do and Google don't and how it is going to impact users in the future.
I remember when I moved from Windows Vista to Windows 7 all the Vista drivers were functioning allright after installing Windows 7 and I have also faced situations where I did not have certain drivers but the PC still functioned on generic drivers provided in the Windows software.
Don't you feel it would be much better if Google just released a Jelly Bean OS and left it to us to install it and I am sure that based on devices already in the market those drivers can always be included in the OS and each phone would pick its own based on its hardware. Only the new devices would need new ones which Google may not be able to provide. If this were true today I would be installing JB in my Galaxy S3 and not have to wait for Sammy.
djbijo said:
windows is the opposite from open platform!
android is an open platform.
the phone makers are free to use android as they wish, they can decide if to upgrade or not.
google only realeses the source code.
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No, Windows is quite open. Apple is the closed one.
Sent from my MB508 using xda premium
Don't you think its about time that google implemented a "Windows Update" style updater for Android if only for the security updates?
I think that in the long term Google should look into developing a system which should allow them to send out the updates (eg: from ICS to JB) to all devices, by simply having a three layer system:
Layer 1: Kernel
Layer 2: OS
Layer 3: OEM Skin, apps, etc...
that should enable them to update everyone immediately and if the OEM's skin needs updating to support one or two features of the new update, then Google could easilly email them during development of the update, and if the OEM doesn't support the update, either don't allow the update to go out the their devices, or if its something small (eg: the moving widgets in JB) allow the update to go out and the OEM can support the updates in their skin in their own time.
as for the hw, if the update only works with ARMv7 CPU's it shouldn't be that difficult for them to tell the update SW that the latest update won't work with that ARMv6 device...
or if it needs slightly different drivers for different devices, it shouldn't be too difficult to install a drivers pack along with the update.
what are your thoughts on this?.
The problem is Windows updates are different from Android ones. First off they are security updates most of the time and not OS updates. It would be possible for Google to do universal security updates for all Android devices, wouldn't be a bad idea. OS updates would be another story. Windows is easy to update because all computers support a minimum hardware configuration going back to the IBM-PC days. This allows you to boot into Windows even with minimal driver support. From there you can install drivers and generally hardware OEMs will provide driver support for newer versions unless the hardware gets old. Android on the other hand needs drivers integrated into the kernel IIRC.
spunker88 said:
The problem is Windows updates are different from Android ones. First off they are security updates most of the time and not OS updates. It would be possible for Google to do universal security updates for all Android devices, wouldn't be a bad idea. OS updates would be another story. Windows is easy to update because all computers support a minimum hardware configuration going back to the IBM-PC days. This allows you to boot into Windows even with minimal driver support. From there you can install drivers and generally hardware OEMs will provide driver support for newer versions unless the hardware gets old. Android on the other hand needs drivers integrated into the kernel IIRC.
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I'd say it is not about the drivers only. Most of thel vendors supply their devices with slightly modified versions of Android. Google just incapable of controlling and updating those new versions of Android. It is a job for vendors, not for Google.
But idea is definitely good.
Does anyone think this will happen? I hope not. The main reason I use Android is it's open source nature. And what about custom roms? What will happen to them?
Google is preparing to seize control of Android with its own proprietary closed-source version of the mobile operating system, an analyst claims.
Technology analyst Richard Windsor says that a highly confidential internal project is underway to rewrite the ART runtime, removing any lingering dependencies from the freely downloadable open source AOSP (Android Open Source Project) code base.
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Full story: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2016/06/08/google_is_taking_android_proprietary_heres_how/
It will happen, there are too many risks now with un-patched OS versions
While Google are promptly releasing fixes, the OEM's are not pushing them out.
(They claim testing/compatibility issues, but really mean, we want you to buy a new phone)
Why should I have to pay ~£500 every year for a phone with the latest OS just to stay safe.
I have a 2010 HTC Desire HD running MM perfectly happily (thanks to XDA developers), it just goes to show it can be done !
Even flagship models are slow to receive latest updates while OEM's re-tweak all their 'crapware' to work with the updates.
The only way Google can force updates out is to lock down the underlying OS so that it removes the OEM's excuses.
Its a shame that OEM's laziness/greediness is going to ruin it for all.
Unfortunately closed-source = death of custom ROMS :crying::crying::crying:
Mainline it to the main Linux repo
Use mobian END or
If you want android Get the upgraded LOS port to your device and port it to AOSP using the android mainline kernel (now with the last Linux you can use any android version you want), with mainline drivers like freedreno etc... (You can use drm-hwcomposer) END or
If you want your stock rom like OxygenOS extract the GSI of the newer model of your phone, decompile apks, edit files etc... To match your hardware and reenable lost features or disable feature with hardware requirements. To make sure everything is working fork LOS and call it, merge it with the prebuilt GSI and modify it to work lawless with stuff like enforced selinux.
I'm doing this with my OnePlus 6T, my hope is to have the last OxygenOS that work flawlessly on mainline kernel and upgrade it until the hardware is not good enough, then I'll just use mobian or buy a new phone.
Given that Android is comprised of multiple disjoint components, about two dozen of which are encompassed in Project Mainline/Treble/Google Play system updates/etc., now mostly simply referred to as "Google System updates"...
"One of Google's biggest efforts for Android in recent years is to make updating parts of the operating system easier, cutting out the middlemen wherever possible to deliver updates directly to customers. Originally referred to as Project Mainline, the system is now called "Google Play system updates" or sometimes "Google System updates."
These updates are downloaded and installed automatically by the Play Store, with the installation finalizing whenever you decide to reboot your phone. Generally speaking, the system is designed to go unnoticed, a goal that Google has achieved with relative success."
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I have asked this key pertinent question of everyone I can ever since project Mainline/Treble had been announced way back for Android 10 and have yet to get _any_ answer whatsoever that has any basis in published facts from Google.
The question...
For the two dozen core modules covered in project Mainline, for how long does Google update them over Google Play Update services on Android 10+ phones?
The answer...
Is it finite?
Is it forever?
Is it arbitrarily finite?
For how long are the two dozen core modules updated over Google Play for any given Android X+ device?
GalaxyA325G said:
Given that Android is comprised of multiple disjoint components, about two dozen of which are encompassed in Project Mainline/Treble/Google Play system updates/etc., now mostly simply referred to as "Google System updates"...
I have asked this key pertinent question of everyone I can ever since project Mainline/Treble had been announced way back for Android 10 and have yet to get _any_ answer whatsoever that has any basis in published facts from Google.
The question...
For the two dozen core modules covered in project Mainline, for how long does Google update them over Google Play Update services on Android X+ phones?
The answer...
Is it finite?
Is it forever?
Is it arbitrarily finite?
For how long are the two dozen core modules updated over Google Play for any given Android X+ device?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The "project mainline" is misleading. Here when I tak about mainlining I'm talking about running android with a generic Linux kernel instead of the fork. So you can basically update the kernel to infinity and so port every android version you like.
So basically now I'm porting the OnePlus 6t to aosp using android-mainline as kernel with drm-hwcomposer. So anything forked or something.