Seems like some recurring discussion in past threads:
1 - why should we even bother overclocking if we’re not a gamer.
2 - won’t we damage our device with overclocking.
I haven’t seen definitive answers posted anywhere, and I certainly don’t have one.
Maybe in that case (I have no definitive answer), I should probably just keep my mouth shut.
It may be the case, if so let me know.
For whatever reason, I have some strong opinions and I feel it would be useful to share my opinions and the reasons I have formed those opinions.
Take them or leave them or add to them... up to you.
Point out to me if you think I am grossly mistaken.
1 - why should we even bother overclocking if we’re not a gamer.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
There is constant tradeoff between battery and performance.
Underclocking will help you save battery. How low you want to underclock depends on what you can tolerate.
But what you can tolerate depends on your user experience, which can be dramatically impacted by use of overclocking at other times.
The perfect example for me is a program which is slow to start up. In my case it is Memento database with 1000+ records, takes a long time to read in (I think the program does some sorting every time it opens). That is a minor annoyance. If I were to underclock it will start even slower, I’m going to get impatient and set my speed back up.
But think about this:
1 - Using Tasker you can apply cpu profiles upon application launch and remove them after a predetermined length of time. I can give the program a blast of 1600M-hz when it starts, then set it back where it was after predetermined period (for example 10 seconds).
2 – Setcpu is not quite as flexible as tasker in this regard. With setcpu we can create a profile to occur when we launch the program like Memento, but we just can’t incorproate a time delay into the logic (it will stay on the higher profile as long as the program runs in the foreground).
3 - There may be circumstances where this setcpu behavior is what you want... it will give you faster response whenever the program is in the foreground, and will yield to lower priority profiles whenever the program goes to the backghround.
(I haven’t investigated how to make make Tasker and setcpu play nicely together yet).
So, if you speed up the things that cause noticeable delay for only a short time, or particular applications which seem to run slow then you can probably be more satisfied with your underclock in the other times. In the overall picture, I think the overclock capability can ironically be used as part of a strategy to save battery (unless you just like overclocking just to see things zip accross your desktop and menu’s pop in and out faster than you can blink, I’m starting to get spoiled with that behavior on my phone in its new configuration, partially from overclock..I’m sure others get even better in their configuations..).
2 - won’t we damage our device with overclocking.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
On this I would say no, as long as you are careful about not running it in conditions that create high temperature. .
(you may have stability problems as you guys know, an entirely different subject).
The physics of the damage are all related to temperature. There are many variables affecting temperature that the designer is unaware of and so he builds in margin for the worst cause unknown future occurence (he has to consider maybe phone will be in desert with 100F ambient, and on the charger, while the user tries some heavy surfing with gps, all at the same time, so he limits cpu to 1200Mhz).
We on the other hand know what are the conditions of our phone and what it’s likely to see and what it’s doing at any given time, and setcpu provides additional ability to monitor and adjust.
Here are example setcpu profiles I came up with to protect myself from damaging temperatures (Zen's kernel A/1600)
Priority 100: If batter temperature > 50C (122F),establish conservative governor 100-400Mhz
Priority 90: If batter temperature > 45C (113F),establish conservative governor 100-800Mhz
Priority 80: If battery temperature > 40C (104F), establish conservative governor 100-1200Mhz (in the event I was overclocking, this profile will stop it when battery temp exceeds 40C, all other profiles that may invoke overclocking are lower priority than 80).
This is just from judgement, knowing that I’m normally < 104F battery temp during light use and don’t want to overclock when I’m outside that normal light use zone. Some further curtailment of cpu max frequency occurs as battery temperature climbs above that. (which I would not have even had the benefit of if I were casual user with no overclocking and no setcpu).
As long as you’re limiting temperature, you should not be worried about damage imo. By the way, of course overclocking is not the only thing to affect temperature: things like phone case (thermal insulation), charging, gps, heavy use etc all have an effect. I'm not quite sure why sometime cpu overclocking gets singled out in a dangerous category all its own without any discussion of other things that affect tempertaure.
In fairness, you may point out that what we monitor is battery temperature and not the same thing as cpu temperature. It’s a good point. Increase in heat generated at the cpu causes more of an increase in temperature at the cpu then it does at the battery. But it's question of how much different. there's a matter of how much. Why do you think it is that Samsung didn’t give us cpu temperature indication? I think because they knew battery temperature is close enough. Even on newer flagship Behemoth Samsung Note, I’ve read you still only get battery temperature, no cpu temperature. If cpu temperature was that much different, they surely would have provided a separate indication of cpu temperature (cpu is after all a much more critical component than replaceable battery).
And why should we expect battery temperature to be representative of cpu temperature on our phone, when the same is not true on a pc? I think I can answer that:
* PC has things all spread out. There is air flowing through. The air picks up heat from each component from heat sinks by convection. The component temperatures are not tightly coupled together.
* Phone (in contrast to pc) has everything compact inside one itsy bitsy case. There is no air flowing through. That means heat transfer inside the phone is not by convection but by conduction. For most effective conduction, all components are attached with high thermal-conductivity path to the phone structure and the exterior surface of the phone. The heat transfer from phone to ambient is primarily convection. So we have effective heat transfer (conduction) among the components of the phone and less- effective heat transfer (from phone to environment). It tends to tell us that there will not be big difference in temperature among phone components. The big temperature difference that occurs is between the phone and the ambient air.
I don't have access to a phone which has both cpu and battery temperature indicators. If someone does, it would be interesting to hear how close those two temperatures follow each other.
===================================================================================
Edited to add: searching other threads suggests there can maybe be a substantial differencebetween cpu temperature and battery temperature. That makes me a little less certain. At least we can use battery temperature as a gross indicator that the cpu isn't seeing excessive extra heat from other non-cpu sources while we're overclocking it. Certainly having profiles in place to limit overclocking when battery temperature is high can only help protect us. But is it a false sense of security which can lead us astray? I dunno. I have already done a stability test at 1600 for quite awhile and there's no damage in sight, so if there is any damage potential, then it is only an accumulation over time. I don't plan on leaving Fmax at 1600 all the time anyway, since it would kill the battery. My planned strategy reserves the 1600 overclock for occasional playing around, and boosts when I need them like like my Memento database. My gut says that approach is just fine. Interested in hearing any other thoughts, experiences, links that may shed light.
Hello, is there a way to reduce the heat due to high CPU frequency? In fact, when I play games such as Real Racing 3, in order to maximize my phone's potential as it has quad core, I usually set my CPU to maximum frequency (1.8GHz). However, l discover that the CPU drops back to 1GHz or lower, after about 10 minutes of gaming. In the beginning, I thought that it was a bug, but consulting someone in this forum, I discovered that the drop is part of the CPU protection feature. I appreciate this kind of safety feature but it will be boring that you can only enjoy a short 10 minutes of gaming before the phone heats up like a kettle. So, here is the question, is there a way in order to reduce the heat due to high CPU frequency? Will undervolting (UV) be recommended? Thanks.
Heat is generated as a byproduct of electical risistance... You'll have to exuse the bad spelling till I fix it...
1. under volting will reduse the electrons that are alowed to flow, thus reduceing the heat genorated, and it will also reduse your devices' performance.
2. A heat sync will reduce heat if the flat part is placed where the processor is. I ripped one out of an old copmuter and set my phone on it when modum tethering when playing online games and it works well. But not so comphotable when actualy using the device as the metal flanges coming off the other side of the heatsink are pokey.
3. A cpu govener change is the most likely solution to your problem of auto throteling and ramping of your devices' cpu friquancy. There are guides and info kicking around that using a google search like this:
cpu govener site:www.xda-developers.com
Will result in helpful reading matierial. I'd sugest looking at a program like rom tool box that will alow you to set up profiles that triger diferent cpu speeds and govenars bassed off of what your device is doing; such as when the screen is on, max frequancy=max, govenar=smartassV2 and; when the screen is off, max frequancy=50% of max, govenar=conservitive.
4. When all else is not good enough and you've gathered some info on how your device handles different govenars; then build your own. From what I've been reading its not so diffacult to tell your device exsactly how to behave in every way.
Hope some of it helps. And if you need some help with finding spisific sorces of info that I've hinted at, say something and I'll add some links when I spell corect this.
Sent from either my SPH-D700 or myTouch3Gs
Debian Kit Install guide for all android devices that I'm writing:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2240397
Or
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ssVeIhdBuuy8CtpBP1lWgUkG6fR6oHxP20ToYPPw6zI/edit?usp=drive_web
I am having an issue with my Galaxy S6. The videos I have seen online show that S6 achieves scores more than 5000 on multicore on Geek Bench. However not even once have I been able to achieve that. My Geek bench is 64bit edition.
Not that my device is slow or anything but just that I have never been able to achieve that score. I get an average of 4500.
Please help.
bhavinshah_321 said:
I am having an issue with my Galaxy S6. The videos I have seen online show that S6 achieves scores more than 5000 on multicore on Geek Bench. However not even once have I been able to achieve that. My Geek bench is 64bit edition.
Not that my device is slow or anything but just that I have never been able to achieve that score. I get an average of 4500.
Please help.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Please no. You should keep yourself from doing that. Your device works fine.
Benchmark scores doesnt really scale well on day to day usage I guarantee that.
The main issue with low score in benchmark is DEVICE Temperature. The more heat it gets the lower the score.
Let me clear this thing up to you
You said that your device is not slowing down but got low scores in benchmark, that's because your normal usage of device doesnt push your hardware to its limits therefore you dont feel like it is crawling.
Benchmarking is different. It generally juices up your phone to its full capacity but thermal throttling comes into play, it is a safe-fail feature on device to prevent chips from getting fried. Its doing it by lowering the CPU/GPU clockspeed, the lower the speed, the lower the score you get.
But if you're desperate enough, you may achieve this thru cooling it first, mine gets 5.3k+ on multiscore at 23-25 airconditioned room. 4.5k average on room temperature, and a much lower score of 3K when I run it multiple times.
Oh okay. This is nothing to worry about right? Coz I read in one of the xda forums that this is coz there are some faulty units out there. And I voided my warranty with Unikernel. It was worth it. RAM issues and all.
Keeping it in a AC room I achieved scores beyond 5k.
See why worry if your device doesnt fail you at all hehe.
I dont know about you guys who keeps on relying with benchmark scores?
Live up with your device people. Just settle down and enjoy using it.
Haha yeah. Honestly if it wasn't for Unikernel I'd be pretty disappointed with this device. All lag and stutters gone and finally smooth scrolling. OK totally off topic questions.. Apparently this kernel has something called LED Fade. And I don't know how to make it work. Any help? My notification LED is still the same.
Hai i have some problem on gpu s6.
Anyone can fix my problem. ??
You can sew on attachment.
Make me confused. My device no root
Why do people worry about their benchmark scores? IT wont do good on you I assure that.
Just be content that your device is powerful enough. Continous benchmarking at a short time span will make your device hot, thus cpu/gpu throttles.
Low speed, low score.
Your phone will give the best performance when you need it at most. Texting, browsing, checking emails, calls don't need all cores/gpu processing on your phone.
Intense gaming would fire up your phone to its full power.
People should refrain from using benchmark scores as much as possible.
Again, heat is the no.1 problem why your score is low, and if you're asking if removing throttling is the best way to get high score?
Its not possible and No, because it is the feature needed by your phone to protect the battery and its chips inside. You dont want to have something bad in your phone and to yourself
Same with desktop, they do have this safe-failure set up on cpu's and gpu's to prevent from overheating.
i would be glad if someone provides this so i can play more on my phone p9 is pretty sensitive
rhaegon36 said:
i would be glad if someone provides this so i can play more on my phone p9 is pretty sensitive
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
check this out: http://forum.xda-developers.com/p9/help/huawei-p9-overheat-protection-feature-t3441315/
As i already stated over there, if you disable termal throttling you will not get better performance, well, actually you will, for a whole lot of 15 minutes, then you get a dead phone.
Termal throttling is there for a reason, if the components get too hot they will get damaged. If you want to disable termal throttling, you need to improve heat dissipation first, and, as far as i know, there is now way to do so.
noki57oo said:
check this out: http://forum.xda-developers.com/p9/help/huawei-p9-overheat-protection-feature-t3441315/
As i already stated over there, if you disable termal throttling you will not get better performance, well, actually you will, for a whole lot of 15 minutes, then you get a dead phone.
Termal throttling is there for a reason, if the components get too hot they will get damaged. If you want to disable termal throttling, you need to improve heat dissipation first, and, as far as i know, there is now way to do so.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well trinity kernel tool exist but its way too old, no new update, trinity kernel tool where u can optimize voltage disable thermal throttling etc., my phone slows down at 39-40 sometimes even at 36 when i know my phone can handle maybe like 45-50 without damage.. ive seen old posts on LG phones where there is a kernal.zip with thermal throttling disabled and you can install it. i know it can be disabled but havent found any links for p9. i was just posting here to by chance get some from the devs here. i can control my phones temp i can cool it off on my AC while playing, i just want it to maybe if not disable it then set its throttling lvl to like 50degrees because i think the p9 throttling is set to a very low trigger point where it could be higher and still be OK
rhaegon36 said:
well trinity kernel tool exist but its way too old, no new update, trinity kernel tool where u can optimize voltage disable thermal throttling etc., my phone slows down at 39-40 sometimes even at 36 when i know my phone can handle maybe like 45-50 without damage.. ive seen old posts on LG phones where there is a kernal.zip with thermal throttling disabled and you can install it. i know it can be disabled but havent found any links for p9. i was just posting here to by chance get some from the devs here. i can control my phones temp i can cool it off on my AC while playing, i just want it to maybe if not disable it then set its throttling lvl to like 50degrees because i think the p9 throttling is set to a very low trigger point where it could be higher and still be OK
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
"i know my phone can handle maybe like 45-50 without damage"
"i think the p9 throttling is set to a very low trigger"
You know? You think? I'm sorry man, your knowing and thinking, unless based on official documents of Hisilicon, is just that, guessing, and it's not worth anything.
Just because some LG smartphone could do it, it doesn't mean it can be done. Also, you need to take into account the manufacturing process, the same chip could handle different temps if not built by the same company, or even if built by the same company, all the chips are different even if they are pratically the same. Guess what happens if you take different chips, or even different smartphones...
Termal throttling is not there to bother you, it's there for safety reasons, if the temperature is any higher than what the manufacturer had intended you could cause a lot of permanent damage.
Also keep in mind that if you disable termal throttling you will keep increasing the temperature, as the heat produced is the same at any given time under costant load and the passive dissipation system can only get rid of a small amount of what you produce (that's why it needs termal throttling at all), which means that if not stopped at 50C, your phone would just reach 70, or 80, or even 100C in a small time frame, and just keep rising until it eventually dies. Also, the throttling could even be power based, perhaps the battery is too hot, so if you keep going it could even "blow" up.
If you take into account undervolting and underclocking perhaps you can achieve the same result, but termal throttling has to stay.
I hope that explains it, so rather than asking for a kernel without termal throttling, ask for one with undervolting, it makes much more sense.
noki57oo said:
"i know my phone can handle maybe like 45-50 without damage"
"i think the p9 throttling is set to a very low trigger"
You know? You think? I'm sorry man, your knowing and thinking, unless based on official documents of Hisilicon, is just that, guessing, and it's not worth anything.
Just because some LG smartphone could do it, it doesn't mean it can be done. Also, you need to take into account the manufacturing process, the same chip could handle different temps if not built by the same company, or even if built by the same company, all the chips are different even if they are pratically the same. Guess what happens if you take different chips, or even different smartphones...
Termal throttling is not there to bother you, it's there for safety reasons, if the temperature is any higher than what the manufacturer had intended you could cause a lot of permanent damage.
Also keep in mind that if you disable termal throttling you will keep increasing the temperature, as the heat produced is the same at any given time under costant load and the passive dissipation system can only get rid of a small amount of what you produce (that's why it needs termal throttling at all), which means that if not stopped at 50C, your phone would just reach 70, or 80, or even 100C in a small time frame, and just keep rising until it eventually dies. Also, the throttling could even be power based, perhaps the battery is too hot, so if you keep going it could even "blow" up.
If you take into account undervolting and underclocking perhaps you can achieve the same result, but termal throttling has to stay.
I hope that explains it, so rather than asking for a kernel without termal throttling, ask for one with undervolting, it makes much more sense.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
alright man thanks, just kinda pissed i cant play too long on my phone
noki57oo said:
"i know my phone can handle maybe like 45-50 without damage"
"i think the p9 throttling is set to a very low trigger"
You know? You think? I'm sorry man, your knowing and thinking, unless based on official documents of Hisilicon, is just that, guessing, and it's not worth anything.
Just because some LG smartphone could do it, it doesn't mean it can be done. Also, you need to take into account the manufacturing process, the same chip could handle different temps if not built by the same company, or even if built by the same company, all the chips are different even if they are pratically the same. Guess what happens if you take different chips, or even different smartphones...
Termal throttling is not there to bother you, it's there for safety reasons, if the temperature is any higher than what the manufacturer had intended you could cause a lot of permanent damage.
Also keep in mind that if you disable termal throttling you will keep increasing the temperature, as the heat produced is the same at any given time under costant load and the passive dissipation system can only get rid of a small amount of what you produce (that's why it needs termal throttling at all), which means that if not stopped at 50C, your phone would just reach 70, or 80, or even 100C in a small time frame, and just keep rising until it eventually dies. Also, the throttling could even be power based, perhaps the battery is too hot, so if you keep going it could even "blow" up.
If you take into account undervolting and underclocking perhaps you can achieve the same result, but termal throttling has to stay.
I hope that explains it, so rather than asking for a kernel without termal throttling, ask for one with undervolting, it makes much more sense.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
no, you're wrong. cpu will safe at 100°C, cpu far away not enough warm the battery and kaboom. and voltage is set too high so phone become too hot in a short time it scaling to max frequency, max voltage in voltage table is used. temperature is closely related to voltage, not about cpu frequency. many manufacturers always set the voltage to too high, this is what causes overheating, I have undervolted and overclocked: I get 3 things: phone always cold cool!, huge battery life and speed of light as I want, I'm very please about it when I can control my phone, also my pc