Related
When it comes to android, you know that you have an outstanding range of hardware. From the low-end Optimus T/S to the titans of the OS such as the Galaxy S2, and everything imaginable in between. These days, you can even find generic china phones running an, often dated, android. Every carrier has it, they come in all price ranges, and they're available on demand. The question I pose to you, "Is android's key selling point the hardware?"
I understand that numerous XDA members and even some outsiders enjoy the limitless customization options made readily available in android and that's awesome. However, the general consumer is happy to end customization at setting their own ringtone. It's not a breaking factor for the majority that you can swap out kernels. Overall, android is a decent enough platform, but for the masses, I see little that it offers, hardware aside, that it's competitors don't.
Here recently, a thread was posted regarding the ASUS Transformer 2, a pentacore processor in a tablet. Now, most people have yet to exhaust the resources on their dual core phones. A penta-core device seems to be pushing the limits. Considering that it is running a mobile OS, by the time those cores could be utilized, wouldn't the tablet be long outdated? However, I know it will sell well because the word "Penta-core" sounds too awesome for the masses to pass up.
Another occurrence I've seen, having worked in retail shops for some time. A lot of customers, when asked about what OS their phone is running, will reply, "HTC" or, "Samsung." A lot of them have no idea what our little green friend is. Another point towards my personal opinion that the hardware is a huge selling factor.
Overall, android is a very complete platform. It is not my daily driver, but I do enjoy it whenever I have time to tinker. I am inquiring about this matter to get your opinions, what sells? Hardware or software?
I think for me its a little bit of both. I like the fact that the hardware is there in my 3d when I need to push the system really hard. Its not often I do, but its good that when I do, it executes the tasks with ease.
On the same hand there are huge software benefits for me. I love the UI and that I can set swype gestures to open particular apps or settings. It makes multi tasking tthat much easier and fluid for me.
Also, at least from what I have seen with iOS5 (my girl has the 4s) is that android seems to be ahead in certain areas of functionality. For example it is not an innovative thing (to me anyways, being an android user) to be able to back up your device without the use of a computer... I have been doing wireless backups and internal backups since I bought my first android phone.
I think one thing you mentioned before... I think it was you, anyways... was pretty much right on when you said that android is capable of meeting so many different needs in the sense that you have a wide range in variety of devices to choose from and at different costs. There are high end phones available such that perform to today's standards in the mobile world, and there are lower end ones available that are more cost effective.
I feel if you yourself are innovative and creative, you are way more capable of taking an android phone and building the UI to what you want/need. I don't sacrifice functionality for speed, ever. In the end it is still just a phone, but I prefer this platform because it caters to that need I have to customize my phone the way I want it to be, not what somebody else feels it should be.
---------- Post added at 02:19 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:13 AM ----------
And to address your comment about the bajjillion core tab....
Seems the hardware is way ahead of the software in this case... therefore, I am not impressed by it.
I have a Motorola xoom and it has plenty of power to do what I need it to do. I will not be taking it back to simply have two more cores under the hood. And somebody else mentioned the new kal el device only has 1gb of ram? In my opinion that is really disappointing for a device with that kind of processing power.
i buy phones based on hardware specs
the OS is optional
I prefer to load my OS of choice
just like my PCs / Laptops
z33dev33l said:
When it comes to android, you know that you have an outstanding range of hardware. From the low-end Optimus T/S to the titans of the OS such as the Galaxy S2, and everything imaginable in between. These days, you can even find generic china phones running an, often dated, android. Every carrier has it, they come in all price ranges, and they're available on demand. The question I pose to you, "Is android's key selling point the hardware?"
I understand that numerous XDA members and even some outsiders enjoy the limitless customization options made readily available in android and that's awesome. However, the general consumer is happy to end customization at setting their own ringtone. It's not a breaking factor for the majority that you can swap out kernels. Overall, android is a decent enough platform, but for the masses, I see little that it offers, hardware aside, that it's competitors don't.
Here recently, a thread was posted regarding the ASUS Transformer 2, a pentacore processor in a tablet. Now, most people have yet to exhaust the resources on their dual core phones. A penta-core device seems to be pushing the limits. Considering that it is running a mobile OS, by the time those cores could be utilized, wouldn't the tablet be long outdated? However, I know it will sell well because the word "Penta-core" sounds too awesome for the masses to pass up.
Another occurrence I've seen, having worked in retail shops for some time. A lot of customers, when asked about what OS their phone is running, will reply, "HTC" or, "Samsung." A lot of them have no idea what our little green friend is. Another point towards my personal opinion that the hardware is a huge selling factor.
Overall, android is a very complete platform. It is not my daily driver, but I do enjoy it whenever I have time to tinker. I am inquiring about this matter to get your opinions, what sells? Hardware or software?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
First time I have to agree with you pal.BUT:
i)Those guys/gals whose customisation needs end with setting the ringtone are the ones who won't care or even won't realize if the OS is different between an iPhone and an Android device.
ii)Android offers most(if not all) of the things other OSes offer,plus the infinite customisation capabilities no other OS has.Now this is what matters for those of us who can do more than changing the ringtone.
Other than these two things,I generally agree.In the end,though,it's user preference that matters.And people's idiocy in fact.Hell,many people buy their phones depending on how many megapixels their camera can do!
AllGamer said:
I prefer to load my OS of choice
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'd prefer that too, but mobile hardware is pretty much completely closed, so this is not really possible in practice, except maybe on very very few models.
To answer the title question: I don't know about others, but for me it's definitely the OS. Android is the closest to Linux as I'll probably get on a phone, people are free to cook up their own ROMs (not completely free in many cases, there's closed components in every ROM, but oh well), vast customization capabilities, for getting software you're not limited to one store with draconian rules and sometimes arbitrary decisions.
Certainly a combination of software + hardware with a little bit of company preference.
But considering the range of manufacturers for android based phones, I find it hard to lag behind hardware wise.
1) I look for a device that I think will last me the three years of my contract or at least the majority of it
2) I look here on XDA and see what the dev community is like
3) I buy the phone
I would guess that for 80%+ of phone buyers the main factor is price. Sure they know about the iPhone and the Samsung Galaxy devices, but for most those phohnes are out of their price bracket. So they find the device which has the same sort of idea but in a cheap package, which has helped Android no end since there are low end Android devices, and Apple have little interest in that.
For myself as a more techie person, I use Android becuase of the freedom to do what i want with my hardware. At least that's why i got into Android. Now I will continue to buy Android devices, but the major reason is I've invested in the app market, I have tens of pounds worth of apps for Android. To jump to anotehr platform now would mean having to start over with that. That's the power of these stores and markets, once you are invested changing platform is a lot more of a jump that just deciding which you like the most at the time.
countstex said:
I would guess that for 80%+ of phone buyers the main factor is price. Sure they know about the iPhone and the Samsung Galaxy devices, but for most those phohnes are out of their price bracket. So they find the device which has the same sort of idea but in a cheap package, which has helped Android no end since there are low end Android devices, and Apple have little interest in that.
For myself as a more techie person, I use Android becuase of the freedom to do what i want with my hardware. At least that's why i got into Android. Now I will continue to buy Android devices, but the major reason is I've invested in the app market, I have tens of pounds worth of apps for Android. To jump to anotehr platform now would mean having to start over with that. That's the power of these stores and markets, once you are invested changing platform is a lot more of a jump that just deciding which you like the most at the time.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've seen the price comment being made multiple times but aren't these devices pretty close to each other in terms of price after a 2 yr contract? In fact if you shop around, you can find some of these highend units for nearly nothing from online stores such as amazon
As for me, overall package is what sold me to galaxy s2. Form factor, hardware specs, overall implementation of the OS (gpu acceleration various places), etc. Version number really doesn't really bother me (2.3.3 vs 2.3.4/5/6/7) as long as there aren't any key features missing in the current revision that exists in the newer revisions.
Gusar321 said:
I'd prefer that too, but mobile hardware is pretty much completely closed, so this is not really possible in practice, except maybe on very very few models.
To answer the title question: I don't know about others, but for me it's definitely the OS. Android is the closest to Linux as I'll probably get on a phone, people are free to cook up their own ROMs (not completely free in many cases, there's closed components in every ROM, but oh well), vast customization capabilities, for getting software you're not limited to one store with draconian rules and sometimes arbitrary decisions.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
HD2 was a great example
then there are many other HTC devices that did the same
and a few Samsung devices as well
and there's the HP Touchpad
and...
For most people it's both.
They're attracted for the first time by the look and find the OS easy to use.
Despite people stating that the iphone is for people who just want to use a smartphone for the first time etc and Android is for techies and geeks to customise, if that were actually true then that would mean that there are a hell of a lot of geeks out there, which obviously isn't the case.
I would guess the majority of Android users' extent of customisation is changing the picture of their wallpaper, and that's the thing, with Android you can do that, it's easy to use, with the extra buttons it can seem more logical to new users compared with the single button on the iphone for instance.
It has the "apps and the wifis" that average users want, it looks good and you can make it look pretty much how you like.
Being able to just plug it into another computer and transfer files is a huge boon too, something a colleague was very disappointed with the iphone4 because of it's lack of ability.
There is 500+ android devices on the market globally, its the brand name and hardware specs that sell. Not the os.
Sent from my ADR6300 using XDA App
I'd rather say that that none of those sell the other: it's actually the price selling both, plus the "status symbol" factor thatbhas to do with Apple things. Androids are generally cheaper then both the iPhone and WP7 phones. This, plus the fact that most people don't seem to like WP7 tiled ui, basically because it doesn't "look like an iPhone" enough. That might sound harsh, like saying that most people are dumb, but it's not (only) that actually: people got used to icons since the day they got their first pc, no wonder they go for something that looks more familiar to them when they wanna buy a smartphone. Maybe Win8 will totally change the name of the game, but that's it for the moment (sadly enough I dare say).
I think we have to remember that 'most' people don't include the tiny fraction of the consumer market that are active on XDA. We make choices on a range of factors as we are better informed about both hardware and software. When we walk into a phone shop we want to assess the phone on build quality, size, Android version, display type, etc.
When the average punter walks into the same shop their buying choice usually boils down to no more than, 'Oh look, a shiny thing. I want that one'.
.
Thread moved to Android. Would advise you to read forum rules and post in correct section.
Failure to comply with forum rules will result in an infraction and/or ban depending on severity of rule break.
Do you review the content of my threads before moving them or do you see my name and play pin the tail on the donkey with the final location of the thread?
Before returning to Apple in 1997, Steve Jobs said that there was one thing wrong with Apple, "The products suck! There's no attraction in them anymore!" what he meant was that they had become boxes with generic designs and some chips thrown inside for good measure. They failed to induce lust within the consumer, did not make them wait in lines for their release, did not make them think about selling vital organs, apendages, wives, anything, just to lay their hands on a new Apple product.
Android OEMs seem to be suffering from a similar fate as Apple in its Jobs-less era. Though it has become highly successful in the low and middle-end market, Android has been unable to usurp the iron throne of the iPhone on top of the high =-end market, where all the large profit margins reside. A few phones are able to make a splash, but none of them have had as huge an impact as the iPhone. Even developers are getting tired of the highly fragmented platform and journalists are getting bored of reviewing similar looking devices coming out of a thousand different camps, as everyone and their mother, maybe even their grandmother along with a few nephews, think that it’s a good idea to 'develop' a new Android device.
What Android needs is a super sexy halo device, a flagship that through amazing design, stands out in the crowd and attracts customers towards it in droves. The iPhone was such a device and now even Microsoft’s Windows Phone has such a device in the shape of the Nokia Lumia 800 and it’s upcoming follower the Lumia 900.
The iPhone offers a perfect mix of stellar hardware married to beautiful, yet simple software. People are attracted by the design, and once they get it in their hands and explore the UI, it’s the begining of a love affair. With its latest iteration, Ice Cream Sandwich, Android has, for the first time, gained as beautiful an interface. All Android needs at this point is for some OEM to build a design, attractive enough to give consumers that initial push to fall in love with their OS and to take them to the level of sophistication, as their competitors.
Here are a few of my thoughts about what leading OEMs in the Android world can do to have any hope of being as sexy as their competition:
Samsung
Of all Android OEM’s, none have been as successful in the Android arena as Samsung. Owing to the fact that they produce their own chipsets, they are able to optimize their software much closer to their hardware and are thus able to create a blazing fast user experience. Even their designs are mostly serviceable, but they lose out on one key aspect: material quality. They tend to make all of their phones with cheap looking plastic, which is not preferable for customers who are spending exorbitant amounts of money to purchase their high-end phones. We need more metal, glass and polycarbonate, people!
HTC
Initially, HTC were on the right path; they made some pretty cool devices, like the Nexus One, the Desire S and the Legend, which proved successful for them. But they took that success to heart a little too vehemently. Now, all their devices seem so similar that one would need a microscope to differentiate them, the same wide speaker grills and curved edges; do not make a sexy device! Add to that the sheer volume of devices they produce, customers can get confused far too easily. Guys, churn out low to mid-end devices, all year, but focus all your attention and all your design chops on one high end device per year and build a brand around it. Fortunately, their new One series seems to be on the right track, let’s see what kind of impression it makes.
Motorola
Motorola, just needs focus! They are being acquired by Google, which is a huge deal! One would think that their collective vision of software would be better. After their ridiculous experiments with MotoBlur, their new skin is a major improvement, but there’s still a long way to go to achieve design parity with their competition. Also, they need to maintain the integrity of their brands; it wouldn't exactly inspire customer loyalty to have their newly minted devices one-upped just months after they bought them. For example, the Droid Bionic was released in September 2011, the Razr, two months later and the Razr MAXX a mere three months later, all at the same launch price of $299.99 on a two year contract. Such tactics do not inspire customer loyalty, as customers buy high-end phones with the assurance that theirs would be the best phone on the market for the foreseeable future. Again, focus on one flagship slab phone, coupled with another flagship QWERTY slider per year, and you're golden.
Sony
Sony is one of the strongest Android OEMs, right now in terms of design. Both the Xperia Arc and the newly announced Xperia S are pretty well-designed phones, but Sony always commits one fatal error, it does not iterate fast enough! The fact that the Xperia S is going to be launched with Gingerbread, instead of Ice Cream Sandwich and that it is using last year’s silicon (i.e. the Snapdragon S3, instead of the S4) cumulatively makes it a bittersweet deal. Good design needs substance as well, so ramp-up your game Sony, catch up already!
Android has now evolved into a pretty compelling platform with the advent of ICS. OEMs need to do justice to such attractive software and combine it with, simply put ‘amazing hardware’, to make sure that this sweet lass called Android, finally becomes sexy enough to attract as large a cult following as iOS.
Basically you've addressed the strategy each of the major players in Android need to take. I have generalised it a bit more other threads, saying that they need a strategy close to Sony and HTC, meaning more polish and support on a range of fewer phones. Although I do agree about Sony being behind on both OS and tech. While churning out numerous various iterations each year seems to be profitable, it is conversely damaging to these companies. The company's reputation becomes tarnished, and when they perfect the 'smaller range of phones with more polish' strategy, the companies should see more profitability.
Samsung while needing to put better build materials, also needs to reduce the sheer range of phones they put out each. Galaxy S series (1, 2 and upcoming 3) Galaxy Note, and Ace series really comprised the quintessential range of Samsung Android phones. The Galaxy Beam could be included when released. However you can't say that about the Galaxy R, W, Fit, Mini, Gio etc. It fails to really bring meaningful variation. Android is about options, but the difference in choices should be substantial or tangible.
I, often, go as far to say you have three level for consumers; high end, mid level, and budget. Now the major players excluding Sony, usually like to intergrate the lastest tech, which means that 4 - 5 months later the manufacture can introduce a new phone on just two levels or all three. So you've got a base range of 9 phones more or less each year. You might have a catergory of Special phone category for unique features like the Galaxy Beam or Xperia Sola or Padphone. A company should easily be able to provide excellent support for 9-10 phones. It might be a little more with 4g(or next gen)/International variations but is a new budget phone every 4 months necessary?
I really think customers would get this, but what do you think.
Agreed with pretty much all of it. Ever since after the Nexus One (arguably, before it as well), there have been too many Android devices that are practically clones. Although this is good because the more phones there are the more people will use Android (I guess), it's just overcrowding crap. And yes, Samsung's phones major downside is the stupid plastic they use, haha!
charmthief88 said:
Basically you've addressed the strategy each of the major players in Android need to take. I have generalised it a bit more other threads, saying that they need a strategy close to Sony and HTC, meaning more polish and support on a range of fewer phones. Although I do agree about Sony being behind on both OS and tech. While churning out numerous various iterations each year seems to be profitable, it is conversely damaging to these companies. The company's reputation becomes tarnished, and when they perfect the 'smaller range of phones with more polish' strategy, the companies should see more profitability.
Samsung while needing to put better build materials, also needs to reduce the sheer range of phones they put out each. Galaxy S series (1, 2 and upcoming 3) Galaxy Note, and Ace series really comprised the quintessential range of Samsung Android phones. The Galaxy Beam could be included when released. However you can't say that about the Galaxy R, W, Fit, Mini, Gio etc. It fails to really bring meaningful variation. Android is about options, but the difference in choices should be substantial or tangible.
I, often, go as far to say you have three level for consumers; high end, mid level, and budget. Now the major players excluding Sony, usually like to intergrate the lastest tech, which means that 4 - 5 months later the manufacture can introduce a new phone on just two levels or all three. So you've got a base range of 9 phones more or less each year. You might have a catergory of Special phone category for unique features like the Galaxy Beam or Xperia Sola or Padphone. A company should easily be able to provide excellent support for 9-10 phones. It might be a little more with 4g(or next gen)/International variations but is a new budget phone every 4 months necessary?
I really think customers would get this, but what do you think.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My Personal opinion differs for every company,
1. HTC - Last year, they produced many handsets, but none of none them was able to catch up with Samsung's flagship. They even produced two variants of their previous flagship Sensation which are Sensation XE and XL. In terms of design, XL was just a re-branded sensation with the beats logo, colored grills and increase in the CPU speed, while the XL was Xtra Large and was really costly. This played a major role in their loss of profit or revenue last year, Although i liked the Explorer, it was quite cool handset and showed improvement over it's predecessor Wildfire S.
2. Sony- Previous year, they just focus on their Xperia line of phones, one by one they just released Xperia series phones. They completely forgot their legendary series viz Walkman, Although the xperia smart phones were good- looking, sony's strategy failed to appeal to consumers much.
P.S. Sorry, it was Sony Ericson previous year.
3. Samsung- They are the most successful company in the Android smart phones arena. Producing smart phones like Galaxy SII and Galaxy Note, i think i don't need to say much about them. But, whereas they produced great phones, they also made some goofy mistakes, like producing clones of their previous flagship like Galaxy S Plus, Galaxy S advance and the recent Galaxy S blaze. In my opinion, Samsung currently holds a powerful portfolio of smartphone varying from Low-end droids to high end. But they also have some obsolete stuff in their portfolio which they should clean viz. Pop, fit, mini etc.
Hi all,
Since the release of the new Apple 13 (Pro) device, the main question is: do the new features of this new Apple iPhone justify to upgrade from an Apple 11 or Apple 12? In a lot of reviews the new Apple 13 is mainly seen as an/compared to the Apple 12S with minor added features. What are the new features of the new iPhone 13 (Pro)?
1. Better camera's compared to it's predecessors
2. More storage
3. A bit faster processor
4. Faster loading and a bit greater battery
But the question still remains, is it worth to upgrade?
IMPO, this is not the case when you own, as I do, the Apple Pro 12 Max. It's only worth to upgrade when you are a die-hard photographer. Then you will enjoy and appreciate the added new features in the Apple iPhone 13, which are somewhat disappointing regarding the costs. Also the update from iOS 14.8 to iOS 15 do not lead to big improvements, which is Apple unworthy unfortunately. Also the use of the lightning cable has become obsolete as of today. Apple has to switch to the, at this very moment, generally accepted USB C cable. A severe omission. What are your experciences and considerations to buy the new Apple iPhone? Am I right or wrong?
kindest regards, kuzibri
Whether the iPhone are pricey or not, totally depends on what weights more on your value scale.
iPhone is simple, easy to use (ridiculously easy), and very powerful in many aspects.
Apple managed to benefit from this combination.
Of course there's a lot of cons and pros, but there's something you need to know, if you were to buy a phone from Apple, Apple has one line of phones, and they are the company's flagship products.
You know how much flagship devices cost, the difference lays in what each OS offers. I personally don't like Apple products. So much underestimates.
I also disliked Apple products due to their stuberness to let us choose our own home display, etc. I acknowledged though that they made beautiful devices (my wife is an Apple addict). But at a certain moment, Apple released the watch 6 of which I was stunned by it's possibilities compared to the Fitbit Versa 2. I relealized that when I wanted to buy this watch, I also needed to buy an iPhone. Not so an interesting idea, UNTILL Apple released iOS 14.5, with which it was possible to achieve what I wanted, e.g. compose my own home display. This was the moment to make the switch for me and after one year now, I totally do not miss Android at all. Using the Apple now, I noticed a few things in comparison with Android: 1. It never crashes, 2. Updates, in contrast to Android, are not only on a very regular basis, but devices are also supported for a long time. Now iOS 15 is released, which still works on an iPhone 6S. This is not the case with the support of any of the Android devices. Besides that, altough the iPhones are not cheap, the Samsung top devices are also vey expensive. My home display is now exactly the same as I had on my Android devices. Regards kuzibri
I picked up my second new Note 10+, 256gb, 12gb ram for $800 a week ago.
Anything without a SD card slot is dead to me.
A dual drive 1.25tb handheld PC... hell yeah.
Apples run very good, are very easy to use, and bore me to tears. I loathe them; they are overpriced and use CCP sweat cities to manufacture them. The bright icons and pastels drive me insane; Debbie would love them.
Samsung's are the most customizable stock phones on the planet. Unfortunately the 10+ and Android 10 were Samsung's and Android's best releases to date respectively. Which is why I went with a 2nd 10+, sad but true.
It's ok because even after 2 years the 10+ is just plain fun to use; fast, stable, excellent build Q with one of the best displays there is even today. No high refresh rates but better color rendering than even some newer flagship phones. The display has perfectly square corners, none of that horrible CRT roundness here. 7mm thick, even in a good case it's thin. Pics don't do it justice. The spen nests until needed as a remote shutter release or for Smart Capture which is great to have.
No way I would upgrade the Apple, but I'm extremely biased and hate pastels
blackhawk said:
I picked up my second new Note 10+, 256gb, 12gb ram for $800 a week ago.
Anything without a SD card slot is dead to me.
A dual drive 1.25tb handheld PC... hell yeah.
Apples run very good, are very easy to use, and bore me to tears. I loathe them; they are overpriced and use CCP sweat cities to manufacture them. The bright icons and pastels drive me insane; Debbie would love them.
Samsung's are the most customizable stock phones on the planet. Unfortunately the 10+ and Android 10 were Samsung's and Android's best releases to date respectively. Which is why I went with a 2nd 10+, sad but true.
It's ok because even after 2 years the 10+ is just plain fun to use; fast, stable, excellent build Q with one of the best displays there is even today. No high refresh rates but better color rendering than even some newer flagship phones. The display has perfectly square corners, none of that horrible CRT roundness here. 7mm thick, even in a good case it's thin. Pics don't do it justice. The spen nests until needed as a remote shutter release or for Smart Capture which is great to have.
No way I would upgrade the Apple, but I'm extremely biased and hate pastels
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hi, very glad that I finally stirred up the discussion between Android and Apple users. As already mentioned, used to be a very satisfied Android user, but since Apple introduced the iOS 14, there is no difference anymore between an Android and Apple device. You're now able to make your own Home Screen, just like in Android. And let's be honest, which company gives updates so long to old devices as Apple. The most recent Apple iOS is 15 and runs on an Apple 6S. No Android device supports that long their devices. All in all, I do agree with earlier responders that Apple used to be boring, but that is now just ancient history since the release of iOS 14.5 and certainly now iOS15. Best regards, kuzibri
I haven't played with an Apple in 6 years... so there's that. That icon pack burns my eyes and display out though. Apple is going in unsavory directions on multiple fronts now. No SD card support alone though blows them out of the water.
As for updates once I have firmware that's fast, stable and fulfilling it's mission I leave it be. I rarely update and rarely have issues, that's not a coincidence. I may update my older 10+ running on 9 to 10, the same as the new one but that will be the last update.
Security simply isn't an issue. My current way outdated load is 16 months old, still fast and stable. No breaches.
All my critical data is redundantly backed up, a forced reload is the worst that could happen. Down time 2 hours, 6 if I need to repopulate the SD card. Any major firmware upgrade would cause far more downtime and worse could permanently degrade performance or capabilities.
I see no real advantage to updating an old device with a bloated OS it's hardware wasn't designed to handle. OS's tend to get larger, not smaller and are designed/optimized with the current hardware in use. So that 3, 5 whatever years support doesn't impress me in the least.
Tough choices if you are even considering one platform let alone two. I probably would wait to latter in 2022, even 2023. My next new purchase will be probably 2023 or latter. This year is a bust for Samsung and likely 2022. Apple may or may not be faring as badly, but there are supply chain issues worldwide. China is also having power infrastructure issues as well as a growing political storm both of their own making. I expect especially the latter to grow worse not better in the next 3 years.
kuzibri said:
Hi, very glad that I finally stirred up the discussion between Android and Apple users. As already mentioned, used to be a very satisfied Android user, but since Apple introduced the iOS 14, there is no difference anymore between an Android and Apple device. You're now able to make your own Home Screen, just like in Android. And let's be honest, which company gives updates so long to old devices as Apple. The most recent Apple iOS is 15 and runs on an Apple 6S. No Android device supports that long their devices. All in all, I do agree with earlier responders that Apple used to be boring, but that is now just ancient history since the release of iOS 14.5 and certainly now iOS15. Best regards, kuzibri
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't mean to be rude, I'm sorry, but .. do you really want to compare the customisation level between Apple & Android?
Apple is never close to a customisable OS, it has always been late to the party. Not just the home screen, there's a lot of features took it years to implement, though they were on Android for a long.
I used iPhone 11 Pro Max for about a week. I don't know, but I never got relieved about it. Leaving all the customisation behind, and step into a kindergarten?
One thing I hated was Apple's underestimation, they act & think on your behalf. If they thought a regular user don't need to manage files, they'll not integrate any support for file manager.
That's exactly how their security system works, if they thought something can risk the device, they don't build a firewall, they just eliminate the target. A very good example is the recent Visa payment hacking issue, where a warning was sent to remove the Visa as a payment method.
I see this very ridiculous, it gets the job done, but in a non-professional way.
In the other hand, Android does not think on your behalf, it gives you what an iPhone lacks, an option. A vast range of options, and if something doesn't suit you, you can change it. Or simply, build it.
I think I may use an iPhone when I'm dying or something. At least I won't have anything else to do but socialising.
Hi, "@Mohamedkam000: do you really want to compare the customisation level between Apple & Android?". No that is not my purpose. My point is that untill recentrly there were two incompatible worlds, e.g. the Android world vs the Apple one. Now, due to the the release of iOs 14.5 Apple offers somewhat more possibilities to customize your device. Untill recently I belonged to the Android world and my motto was always "Apple is for dummies", although I was also always under the impression of the build quality of the devices, which is beyond doubt. Since it's possible to customize your iPhone, it has become easier, certainly if you just like me want the Apple watch but not the iPhone, to make the switch to Apple. There is now more or less an "in-between" world. That's my point, no more or less. Kind regards, kuzibri
BTW: let's be honest, the best OS for mobile devices that even existed was Windows Mobile, which was as versatile as it could be. I owned an HTC HD2 with windows mobile, android and apple on one phone and all working perfect.
kuzibri said:
Hi, "@Mohamedkam000: do you really want to compare the customisation level between Apple & Android?". No that is not my purpose. My point is that untill recentrly there were two incompatible worlds, e.g. the Android world vs the Apple one. Now, due to the the release of iOs 14.5 Apple offers somewhat more possibilities to customize your device. Untill recently I belonged to the Android world and my motto was always "Apple is for dummies", although I was also always under the impression of the build quality of the devices, which is beyond doubt. Since it's possible to customize your iPhone, it has become easier, certainly if you just like me want the Apple watch but not the iPhone, to make the switch to Apple. There is now more or less an "in-between" world. That's my point, no more or less. Kind regards, kuzibri
BTW: let's be honest, the best OS for mobile devices that even existed was Windows Mobile, which was as versatile as it could be. I owned an HTC HD2 with windows mobile, android and apple on one phone and all working perfect.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I can go ahead and bring the pros and cons of iOS, but that's a long fight. So I'm gonna stick into the reasons you're providing to justify iPhone.
kuzibri said:
due to the the release of iOs 14.5 Apple offers somewhat more possibilities to customize your device
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't think you ever tried custom ROMs on Android phones. CyanogenMod? What about MIUI custom ROMs of 2014? How about the famous LineageOS?
Okay let go of the systems, how about Xposed? Ever used it? Ever used Dr. Ketan's ROMs? I'm asking to see if you had any experience in deep customisation.
Okay, do you know that you can change the home screen launcher on Android? You can change icons? You can use themes? Not just a wallpaper, a full theme.
If you know that, I wonder how can you even think about saying the iPhone is comparable to the customisation level on Android.
kuzibri said:
"Apple is for dummies"
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The company does literally acknowledge this phrase. And they are right to assume that. But, they are profiting from their right assumption.
Apple treats people like babies, people don't need the complications of programming and themes and customisation and other stuff. People just need to pay and use the limited things Apple offers.
kuzibri said:
want the Apple watch but not the iPhone
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Safety features like Fall Detection, Emergency SOS, and high and low heart rate notifications make Apple Watch great for older family members, even if they don't own an iPhone.
Calling, texting, and location sharing provide an easy way to stay connected with the family. Where I live, no one cares about smart watches, so I can't speak about it.
One last thing:-
iPhone has been released earlier than Android, it was revolutionary back then, and as you know, first impressions has a very huge impact on the customer's preference.
I have a relative that is using an iPhone for appearances, but his actual primary phone is an Android. It simply helps him a lot in his work, for he don't need a laptop to manage files or something.
@Mohamedkam000 said: I don't think you ever tried custom ROMs on Android phones. CyanogenMod? What about MIUI custom ROMs of 2014? How about the famous LineageOS?" Yes in my Android time I have used a lot of custom ROM's, like f.i. CyanogenMod, Artemis Rom, etc. So I'm familiar to customizations. To state that the iWatch is only for older family members is IMPO at least shortsighted. It's by far the best smartwatch available at this very moment (except for battery life). My sole purpose is to bring the Android and Apple world somewhat closer together instead of the current "War of the worlds". Both make beautiful devices with it'own pros and cons. Kind regards kuzibri
kuzibri said:
@Mohamedkam000 said: I don't think you ever tried custom ROMs on Android phones. CyanogenMod? What about MIUI custom ROMs of 2014? How about the famous LineageOS?" Yes in my Android time I have used a lot of custom ROM's, like f.i. CyanogenMod, Artemis Rom, etc. So I'm familiar to customizations. To state that the iWatch is only for older family members is IMPO at least shortsighted. It's by far the best smartwatch available at this very moment (except for battery life). My sole purpose is to bring the Android and Apple world somewhat closer together instead of the current "War of the worlds". Both make beautiful devices with it'own pros and cons. Kind regards kuzibri
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Unless Apple changes its ecosystem of which it does not allow its devices to work well with other rival products, there's no way the two worlds could join.
Hi @Mohamedkam000 , regarding this "Unless Apple changes its ecosystem of which it does not allow its devices to work well with other rival products, there's no way the two worlds could join." If we're holding on to these points of view, indeed the two worlds will never join. It's a matter of giving and taking. F.i. you ask Apple to change their ecosystem in order to work well with each other. But, what do yo have in return for Apple? That's the main problem for this dead end. As I see it, Apple has a lot of knowledge about securing the privacy of their users, while Android suffers once and a while from mal/ransomware due to the opensource of the OS. See what I mean? Regards, kuzibri
BTW: this does not mean that I'm able on my own to solve that problem not are you, but if we cooperate in this line, we might be able to convince some leading persons of both sides to do something about this.
BTW2: Also see this regarding customizations regarding icons on an iPhone: https://forum.xda-developers.com/t/customizations-on-the-apple-iphone.4342639/. It's only an example of many other apps.
kuzibri said:
Hi @Mohamedkam000 , regarding this "Unless Apple changes its ecosystem of which it does not allow its devices to work well with other rival products, there's no way the two worlds could join." If we're holding on to these points of view, indeed the two worlds will never join. It's a matter of giving and taking. F.i. you ask Apple to change their ecosystem in order to work well with each other. But, what do yo have in return for Apple? That's the main problem for this dead end. As I see it, Apple has a lot of knowledge about securing the privacy of their users, while Android suffers once and a while from mal/ransomware due to the opensource of the OS. See what I mean? Regards, kuzibri
BTW: this does not mean that I'm able on my own to solve that problem not are you, but if we cooperate in this line, we might be able to convince some leading persons of both sides to do something about this.
BTW2: Also see this regarding customizations regarding icons on an iPhone: https://forum.xda-developers.com/t/customizations-on-the-apple-iphone.4342639/. It's only an example of many other apps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
iPhone is safer than Android, but not more secure. For a device that receives so many patches for vulnerabilities, it doesn't seem to be better than Android.
I mean .. I've never heard of an essay alerting Android users to remove their Visa from the device. Android does fix the vulnerability. Apple does remove the reason the vulnerability is their in the first place.
Android is used by many, many people around the world, it is a very attractive target for hackers, of course it'll get some attacks. But, most of them does exploit the negligence of the phone owner. Like the latest report of malware-infected apps.
Example: Samsung has allowed iOS devices to connect to her Watch products for a long, maybe sometimes there's some missing features, but that's because it is created for Samsung devices.
On the other hand, Apple smartwatch does not allow any Android device to pair with it, it simply refuses to pair. If it was really a give-and-take, then Apple will take and not give.
Hi @Mohamedkam000 , regarding this: "On the other hand, Apple smartwatch does not allow any Android device to pair with it, it simply refuses to pair. If it was really a give-and-take, then Apple will take and not give.", see this video:
. It's not flawless, but it's possible.
Pairing Android watches to an iPhone is also not very easy and has it's disadvantages: https://www.lifewire.com/pairing-android-wearables-with-the-iphone-3875746. Regards kuzibri
kuzibri said:
Hi @Mohamedkam000 , regarding this: "On the other hand, Apple smartwatch does not allow any Android device to pair with it, it simply refuses to pair. If it was really a give-and-take, then Apple will take and not give.", see this video:
. It's not flawless, but it's possible.
Pairing Android watches to an iPhone is also not very easy and has it's disadvantages: https://www.lifewire.com/pairing-android-wearables-with-the-iphone-3875746. Regards kuzibri
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I thought we were talking about what is official, and what can be done without using back-door. Hacks happen due to an existing restriction, iPhone does not need to hack anything to connect to Samsung Watch, it is allowed to. Sometimes with limited features, and you know why.
I know there is Jailbreak on iPhone, too. But have you thought about the word itself? Jail? Break? iPhone is a Jail? Like .. I've never seen a company that makes choices on behalf of their customers like Apple do. It'll probably take them years to, for example, add another user-prefered customisation features.
Mohamedkam000 said:
I thought we were talking about what is official, and what can be done without using back-door. Hacks happen due to an existing restriction, iPhone does not need to hack anything to connect to Samsung Watch, it is allowed to. Sometimes with limited features, and you know why.
I know there is Jailbreak on iPhone, too. But have you thought about the word itself? Jail? Break? iPhone is a Jail? Like .. I've never seen a company that makes choices on behalf of their customers like Apple do. It'll probably take them years to, for example, add another user-prefered customisation features.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I just replied to your remark that Apple does not allow to pair with Android Smartwatches at all, no more or less. The only Smartwatch I know that supports both Android and, in a bit minor fashion, Apple's iOS, are the Fitbit devices due to their own Fitbit OS. Maybe in the near future Google Smartwatches are able of paring to Apple due to the fact that Google bought Fitbit.
Depending on what factors more heavily on your value scale, you can decide whether the iPhone is expensive or not. The iPhone is straightforward, really simple to operate, and extremely powerful in many ways. Apple was successful in gaining from this combo.
There are undoubtedly many advantages and disadvantages, but if you were to get an Apple phone, you should be aware that the business only produces one line of phones, which are its flagship models.
The pricing of flagship devices is well known; the differences are in the features that each OS provides. Apple items don't appeal to me personally. Much is understated. But I had spent a lot of money to buy it.
Hi all, I fully realize that this is a difficult question in this forum of mainly Android adepts, but nevertheless I'm just curious what people drive to buy an Android device or an Apple one. Wherefore then this question? Simple, at this very moment there are two incompatible worlds, the Android one versus the Apple one, e.g. either you're an Android adept and hate Apple or vice versa. But there is since a short while a change in the stubbern Apple's philosophy to determine what you can do with it's devices, meaning nothing at all. Apple used to determine how you use the device. Since the release of Apple iOS14.5 there is a slight, but significant change, in this philosophy. Now you're able to customize your own home screen with widgets, etc. You're even able to get your Apple's home display look like an Android one (see attachment). I have been for many years an Android adept who always stated the Apple is for dummies. After the release of the iWatch 6 and noticing all of it's capabilities, I wanted one but neglected it cause I did not want an iPhone for the above reasons. This changed after the release of iOS14.5 and certainly after the release of iOS 15. I now own not only the iWatch 6 but also the Apple 12 Pro Max and customized my iPhone to my needs. So all in all, I'm just curious if this kneel from Apple towards it's users leads to a sort of "in between world", instead of two incompatible worlds. Kind regards kuzibri
IMO you can't compare Apple with Android, but at most Apple's iPhone with Android phones from different manufacturers, Apple's iOS with Android OS which is different from manufacturer to manufacturer.
My resume with regards to difference:
Phones with Android OS can be expensive, phones with iOS always are, although both are based on an unix-like kernel.
Hi, thanks for your post. It's not my intention to compare Apple with Android or vv, but just curious what drives people to either buy (one of the many) an Android device or an Apple one. Both sides have very great devices but the world between them is immense. Kind regards, kuzibri
In September, 2021 the worldwide market share of Apple iPhones and Android OS based phones in terms of devices with a mobile OS was
73% Android OS based phones
17% Apple iPhones
what I think says all.
jwoegerbauer said:
In September, 2021 the worldwide market share of Apple iPhones and Android OS based phones in terms of devices with a mobile OS was
73% Android OS based phones
17% Apple iPhones
what I think says all.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
These % do not mean a lot IMPO. There are lots of Android devices on the market (Samsung, Reno, Huawei, Google, Sony, etc, etc, etc) compared to Apple. So it's completely logical that Android sells more phones than Apple.
kuzibri said:
Simple, at this very moment there are two incompatible worlds, the Android one versus the Apple one, e.g. either you're an Android adept and hate Apple or vice versa.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's not entirely true. There are simple people and people who prefer simplicity, but it is not necessarily that simple. Until this year, I've always had both. The only reason I don't now is unfortunate circumstance (factory defect), not choice.
Realistically, there are a decent number of people with Android devices that went after an iPhone and either couldn't get it because it was sold out, found a novelty feature about an Android device that caught their eye, or were sold on how much cheaper it was to get something that the clerk said was "fundamentally identical" (where it mattered). Some go back immediately, some later, and some find they were actually fans of Android that just never knew it.
twistedumbrella said:
That's not entirely true. There are simple people and people who prefer simplicity, but it is not necessarily that simple. Until this year, I've always had both. The only reason I don't now is unfortunate circumstance (factory defect), not choice.
Realistically, there are a decent number of people with Android devices that went after an iPhone and either couldn't get it because it was sold out, found a novelty feature about an Android device that caught their eye, or were sold on how much cheaper it was to get something that the clerk said was "fundamentally identical" (where it mattered). Some go back immediately, some later, and some find they were actually fans of Android that just never knew it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Many thanks for your objective answer. This kind of answer is the sole purpose of this thread. Kind regards kuzibri
kuzibri said:
Hi, thanks for your post. It's not my intention to compare Apple with Android or vv, but just curious what drives people to either buy (one of the many) an Android device or an Apple one. Both sides have very great devices but the world between them is immense. Kind regards, kuzibri
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My preferences are simple. Expandable storage, and the ability to unlock the bootloader (proves manufacturer has nothing to hide/true ownership of the device), and dark mode. Blinding white screens were the dumbest idea ever. Anything else is a bonus.
kuzibri said:
Hi all, I fully realize that this is a difficult question in this forum of mainly Android adepts, but nevertheless I'm just curious what people drive to buy an Android device or an Apple one. Wherefore then this question? Simple, at this very moment there are two incompatible worlds, the Android one versus the Apple one, e.g. either you're an Android adept and hate Apple or vice versa. But there is since a short while a change in the stubbern Apple's philosophy to determine what you can do with it's devices, meaning nothing at all. Apple used to determine how you use the device. Since the release of Apple iOS14.5 there is a slight, but significant change, in this philosophy. Now you're able to customize your own home screen with widgets, etc. You're even able to get your Apple's home display look like an Android one (see attachment). I have been for many years an Android adept who always stated the Apple is for dummies. After the release of the iWatch 6 and noticing all of it's capabilities, I wanted one but neglected it cause I did not want an iPhone for the above reasons. This changed after the release of iOS14.5 and certainly after the release of iOS 15. I now own not only the iWatch 6 but also the Apple 12 Pro Max and customized my iPhone to my needs. So all in all, I'm just curious if this kneel from Apple towards it's users leads to a sort of "in between world", instead of two incompatible worlds. Kind regards kuzibri
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You can read about my exploits with my Android phone here:
Any help rooting or unlocking bootloader on the incredibly unpopular Blu Life One X3?
So, here's my problem: I bought a Blu Life One X3 late last year since it was on sale for $150 ($100 lower than the current MSRP). Since it was still a new release, I thought that the modders would come after it eventually, so I just waited it...
forum.xda-developers.com
I chose Android because it's infinitely configurable... I've got mine to the point that there's no logging, no aGPS, no ability to remotely enable aGPS or any tracking 'features', no Near Field radio spying, no ads, no ad tracking, etc. My phone doesn't even have an Advertising ID. There's no 'phoning home' to Google or any of the advertising trackers whatsoever.
Everything 'Google' is either uninstalled or disabled completely except for the phone app (I can't find one that works well with this phone), and even that is neutered so contacts and phone calls aren't tracked by Google.
As such, my phone runs a long, long time. Even when using it, the battery only decreases by ~3% / hour. So I could literally talk for 30 hours straight and still have battery left.
Before I modded the phone, the CPU always ran warm because of all the corporate spyware stuff. Now I've got it throttled so when it's plugged into USB, it can run all 8 cores at speeds between 299 MHz and 819 MHz, and when it's unplugged, it's throttled to a single core limited to between 299 MHz and 442 MHz, with little noticeable lag.
My wife, on the other hand, got an iPhone... she's constantly plugging it in to charge, it tracks everything she does and says (and now they're perusing people's cloud storage, purportedly for CP), she gets all sorts of ads for stuff she's mentioned verbally. We've noticed the Siri 'creepy laugh' twice, and the camera came on by itself once... her phone isn't allowed in the bedroom.
Hi @electrofryed and @Lusty Rugnuts, many thanks for your posts and considerations on buying which phone. Your answers I was looking for when starting this thread, kindest regards kuzibri
Hi all,
I'm the type of person that doesn't really renew hardware until it dies out, and don't usually care for too fancy things either, so I keep my budget as low as possible.
I do appreciate vfm choices though, so I do pay for what features I can fit in my budget.
I also highly value a clean, bloatware-free software experience, good support (security updates and updates in general), that's why I've always been at least somewhat in touch with the custom ROM community so that I can keep my phones alive for as much as possible).
That said, I have a Redmi Note 4X (served me well for about 4 years, currently running PixelExperience) that is dying on me, so I've been checking out budget options (ideally around the 200 +-25% euros range).
I'm very sad to see that Xiaomi (which I've always preached to friends as best vfm, despite my despise of MiUI) is adopting the anti-OSS approach of MTK hardware, while at the same time has resentfully moved away from it's Android One phones and initiative (https://www.xda-developers.com/xiaomi-deletes-twitter-poll-android-one-miui/).
Similarly other budget choices seem to follow way (eg Samsung budget lines).
I was hoping to buy into 5G with my new device since some 5G towers are starting to appear in my country's big cities, but with a quick search I see that if I back out of 5G, I might still have some 4G options that can keep me in the Snapdragon realm and therefore the custom ROM community.
All that said, what would be my best vfm low budget choices with the current market?
Also please feel free and encouraged to comment on my perception of Mediatek gaining market share and it's effect on the community.
I'd find it interesting to see a different perspective on it if anyone has one.
Hi, if you are fixed on the ~200,- Euro price range go for a used Pixel3 in good condition. In a big german portal ("ebay-Kleinanzeigen") you can grab one in the price range of 150-180,-. i buyed one for 110,- and another for 140,-. My other productive phone is a Pixel2 running LOS18.1 currently. I buyed it to play/test but it is a very good device, so i started to love it ( ) and i use it as my daily business driver. You should be able to get one at ~ 100,- Euros.
The other alternative is the Pixel5. Disadvantage: its new and used one are at €~400-500,- currently. I expect that the price will go down when the Pixel6 is out in the market . The P5 is well supported with LOS either.
Edit: Have to tell that a screen size of 6"/ Height of 145-150 Millimeter is the maximum for me. I dont want a tablet, yes most current phones are tablets!
I think used* or an older new* discounted phone are viable options.
5G is overrated and not needed.
I just picked up a second new N10+ 4G running on Q although my savings weren't tremendous, the phone is.
That's what I think about the latest generation of technology and Android OS... not much.
The chip shortage will continue into 2022-3 more than likely. Grab it while you can as prices are still climbing. Tough times and more are likely coming.
*only from known good vendors. Protect yourself fully! A lot of scamming and misleading advertising going on now. Best to talk to the vendor on the phone first.
zimral.xda said:
Hi, if you are fixed on the ~200,- Euro price range go for a used Pixel3 in good condition. In a big german portal ("ebay-Kleinanzeigen") you can grab one in the price range of 150-180,-. i buyed one for 110,- and another for 140,-. My other productive phone is a Pixel2 running LOS18.1 currently. I buyed it to play/test but it is a very good device, so i started to love it ( ) and i use it as my daily business driver. You should be able to get one at ~ 100,- Euros.
The other alternative is the Pixel5. Disadvantage: its new and used one are at €~400-500,- currently. I expect that the price will go down when the Pixel6 is out in the market . The P5 is well supported with LOS either.
Edit: Have to tell that a screen size of 6"/ Height of 145-150 Millimeter is the maximum for me. I dont want a tablet, yes most current phones are tablets!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah, I am kinda fixed on the price. Could maybe go up to 250 but anything over that would be a waste for my personal needs.
To be honest I'm slightly skeptical about the used market especially at this time since the shortage seems to have promoted scamming
That said a lot of people have suggested used Pixels as being great value so I'll still think of this option, thanks for your insight!
blackhawk said:
I think used* or an older new* discounted phone are viable options.
5G is overrated and not needed.
I just picked up a second new N10+ 4G running on Q although my savings weren't tremendous, the phone is.
That's what I think about the latest generation of technology and Android OS... not much.
The chip shortage will continue into 2022-3 more than likely. Grab it while you can as prices are still climbing. Tough times and more are likely coming.
*only from known good vendors. Protect yourself fully! A lot of scamming and misleading advertising going on now. Best to talk to the vendor on the phone first.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As stated just above ^, I'm slightly skeptical of the current used market.
I bet the N10+ is an amazing device, however its way out of my budget (~870) and, honestly, an overkill for my needs.
Would you have any suggestions for an "older new" phone around that budget with a snapdragon
From my searches on the biggest local search engines for tech products since I posted this, the only new options that come up which mostly fill my needs appear to be:
- Moto G 5G Plus (4GB ~220)
- Oppo A72 (~210)
- Oppo A74 (~240)
- Xiaomi Redmi 9T (~170)
- Xiaomi Poco M3 (~170)
- Xiaomi Poco X3 (6GB ~200 / 8GB ~235)
Pretty much everything else has Mediatek.
Would any of those be a good choice with solid support for custom ROMs?
Are there any others out of this list available on EU vendors?
My area of interest in phones is pretty narrow.
Mostly Samsung as it crosses over to my device. The Note 9 seems nice and their price is down now.
I don't root so I'm not the best one to advise you on that.
Maybe get the phone through a carrier deal and distribute the payments over time.
Again it's better to avoid Android 11 and above.
You said your phone is "dying", it may be easier to repair it for now to get more room to maneuver.
@Joakpa
Taiwan's MediaTek has not suffered in any way from the global shortage in the semiconductor market
With regards to Custom ROMs:
Custom ROMs ( mostly ) simply are AOSP based de-bloated Android versions: they aren't compiled to be run on Android device with a specific SoC, they only must match SoC's architecture ( either 32-bit or 64-bit ).
With regards to SoC:
Only when it comes to play high-end games ( video editing, and similar CPU demanding tasks ) the type of SoC is of interest: MediaTek SoCs are a good choice for daily use tasks, whereas Qualcomm's Snapdragon and/or Exynos SoC and also Hisilicon Kirin SoC are the right choice if heavy task must get done, IMO.
In any case it should be at least a 8-cores 64-bit SoC to get Android flawlessly running.
@jwoegerbauer
Taiwan's MediaTek has not suffered in any way from the global shortage in the semiconductor market
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's my point exactly... the result of this has been that more and more phones (eg Xiaomi's budget lines) that used to be based on Qualcomm Snapdragon (which HAS suffered from the shortage: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-chip-shortage-qualcomm-idUSKBN2B32OO https://www.wsj.com/amp/articles/qu...hip-shortage-stretching-into-2022-11627504790) are now turning to MediaTek, therefore hurting the reach of the custom ROM community to the extent of the budget phone market.
With regards to Custom ROMs: / With regards to SoC:
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I do understand that. And it appears that you probably do understand exactly what I am referring to as well. Your own answers to this thread shows you do. MediaTek is a nightmare for custom development (Edit: mostly due to closed-source if it's not already clear enough), and compatibility of custom ROMs is a requirement as I've explained. Therefore MediaTek phones are out of the question for me.
My favorite budget phone for custom ROM is the Motorola Moto G8 Power. $220 CAD
Joakpa said:
@jwoegerbauer
That's my point exactly... the result of this has been that more and more phones (eg Xiaomi's budget lines) that used to be based on Qualcomm Snapdragon (which HAS suffered from the shortage: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-chip-shortage-qualcomm-idUSKBN2B32OO https://www.wsj.com/amp/articles/qu...hip-shortage-stretching-into-2022-11627504790) are now turning to MediaTek, therefore hurting the reach of the custom ROM community to the extent of the budget phone market.
I do understand that. And it appears that you probably do understand exactly what I am referring to as well. Your own answers to this thread shows you do. MediaTek is a nightmare for custom development (Edit: mostly due to closed-source if it's not already clear enough), and compatibility of custom ROMs is a requirement as I've explained. Therefore MediaTek phones are out of the question for me.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wouldn't write for just writing an opinion.
But considering the same position I was in years ago as you write yourself today so I have a few pennies to donate.
Spoiler: read if you want
I was skeptical of mediatek phones until I researched more and asked more. I found a good person who explained and showed me how much mediatek phones would evolve over time. Yes! I was a loyal Qualcomm user for the rest of my life if I didn't have this guy to give me new insight.
Not! I haven't stopped using phones with Qualcomm. But I went to personally verify everything that was said precisely because I was urged to really have my opinion.
In the beginning everything was weird and hard to understand. But for those who have knowledge in qualcomm, even if little, it was very easy to deal with and understand the steps to have Custom recovery and Custom ROM.
There were 4 mediatek phones in my hands and what I saw over time was a large community of people helping each other and new knowledge that I didn't have.
So the lesson for custom recovery and many ROMs is to have a developer or person who has a lot of knowledge to create everything smoothly. Mediatek's Source Code has been a big issue in the past. Research the number of mediatek phones that have custom rom partially working and fully working. It's bigger than having exclusivity for a particular qualcomm phone with a fully functional ROM.
Yes! Qualcomm phones are faster and easier with custom ROM. It still needs a developer with the skills and time to have something bug free.
Many qualcomm developers also know how to do something with mediatek phones. So the word about Custom ROM development is: having a good developer.
The bad part: Many qualcomm users make donations either by phone or in $. But it is difficult or rare for mediatek users to make donations either by phone or $.
As for your current question: without good money to buy something new and decent, no doubt choose a good phone with qualcomm. To get a different view, buy 2 used phones one with qualcomm and one with mediatek (choose the best SOC, processor and good RAM, battery and processor) within budget. This will give you a unique experience and your opinion at the time.
We are now with GSI and many A9;A10;A11 phones already have the ability to handle minor bugs without having the help of developers.
Good luck on your journey.
DragonPitbull said:
I wouldn't write for just writing an opinion.
But considering the same position I was in years ago as you write yourself today so I have a few pennies to donate.
Spoiler: read if you want
I was skeptical of mediatek phones until I researched more and asked more. I found a good person who explained and showed me how much mediatek phones would evolve over time. Yes! I was a loyal Qualcomm user for the rest of my life if I didn't have this guy to give me new insight.
Not! I haven't stopped using phones with Qualcomm. But I went to personally verify everything that was said precisely because I was urged to really have my opinion.
In the beginning everything was weird and hard to understand. But for those who have knowledge in qualcomm, even if little, it was very easy to deal with and understand the steps to have Custom recovery and Custom ROM.
There were 4 mediatek phones in my hands and what I saw over time was a large community of people helping each other and new knowledge that I didn't have.
So the lesson for custom recovery and many ROMs is to have a developer or person who has a lot of knowledge to create everything smoothly. Mediatek's Source Code has been a big issue in the past. Research the number of mediatek phones that have custom rom partially working and fully working. It's bigger than having exclusivity for a particular qualcomm phone with a fully functional ROM.
Yes! Qualcomm phones are faster and easier with custom ROM. It still needs a developer with the skills and time to have something bug free.
Many qualcomm developers also know how to do something with mediatek phones. So the word about Custom ROM development is: having a good developer.
The bad part: Many qualcomm users make donations either by phone or in $. But it is difficult or rare for mediatek users to make donations either by phone or $.
As for your current question: without good money to buy something new and decent, no doubt choose a good phone with qualcomm. To get a different view, buy 2 used phones one with qualcomm and one with mediatek (choose the best SOC, processor and good RAM, battery and processor) within budget. This will give you a unique experience and your opinion at the time.
We are now with GSI and many A9;A10;A11 phones already have the ability to handle minor bugs without having the help of developers.
Good luck on your journey.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Let me start by saying I really appreciate your message!
I always like to see a different perspective on any of my views and having them challenged
You are absolutely right about the effect of a good dev being in control of said custom ROM development for ANY device, however (in my experience) developing for something closed source is more often than not "guesswork" and "hacks/workarounds". A good dev surely can often guess right, but it is still guessing. Write some code that guesses the output of system A and the input of system B, then bind them together so that you establish an interface from A to B. Now, there is a driver update for system A (and/or B), your interface is broken and your hard work is void...
You might be right about donations playing a part in it (I have no knowledge around that but I could see it being true), but I can also see developers not wanting to put time and effort into developing something that could crumble down at any given time (and it being out of their control). Of-course you could ignore driver/firmware updates or whatever other updates, but then what's really the point of developing past official Vendor Support periods anyway?
To get a different view, buy 2 used phones one with qualcomm and one with mediatek (choose the best SOC, processor and good RAM, battery and processor) within budget. This will give you a unique experience and your opinion at the time.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My current finances do not encourage playing around with multiple phones at a time (I could, but it would not be ideal ) and I'm only looking to buy a new one mostly out of necessity, however I will keep your suggestion in mind for once I get the chance to have a bit more wiggle room in my budget. That said, do you have some specific MTK device in mind that you've seen having reasonable to solid support of ROMs?
Thanks again for taking the time to contribute to the conversation!
It tooks me a total of >~ 5 years to find "my" phone. I tried alot of them all buyed used or old ones from my wife & daughters. Huawei 8860, Mate20, P10, Xiaomi Redmi3, iphone5, Samsung A8, Samsung XCoverPro, GalaxyS5mini, GalaxyGIO, GalaxyS5 just some to name. At the end of the day i will stay with the famous GalaxyS5 as long as they run LOS and for real Production/Daily driver the Pixel2 and the Pixel3. I do not pay more than 120-150 € per phone. Point. I am able to select and buy used phones without getting ripped off. My next phone in ~ 2 years or so will be a used Pixel5. I dont want a phone without IP68. I am able to open a phone case and replace batterys, i have the knowledge and all necessary tools. And i like smaller phones.
I made a list of features i want: IP68, max height of 145mm, replaceable battery, headphone jack, good LOS support, good camera at night shots.
It is nearly impossible to get all of these so i removed the replaceable battery and the headphone jack.
And i end up buying..... PIXELS. Except the Pixel4 due to the bad battery and the Pixel4a due to the missing IP67/68.
mediatek and xiaomi are best supported rom in community if you want custom rom.