Hey Guys,
I am thinking about purchasing a Surface, but not sure which to go with. I would prefer the 64GB one but not sure if I should go RT or Pro.
What are the main differences between the RT and the Pro? Why go Pro and not RT?
Please help me out guys
Its a very blunt difference.
The Surface RT uses an ARM processor. The Surface Pro uses an x86 processor.
As a result of that the Surface RT uses Windows RT which is not the same as Windows 8. Windows RT only runs on ARM processors and will not run software from previous versions of windows. All of your existing windows software will no longer work on the RT. RT can only install software downloaded from microsoft app store OR there is a jailbreak on these very forums allowing you to download software specifically ported for windows RT. Note, it must be specifically ported and there is no way of taking a DVD of software you already own and converting it for windows RT, basically if its not a piece of open source software then there is a 0% chance of getting it on your RT, if it is open source software then *eventually* you might be able to have a port but right now there are hurdles we need to get over first. Windows RT does come preinstalled with microsoft office though (although some macro's and extra features are missing). Internet explorer is the only web browser on it right now but does work in both metro and desktop mode. Someone is working on chromium (googles open source version of google chrome) but that has alot of problems that need solving yet. There is an x86 emulator but its too slow to be used on anything but software from the 90's maybe.
Regular versions of windows (including windows 8) can only run on an x86 processor (such as almost anything made by intel or AMD). The Surface Pro does have this and comes pre installed with Windows 8 Pro accordingly. As a result all existing windows software that you may own will run on the Surface Pro. Downsides are that the battery life is significantly impacted (Toms hardware recorded over 7 hours on the RT but only 5 on the Pro), the weight is increased, fans are needed to cool the intel core i5 chip empowering the Pro so you have noise from them and it costs about twice as much as the RT. The pro also gets a fancy wacom stylus.
If your just web browsing and can live with only using the microsoft store and the limited pool of software available via the jailbreak (read in the relevant threads for more info) then go for the RT as its cheaper.
But if you do need full compatibility with previous windows software you own then RT will just annoy you, you'll have to splash out more cash sadly.
One other thing. The surface RT and the surface Pro are not the only windows tablets on the market. Windows RT tablet choice is a little limited (and out of the bunch then either the Surface RT or the Asus Vivotab RT are the best in my opinion) but there are plenty of full windows 8 tablets. Some of the other full windows 8 tablets use an intel atom processor instead of an intel core i3/i5/i7. The atom processor powered tablets often manage to ditch the fans featured in the core i series devices, boost the battery life to be competitive with ARM/WindowsRT devices, reduce weight inline with ARM tablets and most importantly reduces cost to be more inline with ARM devices. Infact thats the most annoying thing about current Windows RT on ARM devices, there is very little reason to buy them when in the same form factor, cost, weight and battery life you can have a tablet running full Windows 8 on the intel atom which is an x86 chip. Downside to the intel atom compared to the core i3/i5/i7 powered devices is processing power. They are not very powerful. The core i3/i5/i7 could possibly be used for some light 3d gaming but the atom will probably only cope with 2d games and not so much in the way of 3d (although that said, my friend plays minecraft on a previous gen lower clock speed intel atom quite happily and according to all benchmarks the intel atoms are more powerful than my current laptop which also copes with minecraft).
64GB Pro is a good compromise. It allows you to get rid of your tablet and your laptop and go for an all in 1 solution that can later be expanded via SD card to add additional 128 GB
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Ryno_666 said:
can later be expanded via SD card to add additional 128 GB
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via microSD not SD. Max size microSD available on the market right now is 64gb not 128.
Just go with the 64GB model Pro. You can always just add a MicroSD card for an extra 64 GB of space for movies, pics, etc..
The RT model will only use the RT software and the Pro will also use any PC software. No brainer for my choice.
Depends on what you need and want. The RT Imo blows the hell out of every other tablet on the market. The Pro is a desktop replacement. I went with the RT because I needed all day battery life, and have a pretty powerful desktop at home for gaming/encoding and most apps are available for the RT that use. Honestly the pro to rt compares are pretty pointless, it's like comparing an ipad with a mac book air (with way worse battery) and talking about the ipad like it's a POS because the air can do more. You also need to look at the Os's, Ipad and Android tablets are basically big phones honestly. Most android apps for tablets are phone apps just scaled to be huge. Windows RT is a watered down full OS which means printing is easy easier, full access to file system like you're used to, and a full office suite where you can actually be productive.
So long story short, do you NEED to run x86 apps on your tablet, is it your only PC, and do you not mind 3-4 hour battery? Then stick with the pro. If you want a kick ass tablet, RT is where it's at IMO.
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If you're only going to be doing regular tablet stuff, like browsing, watching videos/movies etc, but still feel like you need a full windows 8 experience, you should check out the Asus Vivotab smart. It uses a dual core Intel atom x86 processor clocked at around 1.8 ghz, had 64 gb storage, nfc, 10.1 inch screen with optional Bluetooth keyboard. Best of all, it only costs $499 (excluding the keyboard) and has 8.5 hours of battery life on regular use and 7 hours on heavy use. I checked out a couple of reviews (engadget and cnet) and both were very positive. The surface pro is geared towards 'prosumers' who create as well as consume and so require the processing power of an i5. But for the money, the vivotab is the best windows 8 tablet...... IN THE WORLD! (Jeremy Clarkson voice)
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RT is arguably more secure. Battery life is better. Cheaper. Very close to the full Windows experience compared to other popular tablets. Mail app is crappy. Can get sluggish like a netbook depending on how you use it. All plug-ins and drivers aren't compatible. So you couldn't root your android device with a RT for example or install a MMO you like.
Pro is a much faster full Windows experience with it's i5 and SSD and can do nearly everything your desktop/laptop can do but it's ports and screen size are limited. It has nifty pen input. Scaling issues. Its GPU is weak for games. Do you need a powerful computer that's mobile or a companion device that lasts most of the day? Basically what it comes down to.
vesper007 said:
Best of all, it only costs $499 (excluding the keyboard)
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Thats what I like about the atom powered devices. Here in the UK I can only find the Surface RT on sale for £399.99 without keyboard. I can only find the ASUS VivoTab Smart on sale for £399.99 without keyboard. Hmm. Battery life is similar. OS feels equally responsive on both devices for Microsoft Store apps. Cost the same. Hopefully we'll see RT devices dropping in price soon. Hardware wise they are hardly different from existing android devices which somehow manage to be far cheaper....
Personally I am saving some money aside for the ASUS VivoTab. The 11" model with a wacom stylus, gorilla glass and a transformer style keyboard dock rather than the Smart (smart keyboard is instead just a bluetooth keyboard which clips into a wallet/case for the tablet, case can also double as a stand).
Asus?
Ryno_666 said:
64GB Pro is a good compromise. It allows you to get rid of your tablet and your laptop and go for an all in 1 solution that can later be expanded via SD card to add additional 128 GB
Sent from my EVO using xda premium
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Click to collapse
I purchased an RT device and felt **** blocked by the ARM architecture, the whole OS is right there, but you can't do anything with it. I waited till the Surface Pro released with plans to buy one, but the battery life sucks. I ended up getting a VivoTab T810C and the dock, then upgraded to Windows 8 Pro to join a domain and it has been perfect. Other than the low res screen (720p, would love to have seen a 1080p option) and occasional lag due to lower power CPU than I'm used to (My old daily driver had a quad core i7, 8gb of ddr3 1333, and a SSD, so a real speed demon) I love this thing. The dock gives an extra 10 or so hours of use plus 2 extra USB ports. Using an adapter to get full sized HDMI, it can run an external monitor. I'd love to see a desktop dock with ethernet and two full sized display outputs, but I'm assuming the dock port doesn't have enough bandwidth.
RT!!!
Go RT, it comes with office, which is at least $100 otherwise. Battery life is better, lighter, etc. I have the RT and love it! Plus its way cheaper, and you can use the microsd. Definitely go RT if you don't absolutely NEED any x86 programs. Plus, no viruses! (which you shouldn't get anyway unless you are on lame sites ?
I bought the Pro and took it back for the RT.
The Pro's battery life was too short for me and the tablet was quite warm while using it.
I had Lightroom installed and it ran quite well. Storage was an issue though so I decided to use Lightroom on my desktop instead and use the RT for the other tasks.
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My main question is whether or not the RT connects to ad-hoc WiFi like from WMWifiRouter or USB tether? That I think is the only thing keeping me from jumping laptop ship and also ditching my TouchPad.
It runs Windows. Pretty much anything you can do in Windows 8 other than run desktop x86 apps (and even that's being worked on!) can be done in RT. This includes not only connecting to ad-hoc networks, but creating them, bridging them, and (I think; haven't tried yet) even Internet Connection Sharing through them, if you connect it to another network (for example, via a USB Ethernet adapter).
GoodDayToDie said:
It runs Windows. Pretty much anything you can do in Windows 8 other than run desktop x86 apps (and even that's being worked on!) can be done in RT. This includes not only connecting to ad-hoc networks, but creating them, bridging them, and (I think; haven't tried yet) even Internet Connection Sharing through them, if you connect it to another network (for example, via a USB Ethernet adapter).
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I was hoping so, but you never know what some will do to lock their stuff down. All of the WInMo phones are/were capable of the same thing yet we had to hack that in.
Thanks for the info, youve pretty much pushed me the last bit, now i need to go play with one to be sure.
Oh, does anyone know if on Office 2013 Outlook still works like 2007/2010 with POP3? Does 2013 come with Outlook? If not, can i somehow install an older version or setup my email like a cell phone client? I use the 'keep on server for 1 day' feature to synch my phone and computer which auto cleans out my Inbox on my phone. I will not use IMAP so please dont try to convince me.
Office 2013 comes with Outlook in the same editions that Office 2010 or 2007 did. Office RT (the Windows RT port of Office 2013) does not come with Outlook.
Outlook 2013 can use POP3 "correctly" (in quotes because there's no correct way to use a protocol that obsolete and poorly designed) in the same manner as previous versions, yes.
Outlook RT has not yet been released, and may never be. If it is, it will probably cost some money but will almost certainly support POP3.
The default "Windows Mail" (in quotes because it's a travesty compared to the Vista-builtin program of the same name) client on Win8 and Windows RT actually does act as a mobile client, not a desktop one; this can be useful in some situations, but is more often a hassle. It does not (currently) support POP3 and may never.
Out of morbid curiosity, what's your beef with IMAP? It's not an ideal protocol, but it beats POP3 hands-down for a multi-device scenario (things like keeping track between devices of what has and has not been read, access mail sent from one device while on another one, delete from one device and optionally have it removed from all).
My "beef" is for one, its slow and clunky and i keep all my emails on my main PC in one .pst file, which is not my server. Keeping the emails on the server for one day allows me to synch Todays emails only on any phone/device i want and it works flawlessly. I also dont have to manually delete or scroll through a million emails on my phone. I also have multiple accounts which go to Outlook but only 3 that go to my phone and i dont want all of them on my phone.
Basically, it works for me and no one can convince me otherwise
In comparison to your "obsolete" comment the VA Hospital network uses a program built in COBOL and BASIC back in the 70's, yet they still run it today because it still works and is quite solid and havent been able to come up with anything that beats it. So whats wrong with using something that works?
Have you actually looked at the wire traffic for POP3? It's very inefficient. Not sure where you got the idea that IMAP was slow or clunky by comparison. Granted, if you for some reason *really* don't want to store your email on the server, then POP3 works fine (you can use IMAP the same way, but you lose most of its advantages if you do so). Of course, you're hosed if anything ever happens to that single PST file on that single hard drive, so hopefully you make backups regularly (everybody should, anyhow)...
Your phone (or any other half-decent IMAP client) has options to only sync the most recent X number of emails. "... manually delete or scroll through a million emails on my phone..." shows that you've clearly never even looked at an IMAP client closely, much less tried to use one. I set most of my accounts to sync the last two weeks. Oh, that's another thing: why do you mention that you only sync three of your accounts on the phone as though that makes POP3 better? That's actually a downside of POP3, because you'll receive everything in those accounts, with no filtering. With IMAP, you could not only choose which accounts to sync, but which folders *in* those accounts. IMAP lets you automatically (for example) filter out spam from the inbox to another folder (possibly trash), and you'll never see it on the phone at all. Also, with IMAP, you can flag items on your PC for later reading on your phone (or vice versa). Your phone should offer the ability to filter by unread messages, which means that even if you get a lot of mail you can have your phone only show you the ones that you didn't already look at on the PC (with no searching needed on your part at all).
Why compare a network protocol to a hospital mainframe, when there's such a much more obvious apples-to-apples comparison available? Speaking of which, why the heck are you using HTTP and HTML? It's just terribly "slow and clunky" compared to Gopher! Think of all the bandwidth you're wasting with those headers and those markup tags and those images! Yes, sometimes we still use old things. ASCII, for example, is 50+ years old. Of course, so are B&W CRT analogue TVs and vacuum tubes, but I bet you don't still use either of those, either...
Meh, if you're still unconvinced, you're being willfully ignorant at this point, so carry on if you wish. Don't complain when you can't find any stores that still sell buggy whips, though. The world is moving on, and rightly so.
You are hilarious. Just quit derailing the thread. Thanks for pointedly answering my 2 questions though.
GoodDayToDie said:
Have you actually looked at the wire traffic for POP3? It's very inefficient. Not sure where you got the idea that IMAP was slow or clunky by comparison. Granted, if you for some reason *really* don't want to store your email on the server, then POP3 works fine (you can use IMAP the same way, but you lose most of its advantages if you do so). Of course, you're hosed if anything ever happens to that single PST file on that single hard drive, so hopefully you make backups regularly (everybody should, anyhow)...
Your phone (or any other half-decent IMAP client) has options to only sync the most recent X number of emails. "... manually delete or scroll through a million emails on my phone..." shows that you've clearly never even looked at an IMAP client closely, much less tried to use one. I set most of my accounts to sync the last two weeks. Oh, that's another thing: why do you mention that you only sync three of your accounts on the phone as though that makes POP3 better? That's actually a downside of POP3, because you'll receive everything in those accounts, with no filtering. With IMAP, you could not only choose which accounts to sync, but which folders *in* those accounts. IMAP lets you automatically (for example) filter out spam from the inbox to another folder (possibly trash), and you'll never see it on the phone at all. Also, with IMAP, you can flag items on your PC for later reading on your phone (or vice versa). Your phone should offer the ability to filter by unread messages, which means that even if you get a lot of mail you can have your phone only show you the ones that you didn't already look at on the PC (with no searching needed on your part at all).
Why compare a network protocol to a hospital mainframe, when there's such a much more obvious apples-to-apples comparison available? Speaking of which, why the heck are you using HTTP and HTML? It's just terribly "slow and clunky" compared to Gopher! Think of all the bandwidth you're wasting with those headers and those markup tags and those images! Yes, sometimes we still use old things. ASCII, for example, is 50+ years old. Of course, so are B&W CRT analogue TVs and vacuum tubes, but I bet you don't still use either of those, either...
Meh, if you're still unconvinced, you're being willfully ignorant at this point, so carry on if you wish. Don't complain when you can't find any stores that still sell buggy whips, though. The world is moving on, and rightly so.
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Maybe because not every email provider has IMAP and the Surface RT should be about flexibility. . . I certainly am not going to change my email provider of 5 years because RT can't handle it.
I decided to create a new thread for this, because I have confirmed that I now have my device rooted via KingRoot and have installed BusyBox, so the thread title of my previous thread is no longer relevant to my situation.
Anyway, I have a Chinese netbook thing with a keyboard and touchpad, but no touchscreen, GPS, or SIM card functionality. It was cheap and don't have anything essential on the device, so I'm not afraid to brick it if there's risk involved.
Most guides that explain how to get Linux working on Android devices only explain how to access Linux indirectly via a VNC viewer or terminal running on Android, which is not what I want because I don't have enough RAM to run X on top of Android and a VNC viewer. There's too much overhead. I want Linux running on the bare hardware so that I can compile/run native ARM code and use applications actually designed for a mouse/keyboard rather than a touchscreen.
I'm trying to figure out what that would take. Can my device be booted from an SD card so that I can keep Android and boot into Linux by inserting the SD card? Or do I need to flash the "BIOS" and wipe everything out in order to achieve this? If so, what do I need to flash to get a Debian ARM distribution working on such a device, and how do I do it? Ideally, I'd like to be able to dual boot rather than be limited to one OS, but I'm willing to replace Android if it's required.
I'm not sure if I'm posting in the right place, but the problem is that most of the more specific forums on this site involve knowing the exact brand-name and model of the device, and I only know the Chipset and specs of my system. I can't even post pictures of the device or screenshots of application output because I don't have enough posts yet.
Basically, the core of the system is GA-1311F, WM8880. It has a 13.3" screen, 1GB of RAM, 8GB of Storage, Cortex A9 @ 1.5GHz, and Mali 400MP2 Graphics. It has two USB type-A ports, a Headphone and Microphone port, an SD card slot, an HDMI port, and an Ethernet port that I suspect may be powered by a RealTek 8192 chipset of some kind. There's also Bluetooth and Wi-Fi. When I run a terminal and look around at the configuration, I see the acronym WMT all over the place, but I don't know what it means. It's currently running Android Jelly Bean.
I haven't found a lot of information about my specific device, as there is no manufacturer listed aside from VIA and WonderMedia, although they only make the chipset and not the actual devices.
Thread closed / Duplicate