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Hey there,
I'm a Winmo user/fan and have been for a few generations of phones now. My first Winmo device was the HTC/UTStarcom Apache for Verizon (aka the XV-6700). My next upgrade was to the XV6800, which I loved. It served me very well, even when friends around me went on and on about their iPhones, I couldn't help but say how much I loved my phone.
Now, I have the Verizon Touch Pro2 (Rhodium). It really was a natural upgrade for someone who loved full qwerty keyboards, and this phone really didn't disappoint. I pretty much stuck with stock ROMs for a while, from the original Winmo 6.1, to the MR1 update to 6.5, and finally when MR2 landed, I loaded up Mr X's custom ROM, which was the MR2 with some annoyances fixed (he did a great job with it, I picked it up at ppcgeeks.com). With Sense 2.5, I finally got to mod my home screen with Cookie's Home Tab, and it simply rocks. CHT is a very awesome mod.
So, suffice to say, it wasn't all that long ago, I got my phone to the point where I really really liked it. I'm extremely happy with my current phone; I have over a year left on my contract. Which gives me plenty of time to think about what's next. Where do I go from here?
So, what is next??
Hardware is just going to keep getting better and better. I'm not really worried about that so much as I am what OS I use.
I love Winmo simply because it is so customizable. It isn't all that hard to get it to do what you want it to do. Most times, all you have to do is look around, and someone already solved the problem you're working on.
Windows Phone 7 doesn't really appeal to me. I can certainly see why it would appeal to other people, but it doesn't look like its going to really be my type of phone OS. Honestly, if I wanted the type of OS Microsoft iss building, I would much rather go with an iPhone. And, for that matter, if a CDMA version of iPhone hits the big VZW I might really think about it.
And then there is the new kid on the block (sort of). Android.
Android intrigues me. So much so, that I tried installing the Project Android Port on my TP2. Gotta love Haret. I started with the basic ROM that looks a lot like the UI for the Motorola Droid. It wasn't too bad, but the ROM ran rather poorly on my device. Then, later on, I installed the Klinux version, that has the Sense UI on top of Android. I think I really like that interface. It rocks. The port is still a little slow, but its also running off of a SD card, and its not really a 100% working port yet.
Now, I think I like the Sense UI implementation in Winmo more than I do the implementation in Android. However, HTC has done a fine job with it on Android, and it's got a lot of potential.
So, I'm really starting to think now, "Could my next phone be an Android device?" And to be honest, it doesn't sound like a bad idea. It's an open platform, it's very customizable (why I liked Winmo so much), and it seems to be picking up steam in the Apps category (sometimes I'm jealous that I can get an app for something on my Android port and not on Winmo).
But, what would be nice to have, in my mind, is a little more help from the big G itself. Google already has a feature with its Gmail application that allows you to basically tell Gmail to log into your other email address (that you are presumably trying to switch from) and it will pretty much import all of your old messages and contacts, etc.
I think it would be really spectacular if they could do the same thing for Winmo users. Basically, have a new site --> phone.google.com (or something similar), and have it be your cloud based backup location for everything that doesn't get synced now from Google. Sync up all of your SMS Text Messages, your documents stored on your phone, music, videos, and photos. Also, it can be a portal linking you to other Google apps like your calendar and contacts. And then, give this new site the ability to log into myphone.microsoft.com and pull all of the old stored data from there.
It would be perfect for someone like me who has all of his content there. Bam, all of your saved SMS messages... pulled over from MS to Google, and you don't miss a beat with them. Seriously, SMS is becoming as important as email for a lot of people. I hate having to lose texts, so when MS offered MyPhone and the ability to back them up, I was all over that.
Heck, Google could even improve upon what MS started. Have customizable settings, where if any SMS is older than a certain date, it gets archived in the cloud (so its still stored and searchable), but your device doesn't have to get bogged down with actual files, and older messages that have been archived get automatically removed from your device. If your device gets wiped, and you reinstall everything, when it syncs up, you pull back all of the messages that are newer that "X" date, while everything else older than "X" stays in the cloud in your archives. They could make the data exportable... its just data in a database, you could export to a spreadsheet like Excel, or Google Docs equivalent. Give people options, they'll love you for it.
I'm sure that there is only a small fraction of their userbase that is coming from Winmo over to Android, so I really don't expect them to do this... but wouldn't it be nice. They'd surely win me over with it. I know, somewhere out there, there is an SMS backup application for Android, but it sends your SMS messages to an email account to be backed up there. I think a dedicated system in place for backing up, restoring, and archiving SMS would be better. To me, its one of the missing pieces to Android's way of doing things.
If any of you out there have any thoughts on this, why not comment. I'd love to hear other ideas that people have regarding this.
(Also, I couldn't really figure out a good place to post this, so "General" seemed as good a place as any. If any mods see fit to move this to somewhere better, go for it.)
I agree with this completely. I'm a big Winmo advocate, and I love the customiseablity that it gives. I've pretty much got my device to the point of perfection, and I'm practically in love at this point. Anyway so I decided to give android a go on my device, and at first I was pissed that they tried to force me to register a google account, which I was unwilling to do. I somehow got it to work and I quite liked it in all honesty. I bought my topaz outright, so I don't plan on getting a new phone anytime soon, but Android intrigues me and if there isn't any new WinMo or something in the future, that will be what I will switch to.
Switching for me wouldn't be a problem, I don't really have anything that I can't backup to an sd card so thats not a problem for me.
Android is 3 thime more customizeable than winmo, I switch from winmo to android and LOVED WINMO but now I can't stand it GET ANDROID
Sent from my myTouch 3G Slide using XDA App
The wonders of the cloud... seriously. MS had a good thing going with the KIN and KIN Studio, where it would upload every single thing to a server in the cloud- pictures, videos, favorites, status updates, etc. And everything you put on the cloud from your PC would beam back down to your phone (contacts!).
Google could probably easily push this very easily- their cloud services are extremely powerful already, so I don't see why they couldn't and shouldn't.
I have a loyalty towards WinMo from having used the Touch Dual, Touch Diamond, and Touch Pro2.
But it's getting very difficult to defend WinMo. It basically comes down to WinMo gives users the option to tweak everything about the OS. You can make the OS look like whatever you want it to. You can tweak it for performance. But let's stop and think about this for a moment.
1. Why do we tweak the aesthetics of the OS?
We do it because the the OS looks ugly and outdated. The main look of the OS hasn't changed in over 10 years! We do it because it's not fingerfriendly since the OS was designed to be used with a stylus.
2. Why do we tweak the OS for performance?
We do it because despite the OS being known for multi-tasking, it just doesn't now how to handle RAM very effectively.
So far with Android, I've been able to do everything I could on WinMo. Plus, the OS looks modern and performance is excellent. Aesthetically and in terms of performance, Android is significantly much much better. So what's the reason for staying with WinMo? I can't think of a legitimate reason anymore...
Thanks for the input folks! ohyeahar, you make some very good points, and its some of the things that I have been mulling over myself.
I think my biggest point, is that Google has a chance to really improve its cloud based services with their phones, and I hope they do.
To begin, I am/was a "fanboy" of Windows and Windows Mobile. My first "smartphone" was the Toshiba 2032 running Windows Mobile 5. My next phone was a PPC-6700 using Windows Mobile 5 and my last phone was the PPC-6800 using Windows Mobile 6.1. I honestly detest the iPhone and Mac computers and go out of my way to stay clear of those "popular" items. I'm not even a fan of the Android operating system. I played on it for a while and it seemed "meh" to me. What I was looking for was an "iPhone Killer" in the HTC Arrive with WP7. What I got was the iPhone/Kiddie Phone Light....
Perhaps I had grown too accustomed to the various customization options offered by previous versions of Windows on cell phones. Perhaps Windows Phone 7 has decided to no longer be a "businessman's phone." I understand that the market was for general consumers but to shift so far away from their original product, well that just sucks.
The Good
1. THE SPEED OF THE HTC ARRIVE AND WP7 IS EXCELLENT. Apps load quick and easy and without lag. I am impressed by how quickly my phone restarts once completely shut down. I measured the time it took the PPC-6800 to load the operating system in minutes where the Arrive load time is measured in seconds.
2. THE SMOOTHNESS OF THE SCREEN OPERATION AND WP7. Flicking my thumb, I can quickly scroll across to another page or scroll down a long list of applications installed on my phone. It also works well within applications and using internet explorer.
3. THE MAIN START SCREEN. I like the way almost any app can be pinned to the main start screen for quick and easy access.
4. PLENTY OF PROGRAM MEMORY. I remember how I had to shut down programs on my PPC-6800 in order to conserve memory, especially if I was using Opera 10 for browsing the internet. So far, I have not had any slow-downs or freezes due to have various programs open on my phone.
5. THE PHONE INTERFACE. I like the way the phone works in that the screen goes black when you are using the phone up to your ear so that your cheek, ear, whatever doesn't hit any buttons and when you pull the phone away, it recognizes this and gives you the options to end call or open the keypad.
6. CALLS ARE CRYSTAL CLEAR. So far, the calls have been great, but I've only used it in an office setting or in my vehicle. I have yet to visit a construction jobsite with heavy machinery moving around. I'll see how it works in that scenario soon enough.
7. THE SCREEN. Wow! I love the screen. HD Movies are clear, colors are vibrant, it seems the screen is one of the best features.
8. THE CAMERA. Some may disagree, but I think the camera on this phone is good. Not great, but good. It is good enough to take photos. The only change I would make would be for the camera to remember the previous settings and not default back to 5MP.
The Bad
1. HUGE CHANGE FROM WINDOWS MOBILE. I think the Microsoft Programmers were too influenced by the Apple iOS and Android to stay with what they originally had in terms of "Windows" operating system. The name of the operating system is "Windows" so just keep it with actual windows on the phone. They moved so far away from the standard windows operating system that it isn't even recognizable. Was Windows Mobile really that bad? I was able to be quite productive with WM, let's hope WP7 proves to be the same.
2. CUSTOM OPTIONS. The phone leaves little for customization in terms of giving the user options for color, background, theme or even the transfer of multimedia or files (see Ugly #1). It seems Microsoft has made the statement, "Do it OUR way or not at all!"
3. HARD KEY SENSITIVITY.. I can't count how many times my fingers have accidentally hit the "search, windows, or back" keys on the face of the phone while browsing, texting, or picking up the phone. I like having the keys there, but they are too sensitive to the touch!
4. PHONE VOLUME. The volume maxes out at the number "30" which seems fine for a quite office or home setting but at the gym, driving, outdoors, or at a jobsite, one should be able to crank it louder. I hope HTC or Microsoft can come out with some kind of fix or crack to allow for greater volume on this phone.
5. A KEYBOARD WITH A "SMILIES" BUTTON. Seriously? Is this a kid's phone or an adult's phone. I'm ok with smiley use, but to actually have a key that pops up options for various smilies? My 3 year old daughter uses this, not me. That should have been my first hint that this phone was made more for adolescent teenie-boppers and not a businessman.
6. FORCED INTEGRATION OF CONTACTS. The worst is from Face book directly into the phone. I know I can turn it off when looking at contacts, but why not give me the option to import them or not. There are people that are FB friends that I don't even speak to or haven't spoken to since High School. I should have just downloaded the FB app and skipped logging into the phone's built-in FB app which to me is worthless.
7. NO FOLDERS FOR APPS. At this time, I don't have an overabundance of apps for the phone, but as time goes by, I might have need for more. Why not have folders for apps or the option to place them in folders so that I don't have to scroll down through a long list. Sure, scrolling is quick, but with 100 apps (if possible) it could take a while.
8. PHONE TEMPERATURE. Remember when Dell's laptops would burn people's legs because they became so hot? Well, the HTC Arrive may not cause burns but it is the first smartphone I have experienced that actually radiates heat from the battery compartment. Maybe this is a heat exchange issue to allow the phone to cool off. Maybe it is a big problem to come.
9. BATTERY LIFE. I know many have complimented the battery life of the HTC Arrive but I have to state that it is not as good as it should be. I have to charge the phone at least once a day and it has actually shut down on me twice before I could charge it, whereas the old PPC-6800 gave me plenty of warning before shutting down. I am disappointed with the batter life and will need to purchase a spare for long trips where I can't stop to recharge the phone.
The Ugly
1. TRANSFER OF FILES. Honestly, why are we forced to use Zune to transfer files to WP7? I used a "hack" to allow me to open WP7 in my explorer but now what do I do? Do I just transfer files over? The files on the phone are not in the window so I have no idea where the files are going! And what about "syncing" Word and Excel documents? How do I do that without having to upload them to a skydrive??? I've already had problems trying to transfer a single photo from my computer to my phone. Let me choose how I want to transfer files. I'm not an idiot, I can work with computer hardware and software, I did it flawlessly on WM5 & WM6 but now it seems Microsoft doesn't trust me to do this on my own so I am forced to use Zune!
2. MS EXCHANGE SYNC ISSUES. I am not the only one that cannot sync my e-mail, calendar, or contacts with my Microsoft Exchange Server here at work. I've read numerous items on the net about these issues. I was hoping that a Microsoft Windows Phone 7 would work flawlessly with Microsoft Exchange Server. It used to be a piece of cake to use ActiveSync to establish a physical connection for the option to Sync this data. Why not bring back that option?
3. AUTOMATIC TILT. Honestly, why do I need to have my screen tilt automatically? I understand if I don't slide out the screen all the way I don't have to tilt it, but why not give me the option to tilt like the TP2? HTC really screwed up on this one. In order to type with my thumbs and view the screen in tilt mode, I have to bend my wrists forward to compensate for the angle. What is the reason for the tilt, anyway? The only reason I could come up with for the automatic tilt was to annoy HTC Arrive users so much that they would rather use the onscreen keyboard than to use the physical one. This way, HTC can stop making phones with a physical keyboard which costs more to manufacture in terms of parts and labor!
4. NO REMOVABLE MEMORY CARD. I know one can remove and replace it with skill (at least on the 7 Pro) and with voiding any warranty, but this was one of the WORST ideas yet! After painfully transferring multimedia with Zune and realizing I had to do a hard reset for another reason, I lost all the information that was on the card! At least with the PPC-6800 a hard reset just lost my phone settings and programs but not everything on the memory card!
5. FORCED TO USE ONLY ONE LIVE ACCOUNT. This sucks big time! If you enter a live account and need to change it to another one later (I get waaaay too much spam in my hotmail account - and have turned off syncing with it) one has to do a hard reset on the phone to return it to factory settings and delete everything, including what is on the internal memory card. See #4.
6. NO UPLOADING OF VIDEOS DIRECTLY FROM THE PHONE. Sure, I can upload photos I've taken with the camera but I have to transfer the video to my computer (through Zune, see #1) in order to upload it to Facebook? Honestly, quit treating us like children and let us work with what we know! Microsoft has added yet another barrier/step to a process that used to be so simple!
7. NO 4G, NO EASY ACCESS TO WIFI OPTIONS. I understand that "4G" is possibly on its way out, but why not have the phone have that option. I don't even know if I am getting 3G service with this phone! Also, the ONE thing I would have stolen from the Android OS is the ability to scroll to my left from the start screen and access my communication options, Airplane mode, WiFi, 3G, etc... Having to scroll down numerous apps to get to the phone communication settings is just plain idiotic.
If I were grading the phone I would give it a solid C+. No, I'm not returning it for an Android, I am too much of a Windows user to give this up. I'm not sure how much of a "fix" can be done with some of the issues so I guess I will have to wait for a new phone to come out next year. By comparison, when the HTC PPC-6800 came out, I graded that as a B+/A-.
You said it.
Everything you said is correct. I'm with you. They need to fix all these issues.
I have the Arrive and its like they put us on lock down. They need to unlock this.
I agree with your ideas and i...:
VERY, VERY, VERY UGLY
The phone doesn't have the confortable phonepad of wm6.5 that i could use to get the contact of everybody with some pression.
agree with u on some, disagree on some
overall, i find this an upgrade over my touch pro, but although the execution leaves much to be desired, it's ms's fault, not htc's
u didn't mention a nice feature.
tried sliding out the keyboard when using IE in landscape mode vs using ie in landscape mode without the keyboard slid out?
??????
so what's going on!!!
I really love to work with WM or WP .... but the new htc phones have android...
We can simply write program for WM with Visual Studio . and WM is so user friendly and programmable . I Really need a phone like Htc 7 Pro - but with this OS ....
my previous phones are : K-Jam and Touch Pro -- both of them have keyboard and good style and very very user friendly - Touch pro simply upgrade to WM 6.5 with good Roms Like : Tael Rom ..
maybe they force us to use android ??
Sorry guys. You want endless customization and a huge developer/hacker community, Android is the current platform for that. Android has basically become exactly what WinMo is/was: does a lot, can endlessly modify anything and everything, but user experience is mostly poor.
As far as UI and the complete experience, the Arrive is really the best phone I've seen. It is smooth, intuitive, and just looks great. The style is really unique.
That being said, I will be trading for an Epic tomorrow. While I really like the overall experience on the Arrive, the M$ "branding" really limits it for now. I understand they are trying to get a baseline across all carriers/devices, and it is still an early OS, but this isn't really a "smart" phone as far as I'm concerned.
Coming from WinMo, this phone seems just as useful as an iPhone. No real customization options, no Mass Storage device, no way to even download a file from the internet. IE is not bad(or Cube) but there's not even any other browsers that aren't based on IE yet.
I know it's still early on, but I would rather go with a phone for now that lets me do what I want to do, or can be customized to do so. And can multitask. I have used my Touch Pro to fix people's computers, and can run a mostly functional(if battery eating) Android. I can't even change the Arrive's ringtone(although I do like 8-Bit).
This is a great comment that I agree with 100%. If you want an experience that is very similar to what Windows Mobile used to be, Android is the platform for you. There is a huge developer/hacker community out there doing lots of awesome things for an unbelievable number of devices. If you could do it on WinMo, chances are you can duplicate it on Android and it'll be easier to do. So to the OP who doesn't want to go with Android because he's a Microsoft Fanboy - well, your loss.
Personally, I've recently discovered that I'm either no longer a power user, or never really was one. Sure, I tethered used BT PAN and then WMWiFiRouter on the 6700, Mogul, Touch Pro, and then a similar solution on the Evo. But I've since moved to where my smartphone is no longer my primary internet connection. Windows Phone 7 does most everything else that I used my WM/Android phones for. There are still some gaps - I miss multitasking and Google Maps from Android, and I miss... well, I can't really say I miss anything from my WinMo days. Those days were great to begin with, but when I got my Evo, I swore I'd never go back. And yet it only took ten months for my love affair with Android to sour and I was right back to where I was with WinMo - endlessly customizing my device and never being truly satisfied with the results. Basically it comes down to UI performance for me, and right now iOS and WP7 are untouchable. Android has become a laggy mess (this was especially evident last weekend, when my friend showed me his brand new Droid2 Global and it was chugging and stuttering right out of the box). WebOS could have been a contender but terrible hardware and a glacial pace for updates have spoiled any momentum it once had. Which is a damn shame, because I think I'd like a Pre3 just as much as I like my Arrive, but the Arrive is here now and I've already fallen in love with it.
jaqual said:
As far as UI and the complete experience, the Arrive is really the best phone I've seen. It is smooth, intuitive, and just looks great. The style is really unique.
That being said, I will be trading for an Epic tomorrow. While I really like the overall experience on the Arrive, the M$ "branding" really limits it for now. I understand they are trying to get a baseline across all carriers/devices, and it is still an early OS, but this isn't really a "smart" phone as far as I'm concerned.
Coming from WinMo, this phone seems just as useful as an iPhone. No real customization options, no Mass Storage device, no way to even download a file from the internet. IE is not bad(or Cube) but there's not even any other browsers that aren't based on IE yet.
I know it's still early on, but I would rather go with a phone for now that lets me do what I want to do, or can be customized to do so. And can multitask. I have used my Touch Pro to fix people's computers, and can run a mostly functional(if battery eating) Android. I can't even change the Arrive's ringtone(although I do like 8-Bit).
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You know, guys... I don't think it was Microsoft's intention to create the ultimate hacker phone.
thanks for the review with the anger.
i knew ms can do it again just like they did on winmo6.5.
now i know for sure not to touch anything cellphone related from ms.
Hmm, who has the anger issues?
I have upgraded from Mogul -> Touch Pro 2 -> HTC Arrive. All I can say that I am really happy with the update
I just got the Arrive and honestly, I love it. I haven't had any problems at all of any kind, ever.
I think the auto tilting thing will drive me nuts too... WHen I got my TP2 I used it a few times but, I can see how it got annoying and it's very rare that I tilt the screen now, unless it's got perfect with no light lost at a angle...I'd hate it
Years ago, my elderly parents decided to get a computer and become "high tech". And ever since, I've been having trouble to get them to understand the basic functions of a pc. I still occasionally get the phone call from my dad asking me how to perform the most basic functions like downloading pdf files or downloading music. Just the other day, I was asked again how to get into email.
I recently got them a tablet so they could surf, check email, and eventually skype (when it finally comes out) while sitting comfortably on the couch watching tv. Somehow, they're not having trouble with the tablet.
I don't get it. They've been having trouble with the pc for years. I've always figured it's because of the multi-function aspect of the pc that's been giving them trouble. Almost everything else in the house (microwave, washing machine, dish washer, oven, toaster, tv, dvd player, bluray, etc.) has a perfect hardware-software integration and only serves 1 purpose.
But for some reason, they're not having any trouble with their first touch screen device. They're actually able to explore and find new ways at doing things with the gtab. I've been watching in awe as my parents do one thing after another with the gtab. Never seen them so technical before.
I can't seem to find a pattern here. How come they're still having trouble with the PC and yet they have no trouble with an android tablet? Anyone else observing this in their elderly parents?
PS - My 80 yr old uncle is thinking of getting a tablet after seeing how my parents have been playing with a tablet.
Doing the same thing with my mom too. Recluse and giving up on life at 71. The grab has really changed things alot. I put Facebook as a icon on the main screen and she now pecks away talking to my sister 1200 miles away. And her grandson too. Trying video calls next with Skype but haven't got there with working 2 jobs. The gtab has been a God send for me. Even jewels helps with mental abilities and now she is addicted. I can't get it away from her. I am really greatful for this wonderful device. Took it to work and a coworker bought 2 at woot where I bought mine. She asked me to flash them for her. I told her I would show her since she is like me working in lab and IT. Its a wonderful thing. Dan
The more I think about I think its about ease of use. Giving mom a laptop. She is afraid she would break it. Also size. Desktop means sitting at a desk etc. And a keyboard. She can't type. And oh I am going to break this big expensive machine. But she is good at hunt and peck.
Fear factor. By giving her something small, thin and eyecandy takes the fear out of it. Its more like a microwave screen than a huge desktop or even a laptop. Also her gtab has become personal. This is mine and I like it. Its fun and functional at the same time. You should see her playing stuntcar and steering the screen like a car. I also like to say she is partially blind in one eye and bad in the other. This has really helped her visual aquity alot in the month we have had our devices.
I have had the same experience with my mother. She is a complete technophobe. So much so that she retired early from her career as a nurse because she was about to start having to use a Palm Pilot to monitor prescriptions and such. She's wanted email for years and we've tried computers, laptops, etc, all to no avail. She's intimidated by them or something and after a very short period she just stops using them. This is a woman who's scared to program numbers into her cell phone and usually asks me or my brother to do it for her when she needs someone added.
My brother broke down and bought her an iPad for Christmas this year and it's really stuck with her. She's using it everyday to email people (it's the first time we've been able to get her to email consistently) and search recipes on the Internet. For whatever reason, it doesn't intimidate her like every thing else, including her basic, no-frills cell phone. I don't know what it is, but it's working and I'm not complaining.
I'm starting to wonder if it isn't the touch screen that allows a lot of this. Is it that non-techies are actually more comfortable manipulating things this way? Perhaps a more natural method of input allows them to have a higher comfort level and the higher comfort level allows them to push the boundaries of what they know a little harder. I don't know, but it sure seems to be a common theme.
Technology tots
Funny how the elderly and the very young take to tablets/itouch but probably for very different reasons. My 4 year old grandson just bought $60 worth of extras off my daughters iTouch while playing a game.
Not to take your thread off topic, but yahoo messenger + video plugin works great on the gtab if you didn't want to wait for Skype to get their butts in gear. My wife and I use it everyday when I travel.
crispyone said:
Not to take your thread off topic, but yahoo messenger + video plugin works great on the gtab if you didn't want to wait for Skype to get their butts in gear. My wife and I use it everyday when I travel.
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Have you any idea how many hours I put in to showing, explaining, showing again, explaining again, etc... my elderly parents, elderly uncles, elderly aunts, and all their computer illiterates how to use skype? Just last week, they had issues with hearing my parents. My parents had to call me and tell me about it. I, in turn, called all the way to the other side of the world to tell them to turn up their volume.
No, I think I will wait for skype on android, thank you very much.
goodintentions said:
I, in turn, called all the way to the other side of the world to tell them to turn up their volume.
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Or turn up their hearing aid!
To the computer illiterates, something as simple as double clicking on an exe file is a world of confusion. Those who live in a modern country like the USA have trouble understanding this. Usually, when I tell people that my folks back in my home country have trouble finding the print button or even have trouble understanding the print button concept people don't believe me. Surely, they thought, nobody in the world would have trouble with clicking on print and out comes a printed paper.
Last month, one of our relatives back in my home country paid a couple of guys to set up their computer for them to yahoo vid with us. The dumbasses (the guys who got paid to set up their system) put the camera facing the front window. Those who have the least experience with cameras should know that you never shoot anyone with the sun as the background. Won't see anything. It took me about half an hour to instruct them to move the camera to face somewhere else for this side of the family to see them.
You know how when someone calls you on skype there's a big green button that says "accept"? Well, some people have trouble understanding the concept of a virtual button, so even something as simple as moving the mouse cursor to the accept button and press it requires time, explanation, and frustration.
You think you have it bad dealing with android newbies? Try dealing with people who until the last couple years never even know what a computer was. Now, try explaning what a mouse cursor is over the phone with the other side of the line being 3 thousand miles away.
Edit.
And to the previous post, have you any idea how painful it was to instruct them to press the Fn button while pressing the + sign to up the volume? They even had trouble understanding the concept of pressing 2 buttons simultaneously. And no doubt, some people here will not believe me. Again, surely, they thought, everybody in the world knows how to turn up the volume.
My guess is that you've already used some sort of remote PC app, but if not,
I would suggest trying out Teamviewer.
It's free for personal use and is dead simple to set up (you might consider setting it to auto-start when they turn on the PC - just put good PW protection on the service.)
I like TV better than any other Remote app.
Zaphod-Beeblebrox said:
My guess is that you've already used some sort of remote PC app, but if not,
I would suggest trying out Teamviewer.
It's free for personal use and is dead simple to set up (you might consider setting it to auto-start when they turn on the PC - just put good PW protection on the service.)
I like TV better than any other Remote app.
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Click to collapse
Been using VNC pro. But again, the problem is trying to get them to install and give me their ip address. If I can remote control their PCs without having them install the software and giving me their ip's, then I might as well hack into banking systems and make myself rich.
goodintentions said:
Been using VNC pro. But again, the problem is trying to get them to install and give me their ip address. If I can remote control their PCs without having them install the software and giving me their ip's, then I might as well hack into banking systems and make myself rich.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I know we went way OT here, but that's why I like TV. It uses the TV server's as an intermediary, so you don't need their IP. All you need is the ID for their install (which never changes) and their password. If you can get it set up the one time, then you'll never have that issue again.
You can even set up a profile/login to store all of the ID's that you commonly connect to (and their passwords) to make connecting/logging in very easy.
I have a small company with 5 remote employees who are at varying degrees of tech savvy. Once I got TV set up with all the ID's, I can take over their computer anytime I want ... Doesn't need their intervention at all.
Can you please tell me what TV stand for? Don't tell me to google. Every google result has something to do with television.
goodintentions said:
Can you please tell me what TV stand for? Don't tell me to google. Every google result has something to do with television.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
TeamViewer
http://www.teamviewer.com/en/index.aspx
Zaphod-Beeblebrox said:
TeamViewer
http://www.teamviewer.com/en/index.aspx
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just spent the last 2 hours trying to instruct relatives how to run teamviewer on their vista pc. No go. I gave up after an hour trying to explain to them what a window was. I even showed them my screen showing them step by step instruction. They just couldn't understand why I couldn't "remote control" their pc because I already knew their email pass.
Again, you people think its bad dealing with droid noobs? Try being tech support for people who don't know what a mouse cursor is on the other side of the world.
TV is no go. Any other suggestion? Apparently, checking a box and clicking next is too complicated.
goodintentions said:
Just spent the last 2 hours trying to instruct relatives how to run teamviewer on their vista pc. No go. I gave up after an hour trying to explain to them what a window was. I even showed them my screen showing them step by step instruction. They just couldn't understand why I couldn't "remote control" their pc because I already knew their email pass.
Again, you people think its bad dealing with droid noobs? Try being tech support for people who don't know what a mouse cursor is on the other side of the world.
TV is no go. Any other suggestion? Apparently, checking a box and clicking next is too complicated.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm surprised they can turn the computer on.
I really don't know of anything easier than TeamViewer.
Did you try using the QuickSession? I think you can download the QuickSession app and pre-configure it to 'auto-dial' back to your system. 'all' you have to do is get them to run the app (which sounds like a chore in and of itself).
If you figure out how to get through this pain one time and get control of the system, TeamViewer will be your best friend forever
Zaphod-Beeblebrox said:
I'm surprised they can turn the computer on.
I really don't know of anything easier than TeamViewer.
Did you try using the QuickSession? I think you can download the QuickSession app and pre-configure it to 'auto-dial' back to your system. 'all' you have to do is get them to run the app (which sounds like a chore in and of itself).
If you figure out how to get through this pain one time and get control of the system, TeamViewer will be your best friend forever
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Unfortunately, most of the problem is getting them to run the damn app.
See, we have to understand the fact that some parts of the world just haven't dealt much with a multitasking machine. A tv, vcr, frige, radio, etc. all have perfect software-hardware integration. people don't even notice the software part. They think the hardware is all of it. But with a computer they have to deal directly with software. Huge part of my problem was getting them to press software buttons. They just can't wrap their heads around soft buttons.
This is why back in my home country people get paid ridiculously high for teaching basic microsoft office skills. Heck I should quit my job and go back there and be a professor there.
God that was frustrating.
My mother just moved, and her old WinXP PC didn't survive the move. I built her a new one using an dual core Atom/ION2 mobo, and since she only browsed and checked email I installed Ubuntu. She is 84 years old.
I had made shortcuts for Firefox and Yahoo email on her WinXP box, so I did the same with the Ubuntu one. I even installed a WinXP-looking desktop wallpaper.
She had U-verse internet installed, and the tech booted the PC to do the online registration. He had to call me and said he had looked all over and couldn't find Internet explorer on the PC. I had to tell him that he was using a Linux OS, and not a Microsoft OS!
I considered offering my second Woot g-tablet to my mom, but not sure if she would really use it.
Wow, great thread reading about technology touching people in a positive way...
IMHO, LogMeIn Hamachi is hands down easier than ANYTHING else. Install, join network, finished.
It works similar to TV, but with less 'stuff'.
Install on your computer an create "My Hamachi Group"
Create a password for "My Hamachi Group"
Give your group name "My Hamachi Group" and "group password" to whom ever you wish to join your network
They simply install, enter "My Hamachi Group" and the "group password" and are now on your virtual private network.
Use good old native remote desktop to view remote computers, not another program. Works excellent with Vista and Seven when installed with right-click and Run as Administrator, no special tricks for XP.
Runs by default at startup and you can see who is available and connected at all times.
tenet420 said:
IMHO, LogMeIn Hamachi is hands down easier than ANYTHING else. Install, join network, finished.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I looks like that is a windows program. I, and now my mother, use Linux. Fortunately (for her) she lives close enough that I can just go over to her apartment. If she ever starts to actually use her Ubuntu PC for something other than browsing/email, then I'm screwed!!
As an iPhone user, I want to know why the people in this community prefer Android, what makes Andorid phones “Smart” to you.
I know customization is a big one for most people, it used to be my number one as well. I used WinMo since the 2003 edition, then the HTC Hero. However slowed I became tired of it, and I realized customization is a pretty big waste of time. At the end of the day, having the option for a customized user experience doesn’t mean it’s a better experience. Power hungry news widgets, youtube widgets, facebook widgets are quite gimmicky and almost useless. The only things useful were the quick settings.
This is just my opinion on the customization argument. Don’t hate.
For me, features that makes life easier makes phones smart, and iPhone has a number of them that gets used all the time:
Wireless sync without hassle (plug in the power, no button pushing at all)
Air Play, wirelessly play music on my speakers (I have yet to get a apple TV, but able to wirelessly stream video would be pretty cool too)
iPod with music controls on the Lock Screen, and also multi-tasking bar. These little things really makes the overall experience top notch.
Facetime/iMessage – I love native apps, so fast, easy, reliable.
I want to make a switch to Android because I want a larger screen (G NOTE!), but I don’t know enough about the OS to overcome the pros of iPhone.
What features/apps do you use all the time that are great and exclusive to Android?
So far im thinking:
Better Gmap, youtube, actual folders, screen size, independence from computer. What else?
All I can say is wow, I have an iphone 4, ipad 2, galazy tab 10.1 and galaxy s2. Everything you mentioned can be done on andriod with the exception of itunes crap, lets not forget that half the stuff you mentioned were actually on andriod a long time ago.( Apple always announces producta as new but in reality their just really stating they can now do it. Just google specific app types for what you have listed and you will find them easily.
Sent from my GT-P7510 using xda premium
your choice s is right..Andorid is a good platform ..
You don't like customisation? you probrobly still won't like android. None of the features you mentioned are impressive they are availible to android phones in one form or another. WHat makes android smart is its ability to be how you want it. If you like being told how to use your phone and what to do with it, stick with apple, or try wp7. If you want your phone to keep suprising you go for an android handset. Some apps you may need to set up once. That goes for any phone.
I have chosen android because of the great community of developers and the possibility to use customroms.
Sent from my Galaxy S (ICS Beta 1) using Tapatalk
All I can say is wow, I have an iphone 4, ipad 2, galazy tab 10.1 and galaxy s2. Everything you mentioned can be done on andriod with the exception of itunes crap, lets not forget that half the stuff you mentioned were actually on andriod a long time ago.( Apple always announces producta as new but in reality their just really stating they can now do it. Just google specific app types for what you have listed and you will find them easily.
I'm careful about posting at night, but:
Cm nightly 263
Tmobile g2
300 dollars on ebay 6 months after it dropped
183 apps
Paid for 2:
Geocaching app
ICS blue theme
Pandora no ads
Unlimited skips
Plugged into 18 dollar cigarette lighter mp3 player in expedition with 9 speaker surround sound
Full keyboard
Etc etc
Sent from my HTC Vision using XDA Premium App
Even if you need some apps that aren't stock from the market, Android is a better experience. With some tweaks (legally, opositive as Jailbreak), like ROOT and unlock bootloader, you have everything you need and don't need in no time.
Android is the way you want it. I used a little of his iPhone and entered on the App Store. That thing don't have NOTHING. No substitute music app, video app. And the things I saw have 2.5 of 5 in ''points'' (sorry, coudn't find the correct word), and in Android Market most of apps have 4.0 or more.
The thing I want to say is, with Apple, in my opinion, you pay for things you won't have. Processors are from Samsung, camera sensors are from Sony, desing is horrible, in my opinion, compared to Xperia Arc.
But all of this is my opinion.
Sorry for english, btw
Sent using Mini CM7 Pro by Paul
I would say large number of wrapper classes
bennyx8903 said:
For me, features that makes life easier makes phones smart, and iPhone has a number of them that gets used all the time:
Wireless sync without hassle (plug in the power, no button pushing at all)
Air Play, wirelessly play music on my speakers (I have yet to get a apple TV, but able to wirelessly stream video would be pretty cool too)
iPod with music controls on the Lock Screen, and also multi-tasking bar. These little things really makes the overall experience top notch.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well, actually all the things you mention there are on Android; in fact they were already on it long before the iPhone could do it.
music control on lock screen - Android has had it for a long time, I think since first release. in fact, there are several music player apps that are able to set their own controls to the lock screen, Player Pro is one of the most popular. I prefer btunes though, which you might like because it's basically an exact copy of the iOS player with some enhancements that I was really craving back when I had my iPod.
speaking of, Android's stock music player app is pretty good, although a fave feature of mine is the ability to download alternate ones if you wish, many of which have a wealth of feature the iOS app really out to have by now. as for your music itself....
wireless sync - Android could do this before iOS. in fact, it could wirelessly sync with itunes months (maybe over year or more) before Apple even announced the feature for iOS, which only a month ago received the feature. just use Doubletwist, or iSyncr wifi, (both allow it over wifi or USB). for a good long time now, these apps and others have allowed this. i prefer iSyncr, as it allows you to sync only the checked songs in Itunes. USB can be configured to sync automatically at plug in, and the wifi add on allows it to be set to auto sync at certain times of day, on the hours, every four hours, every 8 hours or manually. it also lets you auto sync and upload new music, photos and videos, default to your iTunes folder but you can set it to send the anywhere else on your computer that you like. best of all, the USB version can sync with any Mac or PC running iTunes without installing ANY programs on said computers, and the wifi version only needs a very small counterpart program installed on it, which is free and can be loaded to your phone's own sd card for easy installation if you don't have a connection on the comp at the time. configuration is easy, but only takes once, and anyway both versions come with common, good options preset if you wish.
Also, Doubletwist does Airplay on android, as do several other apps, although I can't say much about them because I never really got into local vid streaming. I'm told they work great though.
there's also more options for buying music on Android, as we have Amazon MP3 and now google music to download directly to the device or through your computer, and of course, iTunes through your comp if you wish.
as for multitasking bar, well Android had that too, you hold the home button and it shows a list of recent apps. there's lots of additional third party options for this too, like alternate home screen launchers and such that allow scrollable docks.
I know you said you don't like widgets, but of course you don't have to use them. there are several widgets that also add multitasking capabilities too, like circle launcher and some folder-type organizers.
God I write too much. anyway, check out some of the apps I mentioned on the Market website.
https://market.android.com/
The ability to do basically anything on it, customized it so it fits your needs, and being unique from other devices.
And you can change to a thrid party keyboard instead of using the stock keyboard.
OK which i have SwiftKey X.
In some words, iOS does not have everything Android has but Android likely has everything iOS has and more than that.
silveraero said:
In some words, iOS does not have everything Android has but Android likely has everything iOS has and more than that.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's a good way to put it, yes. In fact, Android users got quite a kick out of the iOS 5 unveiling a few months ago; it was widely noted that of all the "new" features unveiled, every single one of them was actually stolen directly from the Android OS, or one of it's popular exclusive apps, except for iMessaging, which came from BlackBerry.
It really angered a lot of people actually, because Apple even copied the pull down notification menu, renamed it the notification "center" and still proceeded to sue every Android dvice manufacturer it can, claiming they infringe on things like scrolling, anything with a touchscreen, rounded corners, black borders, etc.
I think the real question. Is why not android? Not much you can't do with these devices.
Sent from my DROID X2 using XDA App
I had a Droid, sold it and went to iPhone. There are some features I prefer on iOS compared to android. Syncing to iTunes for one. When I was on my Droid, doubletwist was in its infancy and didn't work all the time. If it does now, that's a big plus.
My iPhone plugs directly into my car stereo via usb, so it charges and plays at the same time. Not sure if something like that is possible on android, but it wasn't at the time to my knowledge.
I prefer the music app on the iPhone and the way it manages everything. Again, that has likely improved.
I recently got another android device in my Nook Tablet. It's gotten me back into wanting to find my way around hacking android. Now if there was an app compatible with FaceTime, and a game I play was ported over, I'd switch back to android when my next upgrade came around.
I also have a lot of audiobooks in m4b format that I don't want to reconvert, not sure if there is an Android player that will play them. That would be an important factor in switching to android.
Sent from my BNTV250 using Tapatalk
I'm glad you can do that on that small screen, also can you send me a file by Bluetooth ?
I choose Android not only because of customization, but because Apple is so ANTI-customization. They shove their consumers in a box and expect them to stay there. If anything's changed, they face bricking/fines/etc. Apple doesn't condone freedom. Apple screws innovators. Therefore, I say screw Apple.
bennyx8903 said:
Now, I'm not exactly shooting you down, but rather mentioning that these are available on Android;
For me, features that makes life easier makes phones smart, and iPhone has a number of them that gets used all the time:
Wireless sync without hassle (plug in the power, no button pushing at all)
DoubleTwist + AirSync.
Air Play, wirelessly play music on my speakers (I have yet to get a apple TV, but able to wirelessly stream video would be pretty cool too)
I've seen this several times; HTC devices have it built in and several Market apps do it.
iPod with music controls on the Lock Screen, and also multi-tasking bar. These little things really makes the overall experience top notch.
Every single lockscreen in the world has Music controls, and Android has recent apps (which are greatly revamped in ICS)
Facetime/iMessage – I love native apps, so fast, easy, reliable.
Google Talk, built in app.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Had to do some things there. On a side note, I respect you for coming to a site filled with hardcore Android fans and talk about the iPhone.
bennyx8903 said:
As an iPhone user, I want to know why the people in this community prefer Android, what makes Andorid phones “Smart” to you.
I know customization is a big one for most people, it used to be my number one as well. I used WinMo since the 2003 edition, then the HTC Hero. However slowed I became tired of it, and I realized customization is a pretty big waste of time. At the end of the day, having the option for a customized user experience doesn’t mean it’s a better experience. Power hungry news widgets, youtube widgets, facebook widgets are quite gimmicky and almost useless. The only things useful were the quick settings.
This is just my opinion on the customization argument. Don’t hate.
For me, features that makes life easier makes phones smart, and iPhone has a number of them that gets used all the time:
Wireless sync without hassle (plug in the power, no button pushing at all)
Air Play, wirelessly play music on my speakers (I have yet to get a apple TV, but able to wirelessly stream video would be pretty cool too)
iPod with music controls on the Lock Screen, and also multi-tasking bar. These little things really makes the overall experience top notch.
Facetime/iMessage – I love native apps, so fast, easy, reliable.
I want to make a switch to Android because I want a larger screen (G NOTE!), but I don’t know enough about the OS to overcome the pros of iPhone.
What features/apps do you use all the time that are great and exclusive to Android?
So far im thinking:
Better Gmap, youtube, actual folders, screen size, independence from computer. What else?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Android has wireless sync...its not just a iPhone feature as the iPhone 4 and 4S are both minor fails. Atennagate and iOS 5 battery problems.
I'm thinking of going to WP7. An Android app exclusive is PewPew. I haven't seen that in iTunes.
Sent from my SPH-M920 using xda premium
Android is open source OS, many developers can come up with Custom ROM and kernel that is better in terms of performance other than that, i like how it sync with my google mail, contact and calendar.
Hi guys, today I saw Nokia WP7 Lumia 800, before myself.
No doubt WP7 looked Beautiful. I mean Android is far better in definition of smartphone, for e.g. True multitasking, etc. but I never found Android OS beautiful.
I had Android in my hand (CM7 with complete ICS look, also ICS status bar), and my friend had WP7, and WP7 looked amazingly beautiful.
Personally I would love an OS which is beautiful, since I look at it (the OS), and I'm not a huge app user. Also I'm not a user who does not need apps running in background. Here are the apps that I use on Android (only these apps)----
1) App Lock - Prevent unauthorized access for any person to any of my apps (Very useful)
2) Calculus Tools
3) Handy Calc
4) Concise Offline Dictionary (Very useful)
5) Moon Reader (epub reader ebook reader) (Very Very useful)
6) MX Player (Very useful, plays any video format)
7) Opera Mini & Opera Mobile (Very useful, saves data cost)
8) USB Tunnel (Reverse Tether, very useful)
So, I want to ask, are these apps ( or there replacement apps )are available on WP7 market, or WP8 market???
I'm looking forward to buy WP8 in future. Please reply if you know these apps or replacement apps are available for WP7 orWP8?
Also, Windows is major PC OS, and I'll always have Windows ( Mac never ), and Windows PC has many software, so there is great possibility that WP8 will see many new apps in market, ( WP8 ports of the PC softwares ). Also looking for full integration with my PC. ( like iOS and MAC).
Posting in the wp7 section night help more as these are wp7 apps you're looking for and only they know
Anyway, depending on your handset i would wait for jellybean to see how it is before you think about switching. For me however I'll never switch. And btw you should try the real ics.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2
Thanks
shockem said:
Posting in the wp7 section night help more as these are wp7 apps you're looking for and only they know
Anyway, depending on your handset i would wait for jellybean to see how it is before you think about switching. For me however I'll never switch. And btw you should try the real ics.
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks for not putting heat on me. unlike some YouTube users who would have said something like,
' Are you crazy', or ' Goodbye forever' etc.
CM9 for my device has camera bug. So ICS is never for my phone.
Played with it previously. It's clean but it's so locked down I could never deal with it. It's even worse than iOS in terms of customization right now. For someone who just wants something straightfoward though it's a good device. I really think Nokia could have done a slightly better job on the hardware though.
That said, there are already multiple threads on this so this one may get locked.
I don't know man.
I like the fact that with android, once you get tired of a ROM, you can just find another one that looks nice or satisfies that craving for a "different" phone without spending a lot of money.
But if it floats your boat, make the switch
1) No. And unlikely to happen. You can lock the phone, but not individual apps.
2) Probably. A quick Marketplace search for 'calculus' returns a number of results.
3) As above.
4) As above.
5) As above.
6) Nope. There's new video features in WP8, but we don't know details yet.
7) Nope. IE10 on WP8 uses similar technology though.
8) I'm not sure what this does? I'm guessing it allows the phone to connect to the internet over a USB cable or Bluetooth? I which case, no. You're also unlikely to see this one appear.
So... basically 7 is no good to you and 8 will only work for you if you're willing to accept some compromises. More of your boxes might get ticked as time goes by; I'm not sure what the app development limits are regarding points 1, 6, 7 and 8.
satchef1 said:
1) No. And unlikely to happen. You can lock the phone, but not individual apps.
2) Probably. A quick Marketplace search for 'calculus' returns a number of results.
3) As above.
4) As above.
5) As above.
6) Nope. There's new video features in WP8, but we don't know details yet.
7) Nope. IE10 on WP8 uses similar technology though.
8) I'm not sure what this does? I'm guessing it allows the phone to connect to the internet over a USB cable or Bluetooth? I which case, no. You're also unlikely to see this one appear.
So... basically 7 is no good to you and 8 will only work for you if you're willing to accept some compromises. More of your boxes might get ticked as time goes by; I'm not sure what the app development limits are regarding points 1, 6, 7 and 8.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks. Your reply was good, and to the point. Like it.
MissionImprobable said:
Played with it previously. It's clean but it's so locked down I could never deal with it. It's even worse than iOS in terms of customization right now. For someone who just wants something straightfoward though it's a good device. I really think Nokia could have done a slightly better job on the hardware though.
That said, there are already multiple threads on this so this one may get locked.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yes, WP7 customization is very less at this moment. WP8 has reduced some limitations on OEMs and allowed customization on some places like Start Screen.
Waiting for WP8 review.
Android doesn't have true multi-tasking. And neither does WP7. At least till mango according to this article: http://www.pcworld.com/businesscent...e_7_day_21_mango_does_multitaskingmostly.html
The only true multitasking I've heard about on a mobile platform (Save for the full-fledged PC OSes) is QNX which runs on the Playbook. Also, Windows Mobile which ran on pocket PC has true multitasking.