Database Info

KitKat?

When should we expect the release of KitKat for the Relay?

When TeamApexQ deems fit to release it.
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Nardholio said:
When TeamApexQ deems fit to release it.
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Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nardholio, do you expect any major innovations, and most importantly, any major sources of bugs or instabilities with KitKat?
Thanks!!

Guiyoforward said:
Nardholio, do you expect any major innovations, and most importantly, any major sources of bugs or instabilities with KitKat?
Thanks!!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's a question we won't really be able to answer until there is more solid information on KitKat generally available.

Looks like CM is setting up the KitKat AOSP code for there builds Check out @CyanogenMod's Tweet: https://twitter.com/CyanogenMod/status/396000889011326976
Sent from my SGH-T699 using Tapatalk
---------- Post added at 10:29 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:23 AM ----------
Cyanogenmod Google+ post " Android 4.4 Source
Source is now being pushed to the AOSP trees. Of course, when it is all there we will begin the process of figuring out what changed, needs work, and/or is no longer feasible or needed.*
We are not in a rush to get 4.4 builds out. We are going to continue the process of working on CM 10.2 M1 - getting that out the door and onto your devices. Further, we will 'finish' the 10.2 code base, similar to what we did with 10.1.*
As a friendly reminder, please don't flood us with requests for 4.4 - we all want new and shiny things, but we will not do so at the expense of abandoning the hard work our contributors have put into 10.2.*
Final note, a lot of folks are reading into the "512mb" item on the release notes. No, this does not mean a sudden resurrection of older hardware, there are dependencies beyond the RAM (and CM has enforced that minimum since ICS)."
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pst @Magamo this thread was best ended with a simple "when I say so" response and nothing more
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Nardholio said:
pst @Magamo this thread was best ended with a simple "when I say so" response and nothing more
Sent from my SGH-T699 using Tapatalk
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Click to collapse
I actually was referring to an official KitKat OTA update from T-mobile.
How long did it take them to release a JB update after it was first introduced?
I have no interest in a CM ROM full of bugs and things that don't work.

andrewsfm said:
I actually was referring to an official KitKat OTA update from T-mobile.
How long did it take them to release a JB update after it was first introduced?
I have no interest in a CM ROM full of bugs and things that don't work.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Given that we never got upgraded to 4.2 or 4.3 by T-mobile/Samsung, I kinda doubt we'll be getting an official 4.4. And our CM rom, which has been built for us by a couple of people working for free, currently has fewer bugs than the official ROMs.

Jax184 said:
Given that we never got upgraded to 4.2 or 4.3 by T-mobile/Samsung, I kinda doubt we'll be getting an official 4.4. And our CM rom, which has been built for us by a couple of people working for free, currently has fewer bugs than the official ROMs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
4.2 and 4.3 were minor updates with no name change. JB was a major update and they did update to it.
4.4 KitKat being a major update, I've got my fingers crossed considering the wide range of devices that it's being planned for.
Was just hoping to see if there was any news on a KK update for this model.
CM is fun to play with and all, but it's not something I would trust on an everyday phone.

I use CM as a daily driver every day, and have been doing so since 10.2 became CyanogenMod official - everything just works. Now I'm not one of those people who demands a LOT of my phone, but I use it in the course of doing my job daily and it performs better, and more efficiently (with regards to battery consumption) than it did on the debloated stock rom, so much so that I deleted my Nandroid of that setup.
Sent from my SGH-T699 using the XDA-Developers app.

onebornoflight said:
I use CM as a daily driver every day, and have been doing so since 10.2 became CyanogenMod official - everything just works. Now I'm not one of those people who demands a LOT of my phone, but I use it in the course of doing my job daily and it performs better, and more efficiently (with regards to battery consumption) than it did on the debloated stock rom, so much so that I deleted my Nandroid of that setup.
Sent from my SGH-T699 using the XDA-Developers app.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm not sure if I fall into the category of demanding alot from my phone, but if there are issues like, Wifi and BT can't be on at the same time, that's not good enough. That's a serious issue. So if I forget to turn one of them off, stuff stops working? That's not okay...
I want my camera to work, for videos and photos. I want the phone to do everything the hardware is supposed to do.

andrewsfm said:
I'm not sure if I fall into the category of demanding alot from my phone, but if there are issues like, Wifi and BT can't be on at the same time, that's not good enough. That's a serious issue. So if I forget to turn one of them off, stuff stops working? That's not okay...
I want my camera to work, for videos and photos. I want the phone to do everything the hardware is supposed to do.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Awesome! And you want that for free? You don't seem to appreciate a lot the effort that other people are putting into this...

The wifi/bluetooth issue isn't that bad. It only falls apart when WiFi is on and connected to a 2.4GHz access point, and bluetooth is on and connected to a bluetooth device. If you have an N wifi access point that operates at 5Ghz, you can just connect to that instead of the 2.4Ghz node and then the two play nice. It's what I do.

Jax184 said:
The wifi/bluetooth issue isn't that bad. It only falls apart when WiFi is on and connected to a 2.4GHz access point, and bluetooth is on and connected to a bluetooth device. If you have an N wifi access point that operates at 5Ghz, you can just connect to that instead of the 2.4Ghz node and then the two play nice. It's what I do.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would do this if I had a 5GHz AP, but what I'm saying is that I don't want to have to worry about stuff like that.
Guiyoforward said:
Awesome! And you want that for free? You don't seem to appreciate a lot the effort that other people are putting into this...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't want anything for free, except a stock KitKat update from T-Mobile/Samsung for the hardware I paid for... At no point did I say I was interested in CM. I've been explaining why I'm not, the whole time.
I started this thread to find out how long historically after the release of a new OS, does it usually take Samsung/T-Mobile to release an OTA?

andrewsfm said:
I would do this if I had a 5GHz AP, but what I'm saying is that I don't want to have to worry about stuff like that.
I don't want anything for free, except a stock KitKat update from T-Mobile/Samsung for the hardware I paid for... At no point did I say I was interested in CM. I've been explaining why I'm not, the whole time.
I started this thread to find out how long historically after the release of a new OS, does it usually take Samsung/T-Mobile to release an OTA?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Normally only after the Samsung high-end phones get the update and they are just barely getting Android 4.3. It also depends if they decide to update this phone at all. I have been asking t-mobile and Samsung that and they keep blaming each other or referring me to the forum for the phone on there websites.
Sent from my SGH-T699 using Tapatalk

chris122380 said:
Normally only after the Samsung high-end phones get the update and they are just barely getting Android 4.3. It also depends if they decide to update this phone at all. I have been asking t-mobile and Samsung that and they keep blaming each other or referring me to the forum for the phone on there websites.
Sent from my SGH-T699 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I guess Windows has spoiled me, because I don't understand how it's so hard to port Android to each device.
AMD or Intel, they both use the same instruction set, so they work on any x86/x64 processor, and then you install drivers for your hardware peripherals.
Shouldn't Android run on any ARM processor, and then just have drivers that need to be plugged into it for each component of the phone to work?
Apparently it's a lot more complicated than that, but why...

andrewsfm said:
I guess Windows has spoiled me, because I don't understand how it's so hard to port Android to each device.
AMD or Intel, they both use the same instruction set, so they work on any x86/x64 processor, and then you install drivers for your hardware peripherals.
Shouldn't Android run on any ARM processor, and then just have drivers that need to be plugged into it for each component of the phone to work?
Apparently it's a lot more complicated than that, but why...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A lot of the complexity comes from the manufacturers of the SoCs not opening up the workings of their drivers to the wider world that makes porting to new devices, and to new versions of Android so difficult. Things work on one kernel, or one interface, and that's it, and we have no way of tweaking it to work in other ways. Back to the subject at hand. I personally suspect that the Relay will get no official update to KitKat. The Relay is over a year old, T-Mobile has been trying to dump it since 2013 began, and they are the only retailer. The 4.1.2 Jelly Bean updates were rolling out to the then mainline Samsung phones within a week of the Relay's release in September 2012, and we didn't get our update (which frankly is a broken PoS, ESPECIALLY when held up against any CM build for the Relay) until March or April of '13, so expect another 6 months before we MIGHT (and likely won't) get an official 4.3 update.

Looks like coding for CM 11 has started. Check out @CyanogenMod's Tweet: https://twitter.com/CyanogenMod/status/397817644650205185
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Magamo said:
A lot of the complexity comes from the manufacturers of the SoCs not opening up the workings of their drivers to the wider world that makes porting to new devices, and to new versions of Android so difficult. Things work on one kernel, or one interface, and that's it, and we have no way of tweaking it to work in other ways. Back to the subject at hand. I personally suspect that the Relay will get no official update to KitKat. The Relay is over a year old, T-Mobile has been trying to dump it since 2013 began, and they are the only retailer. The 4.1.2 Jelly Bean updates were rolling out to the then mainline Samsung phones within a week of the Relay's release in September 2012, and we didn't get our update (which frankly is a broken PoS, ESPECIALLY when held up against any CM build for the Relay) until March or April of '13, so expect another 6 months before we MIGHT (and likely won't) get an official 4.3 update.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah k I see. The hardware vendors are mostly to blame it seems.
I may try a stable CM11 if that ever sees the light of day, but I won't hold my breath.
I've heard about the official JB ROM being problematic, so I plan to stay on ICS the phone originally shipped with.
I'm just glad to be getting rid of my Droid3 and Gingerbread.

andrewsfm said:
Ah k I see. The hardware vendors are mostly to blame it seems.
I may try a stable CM11 if that ever sees the light of day, but I won't hold my breath.
I've heard about the official JB ROM being problematic, so I plan to stay on ICS the phone originally shipped with.
I'm just glad to be getting rid of my Droid3 and Gingerbread.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
True, there have been some bugs. However, I use the official nightly of cm10.2 as a daily driver. I'd rather put up with the MINOR issues that are left (hardware is stable for the most part) than have a manufacturer ROM. IMHO, the stock ROM that comes with the phone is usually full of crap bloat ware that I don't use and takes up space, and a UI that is SEVERELY limited in customization.
Also, the more people participate and report problems, the faster it takes TeamApex to fix and push out. At least team apex RESPONDS to their users. As mentioned before, it can take as long as 6-8 months after an android release for the manufacturer to roll out an update...still full of crap ware that's NOT used and cannot be uninstalled without root privileges or botching up the UI further.
These people who work tirelessly to provide to us, the end user, an updated version of Android, do so out of their own free will, and don't get a penny. These devs are here to proudly share what they have created, and I applaud and give my utmost respect to them.
You don't wanna install aftermarket firmware? Don't want to aid in bug reporting? Fine, put up with the crap that the manufacturer pushes onto you. Plus, Samsung & T-Mobile don't get any more of your hard earn dollars rolling out an Android update for our year-old device. They'd rather you dump it and buy the latest phone. THAT'S THEIR BUSINESS MODEL! So they have no interest in rushing an update to something as "old" as the Relay.
If you want JB or KK and are unwilling to wait for & install after-market firmware, I suggest you pony up the dough and buy a nexus 5. Better still, learn how to dev and make your own version of JB or KK for the Relay. That's the beauty of open source.
Your rant and *****ing about when "they are going to develop Kit Kat" makes you come across as arrogant, snobbish, and child-like.
Sorry for MY ranting, but it's unappreciative asshats like andre that just piss me off.
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Why root a Nexus 5?

Hi guys,
Just got a Nexus 5, had previously had a Samsung Galaxy S3.
My S3 was rooted, mainly to get rid of carrier bloatware and later because I wanted the Android 4.2 camera with Photosphere (my carrier was stuck on 4.1 until a few months ago).
As time wore on my device had numerous problems ultimately I felt related to rooting, I could never find ROM's with at least one major glitch. I ended up on a stock ROM for most the time with the only root change was flashing the 4.2 camera for Photosphere. Rooting in general I found caused more headaches than it was worth.
Anyways, I just got the Nexus 5 and have no real intention to root it. Since it's devoid of carrier bloatware and it runs super fast and responsive, just wondering what the real credible benefits to rooting it are? (and voiding warranty in the process)??
I don't see a lot of bloatware on the device, it's going to get constant updates from Google (as opposed to devices depandant on a carrier), I don't really need to overclock or mess with kernals on an already fast device.
Am I missing something here?

Sianspheric said:
Hi guys,
Just got a Nexus 5, had previously had a Samsung Galaxy S3.
My S3 was rooted, mainly to get rid of carrier bloatware and later because I wanted the Android 4.2 camera with Photosphere (my carrier was stuck on 4.1 until a few months ago).
As time wore on my device had numerous problems ultimately I felt related to rooting, I could never find ROM's with at least one major glitch. I ended up on a stock ROM for most the time with the only root change was flashing the 4.2 camera for Photosphere. Rooting in general I found caused more headaches than it was worth.
Anyways, I just got the Nexus 5 and have no real intention to root it. Since it's devoid of carrier bloatware and it runs super fast and responsive, just wondering what the real credible benefits to rooting it are? (and voiding warranty in the process)??
I don't see a lot of bloatware on the device, it's going to get constant updates from Google (as opposed to devices depandant on a carrier), I don't really need to overclock or mess with kernals on an already fast device.
Am I missing something here?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Some people prefer different launchers or ROMs or to have access to certain functions (e.g. full backup) that require root. I've had my N5 for a month and haven't felt the need for it, so I'm still stock, locked, unrooted.

Xposed for me.
Most of the mods from Custom ROMs with the OTA updates from Google
Sent from my Nexus 5 using XDA Premium HD app

Xposed framework, Adaway, Lmt launcher, AppOps, AutomateIt Pro... Basicly everything to take control over your device.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using xda app-developers app

So.....ad blocking apps, minor tweaks, custom ROM's.
eh, not really compelling reasons for me I guess.

Sianspheric said:
So.....ad blocking apps, minor tweaks, custom ROM's.
eh, not really compelling reasons for me I guess.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I wouldn't call them minor tweaks at all. There is an extremely wide variety of things that require your phone to be rooted. Often times an app will have limited functionality without root.
Please note that rooting your phone has nothing to do with using a custom rom. (You can in fact have a custom rom that is not rooted) Your problems with your prior phone were not in any way as a result of rooting the phone. If you had problems with the rom (sometimes custom roms have broken components) that has nothing to do with having root access.
At this point, I'd be willing to bet the most common usage of the phone at this point (amongst users of this site) are those who are rooted, but still using the stock rom. More and more users are migrating to the custom roms, but this is because rom development takes a bit of time with major releases.

AdAway is the main reason for me - I HATE adverts with a passion!
Sent from my Nexus 5 using xda app-developers app

Sianspheric said:
So.....ad blocking apps, minor tweaks, custom ROM's.
eh, not really compelling reasons for me I guess.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
what you consider "minor tweaks", might be a big deal for someone else. Tastes differ.
i root because of 1 main reason, i paid for the device and i believe i should be able to have full control over it.
Another thing is, whatever i do with my phone, i always know what i'm doing and why i'm doing it, so the odds of screwing something up are very little. In case i do need to claim warranty, i know how to set everything back.

Sianspheric said:
So.....ad blocking apps, minor tweaks, custom ROM's.
eh, not really compelling reasons for me I guess.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ehm...why did you buy a nexus? Actually i don't even know what you are doing on xda. No offense but... Sound more like an iPhone kind a guy...
Sent from my Nexus 5 using xda app-developers app

It's up to you whether to root or not. Whatever problems you had with your previous device, it wasn't due to rooting persay, but rather what you did with root access. Rooting doesn't change anything, it just gives you administrative access to the operating system. Running un-rooted is analogous to accessing your desktop PC through a guest account. Rooting your Android device gives you full access like you have on your desktop as as an administrator.

He just wants to know the benefits. No need to harp on him for not wanting to root. If anything Nexus 5 has less reasons to be rooted then OEM phones.

bblzd said:
He just wants to know the benefits. No need to harp on him for not wanting to root. If anything Nexus 5 has less reasons to be rooted then OEM phones.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe someday he'll want to tether.

AT LEAST UNLOCK THE BOOTLOADER
Fastboot OEM Unlock
That easy, it'll erase EVERYTHING. So if you do it now you won't lose much. Do it later when you want to root (like my mother and myself) you'll have to unlock and lose everything.
If you ever need you return it just lock it again it's easy. And you won't lose ANYTHING for relocking it.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

Two words....
Franco kernel
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

Titanium back up because I'm too lazy to reinstall all of my apps on my previous device.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

Not much reason to if your main use is as a "daily driver".
Mine is rooted mainly due to needing to use it for development work related to my job, but ad blocking and several xposed modules would require root anyways. That and I just can't help but mess with stuff like CPU frequency/voltage settings, etc.

Ben36 said:
Two words....
Franco kernel
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I second this.

I was previously on Galaxy S2 rooted. I'd tested some custom roms like chamaleon, cm, but at last, what i realized that I needed wasn't a lot of new features i only wanted a good battery performance and a fc and random reboots free phone.
So I returned to stock roms with the more stock-like rooted kernel with Xposed and some additions. At last I got a good battery performance to keep the phone full day without charging.
Now that my N5 is with me for about 6 or 7 weeks I don't need rooting, modding ... nothing. The performance for my daily use is about 30 hours between charges with almost 3 hours with screen on.
That is all I need!
And for backups (i've payed for titanium backup app for my S2) now I use ADB from command line and it's enought for me
Also, the Nexus in this conditions hasn't hanged yet.
It spent more than 350 hours until I decided to change to Dart and I had to restart the phone. this is much better than my old S2 that needed two or three weekly reboots even with stock rom.
So, i'm very happy with my non-rooted N5 but if I need to root it in the near future it will be not a problem to me doing it.

I use it for Titanium Backup myself, whose backups I periodically have uploaded to Box.com. Obviously it's there for when I want to change phone and want to restore app data, especially for game saves, but you also never know if your phone is going to malfunction and you have to wipe or get lost/stolen. I think it's pretty useful to have an app that automatically takes care of backing up your data for you.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

http://lifehacker.com/top-10-reasons-to-root-your-android-phone-1079161983
Sent from my Nexus 5

[Q] The severe lack of ROMs / Kernels

Hi everyone!
I am currently looking to replace my slightly broken Google Nexus 5 with a Sony Z3 and as per usual I checked the XDA for common issues or anything that I may need to be aware of before purchasing one... So whilst I was here I decided to look through the ROM's / Kernels and these is a huge lack of ROM's for this phone...
What are the reasons behind this? Is this a pure lack of developers willing to spend their time on it? The source code not being available easily?
Is there a logical explanation for this?
I had two ROM's a while back for five different phones (links are below probably) and I was thinking of getting back into it again and being a Sony phone I thought "I have done it once, I can do it again!"
Any help / guidance / explanation will be great, looking forward to reading through the replies and hopefully purchasing my phone later this week

apmartin1991 said:
Hi everyone!
I am currently looking to replace my slightly broken Google Nexus 5 with a Sony Z3 and as per usual I checked the XDA for common issues or anything that I may need to be aware of before purchasing one... So whilst I was here I decided to look through the ROM's / Kernels and these is a huge lack of ROM's for this phone...
What are the reasons behind this? Is this a pure lack of developers willing to spend their time on it? The source code not being available easily?
Is there a logical explanation for this?
I had two ROM's a while back for five different phones (links are below probably) and I was thinking of getting back into it again and being a Sony phone I thought "I have done it once, I can do it again!"
Any help / guidance / explanation will be great, looking forward to reading through the replies and hopefully purchasing my phone later this week
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The reason rom development is so slow is because of the DRM issue that no one can get passed, the vast majority of Z3 owners still have a locked BL, you can google search and read up that unlocking the phone's BL causes plenty issues, specially camera related. Until a root exploit is found i am afraid it will carry on being this slow..

corpsegrinder62 said:
The reason rom development is so slow is because of the DRM issue that no one can get passed, the vast majority of Z3 owners still have a locked BL, you can google search and read up that unlocking the phone's BL causes plenty issues, specially camera related. Until a root exploit is found i am afraid it will carry on being this slow..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I did indeed have a quick google and I read about the issues you explained, all about DRM issues with Camera and a few other things.
Many thanks for your reply, hopefully they will remove some of this with android L.

I'm pretty sure the DRM can now be restored with a unlocked bootloader

CameronBanna said:
I'm pretty sure the DRM can now be restored with a unlocked bootloader
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's not possible. The only thing possible is restore some features that you lose when you unlock the bootloader.

apmartin1991 said:
Hi everyone!
I am currently looking to replace my slightly broken Google Nexus 5 with a Sony Z3 and as per usual I checked the XDA for common issues or anything that I may need to be aware of before purchasing one... So whilst I was here I decided to look through the ROM's / Kernels and these is a huge lack of ROM's for this phone...
What are the reasons behind this? Is this a pure lack of developers willing to spend their time on it? The source code not being available easily?
Is there a logical explanation for this?
I had two ROM's a while back for five different phones (links are below probably) and I was thinking of getting back into it again and being a Sony phone I thought "I have done it once, I can do it again!"
Any help / guidance / explanation will be great, looking forward to reading through the replies and hopefully purchasing my phone later this week
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The main reason there are no roms for the devices at this point is NOT due to the DRM issues. The phone is easily unlocked and rooted - there's instruction all over google...it's actually due to the Xperia Z3 being a very new phone arriving right around the time that Lollipop hit the shelves on Nexus devices. DEVs are busy updating their ROMs to be based on the Lollipop platform. This is of much more importance to them as it gives them much more rep, than them wasting time on a new phone. As they say... being first in the game is a lot easier than working your ass off to catch up.
In my opinion, I think you should jump on the Z3. It's a great phone. Kick ass battery. Great stock rom, and google lollipop update coming soon, which will kick out a lot of the needs for a custom rom for day to day usage + Nova Launcher does a kick ass job filling in a few holes. I'm waiting until DEVs get the lollipop based roms ready and then you can be sure the Z3 will have plenty of custom rom options. For the same reason above, root w/ Locked BL (liked the Z2) probably won't be available for a while as well...but...
The DRM keys that are lost when unlocked, mainly affect the camera (night shots). That said though... it really doesnt. I've done quite a bit of testing in different low light conditions using the Sony Camera app, and using the Google Camera app (cause I love photosphere). The SOny camera app uses the algorithms locked in the DRM keys, while the google camera doesn't. The low light photos, in my opinion, have very minimal difference, unless one is taking a twilight shot using a tripod stand for the phone... in which case they deserve to be hit across the head with a bat.
As for the competition... I tried the Nexus 6 and it's simply too big. The Samsung S5 is nice... but just not sexy enough and the battery is not as good and touchwiz is not really all that great.

munsabin said:
The main reason there are no roms for the devices at this point is NOT due to the DRM issues. The phone is easily unlocked and rooted - there's instruction all over google...it's actually due to the Xperia Z3 being a very new phone arriving right around the time that Lollipop hit the shelves on Nexus devices. DEVs are busy updating their ROMs to be based on the Lollipop platform. This is of much more importance to them as it gives them much more rep, than them wasting time on a new phone. As they say... being first in the game is a lot easier than working your ass off to catch up.
In my opinion, I think you should jump on the Z3. It's a great phone. Kick ass battery. Great stock rom, and google lollipop update coming soon, which will kick out a lot of the needs for a custom rom for day to day usage + Nova Launcher does a kick ass job filling in a few holes. I'm waiting until DEVs get the lollipop based roms ready and then you can be sure the Z3 will have plenty of custom rom options. For the same reason above, root w/ Locked BL (liked the Z2) probably won't be available for a while as well...but...
The DRM keys that are lost when unlocked, mainly affect the camera (night shots). That said though... it really doesnt. I've done quite a bit of testing in different low light conditions using the Sony Camera app, and using the Google Camera app (cause I love photosphere). The SOny camera app uses the algorithms locked in the DRM keys, while the google camera doesn't. The low light photos, in my opinion, have very minimal difference, unless one is taking a twilight shot using a tripod stand for the phone... in which case they deserve to be hit across the head with a bat.
As for the competition... I tried the Nexus 6 and it's simply too big. The Samsung S5 is nice... but just not sexy enough and the battery is not as good and touchwiz is not really all that great.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thats a precise answer! Thank you for that. I would like to back it again that the low-light performance is really minimal at most. I'm definitely considering unlocking the bootloader now even to achieve root. Do you know if the D6653 and the D6603 are 'cross-compatible' with custom ROMs?

corpsegrinder62 said:
The reason rom development is so slow is because of the DRM issue that no one can get passed, the vast majority of Z3 owners still have a locked BL, you can google search and read up that unlocking the phone's BL causes plenty issues, specially camera related. Until a root exploit is found i am afraid it will carry on being this slow..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Should probably edit / delete this post since it's not really correct and you're essentially driving people away from a great phone. DRM is not really an issue if you do some more research, unlocking the phone is easy and info is all over google, and rooting the phone; same story.
Reason no ROMs are available is b/c Xperia Z3 and Lollipop hit the shelves around the same time. DEVs are working to get lollipop based custom ROMs out, not ROMs based on old OS for a new phone.
---------- Post added at 08:27 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:23 PM ----------
squabbi said:
Thats a precise answer! Thank you for that. I would like to back it again that the low-light performance is really minimal at most. I'm definitely considering unlocking the bootloader now even to achieve root. Do you know if the D6653 and the D6603 are 'cross-compatible' with custom ROMs?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No clue. I'm sure when custom ROMs will be available; that info will be clearly mentioned.

munsabin said:
Should probably edit / delete this post since it's not really correct and you're essentially driving people away from a great phone. DRM is not really an issue if you do some more research, unlocking the phone is easy and info is all over google, and rooting the phone; same story.
Reason no ROMs are available is b/c Xperia Z3 and Lollipop hit the shelves around the same time. DEVs are working to get lollipop based custom ROMs out, not ROMs based on old OS for a new phone.
---------- Post added at 08:27 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:23 PM ----------
No clue. I'm sure when custom ROMs will be available; that info will be clearly mentioned.
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Click to collapse
Whilst i do agree to your point, my point of view of the post is not exactly inaccurate but rather a different point of view to yours, think of it like this: many users start developing because they start to tinker with their new amazing device, many users themselves apart from developers try at developing aswell, and this all ads to rom and kernel growth as well as bug/beta testing which developers obviously need to keep developing, whilst yes Lollipop is a great thing and yes many devs are trying to get lollipop working instead of modding kitkat, there are still plenty users that will prefer kitkat over lollipop. The vast majority of users and devs are first working on a root exploit cause 80% (give or take my best guess here) of users are now frustrated from buying a device they cannot unlock or develop with unless they willing to risk their warranty or destroy 30% of the phone's functionality included by sony which we all love and taking such a risk knowing you got only one try to get it right, this is tricky.. so if you think of lets say 30 000 users on xda owning a z3, i can bet you not even 2000 of those are unlocked yet, and therefore slow development happens because all focus is taken to finding an exploit, which is great, i cannot wait for the day my Z3 can get unlocked when we can backup DRM. Im not disrespecting anyone here fyi, im just posting my opinion.

CameronBanna said:
I'm pretty sure the DRM can now be restored with a unlocked bootloader
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Click to collapse
Most DRM is not restorable, although it can sometimes be backed up and then restored with various other phones.
iFlasher said:
It's not possible. The only thing possible is restore some features that you lose when you unlock the bootloader.
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Click to collapse
This is correct from what I hear.
munsabin said:
The main reason there are no roms for the devices at this point is NOT due to the DRM issues. The phone is easily unlocked and rooted - there's instruction all over google...it's actually due to the Xperia Z3 being a very new phone arriving right around the time that Lollipop hit the shelves on Nexus devices. DEVs are busy updating their ROMs to be based on the Lollipop platform. This is of much more importance to them as it gives them much more rep, than them wasting time on a new phone. As they say... being first in the game is a lot easier than working your ass off to catch up.
In my opinion, I think you should jump on the Z3. It's a great phone. Kick ass battery. Great stock rom, and google lollipop update coming soon, which will kick out a lot of the needs for a custom rom for day to day usage + Nova Launcher does a kick ass job filling in a few holes. I'm waiting until DEVs get the lollipop based roms ready and then you can be sure the Z3 will have plenty of custom rom options. For the same reason above, root w/ Locked BL (liked the Z2) probably won't be available for a while as well...but...
The DRM keys that are lost when unlocked, mainly affect the camera (night shots). That said though... it really doesnt. I've done quite a bit of testing in different low light conditions using the Sony Camera app, and using the Google Camera app (cause I love photosphere). The SOny camera app uses the algorithms locked in the DRM keys, while the google camera doesn't. The low light photos, in my opinion, have very minimal difference, unless one is taking a twilight shot using a tripod stand for the phone... in which case they deserve to be hit across the head with a bat.
As for the competition... I tried the Nexus 6 and it's simply too big. The Samsung S5 is nice... but just not sexy enough and the battery is not as good and touchwiz is not really all that great.
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Click to collapse
Thanks for a brilliant reply, I am waiting for CES to finish this week and then if nothing major is announced I will be buying a Z3, as soon as lollipop is out and in a good state I will make a ROM if I have the time
squabbi said:
Thats a precise answer! Thank you for that. I would like to back it again that the low-light performance is really minimal at most. I'm definitely considering unlocking the bootloader now even to achieve root. Do you know if the D6653 and the D6603 are 'cross-compatible' with custom ROMs?
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Click to collapse
They may need different drivers as they have a slightly different chipset in them, most devs should be able to account for this
munsabin said:
Should probably edit / delete this post since it's not really correct and you're essentially driving people away from a great phone. DRM is not really an issue if you do some more research, unlocking the phone is easy and info is all over google, and rooting the phone; same story.
Reason no ROMs are available is b/c Xperia Z3 and Lollipop hit the shelves around the same time. DEVs are working to get lollipop based custom ROMs out, not ROMs based on old OS for a new phone.
---------- Post added at 08:27 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:23 PM ----------
No clue. I'm sure when custom ROMs will be available; that info will be clearly mentioned.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
He should not delete his answer, his answer was a good one albeit not as detailed as the rest. DRM is an issue to contend with as some users like it and want to keep it.
corpsegrinder62 said:
Whilst i do agree to your point, my point of view of the post is not exactly inaccurate but rather a different point of view to yours, think of it like this: many users start developing because they start to tinker with their new amazing device, many users themselves apart from developers try at developing aswell, and this all ads to rom and kernel growth as well as bug/beta testing which developers obviously need to keep developing, whilst yes Lollipop is a great thing and yes many devs are trying to get lollipop working instead of modding kitkat, there are still plenty users that will prefer kitkat over lollipop. The vast majority of users and devs are first working on a root exploit cause 80% (give or take my best guess here) of users are now frustrated from buying a device they cannot unlock or develop with unless they willing to risk their warranty or destroy 30% of the phone's functionality included by sony which we all love and taking such a risk knowing you got only one try to get it right, this is tricky.. so if you think of lets say 30 000 users on xda owning a z3, i can bet you not even 2000 of those are unlocked yet, and therefore slow development happens because all focus is taken to finding an exploit, which is great, i cannot wait for the day my Z3 can get unlocked when we can backup DRM. Im not disrespecting anyone here fyi, im just posting my opinion.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This is a good answer too, and your bang on, not everyone wants to lose DRM keys or risk losing stuff they like. I will be patient until I start ROMing myself again or until someone manages to hack around this known issue. Sony have always been tight arses with ROM developers...

@apmartin1991 - root w/ locked BL is now available. No need for custom roms IMO when you've got xposed framework available. Xblast Tools will give you a LOT of what you'll find on custom roms, plus you'll be running on stable stock rom. Kernels can be modified once you've rooted your phone with locked BL, saved TA partition (for future), and unlocked bootloader. But unlocking bootloader will kill camera night shots.

Is the Pixel 2 right for me? Opinions appreciated.

Hi all,
I am enamored by the Pixel 2 for the camera, general size and clean android experience. I am coming from a Moto X (2013) DE, which I have been using for almost three years with no complaints. I am on Verizon GFUDP, am unlocked, rooted and using Xposed framework. I use the phone for tethering quite often. I don't generally use custom ROMs,; once I am setup and got everything running nice, I stop playing around with the phone and just use it.
That said, I am ready to upgrade and still want an unlockable, rootable device, which has a really good camera and will allow me to tether at will. My thought is to purchase the Pixel 2 through Google. I see that there has been some bumpiness in the road to root success, and I am wondering if this device will eventually (if it's already not) become stable enough to do what I want without a lot of fooling with it, or fear of accidentally "bricking", or other issues down the road.
So in the big picture, do you feel that the Pixel 2 can be set up, forgotten about, and just used, as I describe above, or do you think that the device will need to be tweaked on a regular basis? If so, do you have any recommendations of devices which better fit the parameters listed above?
Thanks in advance!

amajamar said:
Hi all,
I am enamored by the Pixel 2 for the camera, general size and clean android experience. I am coming from a Moto X (2013) DE, which I have been using for almost three years with no complaints. I am on Verizon GFUDP, am unlocked, rooted and using Xposed framework. I use the phone for tethering quite often. I don't generally use custom ROMs,; once I am setup and got everything running nice, I stop playing around with the phone and just use it.
That said, I am ready to upgrade and still want an unlockable, rootable device, which has a really good camera and will allow me to tether at will. My thought is to purchase the Pixel 2 through Google. I see that there has been some bumpiness in the road to root success, and I am wondering if this device will eventually (if it's already not) become stable enough to do what I want without a lot of fooling with it, or fear of accidentally "bricking", or other issues down the road.
So in the big picture, do you feel that the Pixel 2 can be set up, forgotten about, and just used, as I describe above, or do you think that the device will need to be tweaked on a regular basis? If so, do you have any recommendations of devices which better fit the parameters listed above?
Thanks in advance!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It should be good in the long run. In my personal experience after using a lot of ROM's/kernels/mods since 2011 I would say the max your needs would come to is getting a custom kernel. With no disrespect to the developers who have worked on providing great roms throughout the years, google has really developed 8.0/8.1 into a completely viable solution that till now has not got me to even consider rooting the device to get some custom features on it.

flunk03 said:
It should be good in the long run. In my personal experience after using a lot of ROM's/kernels/mods since 2011 I would say the max your needs would come to is getting a custom kernel. With no disrespect to the developers who have worked on providing great roms throughout the years, google has really developed 8.0/8.1 into a completely viable solution that till now has not got me to even consider rooting the device to get some custom features on it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As I said, as long as I can get the tethering function, I am pretty much good to go. Do I need a custom kernel for that?

amajamar said:
As I said, as long as I can get the tethering function, I am pretty much good to go. Do I need a custom kernel for that?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Afaik just rooting and getting an app designed for that should be fine I guess. It's not something I know since we don't have that issue with carriers on that front

amajamar said:
As I said, as long as I can get the tethering function, I am pretty much good to go. Do I need a custom kernel for that?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As far as I'm aware you can achieve this with Magisk root and a Magisk module.

Buy Pixel 2, unlock bootloader before you set up the phone (get the factory reset out of the way), then just use it as-is indefinitely until you find you need something that only root can provide. If that's the case, then install Magisk, and keep on rolling.

Why is that there is Hardly any content for pixel 2?

When I the I had nexus 5 there used to be loads of content in xda be it roms or mods. Now for the pixel 2 there is no custom rom to begin with. I understand the stock Google oreo is as good as ever but still the basic tweaks would add much more to it.
Is there any specific reason for this? May be Google's security is much complicated in oreo to implement changes in the stock rom?
I was just looking for dual speaker ring, status bar tweaks.

I hope to see more soon as well. Now that Verizon phones are on board for rooting there will probably be more devs getting their hands dirty.
Not to mention there are still only a few phones running Oreo. Right now it's just basically pixel owners. So all the mods made for other phones haven't been ported or upgraded.
I'll have this phone for the next two years I'm hoping there will be more with time.
I haven't even been able to get debian, Ubuntu, or Kali to work along side this phone yet. Proot and chroot don't seem to be working as they should. I tried 3 methods. Linux deploy, termux ,and using the nethunter module. Guess I'll just keep at it until New methods are found.

I assumed the Pixel line would just replace the Nexus line for modders. Sadly, that couldn't be further from the truth for either the Pixel 1 or 2. Which phone(s) have all the devs moved to?

teh_lorax said:
I assumed the Pixel line would just replace the Nexus line for modders. Sadly, that couldn't be further from the truth for either the Pixel 1 or 2. Which phone(s) have all the devs moved to?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
One plus because of the price
Sent from my Google Pixel 2 XL using XDA Labs

Sman999 said:
Is there any specific reason for this? May be Google's security is much complicated in oreo to implement changes in the stock rom?
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Click to collapse
The a/b bootloader partitions... No dedicated recovery.... Blah blah blah too much for me to understand but basically it's screwing with devs.

teh_lorax said:
I assumed the Pixel line would just replace the Nexus line for modders. Sadly, that couldn't be further from the truth for either the Pixel 1 or 2. Which phone(s) have all the devs moved to?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I guess oneplus or Samsung. The later cuz the design is awesome but software experience is poor so if the software is improved it ll be awesome Samsung. ?

I wondered the same thing but then it dawned on me, I only rooted/ROM'd devices to run something that's a vanilla build of Android. That's what this is. There's a few nitpicky things that I would love to have but for the most part, I'm happy with it.

main reason for me is the PRICE.. if it was just priced same as the nexus 5, . thats why oneplus devices are being so favored

teh_lorax said:
I assumed the Pixel line would just replace the Nexus line for modders. Sadly, that couldn't be further from the truth for either the Pixel 1 or 2. Which phone(s) have all the devs moved to?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
pixel devices are no where near as easy to get roms on. Not only is the device tree clustered, but a b partitions, the trend of users demanding security, the expensive price of the device, the changes to the build process, and how Verizon royally made blobs more complicated contributed too.
I have brought up a few device tress before but I definitely had to debug the most for pixel 2. Theres an entire new flashing method and it doesn't help ramdisk is in system now.
Now after all that negativity, I can tell you I know of 4 roms actively working on roms. And two of them booting, including my shameless plug in p2xl forums of ABC Rom working with plenty of mods.
I'd say the good times are on their way, once one rom goes up more will pop up instantly.
Let's hope this helps start the domino effect.
https://forum.xda-developers.com/pi...sp-tamien-8-1-opengapps-t3727948/post75108624

Surge1223 said:
pixel devices are no where near as easy to get roms on. Not only is the device tree clustered, but a b partitions, the trend of users demanding security, the expensive price of the device, the changes to the build process, and how Verizon royally made blobs more complicated contributed too.
I have brought up a few device tress before but I definitely had to debug the most for pixel 2. Theres an entire new flashing method and it doesn't help ramdisk is in system now.
Now after all that negativity, I can tell you I know of 4 roms actively working on roms. And two of them booting, including my shameless plug in p2xl forums of ABC Rom working with plenty of mods.
I'd say the good times are on their way, once one rom goes up more will pop up instantly.
Let's hope this helps start the domino effect.
https://forum.xda-developers.com/pi...sp-tamien-8-1-opengapps-t3727948/post75108624
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Click to collapse
Good to know you're busy helping us all with our crack flashing addiction. I can't wait for the goodies to start. Thank you and all the other devs. I've been waiting to unlock my bl because of lack of roms. Is bajasaur still in the game? I haven't really seen him since my note 3 days.

bmwh0r3 said:
Good to know you're busy helping us all with our crack flashing addiction. I can't wait for the goodies to start. Thank you and all the other devs. I've been waiting to unlock my bl because of lack of roms. Is bajasaur still in the game? I haven't really seen him since my note 3 days.
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Click to collapse
Ironic you should ask..I helped him come back to the game today you could say lol