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For the past few days, I've been dealing with what appears to be a disproportionately huge group of Evo owners (relative to other Android phones) who've been having crashes with an app I wrote that appear to be caused by the unavailability of network-based location services. I did some research, and it looks like a LOT of Evo owners have been doing things that (temporarily?) disable network-based location services in an attempt to keep the battery from dying too quickly.
Are Evo users who do this literally going into Settings and disabling network-based location services outright, or are there one or more apps/hacks that supposedly disable it only when "it's not being used"? If there are, what does an app that depends on network-based location services have to do to make sure that whatever is supposedly enabling network-based location services "when necessary" realizes that it is, in fact, necessary... and do it in a way that won't cause the lookup request to prematurely or needlessly fail?
Like I've said, I've had a few users with other phones have problems due to the app's current absolute dependency on the availability of network-based location services... but with Evo owners, it's more like a nonstop hailstorm of complaints. Rewriting the way the app handles location to eliminate that absolute dependency is my next major project, but it's going to take me at least a week or two to finish, and in the meantime I'd love to be able to find a temporary solution that I can patch and release tonight that will solve the worst of the problem for the majority of Evo users in the meantime.
Speak up brother. What is the App (so people who don't have the slightest clue as to how to relate your user name with the buggy app you have)?
I'm not sure why anyone would do this, aside from "privacy" concerns... It will not help with battery life on it's own. If your GPS is turned off, your device gets it's relative location via the cell phone tower's coordinates. This information gets transmitted to your phone regardless if you have it disabled to accept it.
They are probably thinking that if they disable it, other services won't try to update information based on your location. Instead they should just adjust any services that are auto-updating.
I can go >24hours before I need to charge my phone with moderate usage throughout the day (without using 4G). I can post SystemPanel screenshots if anyone is interested.
mattrb said:
Speak up brother. What is the App (so people who don't have the slightest clue as to how to relate your user name with the buggy app you have)?
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Click to collapse
OK, if it makes you happy, I didn't personally write it that way. It's a legacy app I'm helping to fix. In the meantime, I'm trying to put out as many fires as quickly as I can. That said, I'm not going to condemn the original author. All things considered, it was a perfectly reasonable decision for him to make. It was his first major Android programming project, and his immediate runtime environment was a Droid on Verizon. 99% of his Android-owning friends were Sprint or Verizon. For the most part, on Sprint & Verizon, network-based location services work really well. The app's dependency on them didn't really bubble to the surface as anything more than likely user error until lots of non-Americans started showing up with phones that couldn't be automatically assumed to have inseparably-bundled mandatory data service.
Truth be told, America is a lot like Japan -- cellular networks that are almost proprietary to the national market and work in ways that aren't necessarily consistent with the way things work elsewhere in the world, but utterly ubiquitous and totally dominant within it. I'm sure that right now, plenty of Japanese developers are writing Android apps that assume every phone supports network-level low-latency "Push to Talk" capabilities (IDEN's "killer app"), or some other feature that's ubiquitous in Japan and (almost) unheard of elsewhere. Six months from now, they're going to be scratching their heads wondering why it crashes on every phone in Europe and most phones in America (Sprint, and I think Verizon, try to emulate IDEN's PTT on CDMA by buffering the audio stream on a server, then sending a SMS to the recipient's phone that triggers its download and streaming a couple of seconds later).
Anyway, I digress. Getting back to the original question, are Evo owners who disable network location doing it manually, or are they doing it in a way that can be worked with cooperatively by apps in order to get it to automatically turn it back on when needed?
Actually, I have theory #2 about why Evo owners might be having problems, but it's pure speculation at this point. I'm wondering whether there might be Evo owners who've explicitly disabled EV-DO and 1xRTT to try and force the phone to use WiMax in areas where it might otherwise try to fall back to the older modes, and the possibility that even NON-network location service DEPENDS on EV-DO/1xRTT for aGPS data transmission of the raw telemetry data. In a way, it makes sense... the WiMax network is totally parallel to the CDMA2000 network, and it's not inconceivable that there might BE no data route between the Sprint WiMax network and the servers that handle aGPS queries. Especially if there aren't any real-world locations where Sprint WiMax is available, but CDMA2000 data is not.
If you go into the settings you can disable the network location, but there are ways for an app to ask if the user wants to turn the setting back on.
Evo owners can't disable 1xRTT otherwise standard calls and text messages won't work anymore. They can change settings if they have their MSL code such that EVDO isn't ever used however.
Well, maybe "disable" is a strong term. I know that on a Hero, there's a network setting somewhere that allows you to tell the phone, "Use EV-DO, or don't do data at all". It doesn't affect the operation of voice or sms -- only the phone's willingness to fall back to 1xRTT for internet access if EV-DO isn't available. I'm assuming the Evo has a similar setting that goes a step further and lets you dictate "WiMax or Nothing".
Here's how it could theoretically affect location services: obviously Sprint does aGPS. By law, it HAS to do it for e911 purposes. HOWEVER, I think that non-e911 aGPS lookups on Android phones get diverted through Google (or at least an aGPS service hosted by Google) unless you pay Sprint extra for navigation service. Under those conditions, if you told the phone to use ONLY WiMax for internet access, and you were in an area where only EV-DO and/or 1xRTT data were available, you could have a situation where the phone can do e911 location, but wouldn't necessarily have that info available for use by other applications (vis-a-vis most of HTC's WinMo 6 phones). If the phone couldn't use WiMax, and the user dictated "WiMax or Nothing", the phone couldn't reach Google. Without Google, there'd be no free aGPS for Android apps to consume.
The above is pure speculation, of course. As a practical matter, Sprint itself can't/won't give a coherent explanation of where the line gets drawn between Sprint and Google for (a)GPS service, which makes troubleshooting location-related problems that much more fun. Personally, it wouldn't surprise me in the least if late-model HTC phones DO have 100% of the hardware onboard to turn satellite telemetry into latitude/longitude/altitude coordinates, but the underlying software fails without realtime network connectivity anyway because it still tries to involve a server somewhere for some reason.
Look, this is what happens to me and I think it's a bug.
When I turn off GPS for a while, like for 12 hours, and then I turn it on, I still see the "Location" icon crossed out. At first I didn't know what was going on. I thought it was the GPS icon, but it wasn't, it was the location services being turned off.
So I reproduced it several times and this is what happens. When you turn off GPS for a while, the location setting will be turned off also, and it will remain off even after you turn on the GPS again. Which IS A BUG. That's not an expected behavior. So you may be right.
baiatul said:
Look, this is what happens to me and I think it's a bug.
When I turn off GPS for a while, like for 12 hours, and then I turn it on, I still see the "Location" icon crossed out. At first I didn't know what was going on. I thought it was the GPS icon, but it wasn't, it was the location services being turned off.
So I reproduced it several times and this is what happens. When you turn off GPS for a while, the location setting will be turned off also, and it will remain off even after you turn on the GPS again. Which IS A BUG. That's not an expected behavior. So you may be right.
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Click to collapse
My experience doesn't mirror that at all. When I turn GPS on (which I am impressed to say has it finding satellites many times faster than my old HTC Fuze) the location disabled icon changes almost immediately. I saw this a lot over last weekend when I was doing a lot of phone based navigation.
Yes, I forgot, I'm in NY, and in Manhattan very strange things happen when you go in and out the subway with signal and no signal several times a day for periods of time from minutes to an hour.
Many programs that are expected to work crash when there is no signal. Or when you run applications in the subway with no signal, the gadget freezes sometimes. Maybe this GPS thing is also one of those glitches. Maybe it's a combination of turning on or off the GPS, and then the loss of signal for a while. It still happens to me, but I got used: every time I turn back on the GPS after being disabled for MANY HOURS (12? 24?), I have to turn back on the Location setting.
merak69 said:
I'm not sure why anyone would do this, aside from "privacy" concerns...
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I turned off network location services for one simple reason....using it caused my location to off by at least 1/2 mile. So it seemed pretty useless to me.
pixelpop said:
I turned off network location services for one simple reason....using it caused my location to off by at least 1/2 mile. So it seemed pretty useless to me.
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Click to collapse
It's basing your location on the information from the cell phone tower. It isn't meant to give you a precise location like GPS can (this is why its called aGPS). The point is to give a general location so that apps that need to know what city you are in (weather apps for example) can figure it out to show you information for where you currently are.
If you want precise information, turn on full GPS and you are good to go.
My point was disabling location services entirely will not save you any more battery life vs leaving network location on (excluding full GPS obviously). What will save you battery is turning off your other services (Facebook, Twitter, News, etc) to only update when you manually say so or setting their update schedules to much longer frequencies.
Here's how it could theoretically affect location services: obviously Sprint does aGPS. By law, it HAS to do it for e911 purposes. HOWEVER, I think that non-e911 aGPS lookups on Android phones get diverted through Google (or at least an aGPS service hosted by Google) unless you pay Sprint extra for navigation service. Under those conditions, if you told the phone to use ONLY WiMax for internet access, and you were in an area where only EV-DO and/or 1xRTT data were available, you could have a situation where the phone can do e911 location, but wouldn't necessarily have that info available for use by other applications (vis-a-vis most of HTC's WinMo 6 phones). If the phone couldn't use WiMax, and the user dictated "WiMax or Nothing", the phone couldn't reach Google. Without Google, there'd be no free aGPS for Android apps to consume.
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Click to collapse
Your phone doesn't communicate with Google. Sprint has their own aGPS servers but I think you might misunderstand what their purpose is. The "a" part of aGPS means Assisted, but only assisted in the fact of giving the chip the information it needs to lock on to the true GPS signals faster based on your current location.
For example: If you used a GPS device that wasn't assisted and its known internal satellite database was out of date, it'd have to search for awhile to location any/all satellites in the sky. On the flip side, an assisted chip can use the network server to download satellite info (ids, frequencies, etc) to show which satellites are visible for your given rough location. This enables hardware lock to happen faster.
However those aGPS servers are optional since the chip has a hybrid mode of operation:
a) If you have true GPS on, obviously it uses GPS to determine your location, down to potentially 3-4 meters.
b) If the chip can't get a satellite lock or you have true GPS turned off, the chip uses multiple known tower locations in combination to triangulate your location (based on signal strength to known towers). The fewer the towers it has access to, the less and less accurate your known location becomes. This works even with 3G and 4G disabled because it transmits the data over 1xRTT (you can easily test this in Google Maps).
In the second situation (b), I've seen where tower triangulation has narrowed my location down to 100 meters. I've also seen where it can't get a lock on multiple towers reliably such that the chip puts my "center" location as the actual location of the tower with an accuracy rating of 2000 meters. This is what Pixelpop is mentioning above about accuracy.
merak69 said:
Your phone doesn't communicate with Google. Sprint has their own aGPS servers but I think you might misunderstand what their purpose is. The "a" part of aGPS means Assisted, but only assisted in the fact of giving the chip the information it needs to lock on to the true GPS signals faster based on your current location.
For example: If you used a GPS device that wasn't assisted and its known internal satellite database was out of date, it'd have to search for awhile to location any/all satellites in the sky. On the flip side, an assisted chip can use the network server to download satellite info (ids, frequencies, etc) to show which satellites are visible for your given rough location. This enables hardware lock to happen faster.
However those aGPS servers are optional since the chip has a hybrid mode of operation:
a) If you have true GPS on, obviously it uses GPS to determine your location, down to potentially 3-4 meters.
b) If the chip can't get a satellite lock or you have true GPS turned off, the chip uses multiple known tower locations in combination to triangulate your location (based on signal strength to known towers). The fewer the towers it has access to, the less and less accurate your known location becomes. This works even with 3G and 4G disabled because it transmits the data over 1xRTT (you can easily test this in Google Maps).
In the second situation (b), I've seen where tower triangulation has narrowed my location down to 100 meters. I've also seen where it can't get a lock on multiple towers reliably such that the chip puts my "center" location as the actual location of the tower with an accuracy rating of 2000 meters. This is what Pixelpop is mentioning above about accuracy.
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Click to collapse
You're correct that aGPS doesn't go through Google. It's presumably handled by the radio and Android is never aware of it at all.
Cell tower location/triangulation is different however. The OP is correct that it does go through Google, as the US CDMA carriers are totally unwilling to allow outside access to this information like GSM carriers do. Google built and maintains their own database of tower info, and that is what populates your rough location in Android. It is not aGPS data from Sprint's servers that is allowing that.
You want a hack? Well use the last known position, if it's historical then post a message "wtf turn on location services, if you want picture phone to work".
The app may not work but it won't crash as it has a location. More so it blames the user. lol
Post a little line to the location service enable semaphore, "who turned off the lights?"
You can get location assisted position from Wi-Max just like you can get it off Wi-Fi. As far as I know there is no app to disable Mobile Network Location on demand. If your having issues with it than users are going in and disabling it by hand through the settings. The problem probably is that 90% of the know it all bloggers advise to disable network position because they think it does something for battery life.
I'm also willing to bet good money that Google is handling the network location. Why else would they have a location server(supl.google.com). Only to let Nokia users use it?
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I've noticed that there are areas where the GPS doesn't work, even outside with no sky obstacles. One of them is on 113 st. between Broadway and Amsterdam avenue (NYC), right next to a building tagged "Cell Motion Laboratories." I've been there twice since I have EVO and the GPS is off like 10 buildings when I'm in the building next door. From outside, it just looks like any other Columbia University residence.
(Yes, my location settings were enabled and GPS was on).
ZIP 10027.
I just searched that lab, and it has nothing to do with cellphones, but with real cells (biological lab for kids, I think).
bedoig said:
You're correct that aGPS doesn't go through Google. It's presumably handled by the radio and Android is never aware of it at all.
Cell tower location/triangulation is different however. The OP is correct that it does go through Google, as the US CDMA carriers are totally unwilling to allow outside access to this information like GSM carriers do. Google built and maintains their own database of tower info, and that is what populates your rough location in Android. It is not aGPS data from Sprint's servers that is allowing that.
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Click to collapse
What you are talking about for triangulation is software level functionality part of Google Maps and Google Maps only and yes it contacts their servers to try and guess where you are. Google does build out their own "database of tower info" just like they collect all sorts of other statistical information (you agree to this when you turn on location services), but part of the aGPS standard is that every cell phone tower, GSM or CDMA, transmits its coordinates to your handset.
What I'm talking about is all strictly in the hardware, but perhaps the word "triangulation" was the incorrect choice of word when talking about aGPS, however it is similar... The aGPS functionality in our phones is tightly integrated into the radio chip (Qualcomm RTR6500 CDMA2000) and this chip does not need to contact Google or Sprint to determine your rough location from a tower (turn off all internet access and you'll see what I mean). It can contact Sprints servers through the network (when it is able) to further plot your location based on the data transmitted to/from the aGPS server.
When you first use the EVO, there is a screen that asks if you want to share anonymous location data. That setting is also tied to network-based location services. That is, if you disable anonymous location sharing, it also disables NBLS entirely. You can thank either Google or HTC (not sure which) for their greed on that one.
I just checked and mine was set to off. not sure what sets it to that as I never touch that setting.
Just adding my 2 cents.
This might be my first post ever, however, long time lurker on the boards.
I think I have a potential fix for the GPS issue with the Captivate. I don’t think this is the same as the “quick fix” found elsewhere on these and other the boards. I am not sure what (if any) 'side effects' there are to this.
My phone previously had the AT&T/Samsung fix from late September applied, although it didn’t seem to help.
Get to the Lbs test menu; previous available through *#*#1472365#*#*. However, if you previously installed the recent AT&T/Samsung (supposed fix) for the Captivate, you can’t get to the menu through the dialer. Use Anycut from market to get to the Lbs test screen.
My GPS now gets a great lock about 30 seconds.
BTW, I am not root….
YMMV. You should record your original settings prior to making these changes, just in case you need to revert.
Standard Disclaimer; I am not at fault for any issues this causes your device…..
Now, down to the settings that I use:
In Lbs test menu:
I “deleted GPS data”
Application Settings
– Session Type: Tracking
– Test Mode : S/W Test
– Operation Mode: MS Based
– Start Mode: Cold Start
– GPS Plus: Off
– Dynamic Accuracy: On
– Accuracy: 50
– Use Skyhook: Off
– Use PC Tool: Off
SUPL/CP Settings
- Server FQDN Type: Auto Config
- Server [leave what is autopulated]
- Server Port [leave was is autopopulated]
- Supl Secure Socket: On
- AGPS Mode: SUPL
Reboot.
Use GPS Test from Market, or the The “Get Position Test” menu from Lbs screen to validate.
WIFI Problem:
One thing I have noticed is that depending on the settings above, wifi (if on) sometimes inhibits the ability to see more than 1 satellite. I think the problems with GPS are overall related to Wifi in some way.
If you do not have luck with above settings, turn wifi off and see what happens.
I only had to change a couple of the settings but this is working nicely so far...Ill try again over the next day or so in various situations and report back.
Changed:
Op Mode to MS Based
Start Mode to Cold
Turned off GPS Plus
Secure Socket to off
Thanks!
I'll admit some of this seems counter-intuitive, but at this point anything is worth a shot.I'll let you know how it goes!
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App
You don't need to download anything to access the Lbs test. Just type *#*#3214789650#*#* in the dialer and you will get access. Works with JH7 and Froyo.
Before anyone else reads this and declares their GPS fixed, they should read at least the first post of this thread completely. http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=789383 If you understand what is being said by that post, then you can offer GPS solutions. The only thing you have changed is AGPS settings. While those settings will get you a lock, they don't help out with accuracy. If you really want to test your GPS, you have to turn off the use wireless networks feature, take it outside and see how well it works then.
Everything that has been said in this thread has been said elsewhere and is not a solution.
Nope, it's definitely not fixed...but it did give me a better lock than before. Same old...
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App
Well if its not a fix then it is most definitely better...I can get a lock in ~20 seconds where as before it might not even come close.
l7777 said:
Before anyone else reads this and declares their GPS fixed, they should read at least the first post of this thread completely. http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=789383 If you understand what is being said by that post, then you can offer GPS solutions. The only thing you have changed is AGPS settings. While those settings will get you a lock, they don't help out with accuracy. If you really want to test your GPS, you have to turn off the use wireless networks feature, take it outside and see how well it works then.
Everything that has been said in this thread has been said elsewhere and is not a solution.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Additionally, a lock is not enough to say it works. Take it for a drive along with another GPS device - use Google my tracks or some other tool to record your path. Even use GPS test and watch your MPH, direction and location.
You will find that it is not fixed. It works OK sometimes, but many times it is behind or inaccurate.
msinkovich said:
Well if its not a fix then it is most definitely better...I can get a lock in ~20 seconds where as before it might not even come close.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You will have to do that every week as your cached GPS data expires. And you can literally use any settings as long as you can use the lbstestmode to accquire a lock. That's all you need to do (accquire your first lock and it will cache the data for 5 to 7 days).
Any "fix" that involves "settings" isn't a "fix" at all since it demonstrates an utter lack of what the real problem is and how GPS fundamentally works.
The real "fix" won't come in the form of settings. Any purported settings "fix" is snake oil.
I've given up on GPS a while ago.
It's a fringe feature anyway.
I never have "use wireless networks on" and gps works good enough. It may not be perfect but everytime ive used it it has got me where i need to go no problems. It may jump off track or be slow to turn for a second but it still gets me to wherever just fine.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App
If I read this correctly your turning off skyhook ? I read this http://www.skyhookwireless.com/howitworks/, and to me you need it turned on for urban areas and in the city need wi-fi turned on because of the occlusions caused by buildings and such...?
Mac
roadrash7 said:
I never have "use wireless networks on" and gps works good enough.
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Click to collapse
That option has nothing to do with GPS. 'Use Wireless Networks' is actually quite useful for location aware apps like Google Maps, Places, Speed Test etc. where an accurate but slow GPS lock may not be needed (or even possible if you're underground or inside a concrete building). This option enables those apps to use cell tower or wi-fi signal trianglation to get a quick estimation of your current location so that apps can give you relavent information, i.e. nearby gas stations or resaurants. It has nothing to do with aGPS either.
MikeyMike01 said:
I've given up on GPS a while ago.
It's a fringe feature anyway.
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Click to collapse
You have to be kidding saying its a feature right? I can't believe how many say that its a feature and that it is ok that Samsung is screwing them ( along with placebo updates) . I myself love and would like a Galaxy S phone or even the new Focus 7, but its looking like it too has GPS issues from early reports with the Omnia 7.
I know most of you guys are already locked in with your carrier and don't have much choice with the GPS issue but its not a feature, its a valuable function just like placing calls, sending emails, texting, etc.. If you don't care about this, then you should of bought a Razor flip phone.
I have been keeping up with this because I really want to see Samsung resolve this and make right.
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
So the only reason you need a phone is for the GPS? Otherwise just stay with my 1996 model flip phone? Just...wow!
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App
I think their point is that it is an advertised function of the phone and we would like to work properly.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using Tapatalk
GimpyLeg said:
So the only reason you need a phone is for the GPS? Otherwise just stay with my 1996 model flip phone? Just...wow!
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
My reasons for a working GPS are as follows:
Pinpoint your location, get turn-by-turn directions to restaurants, businesses and other destinations, location-based mobile games, social networking sites, real-time position tracking, lost or stolen phone tracking, etc., etc., etc..
What I am saying is just quit making excuses for Samsung and demand what you paid for! There are people on here who would really like for their GPS to be working and rightfully so.
Oh, I agree that it should work as advertised. Can't say Samsung is ' screwing' me because they can't get it right. Would have bought the phone if I knew about it beforehand anyway. There are many other features that led me to the Cappy. Samsung does need to fix the problem and I hope they do so soon. Buy I won't try discourage anyone from Samsung products in the meanwhile.
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wsantiagow said:
My reasons for a working GPS are as follows:
Pinpoint your location, get turn-by-turn directions to restaurants, businesses and other destinations, location-based mobile games, social networking sites, real-time position tracking, lost or stolen phone tracking, etc., etc., etc..
What I am saying is just quit making excuses for Samsung and demand what you paid for! There are people on here who would really like for their GPS to be working and rightfully so.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The solution to the GPS problem is quite simple, but most people still don't see it.
If 100% accuracy and < 10 second fixes are more important to you than the rest of the Galaxy S features, then you do not want a Galaxy S phone. Either return the one you have or don't buy it. For most people, that good of a GPS is a bonus and not a requirement.
The GPS problems are not undocumented, anyone reading any reviews for the phone will realize that the GPS is not as good as other devices. Even if they don't realize it before they buy it, they have 30 days to return it. Samsung may or may not ever get the problem worked out since phones have such a short life cycle. *****ing about it in thread after thread, online petitions, and idle threats of legal action will have absolutely no impact on Samsung.
Hey guys i have an 19020a nexus s. I recently had the power button issue and had to ship it in to samsung to get it fixed. They fixed it and it works fine but i have noticed that gps either takes over 10 minutes to get a lock or doesn't ever get one at all. If it does manage to finally get a lock, it loses it after about 10 seconds. I don't know if this is a hardware issue or software but any help would be appreciated!
what kind of rom do you have?
well im using brickmaker's miui v4. but i couldn't get gps on codename android either. im using the matr1x kernel but i was using stock and i wasn't getting gps either.
You might need to set the NTP server to your region. I seem to have to do this every time I flash a new rom since I got this phone. I use GPS Aids to do it.
you could try this app gps status it may help
https://play.google.com/store/apps/...wsMSwyLDEsImNvbS5lY2xpcHNpbS5ncHNzdGF0dXMyIl0.
none of these apps seem to work. the best i can get is my phone finding a few satellites but it can't manage to get a location lock off of them. i changed my ntp and tried using various gps fixing apps but nothing is working.i managed to get a gps lock once or twice but it loses it as soon as the phone moves...
emailed samsung and got this... -_- idiots.
Thank you for your inquiry. We apologize that your phone no longer able to get GPS location after it was sent back to you from our Repair Center. We recommend obtaining the initial lock while outdoors in clear view of the sky.
Do you have stable connection on the internet for the GPS functionality to work completely?
GPS problems can be linked to a number of factors. It may be a building that tends to block the satellite due to the nature of its structure. It may also be that the strength of the GPS signal may be particularly weak in that specific area. Geographic conditions, internal software and tower placement play a significant role in how well the phone grabs and maintains a GPS location.
We will forward your report of this behavior along to the appropriate parties for additional review and consideration. Please bear in mind that network features, to include the GPS functionality, are best supported by your service provider. We recommend contacting an T-Mobile Service Representative to confirm that there are no service issues that may be affecting your handset and in your location.
I've been experiencing the same issue as yours since I forced update to ICS... I'm still looking forward to a way to solve this...
i dont think my issue was with ics since i had been running ics since december. i did however call samsung and i sent my phone back in. they just got it today so we will see what they do about it.
I want to create an "un-steal-able" phone.
Of course this is impossible, but I want to make it as difficult as possible for thieves to get away with it, and as easy as possible for me to find it.
Assumptions:
Phone has available call and text messaging service.
Phone has internet capabilities and "permanent" Internet access. (We will consider 2G, 3G, or 4G cellular access with a data plan to be permanent. Depending on an open WiFi network to be available at all times is unreliable).
Phone is on and has some charge in its battery. (If the phone is off, we can't do anything).
Phone has an accurate GPS receiver.
Requirements:
Software that relays GPS coordinates via an Internet connection. As a backup for when there is no cellular data signal, software that relay GPS coordinates via SMS
Software cannot be disabled or removed without authentication.
GPS on phone cannot be turned off without authentication (alternative: remote activation of GPS receiver via Internet or SMS)
Cellular data and/or WiFi cannot be turned off without authentication (alternative: remote activation of cellular data via SMS)
Where GPS signal can be used for macro location (within 10 to 30 meters), there must be some method of micro location (within a few feet).
Phone cannot be powered off via any button press, on-screen menu, or removal of battery
Phone cannot be wiped by on-screen menu or by computer cable connection
Now I have approached this solution from two starting points: the iPhone running iOS, or an Android-based smartphone. Both have different advantages and technical details. Let's look at how we can meet each of these requirements one by one.
iOS solution:
Unfortunately, if your iPhone is not jailbroken, your choices are not so great. But FindMyiPhone does do the basic job of relaying GPS coordinates. For a jailbroken iPhone, iCaughtu seems to be the best of the bunch from the research I have done and gives you a bunch of cool anti-theft features.
and
Using the options under Settings -> General -> Restrictions, you can disallow users from deleting apps AND from turning off location services. Of course, you can accomplish something similar by simple setting a password to access your phone. Unfortunately I haven't yet seen any program that allows you to remotely activate the GPS receiver on an iPhone.
Unfortunately I don't think there is anyway to prevent a thief from disabling your cellular connection other than setting a password on the whole phone. This has its advantages and disadvantages.* Similarly, I don't see any way to remotely activate the Cellular Data on an iPhone via SMS.
This is where things start to get more complex and we need to start thinking of actually modding the phone. So far the best RF tracking solution I have found (in terms of size, cost, and effectiveness) is a cheap chinese-made product that I picked up in Asia and cannot find a link to. This one is very similar http://www.amazon.com/Loc8tor-LTD-Loc8torLite-LOC8TOR-Lite/dp/B0012GMDC4/ but the reviews are meh. It is RF-based but does not really give any directional information. Once you are close to the RF transmitter (using the GPS coordinates), you can use the RF receiver to basically play a little game of hot and cold and walk in different directions all while watching if the signal gets stronger or weaker. I've done two real world field test with the similar device and was able to successfully find a purposely concealed bag in a slum twice.
But how do we get this into the phone? If you disassemble the transmitter, it is a very small circuit board, but most phones these days are already packed to the brim. Additionally, these units need power, so you would need to solder it into the phone's power system.
For the iPhone, concerns about a battery-based shutdown are reduced by its "sealed" battery compartment. Of course, with the right tools, someone can get to the battery. But this is not likely to happen quickly and will likely occur in a specific home or shop, from which we can get coordinate data. We only need to delay the thieves long enough to track them. The bad news is that preventing an iPhone from being shutdown via button press is much more difficult. Even with a lockscreen password, anyone can turn off an iPhone with a long power/sleep button press. I found a mod on Cydia that required a password before any shutdown, but it seemed it was only compatible with iOS 5 and I am running iOS 6.
This is the most challenging problem, as the most common method for any experienced phone thief to avoid detection is simply to power off the phone (or disable internet/3G) and as quickly as possible get to a computer and perform a complete wipe using any number of computer programs. A password on the phone can prevent access to the menu options for resetting factory default, but very little can prevent a thief from physically connecting the phone to a computer and wiping it.
Again I turn to physical modding. Would it be possible to modify the iPhone connector in such a way that the pins for power and charging would still work, but the pins for a data connection would require a specially modified cable to conect to the computer? Once my phone is through its initial setup and/or, most anything I need to do as far as data can be accomplished via WiFi. If needed, I would keep my special data cable at my home only and never take it out. But losing the ability to charge from any iPhone cable would be too debilitating to daily usage.
So I ask the experts: how can I improve on or solve these ideas? Is there software out there that I don't know about, either on the App Store or the Cydia Store? Are there ways to remotely control the iPhone's wireless and GPS functions via text? There should be. Any ideas on incorporating a tiny RF transmitter into the iPhone? Is there any way to prevent an iPhone from being shut down via the sleep button? Is there anyway to sabotage the lightning connector in an intelligent way to prevent a computer-based wipe?
*Advantages and Disadvantage of a phone-wide password. Honestly, I would rather not have a lockscreen password on my phone. I'm not a privacy freak and I don't care if a thief sees my pictures of e-mails or Facebook. If my phone is stolen, I'm hoping it is stolen by an idiot and that they WON'T try to wipe the phone. None of my solutions are foolproof. Everything in here is about delaying the thief long enough to track them. If an idiot steals a phone without a password, he MIGHT just use it as is. But if an idiot steals a phone and can't doing ANYTHING with it, he is going to take it to someone who will be smart enough to wipe it MUCH SOONER. Of course, the disadvantage is a loss of privacy, but iCaughtu has a cool solution for that too.
Android solution:
Android phones are much easier to root, and software solutions exist that will work reasonably well even for nonrooted phones. The best software I have seen is Avast! Anti-theft (part of Mobile Security), AndroidLost, and Cerebrus. All of these can report GPS coordinates, and with Avast! at least, you can also see coordinate history online and actually follow the path of your phone through the minutes, hours, and/or days. AndroidLost can report GPS coordinates online OR via SMS!
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Avast! cannot be removed without a pin code. It can also prevent the user from during off Cellular Data and GPS. AndroidLost can be used to activate WiFi, Cellular Data and/or GPS via internet command OR via SMS. There are a ton of other internet-based and SMS commands in AndroidLost as well. Even without an active lockscreen password, a thief would be powerless to disable communication between the tracking software and you. In this department, Android truly outshines the iOS solution.
Getting an RF tracker into an Android-based phone has the same challenges as an iPhone.
I haven't found ANY glimmer of hope for a mode to disable shutdown via a long-button-press on Android. At least I found one mod for iPhone, even if it was the wrong iOS version. This is a huge gap in the goal of building an "unstealable" phone for both operating systems. As for the battery: Android phones come in many flavors. Many have removable batteries, so if you want to make life more difficult for thieves you'll have to limit yourself to a phone with a "sealed" battery compartment such as the HTC One.
A computer-based wipe via USB cable presents the same challenges as an iPhone EXCEPT that we're dealing with a more standard interface so that MIGHT make modding an easier task. Is there any way to make the microUSB jack more "proprietary" so that any normal USB cable can charge it but only a specially one can transmit data?
There is one other detailed I am interested in, but which is, I believe, currently impossible since it would require modifications to the lowest level of the phone's software, and that would be an auto-on feature. If the phone's battery dies for any reason (or any other shutdown that is not user-initiated), I would love for the phone to automatically power back on whenever it receives a new power source (either being plugged into the wall or getting a fresh battery).
Why am I so interested in doing this? I live in a third-world country and I travel to many other third-world countries. For 3 years, I guess I had good luck, but in the past year I have had three phones and a laptop stolen from me on the street and I have been punched in the face. Several of my friends have also had phones stolen during that time, and one friend was even kidnapped and robbed. Maybe crime is getting worse or maybe it is just coincidence. I have tried to be more careful each time, but one should not live life in fear or blame ones carelessness alone. It is time to fight back. Money, time, memories, self-respect, and peace of mind have been taken away from me and from people I care about. These thieves bear the real responsibility for these crimes. And the police and government here is largely unwilling, incapable, uncaring, and/or corrupt. Maybe I can help others as well.
Thanks for your suggestions and input.
Your thoughts are well expressed.
Hopefully something is coming fast to consumers.:good:
Recently I had a problem where my phone was hacked.
One of the things that happened was that the supposed person managed to stay by my side and when it left, I looked at my cell phone and Bluetooth was enabled (it was not before). There is a possibility that Bluetooth was already enabled but I don't think so.
After that I had leaked information from the cell phone, including the camera, calls and microphone.
Is there an attack that does this? And how can I protect myself in the future?
Also, how can I know on a non-rooted device if my phone is being monitored? I only find programs that find known viruses and network monitoring programs that are difficult to interpret or do not give veyy useful information.
Is there a way to get proof that my device is infected / being monitored?
unkownuserl33t said:
Recently I had a problem where my phone was hacked.
One of the things that happened was that the supposed person managed to stay by my side and when it left, I looked at my cell phone and Bluetooth was enabled (it was not before). There is a possibility that Bluetooth was already enabled but I don't think so.
After that I had leaked information from the cell phone, including the camera, calls and microphone.
Is there an attack that does this? And how can I protect myself in the future?
Also, how can I know on a non-rooted device if my phone is being monitored? I only find programs that find known viruses and network monitoring programs that are difficult to interpret or do not give veyy useful information.
Is there a way to get proof that my device is infected / being monitored?
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Click to collapse
There is a feature in some android devices that automatically enables Bluetooth when it encounters devices that it has previously been paired with at some point, some even have a feature that enables Bluetooth when any other active Bluetooth device comes within range.
Maybe this is what you are experiencing.
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