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Alright, short and sweet;
I'm in the market for a Tablet - this will be my first, although I'm not new to smartphones/android - and I'd decided to get the G-Tablet.. until I read about the Motorola Xoom.
I like how clean the Xoom looks, how thin it is and how small the frame around the display is. I also like that it's a Motorola product, meaning there will probably be an abundance of spare parts on ebay in the following months should I need a digitizer or what have you. I don't like that I'll probably have to wait to root and modify - judging it based on Motorola's recent history with Android devices and how well they're locked down.
I like the hardware and hackability of the G-Tablet, and the fact that I can pick one up tomorrow at-will. Is there any reason NOT to get the G-Tablet right now?! This tablet will need to last me until around Christmas.
So, in your opinions, throw some pros and cons at me and lets decide which route I should go.. G-Tablet or Xoom (once it's out).
I think the biggest pro would be...it'll be a lot cheaper than the Xoom. Aside from a better screen, camera, and form factor...the gtablet should be up to par with the Xoom.
I'm pretty sure that the Gtablet will get honeycomb so it should keep the device fresh. I think it'll last you til next Xmas but I'm sure temptations to ditch the gtab will be abundant next year.
Yea the price-point for the xoom, I'm guessing, will be on par with the Galaxy Tab, if not slightly more, which would put it out of my price range.
Hows the display on the Gtablet? I've heard mixed reviews.. but I'd expect alot of viewsonic.. pics would be great if anyone has any.
Sent from my Evo 4G running AvaFroyo w/ MakMod using TapaTalk Pro
.mak said:
Yea the price-point for the xoom, I'm guessing, will be on par with the Galaxy Tab, if not slightly more, which would put it out of my price range.
Hows the display on the Gtablet? I've heard mixed reviews.. but I'd expect alot of viewsonic.. pics would be great if anyone has any.
Sent from my Evo 4G running AvaFroyo w/ MakMod using TapaTalk Pro
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The screen isn't so great on the gtablet, but if you are mostly using it from straight on it isn't a problem.
As for the Xoom, I think I'm going to be looking at other tablets. Viewsonic is supposed to release a newer tegra 2 tablet at the end of the first quarter, which looks design-wise more like the Xoom.
I would maybe, maybe get another motorolla phone to replace my droid x because it is something I rely on and don't modify it that much. However, I would never buy a locked down motorolla tablet. And worse yet, I've heard the locking down is only going to get worse with them. It's too bad because they make nice hardware.
I agree. Locked down=deal breaker. If you want to go locked down why not go ipad?
The screen on the gtab is fine for my needs (but who wouldnt prefer "better").
The developer support for gtab seems top notch and it will get better by the month for at least six months to a year. With any thing too locked down what started out as better than a competiting device could easily be getting its a$$ handed to it by said device 4 months later.
I think with CES in the first week of this year you will have a number of announcements of tablets, where I expect shipments by mid-year. I for one don't want a tablet with a data plan and I believe the Motorola will ship with a cellular data modem which will drive higher cost, carrier ties, etc.
The Acer tablets look interesting, but from the pictures on the web it isn't clear if their displays are any better.
.mak said:
Alright, short and sweet;
I'm in the market for a Tablet - this will be my first, although I'm not new to smartphones/android - and I'd decided to get the G-Tablet.. until I read about the Motorola Xoom.
.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
vsc said:
I think with CES in the first week of this year you will have a number of announcements of tablets, where I expect shipments by mid-year. I for one don't want a tablet with a data plan and I believe the Motorola will ship with a cellular data modem which will drive higher cost, carrier ties, etc.
The Acer tablets look interesting, but from the pictures on the web it isn't clear if their displays are any better.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would have to agree, part of the reason why I went with a G-Tablet was because I don't want any type of cellular support. That's why I have a cell phone with hotspot capabilities.
After seeing what the folks here have been able to do with the tablet, especially after going Vegan, this thing is simply amazing. The fact that even Viewsonic even recognizes (in a roundabout way), on their own site, the work that is being done here is "icing on the cake" for me...
It depends if you want to wait or not. Point is the CES products will be MONTHS away and almost certainly more expensive. THEN you will have to wait for a dev community to acclimate and publish software for the product.
1. Gtablet is here NOW
2. Less than $400
3. Tegra 2 (like the best of those devices will have)
4. Dev community is producing NOW
5. Easy market hack NOW. No guarantee for future products.
6. Speaking of guarantees, do you think the products being shown at CES will be as root friendly?
Agree with what others have said already about Gtab. I used my Gtab 99.9% of the time in landscape mode so viewing angle wasn't a problem for me (though in portrait mode you need to tilt a little sideway but not much to get a good viewing angle).
If you are a hobbyist (which I think you are based on the # of projects you are currently working on) and like to tweak things then Gtab is definitely worth looking at. It is so hackable and unbrickable that it's a dev heaven for Android development. I have learned a lot by playing with different ROMs on the Gtab. Dev guys like Roebeet, Rothnic, Gojimi, Clemsyn, etc., have been keeping us busy around the clock with new builds/tricks/support that I probably will still play with it around Xmas 2011
If you are lucky you might be able to snatch a refurb Gtab from Sears outlet for $279. I got mine on sales at Sears for $349 last month brand new.
Cons:
No built-in kickstand (I modified an iPad kickstand from 5Below for $5; works perfectly though)
No perfectly fit screen protector yet (I modified an iPad screen protector to fit my Gtab screen)
No rear camera (I don't miss it but not sure about you)
No multi-finger touch (two fingers only on Gtab; not sure if it's s/w or h/w limitation but I don't find it to be an issue but would like to point it out)
No built-in GPS (but works with Bluetooth GPS to grab GPS data from your phone or other bluetooth GPS devices)
Does not support smooth playback of H.264 High Profile Encoded HD Video (you will have to convert to Main Profile before watching it on Gtab)
Hard-to-find case holder for Gtab (unlike iPad where tons of them are available)
Video Conferencing app support is still not yet widely available (only Yahoo Messenger seems to work so far but image quality is not great; others like Fring & Tango have failed on Gtab but I believe it's software on the app itself)
rothnic said:
The screen isn't so great on the gtablet, but if you are mostly using it from straight on it isn't a problem.
As for the Xoom, I think I'm going to be looking at other tablets. Viewsonic is supposed to release a newer tegra 2 tablet at the end of the first quarter, which looks design-wise more like the Xoom.
I would maybe, maybe get another motorolla phone to replace my droid x because it is something I rely on and don't modify it that much. However, I would never buy a locked down motorolla tablet. And worse yet, I've heard the locking down is only going to get worse with them. It's too bad because they make nice hardware.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The screen is my only concern at this point.. I guess GPS is an issue for me since I'd want to use this thing as a giant navigation unit on occasion, but I always have my Evo around so whatever I guess..
rushless said:
It depends if you want to wait or not. Point is the CES products will be MONTHS away and almost certainly more expensive. THEN you will have to wait for a dev community to acclimate and publish software for the product.
1. Gtablet is here NOW
2. Less than $400
3. Tegra 2 (like the best of those devices will have)
4. Dev community is producing NOW
5. Easy market hack NOW. No guarantee for future products.
6. Speaking of guarantees, do you think the products being shown at CES will be as root friendly?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
All very good points that I'd taken into account, but was hoping someone would point out to further my belief that the G-Tablet is a wise investment.
samepic said:
Agree with what others have said already about Gtab. I used my Gtab 99.9% of the time in landscape mode so viewing angle wasn't a problem for me (though in portrait mode you need to tilt a little sideway but not much to get a good viewing angle).
If you are a hobbyist (which I think you are based on the # of projects you are currently working on) and like to tweak things then Gtab is definitely worth looking at. It is so hackable and unbrickable that it's a dev heaven for Android development. I have learned a lot by playing with different ROMs on the Gtab. Dev guys like Roebeet, Rothnic, Gojimi, Clemsyn, etc., have been keeping us busy around the clock with new builds/tricks/support that I probably will still play with it around Xmas 2011
If you are lucky you might be able to snatch a refurb Gtab from Sears outlet for $279. I got mine on sales at Sears for $349 last month brand new.
Cons:
No built-in kickstand (I modified an iPad kickstand from 5Below for $5; works perfectly though)
No perfectly fit screen protector yet (I modified an iPad screen protector to fit my Gtab screen)
No rear camera (I don't miss it but not sure about you)
No multi-finger touch (two fingers only on Gtab; not sure if it's s/w or h/w limitation but I don't find it to be an issue but would like to point it out)
No built-in GPS (but works with Bluetooth GPS to grab GPS data from your phone or other bluetooth GPS devices)
Does not support smooth playback of H.264 High Profile Encoded HD Video (you will have to convert to Main Profile before watching it on Gtab)
Hard-to-find case holder for Gtab (unlike iPad where tons of them are available)
Video Conferencing app support is still not yet widely available (only Yahoo Messenger seems to work so far but image quality is not great; others like Fring & Tango have failed on Gtab but I believe it's software on the app itself)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Accessories, rear camera and multi-touch aren't a problem for me.. two-finger zoom is all I use on my devices anyway. Video conferencing is important, but only to an extent.. No GPS is problematic, but I can bluetooth my Evo in.
None of these are deal-breakers but, in the end, without video chat, without gps, with jittery playback of h.264 video and poor display quality, I'm wondering what I'll use the G-Tablet for lol
I suppose I'd be using this for media playback around the house and while traveling, same with web browsing (with Flash, and I'll tether to my Evo when away from home), Netflix when it becomes available (I'm sure there'll be a hack for that) and Google Maps.. does it support v5 Maps with 3d buildings??
As for the iPad comment earlier in the thread; I thought about it, but I like widgets and expansion way too much to go with the iPad.
samepic said:
Agree with what others have said already about Gtab. I used my Gtab 99.9% of the time in landscape mode so viewing angle wasn't a problem for me (though in portrait mode you need to tilt a little sideway but not much to get a good viewing angle).
If you are a hobbyist (which I think you are based on the # of projects you are currently working on) and like to tweak things then Gtab is definitely worth looking at. It is so hackable and unbrickable that it's a dev heaven for Android development. I have learned a lot by playing with different ROMs on the Gtab. Dev guys like Roebeet, Rothnic, Gojimi, Clemsyn, etc., have been keeping us busy around the clock with new builds/tricks/support that I probably will still play with it around Xmas 2011
If you are lucky you might be able to snatch a refurb Gtab from Sears outlet for $279. I got mine on sales at Sears for $349 last month brand new.
Cons:
No built-in kickstand (I modified an iPad kickstand from 5Below for $5; works perfectly though)
No perfectly fit screen protector yet (I modified an iPad screen protector to fit my Gtab screen)
No rear camera (I don't miss it but not sure about you)
No multi-finger touch (two fingers only on Gtab; not sure if it's s/w or h/w limitation but I don't find it to be an issue but would like to point it out)
No built-in GPS (but works with Bluetooth GPS to grab GPS data from your phone or other bluetooth GPS devices)
Does not support smooth playback of H.264 High Profile Encoded HD Video (you will have to convert to Main Profile before watching it on Gtab)
Hard-to-find case holder for Gtab (unlike iPad where tons of them are available)
Video Conferencing app support is still not yet widely available (only Yahoo Messenger seems to work so far but image quality is not great; others like Fring & Tango have failed on Gtab but I believe it's software on the app itself)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
kindle dx cases fit the gtab nicely
Gentlemen:
Lots of good thoughts and ideas -- but I have one that hasn't been mentioned.
Simply put, I'm not rich but if something really better comes out I'll go buy one!!!
I bought two G-Tabs for the fun of playing on the bleeding edge and for personal use. I already have more than justified what I spent with what I have done already!!! I'm even. And I still have a lot more playing to do.
I have accepted the fact that Viewsonic accomplished what they intended in getting a tablet with good hardware and "open" software on the market early. Did they miss the mark on the software -- we may never know except for what we have found in using the tablet.
But they have responded and the devs have catered to us and so far as I can see it we all are having a blast.
I saw a report that an estimated 80 tablet devices will be announced at CES!!!
Got to be something worth playing with in there. But most them are months away. When they are really available we'll see.....
For now, here's to a Happy New Year and lots of fun until it's time to do it again!!!!
Rev
I had mine for almost two weeks and just returned mine to Office Depot. Some of my reasoning is that while it's fast, it feels cheap and the display quality just kills me. Also the Samsung Galaxy Tab just dropped to $500 with no contract from Verizon. CES is just around the corner and I have a feeling that there's going to be a slew of tablets from different vendors. Best buy already has 3 different android tablets in the store since the Fall.
I did enjoy the aspect of it being easy to flash and VEGAn is great, but the lack of being able to run Google Location Services and VOIP kinda also killed it for me. Then the few reports of the power port being knocked loose, made me decide to return it.
After days of researching and some great replies here, I'm positive I'm going to hold off for CES to pass and see what's being offered.
I've decided I need GPS built-in and a better display, and an aluminum body wouldn't hurt either! (but it's unlikely..).
I may grab an iPad used and lowball someone, just to hold me over until CES passes and the new tablets hit stores.. by then Netflix may have the Android app out, and I'll have had a few solid months using it on the iPad.
If I get an iPad for now, I'll also grab the Desktop Connect software so can mess with my laptop through the ipad.
This should hold me over for now, thanks guys!
I just wanted to add my 0.02 for anyone else contemplating the gTab. My wife and I got an iPad this weekend from my Mom for christmas, and since we weren't really looking for a tablet, I hate itunes, I already have a droid x, and I didn't like that she spent so much money, we decided to return the ipad and get an android tablet. Since I only had a day to figure out what we wanted - if anything- I did some frantic searches on the droid x which lead me here. I read about all the issues, the ROMs, and the hardware and decided for the money the Gtab was the way to go. I also thought the screen wouldn't bother me much.
First experience with the Gtab is like everyone else's. Its total crap from the oem. I was reluctant to even let my wife touch it before I modded it. Lucky she doesn't have very high expectations, but she kept asking why everything kept "Force closing" lol.
This is my first time rooting any android device (I've rooted a few linksys routers though) but it was super easy (once I realized the + vol button was the OTHER one). My Gtab is now running VEGAn beta 5 and so far is fantastic. It runs better than my droid x and the only bummer is the missing market stuff. Seems anything GPS related is missing and I'm sure other stuff. I have the droid x paired with the Gtab for GPS and I was hoping the GTab could be my new Giant plotter in my boat but I couldn't find my Navionics software in the market to install. Will have to look into finding a way to install it.
But the real biggest let down surprised me. The screen. I thought it wouldn't matter much to me, but 99% of the time I find myself laying it flat on a desk or my lap in landscape mode and that is the worst possible viewing angle for this device. Quite annoying, but I would still buy (I guess I should say "trade an iPad for") the Gtab again.
The main use will be office productivity for my wife at home/travelling and email/facebook stuff also. I expect it to work well for that.
I was at Best Buy today and almost bit the bullet on an iPad 16GB WiFi, but decided to head to sears and see the G-Tablet on display.. turned out the genius working the counter mistook the cardboard cutout for a real G-Tablet! LOL
Anyway, I decided, regardless of the horrid return policy (30 days, 15% restocking fee unless defective) that I'd take a gTab home with me and give it a shot.
I'm liking it so far, the screen is horrible but I'll adjust. Clockworkmod install was very straightforward, as was installing zPad 3.0 and getting some apps installed (all expected..).
Only time will tell if I regret my purchase.. but if I can get hulu working and some sort of a remote desktop / vnc to control my laptop without loads of lag, I'll be a happy camper.
While I'm on the subject, is there an app similar to AirStream for the iPad? It's VERY fluid and works almost as if you're using Windows (or OSX) from the iPad.. PhoneMyPC is laggy and choppy, LogMeIn is as well.. any others I might try?
The iPad is awful, except the screen
I actually bought an iPad at Worst Buy last week - I just had to test it out. The screen is really very nice and comic viewing is PERFECT on it.
However.....
- No Flash (knew that going in)
- No USB (knew that going in)
- One speaker. That one I didn't expect.
- Mediocre video support. You have to buy an app to get XVID support, and it didn't even work 100% of the time. The GTab might choke on high profile x264's, but it shines on XVID's.
- Mediocre audio support. No WMA, no Vorbis, no FLAC. Nuff said.
- SMB access requires a paid app, and even so it only supported native extensions.
- No drag and drop, and the sharing feature is spotty at best. I would push over a CBR file to Stanza, and 50% of the time the transfer would flat out fail. And I was doing this on a Mac.
The last bullet was the one that "broke the camel's back". I can dump all my CBR's on a NAS device and read them on the GTab (with VEGan b5.1) with no problem. On an iPad, it's a chore to just add a handful of comics. Basically, the device was not designed for me, it was designed for someone who stays within Apple's walled garden and is willing to pay pay pay for all their content (even if they already own it, but it's not supported).
roebeet said:
I actually bought an iPad at Worst Buy last week - I just had to test it out. The screen is really very nice and comic viewing is PERFECT on it.
However.....
- No Flash (knew that going in)
- No USB (knew that going in)
- One speaker. That one I didn't expect.
- Mediocre video support. You have to buy an app to get XVID support, and it didn't even work 100% of the time. The GTab might choke on high profile x264's, but it shines on XVID's.
- Mediocre audio support. No WMA, no Vorbis, no FLAC. Nuff said.
- SMB access requires a paid app, and even so it only supported native extensions.
- No drag and drop, and the sharing feature is spotty at best. I would push over a CBR file to Stanza, and 50% of the time the transfer would flat out fail. And I was doing this on a Mac.
The last bullet was the one that "broke the camel's back". I can dump all my CBR's on a NAS device and read them on the GTab (with VEGan b5.1) with no problem. On an iPad, it's a chore to just add a handful of comics. Basically, the device was not designed for me, it was designed for someone who stays within Apple's walled garden and is willing to pay pay pay for all their content (even if they already own it, but it's not supported).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yep. It's why I never even bothered to look at an iPad when they came out even though I had wanted a tablet ala Newton Messagepad 2100 for YEARS!
h.264 HP: I still think that it's just a driver problem, and all Tegra 2s currently have the same problem. nVidia is still claiming full h.264 and I doubt that they'd continue on with that if the hw wasn't capable... so it's a wait for nVidia to fix thing, or admit that they have a hw bug that they can't workaround w/sw...
My only thing with the gTab was that I wished that the camera was higher res... it's not really extra horrible, but it's not awesome either... just kind of meh...
Still using my gTab mainly for web browsing, occasional video, and I have used it to read in portrait mode before in the past although in that function it's been retired since I picked up a NC last week... but I can see situations where I might revert to it if the NC battery is almost dead and I need something backlit to read on... that said in portrait orientation as a reader it just wasn't comfortable to hold to begin with... NC much better for that...
NC screen: yeah better viewing angles, but turns out not to be very selling to me. OTOH the pixel density is VERY nice, unfortunately B&N QA sucks. (My first NC had a defective USB port, and I had a b!tch of a time getting the yahoos in the store to exchange it, so they have a sh!tty cs experience as well... as in if anything goes defective on #2 in the next week it's going back for cash because of their horrid cs.)
Just for what it's worth, take a look at last year's CES and the one before it and see how many products seen there actually hit the market, and of the ones that did, how many were there that actually made it out in the first 2 quarters?
Any tablet at CES that magically passes those 2 barriers will be so proud of itself, it's going to slap a pricetag of $700+ on itself. History repeats itself, CES is all hype specifically to try and rally you into thinking $700 is a great deal.
I would strongly suggest the $350 gtab for this reason hands down, besides, the $700 one if it even does materialize before Q3, will be sporting an approximation of the hardware of the gtab so we will get all their softwares anyway..
See I don't know about that. I think that carriers and manufacturers learned from the massively overpriced galaxy tab. Over $500 is asking a lot of the average consumer, and my guess would be that a majority off these will be around or below that price. For example the notion ink with the lcd is sub 500, and there are plenty more coming out half as nice looking.
Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using XDA App
I am in the market to buy a new tablet but I have been looking between archos and a viewsonic. I want to stick with a 10 inch screen but I would like to get the most bang for my buck right now my spending limit about 400 dollars.
I am aware that the g tablet has a nvidia dual core processor which is fairly appealing. However I wanted to get some input from people that have had hands on experience with those tablets. Are there any new tablets I should hold out for or what would you people suggest thank you for your help.
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App
I own both and will probably sell one of them. I'm still deciding, but leaning in favor of the Gtablet. I plan to post a full comparison on my blog (http://www.blendblog.net) where I reviewed the Archos 101 already.
A quick summary though is as follows:
GTablet performs much better. I've not had to worry about memory whereas on the Archos I've often had to manually kill apps to get the device to stay responsive.
The Gtablet is built better. The screen is slightly better, viewing angles are bad on both but the Archos screen feels like you are tapping on cheap plastic wheras the Gtablet feels like solid glass. The tradeoff is that the Gtablet is MUCH heavier, and bigger.
Both of them have very good speakers.
The fiddle factor with the Gtablet is much higher, but if you are here you probably know that. You must root and rom the device, although that is not a tough thing to do. However, I have spent countless hours with mine trying to get it to wake from sleep correctly, an issue many have. I finally figured out a workaround that fixes the issue at the expense of battery life. It seems that some units just have issues waking from sleep, I may still exchange mine because of this.
Build consistency seems to be a bit sketchy on both fronts. The aforementioned sleep issue has bitten me on the GTablet and my Archos has been RMA'd (their support was excellent though) due to a huge stuck blue pixel in the display that was horrible looking.
Archos has one big leg up on the Gtablet and that's video support. It will play anything I throw at it (I did have to buy a $15 AC3/MPEG2 codec package though). The stock video player is much sleeker as well integrating movie descriptions etc. With the Gtablet you are left with the usual hodgepodge of Android video players that don't work with everything etc.
Google was somewhat right in saying Android wasn't ready for "primetime" but I have to say, I find these devices very fun to play with and use on a day to day basis.
I am definitely leaning towards keeping the Gtablet and selling the Archos when I get it back from RMA. The speed advantage of Gtablet is noticeable and with this excellent hacking community in place I feel like there is a much better chance of it being relevant (Honeycomb?) going forward than with the Archos.
I hope this helps!
Sean
Grabbing VitalPlayer pretty much cleared up the problem of the G-Tab not supporting MPEG-2 or AC3, and it's free. YMMV.
VitalPlayer on Appbrain
Where are the codecs for g tablet to match Archos ???
This lack is confusing given the fact that we know tetra 2 is superior. It would seem that xoom will support many popular video codecs when it comes out in Feb!
Archos vs
I own both tablets, and can say without reservation that the G tablet is superior in many ways. It is a much more solid build ( although about 8 oz heavier)
The G tablet is much faster with the Custom Roms. I have had a number of Archos devices, and have been pleased with them, but after owning the G tablet, with its open nature and ability to modify, I will never opt for such a closed off device like the Archos again. Don't get me wrong- it is a good device, but it lacks the potential of the G tablet.
I have the gtablet running Vegan 5
I have no problems playing videos at all using vplayer, rock player and even es explorer has a pretty good player. I played with 101 archos not bad but looks cheap next to the g tab, also as a long time fan of NVIDIA I knew it was going to fast!
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
I haven't used the Archos, but I was in your exact position a little over a month ago, ultimately I choose to check out the G-Tab because I could pick one up locally and return it in 30 days if I didn't like it. I have to say that at first I wasn't pleased with it overall, but that changed as soon as I started flashing some of the amazing ROMs available here on XDA. I'm not new to flashing my devices, but even if this had been a first time experience for me I doubt I'd have had any problems. Follow steps carefully and you can't go wrong, if you have a question it's most likely already been asked by someone before you, so just search the forums and you'll find the answer quick enough. Long story short the G-Tab would be a real dog of a product if it weren't for this amazing community of developers, but because of them I think it's got a future, a fairly bright one at that. I love my G-Tab more and more everyday, and as of now I do not regret purchasing it.
snipestech said:
I have the gtablet running Vegan 5
I have no problems playing videos at all using vplayer, rock player and even es explorer has a pretty good player. I played with 101 archos not bad but looks cheap next to the g tab, also as a long time fan of NVIDIA I knew it was going to fast!
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Mine's running the same configuration. Do you have anything with audio encoded in AC-3 Dolby Digital? I ripped all my DVD's to my media server using h.264 for video but leaving the original surround sound audio in place. On the Archos I could play those files with the $15 MPEG2/AC-3 plug-in. I have not been able to find a video player yet that does this for my Gtablet (tried ES and Rock amongst others) but I haven't tried the VitalPlayer that theindependent recommended. I'll post back when I get a chance to try that player, it may solve this issue somewhat.
Sean
Same here... Once I did a little more research I found that the Archos 101 had the exact same viewing angle issues with a crappier plastic feeling screen. When you couple that with 256 meg ram and Single Core design it was a simple decision for me.. I figured if I couldnt have an iPAD equivilant screen then I would go with what is future proof. The only real option is the 7inch which every states viewing angles are good - but was still concerned with the future use of the hardware and resale value (at that time). Dual core Tegra's in about 6 - 12 months will hold their value significantly higher than a 256 meg / single core device. By then I see better screens coming out and will upgrade then.
Till then... Im loving the decision - I also agree I was very upset the first few hours until I got the custom rom, kernel, launcher and other apps all up and running..
geoffreywolter said:
I haven't used the Archos, but I was in your exact position a little over a month ago, ultimately I choose to check out the G-Tab because I could pick one up locally and return it in 30 days if I didn't like it. I have to say that at first I wasn't pleased with it overall, but that changed as soon as I started flashing some of the amazing ROMs available here on XDA. I'm not new to flashing my devices, but even if this had been a first time experience for me I doubt I'd have had any problems. Follow steps carefully and you can't go wrong, if you have a question it's most likely already been asked by someone before you, so just search the forums and you'll find the answer quick enough. Long story short the G-Tab would be a real dog of a product if it weren't for this amazing community of developers, but because of them I think it's got a future, a fairly bright one at that. I love my G-Tab more and more everyday, and as of now I do not regret purchasing it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
stiphy said:
I own both and will probably sell one of them. I'm still deciding, but leaning in favor of the Gtablet. I plan to post a full comparison on my blog (http://www.blendblog.net) where I reviewed the Archos 101 already.
A quick summary though is as follows:
GTablet performs much better. I've not had to worry about memory whereas on the Archos I've often had to manually kill apps to get the device to stay responsive.
The Gtablet is built better. The screen is slightly better, viewing angles are bad on both but the Archos screen feels like you are tapping on cheap plastic wheras the Gtablet feels like solid glass. The tradeoff is that the Gtablet is MUCH heavier, and bigger.
Both of them have very good speakers.
The fiddle factor with the Gtablet is much higher, but if you are here you probably know that. You must root and rom the device, although that is not a tough thing to do. However, I have spent countless hours with mine trying to get it to wake from sleep correctly, an issue many have. I finally figured out a workaround that fixes the issue at the expense of battery life. It seems that some units just have issues waking from sleep, I may still exchange mine because of this.
Build consistency seems to be a bit sketchy on both fronts. The aforementioned sleep issue has bitten me on the GTablet and my Archos has been RMA'd (their support was excellent though) due to a huge stuck blue pixel in the display that was horrible looking.
Archos has one big leg up on the Gtablet and that's video support. It will play anything I throw at it (I did have to buy a $15 AC3/MPEG2 codec package though). The stock video player is much sleeker as well integrating movie descriptions etc. With the Gtablet you are left with the usual hodgepodge of Android video players that don't work with everything etc.
Google was somewhat right in saying Android wasn't ready for "primetime" but I have to say, I find these devices very fun to play with and use on a day to day basis.
I am definitely leaning towards keeping the Gtablet and selling the Archos when I get it back from RMA. The speed advantage of Gtablet is noticeable and with this excellent hacking community in place I feel like there is a much better chance of it being relevant (Honeycomb?) going forward than with the Archos.
I hope this helps!
Sean
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Great summary! I expect video support to get a lot better once Nvidia finally releases final drivers. Kind of have too, with all the T2's coming out soon.
In a nutshell, if higher def video is not 90% of the reason you are getting a tablet, the Gtablet is a FAR better choice than the Archos 101. Also, the Archos 101 has a few glaring problems besides a much slower chipset:
1. 230mb of device app space. Gtablet has eight times more space
2. 256mb ram (contant performance battle unless just using for video)
Have both Archos is light and thin, a little bit flimsy, but is a great pmp/ereader especially when on the road. Gtablet is a beast though runs circles around the Archos in regard to performance and flexibility. As a long time Archos supporter I think this my last device from them.
I just installed VitalPlayer from the market, thanks theindependent for the pointer.
It does play AC-3 so my ripped DVD's are fine. I have a 720p video though and it can't keep up, it stutters. The Archos 101 played it just fine.
Hopefully as rushless said, there will be updates to the driver so that hardware acceleration for hidef video can be added.
There are 2 other features the GTablet are missing that I forgot about:
1) No mini-hdmi output port, instead it has a docking station port. I would get more use out of mini-hdmi although the UI on the Archos is very bad when plugged into a monitor as I menitioned in the review on my blog.
2) The kickstand, while somewhat cheesy, is a nice feature on the Archos device.
One plus for the Gtablet (for me at least) is it uses the more standard mini-usb type plug instead of the micro usb plug of the archos. Most of my other devices are miniusb so I prefer this.
I think to sum things up I'd say that if you want a video player and e-reader that can do a nice amount of computer like things I'd go Archos. If you want a computer that is an ok e-reader (just a bit heavier) and can do some video go Gtablet!
Sean
I was seriously considering the 101 until I found this device. I think so far (only 1 day) it is a win.
As far as kick stand I am using a Garmin GPS suction mount for a windscreen on the back it works well.
Stuggy said:
I was seriously considering the 101 until I found this device. I think so far (only 1 day) it is a win.
As far as kick stand I am using a Garmin GPS suction mount for a windscreen on the back it works well.
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Can you show some pictures of that? I have a Garmin Widescreen GPS, I ould like to see how you have it setup with the g-tablet.
Sm0k3d 0uT said:
Can you show some pictures of that? I have a Garmin Widescreen GPS, I ould like to see how you have it setup with the g-tablet.
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When I get home I'll do it. It is basically the mount on the back of the g-tab (choose a location to determine tilt) and then the ball rests on the surface of desk or you can hold it using that.
How were you able to get Vplayer to run?
I've been able to install fine but when I run it I am unable to open any videos, same from a file explorer with the open with menu. Thanks!
snipestech said:
I have the gtablet running Vegan 5
I have no problems playing videos at all using vplayer, rock player and even es explorer has a pretty good player. I played with 101 archos not bad but looks cheap next to the g tab, also as a long time fan of NVIDIA I knew it was going to fast!
Sent from my PC36100 using XDA App
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You should also consider what you will want in the future their are many new tegra 2 powered devices coming out soon for a reason, the g tablet already has the same hardware but the developement is ahead of all other tablets on the market. I have the g tablet and wouldn't consider any other device thanks to the devs on the forum making it the best tablet available right now.
Sm0k3d 0uT said:
Can you show some pictures of that? I have a Garmin Widescreen GPS, I ould like to see how you have it setup with the g-tablet.
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I have some pictures here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=10099907&postcount=10
RojasTKD said:
I have some pictures here:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showpost.php?p=10099907&postcount=10
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Mine looks just like that - same suction mount. Sorry I didn't upload. And I think I got the idea from that post although I probably would have tried it in looking for a stand method.
I just got my Archos 101 back from RMA.
One thing I noticed that is a big plus for the Archos, at least in my setup is that when it is powered down it "sleeps properly." After 20 hours of sitting on my desk powered down it still has 95% battery life. My GTablet on the other hand won't wake up from sleep properly. You can follow the travails I and others are having on this thread: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=855821. If I leave my GTablet on for 20 hours it will be down to around 15% battery life. That's without my workaround to keep the CPU on when the screen is off that fixes the broken wake from sleep (but does slightly increase this battery drain).
Now maybe I have a defective unit, and I am contemplating returning it still. Can anyone else comment on what they see battery life wise with their GTablet when its sleeping. Preferably someone without the wake up problem my unit has. To test just charge it up, leave it "sleeping" overnight with the screen off and when you wake up the next morning report what the battery life is. The Archos only loses about 1% every 4 hours, the GTablet is losing 4% every hour!
FWIW, Archos support was awesome, I live in the US Virgin Islands and they at first tried to send it UPS which is "international" for us and a cluster to deal with. Because of this the UPS tag that was generated had it going to Pennsylvania (yes this is a common occurrence with UPS and the USVI). I called them immediately and they halted the shipment, then sent it to me USPS Express mail so I had it in 2 days! The replacement unit was in perfect shape.
Sean
So my GTab is on the truck out for delivery. I'm seriously considering returning upon arrival without even opening it. I know we are not suppose to talk about Honeycomb but I really doubt that this tab will ever get it. I am a ROM addict with my incredible and feel real comfortable with all that. But is the screen glare and lack of honeycomb enough to spend an extra 100-200 on another tablet. Think Asus or even Xoom.
What are your thoughts... Any insight will be greatly appreciated. I commute 75 minutes on a commuter rail every day to work. I use my device for movies, shows, reading and games.
Thanks all...
rmd0311 said:
So my GTab is on the truck out for delivery. I'm seriously considering returning upon arrival without even opening it. I know we are not suppose to talk about Honeycomb but I really doubt that this tab will ever get it. I am a ROM addict with my incredible and feel real comfortable with all that. But is the screen glare and lack of honeycomb enough to spend an extra 100-200 on another tablet. Think Asus or even Xoom.
What are your thoughts... Any insight will be greatly appreciated. I commute 75 minutes on a commuter rail every day to work. I use my device for movies, shows, reading and games.
Thanks all...
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Click to collapse
This tablet will do all of those admirably without Honeycomb. Battery life is amazing, Video support under Froyo based roms is good. Gingbread still needs drivers, but Software Decoding works in many cases, depending on the quality of your source etc.
Reading might be the only disappointing area. If you hold the Tab in portrait mode, that's where the viewing angles get to be a problem. Might bother you, might not.
Having said all of that, If I didn't have a G-Tab, I'd probably be buying an Asus Transformer (not a Xoom). But, since I have my G-tab, it's quite capable and I'll be keeping it.
I would keep it...
Most of the other tabs will not be out until June or later. I would wait and keep the gtab until the market and prices stabilize. The gtab is more than capable of doing what u want.
As far as I know, there has not been an Android tablet released yet that has not had its share of problems and disappointments. How long will it take until the Asus has all the fixes in place....or until there are custom ROMs for it (if ever)?
I wouldn't spend a premium on a device that has not been on the market long enough to know if it meets my needs.
The Gtab at under $300 is a steal as far as I am concerned. I've had mine for a month, running Vegan-Tab 5.1.1, happy as can be with it. Many people have posted about the poor viewing angle. I disagree....I actually like the viewing angle as I don't want everyone in the neighborhood to be able to see my screen anyway. I just haven't seen the issue....of course, each of us is different in that regard.
I'd buy the GTab all over again. I think it will meet/exceed my NEEDS for a loooong time to come. And when I am done with it, my grandkids will have a new toy!
Joe
If you think the screen will be an issue then send it back and wait for an IPS from ASUS. $400 and Honeycomb
Joeb2751 said:
As far as I know, there has not been an Android tablet released yet that has not had its share of problems and disappointments. How long will it take until the Asus has all the fixes in place....or until there are custom ROMs for it (if ever)?
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Yeah the Engadget review wasn't very good of the Asus tab. Not that I have a lot of faith for them to review it without some sort of bias but the videos did not show it off well. The OS seems really sluggish and the screen, while IPS has some serious glare on it. Seems to defeat a lot of value of IPS when you still have to hold the tablet at an angle to see the screen properly.
I probably won't buy a high-end tablet until late in the year to see the direction the manufacturers go.
rmd0311 said:
So my GTab is on the truck out for delivery. I'm seriously considering returning upon arrival without even opening it. I know we are not suppose to talk about Honeycomb but I really doubt that this tab will ever get it. I am a ROM addict with my incredible and feel real comfortable with all that. But is the screen glare and lack of honeycomb enough to spend an extra 100-200 on another tablet. Think Asus or even Xoom.
What are your thoughts... Any insight will be greatly appreciated. I commute 75 minutes on a commuter rail every day to work. I use my device for movies, shows, reading and games.
Thanks all...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I bought my g-tab from TigerDirect yesterday and was totally disappointed during my first 45mins with the machine when it was stock. The custom UI was probably put together by a gang of retarded midgets.
Then I installed Vegan 5.1.1 and my g-tab became the greatest steal of a buy in 2011.
For $280, you can't go wrong. With Calkulins Rom, Pershoots overclock kernal and Go Launcher this thing just fly's. It does everything you need it to do. Will I upgrade in a year or so, probably. By then the bugs should be worked out. This tab with Froyo runs great. Don't get caught up on Honeycomb, they all have their limitations.
If I was you I would hold out and keep my gtab because there are alot of tabs coming to the market you might favor one of those just keep your gtab in good condition because viewsonic has some strick return policy rules
Sent from my Dell Streak 7 using XDA Premium App
I have the urge to get the transformer or xoom as well, but I'm not giving up the gtab just yet. With the gtab, I can install different roms and play with stuff.
With transformer or xoom, I'm entirely at their mercy. There is no evidence that honeycomb on those devices are any more stable or smooth.
I do know gtab does everything I need....just not everything I want...(want gps!!)
Gtab doesn't do GPS?
californicatorz said:
I bought my g-tab from TigerDirect yesterday and was totally disappointed during my first 45mins with the machine when it was stock. The custom UI was probably put together by a gang of retarded midgets.
Then I installed Vegan 5.1.1 and my g-tab became the greatest steal of a buy in 2011.
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Eh? Did I miss the memo on short people being less intelligent?
Chiming in...
Here at work, Verizon dropped off a Xoom for me last week to demo. It's interesting, has a better screen, built in cell radio comes in handy, and a bit sexier - but definitely had it's shortcomings and definitely not worth the $300 premium in price.
Truth be told, it made me proud of my GTab (Vegan 5.1.1, pershoot's 1.4 kernal, and VTL launcher). I see nothing on the market that is worth upgrading to currently.
Love my tablet. Thinking of getting a second one for the Girlfriend. Running Vegan-tab ge rc1 and have it set up better than my computer in most instances. You can't expect this thing to replace all of your computer needs but it can come close. Sure it don't have gps built in but that is what we have phones for and if you need how just buy a Bluetooth one for about 40 or less bucks. It's a wonderful machine for the price you can't beat it.
Sent from my Desire HD using XDA Premium App
IMHO You'd be a fool not to wait for the EEE Asus Transformer. 400 bucks for a legit honeycomb tablet. another 150 for a legit laptop/notebook. Thats the way to go...
They took Honeycomb out of the oven too soon, they need to cook it for another few months before it becomes tasty. You'll see the shortcomings now that the affordable (or reasonably priced) tablets are arriving. It will take developers a few months of usage to make it better... I was going to get the Asus also but decided to wait until summer instead. Until then the G Tab with Froyo is all that is needed.
I have VegaN 5.1.1 and ADW Launcher on mine.
For reading, I like Aldiko because I like the two page, side-by-side presentation. I have also set up Aldiko as an Adobe DRM device, which means I can purchase books from Google/books then download and read them directly on the G-Tablet with no other steps in between.
Movies / Shows I prefer Rock Player. I haven't found any in my collections that don't play well with this setup.
Games; I have X-Plane 9, Leos RC Simulator, Angry Birds, Curling, Sudoku, ... No problems with any of them or many others.
I am so accustomed to the screen by now that I hardly notice the viewing angle difficulties any more. Sitting upright, like on a train, and holding the tablet is one of the best angles, so there is no problem there. The worst is probably laying the tablet flat on a desk in landscape mode. But if I turn mine upside-down, even that works very well.
I do have to keep my phone handy while not at home or in the office. Through the phone ( Samsung Galaxy S ), I can tether to 3G via Wifi and tether to GPS via BlueTooth.
I have no reason to need a more costly tablet right now. The G-Tablet does everything I want it to do.
Not sure what the return policy is but if it's 30 days, I would keep the gtab to at least try it. It's super easy to put it back to stock so that shouldn't be an issue.
I bought my gtablet back in November for $379. I recommended it at that price (at that time) so with the price dropping under $300, I think it's a great buy. IMO, it's the best 10 inch tablet for $300 and below. It's also a good "starter" tablet. It's a good tablet to see if you really want or need a tablet. The gtablet is not frustratingly slow so it's a good representation of an Android tablet's capabilities.
When holding the GTab in lanscape mode, the horizontal viewing angle is not too bad, the vertical viewing angle is terrible especially when watching dark video. For reading e-books, most likely you will be holding it in portrait mode, the viewing angle should not be an issue.
For $300, I don't regret buying the GTab and keeping it because I know there is a large and active community to support it.
I'm actually returning mine for the Acer. Taking a bit of a gamble that there will be good development on it, but for $150 difference, I thought that the better screen, newer software and hardware was a good move. I figured the support (both manufacturer and dev) of a new tablet would outlive the year-old gtab.
-J
Hey everyone! Looks like I'm finally gonna bite the bullet and buy a tablet next month. I'm looking at the following possibilities:
Asus Eee Pad Transformer
Acer Iconia A500
Motorola Xoom
iPad 2
Something else?
I'm in desperate need for some advice though. For reference, my primary uses for the tablet will be web browsing (over home wifi only), watching movies, playing games, GPS and map browsing, and developing 3D applications.
I'm a long time Java developer, so I'm thinking Android might be a nice way to go, but I'm willing to go iPad 2 if it's really a better device for my other uses.
Here's some things I'm curious about:
I've heard that Android tablets have some serious stuttering problems when playing H.264 movies. True?
Which of the manufacturers has a better track record for regular OS updates?
Do the Android tablets often have to reload pages that are already open in other tabs when going back and forth? (This drives me crazy on the iPad 2... along with the page loading delay when scrolling down long pages).
Does the same game released for iPad and Android Tablets run better on one over the other?
Any help/advice is greatly appreciated! Thanks!
I also confused if which one I should chose.
I took ipad2 and recommend i pad 2.
It is lightest and XGA resolution is very convinient to use.
Smart cover is also very useful.
Galaxy tab 10.1 and 8.9 also are lighter and look good but
ipad2 is still better with smart cover.
I would go fo the Xoom this is better than Ipad 2, but still a little expensive.
I have just returned from US and the rumor was that later this month you can bye the Xoom without 3G for apr. $600. Not bad.
I myself have an Toshiba Folio 100 and with the Dexter Foliomod Rom, this is faster than the Apple. Maybe buy a used one cheap.
I got to play with the EE transformer by Asus I would wait for that With the Detachable keyboard and 3.0 it works very nice and better price point than the xoom 600 bucks as soon as this is out ill have one
Do you have any experience with movies and videos on the Android tablets? Are they choppy/stutter like I've heard a few people complain about?
I've got the zoom and no problems with video whatsoever the new dual cores will really help in that regard, plus most high end new tablets have enough ram to do multiple things at once. I kinda wish i would've waited for the new galaxy tab though looks pretty sweet.
I would prefer the Asus Eee Pad Transformer
If you like iOS then get the iPad.
If you like android check out the viewsonic g-tab. Its very popular on these forums and nicely spec'd for its price.
Sent from my T-Mobile G2 using XDA App
Interesting... I hadn't actually heard of the Viewsonic g-tablet until now (only their Vpad). I'll have to look into that one a bit more.
Yeah, looks like the Viewsonic tablet is running Froyo. I think I want to stick with a 3.0 tablet.
The Asus Eee Pad Transformer is definitely looking the most likely right now (with the Acer Iconia A500 in a distant second). I have friends trying to push me towards the iPad 2, but I'm not terribly impressed with any particular aspect of iOS except for the available software. I much prefer the base functionality of Android.
My main concern with the Asus Transformer is that I'm worried it's more hype than what it'll actually deliver. I wish I could hold one in my hands and try it out first.
I had to choose between many android tablets and I chose the iconia a500, cause of the better price. The Asus has better screen though.
Video playback is very subjective. I'd recomend taking a sample vid to a store and testing.
Personally, I haven't found any Tegra2 based tab great for it.
I'd say look at Tegra3 based tabs.
No exp with Ipad2, but unless urgent I would hold at this point for Ipad3 release. Rumor has Ipad2 down at least $100 when that happens.
Neil
Hi all,
First let me say I want to stay away from the iPad. After getting royally burned with the 4.0 iOS upgrade on my iPhone 3G and now having to live with the degraded performance on it and lack of future support past 4.2, I doubt I'll ever buy another apple product. I was never one to drink their cool-aid anyway.
But now to the question at hand. What Tablet should I buy?
The main reason for the purchase is so I can watch videos without having to drag out my laptop. I don't want to have to convert the video to be able to play it. I just want to watch 350Mb/1.1Gb TV shows on it without having to worry about planning ahead of time.
Ideally, I would like GPS capabilities on it. 3G is not really required, I can tether it to my phone (i have a plan for that) or will be using it in areas where wifi is available.
I've been looking at a few tablets, namely the Motorolla Xoom and the Viewsonic Viewpad 10. The Xoom seemed like a nice enough device, especially with honeycomb, but it seems to have issues with HD video. The reason I picked the viewpad 10 was for Windows 7, but android 1.6 and the little disk space available left on it after windows installation makes me wonder how effective it will be as a tablet. Having windows 7 on a tablet would be amazing. I would love the flexibility it would afford on the tablet.
So does anybody have any suggestions?
Thanks for the help!
Do you want to have 7" or 10" ?
For watching Video it will be better with 10".
How about Galaxy Tab 10" ? It's honeycomb and very light.
I am running the Acer A500 right now and am very impressed. It got some poor reviews compared to the Asus Transformer in terms of the battery life and screen quality... I have been off the charger for almost 15 hours, watched an entire episode of Stargate: Universe (streaming btw), a few hours of web browsing casually, a few rounds of Let's Play Golf, and of course the good old forums and I am still at 40%. Pretty damn good I think. Tablet and Win7 really is a cumbersome ui and the battery life terrible there (I own one). Honeycomb has quite a few MINOR bugs to work out, but I am only considering the Asus if the screen is really a lot better. Just my opinion but ihth
Sent from my A500 using Tapatalk
*edit* *edit* *edit*
depends what you want to do with it, first 7 or 10 inch
If you say seven and don't mind messing around with a tablet and enjoy rooting and modding the nookcolor is nice and a lot of fun. that being said if you want working honeycomb out of the box look elsewhere. Also the nook tablet won't be as smooth as it's not a dual core or anything like that, but i still love mine.
If your TV rips are 24p (and most of them probaly are) then they will not play smoothly on the G-Slate at the moment.
Tegra-2 does not do advanced profile, so if your rips are from the net they will most likely not play well and require re-encoding. Tegra2 does not do 8x8 transforms, cabac or p-frames all of which are generally used in "scene rips."
jimmod said:
Do you want to have 7" or 10" ?
For watching Video it will be better with 10".
How about Galaxy Tab 10" ? It's honeycomb and very light.
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Post 1 of 10 for posting on dev thread
I'd have to agree with Skyfox99 on the newer Acer recommendation, or if you're ok with waiting a bit, the HTC Flyer looks pretty good too.
Sadly, the i-Devices have the fastest graphics processing at the moment, but soon there's going to be new chips released to top it again.
I did forget to mention it, but I was looking at 10" Tablets.
I was digging around a little after I posted this and did see the Acer A500 and the transformer. Both seemed to be great machines. I was actually aiming for the 16GB transformer. 16GB would be plenty and would only cost about 400$ plus tax and S&H, and I can always add a MicroSD.
I'm in Canada though, and it seems both the A500 and Transformer are either unavailable as of yet or back-order. But I'm willing to wait for those since the price seems to be right and so far I'm reading positive reviews.
I've read about the Tegra not being the best at doing video, another reason why I was looking at the viewpad 10 that has an atom cpu.
I dont mind putting down 300-400$ on a tablet, as long as it does what I want from it.
Thanks for all the answers so far!
wait for sony s1 and s2!
buy iPad 2
A friend of mine got the XOOM and he was happy with it for a couple of days. When it comes to productivity the Xoom doesn't really stand out. It's really just a enhanced version of a phone without the calls if you get the wifi only version. He returned it a week later for a refund and is getting a Ipad 2.
I think Samsung Galaxt Tab2 is a good choice.
I'd recommend WeTab with MeeGo
If I had the money: ipad 2 because of Netflix support.
But for affordability: Asus
Sent from my HTC Inspire 4G
XDA Developers Premium App
Palms new tablet looks pretty cool, but is only if you are rockin a pre 3 with it because of the touch to share innovation.
I agree with groe. The new Palm or should I say HP tablet looks pretty beastly, with the Pre3 along side it that is. Otherwise I'd say go iPad 2.
Persoanlly i wouldn't get any right now since they're all coming out with tegra 2. And as stated before, tegra doesn't do very well with high profile videos/real HD videos. But if I had to, I'd get the Asus transformer since I fancy the lappy dock. But we all know how "limited" in supply it is. =.=
Galaxy Tab
I would get the Asus with the tegra 3 cpu... yum!