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Porting Windows Mobile to Android

I was wondering if anyone has explored the possibility of porting Windows Mobile to the android devices.
I know that it's been done the other way.

gprimr1 said:
I was wondering if anyone has explored the possibility of porting Windows Mobile to the android devices.
I know that it's been done the other way.
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Though many have requested it, Windows Mobile has never been ported to any device it was not shipped on. Windows Mobile is extremely complex at the lower levels, consisting of many hardware dependant components which make up the most critical parts of the OS. In addition, it's closed source, so there's no way to modify the source like when Android/Linux is ported to a Windows-based device. In short, don't hold your breath for a release, it won't happen.

DaveTheTytnIIGuy said:
Though many have requested it, Windows Mobile has never been ported to any device it was not shipped on. Windows Mobile is extremely complex at the lower levels, consisting of many hardware dependant components which make up the most critical parts of the OS. In addition, it's closed source, so there's no way to modify the source like when Android/Linux is ported to a Windows-based device. In short, don't hold your breath for a release, it won't happen.
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If its immposible to port WM to Android device then is it possible to port Android ROM on windows Mobile based device..like we do on pc i.installing windows Vista after formatting old OS.

@ psolunke
Yes its possible to get Android running on a WinMo device, its been done with a number of phones.
Basically without Windows Mobile being open source, the chances of it going the other way are slim to none. Not to mention that the HD2 is the only WinMo device with a capactive display while nearly all Android devices have one, which would make it hard to get even that to work.

[Q] Qt on WP7: Possible but why not?

Qt apps work on WinCE. If WP7 is built on top of WinCE, why would Qt apps not be allowed on Win7?
I'm just trying to make sense of it here. Is it an artificial Microsoft restriction for their platform?

Because third-party apps are managed in .NET compact framework. Qt is a C++ framework and thus unmanaged. This is a smart move by MS as it increases system stability and enhances user experience.

leonard2010 said:
Because third-party apps are managed in .NET compact framework. Qt is a C++ framework and thus unmanaged. This is a smart move by MS as it increases system stability and enhances user experience.
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If that's the lame reason they give for it not being doable then I will just need to hack Qt onto it. Dumbest move in Nokia's history!

discourse said:
If that's the lame reason they give for it not being doable then I will just need to hack Qt onto it. Dumbest move in Nokia's history!
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givin that one of the main reasons that windows mobile 6 and for that matter windows desktop can be unstable is poor quality 3rd party programs i think the move was a very good one, forcing programers to stick to strict controls means they have to develop good software, also givin MS got most of the flak for these crap programs i think it was a good move on their part

at the cost of lower performance and code easily being stolen. MS don't care about developers. Hacking a silverlight app onto CE and calling it a new OS was a terrible shortcut and will cost them in the long run.

It's a matter of time until Microsoft releases a Native Development Kit. In a recent interview Brad Watson from Windows Phone 7 Development team said:
Brad Watson said:
8) What about native SDK? Android got theirs later, should we expect Microsoft to provide a native SDK also, or just forget about it ?
BLW – if by native SDK, you are asking will we allow anyone to run C or C++ unmanaged code on the device, the answer is “not now.” Our primary concern is ensuring that there is a fantastic customer experience on the phone. We recently announced that we have satisfaction rates for the phone at 93%. That’s amazing. We attribute at least some of that to the fact that customers can buy apps that they don’t have to worry will trash their phones, and they don’t have to worry because of the managed platform.
Over time we will certainly relax certain restrictions on the phone, but we cannot compromise the integrity of the phone experience or the marketplace experience.
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Microsoft has to release a NDK because the competition has a NDK. Hopefully the competition will have more and more NDK applications (Firefox, Skype) which would make them more appealing to the user.
When such a NDK will be present, Qt (at least lighthouse) will be ported to Windows Phone 7

indiekiduk said:
at the cost of lower performance and code easily being stolen. MS don't care about developers. Hacking a silverlight app onto CE and calling it a new OS was a terrible shortcut and will cost them in the long run.
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While I agree it's far from the entirely new OS we were promised I very much doubt it will cost them in the long run. They have provided a OS experience that is second to none, this is all because of the limitations they have put in place.
I would expect the platform to open up somewhat for the next wave of [higher-end] devices giving existing users an iOS-like experience where you can certainly upgrade to utilize multitasking and all that jazz but it will cost you some of the current smoothness of the UX.
The fact that .Net assemblies are easily decompiled into fully working Visual Studio projects hasn't been a huge problem on the desktop and as obfuscating tools become better and better I see no reason why it should lead to a problem on the mobile platform either. Looking thru some of the recent marketplace apps they are all but decipherable for the average developer. Also, as more and more processing moves to the cloud it becomes less and less of a problem - most startups are neither willing not capable of mirroring your closed-source/protected backend services.

The missing NDK is not the sole reason. The OS IS different. As others have pointed out, quite some GDI stuff is just not there, or doesn't do anything. So, Qt would probably just not start. And as there will never be (as MS said) (official) OpenGL drivers on WP7 you can't switch the backend.
And there has to be already some kind of NDK, as e.g. Navigon Select is a semi-native application and it is not created by OEMs.

Hades32 said:
The missing NDK is not the sole reason. The OS IS different. As others have pointed out, quite some GDI stuff is just not there, or doesn't do anything. So, Qt would probably just not start. And as there will never be (as MS said) (official) OpenGL drivers on WP7 you can't switch the backend.
And there has to be already some kind of NDK, as e.g. Navigon Select is a semi-native application and it is not created by OEMs.
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They say IE9 will have accelerated graphics support, which I presume is based on Direct3D. For WinPhone7 Qt needs a Direct3D backend, which should work on all WinPhone7 devices.
Qt should have the same capabilities of IE9, which AFAIK is not written in managed code.
Qt could also use Google's angleproject which should help in translating "OpenGL ES 2.0 API calls to DirectX 9 API calls".

Since this is a discussion thread, this is going in WP7 General.
~~Tito~~

It will simply not happen. It's that easy. (Not w/o homebrew that is)

By not allowing Qt on WP7, Microsoft and Nokia have just shot themselves in the foot. Instead of offering a smooth migration path for the millions of Nokia users and devs, they've basically alienated the entire community. WP7 is also losing out on thousands of high quality applications like Angry Birds for Symbian^3 and MeeGo that was developed using Nokia's Qt SDK. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mS1dwYmKMjs

discourse said:
If that's the lame reason they give for it not being doable then I will just need to hack Qt onto it. Dumbest move in Nokia's history!
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Good luck hacking Qt into it.
Using .NET also increases Security.
WP7 doens't need Qt, and Microsoft should do whatever it can to stop Nokia from putting Qt in WP7.
Those reasons aren't lame, unless you're missing the portion of you brain that controls logic.

discourse said:
By not allowing Qt on WP7, Microsoft and Nokia have just shot themselves in the foot. Instead of offering a smooth migration path for the millions of Nokia users and devs, they've basically alienated the entire community. WP7 is also losing out on thousands of high quality applications like Angry Birds for Symbian^3 and MeeGo that was developed using Nokia's Qt SDK. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mS1dwYmKMjs
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It's much easier to develop for WP7 than it is for Symbian/Qt. I don't think the developers will have much of an issue with it. They didn't shoot themselves in the foot, you people just AREN'T developers, and don't understand it.
You know you're talking to clueless people when Angry Birds is the epitome o fa high quality application to them.
Cause you cannot develop Angry Birds in XNA, and you seriously believe porting Angry Birds to WP7 will involve nothing other than a few code line changes and a recompilation?
Give me a break.
I wish Microsoft had partnered with SE or something. Nokia's fanbase are more bat**** crazy over these pet projects than the Android people.

Qt will continue to be the development framework for Symbian and Nokia will use Symbian for further devices; continuing to develop strategic applications in Qt for Symbian platform and encouraging application developers to do the same. With 200 million users worldwide and Nokia planning to sell around 150 million more Symbian devices, Symbian still offers unparalleled geographical scale for developers.
Extending the scope of Qt further will be our first MeeGo-related open source device, which we plan to ship later this year. Though our plans for MeeGo have been adapted in light of our planned partnership with Microsoft, that device will be compatible with applications developed within the Qt framework and so give Qt developers a further device to target.

[Q] How to create homebrew app with native code which run in emulator.

Hi Guys,
I would like to create simple app with NATIVE code which run in emulator.
It is not possible to use solution in http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1299134&highlight=developer+guide because it's use some ARM code.
Do you have any idea how make things work?
Thank you,
Ch.

You actually could (msotly) use that guide, but you would need to recompile the ARM portion for x86. My guess as to the best way to do this would be to use the "Platform Builder" for CE6 or CE7, instead of using the WinMo 6.5 platform as your target. WinMo only shipped on ARM devices, so far as I know, but the underlying OS, Windows CE, is very portable and the tools for it support building on a wide variety of architectures. WP7 is built on a version of CE somewhere between CE6 and CE7.
Otherwise, the stuff about using ATL, making a COM library, using ComBridge from the WP7 app, etc. all still applies.
That all said... why would you want to do this? Do you not have an actual phone to test on? Porting between ARM and x86 isn't *that* hard, but you shouldn't just assume that it'll work in all cases, so it makes a lot more sense, if you're building native code, to build and test for the same architecture you're planning to release on.
Additionally, the emulator may be missing some of the libraries that are present on the phone.

Thanks a lot. I will try it.
This is very beginning of my school project. I want only demonstrate that is possible to run some native code on WP7. Next phase of project will be on real device which I don't have right now..

Well, good luck, but I'd tend to say you're setting yourself up for a risk of failure. I don't know what it will take to use the CE Platform Builder for something like this; I have it installed but have never tried using it.
There may also be a way to compile for x86 using the WinMo build tools; I think some of the old "emulators" for WinMo were also x86 virtual machines (much like the WP7 emulator is). I never tried, though.

Risk of failure? I don't see how. The hardest part of this is finding a way to get his .exe on the emulator device and unlocking it. If he isn't using ARM ASM in his project, "porting" to x86 (or any other processor WinCE supports) should be trivial as long as a sufficiently complete SDK is available. The main issue with x86 on newer Pocket PC-like targets is that there are no Pocket PC SDKs targeting it newer than the Pocket PC 2003 one. If you want to use newer WM5 only features like GPSAPI, you'd probably need to use a CE 6.0 SDK instead.
If he doesn't want to do real time debugging, any of the Windows CE development tools or even 3rd party tools like Bloodshed DevC++, CE gcc/MinGW or FreePascal should all suffice. Windows CE is a very backward compatible OS so even an application targeting the CE 2.11 platform/SDK should still run on WP7 when you are careful to use supported APIs.
If you don't want to install Platform Builder and generate your own custom OS to base an SDK on, there are plenty of SDKs to choose from. Of course, some are worse than others. If you are using the CE 4.2 or 5.0 STANDARD_SDKs, you might become a bit frustrated when you realize they are missing many basic things like the Windows CE SIP APIs. (something that has been available for CE since 1.01 in 1997). But if you don't care about using the latest native CE kernel features and still want to use a newer IDE like VS2005/VS2008, the CE 5.0 STANDARD_SDK should be enough if you are careful. Though, I usually install things like eMbedded Visual C++ 3.0 and 4.0 along with all the Pocket PC and Handheld PC SDKs just in case I need a header or lib file that one or the other is missing.
The following MS SDKs can target x86:
-eVC3
Pocket PC 2002
Smartphone 2002
Handheld PC 2000
-eVC4
Pocket PC 2003
Smartphone 2003
STANDARDSDK_400
STANDARDSDK_401
STANDARDSDK_420
STANDARDSDK_500
-VS2005/2008
STANDARDSDK_500
Another useful x86 SDK I've found is the one for the Allegro CE/DOS Field PC:
http://www.junipersys.com/Juniper-Systems/support/Developers/Allegro-Field-PC/Allegro-CX
Here are some download links to many of the CE SDKs and compilers that were released over the years:
Here are some links to download some of the tools I've mentioned:
http://www.hpcfactor.com/developer/
http://www.microsoft.com/download/en/search.aspx?q=embedded visual tools
You will need SP4 for eMbedded Visual C++ 4.0 if you wish to use newer SDKs with it.
http://www.microsoft.com/download/en/search.aspx?q=pocket pc sdk

Ummm... maybe you missed the part where this is WP7 forum, and the OP is trying to run native code on the WP7 emulator... I can tell from your post that you're not terribly familiar with WP7 development, so here's a few salient points:
Compiling to a .exe is a waste of time. WP7 won't run foreign EXEs, at all, unless you make some pretty low-level changes that aren't possible on the emulator (see "full-unlock" custom ROMs). You have to write a managed app (which compiles to a DLL hosted inside a low-privilege EXE that's built into the system) and a COM library and use the InteropServices ComBridge API. So far we haven't even gotten P/Invoke to work.
WP7, especially Mango, uses a limited set of native APIs and the APIs have changed somewhat in the last decade or so. They aren't supposed to be available to third-party devs at all, so any backward compatibility is basically a convenient accident. Targeting Smartphone 2003 *might* work, but then, it might not. Even a number of WinMo 6.5 APIs aren't available or don't work.
Since it appears that the OP is just going for a demo project, he or she probably is a lot less interested in getting the most powerful APIs, and is probably hoping for something closer to invoking a MessageBox from native code.
All that said, however, it's true that there are WinCE SDKs which can build native x86 code. I'd tend to suggest using the CE6 or CE7 Platform Builders, since they're the most recent (WP7 is somewhere between the two), but there are other options. You probably want to follow the guide as much as possible, including things like using ATL, as it makes writing a COM library a lot easier and that's the best way we currently know for executing native code in WP7.

[Q] Mathstudio (Space Time) for Windows Phone 7

Hi everybody, I am an engineer and I think that windows phone is perfect for my needs..so fast and efficient, office integrated, easy to use and many other qualities..the only thing that I can't find for this OS is Mathstudio.
For those who don't know what's this, it's like having a graphic calculator always in your poket. This program doesn't make everything, of course, but many of the most common things can be done with mathstudio.
I was wondering if somebody could port this program from android/iOS to windows phone 7. Otherwise I must always go around with my mobile and with an ipod touch only for this program. I remember that the previous version of mathstudio (called spacetime) exsists for windows mobile 6.5, an other way could be a porting from windows mobile. I wrote to the official developer but he said he won't realse a windows phone 7 version of his program.
Thank you for listening

Porting WinMo apps is technically possible (though hard unless they were written initially in .NET). Making an unmodified WinMo app run on WP7 is very hard and usually requires a custom ROM to run it (the stock ROMs have very restrictive permissions policies that most WinMo apps can't work with). Porting iOS or Android apps pretty much requires re-writing them, which is an expense that some app authors don't find worth doing.
There are a number of graphing calculator apps available for WP7, and the built-in calculator works pretty well for non-graphing functions, but I can understand wanting access to a specific tool. Unfortunately, since I've never used the app you describe, I can't tell you how well any of the WP7 alternatives compare.

I've got an HD7 and I've made on my own an Y-cable to downgrade it, so now I use the DFT's Deepshining ROM..I didn't know it was even possible to run some old WM6 apps on WP7, such a grat news I'll try to find out more about it Can you give me a list of alternative graphic calculators for windws phone 7? I wasn't able to find anywhere Thank's a lot!!!

I just did a search on the Marketplace for "graphing calculator" and got a number of hits.
If you look at the Opera apps for WP7 custom ROMs, those are actually wrappers around the WinMo Opera apps - the wrappers just put the files in the right places and then launch EXEs.

Thank you so much for the help , I had a look on the marketplace and I found different graphic calculators (Graphing calculator, PoketPi, Eval Graph, Grapher Calculator), but none of them can replace mathstudio for the following reasons: they are only in 2D, they don't support the CAS (computer algebra system, the same present in Matlab), you can't write and save scripts or even one algorythm. I will find out more about wrapping for the moment, but I hope it will come a better solution

Unfortunately, MathStudio will never ported on WP7 platform (according to this: http://www.mathstudio.net/forums/discussion/164/platform-requests , check the last post)
The only hope is upcoming Apollo. WinRT (Win8 API) will have C++ compiler and (probably) will support native code, so MathStudio developers can (also - possible, it's not too easy) port their app to Win8.

Noob question

I'm a WP7 Noob so please keep the jokes down low. But is WP7 Open Source or Closed Source? Development wise!

Sorry, I also just realized this thread should be in the Q&A Section... :/

Closed source. Microsoft does not develop any open-source operating systems at all.

Okay thanks so much. I just had that random question and it kept gnawing at me

But wait, then how can we make Android roms that look and act like WP7?

That's nothing to do with the code, its just how the launcher and other parts of the ROM are designed to look like wp7
Sent from my Lumia 800 using XDA Windows Phone 7 App

Oh okay

Technically, Microsoft does actually make open-source operating systems (Singularity is open-source, for example, but it's a research OS, not intended for "real" use). Also, while WP7 is not open source, it's kernel and core libraries are somewhere between CE 6 and CE 7, and the source code for those is available (under a license that probably doesn't meet the OSI's definition of open source, since you have to pay a license fee to sell devices running anything you built from the code, but otherwise comes pretty close).
As for the Android skins, that's all they are - skins. They may look like WP7, but they don't actually act like it at all under the covers; they're still Dalvik and POSIX C/C++ running on the Android userspace running on the Linux kernel. With a UI as simple as WP7's, it's pretty easy to make something else that looks the same, although all the skins that I've seen do actually have small diferences.

Cuz I was running a rom on my phone and it emulated WP7. Like everything was themed