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Thank you for all of your hard work on the D2. With the X, the competition is stiff, and it seems/feels like there are more of us that "ended up" with a D2 out of a warranty replacement than actually made the decision to buy one.
With that said, I am formally starting a bandwagon for an actual "stock" Android OS ROM. None of this color changing, applications because i like them, better home screen, etc., etc., stuff. I want to see an "actual" Android vanilla ROM for the D2.
I can't be the minority in this request.
I appreciate all of the work that you guys do, I really do. If I had the time to invest in this, I'd build the damn thing myself, but I dont, so I have to rely on you guys.
Thanks.
I'm on the bandwagon.
I believe doing this would require cracking m-shield/efuse in order to get a custom kernel in place, which to my knowledge hasn't been done, nor am I even sure if anyone is actively working on it.
psionicalpha said:
I believe doing this would require cracking m-shield/efuse in order to get a custom kernel in place, which to my knowledge hasn't been done, nor am I even sure if anyone is actively working on it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i'm not asking for a kernel. i'm asking the ROM developers to go stock with their approach as opposed to customizing. That's why i used quotes on "OS". I want a clean ROM that reflects as much as the actual Android OS as possible.
640k said:
i'm not asking for a kernel. i'm asking the ROM developers to go stock with their approach as opposed to customizing. That's why i used quotes on "OS". I want a clean ROM that reflects as much as the actual Android OS as possible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you root your device you can clean out the stock rom yourself. Follow the remove bloatware guide. Once you clean it out you can install launcherpro which IMO is the best home replacement out there. I believe it will be some time before there is a vanilla rom for the d2. We will always need the dialer and a few other apps that are tied into other blur apps.
MotoBoy said:
If you root your device you can clean out the stock rom yourself. Follow the remove bloatware guide. Once you clean it out you can install launcherpro which IMO is the best home replacement out there. I believe it will be some time before there is a vanilla rom for the d2. We will always need the dialer and a few other apps that are tied into other blur apps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
removing "bloat" doesn't cut it for me. i'm already running launcherpro without root and it gets me by. the ROM devs are working hard to bring things back to normal and they're doing a good job. i just don't want to have to pick between a broken phone icon and a black notification bar.
i'm not asking for miracles. i recognize that most of blur is limiting this activity. that's why i'm asking for just a clean ROM. as apks become available and more of blur can be replaced, the ROM will get better.
640k said:
i'm not asking for a kernel. i'm asking the ROM developers to go stock with their approach as opposed to customizing. That's why i used quotes on "OS". I want a clean ROM that reflects as much as the actual Android OS as possible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It is harder than you think. Moto modified many services that build with dependencies on the kernel. If we had access to Motos kernel source, then we could just build the vanilla rom directly with google source and be done. Since this is not currently an option, you need to have services that happen to be compatible with the kernal and Motos current structure which is also difficult. Its easy for simple apps that can be switched out like mail and such. But not everything is that easy to swap out. Pull and replace some services on your phone and your phone won't start, because an alternative will not work because the blur service is expressly called, or expected to function in a very "Moto way".
I don't think people are avoiding the stock approach because they don't want stock, I think it hasn't happened (yet) because Moto has made it difficult. Right now its like a Jenga tower. We keep pulling blocks to see which one won't cause the tower to fall. Pull the wrong one...oops we won't pull that one next time. If we could rebuild it from scratch, it would be much easier, because you could build it in the image you wanted opposed to doing surgery to mimic what you want.
facelessuser said:
It is harder than you think. Moto modified many services that build with dependencies on the kernel. If we had access to Motos kernel source, then we could just build the vanilla rom directly with google source and be done. Since this is not currently an option, you need to have services that happen to be compatible with the kernal and Motos current structure which is also difficult. Its easy for simple apps that can be switched out like mail and such. But not everything is that easy to swap out. Pull and replace some services on your phone and your phone won't start, because an alternative will not work because the blur service is expressly called, or expected to function in a very "Moto way".
I don't think people are avoiding the stock approach because they don't want stock, I think it hasn't happened (yet) because Moto has made it difficult. Right now its like a Jenga tower. We keep pulling blocks to see which one won't cause the tower to fall. Pull the wrong one...oops we won't pull that one next time. If we could rebuild it from scratch, it would be much easier, because you could build it in the image you wanted opposed to doing surgery to mimic what you want.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
this i get, and recognize. but if you read through current ROMs (all two of them), there ARE tweaks that i just don't want/agree with.
i dealt with this alot with WinMo and i've avoided putting ANY ROM on my D1. blur is so terrible, all i want is my D1 one back.. but in my D2's body.
I think these ROM developers simply have no choice but to do the tweaks they've done because Moto services can't just be taken out, they have to be replaced instead of the original so the phone would still work.
We just have to wait, time solves everything, even Moto
facelessuser said:
It is harder than you think. Moto modified many services that build with dependencies on the kernel. If we had access to Motos kernel source, then we could just build the vanilla rom directly with google source and be done. Since this is not currently an option, you need to have services that happen to be compatible with the kernal and Motos current structure which is also difficult. Its easy for simple apps that can be switched out like mail and such. But not everything is that easy to swap out. Pull and replace some services on your phone and your phone won't start, because an alternative will not work because the blur service is expressly called, or expected to function in a very "Moto way".
I don't think people are avoiding the stock approach because they don't want stock, I think it hasn't happened (yet) because Moto has made it difficult. Right now its like a Jenga tower. We keep pulling blocks to see which one won't cause the tower to fall. Pull the wrong one...oops we won't pull that one next time. If we could rebuild it from scratch, it would be much easier, because you could build it in the image you wanted opposed to doing surgery to mimic what you want.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
640k said:
this i get, and recognize. but if you read through current ROMs (all two of them), there ARE tweaks that i just don't want/agree with.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Apparently you don't get it. As stated, stock Android will require the kernel source, which we don't have.
As a former Ion and Nexus One owner who flashed probably a hundred ROMs, I can honestly say Froyo and root is enough to make me happy. Many of the tweaks custom ROMs offered are now built in (they came from AOSP to begin with) and the hardware has advanced to the point that swapper and overclocking aren't necessary. Frankly I'm not sure what more you could want that isn't possible without root and launcher replacements.
640k said:
this i get, and recognize. but if you read through current ROMs (all two of them), there ARE tweaks that i just don't want/agree with.
i dealt with this alot with WinMo and i've avoided putting ANY ROM on my D1. blur is so terrible, all i want is my D1 one back.. but in my D2's body.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am like you. On my D1 I only used OEM ROMs that I modifed myself. I did the same to my D2 and it runs just like my D1. Their are only two differences. Backup assistant services is still running in the backgroud and I still have the messaging app. I removed all blur widgets and all the bloatware I don't need. If I can get rid of the backup assistant I would be very close to plain ROM. Once you remove everything you can safely you are not too far away from a vanilla ROM.
karnovaran said:
Apparently you don't get it. As stated, stock Android will require the kernel source, which we don't have and likely never will.
As a former Ion and Nexus One owner who flashed probably a hundred ROMs, I can honestly say Froyo and root is enough to make me happy. Many of the tweaks custom ROMs offered are now built in (they came from AOSP to begin with) and the hardware has advanced to the point that swapper and overclocking aren't necessary. Frankly I'm not sure what more you could want that isn't possible without root and launcher replacements.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well said. This is not my first android phone either. I have also used Cyanogen and others. Root is more than enough for me.
Back in the day, the custom Roms were pushing us into new territories, giving us features we didn't already have; that was why I wanted them. Now I have everything I need with stock and root. There are so many replacement launchers, lockscreens, etc. Going vanilla is just icing on the the cake; if it ever happens at all.
All of blur's UI flaws and app quirks hardly bug me much at all; I can happily live with them if I have to. Overall, the Droid 2 is a great phone as it is ( with root of course ).
I think i might get my head bitten off for this but id be happy with a stock deoxed rom with the stupid bloat apps removed.
I've come to like the blur widgets and features, well except for the contacts sync issue with facebook.
jerseyh22accord said:
I think i might get my head bitten off for this but id be happy with a stock deoxed rom with the stupid bloat apps removed.
I've come to like the blur widgets and features, well except for the contacts sync issue with facebook.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you goto droidforums.net and in the Xeudoxus ROM section you will see the xultimate thread which is what you need to deodex a rom yourself. If you have the android sdk installed already it is not much work to do. Just follow the instructions and read through the thread for problems that may pop up.
karnovaran said:
Apparently you don't get it. As stated, stock Android will require the kernel source, which we don't have.
As a former Ion and Nexus One owner who flashed probably a hundred ROMs, I can honestly say Froyo and root is enough to make me happy. Many of the tweaks custom ROMs offered are now built in (they came from AOSP to begin with) and the hardware has advanced to the point that swapper and overclocking aren't necessary. Frankly I'm not sure what more you could want that isn't possible without root and launcher replacements.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
apparently you don't get it.
you're not reading what i'm asking. there are ROM devs out now, doing the work. they can debloat and use as many stock apps as possible (or as available). i'm not asking for miracles. i'm asking devs not to customize what they're doing.
i'm asking for standard looks, not black themes. i'm asking for stock apps, where possible. i'm asking for it to work.
don't come in here and thread crap because you don't understand what i'm saying/asking.
MotoBoy said:
If you goto droidforums.net and in the Xeudoxus ROM section you will see the xultimate thread which is what you need to deodex a rom yourself. If you have the android sdk installed already it is not much work to do. Just follow the instructions and read through the thread for problems that may pop up.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I know, i did it before i ran 928droid's theme and epic's rom to change the text to white in the notification bar. Lost it when i restored my nandroid of stock but i could do it again. Just saying if i flash a rom i want it deoxed
I am working on this. Please just wait.
Newbie here. I have rooted my D2, but I haven't yet installed a new ROM. Is there any way that I can use a D1 ROM in my D2?
Sent from my DROID2 using XDA App
640k said:
apparently you don't get it.
you're not reading what i'm asking. there are ROM devs out now, doing the work. they can debloat and use as many stock apps as possible (or as available). i'm not asking for miracles. i'm asking devs not to customize what they're doing.
i'm asking for standard looks, not black themes. i'm asking for stock apps, where possible. i'm asking for it to work.
don't come in here and thread crap because you don't understand what i'm saying/asking.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Maybe I (and others) misinterpreted, but you said stock and vanilla multiple times.
Sorry, but I just don't take well to people starting threads like this. Either do the work yourself, contact a developer directly to inquire about their intentions, or sit tight and wait. It's this kind of "gimme" attitude in forums that scares away talented people.
What the hell? Do it yourself. Are you really acting like this because you don't like black notification bars? If it upsets you so much, learn how to change it. Requests are fine. Acting indignant because you don't know what "I want a vanilla ROM" means is rude.
i have got a samsung omnia7 and was thinking about using the sammy rainbow custom rom, what are the pro's and cons doing this?
atm i have interop unlocked it but as i am still under warranty was curious of the effects.
advice would be grateful
It varies heavily ROM to ROM. However, there are a few common things.
Advantages:
More device control. With the policy system disabled, you can modify almost anything.
More homebrew apps, and more powerful ones (things like bazaar).
Native homebrew apps and ported WinMo apps.
Install XAPs directly (such as from IE), instead of using a PC.
If you find a bug, you can directly talk to the devs about fixing it (or possibly fix it yourself).
You may get updates before your carrier would provide them normally.
Disadvantages:
Higher risk of bugs since the ROMs get a lot less testing than official ones.
Updates may come later because you have to wait for a custom packaging of the update.
Not all custom ROMs are updatable; you might need to replace it with a new version which means you'll lose all your data.
Turning off the policy system increases your risk of malware if you arent' careful what you install.
Custom ROMs may have malware built in (not saying any of them do, but it's a risk).
Currently, I'd suggest waiting a little while to see where the Samsung ROM scene goes, what bugs are found and how quickly they're fixed, what features are available and how useful they are. However, it's pretty much always possible to go back to a stock ROM (unless you somehow really badly mess up your phone) so if you want to experiment or be an early adopter, go ahead. Otherwise, I think it'll be pretty clear what ROMs are good and where the custom ROM scene is going (support- and feature-wise) within a month or so.
so i would be safer to wait and see what the dev of the roms is going to do in the case of bugs.
thanks
That's my take. Note that I'm a dev working very hard on hacks that works with stock ROMs though - somebody who spends their time developing custom ROMs may well give completley different advice. There are certainly lots of advantages to going with custom ROMs, even at this relatively early point (it helps that a lot of the experience from HTC custom WP7 ROMs carries over to Samsung ROMs as well).
it seems as though the custom roms for omnia 7 are coming on leaps and bounds, what with MIRO's ROM http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1499102
there seems to be very little on the way of bugs with his atm so i think i will give that one a shot. i know i am new at this but if you don't ask then you never find out things right
thanks for your advice and input....much appreciated
You know.. it's kind of crazy the captivate is as old as it is, and roms are still being produced (at a fairly large rate) for this device.
For some time now, it has become increasingly apparent XDA could use a slight overhaul or at least a new implementation for the end-users.
I would like to see a review system that allows you to browse by device, then shows you the android roms available based on which version you want to use. .....4.1, 4.0, 2.x......
From there, it could be broken down by most recent version vs. previous versions.
It could have different criteria for review such as battery life, lag problems, how "polished" it is, how well "featured" it is.
Maybe, even an optional set of code for any devs who want to include it which standardize some automatic reporting features so there could be "official XDA stats" and then "subjective user stats"
The reason I'm suggesting this is because even the Captivate which is now *old* by any standard has ample roms for it many of which change at a fast rate. If there was a system that let you see what the original problems were, when they were fixed, and what new problems people were having, it would make the process of rom selection a bit easier. Especially since users have drastically different needs from user to user, and different developers often have different priorities.
We could even have a "voting" system or something where if a user loads up CM10 and feel it has sufficient stutter, A user can go check the "current issues" related to that nightly and click "me too!" so that other users can get an idea of how many people are having what issues. This would also allow us to mark which version of a particular rom we are on and it could even have a system which "moves us" if we report going to a new version/go back device to device.
This would be particularly useful for people who want to give feedback about roms/help developers but, don't want to keep reporting already well known issues vainly, as it would prevent having to look back through 20 forum pages or 15 days of change-log to see what is what. It would also keep users from switching to a new rom, hoping it doesn't have X problem and finding out it does.. only to have to go back and recheck and see if they need to report that issue as well.
XDA is all about the developers but, it's important to consider that a lot of us don't mind giving input/helping/beta-ing and using roms and we even decide our next devices based on what things look like here. That is a 500$ purchase some of us make judging by the atmosphere here at XDA. It is a decision that in a lot of ways pays off, we get to use newer versions of android long after manufacturers quit caring.
If I don't care that the front camera is broken, in CM10 nightly X67 and doesn't work for me, but it works for another user.. Then this can be documented in a much easier to read, easier to follow fashion which would save someone else a lot of time if they don't want to gamble on an unstable camera since they scan lots of QR codes. Especially if the camera was in fact working for almost everyone in the nightly before.
Snow_fox said:
You know.. it's kind of crazy the captivate is as old as it is, and roms are still being produced (at a fairly large rate) for this device.
For some time now, it has become increasingly apparent XDA could use a slight overhaul or at least a new implementation for the end-users.
I would like to see a review system that allows you to browse by device, then shows you the android roms available based on which version you want to use. .....4.1, 4.0, 2.x......
From there, it could be broken down by most recent version vs. previous versions.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't know how the rating system you spoke of would really work out because just as a problem with a ROM could be caused by an error in the code or build, the same problem could be caused by end-user error and any ratings based on that could cause problems with getting an accurate rating.
However what I very much agree with is your idea to break down the listings by software versions. At least if that was implemented within the Development section it would make navigating so much more efficient.
m1batt1 said:
I don't know how the rating system you spoke of would really work out because just as a problem with a ROM could be caused by an error in the code or build, the same problem could be caused by end-user error and any ratings based on that could cause problems with getting an accurate rating.
However what I very much agree with is your idea to break down the listings by software versions. At least if that was implemented within the Development section it would make navigating so much more efficient.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
While I do understand your point about it possibly being end-user related, the reason I don't consider this too big of an issue is because there is always a chance for end-user screw ups with any product.
And being totally honest even if it is end user related, it would allow tracking of possible problems people create for themselves.I do my absolute best to read the instructions two or three times and get everything nailed down before I flash a new rom but, I've made mistakes and said "oops" on more than time.
If we can add that much more clarity to end user created problems vs. inherent rom problems, seems like that much more reason to go through with it.
If I can go back and see X is a problem from Y. I would know, "oh I forgot to clear my cache!" go back, repeat the process do it right and wouldn't have to complain to the dev.
is custom kernels battery life give more SOT than stock kernel.?
If individual developers can make something so good, surely the massive amount of people and money over at Mountain View can do it too?
IMO the device manufacturers develop kernels that will help "they're"device run better. They seldom worry about heavy users.
Suggest to making
Suggest to making, find they modified the kernel, compile or adjusting voltage! I hope it can help you!
More customization means more test variations (test cases, basically) need to be written and run before each release.
matt hardy said:
is custom kernels battery life give more SOT than stock kernel.?
If individual developers can make something so good, surely the massive amount of people and money over at Mountain View can do it too?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The difference between custom and stock ROMs? Same reasoning behind everything that's customised - cars, motorbikes, skateboards, etc.
Custom ROM. Individual developers make custom ROM the way they want to use it. They care about making the improvements and go into detail on how they will go about the customisation. They are not concerned about meeting deadlines because they would be using the phones and improving along the way.
Stock ROM. Phone manufacturers developers make the custom ROM the way the Company wants it to be used. They care about the meeting deadlines for the phones' launch date. Launch first, patch the defects later. Sounds familiar?
Happy Holidays!
I've always thought the same. I've always been scared to install a custom kernel... But how huge are the improvements?
Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk
Narzdy said:
I've always thought the same. I've always been scared to install a custom kernel... But how huge are the improvements?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It depends on the developer and the phone for which the ROM is built. There can be many types of improvemts, for example:
a. Upgrade OS. Phone manufacturers seldom put much effort to upgrade OS. E.g., when KitKat was released, manufacturers offered to an upgrade to only a handful of current phone models. In this case, a custom ROM is the only way for an upgrade for the other older phones.
b. Minimise Bloatware. Stock ROMs usually come with pre-installed bloatware apps that cannot be uninstalled. Not everyone uses all the apps running on the stock ROM. The custom ROM will allow for removal of unwanted apps and prevent apps from running unneccesarily. This will end up with a more efficient phone (more spare RAM) with a longer battery life.
c. Improved user-interface. Stock ROMs come with preset user-interface according to the manufacturer's developer. This may not suit everyone who buys the phone and the user is forced to learn and use this standardised interface. The user-interface of a custom ROM is designed by the developer, and is usually changeable if requests are made to the developer.
d. Fine-tune or tweaking. OS of stock ROMs are usually standardised, and may be carried through a few variations of the phones with very few fine-tuning to match any particular model. The custom ROM is usually optimised for a specific model of phone. When the ROM is optimised, the phone will perform better than stock, with better memory management, smoother running and longer battery life.
Of course, the performance of a custom ROM depends very much on the developer and the users feedback. Some may begin as a quirky OS and does not perform as well as stock, but as time goes on and with feedback from users and commitment from the developer, a custom ROM can evolve into one that will be very superior than the stock. However, this will take some time to happen. You can notice that all of the ROM development threads have so many of pages of posts from users giving feedback, comments and recommendations to the developers.
Happy Holidays!
Developers look at ROMs from the bottom up. Corporate top down
chan.sk said:
The difference between custom and stock ROMs? Same reasoning behind everything that's customised - cars, motorbikes, skateboards, etc.
Custom ROM. Individual developers make custom ROM the way they want to use it. They care about making the improvements and go into detail on how they will go about the customisation. They are not concerned about meeting deadlines because they would be using the phones and improving along the way.
Stock ROM. Phone manufacturers developers make the custom ROM the way the Company wants it to be used. They care about the meeting deadlines for the phones' launch date. Launch first, patch the defects later. Sounds familiar?
Happy Holidays!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Exactly, how else will they be able to push all of their bloatware on you if you could just uninstall it with a custom ROM or root?
Stock doms developed for both casual and users and corporate clients. This means ROM has to pass rigorous testing. This also means no experimental features etc. Another thing is that rom has to be secure e.g. no root.
But most importantly ROM has to suite casual user who needs Facebook, twitter and tons of other useless stuff that consume battery.
Anyone who posts on XDA is NOT a casual user and falls into 10-20% group of geeks
because custom kernel are personalized based on request of the people ..
stock kernel based on the manufacturer's
The wireless carriers and the device manufacturers have the "stock" software produced to blanket specific markets of customers or users. The individual manufacturers also probably have numerous contracts with different providers of services like dropbox and so on. They add all of those apps for that reason and the majority of folks probably never use them. You could compare apps to the "as seen on TV products". Some of them make it and some of them don't. The same could be said for Android apps. I believe they also have a lot of tracking systems in place with the stock roms so they can target advertise to certain customer bases. If you look at any service provider's contract, they don't allow rooting or any type of modification to the base firmware. If you do, it violates the terms of service agreement. That's why your warranty is voided and you're pretty much stuck if you have a problem and can't figure out how to fix it with resources available on the Web. They also have provisioning and proxies to guide you to certain places when using your device, unwillingly for the most part. A good example of that is on my phone I had all Verizon branded apps for customer service and what not. If you open the My Verizon Mobile app and then try to call Verizon customer service and talk to a person it automatically reverts you to the My Verizon Mobile app and says, "if you still want to talk to customer service, please enter your login credentials" I tried this several times but ended up calling Verizon on my house phone. It's pretty sneaky but the more times you handle your own problems with their automated systems, the less money it costs them to run their business.
it's a question i've never understood.
i can try to give you a my personal opinion. maybe stock rom personalized by some brand are not so good as stocks are because they don't look only at fast and battery. they make rom more heay because they want to put a lot of personalization with a lot of graphical effect without spending more time to optimize the whole things
Stock kernels and ROMs have to follow a strict set of rules, custom ones do not.
Sent from my SM-N9005 using Tapatalk
I've rooted several Samsung phones now, and one way which seems to work fine for me is
1) Go to samsung-updates.com and download a stock rom from there (having to deal with some crappy file downloading site like rapidgator or terafile)
2) Find the xda forum thread on how to root the device in question, and download a rooted rom from there (again having to deal with one of these slow ad-filled downloading sites)
3) Come back several hours later when everything has eventually downloaded, and use e.g. odin to flash the rom and finish the job.
I've done this a few times now (rooting and unrooting), and am beginning to wonder several things:
First, where are these stock roms coming from? A non-rooted Samsung phone straight out the box has a non-rooted stock rom on it -- but is there no easy way to dump the stock rom onto a computer (thus saving me the bother of having to download a stock rom when I already have a stock rom)?
Second, how are those rooted roms actually being built? Typically all I want is a stock rom with the superSU app or whatever. One thing I'm particularly confused by is that there are usually loads and loads of stock roms available for a given phone model, depending on which country and provider you want. And yet there is often only one rooted rom. How come the rooted rom doesn't care which country I'm in and which provider I have, whereas stock roms seem to care?
Google supply the android source code for free, right? Can I compile this code myself to make a stock rom somehow? Or a rooted rom? Is this what people are doing?
Third, why do I have to deal with all these crappy free download sites? If someone started some kickstarter to get funds to run a site which kept a copy of all these roms then so many people's lives would be much better, right? Why has this not happened?
Y
yannick.12 said:
I've rooted several Samsung phones now, and one way which seems to work fine for me is
1) Go to samsung-updates.com and download a stock rom from there (having to deal with some crappy file downloading site like rapidgator or terafile)
2) Find the xda forum thread on how to root the device in question, and download a rooted rom from there (again having to deal with one of these slow ad-filled downloading sites)
3) Come back several hours later when everything has eventually downloaded, and use e.g. odin to flash the rom and finish the job.
I've done this a few times now (rooting and unrooting), and am beginning to wonder several things:
First, where are these stock roms coming from? A non-rooted Samsung phone straight out the box has a non-rooted stock rom on it -- but is there no easy way to dump the stock rom onto a computer (thus saving me the bother of having to download a stock rom when I already have a stock rom)?
Second, how are those rooted roms actually being built? Typically all I want is a stock rom with the superSU app or whatever. One thing I'm particularly confused by is that there are usually loads and loads of stock roms available for a given phone model, depending on which country and provider you want. And yet there is often only one rooted rom. How come the rooted rom doesn't care which country I'm in and which provider I have, whereas stock roms seem to care?
Google supply the android source code for free, right? Can I compile this code myself to make a stock rom somehow? Or a rooted rom? Is this what people are doing?
Third, why do I have to deal with all these crappy free download sites? If someone started some kickstarter to get funds to run a site which kept a copy of all these roms then so many people's lives would be much better, right? Why has this not happened?
Y
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Okay, first of all the answers to these questions are easy to find on the forums and the web.
However I will answer them as well.
Stock ROM's come from various locations, usually the ones like the ROMs on SAM-Mobile come from OTA updates or Kies updates which have been extracted/edited to work via Odin. Other stock ROMs come from software "dumped" (extracted) from the phone.
Rooted ROMs don't care as they are usually un-necesary and only for conveniance due to most stock ROMs being able to be rooted easily. Stock ROMs however come in varierties from carriers to countries as they include other features or specific boot languages that would link the phone to its packaging and service provider
Yes you can dump the ROM from your phone to your PC, guides to do this can be found here: http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1771347
Yes you could compile your own code from the Google AOSP however this would be time consuming and could potentially brick your device, most devs of ROMs include drivers created by the actual makers of the device which again is time consuming and requires testing multiple times with risk of bricking and is only for the experianced
Finally, these "Crappy" download sites provide a means of payment for people. Although your opinion on them is that they should use a kickstarter fund many would not pay into it therefore they would loose money. Some may disagree since stock ROMs technicly aren't their work but thats another discussion.
yannick.12 said:
I've rooted several Samsung phones now, and one way which seems to work fine for me is
1) Go to samsung-updates.com and download a stock rom from there (having to deal with some crappy file downloading site like rapidgator or terafile)
2) Find the xda forum thread on how to root the device in question, and download a rooted rom from there (again having to deal with one of these slow ad-filled downloading sites)
3) Come back several hours later when everything has eventually downloaded, and use e.g. odin to flash the rom and finish the job.
I've done this a few times now (rooting and unrooting), and am beginning to wonder several things:
First, where are these stock roms coming from? A non-rooted Samsung phone straight out the box has a non-rooted stock rom on it -- but is there no easy way to dump the stock rom onto a computer (thus saving me the bother of having to download a stock rom when I already have a stock rom)?
Second, how are those rooted roms actually being built? Typically all I want is a stock rom with the superSU app or whatever. One thing I'm particularly confused by is that there are usually loads and loads of stock roms available for a given phone model, depending on which country and provider you want. And yet there is often only one rooted rom. How come the rooted rom doesn't care which country I'm in and which provider I have, whereas stock roms seem to care?
Google supply the android source code for free, right? Can I compile this code myself to make a stock rom somehow? Or a rooted rom? Is this what people are doing?
Third, why do I have to deal with all these crappy free download sites? If someone started some kickstarter to get funds to run a site which kept a copy of all these roms then so many people's lives would be much better, right? Why has this not happened?
Y
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1. stock roms are released by the manufacturer, or leaked to us by someone who works there. generally speaking, no you cant dump the phone then use that to re-flash stock.
2. not sure why you would flash a rooted rom instead of just rooting by itself if that's all you want.
there are many stock roms because they are region and carrier specific.
you need to get a more popular device, then you will have more custom roms to choose from.
custom roms don't contain all the partitions like a stock one does, that's why they can be used on multiple regions. what i mean is, custom roms don't contain things like the modem/radios (and other files) that are specific to your region and will cause your phone to not work or not work properly if you change them.
yes you can compile and build your own roms, but it is very much not easy, that's why everyone isnt doing it.
3. be grateful you can get a hold of the files at all when you need them, because they are not available for all phones. also, only some of the sites used suk, just depends on where the person decides to put them, and i agree, i dont understand why they use this crappy sites when better ones are available.
the reason there hasnt been a site made to store all of these files (actually there are a rare few but only for some devices) is because most people now a days wont pony up the money to support it. we are in the "entitlement" era of android. what i mean by that is, it is becoming more common that users think and act like that community owes them these files, roms, mods, etc and all the hard work it takes to make them. they have little respect for all this work and time put forth. they wont even take a half a second to click the thanks button, that should tell you something right there.
so they sure a s**t arent going to donate to keep a file repository running. yes some would but most wont, and this sort of site would use a ton of bandwidth, which would be very expensive just to host. not to mention the time and effort it would take to keep it up and running with the most current files.
Thanks both of you for the comments and responses. Below is some background which doesn't have any more questions, but is an attempt to explain why I was asking (i.e. moaning!) in the first place.
Rooting -- what I've realised is that I feel really uneasy about the whole process. It seems to rely heavily on trust, for example. Let me explain what I'm comparing it with. 15 years ago (before I had kids) I was a unix hacker and I would download linux source code from a reputable place and compile it myself on various PCs. These sites (containing the linux source code) would be reasonable professional sites with no ads and probably things like md5sums to check your download and so on, the source code would be plainly visible so you could look through it yourself, and the forums associated with them would be professionally run and contributors would clearly be educated people. I've only recently moved into the rooting roms business, basically spurred on by my kids (aged 14 and 12) who are becoming interested in how much they can get out of their android devices, and basically I'm quite surprised about how in comparison it seems like much more of an "amateur set-up". A lot of it is based on "here is a file, download it, trust me, it's fine, but you can't check this". This is fine for my kids, who just use their phones as game tools, but far less fine for me, because I use my phone to manage my finances, my work emails, my childcare, and a lot of other stuff where it's really important that nothing goes wrong [and this is why my main phone is not rooted.] There seems to be far less documentation, and what there is is spread around widely, there are plenty of threads which are dead/out of date and contains links to wildly out-of-date versions of things and so on. xda is absolutely great, once you find the great bits, but it also contains a huge sprawling mess of noise. TechMinerUK suggests (and I'm sure they are right) that one can find all the answers to the questions I'm asking on the forums and on the web. But in a well-organized scenario there would be some clean "front page" which contains a well-signposted FAQ about rooting, a FAQ about roms etc etc, rather than having to google around for everything. Of course I did google for information before I posted the questions above -- I had several more questions in fact, and google answered some of them and I posted the rest. Perhaps the key difference is the following -- 15 years ago a generic college student was only just beginning to hear about the internet and probably had no access to it in their own home, and the people setting up websites were professionals, who probably worked in computer science departments at universities. Nowadays the people rooting their phones might well be college kids with no salaries (yet), or maybe even schoolkids, so everything is perhaps being run on a more "hobby" basis. bweN diorD suggests that people aren't going to pay a little for convenient access to stuff like roms and perhaps this hits the nail on the head -- my demographic (middle-aged waged people) wouldn't think twice about donating a little to support a cause they want to see succeed -- but on the other hand I couldn't see my kids donating to support anything, because they have no income themselves. Perhaps basically the reason all these files end up on these dubious file-sharing websites is that the average wage of the contributor to this game is far less than the average wage of the people writing the linux source code 15 years ago.
That's just some background as to where the questions came from. Thanks again for the answers, and I will keep googling, if that's the way that it's supposed to work now,
Y
yannick.12 said:
That's just some background as to where the questions came from. Thanks again for the answers, and I will keep googling, if that's the way that it's supposed to work now,
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well, the people who have at least some respect for the forum and people who help here try searching first.
you can always come and ask questions, but in my opinion, you are viewed differently if you at least put some effort into finding the answers first.
but i know the information is spread all over creation and some times difficult to find or know what is safe. that's why im here, to lend some guidance where i can, from experience.
one thing you don't want to do is, hesitate to ask a question and do something you don't understand. this frequently leads to jacked up devices.