Related
I've a buddy of mine that found ATK on his own, installed it, and says he sees a "noticeable" improvement in speed on his Captivate (And he's got the lag fix already). I tried to reason that it's placebo but he does swear, it was a large improvement in speed. I can look online and find other reports of this.
And before you go down that route, he had nothing much more than stock installed (Facebook, etc... Nothing that I don't have).
I've also seen someone go from 8 hours of battery life to 12 hours just by installing ATK.
Explain these.
If Android TRULY managed memory so well, how does someone gain such performance boost from killing the processes?
If ATK was actually detrimental to battery life, why does someone gain more by using it?
I've seen both sides. I haven't noticed any speed differences running ATK compared to not running it.
I have also seen another side that says ATK hurt their battery life.
Seems there's too much conflicting info out there. You can argue til you're blue in the face that "it is negative"... But you cannot deny results some people are saying. So I'm just asking those of you that argue from that perspective... To explain these situations?
TexUs said:
Explain these.
If Android TRULY managed memory so well, how does someone gain such performance boost from killing the processes?
If ATK was actually detrimental to battery life, why does someone gain more by using it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
A quick question, does your buddy kill the processes and then let the phone sit? Sure this is going to increase the battery life but so does pulling it from the phone all together.
Bottom line is there is no definitive answer as to the merits of ATK. If you like it, use it.
Most results tend to be anecdotal in nature. Those that get better battery life out of using ATK probably don't realize it's due to ATK killing off bad apps, and not due to freed-up RAM. If Android needs more RAM, it will shut down programs by itself. That 3MB of RAM you freed up with ATK isn't nearly as useful as the fact that same app you just killed was also hogging your CPU. Cause/effect, correlation/causation, etc.
People also get what's ive heard as the "new phone syndrome" where the phone is used constantly the first couple days, and the battery life is then thought to be horrible.
Also tell your buddy to look up settings > about phone> battery usage as the battery is largely affected by voice calls and the screen. A 5 min call uses more than you think.(thus the reasoning behind why I don't use atk)
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App
To a large extent battery life, phone, and app performance will always be somewhat subjective. No two people are going to use their phones in the exact same manner. depending on how a person uses their phone and what they have installed on their phone ATK may very well improve their phone's performance - especially if they have a bad acting app on their phone.
As for my personal testing, my phone does better without ATK. However I was a little biased against ATK from the beginning and this could have affected my results. I have used a half dozen different linux distros over the past eight years and while I have many times had to kill or force close an application, I have never needed to manually manage memory. Linux generally does a good job at managing memory and multitasking.
I can't say for your friend, but I was using a task killer for the first month I had the phone, and now I do not. So far performance, and battery life are the same with and without. I finally removed my old task killer and installed watchdog all I have it set to do now is simply alert me if an app is using excessive cpu, which would likely be due to poor app quality anyway. Other than that I've had no issues.
Mercath said:
That 3MB of RAM you freed up with ATK isn't nearly as useful as the fact that same app you just killed was also hogging your CPU. Cause/effect, correlation/causation, etc.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I guess this is true. I've never seen claims that Android manages CPU, etc effectively, I've just seen claims about the RAM usage.
ageros said:
I can't say for your friend, but I was using a task killer for the first month I had the phone, and now I do not. So far performance, and battery life are the same with and without.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's what I've done as well, and yea... Can't tell a difference with and without (of course I also go "back" out of apps when I'm done).
i dont think it works that well
Hi,
My HTC one S phone came with 1024MB RAM. I understand that the system OS needs RAM memory so there is actually only 684MB available for running apps.
However, I am using only a total of about 100MB apps for the moment (adding up the MB's used by the apps as shown under 'activated apps') but still there seems to be no more than 280MB free RAM available (while I expect about 580 MB available).
This does not make sense to me. Or does it? Could there be a memory leak?
Anyone with the same problem?
Many thanks.
Now that you mentioned it, I also notice something similar with my phone... I did a bit of searching, and I found something that is a little old (as far as phone time goes), but perhaps useful:
http://www.androidcentral.com/ram-what-it-how-its-used-and-why-you-shouldnt-care
In summary, so long as your phone isn't eating up all of the RAM, you should be fine (is it impacting your experience? As for me, it doesn't seem to be). I wish I knew better what is going on, though. I would wager, though, that if one were to run an AOSP ROM on this phone, one would see an improvement in RAM usage, esp. since Sense wouldn't be hogging resources (not that it seems to matter much to me right now, though). Also, the reduction of bloatware from using another ROM would further reduce the amount of things running in general.
My Charge is routinely running 275 - 300 MB of RAM even when "idle" and I receive a LOT of warnings that my memory is running low when I'm using Tasker or Evernote. While I use Linux at home on my personal computer, I'm by no means a professional in any real sense of the word. But my layperson's understanding of RAM is that, generally speaking, more is better and allows for a machine to run, boot, etc... faster and more reliably. I've read that the Charge is a RAM wannabe and I know there are phones with much more than is available with this device but does that mean anything for this phone? Should I be using something that will clear more RAM for me or is that just a pipe dream and I have to deal with the lack of RAM by buying a new phone at some later time?
I'm using Tweaked 3.1 and have to say that Dwitheral has made this phone one I'm happy with - my fiancee has the Charge as well and is paranoid about rooting / ROMing, so she is totally stock. Needless to say, her phone sucks eggs and mine doesn't. I'm looking for a replacement but will not do so until Black Friday next year - then I can get a device that's a little "older" for less than $50 that will be a huge improvement over the Charge. In the meantime, with Tweaked 3.1, a Hyperion 3500 mha extended life battery and Tasker, this phone is serviceable. But the high RAM usage nags at me and I'm wondering if this is really an issue and, if so, is there anything to do about it? When I look at running applications in task manager, it is usually none or one, maybe, on occasion, two running applications.
Can someone clarify this for me? Do I need to be concerned and, if so, is there a solution that doesn't start with "Upon entering the Verizon store, ask where the new DNA is located...."
Thanks in advance!
Forget what you know about RAM in Windows, because this isn't Windows. In Linux (and by extension in Android), unused RAM is generally considered to be wasted. The Android low memory killer (LMK) will take care of killing apps and freeing when it needs to make space for other things, and artificially killing stuff is going to make your phone perform worse and use more battery. You need enough free for apps to have room to start without waiting, but not so much that it kills background apps that you want there. You can tweak the LMK, but 275-300MB used (75-100MB free) is pretty close to the sweet spot for this phone.
I guess it is from since of the tweaks I am running, but I usually have an extra 50-80 MB from what you described.
Sent from my SCH-I510 using Xparent Red Tapatalk 2
Right guys we've got 3gbs of ram woawa. I mean that's f.ING great right ..? Ermm would be if this "unbloated" phone wasn't using 75 percent of it straight out of the box that's 2gbs
. I would imagen the reason our phones are getting extremely hot is that samsung are over loading the basics and this resulting in any extras we download from play store or where ever can't use the ram so where pushING it to the maximum. Im not massively knoelagable on ram my Knole expands to. It determind the speed of data gets handled and it's random access memory well my home pc only has 2 and it runs quite quickly
. My s4 had 2 and it was as fast as this s6. And faster once I rooted it and removed bloat wear but I'm not rooting this for at least six months so any one got any tips on keeping the ram at about 60 percent and keeping my phone from basily being a radiator
#1 Google Translate didn't help so I guess I understood 2% of your text.
#2 Package Disabler Pro on Google Play. Buy and use.
#3 Ever opened Task Manager on Windows OS and checked % ram used? No? Good.
#4 What apps are running when your phone gets extremely hot? Give us GSAM screenshots but hey... that's all about the battery again, not ram...
You're an idiot. RAM being fully used isn't a problem on Linux.
Sent from my SM-G920W8 using Tapatalk
2fb of 3gb = 67% Already better
benjiboythelad said:
Right guys we've got 3gbs of ram woawa. I mean that's f.ING great right ..? Ermm would be if this "unbloated" phone wasn't using 75 percent of it straight out of the box that's 2gbs
. I would imagen the reason our phones are getting extremely hot is that samsung are over loading the basics and this resulting in any extras we download from play store or where ever can't use the ram so where pushING it to the maximum. Im not massively knoelagable on ram my Knole expands to. It determind the speed of data gets handled and it's random access memory well my home pc only has 2 and it runs quite quickly
. My s4 had 2 and it was as fast as this s6. And faster once I rooted it and removed bloat wear but I'm not rooting this for at least six months so any one got any tips on keeping the ram at about 60 percent and keeping my phone from basily being a radiator
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
RAM is there to be used, so if 75% are used, it means that 3GB was a good choice and not wasted. Filled up RAM looks bad and wrong, but it's completely fine unless you run out of it. If you don't, then it doesn't matter, even if 75% are filled up.
The processor is the part that heats up, though a 14nm SoC shouldn't and in fact doesn't heat up too bad, unless you are gaming or doing other heavy tasks. Heat is present on all powerful phones.
As others pointed out, battery logs may help if a rogue app is running and wasting loads of resources, but it would be a start if you defined heat. Actual overheating (data please) or the occasional warm back?
Some of you need to research how Android uses RAM. Here's a good place to start:
http://www.androidcentral.com/ram-what-it-how-its-used-and-why-you-shouldnt-care
greglord said:
#1 Google Translate didn't help so I guess I understood 2% of your text.
#2 Package Disabler Pro on Google Play. Buy and use.
#3 Ever opened Task Manager on Windows OS and checked % ram used? No? Good.
#4 What apps are running when your phone gets extremely hot? Give us GSAM screenshots but hey... that's all about the battery again, not ram...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And your a massive prick English . And I for every one else who seems to think that my phone over heating isn't bad it's over 67c I've pin pointed it down to where it's bellow 20% of battery and the let's put it like this .. more apps open more ram used more proccecer speed require the more my phone slows down yes your ****ing dim wits an Linux and Android ram works the ****ing same as a windows other wise it would be cool something different .
benjiboythelad said:
And your a massive prick English . And I for every one else who seems to think that my phone over heating isn't bad it's over 67c I've pin pointed it down to where it's bellow 20% of battery and the let's put it like this .. more apps open more ram used more proccecer speed require the more my phone slows down yes your ****ing dim wits an Linux and Android ram works the ****ing same as a windows other wise it would be cool something different .
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Nope. Its not like that, read first what other two guys wrote about RAM consumption. Load GSAM and post screenshots what is heating & draining your battery. Then we can discuss more about your overheating problems.
btw: It's You're and not Youre.
benjiboythelad said:
And your a massive prick English . And I for every one else who seems to think that my phone over heating isn't bad it's over 67c I've pin pointed it down to where it's bellow 20% of battery and the let's put it like this .. more apps open more ram used more proccecer speed require the more my phone slows down yes your ****ing dim wits an Linux and Android ram works the ****ing same as a windows other wise it would be cool something different .
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Mine sits on 80% or more used and my phone does not even get hot. Having full RAM does not overheat or slow down your phone. All that pr0n you're loading onto it is probably slowing it down
So i have 8/256 zenfone on last android 10 update but multitasking on this phone behave strange random apps are getting killed in the background even if I use idk 50 % of ram and by night most of the apps are gone from memory.
https://zentalk.asus.com/en/discussion/comment/37973#Comment_37973 now some assus boy is trying to say that this is fine but no it is not -.- iam wondering if iam missing some option to turn off or any of you have some similar issues? Maybe iam missing some power saving option to turn off but i think i turn off all of them by now? :crying::cyclops:
Yes, by default this phone has fairly aggressive memory management. Most of the settings you'll want to adjust are under Settings - Battery - Powermaster - Battery Saving Options. You might also want to have a look under Settings - Advanced - Optiflex.
Devhux said:
Yes, by default this phone has fairly aggressive memory management. Most of the settings you'll want to adjust are under Settings - Battery - Powermaster - Battery Saving Options. You might also want to have a look under Settings - Advanced - Optiflex.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Think I check them all already but today have the same situation still. I even do the format yesterday and for half of the day, phone keep 24 apps in memory without reloading and overnight on charger phone just clean its memory and leave me to 3 apps open so it cleans 21 apps -.- 'm on the edge of returning it i pay 25 % more for 8 GB and my phone is pretending to be 1 GB device sometimes...
berni502 said:
Think I check them all already but today have the same situation still I even do the format yesterday and for half of the day, phone keep 24 apps in memory without reloading and overnight on charger phone just clean its memory and leave me to 3 apps open so it cleans 21 apps -.- 'm on the edge of returning it i pay 25 % more for 8 GB and my phone is pretending to be 1 GB device sometimes...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
That's called battery savings...
EMJI79 said:
That's called battery savings...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't need that and don't need anybody force me to save my battery lol And we have profiles for battery savings x; ) besides that this is my first android phone doing that... Even my older phones from Xiaomi and Xiaomi is widely known for aggressive ram management never went full retard on cleaning almost all my apps. :silly:
And why on earth it decides to save battery when its plugged to charger xD.
@berni502 is right. There's a bug with LMK or something. You can use RAM memory filler to test how much ram can be allocated to an app (and it gets killed at 5GB instead of 7GB on Pie). Since then everything gets killed even though there's about 4.5GB free, SystemUI included. Reboot fixes the problem. I think I'll open a new discussion there.
aleksander002 said:
@berni502 is right. There's a bug with LMK or something. You can use RAM memory filler to test how much ram can be allocated to an app (and it gets killed at 5GB instead of 7GB on Pie). Since then everything gets killed even though there's about 4.5GB free, SystemUI included. Reboot fixes the problem. I think I'll open a new discussion there.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Pls do it! I feel like I am only one in there who cares : ( it seems that killing apps overnight and a way too aggressive ram management starts on android from android 9 there is a lot of ppl writing about it on pixel,oneplus and samsung forums but on asus is it just me : /.
I even find this site but think op resolve problem already because i have op 7t for +/- 3 days and it just works fine no even single app missing form ram overnight.
https://dontkillmyapp.com
I actually can semi confirm your observation about ram after reboots. Yesterday on clean install android 9 multitasking gets huge temporary improvement ram can get as low as 1,5 gb ram or even less but after a day 1 + unwanted ram clear overnight and my restart after this phone struggle to pass 2,8GB free memory it can handle way fewer apps in memory and start reloads them sooner.
First day on android 9 downgrade
VS
Second day
It can be fixed oneplus show it but they won't fix it if I am the only one who is barking about it on their forum.
BTW does your app getting wipe out from memory overnight? I mean from 20 + app get something between 3-9 in the morning and if not can you describe what exactly do you turn on or off in your system or you just don't touch anything?
Well, I'm not that hard multitasker. Of course I have some background services enabled but it's far from having 20 apps running at the same time. Regardless, after a week or so without reboot some issues become more apparent and LMK seems to be very aggressive even though there are 3 GB left (not even buffered).
aleksander002 said:
Well, I'm not that hard multitasker. Of course I have some background services enabled but it's far from having 20 apps running at the same time. Regardless, after a week or so without reboot some issues become more apparent and LMK seems to be very aggressive even though there are 3 GB left (not even buffered).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
can you try to bump your apps for the night and tell me how many of them you will see in recents in the morning
These issues are there from freaking July but they just don't care or idk
https://zentalk.asus.com/en/discussion/7078/ram-management-and-heating-issue
berni502 said:
can you try to bump your apps for the night and tell me how many of them you will see in recents in the morning
These issues are there from freaking July but they just don't care or idk
https://zentalk.asus.com/en/discussion/7078/ram-management-and-heating-issue
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I must confirm that you are not alone. I did it exactly as you described in one of your posts. Before going to bed I opened 24 applications, then I went through them all once again that they are really all loaded in memory (I have 6 GB of memory). When I woke up in the morning and pressed the multitask button, I was surprised to find that out of the 24 applications, there were exactly 3 left, as you have repeatedly claimed.
I stared at it open-mouthed. In fact, I've never done this check because the phone is fast enough that I just didn't recognize in the morning ((still sleepy) that applications were loading from Flash Memory instead of RAM.
This check is really simple, anyone can do it, but apparently not many users have done it yet.
Next time I would like to try to find out which applications actually stayed, whether the last used ones or completely random ones, and what processes took place at night that might be blame.
_jis_ said:
I must confirm that you are not alone. I did it exactly as you described in one of your posts. Before going to bed I opened 24 applications, then I went through them all once again that they are really all loaded in memory (I have 6 GB of memory). When I woke up in the morning and pressed the multitask button, I was surprised to find that out of the 24 applications, there were exactly 3 left, as you have repeatedly claimed.
I stared at it open-mouthed. In fact, I've never done this check because the phone is fast enough that I just didn't recognize in the morning ((still sleepy) that applications were loading from Flash Memory instead of RAM.
This check is really simple, anyone can do it, but apparently not many users have done it yet.
Next time I would like to try to find out which applications actually stayed, whether the last used ones or completely random ones, and what processes took place at night that might be blame.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I am really tired now of talking to the Asus boys on their forum its is like talking to the wall. Now i get info from them that this is a normal android 10 case but don't believe in this... I use logcat app for 2 nights but I am not that smart to figure out what and where its happening am trying but I think it will be better to return this phone while i still can... : / in the end like i said i pay almost 100$ more for 8gb to have those extra multitasking abilities but they are ripped off form the phone.
From my observation apps stayed in ram can be different. It sad because that ram issue was reported in July on their forum now i don't have any hope in asus work on fixing this problem.
use ram truth or some app to monitor ram and you see some another strange thing even that after night you stay with 3 apps open your ram will be almost full. For me, it was today about 700 mb difference after overnight app kill.
Have you guys tried the same exercise of opening 24 apps and checked them back at morning with other phones?. I'm no expert, but it is my understanding that apart from the LMK that kills apps if memory is needed there is also a time killer i.e. if an app is not used after X amount of time it is killed from memory, so what you see is normal Android behavior.
papete said:
Have you guys tried the same exercise of opening 24 apps and checked them back at morning with other phones?. I'm no expert, but it is my understanding that apart from the LMK that kills apps if memory is needed there is also a time killer i.e. if an app is not used after X amount of time it is killed from memory, so what you see is normal Android behavior.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Like i said before i have oneplus 7t on android 10 for 3 days and it not clean my apps overnight but I am trying to collect some more info about pixel and oneplus now. I have multiple phones on android form 2.1 i believe xD oneplus 3 can keep my apps in memory for a week or longer
berni502 said:
oneplus 3 can keep my apps in memory for a week or longer
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Which Android version?
I haven't had a reason to deal with this issue yet, but after a while searching, I'm starting to feel that this is a feature of Android 9 and 10 that users of various brands complain about:
https://forum.xda-developers.com/galaxy-note-9/help/note-9-closes-recent-apps-overnight-t3976779
https://forums.oneplus.com/threads/apps-running-in-background-get-closed-refreshed.735964/
https://www.reddit.com/r/GooglePixel/comments/978fck/anyone_else_having_issues_with_be_pie/
And they nostalgically recall Oreo where these problems were not.
_jis_ said:
Which Android version?
I haven't had a reason to deal with this issue yet, but after a while searching, I'm starting to feel that this is a feature of Android 9 and 10 that users of various brands complain about:
https://forum.xda-developers.com/galaxy-note-9/help/note-9-closes-recent-apps-overnight-t3976779
https://forums.oneplus.com/threads/apps-running-in-background-get-closed-refreshed.735964/
https://www.reddit.com/r/GooglePixel/comments/978fck/anyone_else_having_issues_with_be_pie/
And they nostalgically recall Oreo where these problems were not.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i don't even remember on what android it was
like I said I am trying to collect some information because i had no problems with one plus 7t on android 10 when i have it for 3 days.
here you have links to my threads because most of your info links are pretty outdated
https://forum.xda-developers.com/pixel-4-xl/help/apps-killing-overnight-t4032207#post81434337
https://forum.xda-developers.com/oneplus-7t/help/apps-killing-overnight-t4032153#post81433005
Even if android 10 works like that so what? xD they modified many apps in zenfone system and change many options and not implement many aswell so what's wrong with fixing something that clearly works bad and it is no fitted at all for devices with 6,8 gb of ram and more(not even 4 i will still be mad it this happened to me on 4 gb xD)... hmmm, now I'm curious how it works on rog phone 2 this beast have like what 12 gb of ram ? Imagine that you have 12 gb of ram and your apps still getting killed overnight xD i'am to tired to ask about it on rog 2 forum maybe you can.
berni502 said:
most of your info links are pretty outdated
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
On the contrary, it is important that the links are older, because it only proves that this problem has been around for a long time (at least from A9) and in addition to different brands. The first link is from October 2019, which I would consider as current enough.
_jis_ said:
On the contrary, it is important that the lines are older, because it only proves that this problem has been around for a long time (at least from A9) and in addition to different brands. The first link is from October 2019, which I would consider as current enough.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes but they are speaking about anbdroid 9 and they even find some semi solution of that in there(that restart one it shows how bugged it was) ; ) we don't know how it is on samsung android 10 now.
On pixel 4 seems to be ok without any issue and i can't find any no outdated info about oneplus so i just assume that there is no longer a killing app problemo + i have one fr 3 days.
Even minus app killing overnight ram management on asus it's just strange at the moment I am reopening one app that should be easy in memory because i have like 3gb of free ram left but nope it's gone -.-.
berni502 said:
we don't know how it is on samsung android 10 now.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'll check Samsung Galaxy S10 with A10 tomorrow maybe.
Question is, why would you want an app that you have not used for X hours to stay in memory? All apps that need to run in the background use a service for that purpose. The rest gets killed as they should because either another app needs the memory or because is haven't been used in a long time. To my knowledge Android has been like that for ever (as opposed to windows for example, where you can completely stall without memory unless you manually kill things).
papete said:
Question is, why would you want an app that you have not used for X hours to stay in memory? All apps that need to run in the background use a service for that purpose. The rest gets killed as they should because either another app needs the memory or because is haven't been used in a long time. To my knowledge Android has been like that for ever (as opposed to windows for example, where you can completely stall without memory unless you manually kill things).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
And why do i want all of them gone overnight when I am connected to charger ? Solution is easy if you wanna save your battery you have power profiles for that so you can and if you don't wanna do that you should still be able to but you cant... and there is matter of price why do i pay so much for so powerfull device when iam force to not use its hardware to full of its capabilities. You are right about android ram menagment but that i wanna kill your all apps start on android 9 apparently. There is nothing bad with cleaning some space when you need that for new apps but killing it all or killing it when you have half of ram empty its just stupid...
you can read some more in here maybe https://dontkillmyapp.com
and imagine i have 8 gb of ram that rog phone 2 can have even 12 and 6k battery if they have same problems lol its is like buying a sports hybrid car with turbo v8 engine and be forced to use only that electric motor because of fuel savings ^^