Related
It seems like every review I read tells me the Hummingbird processor is much better and a more capable processor then the snapdragon. If this is true why hasn't HTC produced a phone with a Hummingbird CPU? HTC is way ahead in the android game experience wise but they haven't seemed to make any major hardware changes other then upping the rom and ram and speed of the cpu. Would someone please tell me that samsungs new CPU isn't as good as all the reviews say it is
I can't comment on the CPUs but I would just like to mention that costs, failure rate etc. all play a role in the decision about what CPU to use. There may be reasons for HTC not using the Hummingbird yet other then performance.
The Hummingbird is a little faster CPU-wise, which does surprise me as the Snapdragon has higher quoted instructions per clock. However, its GPU is really in a different league to that in the current Snapdragons and that's where the big difference lies in benchmarks (though that will, of course, only help GPU-accelerated things).
HTC don't necessarily use the chip that benchmarks the best on any given day - they have a relationship with Qualcomm and presumably get preferential rates from them, and they have an established platform. The good news for them is that Qualcomm are bringing out new Snapdragons with higher clockspeeds and better GPUs (and dual cores, though it remains to be seen if/when they arrive on phones) so they should equalise and quite probably turn the tables soon.
Competition is good - we were stuck with 5-600MHz XScales and ARM11s for ages, and now things are finally moving along.
http://smartphonebenchmarks.com/for...ion-samsungs-implementation-of-arm-cortex-a9/
^^^^^^
I'm sick of hearing people cry omg Tegra2 awesome. NO. It's great, but it's not going to make the Hummingbird obsolete. The Hummingbird has a better GPU. Balance it out and you get unnoticeable performance gains from a Tegra2. Not to mention the Tegra2 phones are coming out with Froyo which simply put doesn't have dual core optimizations, so in the end, it might even be SLOWER than the Nexus S.
What you should be waiting for is the Snapdragon and OMAP dual cores as well as the Orion. But these won't be out for a while, so why not get the Nexus S?
It's either or in this case. Don't choose a Tegra2 phone because it's a Tegra2. Choose it because it is the right phone you want, that will get upgades when you want, and is on the right carrier you want. Get a Tegra2 or a Hummingbird, that's all I have to say. They're about equal.
Just sick of the overpraise that the Tegra2 gets when we already have that power in the Nexus S.
NVIDIA - they went from ARM11 (Tegra 1) to Cortex A9 (Tegra 2), skipping Cortex A8 design altogether. Tegra 2's CPU core will be competitive but its GPU appears to be weaker than even PowerVR SGX540. Heck, even Qualcomm's Adreno 205 may outperform this GPU. On the plus side, Tegra 2 is already available on the market NOW, and smartphones based on Tegra 2 will appear during Q4 of 2010. (Read this article for more details on Tegra 2). Samsung, LG and Motorola have announced their intention of producing phones based on Tegra 2 so far.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Power SGX540 = Hummingbird.
By no means am I saying to not get a Tegra2. All I'm saying is to not avoid the Hummingbird because you think the Tegra2 is that much better or something.
Right on anderoid! Love hummingbird but I think I must have something wrong inside me. Kind off topic but I've had a siezure before and some epileptics electromagnetic field messes up semsitive electronics. After my workhorse 2 year old g1 I've had about 16 phones since then. 6 vibrants, 4 mytouch4g and warrantying my 5th and soon to be 6th sns. Granted not all problems have been pure hardware but these bleeding edge phones seem to be either fragile or sensitive.
That said, I love the nexus s. I loved humingbird in my vibrant and the awesome codecs but rfs and touchwiz and lag fixes drove me nuts. The nexus s on paper is amazing. Once you skin the outside or put a case, the scratch issue is pretty null and its such a clean beautiful phone. Cheap feeling? My ass. And it doesn't look anything like an iphone. The speed and battery life of hummingbird is amazing. Once google polishes gingerbread, especially gpu drivers or apps that jive better with it, I think people will regret passing it over. I've never had any slowdowns with it and dungeon defenders with no hacks or oc runs flawless.
Tegra 2 might turn out amazing but after tegra one was such a non starter (did it even make it into a phone?) And the gpu (nvidias pc meat and potatoes) not being as strong as an 8+ mo hummingbird, it seems to be a very short lived "king" if it amounts to that. I might end up very wrong but we will have to see what they bring when they finally go retail. The fact that the atrix needs a 1900mah battery scares me a bit. Maybe its needed for the extra ram and motoblur stuff, or extra resolution, but does anyone else not think it will get better battery life than the iphone4 or even the sns?
Sent from my HTC Dream using XDA App
If you're that desperate for a Tegra branded chip, hang onto your Nexus S until next Christmas and go for a quad core Tegra 3...
Jayrod1980 said:
Right on anderoid! Love hummingbird but I think I must have something wrong inside me. Kind off topic but I've had a siezure before and some epileptics electromagnetic field messes up semsitive electronics. After my workhorse 2 year old g1 I've had about 16 phones since then. 6 vibrants, 4 mytouch4g and warrantying my 5th and soon to be 6th sns. Granted not all problems have been pure hardware but these bleeding edge phones seem to be either fragile or sensitive.
That said, I love the nexus s. I loved humingbird in my vibrant and the awesome codecs but rfs and touchwiz and lag fixes drove me nuts. The nexus s on paper is amazing. Once you skin the outside or put a case, the scratch issue is pretty null and its such a clean beautiful phone. Cheap feeling? My ass. And it doesn't look anything like an iphone. The speed and battery life of hummingbird is amazing. Once google polishes gingerbread, especially gpu drivers or apps that jive better with it, I think people will regret passing it over. I've never had any slowdowns with it and dungeon defenders with no hacks or oc runs flawless.
Tegra 2 might turn out amazing but after tegra one was such a non starter (did it even make it into a phone?) And the gpu (nvidias pc meat and potatoes) not being as strong as an 8+ mo hummingbird, it seems to be a very short lived "king" if it amounts to that. I might end up very wrong but we will have to see what they bring when they finally go retail. The fact that the atrix needs a 1900mah battery scares me a bit. Maybe its needed for the extra ram and motoblur stuff, or extra resolution, but does anyone else not think it will get better battery life than the iphone4 or even the sns?
Sent from my HTC Dream using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
THANK YOU, WELL SAID...I was explaining this to someone the other day and it just wasnt making sense to them for som reason
Well you have the right spirit but little miss informed. What you fail to see is it has dual die so 2 proc thread can run each at 1ghz compared to 1 die 1ghz. I love how Samsung folks always has to bring the GPU in it whats your point? SGX540 is slightly by very small margin wins against Adreno 205. So does that mean NS can hold its ground with MT4G it has better GPU following your argument? No why due to higher memory that is allocated at faster speed.
But I myself would be waiting for Qualcomm to deploy dualcore for me thats when its serious business. Far as Samsung device goes it is already obsolete this is not rant of any from if you want to be head in the Tech world then you better have money for the changes which you will be required every 4-6months.
Jayrod1980 said:
Right on anderoid! Love hummingbird but I think I must have something wrong inside me. Kind off topic but I've had a siezure before and some epileptics electromagnetic field messes up semsitive electronics. After my workhorse 2 year old g1 I've had about 16 phones since then. 6 vibrants, 4 mytouch4g and warrantying my 5th and soon to be 6th sns. Granted not all problems have been pure hardware but these bleeding edge phones seem to be either fragile or sensitive.
That said, I love the nexus s. I loved humingbird in my vibrant and the awesome codecs but rfs and touchwiz and lag fixes drove me nuts. The nexus s on paper is amazing. Once you skin the outside or put a case, the scratch issue is pretty null and its such a clean beautiful phone. Cheap feeling? My ass. And it doesn't look anything like an iphone. The speed and battery life of hummingbird is amazing. Once google polishes gingerbread, especially gpu drivers or apps that jive better with it, I think people will regret passing it over. I've never had any slowdowns with it and dungeon defenders with no hacks or oc runs flawless.
Tegra 2 might turn out amazing but after tegra one was such a non starter (did it even make it into a phone?) And the gpu (nvidias pc meat and potatoes) not being as strong as an 8+ mo hummingbird, it seems to be a very short lived "king" if it amounts to that. I might end up very wrong but we will have to see what they bring when they finally go retail. The fact that the atrix needs a 1900mah battery scares me a bit. Maybe its needed for the extra ram and motoblur stuff, or extra resolution, but does anyone else not think it will get better battery life than the iphone4 or even the sns?
Sent from my HTC Dream using XDA App
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Don't get me wrong, I love my Nexus S. Having had an Epic and an Evo I can easily say this is the most powerful phone I've ever owned; a fact that the people in the epic IRC like to try and dispute as we've established a stable 1.5GHz OC and they've never gone over 1.2GHz.
I love the graphics power it possesses and I definitely love that my friends with iPhones get jealous of how gorgeous the screen is and how blazingly fast the phone runs, even bone stock. However, I do have a few qualms:
I remember when the Nexus one came out. I still had a dumbphone but I had started looking at phones to get and then I found the Nexus One. It was by and large the most powerful phone on the market, nothing else even came close. Being on T-Mobile had given me access to the HTC Dream (G1) and the HTC Magic (MyTouch 3G) and neither of those phones were even close to what the Nexus One could do. Sadly, I was on a family plan and I couldn't afford to buy it off contract so I settled for a MT3G.
The memory of it faded and I had a chance to get off of my Family Plan on T-Mobile and join my wife on Sprint (who were going to be getting the Epic 4G) so I did it. Of course, it was a massive upgrade from my MT3G but I never particularly liked it. Eventually, I traded my Epic for an Evo and it was great. Not as fast or as powerful but I still quite enjoyed it. Then again, I had a chance to leave Sprint (I'd been very unhappy with them from the start) so I went back to T-Mobile and having read a little about the Nexus S I decided to buy one for both myself and my wife.
Again, don't get me wrong, I absolutely love it and so does my wife, but really when it comes down to brass tacks the Nexus S is pretty much a Vibrant without TouchWiz and with a NFC chip and a LED flash. The 'WOW' factor I had with the original Nexus just isn't there.
Is there anything wrong with the Hummingbird chip? Absolutely not. Its the most powerful processor in any phone on the market in the US without a doubt. But the Nexus line, to me, should be the pinnacle of Android performance. It should be the shining example of what the platform can do and where its going (like the Nexus One did with the Snapdragon and its eventual acceptance into most high-performance phones) and not feel like a re-badged five month old phone even if that phone is one of the best on the market. Had Samsung held off a little bit and made the Nexus S a dual-core phone I think it would easily usurp the Motorola Atrix from its lofty throne but as it stands it feels (and seems to be selling) like an afterthought.
Now, I'm still on the fence about these Tegra2 phones. Of course the gadget-whore in me wants to run out and buy one but the sensible part of me wants to see how they run and see how badly they eat battery life (as I'm sure no one can dispute they will). Will I eventually get one? Its more than likely, but I can't say when as I'm pretty happy with the Nexus S and I really like that updates are pushed out from Google and not a carrier or a manufacturer focused on selling more new handsets and less on supporting the ones they've already sold. Only time will tell.
That's just my two cents though.
I typically buy every new phone that comes out to try them and see if I liked it more them my blackberry bold 9700.. I would always end up selling them on ebay bc I didn't find much to love about them (i.e.- g2, vibrant, mt3g, g1 etc), after buying the nexus s, I was hooked. I had a nexus 1 for about two months and then sold that. It cracks me up to hear all the people already downing this nexus s. this phone is solid. I won't be switching to another phone unless it is pure google, no sense or touch whiz, and accompanies higher data speeds. A dual core would be nice , but until that happens, my nexus s is what I'm sticking with!
Sent from my Nexus S using XDA App
The simple fact is Tegra 2 and the Hummingbird wont stand a chance against Qualcomms dual core processors. Android at this point in time is more optimised for Qualcomm and being an owner of the Desire HD and Nexus S i can tell you the desire HD is much smoother even with its HTC Sense bloatware. But i can't stand waiting for updates so i gave it to my sister. But my advice would be don't get any Tegra 2 devices and just wait for the big guns (qualcomm)!
nice GPU is nice, but GPU is mostly for games......for kids....you kids wanna play some games, get yourself an xbox or some ****....
bratfink said:
The simple fact is Tegra 2 and the Hummingbird wont stand a chance against Qualcomms dual core processors. Android at this point in time is more optimised for Qualcomm and being an owner of the Desire HD and Nexus S i can tell you the desire HD is much smoother even with its HTC Sense bloatware. But i can't stand waiting for updates so i gave it to my sister. But my advice would be don't get any Tegra 2 devices and just wait for the big guns (qualcomm)!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed, as when Qualcomm drops it thats when you know its serious business. Terga2 for the time being will hold the crown and make no mistake Hummingbird does not stand a chance against it.
Orion is going to be the fastest duel core chipset in 2011. The cpu can clock close to 2 ghz per core. Will have the same features that Qualcomms have that allow high linpack benchmarks (but not real world improvements). The hummingbird has always been the faster cpu atthe same mhz then Qualcomms cpus. Orion chipset is using a quad core gpu that performs better then xbox 360 gpu. I can not find any duel core that out performs these specs.
LOL?
shep211 said:
Orion is going to be the fastest duel core chipset in 2011. The cpu can clock close to 2 ghz per core. Will have the same features that Qualcomms have that allow high linpack benchmarks (but not real world improvements). The hummingbird has always been the faster cpu atthe same mhz then Qualcomms cpus. Orion chipset is using a quad core gpu that performs better then xbox 360 gpu. I can not find any duel core that out performs these specs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wait? The hummingbird has always been faster cpu at the same Mz then a Qualcomm? Lets think about where your getting that idea..
The Hummingbird deffinitly outperforms the Nexus 1, Htc Desire etc etc which btw are all 1st gen yet i agree have the same 1Ghz clock speed. But still in cpu extensive tasks the 1st gen qualcomms are still not that far behind. Looking at the 2nd gen qualcomms however such as the HTC Desire HD we see the cpu out performing the Hummingbird and only been let down my an extremely marginal difference in the GPU performance. So forget about spec sheets and look at real world usage. Grab yourself a HTC Desire HD with a gingerbread rom (what i had) and a Nexus S and see for your self which wins. Im sorry but Samsung are ****, Google is the only good thing about the Nexus S, but thats good enough for me.
shep211 said:
Orion is going to be the fastest duel core chipset in 2011. The cpu can clock close to 2 ghz per core. Will have the same features that Qualcomms have that allow high linpack benchmarks (but not real world improvements). The hummingbird has always been the faster cpu atthe same mhz then Qualcomms cpus. Orion chipset is using a quad core gpu that performs better then xbox 360 gpu. I can not find any duel core that out performs these specs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
honestly i always thought that the first gen snapdragon, such as the nexus one, outperformed the current hummingbird CPU in a lot of certain types of computational tasks/tests. cpu vs cpu, its very close, the hummingbird doesnt have that much of an advantage. it does have a much better GPU, which is where it shines.
so i'd imagine if the first gen snapdragon is nearly matching current hummingbird, then imagine what second gen snapdragon dual core, smaller die, will do. (i understand hummingbird dual will also come out, but just saying it will still be close).
RogerPodacter said:
honestly i always thought that the first gen snapdragon, such as the nexus one, outperformed the current hummingbird CPU in a lot of certain types of computational tasks/tests. cpu vs cpu, its very close, the hummingbird doesnt have that much of an advantage. it does have a much better GPU, which is where it shines.
so i'd imagine if the first gen snapdragon is nearly matching current hummingbird, then imagine what second gen snapdragon dual core, smaller die, will do. (i understand hummingbird dual will also come out, but just saying it will still be close).
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The second-gen snapdragon is the processor in the G2 and the Evo Shift 4G, isn't it?
shep211 said:
Orion is going to be the fastest duel core chipset in 2011. The cpu can clock close to 2 ghz per core. Will have the same features that Qualcomms have that allow high linpack benchmarks (but not real world improvements). The hummingbird has always been the faster cpu atthe same mhz then Qualcomms cpus. Orion chipset is using a quad core gpu that performs better then xbox 360 gpu. I can not find any duel core that out performs these specs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Actually, to expand upon this, the Orion will have a Cortex A9 which actually has "the same features that Qualcomms have that allow high linpack benchmarks," along with more features not found in the Snapdragon.
To be more specific, the Snapdragon has elements of speculative execution with branch prediction, which is most important area in which it differs from the Cortex A8 reference design. This causes its floating point performance (very important in 3D calculations) to be very high. Unfortunately for Qualcomm, though, even the Adreno 205 falls short in terms of performance. Thus, even though the Scorpion CPU core in the Snapdragon is better at 3D than the Hummingbird's Cortex A8, the Snapdragon's GPU is so castrated that it's much slower in games overall. As a side note, the Cortex A8 in the Hummingbird actually has 2 times the L2 cache compared to the reference A8 design.
The Cortex A9 in the Tegra 2, on the other hand, supports full out of order execution (in addition to speculative execution and branch prediction found in the Snapdragon's Scorpion CPU core). This yields roughly 25% higher IPC compared to the Cortex A8, which is why the CPU section of Tegra 2 benchmarks seem to be roughly that much faster than our Hummingbird. Benchmarks have been mixed for its GPU, as I pointed out here, though that could have been due to a higher screen resolution or immature drivers.
Bottom line is that while the CPU will be ~25% better per clock cycle than our Cortex A8 (when only using one core), its GPU is roughly on the same level--sometimes performing better, sometimes worse. Another thing to remember is that since the Hummingbird uses a PowerVR architecture, it is tile-based deferred rendering. This basically means that fillrate and memory bandwidth are much less of an issue than they are in traditional rendering methods.
What will differentiate Tegra 2 though (in my humble opinion) is software tailored for its strengths, which is what Tegra Zone will likely bring. Sure the Hummingbird's fast, and perhaps even better for GPU rendering, but the code optimized for the Tegra 2's GPU may perform better on a Tegra 2 than on our possibly-faster SGX 540.
Relax, just wait until all that Tegra 2 phones released.
Certainly there will be some reviews, comparisons, benchmarks, etc.
In the mean time, enjoy your Nexus S. It is fast enough for current apps that are available You don't need dual core to run Angry Birds
Then we can wait the next Nexus 3 !
kolyan said:
nice GPU is nice, but GPU is mostly for games......for kids....you kids wanna play some games, get yourself an xbox or some ****....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Err what? GPU relates to the smoothness in transitions of the home screen, the smoothness of the browser, the smoothness of everything. It's not just about games good sir. Compare screen swiping with a live wallpaper on G2 vs Galaxy S on stock Launcher2 and prepare to see why GPU matters.
Or use a phone that doesn't even have a GPU. Like a Wildfire. Then throw it out the window.
Going further, you can't count Quadrant 3d scores on the Nexus S because it doesn't render properly due to Gingerbread incompatibility.
The other reason the Optimus 2x scores higher is the i/o part. If we do the same ext4 lagfix that is probably built into the 2x we get the same i/o as it, and about the same Quadrant, maybe a little lower due to the GPU not running properly ever on Quadrant with Gingerbread.
As for CPU, yes the Tegra2 will be better. It's an A9. However the differences will be subtle at best until the end of 2011 when things are optimized for the Tegra2, which by then both the Qualcomm and Orion god processors will be out.
As far as processing power between the Hummingbird and Snapdragon, it definitely is more powerful than the Nexus One's processor, and GPU knocks it off it's feet.
As for the 2nd gen Snapdragon vs Hummingbird, they're probably about equal processors. The GPU gives the Hummingbird the edge and you will notice it if you take a Live wallpaper and compare Launcher2.apk screen swipes on a G2 vs Nexus S. It is very nudgy on the G2, but smooth on Nexus S.
What causes the Snap Dragon to score so high in Linpack for instance is the FPU aka float processing unit which isn't really worth caring about when it comes to every day tasks.
But yes, the Tegra2 will definitely be a bit more powerful than the Hummingbird. But it won't be tons tons tons rapejob over 9000. This is why Google released the Nexus S with the Hummingbird without second thought.
kenvan19 said:
The second-gen snapdragon is the processor in the G2 and the Evo Shift 4G, isn't it?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well yes, i was referring to the original snapdragon in the nexus one. i think the snapdragon in the G2 and evo shift is just the same snapdragon CPU with an improved GPU. so there's kinda 2 separate topics, CPU vs CPU, and then the GPU vs GPU. i believe the hummingbird and snapdragon CPU vs CPU is rather close, sometimes the snapdragon beats it, sometimes the hummingbird does. then add in the GPU, i believe the hummingbird GPU is better than the new snapddragon adreno. not sure by how much though.
but an example of why it's important for the GPU to actually be taken advantage of in code, the nexus s web browser doesnt seem to be using the GPU properly, so relying soley on CPU vs CPU, we see the nexus one perform BETTER on some types of web pages as the snapdragon seems to be either coded properly, or it is just better for those certain types of tasks. basically my opinion is snapdragon is a better CPU, but the hummingbird has the better GPU.
Edited... I was ranting very off topic
The Nexus S really looks great, but I have doubts if I should really buy it when it's available in Germany/Austria or Switzerland...
The point is I start studying software development in the autumn 2011 and can't afford a new phone each year and would use the phone for about 2 years.
So my question is:
Will I have fun with this phone (as a developer) for the following 2 years or should I buy a more powerful phone?
Note: Currently I have a Nokia 5800 and I definitely want a new one because the bugs are annoying even with ported C6-Firmware it is not really satisfying...
thanks you very much!
ive done so many benchmarks on htc sensation nd gs2..but i still find the gs2 win by a huge margin...but on the other hand..the anandtech benchmark on 1.5ghz msm 8660 showed that it beats all the other gpu's such as mali 400 with its adreno 220...but still y cant it cant beat up the gs2? what is the main reason for this?? and is the msm 8660 on cdma evo 3d is jus d same as 8260 except for cdma connectivity? or it has its differences?? will there b a better benchmark on msm8260 anywhere soon?? even the latest smartbench 2011 which supports dual cores also lists the 8260 at lower benchmark!!! sum1 plz explain,,,...and y msm 8660 is way powerfull than exynos though it shows low benchmarks??
The Exynos is IMO an overall better processor than any Qualcomms. The Exynos is a ARM Cortex-A9 processor while the Sensation's is from what I understand similar to ARM Cortex-A8 architecture. The only advantages the Sensation's processor has over the GS2's are on paper: the Adreno 220 GPU is supposedly better, and the Sensation has asynchronous cores, which the GS2 doesn't have. Otherwise, I don't really know what makes the Exynos better, and I also don't know what the difference is between the Sensation and Evo 3D units.
the 8660 is the CDMA version of the 8260
I don't put alot of stock into benchmarks, and very few are accurate because they can't truly read dual cores.
To the two noobs in post 1 and post 2
The Sensation processor really isnt inferior compared to the SGS2
Why do i say that, because your sensation at this moment in your time in your hand is probably ONLY using one core. the 2nd core will be in an idle state and only activate when you need it.
THE SGS2 no matter what u do, both cores will work together, even when your just looking at touchwiz you are using two cores, even with the screen off in your pocket your using two cores, there is no way to turn one off, thus consumes a little more battery.
With the sensation the 2nd core kicks in when you need the power. they do not work together. Currently if you are looking at the dev thread in the development section you will see the progress.
SImpler term
think of a turbocharger
SGS2 uses two turbos continuously,
Sensation uses one turbo but when it needs more power the 2nd turbo kicks in
I'm well aware that no one has really been able to push the Sensation's processor to what it's capable of. That said, I have done my research on the SGS2 and Sensation processors and still believe that the Exynos is superior to the Qualcomm. I am excited to see what the Sensation can do when we can explore its power, but I still think that it will fall a little short of the Exynos because of the similar to A8 vs. A9 architecture. My prediction is that once proper dual-core support comes for us, we will easily be able to get better performance than the SGS2 has stock, but when it comes to fully modded out Sensation vs. fully modded out SGS2, the SGS2 will still be faster.
To use another car analogy, it's like saying "my car isn't inferior" just because if you throw on some bolt-ons you will be able to get marginally better performance than a stock competitor. But, if both cars were to be fully modded (bolt-ons, FI'd, proper custom engine management, better rubber, etc.), the other car would pull ahead. Essentially, I think that the ultimate the SGS2 can achieve is greater than the ultimate that the Sensation can achieve (but it won't be by much once proper support comes out).
Exynos's A9 has shorter pipelines and is fully out of order and the Sensation's Adreno, despite being faster, has to render at a higher resolution.
Sure, the Qualcomm may win some synthetic benchmarks, but the A9 is still faster due to a better architecture. Same way how K8 was better than Netburst despite the latter having higher clocks, cache, etc, but its deep pipeline was ultimately one of its bigger flaws.
The A9 will always have a 20-25% performance benefit over the A8 if they are running at the same clock speed. The Scorpion architecture is based off of the A8, but it also has some A9 elements because there's so such thing as a dual-core A8 processor. The performance of the Scorpion is somewhere in between an A8 and an A9 because of this. The Exynos at its current state inside of the GSII is clocked at the same speed as the MSM8x60 inside of the Sensation and EVO 3D which is why it has a performance advantage. If it were clocked at 1.5 GHz, then the MSM8x60 would probably have the same type of performance, if not better.
Anand Tech said:
From a CPU standpoint, Apple has a performance advantage at the same clock speed, but Qualcomm runs its cores at a higher clock. NVIDIA claimed that the move to an out-of-order architecture in the A9 was good for a 20% increase in IPC. Qualcomm has a 20% clock speed advantage. In most situations I think it's safe to say that the A5 [ARM Cortex-A9] and the APQ8060 [dual-core Scorpion] have equally performing CPUs.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hope that helped.
thank u so much to all of u guys out here...!! nd from wat ive studies...as u all said the msm8660 in sensation nd evo 3d uses only 1 core and the 2nd strts oly wen needed thanks to the asynchronous architecture of the 8660..!! and the cpu nd gpu of sg2 is jus "ordinary" as compared to 8660 though it has a9 architecture...and 8660 isnt a a9 nor an a8..its different..it may resemble a8 but its different..i has the advantages of both a8 nd a9....check the anandtech review of 8660 along with the review of exynos side by side then u will know what really has the power...the latest optimus 3d's chipset matches to that of qualcomm with a great score in GLegypt.. thanks alot for all of u guys..
I really feel the benchmarks are pointless as they never relate to real world use. Who here could possibly use the CPU like the benchmark can?
After the 2.3.4 update, my phone is faster. The web browsing is twice as fast for me!
I eagerly await CM7 but really dont think it can improve my phone that much more. I am stock, rooted, S-OFF and use ADW EX along with Sense 3.0 FROZEN solid. My battery life (chichitec) is more than I need with moderate use. I like to charge my phone at night while I sleep, so if it lasts me until I am done for the day...GREAT!
At this point, when I look at the SGS2, I feel my phone works just as well but looks 100 times better!
I do feel that the Sensation CPU will wind up outperforming the SGS2 once it is used like it should be...
Matt
It doesnt matter if msm8260 is better than exynos or adreno 220 is better than mali 400, the only thing that matters is real life performance and Samsung optimized their devices better than htc. If only htc take the time to better optimized their drivers and such it would be a faster and better device than samsung. HTC already wins hands down when it comes to design and choice of materials,too bad they are too lazy to optimize for a more superior experience.
brusko1972 I agree with your point that Samsung hardware and software collaboration that makes Samsung efficient than HTC. HTC need to work on hardware and software match to improve their performance specially with power efficiency and distribution. HTC Sense UI is quite heavy and more power and hardware consuming where as Touchwiz is very light UI. That may be also the reasons for low benchmarking results.
http://www.engadget.com/2013/05/06/samsung-galaxy-s4-octacore-review/
The A15 in the octa-core isn't any better or worse than the krait in the snapdragon, either in performance or benchmarks. The extra four helper cores you get doesn't improve battery life. In fact, with the four a15 cores, it is actually WORSE than the more efficient krait cores. All those people bragging about how much the A15 is better than the krait based on thin air speculation really need to shove it up their butt.
It was already expected that the four extra low power cores in an octa core would not make much difference in battery life and actually be worse off than a regular quad-core processor. History has already shown with the Tegra 3's helper core that utilizing low power helper cores is a tricky and inefficient affair. It's not easy to switch between them, to prioritize when to use what, and instead of making a more efficient A15 design, Samsung relied too much on the chip's switching capabilities instead of making an overall better processor.
So if you want LTE, BETTER BATTERY LIFE, rom compatibility and dev support with the most widespread SoC, actual availability in stores everywhere, then stop waiting or worrying about the Exynos octa-core and pick the widely available snapdragon version of the S4. Anyone still spouting how great the octa-core version will be and still lies about it being EIGHT WHOLE CORES! when there's really only four are the biggest trolls in the S4 forum.
this video show more real compasion
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wt5im3WAZYc
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=2258519
Heh, load of bullcrap.
If you do video battery tests you do them on Wi-Fi, congratulations on testing modem battery life. (Same carrier? Same tower? Same time of day? Bravo on apples vs oranges Engadget)
The benchmarks ARE faster on the 9500. Let's not mention that Engadget are incompetent fools who don't understand benchmarking. The Linpack scores are a joke as is CF-bench, one because the benchmark literally takes 0.3s and if you're idling before you press the start button that's not even though time for the CPU to ramp up to highest speed. CF-bench fails due to thermal throttling. At least that's a valid negative point, but not performance, scores are far beyond the 30k mark. I'm also getting funny more realistic results on the other benches: 661ms vs 732 SunSpider, 10% higher Vellamo score, 300 more 3D rating, and I'm sure there's others. Funny how they suddenly don't use GeekBench.
Matter of fact: the 9500 is undoubtedly faster and that's a technical reality. They even state so in their subjective comparison.
As for battery life: I've already mentioned how the early firmware is unfinished. I'm getting roughly 10% per hour usage; right now at 61% and 3h30 screen, and that's with doing benchmarks for the last half hour which ate 9%.
The only correct *video* battery life tests I've seen came from GSMArena (9505) and Russian mobile-review who got 12h.
You're going to have to wait for AnandTech to do a review in a few months to be able to use it as argumental material in such discussions.
Engadget is the pinnacle of ignorance and technical non-reporting, and as they've proved in their botched S3 review last year, the benchmarking seems to be done by the principal of their local baboon academy.
katamari201 said:
All those people bragging about how much the A15 is better than the krait based on thin air speculation really need to shove it up their butt.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't think people thought that devices using Octa vs. S-600 wouldn't perform comparably. It would make no sense for Samsung not to optimize both to the best of their ability and S-600 is a powerful and efficient chip. You can't help but get the feeling that the s/w isn't "done" on either version based on comments on all the SGS4 forums about lag and display driver issues. That's echoed by some of AndreiLux's comments from looking at the code. Octa is literally the first public implementation of big.LITTLE. All of ARM’s future designs will be based on it. That means Qualcomm’s next generation of chips after S-800 will be based on it also as they license ARM’s designs. I'd expect over time that updates will continue to improve Octa's performance (power and efficiency) whereas S-600 is simply a massaged version of S4 Pro and the OEMs have a lot more experience working with it so there's less upside potential. I'd still buy the i9500 over the i9505 if I were going to get a SGS4 (I'm waiting for the N3) as I think its long-term potential is greater than S-600 and, going forward, I'd expect it to be used in more Samsung devices once Qualcomm's RF360 universal LTE baseband becomes available. Once that happens, unless there's production capacity issues, there no reason Octa wouldn't be Samsung go-to high-end chip. Just my opinion of course.
P.S. - The i9500 has about 250MB more free RAM (13%) than the i9505 as Adreno reserves 500MB for itself while PowerVR reserves a little over 200MB.
matheus_sc said:
this video show more real compasion
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wt5im3WAZYc
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Funny thing is you do the same comparison on another I9505 or I9500 and it will most probably yield different results... they are too close to compare
---------- Post added at 11:42 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:38 AM ----------
BarryH_GEG said:
P.S. - The i9500 has about 250MB more free RAM (13%) than the i9505 as Adreno reserves 500MB for itself while PowerVR reserves a little over 200MB.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Really? Where is the source for this? Anyone like to show free ram comparisons between both devices? I am sitting around 750mb free ram,I am Stock Rooted, I have 5 active applications open... And I still have most of the samsung bloat
BarryH_GEG said:
P.S. - The i9500 has about 250MB more free RAM (13%) than the i9505 as Adreno reserves 500MB for itself while PowerVR reserves a little over 200MB.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
None of that memory on neither SoCs is allocated to the GPUs. Video memory is reserved on-the-fly from user-space. That unavailable memory is dedicated to camera controllers, image processors, video decoder, and a bunch of other smaller buffers.
katamari201 said:
http://www.engadget.com/2013/05/06/samsung-galaxy-s4-octacore-review/
The A15 in the octa-core isn't any better or worse than the krait in the snapdragon, either in performance or benchmarks. The extra four helper cores you get doesn't improve battery life. In fact, with the four a15 cores, it is actually WORSE than the more efficient krait cores. All those people bragging about how much the A15 is better than the krait based on thin air speculation really need to shove it up their butt.
It was already expected that the four extra low power cores in an octa core would not make much difference in battery life and actually be worse off than a regular quad-core processor. History has already shown with the Tegra 3's helper core that utilizing low power helper cores is a tricky and inefficient affair. It's not easy to switch between them, to prioritize when to use what, and instead of making a more efficient A15 design, Samsung relied too much on the chip's switching capabilities instead of making an overall better processor.
So if you want LTE, BETTER BATTERY LIFE, rom compatibility and dev support with the most widespread SoC, actual availability in stores everywhere, then stop waiting or worrying about the Exynos octa-core and pick the widely available snapdragon version of the S4. Anyone still spouting how great the octa-core version will be and still lies about it being EIGHT WHOLE CORES! when there's really only four are the biggest trolls in the S4 forum.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Get ornery myself some times. Trust me on this, go out, find some nice young lady, make her see God. Later when you read this and are wondering what the hell you were thinking you can apologize. Everybody wins. :good:
Well Said, AMEN
Well said Krabman.....
katamari201 said:
http://www.engadget.com/2013/05/06/samsung-galaxy-s4-octacore-review/
The A15 in the octa-core isn't any better or worse than the krait in the snapdragon, either in performance or benchmarks. The extra four helper cores you get doesn't improve battery life. In fact, with the four a15 cores, it is actually WORSE than the more efficient krait cores. All those people bragging about how much the A15 is better than the krait based on thin air speculation really need to shove it up their butt.
It was already expected that the four extra low power cores in an octa core would not make much difference in battery life and actually be worse off than a regular quad-core processor. History has already shown with the Tegra 3's helper core that utilizing low power helper cores is a tricky and inefficient affair. It's not easy to switch between them, to prioritize when to use what, and instead of making a more efficient A15 design, Samsung relied too much on the chip's switching capabilities instead of making an overall better processor.
So if you want LTE, BETTER BATTERY LIFE, rom compatibility and dev support with the most widespread SoC, actual availability in stores everywhere, then stop waiting or worrying about the Exynos octa-core and pick the widely available snapdragon version of the S4. Anyone still spouting how great the octa-core version will be and still lies about it being EIGHT WHOLE CORES! when there's really only four are the biggest trolls in the S4 forum.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
AndreiLux said:
None of that memory on neither SoCs is allocated to the GPUs. Video memory is reserved on-the-fly from user-space. That unavailable memory is dedicated to camera controllers, image processors, video decoder, and a bunch of other smaller buffers.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
People were saying the i9505 has 1.5GB of available RAM while the i9500 has 1.8GB. Is that true? If it is, what's contributing to the difference?
BarryH_GEG said:
People were saying the i9505 has 1.5GB of available RAM while the i9500 has 1.8GB. Is that true? If it is, what's contributing to the difference?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, it's not true. My i9505 have 1.78gb of RAM available.
BarryH_GEG said:
People were saying the i9505 has 1.5GB of available RAM while the i9500 has 1.8GB. Is that true? If it is, what's contributing to the difference?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
loollll no ... where are ppl coming up with this nonsense
Who cares really when are we gonna use the phone at max capacity? And 3 months later something better will be out so quit your *****ing and enjoy ya phone
Sent from my GT-I9505 using xda premium
By the time Verizon ships my S4, the next super phone will be out! Seriously, I've got to quit reading these forums.
Sent from my SCH-I510 using Tapatalk 2
1.78gb ram on I9505 here
In any device even low end device you will not find the full ram visible as some is reserved exclusively of the system.
Also the post was on difference between Octa and Quall why would you expect a significant different as if that happens samsung would be trouble because they are the same device right S4 so samsung would tuned both in a way that the performance battery life is almost the same that hows it should be right you cannot say my s4 is slower then yours bec I purchased it from US ????
BarryH_GEG said:
People were saying the i9505 has 1.5GB of available RAM while the i9500 has 1.8GB. Is that true? If it is, what's contributing to the difference?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It really doesn't made a huge difference on Android devices. The extra memory just allows you to have more applications paused in the background before the kernel kills them to free up space. With the S3 if you're playing a game and switch to a web browser it's very likely that the game will be closed as it only has 1GB. On the S4 it will stay open in the background.
katamari201 said:
http://www.engadget.com/2013/05/06/samsung-galaxy-s4-octacore-review/
The A15 in the octa-core isn't any better or worse than the krait in the snapdragon, either in performance or benchmarks. The extra four helper cores you get doesn't improve battery life. In fact, with the four a15 cores, it is actually WORSE than the more efficient krait cores. All those people bragging about how much the A15 is better than the krait based on thin air speculation really need to shove it up their butt.
It was already expected that the four extra low power cores in an octa core would not make much difference in battery life and actually be worse off than a regular quad-core processor. History has already shown with the Tegra 3's helper core that utilizing low power helper cores is a tricky and inefficient affair. It's not easy to switch between them, to prioritize when to use what, and instead of making a more efficient A15 design, Samsung relied too much on the chip's switching capabilities instead of making an overall better processor.
So if you want LTE, BETTER BATTERY LIFE, rom compatibility and dev support with the most widespread SoC, actual availability in stores everywhere, then stop waiting or worrying about the Exynos octa-core and pick the widely available snapdragon version of the S4. Anyone still spouting how great the octa-core version will be and still lies about it being EIGHT WHOLE CORES! when there's really only four are the biggest trolls in the S4 forum.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Amazing! Where were you all these days??
BTW, I don't have to wait, nor do I have to worry about getting a I9500. Stores near me don't have any Snapdragon variant. I think it's always a good practise not to take advise from a random person in the forums.
Nobody asked for your advise on what version to get. People are knowledgeable enough to make that decision.
Hello,
Im currently using a Samsung Galaxy S6 32gb and i love this phone and for me its a very good phone, it has everything i need, i have 9 pages of apps in the app drawer all my movie, games, pics, docs and songs and the phone never let me down but im a performance kinda guy and while i love the performance of the s6 after watching the unpacked 2016 i have decided to get the s7 but after doing so looking i found that the 8890 is more of a CPU SoC while the 820 is more of a GPU SoC so i wanna know i want to have the full S7 experience complete with the gear vr and vulkan api so which one should i get i know that the 820 is a 2+2 CPU with the GPU is doing about 550+ gflops while the 8890 is 4+4 and the GPU is doing about 250+ gflops so which one should i get and why and what are the pros and cons of each one
Thanks a lot and sorry for the long post
The only thing that matters is if you care about AOSP ROMs or not. If you do, Snapdragon is your only choice.
As said before I think there will not be a big difference in regards to the performance. The SD820 tends to be a little bit faster in single core applications, while the Exynos will perform better for multi core applications. Will you notice it? I doubt so.
The GPU in the SD820 is indeed faster, but potentially oversized, too (produces more heat => throttles more). So while benchmarks could be better, after some minutes the GPUs are (more or less) on the same high. Some people will agree, some will not
I think the only point that really matters is if you would like to get custom roms, mainly AOSP roms, at a certain time. With the SD820 your chances are a lot higher. Apart from that...
kaspar737 said:
The only thing that matters is if you care about AOSP ROMs or not. If you do, Snapdragon is your only choice.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
cerbsium said:
As said before I think there will not be a big difference in regards to the performance. The SD820 tends to be a little bit faster in single core applications, while the Exynos will perform better for multi core applications. Will you notice it? I doubt so.
The GPU in the SD820 is indeed faster, but potentially oversized, too (produces more heat => throttles more). So while benchmarks could be better, after some minutes the GPUs are (more or less) on the same high. Some people will agree, some will not
I think the only point that really matters is if you would like to get custom roms, mainly AOSP roms, at a certain time. With the SD820 your chances are a lot higher. Apart from that...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Im not actually into costume roms at all, i actually like the Samsung rom with the touch wiz ui so i guess it will be the 8890 since there wont be any real world noticeable difference
exynos gives 38k em 3d antutu and snap 820 50k, for games snap 820 will be better
matheus_sc said:
exynos gives 38k em 3d antutu and snap 820 50k, for games snap 820 will be better
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You're confusing benchmark scores with game performance. Despite the difference you list (which I suspect, from Exynos' perspective, is the worst result amongst many), I'll be amazed if you find a single game with a discernible performance increase on the Snapdragon. It's all about the heat and power efficiency, there could well be a difference between the two in that respect.
Noob question
How do I tell which one I have?
thafz said:
How do I tell which one I have?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Are you in america? Then you have the snapdragon, elsewhere gets the exynos.
peachpuff said:
Are you in america? Then you have the snapdragon, elsewhere gets the exynos.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Okay thanks I also ran the benchmark last night and it shows there exynos. Actually thought I had the 820 since mine gets pretty warm
matheus_sc said:
exynos gives 38k em 3d antutu and snap 820 50k, for games snap 820 will be better
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Wouldn't be accurate to say the exynos has a faster CPU and generally performs better in day to day tasks, while the adreno has a faster GPU which would do better with high end 3D gaming?