thinking about making a car pc out of an old small form factor computer. Since the roms code is small I was wondering if it can be done? If anoyne knows or has tried this id love to hear about it. Also if you know of any other versions of windows that might be appropriate for a car pc needs to work with bt audio sincd my head unit accepts a2dp. and able to run tomtom.
if you could use an emulator
but not sure if tomtom would work on an emulator
with gps
problem is that an os is binary code as in written to a surden
cpu
and cpu's in pc's speak a whole different "language" then the arm cpu's in our pocketpc's
of cause if wm is really running on Athena's x86(pc cpu)
then maybe
but ms dont really added support for other cpu types in a long time
they cut support really alpha cpu's from digital got removed with windows nt3.5
and mips and the other type got the axe with pocketpc2000
TomTom can work in an emulator, I tried it in my car PC. But it is not as nice as running, say, Destinator 6 directly in Windows.
Windows XP is actually your best bet - I have it (modded using nLite) running on a VIA EPIA 10000k and its performance is reasonable.
If you want to know more about car PCs, have a look at http://www.mp3car.com or if you are in the UK then http://www.digital-car.co.uk
You will of course find much more information there than here.
I'm not sure this will help, but here is some information on running Windows CE (and Windows Mobile 5) off a USB key. Most of it hinges on using the free Microsoft Device Emulator. Tweaking it to run on your PC directly shouldn't be too much of a problem.
Also I commend you on recycling an old computer rather than buying a new one!
Edit: Oops! After all that I forgot to add the link!
Here it is:
http://www.furrygoat.com/2005/09/portable_ce_20.html
So in this thread it tells you how to install pc operating systems like windows and linux on the Evo 3D.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1459153
This, is freaking awesome. This one is a big breakthrough.
----
Here is the thread in the Nook Color forums for ubuntu on the device:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1055954
----
These two threads are native installs, not using some client to access the installation, the device itself is the client as it should be.
This is not some chrooted virtual OS simulation, but the real deal installed to the device.
----
In the back of my mind i've wanted to play with ubuntu installed on the MT4GS, but not a virtual installation I want it installed and running on the device natively.
I definitely don't have the time to do this and a lot i'm trying to do around here even if I wasn't in my busy season for work.
Dropping this information so I can find it later when I do get to trying to get ubuntu (and now windows XP looks like a possibility) installed on this device.
If anyone else feels like looking into this, here's a good place to start. If anyone comes across any other projects that are the real deal and not virtual installs please post links here.
Have fun!
Blue6IX said:
So in this thread it tells you how to install pc operating systems like windows and linux on the Evo 3D.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1459153
This, is freaking awesome. This one is a big breakthrough.
----
Here is the thread in the Nook Color forums for ubuntu on the device:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=1055954
----
These two threads are native installs, not using some client to access the installation, the device itself is the client as it should be.
This is not some chrooted virtual OS simulation, but the real deal installed to the device.
----
In the back of my mind i've wanted to play with ubuntu installed on the MT4GS, but not a virtual installation I want it installed and running on the device natively.
I definitely don't have the time to do this and a lot i'm trying to do around here even if I wasn't in my busy season for work.
Dropping this information so I can find it later when I do get to trying to get ubuntu (and now windows XP looks like a possibility) installed on this device.
If anyone else feels like looking into this, here's a good place to start. If anyone comes across any other projects that are the real deal and not virtual installs please post links here.
Have fun!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Regardless of what impression you may have, it is ABSOLUTELY IMPOSSIBLE to run MSWin on ARM hardware natively. The reason for this is that MSWin is x86 and ARM is... ARM. The approach used in the first link is to use BOCHS (pronounced "Box"), which is a VIRTUAL HARDWARE EMULATOR. It requires a host operating system to be functioning in the background, in this case Linux.
As for Ubuntu... well sure. No problem. Its Linux and the phone runs Linux. Not that big of a stretch to replace the Android parts with GNU.
Note that NONE of this is any kind of "great breakthrough". Bochs has been around for a VERY long time. First OPEN SOURCED in early 2000. Yeah, 12 years ago. As for Ubuntu... well I suppose that the main reason that most people aren't making a native android replacement out of ubuntu, is that not many people are all that interested in it. Cute in theory, but not practical.
What would be a more worthy project would be to upgrade android to GNU libraries and utilities. This would afford us an actually USEFUL balance between the two. Also the ability to run X *through* android without having to do stupid things like VNC. Have the proper interface ***AS AN ANDROID APPLICATION***, leaving Android to work (i.e., phone calls, etc.) while simultaneously offering the standard Linux applications.
My thought though, is that this is becoming less and less important. Firefox is on Android now, the Document foundation has announced LibreOffice for Android -- supposed to be by late 2012 to early 2013... GIMP has no place on Android... That certainly covers the basics.
Appreciate the post. I didn't have time to dig into it too deeply, so took it at face value for the impression I got. Happened to come across it in passing and didn't want to lose track of something vital to the future dev of a project like this on the doubleshot. (but definitely this doesn't belong in the dev section at this time - just clutter there.)
I was hoping people would add to it, especially the way you have, who had more of an understanding of what's going on there - I didn't realize that it was a virtual environment for the windows stuff, but it did seem to good to be true.
Even if no one responded I figured the thread would get pushed down out of the way, but still be here when I got the time to come back to it.
----
My reason for running native linux on the device itself is to be able to use the Android SDK and tools without needing a computer to do so. I have 2 of these phones and a Nook Color. The NC has USB host support, so I could plug the doubleshot into it without frying either device. (yes, i'm blending android and linux concepts here - but usb host support in android shows that it's capable of doing it)
Even from one doubleshot to the other I could use wifi adb for a lot of stuff without plugging them into each other through USB and frying the phones. So that would be a victory as well.
The lack of a hardware charging circuit in the doubleshot makes the worry of frying the phones a big deal, power transfer through USB is a big hurdle to jump in management.
Beyond that - the doubleshot is powerful enough on hardware specs to be able to compile a kernel, but that's not gonna happen through a virtual linux install because the overhead is too much. A native install might just be able to do it though. Won't know until I try, but it's worth the work to get to the point of trying, even if it doesn't work out.
The Nook Color probably won't be able to compile a kernel - it's asking too much from a device not really able to handle that.
Getting what I mentioned above to work would mean I could do all my dev work with what fits in my pocket, and let me keep working wherever I am.
I do like the idea of an app to work with this through Android itself - but I don't see how I could use the SDk and variety of user-created tools without a native linux install. Worth pursuing either way though.
If anyone has anything to add, i'd be welcome to hear it. Just understand this is not a project i'm working on or actively pursuing right now - but fully intend to down the line.
Actually blue. There is a thread somewhere that has a step by step on installing ubuntu on gingerbread. I meant to add it when I added the backtrack link. For some reason I didn't, I probably forgot, I actually think the link for it is in the backtrack thread in the sticky.
If I do find it ill let you know.
Sent from my ICS Splashed using Tapatalk
Hi Folks
Just wondering if anyone has seriously considered or is using android on the desktop?
Hear me out here!
Since stopping using windows as my main desktop OS about 18 months ago, I've been enjoying all the fruits that open source has to offer. I think I must have trying nearly every flavour of Debian/Ubuntu distro's and currently using some Mint/Gnome 2 setup. partly due to Unity's immaturity as Multihead desktop and probably part of me can't let go of that "Start" menu analog.
Through all my "testing" however I've still not settled on the right desktop/development environment, I've tried them all, really, I feel like I given pretty much every Window Manager out there a go, I especially like the blank canvas of openbox although I've got real work to do as well, so configuration wise It's not something I want to know right now
Part of my issue is I've got a what I would consider a bit of an edge case when I comes to setup. My current setup is over 3 Monitors ( I was considering 6 but thought I might get whiplash from moving my head too much :laugh: )
Right now I live my live mostly in Terminal Windows and Bash Prompts and do most of my hacking In gedit with some plugins ( maybe not the most productive but it's kinda of working for me at the minute )
After giving the Android x86 project, It got me thinking whether It would be a viable option. I know android certainly has the capability to run over multiple monitors although whether I would have to do a bit of hacking on the Framebuffer internals ( add extra ones etc ) has yet to be investigated.
With regards Android Development it kinda of makes sense to Develop right there in it's native environment ( I'm talking Kernel/System Level here not apps) . Compiling the AOSP etc should still be the same process.
So Yeah, Android on the Desktop - Discuss
I'd be interested if anyone has been crazy/foolhardy/patient enough to go down this road and are just keeping quiet about it and If there's any gotcha's etc to think about before embarking on such a mission.
Android is better off on smartphones and Tablets and Windows in better off on Desktops and Laptops.
As Im an avid gamer, I wouldnot mind having Android on my Desktop. Android has limited no. of good games but Windows dont.
Sent from my GT-i9100 equipped with Grenade Launcher and Remote Explosives
www dot apc dot io
Hope that answers your question.
Sent from my YP-G70 using XDA
nightfire37 said:
www.apc.io
Hope that answers your question.
Sent from my YP-G70 using XDA
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Thanks, That's the kinda of thing, I was not aware of this project/product ( although still vapourware til next month ) At least I'm not crazy for thinking it
I spent a week or 2 only using an hp touchpad, to see if I could get away using it as a desktop replacement.
The biggest problem I found is that the apps aren't really designed for serious productivity. Google docs is great for viewing things, but is very irresponsive on large documents, and doesn't like fancy formatting. Browsing was a nightmare. I had 3 or 4 different browsers, because each had different plugins, flash support, user agents, etc. Many browsers were unstable, and flash always caused random crashes and other weird problems. Gmail is useless for attachements, and there is no reasonable text editor.
It's doable, but you may have to spend a while finding apps to replicate all the functionality you expect from your PC.
trevd said:
Thanks, That's the kinda of thing, I was not aware of this project/product ( although still vapourware til next month ) At least I'm not crazy for thinking it
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Your welcome. I am thinking on getting this for the fact to support the devs on the product.
Sent from my YP-G70 using XDA
As a desktop replacement I'm not so sure but Android can definitely work as a netbook replacements.
It also depends what you use ur desktop for. Anything more that web browsing and email, I'll still prefer having a full fledged OS on it.
theInfected1 said:
As a desktop replacement I'm not so sure but Android can definitely work as a netbook replacements.
It also depends what you use ur desktop for. Anything more that web browsing and email, I'll still prefer having a full fledged OS on it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
An android desktop could do mail, web browsing, multimedia, usenet or torrent downloads, games, dlna streaming, ebook reading and text editing (writing, creating pdf, etcetera) well.
It would not be able to do some of the things a desktop can do such as transcode video, run open office, use pc accessories, etcetera.
This is primarily because android is a mobile oriented os though it's likely that other than the use of pc accessories developers will write apps to get android doing even more as it is now a very popular tablet os and tablets often get used as a pc does.
Android could be a desktop for general everyday use right now but not for everyone.
For now windows and linux still beat android for both software, peripheral support and overall os speed making those better options however its also easier to have a new user mess those up than it is to mess up android so for general use it could be a good option.
Dave
( http://www.google.com/producer/editions/CAownKXmAQ/bigfatuniverse )
Sent from my LG P920 using Tapatalk 2
Short version: Currently, I would say no. In the future (2+ years minimum), I highly expect Android to compete for the desktop. It comes down to software moreso than hardware.
TL;DR version: Let me start by saying I've owned quite a few Android smartphones, and I've worked on twice as many for friends, family, etc. I've also owned a couple of Android tablets. Without trying to sound too cynical, let's just say I've been around the block when it comes to Android devices When it comes to phones, Android is as perfect as any OS could be. With it always improving, there's always more to love. For tablets, the experience didn't come off to a great start, but there have surely been improvements since. The first high-end tablets, as well as cheap alternatives, ran on Gingerbread or older. My first cheapo tablet ran on a rare version of Android 2.0 Eclair. Let me tell you, it wasn't pleasant at all! I decided to wait for Honeycomb to come out before trying another tablet, and that's when I picked up an Acer Iconia A500 with the sole intention being to use it like I'd use a computer. The only computer I had at the time was a 10" Acer netbook, so once I bought the tablet, I sold the netbook right away. Now, I will admit that I waited a little bit to see how Honeycomb took off. By the time I got my Iconia, 3.2 was just coming out. In order to completely replace any kind of computer, I knew I would need at least 3 accessories: a stand, keyboard, and mouse. In my initial research, I learned that Android 3.0 didn't have mouse support by default. This was fixed by the dev community here, and Google was prompt to add mouse support in the 3.1 update. So by the time I had my Iconia running 3.2, everything appeared to be ready as far as being a PC replacement. Or so I thought. One major reason I picked the A500 over other tablets was the fact that it had a full-size USB port right on the tablet itself, whereas others either didn't have one at all (Xoom, Galaxy Tab), or it was only available on the keyboard dock (Transformer). As a computer replacement, USB was important to me. It didn't take long for me to realize that a tablet as a PC replacement wasn't the most ideal choice at the time. While there are plenty of apps available to perform many different tasks, the real problem I had was with the way Android itself handled. The apps were more than good enough. There's email, web browsing, multimedia, word processing, etc. The problem is the way Android feels with a keyboard and mouse. One major problem for me was that Android has no proper right-click support with mice. It simply works like a back button. I feel that right-click would be more natural as the functionality of a long press. Another issue I was constantly trying to deal with was the amount of clicks required to complete simple tasks. I could do the same tasks twice as fast on any computer running Windows or Linux. This caused more frustration than anything else. File managers were generally really good - there's actually a couple that I really like a lot, but navigation was always an issue. It wasn't only file managers, but within several areas. Once again, this goes back to needing more clicks for the same tasks, and long pressing where a simple right-click would feel better. While the move to ICS was a huge improvement in performance, it didn't really solve anything with productivity and ease of use. USB support was also hit or miss, and a lot of it has to do with drivers. Now that's understandable, as most hardware venders don't expect Android to be the host OS. Hopefully this changes some day. Eventually I ended up trading the tablet and all the accessories for a mid-range laptop which I use now. I have this system triple-booting between Windows, Linux, and Android (android-x86.org). The same problems I faced with the tablet, I also face with ICS on my laptop. I find myself only booting to Android once in a blue moon, and it's always just to show off to my friends. Any real work is done with one of my other OS's. There's definitely a lot of potential with the Android platform as a desktop OS, but I feel like it's still a couple years away at least. There are still a few minor annoyances trying to use Android as a computer that need to be addressed. Maybe by the time Android 6.0 or 7.0 is released, it will put up a good fight for the desktop. Only time will tell. Another viable option is phones that dock to a computer with a desktop interface. Anyone remember Canonical's plans? Also keep in mind Linux kernel 3.3 which adopted Android natively, which is a huge step for Canonical and their Ubuntu-Android dreams.
i have been using android since 2008. The only thing i can tell you is Android can replace netbooks but not laptops and desktop. I used macbook for a year or so but I went back to windows.
HP Touchpad replaced my netbook.70% of the time i use my hp touchpad to chat, browse and play videos.
But when it comes to work or college work I go back to my good ol' desktop or laptop because
google spreadsheet is nowhere near MS Excel
google docs is nowhere near MS Word
fortemcee said:
The only thing i can tell you is Android can replace netbooks but not laptops and desktop.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I coming to that conclusion...... More for on the move devices, Although there some good stuff going on with the 10ft Experience (Android on TV's) at the moment.
It is also interesting to hear how people interact with their devices,
I'm far from an average user..... If i'm not developing with/on android I don't what to do with it :laugh: I think that's why my tablet has a keyboard and mouse plugged into most of the time
Thanks for the Input.
Bloodflame said:
Short version: Currently, I would say no. In the future (2+ years minimum), I highly expect Android to compete for the desktop. It comes down to software moreso than hardware.
TL;DR version: ...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Brilliant That's exactly the type of responses I hoped for, a man whose got he's knees dirty in these dam robots on the desktop ... little long but I did read it.
[Short Version] In Summary I'm inclined to agree with you give it a couple of years, As a developer I could probably fix it up but I probably wouldn't be finished before google etc sorted it themselves[Short Version]
Here's a more verbose reply :laugh:
I have seen some 2.x tabs in my time, trailblazers but not nice.... I presume you gave the 1.6 x86 one a go as well then? Just for kicks.
I've been using a mouse and keyboard on my tablet, an Archos G9 through a usb hub which also has full size usb slot..... I've never really twicked onto the mouse lack of context menu/right click being an issue until you pointed it out, I can see how it would become an irritant after a while unless you're a MacUser than one button should be fine
The right mouse button acting the same as long press would be a vast improvement, I'll probably have a look at what development effort is involved in that ( or at least add it to the pile of interesting stuff I want to do with my time )
I've found the keyboard to be useful, Shortcut Keys are generally the same as there desktop counterparts. Take Ctrl+L to type a web address in your browser for example and If I dig around the android source code for a while I'm sure I could find some more unpublished ones or add my own and help on the number of click navigation issues etc .
USB Support is not a problem with each iteration of Android it gets better internally and I'm currently working with the opinion that if a linux driver exists I can compile it and at least get android the recognize the device... I've been deep in the USB Internals with android for the last few months.
On the Androidx86.... I've not checked the project in a while, there maybe have greater focus on solving some on these usability issues.
With regard to phones and docking I do remember canonicals plans ( wasn't that earlier this year) or are you talking about the circa 2009/10?!? ubuntu proposed project to run apks directly on your pc? essentially running the dalvikvm/surfaceflinger framebuffer management, support services on ubuntu with an X Window for the app.
The latter I feel is highly possible especially with android fully "unforked" in the kernel - not looked at the full details but I presume that includes all androids system level binder stuff and their shared memory modules and the former, I think a manufacturer release something called "Android in a Window" (Motorola or LG, maybe) An interactive android window on the desktop... also motorola's Webtop looks interesting.
I've written enough, Thanks for the Input
no one found any way to run android on PC or Laptop ???????
saqi4you said:
no one found any way to run android on PC or Laptop ???????
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It runs in virtualisation fine and there are a few PC's that can run it natively, I would bet Jelly bean will run on x86 without fuss.
Sent from my Transformer TF101 using XDA Premium HD app
I've had android ICS x86 on my Acer W500 (a windows tablet) for a little while now. It was installed along side the Windows 8 Developer Preview which expired and shuts down after a few minutes of use now. Instead of updating it to the W8 Consumer Preview for more time I just started using ICS full time. With my tablet in the "dock" (which is just a keyboard really) and a mouse hooked up I used it for days as a PC replacement (the power supply in my normal desktop died).
Android would be totally fine as a desktop OS, but apps would have to start being designed with that in mind.
Think about it:
You can't have multiple windows open at once on the screen for serious multitasking. What if I want to have a terminal/command prompt open while I reference a document in the web browser? With android I'm going to be switching between fullscreen apps.
The OS will have to be redesigned to allow for that capability and then new apps will have to be written to able to take advantage of it. Is it possible? Absolutely! Is it ready to be your desktop replacement? Not yet!
deathsled said:
Think about it:
You can't have multiple windows open at once on the screen for serious multitasking. What if I want to have a terminal/command prompt open while I reference a document in the web browser? With android I'm going to be switching between fullscreen apps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would say there is arguments for and against sizeable apps (I suppose that describes it), Personally I run multiple monitors and generally have Maximised Windows all the way, obviously every use case is different but I think android would become "just another window manager" and lose some of what android is If it had totally free window placement.
It is also assuming the current desktop metaphor which is in use today is the best/most productive way of interacting with the machine.... Maybe we're just blindly doing it because we've all be trained to think like that, and it's always been that way.
I don't claim to have the answers on any of these points though
I suppose the only thing I can do is stop talking and start doing, "try it yourself" as we say in the "trade" .....I've got a laptop I could give it a blast on, I can at least try a multiple monitor test with that with out too much disruption.
saqi4you said:
no one found any way to run android on PC or Laptop ???????
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
dragon_76 said:
It runs in virtualisation fine and there are a few PC's that can run it natively, I would bet Jelly bean will run on x86 without fuss.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You might want to read the full thread guys It's kinda what we're talking about, check the Androidx86 project out if you've never seen it before
Actually with apps like overskreen and the open source standout library which lets apps float, so you can have several open at once on screen together and swap between them, you could multitask with multiple open windows.
It's a new approach but already finding favour on tablets.
Dave
( http://www.google.com/producer/editions/CAownKXmAQ/bigfatuniverse )
Sent from my LG P920 using Tapatalk 2
deathsled said:
You can't have multiple windows open at once on the screen for serious multitasking. What if I want to have a terminal/command prompt open while I reference a document in the web browser? With android I'm going to be switching between fullscreen apps.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If I am doing some coding on my PC (running Ubuntu) I use i3-wm which is a tiling window manager. I find the best option is to have all applications full screen and switch between them quickly using keystrokes. The same thing can be done with a theoretical Android Desktop.
I think the case for an Android Desktop is a strong one. Just looking at mobile phone shops and sites, Android is the most popular firmware for smartphones on the market so the amount of people owning one is only going to increase. With that it means that online communities like this site will get bigger with more people offering support and development. An Android desktop might not have the same look and feel as the smartphone version but if it can emulate the same functionality i.e. the way to do something on a smartphone is the same as on the desktop then the leap from smartphone to desktop won't be so hard for people. As you will have the same underlying platform, the same will apply for developers so it means application development on the Desktop version should in theory be faster.
That's a way of doing it but my preference would be a convergence of devices where say I can plug my smartphone into a docking station which hooks it up with a monitor, keyboard and mouse or like the Assus Padfone where a smartphone can be pluged into a tablet dock which turns it into a tablet.
I have wondered this for a very long time
Why isn't there any phone hardware which exists (that I'm aware of) where you can simply install any OS you like without jumping through hoops?
I'm referring to something similar to a PC. When you build a PC, it is all standard hardware and you can load any os you want on it, endless flavors of linux, current or old versions of windows, etc. It is simple. Both windows and linux can generally detect all your hardware and install drivers, it is simple.
With phones however it seems you are always limited. You have to find ways to root them, usually requiring exploiting some vulnerability. Hope the bootloader is unlocked. Assuming you aren't a talented developer (like most typical people), you then must search for roms for the phone, usually made by various people on forums sites or similar. It is a big mess. Or if you don't customize it, your stuck with some bloated os that the manufacturer will fail to update.
I don't understand why phones are such a mess like this, and why you can't just buy an OS-less phone, and simply install vanilla android, or any other standardized open source os on it, similar to how things work on a PC?
There aren't any unified standard in the embedded devices in general and in phones in particular. The reason that you can install compatible OS on the PC is because IBM PC is a standard, which specifies how the PC should boot, where to search for the bootloader, what kind of partition table should be on the HDD, how the devices should be connected, how to probe for the hardware, how software should use hardware, and lots of other things.
In embedded word, there aren't such standard. Until recently, every System-on-Chip used its own boot specifications and bootloaders incompatible with each other. Only in the last 2 years something started to change in a better way.