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Is it just me/my hardware or is GPS over Bluetooth absolutely rubbish!?
I tried a Holux GR-230 unit first but had the usual problems in getting it connected. When I finally did, I was apalled by it's performance, usually failing to get a gps lock at all.
So I ditched it in favour of a Rikaline GPS-6031-X7. It picked up far mor signals and usually obtained a lock almost instantly. However, it's accuracy is very disappointing. Positional accuracy - it's usually ok on a motorway or dual carriageway but at slower speeds, it jumps all over the place, forwards, backwards, in the middle of fields hundreds of yards away - and that's the worst time for it to happen 'cos it's when you slow down for a junction that you actually need it. The second issue is directional accuracy - it often shows me driving sideways as it's so sloooooow to update/recalc the direction.
If this was my first experience of gps, I might be able to forgive it without a benchmark to judge it against. But I've used Navman with an iPaq, a LAM1 unit with my Nokia 9210 and a (cheap) CF device with my Dell Axim and they all performed far, far better! I know that TomTom Navigator 2 isn't the problem as it performed flawlessly on my Axim (PXA255).
So what's going wrong? Is it the bluetooth devices, or the bluetooth technology, or the XDA II? Will O2's bluetooth update improve matters?
I can no longer rely on this and I'm going to have to start taking map backups - something I've never had to do before and really defeats the object.
Any thoughts, experiences, comments, answers?????
Ged.
I think your problem could be the gps receiver.
I am using the Navman 4400 with my XDAII. It took some time and a couple of patches (from this site, thanks guys) to get it to bond via bluetooth, but now it's setup, it works great. It seems to be very accurate and tells me to exit roundabouts just at the correct time.
It's a bit slow to get the initial fix when first switched on (about 2 minutes) but once connected I have no problems.
Is the gps receiver positioned by a heated screen? If so, this will block the signal and produce the problems you describe.
Have you changed your car? Some newer cars have reflective windshields that can cause problems.
Cheers
Thanks guys. I know of both of the issues you describe but I drive a 3 year old clio 172 - no heated/reflective screen. The receiver usually sits on the dash and receives a very strong signal from upwards of 6 sats.
I've now emailed Rikaline too so we'll see what they come up with (if anything).
I am using the Holux GR-230 and it works flawlessly with towas latest patch 1.0.1.2, a very accurate gps based on my own observations with tomtom2.
Hi guys
I have recently received my new XDA II from Orange (know as SPV M1000)
I am using it with the Fortuna Clip On GPS, Tom Tom Navigator and a Jabra 250 headset.
So far I have had no problems with the GPS, it works every time. On a rare ocasion I have to reset the phone to get the head set to work but this is very rare.
Not sure if orange have modified the software but it all seems to work.
I'm beginning to think that it's the XDA that's at fault. I know TTN2 is ok, you guys aren't having any probs with bluetooth gps devices in general, and I'd have to be extremely unlucky to have TWO faulty gps receivers from different manufacturers!
Persuading O2 that it's faulty is another matter though.
i work in the in car navi business and a 3 year old cleo does have a metalic winscreen apart from the hatched area around the rear view mirror (for use with toll tags and other antennas).You will nead a re-radateing antenna mounted externally to get propper reception as the cleo also has a faradays cage effect making radio reception within the cab area very difficult.(they are a ***** to work on)
pinkslayer, shove it in somebody elses car, or slap it on the roof of yours and see how it go's in that location.
Should know my car a bit better really!
I had tried mounting the Holux in front of the rear view mirror but this didn't help so I didn't bother trying the Rikaline. And my wife has a clio too so no point trying it in hers.
So even though I'm locking on to 5-6 sats, it's still not sufficient!? Or is the metallic screen just causing additional latency?
Its not the number of sats, its the strength of the signal received, I have seen 8 sats showing but tomtom wont attempt a route until the signals are strong enough for a lock,
Rikaline GPS-6031-X7
hi all
i use a Rikaline -x7 with TomTom Navigator 2 on my xda ll with the bluetooth pach from
http://bluetooth.i-networx.de/index_e.html
and the update is slow when taking corners (ie the map is slow to turn to the heads up position) or if you come of a motorway/ dual carriageway thats not on the calulated route it will take some time to acknowledge this
but i do not have the problem of it at slower speeds it jumps all over the place
As for accuracy my old tomtom wired gps was better
but the Rikaline-x7 is usable
Thanks peops. I've now tried mounting it on the rear parcel shelf and also stuck it to the shaded area above the rvm but to no avail (even when it was back on the dash this morning, it took 11 minutes to get a fix and another 5 before it could calc direction - cloudy day!). As soon as it's dry enough, I'll mount it outside the car and see how it is.
I don't really want to do down the re-radateing antenna route as the whole point of having portable equipment is that you can use it anywhere and in any vehicle.
Im using the Rikaline GPS 6031-X7 and Im really happy with, no problems at all in fact I think its brilliant............
I'm using the fortuna clipon in a landy with heated windscreen. It doesn't seem to affect the signal (with or without the screen on) and I have to say i was expecting problems with it. It has been the only thing about the whole BT GPS/XDAII setup that I haven't had problems with..
Technology eh!
Hi,
Got my new bluetooth gps receiver a couple of days ago and I just have afew questions: It's a QSTARZ BT - Q880
1. It states that this receiver is 32 channel but when i check on tomtom how many sates i'm connected to I have only ever had a max of 8???
2. The gps works fine in the day but i tested at night and it cannot get a signal? I drove around for around 10 mins but still no signal? I doubt if the gps is faulty because it works fine in normal daytime light? I've also had my old ipaq with original wired tomtom receiver next to it and that picked up no problem.
any ideas on the above
cheers
hi
32 channels is just a bit of a gimmick 8 sats is around average for most standard BT receivers , SirfIII receivers due to there superior technology may average 10 or so.
The signal is not affected by light but can be interupted by other atmospheric conditions. When you are trying to get a lock don't drive around as this will just prolong the time to first fix. Also what vechicle are you driving and what is the position of the reciever . Many new cars have Thermic coatings on the windscreen which will lower the incoming GPS signals. When trying to get a fix check the sat screen in tomtom Grey bars indicate a satelite that can be seen but does not have a fix on its location. Blue bars are fixed satelites. you need 3 to get a 3d fix. Also try putting the receiver on the roof to determing if the car or surroundings are affecting signal stength.
If all this fails to shed any light on the problems maybe you have a tempramental reveiver .
Hope this helps
Keep me updated
Fergy
hi mate cheers for the reply. just a quick update i can get a signal indoors now no problem but havent had time to check at night again. I think when i first tested it was just one of them days but so far i'm really happy with it. Just gotta get used to tomtom on a wizard screen insteasd of an ipaq.
cheers
I bought my first Captivate at the very beginning of August. I wanted the GPS to work, so I could use it instead of a separate GPS unit sometimes. After about 5 days the GPS was really struggling to lock. I put it outside under the open sky for 5 minutes with GPS Test, and it saw lots of satellites but used zero. I reset the phone and poof, it worked properly again. That seemed like a strange bug to me. I heard an update was coming by the end of September, but that was going to be outside my 30 days, so I returned my Captivate to Best Buy and got my $230 back, no problems.
Sept 7, I bought a new Captivate, now only $150 at Best Buy. This one worked fine and the GPS never completely failed like the first one did. But I didn't test much as I waited for the update. September 22 I forced the update on my normal unrooted captivate, and it went fine. I did some testing and the GPS seemed to track OK and lock in a reasonable time. Now its a week later and it still seems good.
Here are a couple comments.
First a note on my GPS experience. I own 3 GPS units besides the Captivate, and older MIO C230, a Garmin eTrex Centure HC, and SPOT 2 GPS Messenger. I also have extensive experience with a Garmin Nuvi 1390T. I ride a dirt bike in the desert and have used tracks to navigate extensively.
- Time to get satellite lock. The Captivate does often take a while to lock on the satellites. But so do all my other GPS devices. Sometimes they lock quickly, but often they can take a minute or more. This is related to whether they have stored data on where they are, and thus know where to look for the satellites. At any rate I don't always get a quick lock on the Captivate, but it has never failed to get a lock under a clear sky if I give it up a minute or two. 10m resolution is typical once locked under a unobstructed sky. For those having trouble with this: Are you giving the Captivate a clear view of the sky and a couple minutes? Yes, sometimes GPS's lock indoors and really quickly. But in my experience this isn't always true. What I'm saying is the Captivate works similarly to the other GPS's I use. Sometimes fast, sometimes slow. But it is always locking under a clear unobstructed sky within a couple minutes.
- Google maps. After it locks, the captivate shows my location on the map well. As I said above, sometimes lock takes a minute or more. And it requires a clear view of the sky most of the time.
- Track quality. I tested with "My Tracks". I run around town on a scooter every day, so its easy to turn on the tracker and and see what happens. I put the Captivate in my pocket on my thigh, back side facing the sky. The only thing obscuring its view is my body. Basically, it seems to work fine. It certainly works as well as my Garmin eTrex. The eTex tracks are always a bit rough too. Yes, the Captivate track does sometimes cut the corner or the curve and is off the street that I actually rode on. But it basically follows my route well. It has always followed me when I loop around a block, or drive down a short dead end and come back. I can definitely tell where I went and what roads I took when I look at the track. I'm not bothered if it shows me 20-40 feet off the road on occasion (as I have noted, so does my Garmin eTrex). I expect this with a 10m resolution.
- Navigation. I've been using the google Navigation app on drives in the car. I mount the Captivate in a mount on the dash, so it has a clear view of the sky through the glass. It's not on the seat, or in the ashtray or in a cup holder. It's mounted to the windshield close to the front, so it has a good view of a broad expanse of sky. This is exactly how I mount the Mio GPS or Garmin etrex or Garmin Nuvi when I use those in the car. Used like this, my Captivate navigation has been excellent. Frankly, its far better app than the Mio or Garmin Nuvi 1390T that I have used. The searches are quick and I like the presentation. Obviously, in Navigation the app knows to lock you on the street. And when I drive past an indicated turn it always notices immediately.
Summary: So I don't know what has changed since my first Captivate, but this one seems fine to me. I don't know if it's the hardware, or the SW update. But so far mine works as well as the other GPS devices I have used. If it keeps working like this for another week, I'm definitely keeping it. I'm sure some have trouble, as I did with my first Captivate. And I do think some others expect too much: I don't expect the Captivate to be "THE BEST GPS" I have ever seen. I expect it to lock within 2 minutes, work for navigation in my car, to find me on a google map and to record a track of where I went. This all seems to be working for me. (And usually it locks in well under a minute for me). I think I'll keep it... if this performance keeps up.
IMO, YMMV
Carl
vintagephone/Carl. Yours is a very useful write up. I use a Garmin GPS for Geocaching, some street navigation and bicycle riding in the country. What you wrote should be very helpful to someone not so familiar with GPS devices in general. Thanks.
= Ron
I completely agree. People looking at 'my tracks' and showing that there are some slight variations - we don't even know if the google maps is 100% accurate, as I know there are certain places where it doesn't match up directly with the road. I think as long as no errors are being presented during navigation (mine is doing fine in navigation mode) there is not really any complaining that can be done. Even my built in car GPS makes a mistakes once in a blue moon.
I'm not sure what Garmin Nuvi you're using, but I have a 2 yr old 250W and it smokes this phone. The phone has me driving through people's yards and buildings. It has gotten better since the JH7 update, its almost what I would call usable now. Try doing a Mytracks track on it, its a joke how far off it is. Its certainly unusable for that.
derek4484 said:
I'm not sure what Garmin Nuvi you're using, but I have a 2 yr old 250W and it smokes this phone. .
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm very familiar with the Garmin I used, a Nuvi 1390T. Negatives for the Garmin included horrible traffic reports, and searches for my destination took forever. Basic Navigation was OK, if you knew the address of where you were going. And if you were going someplace more than 30 miles away (a common undertaking in the LA basin), you just couldn't get there. Searches on the Nuvi only include locations within 30 miles. Frankly, the search was much worse than on my old Mio. I had the Nuvi 1390 for a couple weeks and returned i just as I got my second Captivate. For basic GPS navigation, the Nuvi was OK, but I saw no advantage over the Captivate. Are you mounting your Captivate in the same way and place you are mounting your Nuvi? I actually use a modified Nuvi windshield mount with my Captivate, so my mounting is literally identical.
Now, you Captivate my not work as well as mine. My original Captivate was worse than this one. As I said, YMMV (your mileage may vary).
I use a Garmin V GPS receiver for Geocaching and some other activities which demands a very high degree of accuracy. This receiver will use as many birds as it can find (seldom less than five) to determine its location but a cell phone GPS receiver may limit the number of satellites it tracks to conserve battery power.
Using four satellites, the accuracy of the Garmin V typically comes down to a target area that is two to twenty feet in diameter. This unit is fast; I can watch the current location triangle move past streets just as I am able to make out the street signs.
The Captivate I ordered will not be here until later today so I can't report anything about my experience with that device. I have been using an HTC device (AT&T "Tilt") and Google Maps for several years now and can report it has very good GPS accuracy and speed when compared to the Garmin unit. I would be pleased indeed if the Captivate even comes close to the performance of the Tilt.
As with any GPS device, it has to have line of sight visibility with at least three satellites to report its position with any reliability. Clouds (with heavy moisture), trees and tall buildings can reduce GPS accuracy substantially. Bicycling through heavily forested areas reduces the accuracy of my Garmin V from a few feet to hundreds of feet. As it takes a few minutes for the receiver to "lock on" and recalculate its position, after pedaling through a forested area I can be a mile up the road before the display catches up. Even at bicycle speeds (15MPH) I have missed turns simply because of trees!
With the Tilt, moving on foot around tall buildings, Google Maps sometimes can't figure out where I am. In the car, I usually pull the sunroof shade back so the Tilt gets a clear shot at the sky.
One final point: If I have the Garmin running at home, shut it off, then restart it again when I am fifty miles from home, it takes maybe five minutes to find three in-view birds. There is a feature in the Gamin that allows me to move its cursor to about where I think I am and it, then it uses this information to find new birds. I use this feature frequently and it usually saves two or three minutes locking on to a new set of birds. That feature is not available with the Tilt and it can take a full five minutes for it to find three birds when I change location with the GPS receiver turned off.
I hope these comments are useful. A cell phone with GPS capabilities is understandably no match for a single-purpose GPS receiver and particularly so when the two devices sell for about the same price.
I doubt that it is Maps or myTracks that is off (although I had wondered about this as well) because when you run the Captivate side-by-side with an N1, the N1's lock and track are very fast (almost instantaneous) and flawless. Of course we all know the Captivate's lock and track issues. The N1's track would not be so perfect if it were an issue with the base map accuracy, when the app on both phones is the same and accesses the same data.
The issue can also be seen running GPS Status or GPS Test together too, the N1's lock is always better, although I see no appreciable difference in SNR values for each satellite. It is just like the Captivate simply will not lock, even when it sees the same satellites. That is why I am sure it is the driver issue and therefore fixable.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App
Hello,
I'm encountering some issues with my Samsung Nexus S GPS. I got the i9023 (Europe/SLCD) version of the phone, which is running default rom (stock), freshly updated to 2.3.4 (via official OTA!).
I couldn't figure why, when using Maps, my position would usually be around 1 km away from where I am. I found out later, this time using Navigation, that it is desperately searching for a GPS signal, that it can't find. Sometimes I manage to get a lock, when I keep it running for like 30 - 40 mins, but it immediately disappears. GPS Statuts keeps showing 0/5 sats.
I was convinced that my GPS chip was defective.
But today, I was hanging out in the city and tried running Navigation. I got a lock, for the first time, within a 15 sec delay. That was the first time that I managed to get live GPS tracking. I've walked a bit around, and the tracking was really, really accurate.
Back home, in my apartment, again I can't get any signal. I live in the 3rd floor, walls aren't that thick and, as for an anecdote, in the same room, my iPhone 3Gs instantly finds my position.
I've bought this phone 6 days ago and therefore still under warranty. Question is, can we say my GPS chip is defective ? Is it worth requesting a replacement ?
Thanks !
1st) You cannot expect to get gps reception inside even with professional equipment. When your iPhone gets a fast fix it's most likely WLAN triangulation. As Apple uses a different database than Google, it may work on on your iPhone and not on your Nexus for a paticular place and vice versa.
2nd) It's unlikely that your gps is broken if you can connect to GSM/UMTS/CDMA2000 networks as gps is processed using the same chipset.
3rd) That 1km-off-fix might be celltower based location, 1km sounds quite plausible.
4th) Try _NOT_ to move until you get GPS fix.
5th) Keep internet access while trying to get a fix. The Nexus S as most phones on the market use assisted gps, where your phone contacts a server that provides data which enables your phone to track its position more easily.
6th) Good luck.
Yes, well, I had 2 friends which came to my place, in my room, and just activated GPS on their iphones and it located them straight away, to our exact position. So it was definitely the GPS tracking and not triangulation.
Indeed, when MY phone locates me off 1 km, this is definitely triangulation or cell-towers.
Of course, when I try to get a fix in my apartment or on my balcony, I just put it on a table and must wait for at least 30 mins to get a lock, and it disappears quickly. Doesn't seem normal to me ...
Finally to answer your 5th point, I got 3G, so a perfect fast & smooth inet connection.
GPS testing should always be done outside, you are not supposed to use it indoors.
What is probably happening there is that the other devices are more sensitive and can still get a lock. You might be able to get a lock if you place your phone very close to the window.
I got a Nexus S recently and noticed that the GPS is quite weaker than the one on my old HTC.
Although the Nexus is faster to get a lock (if you let it use 3G) the GPS itself is less sensitive and accurate.
It looses signal easier, for instance, if i go under some trees, and it takes more time to get signal back after loosing it, for example, if you go under a bridge, the old HTC would get the lock back in 2 seconds after leaving the bridge, the Nexus took half a minute.
Having said that, i think it's good enough for driving navigation, i have done some tests and on the road it behaves well enough.
You shouldn't be surprised, this phone is very similar to the Galaxy S and that had terrible GPS issues, this nexus is better, but still weak.
Thank you for your feedback, temp9300 !
I guess the Nexus S can't compete with iphone's. But it's ok, as long as it works fine outdoors, this is what matters.
Hi !
I have a desire s and the acuracy of the gps is sometimes awfull.
With gps test it sometimes give me a precision of 6m and sometime of 80m what is a big problem when your driving a in a big city where the is 3 or for road side by side.
If somebody can make some test with the gps precision of the one s.
I would apreciate it.
Thanks in advance.
a) Where is the phone located in the car when driving?
b) Have you downloaded some GPS Toolbox that gives you a clear overview of how many satellites are in view? Especially IN CITIES the line of sight to the sky varies a lot and can often obscure satellite fixes when being jammed between high rise buildings.
c) Do you have the most current radio firmware (I believe this one contains the GPS stack also).
As I rely on navigations by phone a lot too I will be happy to give you results once my One S comes in, however I can only compare to my current Sensation which has never given me any problems.
Also note that some types of cars have a coating on the windscreen that screws with GPS reception, so if you have a high end vehicle with an expensive optional windscreen this might be the cause (although unlikely, people driving those cars with those options usually have onboard satnav).
My car is from 2004, and I did not have any problem with my htc hd mini and my touch cruise before. same car holder on the windscreen.
And I already have flash lastest htc stock rom ans lastest radio, it 'sa bit better than the bouygues telecom rom and radio that came with the phone but last time in paris the gps was lost during 15mn hopfully a friend had a htc hd2.
Your feedback will be apreciated.
Thanks
Hi, I've had the same problem with a Desire HD Gps. It took ages to fix or accuracy was terrible. One S Gps receiver is way better than that. I takes seconds to fix even at home (old one only worked when placed in the window).
As promised I have just sampled the GPS of the One S and the Sensation side to side (I used a MyTracks recording while they were both in my rear jeans pockets when walking the dog).
The routes have only minimal differences. Initial GPS acquisition on the One S was a bit slower than on the Sensation, but I credit that to needing to get a "fix" while the Sensation already has one (and the GPS satellite manifest) for my area cause I use it regularly. It was the first time GPS was ever turned on on that phone so a little delay is understandable.
No difference to be measured, both OK. will update once I actually use the One X with CoPilot Nav Software in a crowded city with high rise buildings etc. that block the view but I expect the same performance that I got from the Sensation.
Maybe this helps.
thanks
I have passed my order today