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A Rant...

It annoys me how biased some people can be towards phones for the stupidest reasons. Just because it's not HTC, they put it down and only think of all the bad points it could possibly have even though it either hasn't been released or they haven't owned it. For example, the ATRIX is by far more superior hardware wise than the Inspire, yet people make comments that it's gonna be a fail because it's not HTC and point out that all the things better than the Inspire are useless (ffc, dual core, HDMI out, docks, 1GB ram, fingerprint scanner thingy). Yes, some of them are useless (fingerprint scanner imo) but, like, I saw a post saying "not HTC, only 5 MP camera... no thanks" which is completely biased and annoys me. They also say that motoblur is horrible and htc sense is the best, but I honestly dont like sense. It goes to far into the system and you just can't get rid of it, plus I find it slow. With motoblur its just the launcher and a few widgets. Get a new launcher from the market and its gone. I've had smartphones from all 3 major manufacturer and I can't bring myself to judge a phone based on the manufacturer. HTC is great, but not the best. They all have good and bad things to them. My experience with HTC has been bad build quailty. Plus they seem to use the least powerful innards. I know their will be flamers for this, but its the truth and i'm seeing in everywhere in general discussion.

Probably the main reason people badmouth the Atrix is because Motorola took a perfectly good product and vomited BLUR all over it, thus making it less than half as awesome as it would ordinarily be.
Not to mention they likely locked the bootloader, too...
Edit: HTC is usually praised for build quality and while they don't use the most powerful guts (likely a side effect of their allegiance to Qualcomm), they do respectably well. The things I hear HTC panned for are usually things like Sense sucking and the audio/media playback quality being terrible.

I can think of one reason to hate Motorola: EFUSE. Simple. Its draconian, it alienates a large portion of users, and serves practically no value that I could find. Htc has something similar, but wasn't it cracked really quickly?
Powered by Fission, from my DROID 2

I was hoping that Motorola would use the OMAP4 SoC over the Tegra2, but I guess that's cool of them to use Tegra2. Motoblur is kind of bad though, but better than TouchWiz to be honest.
I have had phones from both Motorola (although not smartphones) and HTC. I wouldn't get a Motorola phone on my network because all of them are kind of bad, but the ones on other networks (mainly Verizon) are pretty cool.

As the saying says "Everyone speaks according to their own personal experience"
Said that, I have been using HTC since 2005 and never had any problem!, so I´ll keep it faithful to the brand
The best devices designs on my personal opinion.

I've had both and I love my HTC. I don't really like stock Sense but custom ROMs fix that quickly. But HTCs have awesome build quality and quality control which cannot be said for motorola. That being said, the Droid X is a sexy ass phone.

Lemme join the rant.
I have no specific love for HTC, despite typing this on a HTC phone. However, I consider Motorola a good hardware company with crap support and product on the software side. Considering the bootloader, kernel, blur, etc.
Powered by Android

pl4sMa said:
Lemme join the rant.
I have no specific love for HTC, despite typing this on a HTC phone. However, I consider Motorola a good hardware company with crap support and product on the software side. Considering the bootloader, kernel, blur, etc.
Powered by Android
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Most of the time people care about what kind of experience they get from using the phone. In this case, Motorola usually doesn't deliver in the software end.
If I know that I don't want to use Motorola's version of software, I'd come here or go to another place where I can download a firmware I like better. Without that option, I don't want the phone no matter how good the innards are (not which company makes it).
That said, I'm willing to wait to see what kind of 3rd party support, if any, the Atrix gets.

Honestly it should say something about the company though if people are willing to go out of their way to either avoid or endorse it. Honestly over the past few years I have just not been hot on Motorola's build quality, its been going down hill, nor the way it treats its customers. In the end I would just prefer to vote with my wallet, and the day some one makes a phone that has a totally removable SD card memory that is totally hackable, that is the day a company will find a totally unwavering customer.

I saw the OpenMoko phone at an Linux event.

copius said:
Most of the time people care about what kind of experience they get from using the phone. In this case, Motorola usually doesn't deliver in the software end.
If I know that I don't want to use Motorola's version of software, I'd come here or go to another place where I can download a firmware I like better. Without that option, I don't want the phone no matter how good the innards are (not which company makes it).
That said, I'm willing to wait to see what kind of 3rd party support, if any, the Atrix gets.
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Click to collapse
What is so bad about motoblur? And even if it of tjat bad couldn55 just use a custom launcher to solve the problem? Oh and im asking; I haven't used a motorola phone yet.

Undying brand loyalty can be very illogical, but people are bound to find themselves being loyal to a brand if they've had nothing but good experiences with it.
As XDA members at least we aren't as limited in our choices, as most would be, when deciding what to buy. We have the option to tailor our software preferences to our liking with custom ROMs, themes etc, thanks to the great devs and their prodigious output!

Zephyrs said:
It annoys me how biased some people can be towards phones for the stupidest reasons. Just because it's not HTC, they put it down and only think of all the bad points it could possibly have even though it either hasn't been released or they haven't owned it. For example, the ATRIX is by far more superior hardware wise than the Inspire, yet people make comments that it's gonna be a fail because it's not HTC and point out that all the things better than the Inspire are useless (ffc, dual core, HDMI out, docks, 1GB ram, fingerprint scanner thingy). Yes, some of them are useless (fingerprint scanner imo) but, like, I saw a post saying "not HTC, only 5 MP camera... no thanks" which is completely biased and annoys me. They also say that motoblur is horrible and htc sense is the best, but I honestly dont like sense. It goes to far into the system and you just can't get rid of it, plus I find it slow. With motoblur its just the launcher and a few widgets. Get a new launcher from the market and its gone. I've had smartphones from all 3 major manufacturer and I can't bring myself to judge a phone based on the manufacturer. HTC is great, but not the best. They all have good and bad things to them. My experience with HTC has been bad build quailty. Plus they seem to use the least powerful innards. I know their will be flamers for this, but its the truth and i'm seeing in everywhere in general discussion.
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Click to collapse
I understand exactly how you feel. Make a comment about owning and using an LG Ally. See how nasty the comments get then. This phone does everything I need it to do with no issues whatsoever. But, I get to hear about how much of a POS it is, how slow it is, how LG phones are garbage, etc, etc, etc.....blindly ignorant loyalty to a certain brand is really ridiculous.
JL

I just wish they would sell two versions of each phone, stock android and sense/blur/touchwiz. I personally dislike all the manufacturer uis , but I know plenty of people who love them.
I know that is crazy thinking, but its the reason I'm getting a nexus s, go stock go home.

Zardos66 said:
I just wish they would sell two versions of each phone, stock android and sense/blur/touchwiz. I personally dislike all the manufacturer uis , but I know plenty of people who love them.
I know that is crazy thinking, but its the reason I'm getting a nexus s, go stock go home.
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Me too, hate them with a passion. Nexus line all the way for me, whoever makes it!
I wish Google would take a leaf out of the MS play-book and insist on manufacturers selling their devices with a stock OS. Of course then it would run counter to the open-sauciness of Android.

Would you buy a high end tablet if it were rooted out of the box??

Would you buy a high end tablet it were rooted with an unlocked bootloader out of the box.

After using Cyanogen on my Nook Color, I'd want any "high end" tablet I purchased to be rootable, but it wouldn't be important whether it actually was rooted right out of the box.

I definately would, after rooting my droid1 and incredible and having fun with all the customization and themes I would not have it any other way.

yeah, i'd want it to rootable and moddable, but i wouldn't expect it out of the box.

Absolutely - it would save a lot of time with an "official" root on a tablet. Again, with the iPAD, very frustrating how Apple continues to impose their vision of a consumer in the products they develop without allowing people to customize to their liking. Oh well, that's why I'll stick with the galaxy!

Out-of-the-box root would have no bearing on my decision whatsoever. I have every confidence in our a devs to gain root.
Now, if the question is a locked bootloader, that's a different story.

I can't stand a tablet with a laggy ui, until google doesn't fix this (gpu acceleration) i won't get one...

Price is still key.

Yes but I don't think any phone or tablet should be rooted out of the box. That's asking for wayyyyyy too much trouble.
Sent from my HTC Glacier using XDA App

Nahh.. ill pass.. There goes the adventure all android user were having...

yes...
It would be nice!

All of the companies would probably raise the prices if it comes rooted.

Definitly yes, open bootloader is very important.
root access on rom as than a matter of time.

yeah i think i would

solarpenguin said:
...very frustrating how Apple continues to impose their vision of a consumer in the products they develop without allowing people to customize to their liking.
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Preach on! That was the main reason I switched from the Apple juice. Even though Apple's products are ideal for some, I am not a one-size-fits-all-phone/tablet kind of person.

Yes!! Especially if it also had S-OFF out of the box too.
Sent from my HTC Liberty S using a finger

it would be a nice move from the companies to sell it rooted out of the box, but i think its enough that they aren't making it too difficult.
However a Nexus Tablet would be nice..
Sent from my GT-I9100 using XDA App

no my smartphone is enough for checking my e-mails or to google something

I have never buy any rooted Android phones but I have never used any unrooted Android phones either.
Somehow, I f buy something new, I like it in NEW....unrooted and stuffs...for me, unrooted belongs to signs of untouched device.
I always unroot my phones when I sell them, except if it the buyer clearly stated that he wants a rooted phone.
If I buy an Android tablet, it is just important to be rootable...but please do not root them as I will root it myself.

Jealous of Galaxy S 3 progress

I know only a handful of people have a device in their hands and it's probably not the production firmware, but browsing around the GS3 forums is kind of depressing. I've been watching these One X forums closely, hoping to see great feedback on the stock AT&T One X experience, progress on root/ROMs, or both. With the exception of root I'm sad to see AT&T preventing bootloader unlocks, AT&T/HTC messing with the US software, and a number of problems with Sense (though some of the latter is probably par for the course with a brand new firmware version from HTC). Browsing around on the Galaxy S 3 forums they seem to ship with bootloaders unlocked, there was a full firmware leak, and there's already an early root. At this early stage it seems like that device might end up being a lot easier to develop for.
I know it's probably too early to make any calls on a device that hasn't officially shipped yet, and who knows what kind of delays the North American LTE version will have - or what bastardization AT&T will manage with the GS3. But still, it looks promising over in GS3 land if only from a pure dev perspective.
Then there's the rumor of google selling multiple "Nexus" devices with multiple hardware vendors. Imagine if we had dev-friendly devices at the level of the One X or GS3 in the $400 price range!

well as far as I know it's AT&T that's preventing the boot loader unlock, not HTC, so when the GS3 comes to AT&T, they could very well do the same thing.

lucidlyseen said:
well as far as I know it's AT&T that's preventing the boot loader unlock, not HTC, so when the GS3 comes to AT&T, they could very well do the same thing.
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I also read an article last night, that will annoy people on at&t who are waiting for the GS3. Apparentley verizon is getting the phone first and will have exlusivety over the other carriers for a time, don't know how long though.

Still undecided if I'm keeping the One X. May go for the S3. The only thing I do despise, other than pentile screens, about the S3 is the forums here at XDA. It's worse than an iPhone forum. Samsung could poop a turd and these people would tell you why a turd is now better than anything else any manufacturer has ever produced. It's a tad ridiculous.

lucidlyseen said:
well as far as I know it's AT&T that's preventing the boot loader unlock, not HTC, so when the GS3 comes to AT&T, they could very well do the same thing.
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Yeah, that's what I was saying in the OP. Agreed 100%.
Sent from my Nexus S using Tapatalk 2

You can't compare any brand's unlocked retail devices to those sold through the U.S. carriers. The SGS3 section you're reading is for the international device and each of the U.S. variants will end up with their own forum. Look at the development in the international One X forum; based on the number sold (2MM so far) it too should always stay pretty active.
The i9100 forum is the most active forum on XDA as you'd expect based on the number of phones sold. Most of the lead developers are in the EU as you'd expect for a device sold globally. I'm sure the i9300 (SGS3) forum will be just as active.
Samsung's never locked their bootloaders and their devices are the easiest to mod. It's always been that way so shouldn't be a surprise to anyone. HTC's taking a firmer stand on unlocked devices. In the EU they're no longer covering h/w repairs on devices that have had third party ROMs installed on them (just unlocking the bootloader is OK). This is new since the introduction of the One's. Considering that 95% of people that buy an Android phone don't even know what a bootloader is their obviously putting the financials (savings on warranty repairs) over the needs of what they refer to as the "enthusiast" community. Just something else to consider when comparing devices.

Like Barry said, and once it's released it will be plagued by complaints on XDA, just like the HOX has been, just the nature of the environment.
What hasn't helped HOX progress in the US is the hold at customs, but that is rumored to clear up soon, then we'll be cooking.

vioalas said:
Like Barry said, and once it's released it will be plagued by complaints on XDA, just like the HOX has been, just the nature of the environment.
What hasn't helped HOX progress in the US is the hold at customs, but that is rumored to clear up soon, then we'll be cooking.
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This is what I was thinking too. Bootloader lock? Seen that before and seen phones still be well supported. HOX will be one of the top phones of 2012, so whether devs hack the bootloader or we get direct support from HTC, it will still get done eventually.
The customs hold is more concerning...

jnichols959 said:
I know only a handful of people have a device in their hands and it's probably not the production firmware, but browsing around the GS3 forums is kind of depressing. I've been watching these One X forums closely, hoping to see great feedback on the stock AT&T One X experience, progress on root/ROMs, or both. With the exception of root I'm sad to see AT&T preventing bootloader unlocks, AT&T/HTC messing with the US software, and a number of problems with Sense (though some of the latter is probably par for the course with a brand new firmware version from HTC). Browsing around on the Galaxy S 3 forums they seem to ship with bootloaders unlocked, there was a full firmware leak, and there's already an early root. At this early stage it seems like that device might end up being a lot easier to develop for.
I know it's probably too early to make any calls on a device that hasn't officially shipped yet, and who knows what kind of delays the North American LTE version will have - or what bastardization AT&T will manage with the GS3. But still, it looks promising over in GS3 land if only from a pure dev perspective.
Then there's the rumor of google selling multiple "Nexus" devices with multiple hardware vendors. Imagine if we had dev-friendly devices at the level of the One X or GS3 in the $400 price range!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
What I read here is the GS3 is no further along in development than the ATT HOX?
Leaked ROM: Check
Root: Check
What else do they have?

beaups said:
What I read here is the GS3 is no further along in development than the ATT HOX?
Leaked ROM: Check
Root: Check
What else do they have?
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Click to collapse
They ship with an unlocked bootloader. That's a pretty big deal imho. Yes, the amazing devs here tend to unlock all the big phones one way or another - but shipping unlocked sure makes the first month or two a lot more fun for folks that like to tweak their android device.

jnichols959 said:
They ship with an unlocked bootloader. That's a pretty big deal imho. Yes, the amazing devs here tend to unlock all the big phones one way or another - but shipping unlocked sure makes the first month or two a lot more fun for folks that like to tweak their android device.
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You can pretty much say the internatiional One X was bootloader unlocked.. I mean all you had to do was go to htcdev.. It wasnt like you had to do anything special cept plug your phone in and goto a website. Not really a big deal there either..

jnichols959 said:
They ship with an unlocked bootloader. That's a pretty big deal imho. Yes, the amazing devs here tend to unlock all the big phones one way or another - but shipping unlocked sure makes the first month or two a lot more fun for folks that like to tweak their android device.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Although Samsung's bootloaders are typically not locked, starting with GS2, Samsung's bootloader tracks and displays on boot up how many times you flashed non-Samsung ROM.
As others have pointed out, comparing an unbranded international version of GS3 to a AT&T branded HOX is pretty rediculus. When it finally hits AT&T (which is unknown at this time), its firmware will be modified to AT&T's demand which is pretty in line with what you get with AT&T's HOX.

nugzo said:
You can pretty much say the internatiional One X was bootloader unlocked.. I mean all you had to do was go to htcdev.. It wasnt like you had to do anything special cept plug your phone in and goto a website. Not really a big deal there either..
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Click to collapse
Yeah, I keep hoping I can get a cutting edge, quality android device on a US LTE provider with good dev support but it seems the carriers (and to a lesser extent the patent disputes) are the ones making that difficult.

I hate to say anything that could be misconstrued as something negative to the devs, but it does suck to see that our device isn't getting much love. It's a matter of circumstance and I'm sure the devs out there would love to work on this device, given the opportunity.
Just gave my Galaxy Nexus to the wife... was cleaning it up and putting the latest CM9 nightly on there and it was just beastly. I think if the camera was better I would have stuck with it. The camera on the HOX is absolutely stunning though. I have no idea how any idiots could complain about it. The pictures I take look absolutely beautiful.
Might consider selling this device in favor for a GSIII. We'll see.

look how beastly the international HOX roms are. Our phone will hopefully get that kind of love. This phone will be the next HD2 if we can get the BL unlocked.
Sent from my Calculator

americasteam said:
Still undecided if I'm keeping the One X. May go for the S3. The only thing I do despise, other than pentile screens, about the S3 is the forums here at XDA. It's worse than an iPhone forum. Samsung could poop a turd and these people would tell you why a turd is now better than anything else any manufacturer has ever produced. It's a tad ridiculous.
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Click to collapse
I really wish that someday there would be a different forum address for each manufacturer so I dont have to deal w those Samsuck fan boys. Came across one in another forum and my gosh what a fking ****. If you take notice they're all over Youtube trashing anything non-Samsuck. I hate Samsuck just because of them.

louis.b said:
I really wish that someday there would be a different forum address for each manufacturer so I dont have to deal w those Samsuck fan boys. Came across one in another forum and my gosh what a fking ****. If you take notice they're all over Youtube trashing anything non-Samsuck. I hate Samsuck just because of them.
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Click to collapse
I had a captivate. Development was slow, at first, with all the ATT restrictions..but we got through it. I am 100% Positive we will have our devices unlocked and loaded to the fullest potential.
It might take some time, but so far the stock experience has not been to painful with my HOX, Once Rooted, you can De-brand your device, Replace the missing apps, Remove Bloatware.
Yes we don't have a custom Recovery, and no easy Kernel Tweaks, but they are coming....

louis.b said:
I really wish that someday there would be a different forum address for each manufacturer so I dont have to deal w those Samsuck fan boys. Came across one in another forum and my gosh what a fking ****. If you take notice they're all over Youtube trashing anything non-Samsuck. I hate Samsuck just because of them.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Samsung has come up with very good devices you have agree with that. Galaxy S1 then S2, Note (Probably S3 also). Samsung is competing with Apple, all other android manufacturers are competing with Samsung (in my personal opinion).
I also have captivate which has many hardware issues and as above poster said dev was slow at first but see now, we were among the first ones to get CM9 (alpha) and its very stable now....The development is crazy there still.....
I am sure ATT variant of SG3 will be awesome, as in no locked BL and easy to hack as usual.

warri said:
I had a captivate. Development was slow, at first, with all the ATT restrictions..but we got through it. I am 100% Positive we will have our devices unlocked and loaded to the fullest potential.
It might take some time, but so far the stock experience has not been to painful with my HOX, Once Rooted, you can De-brand your device, Replace the missing apps, Remove Bloatware.
Yes we don't have a custom Recovery, and no easy Kernel Tweaks, but they are coming....
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm as excited as the next person to see what an unlocked bootloader will eventually do for the dev of the HOX, but I think you hit an interesting point; the quality of Sense 4.0. I know everyone ultimately would like to see the unlock, but do you think there may just be less overall development as some people are satisfied with the Sense 4.0 experience? Not to discredit the hard work that many folks are putting into dev, but I wonder if there is just a smaller quantity of dev's out there actually trying, leading to less eyes on the device, leading to a smaller likelihood/pace of new barriers being broken in the process.

fitchpuckman said:
I'm as excited as the next person to see what an unlocked bootloader will eventually do for the dev of the HOX, but I think you hit an interesting point; the quality of Sense 4.0. I know everyone ultimately would like to see the unlock, but do you think there may just be less overall development as some people are satisfied with the Sense 4.0 experience? Not to discredit the hard work that many folks are putting into dev, but I wonder if there is just a smaller quantity of dev's out there actually trying, leading to less eyes on the device, leading to a smaller likelihood/pace of new barriers being broken in the process.
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Click to collapse
nope. i want AOSP. period. i've never ever been a fan of Sense or any overlay for that matter. i love what google has done with stock ICS. i've had my eye on the eXoDIZED ROM by JDR0iD in the international HOX threads. that's exactly what i'd like to see. or even better, MIUI.

Scream @ HTC on their FB page for an update!

This was a good idea (however fruitless it may turn out to be) that I stole from the Galaxy 7.7 forum.
Go to https://www.facebook.com/htcusa and simply post this:
Dear HTC,
Update the MyTouch 4G Slide to Android 4.0+!!!
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Click to collapse
Honestly I don't think anyone would care whether it was ICS or Jelly Bean at this point, but the phone desperately needs an update to the stock ROM. Would be nice if we could get at least ICS with Sense 4!

Not gonna work
Sent from my myTouch 4G Slide using xda premium

way too late at this point

There might (just might) be an update coming from HTC at some point. One of the gov't agencies (can't remember if it was FTC or FCC) ruled against HTC last month in a major case. The result is that HTC will have to update a LOT of older phones in order to comply with the ruling. There were rumors that HTC had been working on an ICS update for our phone but ceased work due to budget issues. So, to comply with the gov't ruling, they might resume work on what they've done and release the update. Or, they could just release some lame-ass patch just to comply. But, regardless, there will probably be some sort of update coming from HTC/T-Mobile for this phone in the coming months.
EDIT: It was the FTC, here is the ruling: http://ftc.gov/opa/2013/02/htc.shtm

WangChung81 said:
This was a good idea (however fruitless it may turn out to be) that I stole from the Galaxy 7.7 forum.
Go to https://www.facebook.com/htcusa and simply post this:
Honestly I don't think anyone would care whether it was ICS or Jelly Bean at this point, but the phone desperately needs an update to the stock ROM. Would be nice if we could get at least ICS with Sense 4!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Done; and answer.....from HTC USA
HTC USA Sorry, .... The MyTouch 4g Slide will not be upgraded to ICS.
maybe more post on their side will change something...((
P.S I'm very fu. angry because there is nothing good / new with slide keyb, and, despite the fact that this equipment has a good performance, they do not want to update it, but it does not give anything with slide. ahhhh!!!!!

HTC deserve all the spam for not updating this device. Its all their fault because they didn't market it as a high end device which it is. And also failed to release an international version. The DS is a great device and still deserves more from HTC

We ALL understand your frustrations. But I'm afraid this flagship has already sailed. This is really a Sensation with a slideout KB and look what they've done for it. But really the only thing that big companies like HTC pay any attention to is marketshare. You know....their own bottom line.
Do what you will but when the time comes, I'm taking my business elsewhere. When they finally figure out that people are sick of being taken in on a worthy $500 phone by sending it out with a big hole in the hull & they all know it's sinking they MAY rethink their business model. But until that happens I'd love to see them have to name the next "biggie" they put out the Titanic.
Maybe they will see then that THEY weren't sunk by an iceberg but by a little ole Ice Cream Sandwich. KWIM?

WeekendsR2Short said:
We ALL understand your frustrations. But I'm afraid this flagship has already sailed. This is really a Sensation with a slideout KB and look what they've done for it. But really the only thing that big companies like HTC pay any attention to is marketshare. You know....their own bottom line.
Do what you will but when the time comes, I'm taking my business elsewhere. When they finally figure out that people are sick of being taken in on a worthy $500 phone by sending it out with a big hole in the hull & they all know it's sinking they MAY rethink their business model. But until that happens I'd love to see them have to name the next "biggie" they put out the Titanic.
Maybe they will see then that THEY weren't sunk by an iceberg but by a little ole Ice Cream Sandwich. KWIM?
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Click to collapse
I'm definitely NOT buying HTC anymore. They suckered me in twice, on this phone and a Flyer tablet. Never again. And I think a lot of people feel the same way, HTC is sinking, their sales are in the toilet, nobody is buying their stuff.

!!11111
Fuzi0719 said:
I'm definitely NOT buying HTC anymore. They suckered me in twice, on this phone and a Flyer tablet. Never again. And I think a lot of people feel the same way, HTC is sinking, their sales are in the toilet, nobody is buying their stuff.
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I'm definitely in agreement here, and it seems that a lot of us share the same feelings ever since HTC and Tmo decided to pretend our phone never happened. I only found out about the phone because it was an insurance replacement for my g2, which apparently wasn't available at all for replacement (refurb or not). I hadn't heard anything about the MT4GS, and the phone had released about a week prior to my swap, which goes to show you how Tmo dropped the ball on marketing. I will say that it was a marked improvement over the g2 and that i've enjoyed my time with it for the most part. However, even bone stock I would get random soft reboots and other quirks that generally went away once I rooted and rom'd.
It wound up being my third HTC phone in a row, and probably my last for some time because of the way we got treated on this device. Not to mention their current lineup (minus DNA) is pretty meh. A friend has a One X that I've had some time on, which is a pretty cool phone mind you, but not that impressive. I guess I'm going to take business to Samsung for the next one, as they irk me the least out of the android OEMs these days. I'd jump on an N4, but the whole cloud thing doesn't go over too well when you don't have consistent 4g or wifi all the time. Unfortunately, New England's geography wreaks havoc on signal in a lot of places and reliance on cloud storage just isn't ideal. Locally stored files ftw.
At the time, the official excuse for our device not getting updated was something about user experience and not working out to expectations, but as we all know that is a load of bull, since the devs here have pulled out the stops in keeping the device up to date. Granted not everything works 100% on these roms, without any source we're doing pretty darn good in this corner and there are no complaints from me about their hard work. Members of this community (and beyond) have attempted to get HTC to budge to no avail... about a year ago. There's no hope at this point of any official anything. And that sucks.
As an aside, has anyone else noticed how visually similar our mysense and sense 4 are? I definitely remember seeing the sense 4 launcher when it first dropped on a few phones and thinking that it looked a lot like our stock one.
I tried not to wall of text but I can't help it. Sorry guys and gals.

I've been looking at the Sony phones. For many years, I never considered anything Sony (after their rootkit fiasco), but that was a long time ago and I do believe their corporate policies are not as draconian. For their Android phones, they're putting out some really nice hardware and they are UPDATING them regularly. Even some of their older stuff is getting updates to JB. And their build quality is markedly better than Samsung. The Nexus phones are probably my primary interest because I'm just tired of hoping for updates. But, I'll probably wait until the next Nexus as I'm just not blown over by the Nexus 4.

Fuzi0719 said:
I've been looking at the Sony phones. For many years, I never considered anything Sony (after their rootkit fiasco), but that was a long time ago and I do believe their corporate policies are not as draconian. For their Android phones, they're putting out some really nice hardware and they are UPDATING them regularly. Even some of their older stuff is getting updates to JB. And their build quality is markedly better than Samsung. The Nexus phones are probably my primary interest because I'm just tired of hoping for updates. But, I'll probably wait until the next Nexus as I'm just not blown over by the Nexus 4.
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With only chatter about what the next Nexus "might" be I'll stick with my Nexus 4. There is not.... Let me say that again while I still can...there is not a faster device out there. Yeah of course some have huge screens and huge 6k mah batteries but they still can't keep up.
I don't keep much on my phone so I rock the 8GB with zero issues.
Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2

Fuzi0719 said:
I've been looking at the Sony phones. For many years, I never considered anything Sony (after their rootkit fiasco), but that was a long time ago and I do believe their corporate policies are not as draconian. For their Android phones, they're putting out some really nice hardware and they are UPDATING them regularly. Even some of their older stuff is getting updates to JB. And their build quality is markedly better than Samsung. The Nexus phones are probably my primary interest because I'm just tired of hoping for updates. But, I'll probably wait until the next Nexus as I'm just not blown over by the Nexus 4.
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I'm looking at Sony phones too. Pretty sure I'm going to get my gf and I the Z/ZL (she's a klutz, so she needs the waterproofing :silly
If the leaks of the SG4 are real, it's just a huge honkin phone/mini Note 3. I don't WANT a giant screen held to my face, and when I want to watch a movie or do some power browsing I have a TABLET for that.

[DISSCUSION] Are unexploitable bootloaders bringing US development to an end?

Opinions from different perspectives are most welcome but please mind your Ps and Qs.
Thank you...

Where did you get this news? please share more details about this.

engineerd2 said:
Where did you get this news? please share more details about this.
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It is not news per se. And not meaning to be flip it is a simply a question brought on by the observation of facts as they present themselfs.

My 2 cents
numbR7 said:
Opinions from different perspectives are most welcome but please mind your Ps and Qs.
Thank you...
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I don't think carriers are locking boot loaders to hinder development, in a strict sense. I believe they're doing it to force people to upgrade their devices more often, in order to gain any new innovations from OS upgrades. Take a look at the Samsung Infuse, a phone which was orphaned almost from the time of it's release. Thanks to a developer named Scott Hart, you can run kitkat 4.4 on it. If people hold on to their phones longer, profits go down.

rgrbckr said:
I don't think carriers are locking boot loaders to. hinder development, in a strict sense. I believe they're doing it to force people to upgrade their devices more often, in order to gain any new innovations from OS upgrades. Take a look at the Samsung Infuse, a phone which was orphaned almost from the time of it's release. Thanks to a developer named Scott Hart, you can run kitkat 4.4 on it. If people hold on to their phones longer, profits go down.
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I take your point and it's a good one. I do not know-for sure-the reasoning behind it just the result. Ironically, I do know that the majoritu of innovation-in my view-have come from xda members saving these carriers a lot of money in R&D. I remember loading CM on a tiny little phone a few years ago to get innvations that are now incorporated standard on most phones.
I would say it's interesting that I am continuously reminded what a small insignificant percentage xda members make up -- interestingly to argue diametrically opposed views.

numbR7 said:
I take your point and it's a good one. I do not know-for sure-the reasoning behind it just the result. Ironically, I do know that the majoritu of innovation-in my view-have come from xda members saving these carriers a lot of money in R&D. I remember loading CM on a tiny little phone a few years ago to get innvations that are now incorporated standard on most phones.
I would say it's interesting that I am continuously reminded what a small insignificant percentage xda members make up -- interestingly to argue diametrically opposed views.
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@NumbrR7: I second your point. I think that really grates (angers) me that most of the "new" phones are mostly incremental updates (i.e. better camera, updated OS). On another note, Oppo (based in mainland China) is gaining a niche for themselves because, from what I understand and read, the OS is developer-friendly and comes factory unlocked out of the box. USA carriers won't let that happen -- oh the horror. <rolling eyes>
Again, I affirm your position on this, numbR7.
XDA rules!

sameog said:
@NumbrR7: USA carriers won't let that happen -- oh the horror. <rolling eyes>
XDA rules!
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Corporate greed and capitalism. Having said that, I disagree, to some extent, with their line of thinking. I have the galaxy s, s2, s3, s4, s5 , and note3. I have had a custom Rom on every single device up until the s5 and the note. Rooting and updating to the latest OS only made me want the new hardware even more. But alas, I too think it might be fading. When it does, I think the opposite will happen, and I will hang on to my device longer. I am already thinking of going back to the s4 with Shostock on it, for my daily phone.

Poke01 said:
Corporate greed and capitalism. Having said that, I disagree, to some extent, with their line of thinking. I have the galaxy s, s2, s3, s4, s5 , and note3. I have had a custom Rom on every single device up until the s5 and the note. Rooting and updating to the latest OS only made me want the new hardware even more. But alas, I too think it might be fading. When it does, I think the opposite will happen, and I will hang on to my device longer. I am already thinking of going back to the s4 with Shostock on it, for my daily phone.
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I don't exactly agree with your first sentence (but it's worth discussion on a different type forum). That said. Your point is otherwise very well taken. You may get a new feature (maybe a new fade) but lose everthing else (that the freedom of controlling your own device gives you) suddenly that extra megapixel or two doesn't seem worth $650. Yep I'm sure of it! I think you have a really good point. I know it's a tad different but I choose to stick with Hyperdrive 15 (4.3) to avoid the hassles with SS and 4.4. That is NOT to say that I am bad mouthing SS. To the contrary, it's saved my behind. Hows that for nice language? Lol

Scott's still going with the Infuse?! Good on him! I loved that little phone. If it weren't for the problems with the video camera, I'd still be using it.
Well, this might rub some the wrong way but if all carriers started locking their bootloaders and forced buyers to choose based on hardware alone, I'd buy an iPhone. I love the little innovations that have come with an open Android - like Paranoid Android - but the hardware is usually underwhelming. The S4 has the screen going for it, but that's it. Apparently Apple will finally use larger screens on their iPhones so not much win for Samsung.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk

Wyzpopper said:
Scott's still going with the Infuse?! Good on him! I loved that little phone. If it weren't for the problems with the video camera, I'd still be using it.
Well, this might rub some the wrong way but if all carriers started locking their bootloaders and forced buyers to choose based on hardware alone, I'd buy an iPhone. I love the little innovations that have come with an open Android - like Paranoid Android - but the hardware is usually underwhelming. The S4 has the screen going for it, but that's it. Apparently Apple will finally use larger screens on their iPhones so not much win for Samsung.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk
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I think you're right especially if the screen is bumped up. With the bootloader situation you already have an "i-droid" anyway. "Open source" no longer has meaning.

Hopefully this will accelerate the people looking at buying much cheaper phones that aren't locked to any specific carrier and also aren't boot locked. The effectiveness of upgrades is dimishing which should help push this shift and hopefully will ultimately keep these big phone manufacturers honest.

bnolsen said:
Hopefully this will accelerate the people looking at buying much cheaper phones that aren't locked to any specific carrier and also aren't boot locked. The effectiveness of upgrades is dimishing which should help push this shift and hopefully will ultimately keep these big phone manufacturers honest.
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I've already looked into those "cheaper" phones. Most of them, right now, anyway, don't have LTE chipsets yet. In addition, 4G just rolled out in China (we get the new stuff first -- obviously). However, the cheaper phones are made and shipped factory unlocked. Some phones have a dual sim slots (i.e. one sim for personal, one sim for business).
I'm partnered up with a wholesaler and have access to everything he carries. The best part is that he doesn't "compete" with whom he partners up with -- bad for business, he says.
My .02 =)

as others have said it's just the way of big business in the 21st century. up until a week ago i had a 2 year old S2 which was running a 4.4.2 ROM (ressurection remix). if i hadnt been able to root and flash a ROM i'd have probably got myself a new phone long ago so locking down phones may get customers to upgrade more often (i know it would with me) as it is i bought my new phone outright and have gone payg to save myself some money and also to be able to upgrade as and when i like. i did look at some of the chinese phones (goophone being one) but wasnt sure of the root capabilities so decided to give it a miss.
i think even locked bootloaders will eventually be hacked. nothing is impossible. it's just down to when and how long we wait.

I took a brief reprieve from this forum, since there wasn't any groundbreaking progress made (and by "groundbreaking", I mean exploited bootloader).
It looks as if that has remained unchanged? I've only had the S4 for a year now, but I am officially "over" Samsung devices. Very aesthetically pleasing, but hardly functional overall. Battery is crap on every Samsung device, and the only thing that ever helped me was either buying a 3rd party with larger capacity, and/or running a custom ROM/kernel combo that allows for both less consumption as well as rapid-charge.
I'm interested to see this new thing Google is going to unveil to replace the GPE phones. I have no issue paying full price for a device that I can do whatever I want with, and know that there will be a strong following for. Even if that following is only a certain, small niche of the overall market.
It's a shame that my fun with AOSP had to come to a screeching halt, I loved the simplicity and functionality of it.

I don't think carriers make much or any money from selling new hardware. They make their money from plans.
That said, I'm happy to be on 4.4.2 SlimRom. ☺

disturbd1 said:
I took a brief reprieve from this forum, since there wasn't any groundbreaking progress made (and by "groundbreaking", I mean exploited bootloader).
It looks as if that has remained unchanged? I've only had the S4 for a year now, but I am officially "over" Samsung devices. Very aesthetically pleasing, but hardly functional overall. Battery is crap on every Samsung device, and the only thing that ever helped me was either buying a 3rd party with larger capacity, and/or running a custom ROM/kernel combo that allows for both less consumption as well as rapid-charge.
I'm interested to see this new thing Google is going to unveil to replace the GPE phones. I have no issue paying full price for a device that I can do whatever I want with, and know that there will be a strong following for. Even if that following is only a certain, small niche of the overall market.
It's a shame that my fun with AOSP had to come to a screeching halt, I loved the simplicity and functionality of it.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, even if I sold my i337, the battery life was honestly very good for me. There's the facts that maybe I don't use it heavily every day, but I turn GPS on only when I have to find a specific place I haven't been to before. GPS down - battery life up. 3G down, unless I need it - battery life up. Power saving mode - battery life up.
As for the Android Silver program, we all are curious to see how will this turn out.