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Hi all,
I am just looking for some advise!!!
I have been playing with xdandroid on my Verizon TP2 for a long time, and have decided its time to switch from win mo to android. Although on the TP2 alot doesnt work, I love android!
Some I'm wondering what is the Best Hackable android phone for Verizon???
Thanks for any thoughts.
Chris Seeley
Many would argue that the droid one is best
For Verizon? Your best bet is probably the Fascinate... maybe the Incredible. From what I've read, the Incredible is more usefully-hacked today, but I believe the Fascinate is likely to have the brightest long-term hacking future.
The big difference between the two: HTC violates the GPL and builds a monolithic kernel with proprietary drivers compiled directly into it, then unceremoniously hacks them out and $hits the hollowed-out carcass on the curb. HTC's kernel source is a half step short of completely useless, and building custom kernels for HTC phones that fully support its hardware (camera, bluetooth, etc) is a never-ending challenge that begins anew with every upgrade. Put another way, HTC's kernel source isn't buildable at all (it has dependencies on files they didn't include and broken references), let alone buildable into a kernel that can be used in the phone. Samsung, in contrast, releases nice kernel source that actually builds, and neatly bundles its proprietary drivers into proper loadable kernel modules.
Put another way, more progress has been made on the Incredible since it's been out for almost 6 months now (vs ~6 weeks for the Fascinate), but the Fascinate today is roughly where the Incredible was 3-4 months after its release. The Epic4G had custom kernels built from the ground up less than a month after its release. Most month-old HTC phones are lucky to have slightly-hacked and tweaked kernels that don't break one or more major peripherals. In fact, the biggest delay for the Epic (and presumably Fascinate) wasn't building a kernel... it was building the replacement bootloader and ripping backup copies of the ROM before blowing it away (the bundled apps from Samsung, Sprint, and Google can't legally be redistributed, so the only way to get them in a new ROM is to rip them from your stock ROM and save a backup copy to restore after reflashing)
Forget Motorola phones even exist. The likelihood of ever being able to truly reflash a Droid2 or Droid X is slim. They've both been rooted, and are hackable to some extent, but with both, you're always going to have to worry about Motorola or Verizon changing the metaphorical locks on the door while you're not paying attention and seriously compromising your satisfaction with your phone.
Thanks.... It just so happened that the fascinate is FREE at bestbuy today. Had to order it online, but I can deal with that.
Free phone Friday I guess....
So it is on order.
Thanks,
Chris
bitbang3r said:
For Verizon? Your best bet is probably the Fascinate... maybe the Incredible. From what I've read, the Incredible is more usefully-hacked today, but I believe the Fascinate is likely to have the brightest long-term hacking future.
--snip--
Samsung, in contrast, releases nice kernel source that actually builds, and neatly bundles its proprietary drivers into proper loadable kernel modules.
--snip--
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would think n1 being a developer phone
Sent from my Nexus One using XDA App
OP said they're on vzw...hence no N1 option
Sent from my ADR6300 using XDA App
Too bad u'r on verizon...otherwise it's the Nexsus One
The incredible is just as hackable as the first droid but twice the speed and way sleeker I've had both and I much prefer the Incredible.
Congrats on the Fascinate!
One other benefit of the Fascinate over the Incredible. The Incredible shares much of its design with the Desire, but the only other Desire that's CDMA is US Cellular's. Verizon has never really promoted the Incredible heavily (first they ran out of them for months, then the Droid2/DroidX came along to take Verizon's top spots), and US Cellular is kind of like Alltel was... not exactly a small company, but not exactly T-Mobile, AT&T, or Sprint, either.
In contrast, the Fascinate shares much of its architecture (including the GPU) with the entire Galaxy S family, and shares the most proprietary parts of its architecture with the Epic4G, which IS Sprint's flagship (or at least reigning co-champion) phone right now. So, in the long run, there won't be any shortage of AOSP-based ROMs that combine the CDMA-specific stuff from the Epic with the family-wide stuff from the rest of the Galaxy S line. Even if the Fascinate never really gets heavily promoted by Verizon or attracts a huge number of developers, the fact that it can more or less benefit directly from so many other family members is IMHO a huge plus. Oh, also... US Cellular has the Mesmerize, which IS pretty much identical to the Fascinate.
The Incredible is a very nice phone. If Verizon released it with the same form factor as US Cellular's Desire (specifically, the real hardkeys) and managed to keep them in stock long enough to tempt me, it might have been the phone that got me to leave Sprint. But knowing what I know now (6 months later) about the kernel architectures and cross-family compatibility of both HTC's phones and Samsung's, I do think the Samsungs are going to have a long, fertile life as phones for hacking.
bitbang3r said:
Forget Motorola phones even exist. The likelihood of ever being able to truly reflash a Droid2 or Droid X is slim. They've both been rooted, and are hackable to some extent, but with both, you're always going to have to worry about Motorola or Verizon changing the metaphorical locks on the door while you're not paying attention and seriously compromising your satisfaction with your phone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I have a droid2, fully flashed to cricket and hacked all to he**.. idk if verizon has something in there system that makes changes to the phone whenever they want, but I have not had any problems with the phone doing whatever I want it to do. custom roms/rooting/etc.. all work great
Droid is the best for hacking other vize try out the Nexsus one....
HTC HD2
Sent from my HTC HD2 using Tapatalk
Thanks to all that contributed. Is the consesus here that the best developer support for future android builds, irrespective of carrier, is The Nexus S ?
Hi tablet users, as a relatively new Android user, (ARIA Rooted and updated to 2.2 thanks to ATTN1) I have been extremely interested in this tablet. I was hoping to get some real answers from honest users of this device. I just don't trust the reviews that you can read from the various e-stores as they could be made up to entice people to buy.
Any feedback would be stellar!
Does it work with the regular Android market?
Don't be afraid to buy, as long as you don't mind tinkering just a little...
It's extremely easy to install one of these custom ROMs and have this little machine humming right along...I went from TnTlite v2.4 to 3.0 in about 5 minutes...
I haven't installed ClockworkMod. Adding Flash is easy enough, and I think is included in TnTlite 3.0...Getting the market to work correctly (99% anyway) is very easy.
I'm looking forward to 3.1 and future updates...it will only get better.
Thanks XDA!
You can add Market to the stock GTablet; there are instructions in other threads on the forum.
You will get the most bang for your bucks by flashing one of the custom ROMs available here. I used Zpad for a while but was won over by the soft buttons and lack of TnT in the VEGAn build.
I use my tablet every day for all my web, email, and chatting needs. I only use my laptop... hmm, when DO I use my laptop? Oh yeah, for torrents and word processing, since there aren't any tablet-aware office suites... yet.
-=Sent from my VS GTablet (VEGAn b4) using Tapatalk=-
I'm just curious but since ICS is coming, what does that mean for us? All I've heard is another UI overhaul for phones to give them more honeycomb, but what do we get? If Hardware Acceleration is in then I would be happy, but there doesn't seem to be anything in it for us tablet users.
Unless I'm missing something.
http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2393797,00.asp#fbid=eHhpmAndRdICant really say kinda early..heres something I found but still unsure
I hope it means an update and AOSP!!
Not sure what the link was for...... Didn't tell me anything I didn't already know. Sorry. But I'm just not sure if I would be excited about ics on my Xoom.
Imma say that it will be on the original Xoom's without a doubt. I read in an article that ICS will be able to run on older devices, thus it's almost a guarantee the Xoom will see it officially. Annnnd for some reason it does not... have no fear, as the devs will be here to solve that problem! The OG Droid was left out of the update loop awhile back because newer models replaced it, but we still have the most current updates on it thanks to the brilliant devs. Just gotta have some faith in your XDA community, and they will figure something out.
But again, I think the OP wants to know (...like I also do) what's the big improvement gonna be?
As I stated on another recent post, the big deal for me as I see it is that (presumably) the SC for HC will be released and then the ROM goodness will follow. But if it's anything like what happened with Froyo, etc, the Honeycomb custom ROMs will kick the stock Icecream Sandwichs' ass.
-No?
Psychokitty said:
But again, I think the OP wants to know (...like I also do) what's the big improvement gonna be?
As I stated on another recent post, the big deal for me as I see it is that (presumably) the SC for HC will be released and then the ROM goodness will follow. But if it's anything like what happened with Froyo, etc, the Honeycomb custom ROMs will kick the stock Icecream Sandwichs' ass.
-No?
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Click to collapse
Thanks for being the only reply actually related to my post, but Google had stated a long time ago that the SC for hc will never be released as the SC for ics will be released instead. But since phones will get more hc goodness, what do we get?(which is the main question in the topic)
I think at this point, it's a wait-and-see kind of thing.
But I think finally having the source code is the biggest news here. I think it will be the dawning of a golden age for the XOOM, so to speak.
Also, one advantage to the phone side getting lumped in to the same OS is that we will see a boost in apps that are tablet optimized since the devs will be able to work all of it into one .apk instead of focusing on two separate projects.
These are the two things I'm personally looking forward to the most as far as the tablet side goes.
Of course, it would be nice to be surprised, too.
kenfly said:
Thanks for being the only reply actually related to my post, but Google had stated a long time ago that the SC for hc will never be released as the SC for ics will be released instead. But since phones will get more hc goodness, what do we get?(which is the main question in the topic)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well, I think, since ICS will be open source, we will get additional development for the Xoom, beyond the wonderful feature additions and enhancements we have gotten with the limited HC.
Don't you think so?
From my understanding, Ice Cream Sandwich is an over haul for phones to bring out an honeycomb interface while allowing for tablet support as well and it will be more controlled by the king them self, Google.
What this means? All android devices will now be updated at the same time as it'll be more tightly integrated which means developers will need to start just making widgets for there own devices instead of a completely different interfaces like they do today. In a way, it'll be exactly what Honeycomb tablets are today (if you look at all the honeycomb tablets that's out, the interface is the same, only differences is that others will have widgets and/or wallpapers designed just for there tablets (i.e., samsung has the touchwiz) but can be upgraded all the same).
This is supposed to be more more uniform support and faster updates.
Will this go into effect right away? Probably not since the manufacturers will still need to make to update go through but we should also expect to see faster updates as well (there's still a lot of users out there still waiting on Gingerbread releases for there devices so with this making it more uniformed should allow for faster releases).
This is only from what I've heard, though.
This is from a PC World article this morning:
Although Google has kept its cards close to its vest about ICS, a number of things have been reported about it.
Widgets will be richer and resizable, as they are in the tablet version of Android.
More multitasking will be added to the system and the OS will be open source.
The system will be tailored to take advantage of devices that use the Texas Instrument's OMAP chip.
As with any Android upgrade, what Android devices will be eligible for the new system will remain with the manufacturers, but two good bets for the upgraded OS are the Samsung Nexus S and the Motorola Xoom.
---
I think it is important to understand one thing about ICS. It is intended to reunify the OS on all device types (like iOS). What this means for tablet (and conversely smartphone) users is that app development will improve and we will get better apps. These apps will make it easier to share functions between your tablet and your smartphone.
We would have found out more next Tuesday, but the announcements for ICS have been postponed. The postponement was for a good reason though. We still don't know what the reschedule date will be, other than sometime this month.
just to let everyone know up front I am not considering any apple tablets, so please do not suggest them
I've been looking at the HTC Flyer, the Samsung Galaxy tab, but am not sure if there are any other decent tablets out there between 7'' - 12''
budgets is about 200-400 quid
I'm just having a hard time making a decision, I'm not bothered about 1080p playback 720p is fine with me, must have a decent processor/gpu as I like to play alot of games as well, must be android only
at least 5mp camera, preferable with the option of being able to root and ICS
do i get a 3g sim or non 3g? what the heck do i do?
hdmi out is a selling point, dual core is a selling point
I won't be making calls on it but I might want to use 3g+ on it if im out and about
rooting and customisation very important
any one got any decent suggestions,
EDIT:
GOT THE XOOM IN THE END, WHAT A TABLET!! its freaking amazing
I hear the Tab is quite good.
Sent from my SPH-D710 using XDA
mox123 said:
just to let everyone know up front I am not considering any apple tablets, so please do not suggest them
I've been looking at the HTC Flyer, the Samsung Galaxy tab, but am not sure if there are any other decent tablets out there between 7'' - 12''
budgets is about 200-400 quid
I'm just having a hard time making a decision, I'm not bothered about 1080p playback 720p is fine with me, must have a decent processor/gpu as I like to play alot of games as well, must be android only
at least 5mp camera, preferable with the option of being able to root and ICS
do i get a 3g sim or non 3g? what the heck do i do?
hdmi out is a selling point, dual core is a selling point
I won't be making calls on it but I might want to use 3g+ on it if im out and about
rooting and customisation very important
any one got any decent suggestions,
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This should help you choose lol
droidfather.com/VideoCategory/Android-Tablets
The Asus transformer series are really nice, I'm looking around to get a Samsung Galaxy Tab myself soon, it looks quiet promising.
I would recommend the Motorola Xoom. The development for the device has been stellar, the devs are awesome and has an unlockable bootloader. Cm9 and other wonderful custom roms like Team EOS nightly builds are solid, fast and will make others envious. The Xoom feels solid and is well built. The screen is not as nice as the ones found on the Asus transformer or Samsung Tab but it isn't bad either. Those other screens also have their cons due to the nature of their technology. There have also been a decent amount of complaints about Asus build quality and Samsung lack of timely updates. The Xoom was the first to get ICS, the first to get a cornerstone build, the first to be officially supported tab for Cm9 and continues to have the latest android enhancements via Team EOS roms. Also the proprietary charger charges the xoom pretty fast and the accessories are cheap now due to it being out for a while. Because it was the first to market, it doesn't mean the it is obsolete. I got a bit of a bad rep in the beginning due to screw ups on Motorola part but all is well now.
I have a 4g Xoom and use it every day. I run the Team EOS nightlys, with the device overlooked to 1.4 (i can get 1.6, but not needed) and undervolted to save juice. Feel free to check out the development thread to verify my claims. Cheers!
what about the xoom 2?
i actually like the look of the xoom 1 but the xoom 2 doesnt look great, whats your thoughts
mox123 said:
what about the xoom 2?
i actually like the look of the xoom 1 but the xoom 2 doesnt look great, whats your thoughts
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Don't get the xoom 2. The bootloader is locked, there isn't nearly as much dev support, no custom roms, no micro sd card slot (deal breaker), more expensive and not all the much of an improvement. It also isn't a Google experience device.
Yea, this I will admit the the screen is better and the writing tech is nice. But you will kick yourself for not going with a better supported device. Before I purchase anything, I checked to see how the community support of the device is and recommend that others do the same. I don't want to solely rely on manufacturers for support.
To be honest I would wait for the Windows 8 tablets if you truly cannot buy an Apple device, as all of the Android tablets still suck(to put it mildly). The iPad is just in a whole another league right now, and ICS didn't make the situation any better. They all lag like crazy, even the 7.7 inch Exynos-equipped Tablet from Samsung. The tablet experience just isn't there yet for android.
What ever you do never get an LG V900 or V909, cant be rooted, or just shortly until you reboot.
Unless you like stock and no root.
Have a look to the Acer Iconia 501.
Toss3 said:
To be honest I would wait for the Windows 8 tablets if you truly cannot buy an Apple device, as all of the Android tablets still suck(to put it mildly). The iPad is just in a whole another league right now, and ICS didn't make the situation any better. They all lag like crazy, even the 7.7 inch Exynos-equipped Tablet from Samsung. The tablet experience just isn't there yet for android.
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Click to collapse
Wow really? What tablets running ICS have you owned? My Xoom running Team EOS ICS 4.0.3 is smooth an rarely lags.
The ipad hardware is in another league but the software is still Crap. What good is having all of that power and design but only being able to do 1/4 of what an android tablet can do? Also you are limited to whatever apps Apple deems fit in their one appstore. The other other alternative is to jailbreak and uses cydia. Don't even get me started on having to rely on a pc or mac to back up apps and settings usin itunes. On android I just use titanium backup and clockwork recovery to make a full back up to my micro sd card. I have been through that Crap an will never go back. Have you?
I also like how people are assuming windows 8 is going to be the answer for everyone. It can't run your normal desktop apps, I will be more expensive, it will be locked down, possibly more vulnerable due to it being based of windows and missing so awesome features due to limited api access or something similar. Keep in mind the Android was never intended to take on desktop OSs and the ios doesn't come any closer to accomplishing that. ios is worst. I don't care if here are 200,000+ apps, how many fart emulators and angry birds clones do you need? I how many apps do people on average even bother downloading from the appstore? I can tell you it is not 200,000 or even 50.
I will admit that the stock rom may have its issues, the custom roms usually fixes and enhances the user experience. I have only used the Motorola Xoom and Asus Transformer. Both have Cm9 and Team EOS ICS 4.0.3 nightlys available for them that run like butter. I never use stock rom.
ICS is there in tablet experience and will be getting better with release of 4.0.5 and 4.0.4. I wish people wih limited hands on experience would stop making blanket general statements. Not having the opportunity to tinker wih various hardware and software is one thing, but being unsatisfied wih the out of he box experience is another. This is XDA, experiment, create and discover.
ASUS Transformer Series are good and popular
@runhopskipjump: Way to go turning this into an Apple vs Android thread. Read any reputable review site that actually have an objective viewpoint on the matter and you'll come to realize exactly what everyone else has(except for some die-hard android fans): the android experience does not translate well onto tablets yet.
I love android, and have been waiting on an android tablet that would match the iPad, like the SGS did with the iPhone, but alas no tablet has done so yet and with the new iPad, apple leapfrogged the android manufacturers by a year, again.
The only tablet I would even remotely consider is the updated Transformer Prime TF700, but that won't be out until June.
Windows 8 is going to bridge the gap between the PC and Tablet space, allowing tablets to run desktop apps and vice versa. I hate having to have two devices, when one should be enough. The battery life of the current crop of Windows 7 tablets just isn't quite there yet and is the only obstacle keeping me from buying one, and I am hoping that the arm version of Windows 8 is going to remedy that.
thats the problem alot of the hardware does suck, however with the tegra 3 having only 1 gpu core compared to a5x's 4 gpus,
i think apple did the right thing here but I can't support a company like apple
the transformer prime sucks and they have made a new model of the same prime tablet due to issues with the back aluminum and some slight enhancements,
so in a way there is a flaw with those tablets right there and to overcome those you need to purchase the even new model of the prime,
I don't want to be running around, I just want something that will work hardware wise, and the software I can work around with custom roms,
tab
i would chose the samsung galaxy tab
I really recommend you TAB from Samsung Galaxy family
.
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I'm very satisfied with my galaxy tab 10.1
Covers all my needs, has great ROMs - I've only tried overcome, but there are others - and is overclockable.
Now that I've found the switchme app - me, my wife and child all have our separate accounts on it.
Whatever you get, make sure you have enough internal space for such an app.
It's very convenient for more than one user to be able to have their own google account on a tablet, since they often are shared my more than one user.
Sent from my GT-P7500 using xda premium
its such a hard choice as they are all good but only one is going to be bought,
I wish I could make up my damn mind
mox123 said:
its such a hard choice as they are all good but only one is going to be bought,
I wish I could make up my damn mind
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If money is no object, you have two choices. Either you want a tablet can double down as a netbook and you go for the upcoming ASUS Transformer tablet (skip the Prime, I've heard from several people that it has connectivity issues), or you're more into consuming media, in which case Samsung Galaxy Tab is really good.
At this point it slowly starts to become a matter of taste. The top competitors are pretty close to each other. I'm curious about the upcoming Google-branded tablet too - I kicked the HTC Sense to the curb after a mere 2 weeks and replaced it with AOSP, so I don't put great trust in third party shells.
now, i understand that development takes time, but given the potential of this tablet, i am somewhat dissapointed. i haven't really seen much progress past getting root, unlock, a recovery, a few roms based on stock, and one guy trying to port cm10. i guess what we are waiting for is the official jellybean upgrade before development picks up.
tweeklulz said:
now, i understand that development takes time, but given the potential of this tablet, i am somewhat dissapointed. i haven't really seen much progress past getting root, unlock, a recovery, a few roms based on stock, and one guy trying to port cm10. i guess what we are waiting for is the official jellybean upgrade before development picks up.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I feel you buddy, I'm coming from the Epic Touch forum that is very active in the development area. I too am disappointed with the lack of devs and ROMs for this tablet, but you have to realize its still fairly new and pretty expensive. I imagine most tablet devs would gravitate toward the Nexus 7 instead. Give it some time though, more will come.
Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S II Epic 4G Touch.
SuperSwagSauce said:
I feel you buddy, I'm coming from the Epic Touch forum that is very active in the development area. I too am disappointed with the lack of devs and ROMs for this tablet, but you have to realize its still fairly new and pretty expensive. I imagine most tablet devs would gravitate toward the Nexus 7 instead. Give it some time though, more will come.
Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S II Epic 4G Touch.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yeah, and they released this iteration way too soon (<6 months i think) for devs to leave their primes
I think a lot of the devs have sent theirs back. I'm kind of wishing I had with mine. Pretty disappointed with the device so far.
One of the AOKP devs is working on a port to the tf700, and judging by his twitter the only major things holding him back from a release are issues with Bluetooth and some visual glitches. Once we have that, roms should follow since we'll have a working AOSP base.
His twitter account is here:
www.twitter.com/_mrbirdman_
Actually to me, having custom ROMS on tablets is a little overrated. Root I can understand but seeing as I have owned the Xoom, Prime, and new the Infinity, must of the ROMS I have played with didn't add that much to the experience that stock already had. Outside of being able to use Sixaxis app, I have had little interest in rooting this Infinity. I think the wait for Jellybean is going to be with it.
Add in the fact that people are doing this on their free time, taking time away from their families, waiting a little bit won't hurt too bad.
SuperSwagSauce said:
I feel you buddy, I'm coming from the Epic Touch forum that is very active in the development area. I too am disappointed with the lack of devs and ROMs for this tablet, but you have to realize its still fairly new and pretty expensive. I imagine most tablet devs would gravitate toward the Nexus 7 instead. Give it some time though, more will come.
Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S II Epic 4G Touch.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
and if you were in the e4gt forums from the beginning you will remember that it took several months for anything worth while to show up and how long for stable cm9? it took that forum quite a while to really get going.
legendary1022 said:
Actually to me, having custom ROMS on tablets is a little overrated. Root I can understand but seeing as I have owned the Xoom, Prime, and new the Infinity, must of the ROMS I have played with didn't add that much to the experience that stock already had. Outside of being able to use Sixaxis app, I have had little interest in rooting this Infinity. I think the wait for Jellybean is going to be with it.
Add in the fact that people are doing this on their free time, taking time away from their families, waiting a little bit won't hurt too bad.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well to each their own, but to me, it's in custom development that you really begin to use the device to it's full potential. For instance, the OG Xoom has been literally given new life with EOS Jellybean builds. Yes, the Xoom wifi did get the JB OTA update, but stock JB is nowhere near as great as the EOS nightlies. They have tweaked it to capacity. The same will happen with the TF700 in time, I hope.
I also have the Nexus 7 and it's true that development has exploded for it, but honestly, it's a really limited device. For that reason, devs are in a performance competition...pushing things to the max. The TF700 though needs to be able to work really well...we'll need to be able to find the balance between high performance and stability. The fact that it's not really skinned is in its favor. It's not a Nexus device though and so some devs will not be interested in working with it.
Part of the problem in developing custom roms - which I have been doing for the Galaxy S 2/3 - is that currently you cannot decompile/recompile the SystemUI.apk file for the TF700T. XDA user iBotPeaches has taken over development of the apktool (tool to decompile/recompile APKs) project and is aware of the problem I and others are having. He is working to fix it.
As soon as it is fixed, I will be releasing a custom rom for the TF700T, but I need to make changes to the SystemUI.apk file. I can decompile/recompile the framework-res.apk file (have added CRT OFF effect already - and it works better than on my Galaxy S3).
So please have a little patience while the development tools are fixed and improved.
One other point to consider is that the Jelly Bean update is right around the corner, so putting much effort into modifying the current ICS version or actually making Jelly Bean work on the tablet is a waste of time.