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Upcoming developer: which platform to concentrate on?

Hi there,
it seems to me most people here develop for WinMo devices, but maybe you can help me out nonetheless.
Currently, I'm a web developer in PHP (+ usual stuff). I studied computer science, so I'm not a newbie when it comes to coding I learned a lot of C and (unfortunately only) basics in Java and C++. I never got my hands on C# or VB and stuff - the only experience in developing applications for Windows Mobile was a small Texas Hold'em Clock (basically a simple countdown and some additional stuff) I did a few months back. I pretty much google'd everything I needed and copy'n pasted the code into Visual Studio - not really developing, but those where my first steps
I consider getting started in development for mobile devices like BlackBerry, Windows Mobile devices, iPhone, Symbian and/or Android. The problem is: I don't know which one of these might turn out useful on when I might be applying for a job later (which is basically my whole point doing this, I don't want to do web development for the rest of my life). Any thoughts?

What type of job do you want to do? first find out what the sort of jobs you want to do require, many software houses use c# so you could develop for windows mobile, if they require java then try android. Iphone uses objective c which isn't used outside of the mac world so unless you want to work for a company which creates mac programs maybe you should try something else.
Then again if you just want to make some cool apps and actually make money from them I would say iphone is the easiest to get you product to market then android with wm coming last.
also if you learn java then you can quickly pick up c# and vice versa so I don't think it really matters either way.
there are of course many other options, if you happen to want a job that requires python you could get the excellent upcoming n900 from nokia

Cant offer advise on that, but what you can do is write a better app for Facebook, the MS one SUCKS compared to the iphones (eeek i said the dirty word............)

ms's also sucks compared to the x1 panel facebook which again is not as good as iphones :S

running application in C on mobile phone with Android

Hello !
SUMMARY: How to run pocketsphinx_continuous on mobile phone with Android, and how to do it with simulator of mobile phone with Android. PocketSphinx can be downloaded for free here, for both Linux and Windows: http://cmusphinx.sourceforge.net/html/download.php .
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SHORT EXPLANATION
I'd like to create application for mobile phone and server such that:
1. User runs application on mobile phone with Android, this application uses PocketSphinx. It is Automatic Speech Recognition software for devices like mobile phones, written in C. Somebody told me that "Pocketsphinx is used successfully on Symbian with minimal effort". (However I think Android may be better choice). My knowledge about Android is limited but I know something about CMU Sphinx. Can you help me, please, to run this PocketSphinx on Android? I also need to find simulator of mobile phone with Android. I have already found Wireless Toolkit and I tried to use this emulator, however I think it doesn't allow to run simulation of mobile phones with Android. (By the way I am limited in my project to mobile phone of the price up to about 160 euro; which Android version would be best for my application?).
2. This application communicates with the user. The users speaks digits and some other words (dictionary is about fifteen words, I can create language and acoustic models, as well as formal grammar in CMU Sphinx, with the use of SphinxTrain). The application recognizes those digits.
3. Based on this talk, mobile phone sends information about results of recognition to the server. I can do it in Java for CLDC/MIDP with httpconnection, POST method on the mobile phone side and with Tomcat on server. I think this httpconnection must be possible not only in Java ME, but also in Android C. But this is thing which will bother me later, now I'd like to run pocketsphinx_continuous on Android and try to modify it according to my needs.
Summing up, what I'd like to know is how to run demo pocketsphinx_continuous on mobile phone with Android, and how to do it with simulator of mobile phone with Android. (I've got Wireless Toolkit but I think it is not capable of running Android). PocketSphinx can be downloaded for free here, for both Linux and Windows: http://cmusphinx.sourceforge.net/html/download.php . There are two ways of installing it in Ubuntu. First is to unpack it (it is tar.gz), enter its directory and type "./configure", "make", "sudo make install". The other, different, is written in README file, i.e. run autogen.sh, "./configure", "make clean all", "make test", "make install". The result should be, among many other files, javadoc in doc directory.
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LONG EXPLANATION
What is required to give me some advices is written above. So if you don't want / don't have time to read the whole text, just above explanation is enough. But let me say about other possible approaches which I try to do. Those are worse than what I explained above, but I also tried them.
CMU Sphinx contains SphinxTrain to create acoustic model. It has got some different recognizers (also called decoders), those are PocketSphinx, Sphinx4 and some other. PocketSphinx is written in C and is for devices like mobile phones. Sphinx4 is Java application for PCs because it requires better hardware. There is good tutorial about using SphinxTrain with Sphinx4. It is here: http://www.speech.cs.cmu.edu/sphinx/tutorial.html . There is no similar tutorial for PocketSphinx. However with some knowledge about Android and C it is possible to run it on Android. The other approach than PocketSphinx, is using this Sphinx4. However it requires connection between mobile phone and server, sending audio data from cellular phone to server. It can be done with Skype, but there is still problem on server side with redirecting sound from Skype to Sphinx4. So you see there are two different approaches. One is to run speech recognition on mobile phone with PocketSphinx and Android. The other is speech recognition on server with Sphinx4. There are some ways to follow this second option. One is Skype on both server and mobile phone. (But there is problem with redirecting speech from Skype to Sphinx4). The other is too expensive Digium card. The third one is IVR, but I still look for good open-source IVR software. All of those three ways of second option involve Sphinx4. It was much easier to create application with Sphinx4. It is for PCs, not embedded devices, because it requires better device, extensive floating point math and some other things. But it has much better documentation than PocketSphinx. But I want to use PocketSphinx because I don't need to pay to anybody for access to mobile internet in order to send data through internet for application like Skype. The access to internet is required only for short time to send little text data with httpconnection, POST method. This is why I'd like you to help me, please, with running pocketsphinx_continuous on simulator of PocketSphinx on mobile phone with Android. (By the way, I see I've got installed S60 Developer Tools -> 3rd Edition FP1 SDK -> MIDP -> Emulator).
Summing up in a list, those are in CMU Sphinx:
I. SphinxTrain, which I can use to create files needed for speech recognition
II. decoders which use speech input and some files which I create with SphinxTrain, to follow speech recognition (input speech + files from SphinxTrain = are used by decoder)
II-1. PocketSphinx, written in C, for devices like mobile phones
II-2. Sphinx3, written in C, for PCs, actually the best developed
II-3. Sphinx4, written in Java, for PCs, with the best documentation
II-4. Some other, older versions
Those are possible approaches of solving my task:
I. Speech recognition on mobile phone with PocketSphinx. This is much better way than [II].
Problems: 1. running PocketSphinx on mobile phone with Android. 2. simulating mobile phone with Android on PC. I also thought that maybe I should consider Meamo, what do you think about it? Or use things different than CMU Sphinx, e.g. Simon, HTK, Julius. I looked at those other ASR engines and I think PocketSphinx may be best choice.
II. Speech recognition on server with Sphinx4. There are some different ways of establishing voice connection between mobile phone and server.
II-1. ordinary call from mobile phone to server; server has got Digium card. Disadvantage: Digium card is expensive.
II-2. to use Skype on both mobile phone and server. Problem: redirecting of sound from Skype to Sphinx4 and vice versa.
II-3. can you think about any other ways? I found that Asterisk may be useful.
Greetings !

Summing up, what I'd like to know is how to run demo pocketsphinx_continuous on mobile phone with Android
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First step would be to setup a toolchain and compile the prog for android
or statically linked with uClibc.
Then push it onto your device and test if it works as expected.
You can also push it onto the android emulator that comes with the sdk.
Just my 2 cents...

Thank you very much!
Can you give me any links to tutorials which can be useful for me?
By the way I know how to create my own application in Sphinx4 and I know how to run demo in PocketSphinx, but I've got some difficulties with creating my own application for PocketSphinx. So if you can have a look at PocketSphinx http://cmusphinx.sourceforge.net/html/download.php and tell me which files I need to have to create new project for PocketSphinx, I would be greatful. I mean that for Sphinx4 the only what I need to do is to enter S:\tutorial\sphinx4-1.0beta3-src\src\apps\edu\cmu\sphinx\demo\helloworld and create my own ...\demo\my_application, and inside it analogically to what is here ...\demo\helloworld. In the case of PocketSphinx, to run the application, I need to enter S:\tutorial\pocketsphinx\doc and run pocketsphinx_continuous. So I check what I've got in this file and I cannot see what files and where I need to have in order to create new project. I uploaded directory doc with pocketsphinx_continuous here: http://www.speedyshare.com/files/19429494/doc.7z
Greetings and thanks once more !

Rough outline: You'll need the Android SDK and NDK, both of which are available from http://developer.android.com/. The NDK will allow you to compile C code. You'll need to wrap the C core in a Java layer to make it accessible to the rest of the Android system. The SDK also includes an emulator, which I believe you've asked for if I understand you right.
I haven't actually attempted this, so that's about all the help I can be, but there is sample code included with the NDK that should get you started.

Thanks for your answer !
I check the google and see that NDK is term of Android, because I knew only SDK abbreviation. I assume NDK is especially for porting (like porting PocketSphinx for Android). So am I right that with this NDK I don't need to change code of PocketSphinx? I think it would be too easy .
There also other question which I've got. It is not strictly connected with Symbian but there wouldn't be any need for porting if I won't solve this problem. I've got my application in Sphinx4. There are also examplary appications for Sphinx4 and PocketSphinx. I can run demos from PocketSphinx (as explained in first post), as well as demos from Sphinx4. I can change source code of demos from Sphinx4 to perform my task. I'd like to do similar thing with PocketSphinx, but even if it should be easy task, I cannot do it. In Sphinx4 it is much simpler because all source files are in one directory. In PocketSphinx it is done in somehow different way. (http://cmusphinx.sourceforge.net/html/download.php). Without ability to move my application from Sphinx4 there is no need for me to port this PocketSphinx to Symbian.
Greetings !

johnyjj2 said:
I assume NDK is especially for porting (like porting PocketSphinx for Android). So am I right that with this NDK I don't need to change code of PocketSphinx? I think it would be too easy .
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Click to collapse
NDK is used to write software for Android devices that are compiled natively to the platform -- for now, this usually means ARM. Java as you probably realize is a bytecode intermediate language that the java virtual machine converts to native calls at runtime. This means that Java is generally platform independent whereas your C code is not.
JNI as used with the NDK is the Java Native Interface (or something to that effect). It allows you to call code that has been compiled for a specific processor from Java. This means that you could put heavily optimized super fast calculations in a native library and call them from your Java app.
It could also mean, that you've more or less written your entire application in some native code, and then you have written a java shim that has enough code to initiate and start your native software. Beware, there be dragons here.
The fact that you CAN do this, doesn't mean you SHOULD. There are a lot of benefits to using the android platform and specifically using the android way of writing applications. Concepts like views, activities, intents, etc., greatly simplify how an Android device interacts with other Android devices and provides a consistent and powerful framework.
For something like SCUMMVM, it is a game (platform) that is very linear in design; you are either actively playing it, or it is on pause. How other applications are running while using SCUMMVM is inconsequential. It sounds like you have very different requirements.

Thanks for answer!
Isn't that link (http://cmusphinx.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/cmusphinx?view=rev&revision=9470) simply trying to copy engine library to Symbian, without effect? Only enginge won't help, there is also need to write from zero code which will use this library. So it looks like there is still long way to have it working. Do I understand it properly?
Greetings!

Views sought on cross platform development

Hi
I work for a small research firm/IT consultancy. I'm attending a meeting in a few weeks time, the meeting is being held by the University of the West of England (a UK Uni) and various local business groups. The aim is to discuss the development of a GPS-based program to help encourage children to exercise. As I have a bit of knowledge about various GPS-based software programs and platforms, I have been asked by a contact of mine to attend.
I've been thinking that by far the most obvious platform to target is the mobile phone - every kid has one and most these days have either GPS built-in or can access a bluetooth GPS device. Now, there are five mobile phone platforms, Java, Nokia's Symbian, Apple's iPhone, Google's Android and Microsoft's Windows Mobile. If an app could be developed across all five platforms, it would be pretty much available to all kids.
As I have very limited experience of these platforms, I was wondering if anyone cared to give any views on the difficulties involved in developing for all five platforms (is it even possible to cross-develop across all these five platforms, or would each one be a separate project?) and any other views pertinent to GPS-based programs for mobile.
Also, if you know of any Android developers (companies) in the South West of England, preferably Bristol, that would also be great.
Rupert Plumridge
Senior Research and Commercial Manager
OTR-Group
www.otr-group.com

All depends of the language that you choose, but remember that mobile devices have some limitations.
Here are some lists of the Windows Mobile limitations: DevBuzz - Windows Mobile Limitations

Cheers for the reply, yeah, I guess language is most important - Java seems the most cross platform - not sure if the iPhone can handle that though.

For iPhone the better choice is Objective-C(CocoaTouch Framework), but you will need to have a Mac if you want to develop for it. This was because I didn't buy a iPhone to start developing for it, I don't have a Mac
For Windows Mobile I suggest you to use C#(.Net 3.5) with Visual Studio 2008 Professional. It's the most featured environment for WM development, or you can try CeGCC.
For Android the best choice will be Java with a very good knowledge of XML. A good link to start is How-To Develop Android Applications
And for Symbian, the best choice will be C++, also take a look at Getting started with Symbian development
Now you choose

You can use C++ on iPhone, WinMobile, Android and Symbian using Airplay SDK - the same compiled app will run on all of them too.
This is a magic bullet for cross platform dev, enjoy!

"For Android the best choice will be Java"
think you get more kernal power in their c++ tdk then java

How to develop an App for multiple mobile-OSys?

Hey there folks,
after reading these forums for quite a while and having several smartphones during the last years, I reached the point where I want to start creating my own apps. I tried to google around a bit and found some interesting tutorials on how to start creating apps. I also found several SDKs for different operating systems. But exactly that is the point leading to my question.
Before starting to code: is it possible to choose a platform from where my app can be delivered to each winmo, iphone, blackberry or android?
Or is that just plain impossible? I mean, those are all touch based devices Should'nt be that much of a difference? Originally I wanted to start developing an iphone app, but that would leave out all the android users and so on. I don't want to rewirte everything from scratch for an android device after having finished the iphone variant. And that did not even consider the advent of windows 7.
So, is there any way of coding for all the operating systems, keeping the effort of switching between operating systems low?
greetings and thanks in advance for your help,
your unexperienced coder-in-spe,
joker

While all four of the devices mentioned all use ARM processors of various flavours to do the work, they are four completely different operating systems, each with their own IDE and programming models.
Even considering Windows Mobile, you have to decide whether you are programming for a SmartPhone/Classic or a Pocket PC/Professional device. In this case it is possible to write code that will run on both WM platforms, but you will have to make that decision at design time, before you even think of writing a single line of code. Your application will then have to act accordingly, depending on the machine on which it runs.

java apps for symbian often works ok on wm using a midlet manager
not sure about android and blackbarry but being java not too much code would be required to port it I suppose
mind you java on wm work pretty poorly
and iphone got rules that you can only make apps using objective-C/c/c++ and their SDK
which is only available if you own a mac computer

Thank you for your answers. Looks like starting to code is not that simple as expected. So I will try developing for iPhone only :/

[Q] What kind of programmer do I need for Android?

I am in the process of starting a small firm to create Android applications. Not being a programmer myself, I have no idea what kind of engineer we need to create vacancies for.
So, what are the languages necessary to program for Android?

ftgg99 said:
So, what are the languages necessary to program for Android?
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I've read that for apps, you need to learn Java, and for Kernels learn C.
Sent from my T-Mobile myTouch 3G Slide using XDA App

As a business owner here is something that might interest you as you will be able to develop cross platform - DragonRad.
Getting ready to try it myself. Best of luck with your search and your new firm ftgg99.
Video 1
Video 2
Video 3
Only drawback I can see is Windoze based only as far as building...use of app is cross platform

Thank you, looks very interesting!

DragonRAD is for building data-driven apps. If you're looking to mobilize your existing back-office data, then DragonRAD is for you. But if you're looking to build games, or 'consumer-type' applications, it may not be. Hope that helps!

Android applications are mainly coded in Java but i believe can also be coded in C++
Although, if you're going to be developing cross platform (iphone, symbian, etc.) you'll need people who can code in a range of different languages.