Database Info

Petition - google, leave cyanogen alone

i am sure you have all read the news.... google sending cyanogen a cease and desist order
http://androidandme.com/2009/09/hacks/cyanogenmod-in-trouble/
please cast ur vote in this thread as a petition
for anyone who doesnt quite get it, google is threatening the future of custom ROM development...not just cyanogens ROMs
you wanna keep using ur favorite custom ROM? let google know they cant push these guys around
although they cant stop us making roms, they want us to stop including google propriatory apps

Where's the 3rd option for wait and see? Google has every right to do this however that doesn't make it any less ****ty.

a bit late now, cant edit polls i dont think....
anyway, kinda takes away from the impact

I don't think they can do anything about it, they don't know where he lives.

Wow thats great. Cyanogen and devs like him are what are keeping android relevant. Shut down the devs and I for one will go back to winmo.

Won't this affect all devs?
Won't this affect all roms?
If this scenario plays out, we will have a mess on our hands.
Why did the even bother to issue and distribute developer phones?
Maybe I just don't understand.

Maemo 5 is looking better and better. Thanks a lot Google.

This is ridiculous! D:

Google......the new Apple!!

cyanogen has gave everyone something lets show some support

My Google Experience
Sucked!!!!! Not long ago Google and Tmobile sold me a piece of S#!T, that was slow only hold about 20 good apps. I was ready to throw it out the window under a moving bus!!!!! Cyanogen is the only person that made to keep this phone, but if no more usable ROMS, that Nokia N900 is looking real nice about now,or even the palm pre, i guess its time to start saving $ again

wow wtf man. cyan and every other dev really did make android way better then what thery have right now. having root on your android makes using it so much easier. and! all the devs made htc and googles dev's work way better. i think there just jelous becuase they didnt push it earlier. also why didnt they stop haykuro when he was working on 1.5, damn man. lol cyan should make another sn and release it under there and says with help from cyanogen.
open source my a$$.

cyanogen made me rethink the possibilities on my G1, if google follows through with this... dare i say it... ugh I WILL GO TO AN I PHONE.. barrrfffffffff
but i will cause seriously Cyanogen is a genius, they need to hire him to train their own dev's cause their **** aint got nuthin on cyanogen's roms

Didn't google promise us open source well this goes against it in every way
If it is such a big issues than offer those closed source apps on the market and cyan can pull them out of his roms. Problem solved
If google proceeds in this direction, then i forsee android tanking
Every one here is either using something from cyan or has at some point

Wow what a douche move google. The only thing that will end here is probably the busy android dev section. There will always be developing going on forums that allow illegal activity.
We will always have hacked roms . We will just have to move to a new forum unless xda changes there ways.
Anyways looks like some one is jealous of cyans killer skills

They have absolutely no right to do this. Every bit (no pun intended) of the computing world should be open source. Anyone whom feels otherwise is part of the problem and an enemy to knowledge and free thought. An individual whom takes part in the suppression of knowledge is guilty of the highest crimes of humanity, and should be punished justly.

bluecluenj said:
Wow thats great. Cyanogen and devs like him are what are keeping android relevant. Shut down the devs and I for one will go back to winmo.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Yeah if Google follows through I'm getting the TouchPro 2 and forget about Android. G1 and Android is nothing without custom roms to me.

im amazed we had a vote for "no"
any member of these forums must realize the bigger picture with this....
about 30,000 installs of the CM-Updater cant be lying.....people love and NEED these roms....

While they do have the "right" to do this, it will not benefit them...
If it is the closed source bits that are the issue, then they are essentially saying it's ok to release a rom with every google app removed (no gmail, no maps, no youtube, etc.)
Do they not want their customers to use their services? Do they want me to use a yahoo email account? Do they want me to use mapquest? I fail to see how that would be to their benefit.
If they don't like him releasing these roms then they should do better themselves so devs wouldn't have to release them! Step it up google. I dare you to outdo Cyanogen. I double dog dare you!

Some Devs need to make open-source replacement apps for the one's Google's making a stink about... then Cyan won't have any problems.

[PLEA] I'm so confused about all the similar ROMs now!

I've been a regular reader of these forums since researching my first Android purchase. Over this time I have seem many new ROM projects born. I would like to argue that many of these projects are so similar that they are pointless.
I'm calling out anyone whoever made a new Hero/HTC-Sense ROM. Seriously. When you saw the 10 other Hero guys out there, what made you think it was better to release your own flavour instead trying to participate in an existing project?
I've taken a look, and as far as I can tell, there should only be 3 non-factory ROM projects:
- CyanogenMod, because of the effort Steve goes to stay 100% legal and teeter on the bleeding edge of Google's source code
- 1 Hero/Sense UI ROM, because we actually only need 1, why don't you guys work together, sheesh
- 1 Blur rip-off ROM, because goodness knows there are going to be people who actually think it's a great idea
Just because Android is based on Linux, doesn't mean we have to make all the same mistakes that has dogged and doomed Linux from the beginning. We don't need to splinter into a billion different distributions, at least not yet. Looking at the feature lists for many of these similar ROMs, the only thing that is different is additional locales or small bug fixes, hardly worth the effort of repackaging. /sigh
*end nerd rage*

i doubt they end. its their project, they build it how they like it and they share it. people do not have to download it. there are many reasons why they release their own, they have more freedom to do what they want. in past rom devs work together then they split up due to differences. working together is all fine and good but this isnt a utopian world haha, people have different opinions on how to move forward with a project.
just because you dont want to download and try different builds dont mean they should stop

jokeyrhyme said:
I've been a regular reader of these forums since researching my first Android purchase. Over this time I have seem many new ROM projects born. I would like to argue that many of these projects are so similar that they are pointless.
I'm calling out anyone whoever made a new Hero/HTC-Sense ROM. Seriously. When you saw the 10 other Hero guys out there, what made you think it was better to release your own flavour instead trying to participate in an existing project?
I've taken a look, and as far as I can tell, there should only be 3 non-factory ROM projects:
- CyanogenMod, because of the effort Steve goes to stay 100% legal and teeter on the bleeding edge of Google's source code
- 1 Hero/Sense UI ROM, because we actually only need 1, why don't you guys work together, sheesh
- 1 Blur rip-off ROM, because goodness knows there are going to be people who actually think it's a great idea
Just because Android is based on Linux, doesn't mean we have to make all the same mistakes that has dogged and doomed Linux from the beginning. We don't need to splinter into a billion different distributions, at least not yet. Looking at the feature lists for many of these similar ROMs, the only thing that is different is additional locales or small bug fixes, hardly worth the effort of repackaging. /sigh
*end nerd rage*
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I understand how you feel, but isn't that what this site is for? If we only had those three ROM's, then this would be a very boring site. I personally like when people take other ROM's and tweak it to their liking. I don't have a clue on how to cook ROM's, but others do, and they might make one that fits my needs. Just my opinion though....

jokeyrhyme said:
I've been a regular reader of these forums since researching my first Android purchase. Over this time I have seem many new ROM projects born. I would like to argue that many of these projects are so similar that they are pointless.
I'm calling out anyone whoever made a new Hero/HTC-Sense ROM. Seriously. When you saw the 10 other Hero guys out there, what made you think it was better to release your own flavour instead trying to participate in an existing project?
I've taken a look, and as far as I can tell, there should only be 3 non-factory ROM projects:
- CyanogenMod, because of the effort Steve goes to stay 100% legal and teeter on the bleeding edge of Google's source code
- 1 Hero/Sense UI ROM, because we actually only need 1, why don't you guys work together, sheesh
- 1 Blur rip-off ROM, because goodness knows there are going to be people who actually think it's a great idea
Just because Android is based on Linux, doesn't mean we have to make all the same mistakes that has dogged and doomed Linux from the beginning. We don't need to splinter into a billion different distributions, at least not yet. Looking at the feature lists for many of these similar ROMs, the only thing that is different is additional locales or small bug fixes, hardly worth the effort of repackaging. /sigh
*end nerd rage*
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
As a regular reader you should know that there are about 5 different versions of Hero floating around to base off of. There are 2 different versions of blur. There is also pulse, donut, cupcake, and variations on them.
Hero includes: Tattoo (a specialized mix of donut and sense), the sense ui merged with magic, the official release Hero, the non-official beta Hero, and the Sprint Hero. (And if you ever read the threads, we do all work together) There are also multiple opinions on BFS and a2sd, which allows for variations.
Blur has both a Hero and a Cyanogen based version, depending on which way they decided to go to get the supporting files for the main system.
The rest are obvious, and I don't feel like going into that much detail.
If we all followed your beleif, updates would take twice as long and not have nearly as many features. Rather than Drizzy, JustAnotherCrowd, Cyrowski, and myself all waiting for the one day we all have 2 hours to meet on google talk, share files, and build an update... JAC relelases an update, Cyrowski writes a new boot image, I restructure the way a2sd operates, and Drizzy comes along and adds in some new apps he restructured to work on that build. Some people choose to stop somewhere along the path and stick to that ROM, others go all the way down the road. If there were only one update, most Devs would spend half the day just telling people how to disable, remove, or add the feature they integrated.
I just dont see how less is more in this case. If you don't like all the updates, do what I do. I have the ones I actually read followed, and I only ever take a quick glance at the first page of posts before checking those. If I miss anything important, it is only ever by a day. If it's that important, it inevitably gets bumped to the first page long before it becomes so old that I surely learned it somewhere else.
*end informed response*

twistedumbrella said:
*end informed response*
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Hehe.
Okay, I get that there's a matrix of every possible version of Android against every different sort of UI (ie Hero+Donut, Blur+Cupcake, etc). My shortlist is obviously too short. But it's difficult to pick out, for example, the best Hero ROM. And I can see the same thing happening with Blur as it becomes more and more in vogue.
Watching 3 different Hero versions, you might decide that ROM A almost perfectly suits your needs except for the bug that only got fixed in ROM B. And ROM C has both the features and the bug fix, but has an ugly custom UI somewhere. So then you think to yourself "why don't I just make package D?". The only way you'll know anything for sure is to spend time trying out however many different ROMs knowing very well that there's a chance you'll be forced to compromise. The only differences between many of these ROMs seems to be the Android version, pre-installed applications and custom kernels.
I know I came off fairly irate and impetuous in my original post. But when you can see all these talented developers producing so many different forks and reproducing so much effort, it can be very frustrating for an enthusiastic end user.

twistedumbrella said:
As a regular reader you should know that there are about 5 different versions of Hero floating around to base off of. There are 2 different versions of blur. There is also pulse, donut, cupcake, and variations on them.
Hero includes: Tattoo (a specialized mix of donut and sense), the sense ui merged with magic, the official release Hero, the non-official beta Hero, and the Sprint Hero. (And if you ever read the threads, we do all work together) There are also multiple opinions on BFS and a2sd, which allows for variations.
Blur has both a Hero and a Cyanogen based version, depending on which way they decided to go to get the supporting files for the main system.
The rest are obvious, and I don't feel like going into that much detail.
If we all followed your beleif, updates would take twice as long and not have nearly as many features. Rather than Drizzy, JustAnotherCrowd, Cyrowski, and myself all waiting for the one day we all have 2 hours to meet on google talk, share files, and build an update... JAC relelases an update, Cyrowski writes a new boot image, I restructure the way a2sd operates, and Drizzy comes along and adds in some new apps he restructured to work on that build. Some people choose to stop somewhere along the path and stick to that ROM, others go all the way down the road. If there were only one update, most Devs would spend half the day just telling people how to disable, remove, or add the feature they integrated.
I just dont see how less is more in this case. If you don't like all the updates, do what I do. I have the ones I actually read followed, and I only ever take a quick glance at the first page of posts before checking those. If I miss anything important, it is only ever by a day. If it's that important, it inevitably gets bumped to the first page long before it becomes so old that I surely learned it somewhere else.
*end informed response*
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
twisted your roms are always the most polished and daily functionable
i appreciate your input on these forums as well as drizzys and jac's
im glad there are multiple possibilities so i can see which one runs the best for my intended uses
party a may use their phone for internet texting and facebook
when party b may use their phone for calls email and business
party A is using XXXHerorom that runs his needed functions the quickest and most efficient way possible
party b is using XXXherorom that runs his needed functions the quickest and most efficient way possible

jokeyrhyme said:
I've been a regular reader of these forums since researching my first Android purchase. Over this time I have seem many new ROM projects born. I would like to argue that many of these projects are so similar that they are pointless.
I'm calling out anyone whoever made a new Hero/HTC-Sense ROM. Seriously. When you saw the 10 other Hero guys out there, what made you think it was better to release your own flavour instead trying to participate in an existing project?
I've taken a look, and as far as I can tell, there should only be 3 non-factory ROM projects:
- CyanogenMod, because of the effort Steve goes to stay 100% legal and teeter on the bleeding edge of Google's source code
- 1 Hero/Sense UI ROM, because we actually only need 1, why don't you guys work together, sheesh
- 1 Blur rip-off ROM, because goodness knows there are going to be people who actually think it's a great idea
Just because Android is based on Linux, doesn't mean we have to make all the same mistakes that has dogged and doomed Linux from the beginning. We don't need to splinter into a billion different distributions, at least not yet. Looking at the feature lists for many of these similar ROMs, the only thing that is different is additional locales or small bug fixes, hardly worth the effort of repackaging. /sigh
*end nerd rage*
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I don't agree and don't understand your frustration. You use what you want to use, let other people make their own decisions.
I happen to prefer Enomther's roms because they are more customizable in terms of what is included on the rom through the expansion pack and expension pack setup. I don't like arbitrary modifications as I prefer to have my phone close to vanilla Android but have performance improvements added. But going by your opinion it should not exist. Who are you to determine which rom's are pointless? I really don't understand the fuss. Different people have different preferences. If you prefer limited/no choice get an iPhone.

Unfortunately each Rom runs differently on each phone. My friend has the blurry screen problem while I dont. He can only run a few selected roms some of which doesn't do what he wants to do. I have gone though about 30 different roms before settling on one and quite frankly I think its pretty fun. I am on the bleeding edge of. techology.
I wish I would make a Rom. I have so many ideas for one.

The concern about multiple builds makes sense, but other folks have mentioned that different builds fix different things.
I've tried many of the Hero flavors, but sadly (unless I simply missed it) none of them have fully gotten bluetooth to work. I prefer using bluetooth for calling, and so far only Cyanogenmod's roms seemed to be able to nail this on the head. It's what I've been using for quite some time, and has proven to be the quickest and most stable.
It would be great if they all worked on just one version of the Hero rom, but it won't happen. Just imagine how many more are going to pop up when the official SenseUI shows up for the Saphire.
Eh

I completely disagree with the OP. Everyones needs are different and having a build thats just right for you is a luxury that you wouldn't get on most other types of phones. I really don't see an issue with having multiple builds even if they are fairly similar. Its not like we are wasting development time, there is no downside. Some may argue it makes it harder for users to find a good rom, but the bottom line is anyone who is flashing their android phone has an interest in technology and is going to enjoy trying out different builds. And once you've tried a few builds you get a pretty good idea of what your looking for in your ideal build making it much easier to choose. Using your Linux example, between work and home I use 3 different distributions everyday, the reason being each has strengths that make it ideal for specific applications, its not a problem or a mistake, its simply not everyones needs are the same.

Even for the novice like me it is not too hard to make sense out of what is available. I never liked when people do not read full thread before posting a question. Is it a problem of impatient generation or just a simple laziness? IDK.
Also, it has been a exiting jorney for me to learn everything about my phone and tremendous possibilities. Fear of bricking and yet the desire to try new stuff.
There are useful bits and pieces in almost every thread except yours, sorry to say that. There is nothing that can replace user's feedback and their own disoveries that are not necessarily coming from devs or people remotely in the field of android development.

Cease the proliferation of similar ROMs!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I also disagree with this thread. More choice is better for everyone!
Also if there are 2 similar roms, as a user rather than a dev you can still take the bits you like from both and make it your own.

jokeyrhyme really? have you made any roms or customized anything for your personal use? if so did you like it? if not, how come you didnt make one custom rom? is it because you dont know how or just rely on others to do it for you? there are soooooo many ppl with different "styles, perceptions and ideals" that one extra rom might be their next rom of choice!! whats wrong with a larger amount of variety? who gives you the right to try and call everyone out when they are the ones spending the time to learn, make and fix all the bugs for everyone when it started off for them selves?!?!? this thread is a joke and is taking up space in development. request for it to be moved to the trash or general. which ever is easiest.

WTF?
Ok at this point i'm kinda getting sick of this whole android forum. Way to much fighting, ignorance, complaints like damn who gives a **** (sorry just vex) who does what or doesnt do what or makes what or doesnt make what. If you dont like something...move onto the next. I mean those who alert the devs/cookers (whatever you choose to call them ) to issues with the rom only for the betterment of the rom are in the right. But when i see dumb **** like "this person's rom does this and that" i get pissed..just reflash that rom sit down shut up and think about that little life of yours that obviously is worthless since you can spend time downing people's work and yet you can make a rom or troubleshoot a rom on your own. Y'all need to relax yourselves find **** that works for you and stick wit hit. If it aint what you want..move on silently. dont fault the creator just move the hell on. Dont post dumb threads like this and most off DONT SAY ****!!! it's these very same forums dedicated to development of our devices that make our devices that much more amazing so dont flood the forum with dumb ****!!!. Show respect to our developers, give em props for taking time out of their lives to make our android experience benificial and super amazing.

I also disagree with OP's sentiment. I'd rather there be as many ROMs as possible than to have my choice restricted to a handful.
And daeshawn you're right, some people are so rude and unappreciative. I just ignore the douchebags and try to contribute as positively as I can.

I completely understand what you're saying. These forums can be really overwhelming at first. But honestly, I enjoy switching between different builds of Android just to see what they're like. Some people want APPS2SD, some don't. Some people want to split FAT32/EXT3/Swap, some don't. There are simply too many combinations for a small set of ROMs to handle.

sigh..... guess well never find the middle of the tootie pop

If a middle ground were to exist it could go something like this:
Everyone can do whatever they want as far as their ROMs go. Perhaps, for new people who might otherwise be overwhelmed with choices, the Q&A (if it doesn't already) could link to a few long-running, stable ROMs that typically accomplish the very basics. And once people get a chance to try those, figuring out what you want becomes a little simpler and the tons of threads start making some coherent sense.
It's like "which is better, Cyanogen's rendition or Enom's" and the answer, for a lot of people, is that it depends. There might be similarities and both ROMs ultimately accomplish a lot of the same things (root, A2SD, compcache, linux swap, etc.) but preferences remain. I like one, you like another. There's no reason both developers, each of whom presumably likes their own, can't go on making what they want to make and offering it out there. More over, the experienced users are already aware of the alternatives.
It's really newbies that might find the choices overwhelming.
As for reinventing the wheel with every ROM, many threads already provide credit to a variety of developers, so clearly the work gets around. Just because they all do it at their own leisure and in the order of their choosing doesn't mean the developers are living in closed bubbles. Maybe the colab work that needs to be done is already being done even if it's not obvious. More over, even if two ROM cookers decide to both implement similar changes apart from each other, the choice to do so is totally in their court. Their time and their money and their brains.
There is kind of, for me, a question of stability. I have a fair confidence, for example, that Cyanogen is not going to drop Android development entirely any time soon and his ROMs will continue to exist with updates and bug fixes. Other developers share this sense of stability, but it's not an all around type of thing. There are ROMs out there now that are interesting because they are cool and new, but will they still be maintained a year from now is another question entirely. And I think that's a legitimate concern and reason for wanting at least a few long-lasting ROMs. Because, essentially, if 5 devs work on something and one gets bored, there's still 4 left. Conversely, if there's only one dev and he/she decides they're done, now what?
Just my $.02

I've no issue with the number of roms.
however, what is missing is a simple resource that lists them and a summary of features.
trying to wade through all the post to see what does what is a total ball ache. I think this is more the problem than the number of roms.
An up to date one pager that showed the current status of what was available would be perfect.

Well, I totally deserve all the hate this thread has brought my way.
*bows head in shame*
I agree that if there was ever a place to test out dozens of difference features, then this is that place. So it's totally appropriate to have as many different ROMs as there are demands for different features and such.
I do think more could be done to draw new users towards stable and long-term projects, as has been suggested by sleepykit and moa77. Maybe that's really the solution I was after. An update to the listing or something perhaps?
Sorry about being a poohead, I'll be good now.
*hugs all round*
PS. I changed the topic title to be less evil and more open.

[IDEA] - Developer should unite their ROMs

Hi,
I see that we have many many roms and 2 types of Sapphire (32B and 32A)
Now I have an idea to help users to install and change rom easierly.
Please read all idea before replying. Some ideas relate to others.​
1. All developer should make 2 choices : 32A rom or 32B rom
2. 32B rom have data/app_s. Running system application on flash memory is more stable and faster than running on ext partition sdcard
3. Recovery should have new feature : Wipe data except data/app_s
Amon_RA should add this feature in his recovery.
4. Developers should remove his own theme, 3rd application (which can download from market), moded application ... from rom, rom will be more stable and smaller
5. If developer want share his theme or moded application or add new feature, he should share extend update in an update_extend.zip on his topic. I suggest him to use 1 folder on sdcard and command *.sh file
If you used iPhone, you will see that moded FW of iPhone OS doesn't include theme, extend application (which can download from Appstore). Why can't we do that? I think almost people just want to find a stable rom without theme, without extend application

Some good ideas
+1 from me
Moar standardization pleez

Sounds like the OP is ill-informed, and wants an iPhone.

funbacon said:
4. Developers should remove his own theme, 3rd application (which can download from market), moded application ... from rom, rom will be more stable and smaller
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
i've seen a few of these in the dream forum.
the developer releases the rom as a base package. ie. rom only, no (or very few customisations).
then add on packs are released to add 3rd party apps and customisations.
eg. http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=538456
this developer has released 4 different roms. each one comes as a base rom that is rooted, and each rom also then has an expansion pack.
themes are then installed as separate downloads.
the post is also very clearly laid out. i wish more developers took the time to create such understandable threads.

Isn't this request cramping developer's style?
Yes that is what you may want. But at the end of the day, they are doing it out of their enjoyment. It's their project and they have free reign on what they do and when they do it. Out of shear good will developers share. Its not up to us to make requests on how things should be. Our roles is to be supportive and grateful for their contributions.
That's not to say your ideas aren't valid... perhaps just not entirely feasible.

ice_prophecy said:
Isn't this request cramping developer's style?
Yes that is what you may want. But at the end of the day, they are doing it out of their enjoyment. It's their project and they have free reign on what they do and when they do it. Out of shear good will developers share. Its not up to us to make requests on how things should be. Our roles is to be supportive and grateful for their contributions.
That's not to say your ideas aren't valid... perhaps just not entirely feasible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Good Say My friend

seems like a pretty simple request. but what was said earlier has merit as well, since it is really the developer's choice since its done for free.
but yeah, some sort of options like Enthomer is nice. But then again those updates made by AmonRa and Cyanogen is awesome as well. Fast, stable and useful.
Oh, and I strongly support the part on the way the threads are made. some are really easy to follow up on for change logs and stuff, some are messy.

funbacon said:
If you used iPhone, you will see that moded FW of iPhone OS doesn't include theme, extend application (which can download from Appstore). Why can't we do that? I think almost people just want to find a stable rom without theme, without extend application[/B]
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Search the board (and the Android Market) for MetaMorph which does exactly that.

+1
well, although 'm not a dev, but as users this idea is pretty workable. at least we had lesser unneccesary thread and will look more neat and tidy. thats what make xda more professional and classy. way to go devs. +1 to the idea.
thanks.

OP, good idea, but not everyone may think like you, including the DEVs. There is nothing wrong with what you are stating, but it has been mentioned before that different DEVs want to work on different things; some people want to be unique.
One more thing, can you please not use the word should so much, please?
My wife uses it all the time..."you should clean this" " you should go here" " you should say this". thanks.

ice_prophecy said:
Isn't this request cramping developer's style?
Yes that is what you may want. But at the end of the day, they are doing it out of their enjoyment. It's their project and they have free reign on what they do and when they do it. Out of shear good will developers share. Its not up to us to make requests on how things should be. Our roles is to be supportive and grateful for their contributions.
That's not to say your ideas aren't valid... perhaps just not entirely feasible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed. Although some of the requests are somewhat reasonable, it's up to the devs to decide what they want to do with their free time and they are dedicating so much of it to making such great contributions to begin with.

We're not paying for the dev's services, so i dont think we have much pull on how they design their ROMS (nor should we)
I think if you want a specific ROM a specific way. YOU should be learning how to code and cook ROMS for yourself.

OzJD said:
Sounds like the OP is ill-informed, and wants an iPhone.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Read and lol'd. This is probably pretty close to the truth.

Well I for one salute the OP for finally taking a stand and telling the devs what we really want. After all it is all about ME and what I want and they should bloody well be grateful that I even bother to tell them what is wrong with their work, and they should fix it faster. I am a busy guy and can't be bothered to figure out this stuff for myself....
If any of that even vaguely resonates with you... here is a very small clue, completely free of charge...
The devs do this work for their own reasons. Some do it for the challenge, some do it for fun, some do it because they want something different, some do it for the glory. However, they all share it and make the results of their hard work available for the benefit of us end user types. Many even provide free support and hand holding, answering the same questions over and over.
You can politely ask for things to change. If you structure your request well enough and it makes sense, some devs may see the benefit and change. Others will not. Trying to dictate standards of documentation, presentation, features, or packaging just is not going to work, and quite frankly why should it. They are not doing it for you, you are just benefiting as a side effect of them being willing to release their work.
I am sure if you were willing to pay regular software developer rates for a particular feature set, you could find folks willing to accommodate you. Unless you are willing to do that, consider that you already get far more than you pay for.

rydr1 said:
OP, good idea, but not everyone may think like you, including the DEVs. There is nothing wrong with what you are stating, but it has been mentioned before that different DEVs want to work on different things; some people want to be unique.
One more thing, can you please not use the word should so much, please?
My wife uses it all the time..."you should clean this" " you should go here" " you should say this". thanks.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I'm Vietnamese and my English is not good. I just know saying " you should do something" is better than saying "you have to do something" or "you must to do something"

ice_prophecy said:
Isn't this request cramping developer's style?
Yes that is what you may want. But at the end of the day, they are doing it out of their enjoyment. It's their project and they have free reign on what they do and when they do it. Out of shear good will developers share. Its not up to us to make requests on how things should be. Our roles is to be supportive and grateful for their contributions.
That's not to say your ideas aren't valid... perhaps just not entirely feasible.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So I guess we should also stop giving developers suggestions and bug reports, because who wants to fix bugs for enjoyment? I disagree quite a lot with your post; it is in fact our role to make requests. How are ROMs supposed to get better without the input of its users? You completely contradict yourself by saying that we should not "make requests" but we should "be supportive," because by making requests, you are being supportive. By trying to better the project, you are being far more supportive than a silent user.
It's not like funbacon's suggestion has malicious intent. Neither is he trying to dictate what devs should and should not do. You don't have to agree with all of his points, but dismissing the whole thing because of one point, or the fact that he referenced the iPhone, is stupid. It's a suggestion, which most of you have said is a good idea, yet don't think it should be incorporated because... of the vocabulary used? Or maybe it's some other reason, but I have yet to see another valid reason.
Will this work in practice? That's another discussion. But I believe having some standards and general guidelines will be immensely helpful and make it simpler to try different ROMs.
Rydr1, you need counseling. Or a divorce.

bjtheone said:
Well I for one salute the OP for finally taking a stand and telling the devs what we really want. After all it is all about ME and what I want and they should bloody well be grateful that I even bother to tell them what is wrong with their work, and they should fix it faster. I am a busy guy and can't be bothered to figure out this stuff for myself....
If any of that even vaguely resonates with you... here is a very small clue, completely free of charge...
The devs do this work for their own reasons. Some do it for the challenge, some do it for fun, some do it because they want something different, some do it for the glory. However, they all share it and make the results of their hard work available for the benefit of us end user types. Many even provide free support and hand holding, answering the same questions over and over.
You can politely ask for things to change. If you structure your request well enough and it makes sense, some devs may see the benefit and change. Others will not. Trying to dictate standards of documentation, presentation, features, or packaging just is not going to work, and quite frankly why should it. They are not doing it for you, you are just benefiting as a side effect of them being willing to release their work.
I am sure if you were willing to pay regular software developer rates for a particular feature set, you could find folks willing to accommodate you. Unless you are willing to do that, consider that you already get far more than you pay for.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
So... all the developers here make ROMs for themselves, but are nice enough to post it for everyone else to use?
Wow, haha. What a distorted view you have there. (Most?) developers aren't as selfish as you think they are. Developers make ROMs so the people who visit this forum can benefit from them, or at least that's the general reason. Why do you think they release updates often to fix bugs or add new functionality, or address issues and suggestions brought up by users?
Or, if I were to look at it from your point of view: users are just tools that devs use to make their ROM better.
Yeah, no. You shouldn't think so lowly of devs here. They should be appreciated, you know.

1.I will say that i've had android since day 1 and funbacon was around at that time to. helping and making changes himself to certain roms and apks etc...and helped other people, so he shouldnt be treated as a noob that doesnt know what he is talking about or that he is whining because that is not the case.
2. He made a suggestion that has to do with development and posted in the correct spot and he still hears **** from it? when there are people posting in deveoplment forums that has nothing to do it " what rom is the best, or what phone should i buy" and they dont get as much **** as your handing to someone that made a DEVELOPMENT suggestion and a good one. in the correct section. so people shouldnt be downing him for his work/suggestions
p.s funbacon...nice to see you around again

funbacon said:
I'm Vietnamese and my English is not good. I just know saying " you should do something" is better than saying "you have to do something" or "you must to do something"
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
No, funbacon, you took it wrong. Im just kidding about using that word. there is nothing wrong with you using it, there is something wrong with my wife using it.
I was just adding a little fun to the thread.

(Calling The Whole Community) - Creation of The Ultimate Rom - (The Community Rom)

Hey Plz read this a creation of a community rom you should be thinking what well:
I am thinking of the creation of the rom called "The Ultimate Rom" for G1/MT3G and hope it also moves onto newer phones as you can see the G1/MT3G is starting to fade as the newer phones begin to be born and because of this I believe we should make a community rom where not only the devs can join in but the community weather it be graphics to sounds I believe we all should be able to join in so I would like to get some help on making it come true I believe there should be a rom we as the community should be happy for that we all chipped in and made something truly amazing ^^
PS: And mods plz don't delete this for being in the Dev section I believe it is about Devs and I would like you to be part of this rom as well ^^
Hoping to start 4th of july so getting everyone ready to put stuff in or ready for it to start ^^
0o ill list down every single person no matter how big this gets up till july 4th and after july 4th and even testing is fine ^^
If it works or not at least we would had tried and at least even if we do fail we have gained knowledge, experience and had fun
A POLL WILL BE MADE TOMORROW SO THE COMMUNITY CAN CHOOSE WHAT THEY WANT ^^ AND ANY OTHER NEW ADDED STUFF THERE WILL BE A LIST TO ADD TO ^^

/sigh
10 char

xillius200 said:
Hey Plz read this a creation of a community rom you should be thinking what well:
I am thinking of the creation of the rom called "The Ultimate Rom" for G1/MT3G and hope it also moves onto newer phones as you can see the G1/MT3G is starting to fade as the newer phones begin to be born and because of this I believe we should make a community rom where not only the devs can join in but the community weather it be graphics to sounds I believe we all should be able to join in so I would like to get some help on making it come true I believe there should be a rom we as the community should be happy for that we all chipped in and made something truly amazing ^^
PS: And mods plz don't delete this for being in the Dev section I believe it is about Devs and I would like you to be part of this rom as well ^^
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
OMG #FAIL haha j/k LOL, count me in of course

kingklick said:
/sigh
10 char
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
lol dude don't be a jerk i've had my fame with speedteam and zachattacks and xillius rom lol I think the community should get there chance ^^ and we need it while we can won't be long till g1/mt3g is gone we should make something to rememberer

xillius200 said:
lol dude don't be a jerk i've had my fame with speedteam and zachattacks and xillius rom lol I think the community should get there chance ^^ and we need it while we can won't be long till g1/mt3g is gone we should make something to rememberer
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It's funny how he always comes back to G1/Mytouch Forums Update his roms with already released things, renames them and then asks for money for a mytouch slide... He is using the community to get him new phones... Anyway back on subject
Got like 4 people now 5 almost

XxKOLOHExX said:
It's funny how he always comes back to G1/Mytouch Forums Update his roms with already released things, renames them and then asks for money for a mytouch slide... He is using the community to get him new phones... Anyway back on subject
Got like 4 people now 5 almost
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yep lol hopefully as much as possible ^^

XxKOLOHExX said:
It's funny how he always comes back to G1/Mytouch Forums Update his roms with already released things, renames them and then asks for money for a mytouch slide... He is using the community to get him new phones...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
(giggles)
.

I can't help..but I'll test anything that pops off

Please. We've been down this road before. When the glory and satisfaction of solo or small team ROMs isn't in play, development suffers. We need creative individuals pushing the limits to advance the scene, and unless they have their name on the ROM, things will slow down. This goes for life (free enterprise vs. socialism) and ROM dev.
Also, keep in mind, all the ROMs are community! There are thousands of man-hours of work already in every aspect of Android. The ROMs we see build on all that. This is a solution in search of a problem.

ytj87 said:
Please. We've been down this road before. When the glory and satisfaction of solo or small team ROMs isn't in play, development suffers. We need creative individuals pushing the limits to advance the scene, and unless they have their name on the ROM, things will slow down. This goes for life (free enterprise vs. socialism) and ROM dev.
Also, keep in mind, all the ROMs are community! There are thousands of man-hours of work already in every aspect of Android. The ROMs we see build on all that. This is a solution in search of a problem.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
lol I have created over 7 successful roms some in a small team others in a big team lol and it worked out xD and I would disagree check I left a bit ago about a month if that lol and no everyone should get a chance not just one person thats just selfish also I think if one big rom is made we can keep some G1/MT3G users for longer lol we need something new and exciting can't you see that ^^ well whatever you say I will try and continue this IDK if it will work or not THE THING IS EVERYONE WOULD HAVE FUN TRYING ^^

If you are serious about this, I think it's a dumb idea. The best thing about having a rooted Android phone is that you can choose whatever ROM suits you.
Personally, I want a fast Donut ROM. I don't care for all the extra bells and whistles in SuperD/CM4/etc and I don't have any interest in running an Eclair ROM as I don't think they perform well enough on our phones. Given the popularity of OpenEclair/SuperE/CM5, there are obviously other people who feel differently and I expect a vast number of people here wouldn't switch back to Donut if you paid them.
There will never be "The Ultimate ROM" because everyone's needs and wants are different. Just let devs make what they will and let users choose what they want.

i have very little experience in the overall creation of the rom, however i am very willing to learn more and would jump at the opportunity to be of any help, if someone was willing to show me a little bit of how this all works i am positive i can be of great help.

To me I could care less about credit.... I rather help where I can then be selfish... Knowledge isn't a competition, it is a struggle as a group I would love to learn what I don't and Help others where I can Ego is the one thing that could destroy this project ...

SpeedTeam is there whenever you need us....Right K =)

Super Jamie said:
If you are serious about this, I think it's a dumb idea. The best thing about having a rooted Android phone is that you can choose whatever ROM suits you.
Personally, I want a fast Donut ROM. I don't care for all the extra bells and whistles in SuperD/CM4/etc and I don't have any interest in running an Eclair ROM as I don't think they perform well enough on our phones. Given the popularity of OpenEclair/SuperE/CM5, there are obviously other people who feel differently and I expect a vast number of people here wouldn't switch back to Donut if you paid them.
There will never be "The Ultimate ROM" because everyone's needs and wants are different. Just let devs make what they will and let users choose what they want.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
with code much is possible you can change your rom by the tick of a button or tap of a button wysie has shown us this and cyan making a rom possible to suite most of course not all people by some options and extra features of choice can be done ^^

christiansantana51 said:
SpeedTeam is there whenever you need us....Right K =)
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Agreed LMFAO but isn't he in SpeedTeam lmfao **SPEEDTEAM FORCES ACTIVATE!*** LMFAO!

XxKOLOHExX said:
To me I could care less about credit.... I rather help where I can then be selfish... Knowledge isn't a competition, it is a struggle as a group I would love to learn what I don't and Help others where I can Ego is the one thing that could destroy this project ...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
and what K said is exactly right also android was opensource as a group project so are you saying that because android was a group project it was a fail I think not

xillius200 said:
Hey Plz read this a creation of a community rom you should be thinking what well:
I am thinking of the creation of the rom called "The Ultimate Rom" for G1/MT3G and hope it also moves onto newer phones as you can see the G1/MT3G is starting to fade as the newer phones begin to be born and because of this I believe we should make a community rom where not only the devs can join in but the community weather it be graphics to sounds I believe we all should be able to join in so I would like to get some help on making it come true I believe there should be a rom we as the community should be happy for that we all chipped in and made something truly amazing ^^
PS: And mods plz don't delete this for being in the Dev section I believe it is about Devs and I would like you to be part of this rom as well ^^
Hoping to start 4th of july so getting everyone ready to put stuff in or ready for it to start ^^
0o ill list down every single person no matter how big this gets up till july 4th and after july 4th and even testing is fine ^^
If it works or not at least we would had tried and at least even if we do fail we have gained knowledge, experience and had fun
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I swear, when I read this, it sounded like you died from lack of oxygen at the end. Please, for the sake of readers, could you use punctuation? Throw a few commas and periods in there.
As for the idea, I would flash a beta version or two, but I can't see this working out as well as some might hope. There will always be disagreements. Some people want 2.1, others, 1.6. Some like SenseUI, and others don't. Words like "perfect" and "ultimate" are very subjective to whoever reads them.
Good idea, probably very hard to execute. Good luck.

NViouz said:
I swear, when I read this, it sounded like you died from lack of oxygen at the end. Please, for the sake of readers, could you use punctuation? Throw a few commas and periods in there.
As for the idea, I would flash a beta version or two, but I can't see this working out as well as some might hope. There will always be disagreements. Some people want 2.1, others, 1.6. Some like SenseUI, and others don't. Words like "perfect" and "ultimate" are very subjective to whoever reads them.
Good idea, probably very hard to execute. Good luck.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
lol thanks dude ^^ hopefully there must someway to make a script for downgrade and upgrade without losing data etc. I wish it is possible lol well something good may come of this rom ^^

I'd be willing to help out aesthetically.

[ATTN] Devs/Chefs/UberGeniuses

SLOW THE %&*$ DOWN!
Just Kidding... but in all seriousness, the variety of roms for the Cappy is amazing. It all comes down to preference; however, I must say that with all of the updates, and new roms, I'm flashing at least twice a day and sometimes even losing track of what I'm running. (Although I know I'm currently running Andromeda and it is by far the best I've had on my Cappy. Awesome GPS lock in seconds, fast, stable.)
The point is... can we consolidate, or come up with a legit thread/wiki that clarifies the pros, cons, features, and specifications on roms. Reading 20 pages of forum after a new ROM is released is getting tiring.

Theodor911 said:
SLOW THE %&*$ DOWN!
Just Kidding... but in all seriousness, the variety of roms for the Cappy is amazing. It all comes down to preference; however, I must say that with all of the updates, and new roms, I'm flashing at least twice a day and sometimes even losing track of what I'm running. (Although I know I'm currently running Andromeda and it is by far the best I've had on my Cappy. Awesome GPS lock in seconds, fast, stable.)
The point is... can we consolidate, or come up with a legit thread/wiki that clarifies the pros, cons, features, and specifications on roms. Reading 20 pages of forum after a new ROM is released is getting tiring.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Well you shouldnt have posted in the DEV section.... See here
But since you have. Just be glad that we have all of them to chose from. Not long ago it was slow here. And no. That thread idea has never worked.....In all the time i have been here.

smokestack76 said:
Well you shouldnt have posted in the DEV section.... See here
But since you have. Just be glad that we have all of them to chose from. Not long ago it was slow here. And no. That thread idea has never worked.....In all the time i have been here.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I agree, it will never work. XDA is here for a reason. lets just keep doing what were doing. Also, where the hell have you been Smoke?

Theodor911 said:
SLOW THE %&*$ DOWN!
Just Kidding... but in all seriousness, the variety of roms for the Cappy is amazing. It all comes down to preference; however, I must say that with all of the updates, and new roms, I'm flashing at least twice a day and sometimes even losing track of what I'm running. (Although I know I'm currently running Andromeda and it is by far the best I've had on my Cappy. Awesome GPS lock in seconds, fast, stable.)
The point is... can we consolidate, or come up with a legit thread/wiki that clarifies the pros, cons, features, and specifications on roms. Reading 20 pages of forum after a new ROM is released is getting tiring.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
If you look at the feature sets, most of them are the same, just different skins, apps, etc included...
everything is pretty common knowledge since we are all running the same mods... additional apps, skins, etc are just fluff, which is why I personally don't include that kinda stuff. I will leave that to the theme and app section and the person running the rom to make it look how they want.
as far as all of us working together, I respond to all the devs who ask for help, I have joined up and help the team efforts, as well as individuals putting roms out that have asked how to do various things.
Putting it all into a wiki? No thanks, that stuff changes to much to want to deal with updating a wiki with 20 different variations on how to do a smali edit for X feature.
If you take donations, in a community based team, this always becomes a stress point, best not to take donations at that point. I won't accept a cut of team donations, someone will ***** about it if they get less or more, not worth it. (just noticed adam sent me a donation, KNOCK THAT OFF! lol)
As far as you not liking to flash a lot, get help, you are a flash addict
I wont be slowing down anytime soon, get used to it
/random thoughts

designgears said:
If you look at the feature sets, most of them are the same, just different skins, apps, etc included...
everything is pretty common knowledge since we are all running the same mods... additional apps, skins, etc are just fluff, which is why I personally don't include that kinda stuff. I will leave that to the theme and app section and the person running the rom to make it look how they want.
as far as all of us working together, I respond to all the devs who ask for help, I have joined up and help the team efforts, as well as individuals putting roms out that have asked how to do various things.
Putting it all into a wiki? No thanks, that stuff changes to much to want to deal with updating a wiki with 20 different variations on how to do a smali edit for X feature.
If you take donations, in a community based team, this always becomes a stress point, best not to take donations at that point. I won't accept a cut of team donations, someone will ***** about it if they get less or more, not worth it. (just noticed adam sent me a donation, KNOCK THAT OFF! lol)
As far as you not liking to flash a lot, get help, you are a flash addict
I wont be slowing down anytime soon, get used to it
/random thoughts
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I feel the same. So many roms are including everything everyone else is. Just skinning and a few differences. I stick to a select few toms and just go frombthere because there is just too much to keep track of right now.
DG you are an idol of a great developer.
It would be great if more.devastating would get together to lighten the load and make it a little easier on all involved, but then again I am excited to.see so.many great revs making a rom all their own.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I897 using XDA App

I think its just crazy that this thread even got other post
I would have thought it was over with mine. But oh well. I have been in the shadows adam
Im always here. Or kinda.... haha

i think a wiki would be convenient in some ways but more trouble than its worth. I mean who would wanna volunteer to keep up with every single rom, and update it daily?
It might help a lil with noobs trying to learn, but honestly reading through 100s of pages in one thread usually ends up helping you learn more than just the rom itself. When i first registered on this forum all i did was read for the first few months before even making a post

Guess I will jump on the bandwagon before this gets moved to the general section.
There was a point in time not so long ago where there were only about 3 ROMs for the captivate and a lot of drooling over what the other SGS variants had going on.
I for one am very happy to see the Captivate community grow and put out some good stuff. The variety and choices really help enable the end-user to get their phone to look and work how they want, end-user empowerment tends to make people happy.
Taco Bell has maybe a dozen individual ingredients but it's the way they are combined that makes each product special.
As for having to read the threads of each ROM, yea it can be a pain, but it is good for you. You are informed, can make the best choice, and know what to expect from what you are about to put on your phone.

designgears said:
If you look at the feature sets, most of them are the same, just different skins, apps, etc included...
everything is pretty common knowledge since we are all running the same mods... additional apps, skins, etc are just fluff, which is why I personally don't include that kinda stuff. I will leave that to the theme and app section and the person running the rom to make it look how they want.
as far as all of us working together, I respond to all the devs who ask for help, I have joined up and help the team efforts, as well as individuals putting roms out that have asked how to do various things.
Putting it all into a wiki? No thanks, that stuff changes to much to want to deal with updating a wiki with 20 different variations on how to do a smali edit for X feature.
If you take donations, in a community based team, this always becomes a stress point, best not to take donations at that point. I won't accept a cut of team donations, someone will ***** about it if they get less or more, not worth it. (just noticed adam sent me a donation, KNOCK THAT OFF! lol)
As far as you not liking to flash a lot, get help, you are a flash addict
I wont be slowing down anytime soon, get used to it
/random thoughts
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
The note you made about the themes and such is exactly why I love Andromeda. I personally do not like the 2.0 theme, but the fact that there is an unthemed version as well as a themed version makes me the happiest panda in the world, and I think more ROM cookers should adopt this policy.
What I'd love more than anything else though, is a ROM that supports the hardware voice processing of the Captivate, as well as any custom kernels/modems the user wants. That would be the ultimate ROM in my opinion. Oh, and the 4 lockscreen mod is a must as well. I do not like the glass lockscreen

chrisz5z said:
i think a wiki would be convenient in some ways but more trouble than its worth. I mean who would wanna volunteer to keep up with every single rom, and update it daily?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
FYI-
Captivate Wiki:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/wiki/index.php?title=Samsung_Galaxy_S/SGH-I897
Looks like it is not too far out of date.

People complain too much....

I understand your post OP but as mentioned it won't work. What get's the me the most is when people ask, "what's changed?"...
There are CHANGE LOGS ON EVERY THREAD FOR EVERY ROM.

xcaliburinhand said:
FYI-
Captivate Wiki:
http://forum.xda-developers.com/wiki/index.php?title=Samsung_Galaxy_S/SGH-I897
Looks like it is not too far out of date.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
maybe i interpreted the OP wrong, but it sounds like hes talking about a wiki with more detail than the one we already have

xcaliburinhand said:
Taco Bell has maybe a dozen individual ingredients but it's the way they are combined that makes each product special.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Taco Bell.. I'm hungry.

It really cracks me up that this thread is still going
Every ROM is made for a handfull of people. AS it seems. So to really make a wiki and save all the Info from a few thousand users is just nutz. even to have a WiKi just for the ROMs is kinda nutz as others have said. Just so much changes daily it would be so hard to keep up with
So i guess....Like all the others. We can let this thread die now

I agree with you Smoke. With the way updates come out sometimes daily for fixes or depending on an issues hourly a Wiki would just be too hard to maintain. If some one is up for it then go for it. I just see it as a way for people not to have to read the roms thread and doing research before they flash a rom to their $500 device.
Thread closed