What I mean is a general problem of this forum: There loads of good tools, ROMs, tweaks etc but most of you don´t spend enough time to explain what is what.
If you provide such a huge mass of information like in this forum its just impossible for new users to sort out whats good, whats bad, whats new, what can I use.....And DO NOT tell me to use the search-function
For example: I come to the Polaris upgrading thread, I´m looking for a fast ROM. Actually I use bepe 0.67, but I wanna try some others. So lets have a look...Hmm, "Vega R3", "Diamond R4", "PhamQuang"..you see, lots of ROMs.
BUT: I want to know which language it is (I think its something like WWE...what is WWE?? just a joke, I know what it means..), is radio included (I normally expect that..), what have I to watch out for when flashing it & how can I flash it (this is often included, but again, very slangy explained) etc etc etc !
In other words: Many infos are provided. But questions and answers from the rest od the thread could be added to the first/second/third post so people dont have to search for hours (yes, i tried for hours !!!!)
What to do ??
There should be some sort of template for everyone posting a new tool, ROM etc.
Must-haves of a post:
** What is it? What can I do with it? What do I need??
** What language is it
** changelog (in 90% cases included)
** links for good explanations (what is... a ROM, radio, hard-spl, WWE etc)
!!!!! Please, just make one standard thread for such infos; one single, long post, explaining "xda-developers"-language
** Links to other websites/downloads that are useful
Such questions should be summarized for each device and PLEASE write in plain english language, for everybody around the world !
And please, dont post links to threads which arent up to date or are not as userfriendly as they should be!
Another suggestion: Give me the infos I HAVE to know at ONE GLANCE. As I said, language, radio included, installation etc..
I know, what you are thinking right now: We already did this and much more than that. BUT, once again, this is just too less for n00bs like me.
And imagine, 50% less people you have to tell to use the search because you just make a understandable download-post/site with all necessary information...wouldn´t that be nice ???
regards,
Martin,
Austria (NOT Australia..)
[EDIT] You might say "there is a wiki"...its just not useful, thats the problem.
m.schmidler said:
You might say "there is a wiki"...its just not useful, thats the problem.
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The wiki is the place to go if you have questions. Are you saying you expect all the great cookers here to further spend more personal time to give you detailed step-by-step instructions on what to do because you feel searching is too much of a hassle for you? There are plenty of "how-to" guides floating around. Each cooker may give instructions, but I don't think it's their job to educate you how on how to do it, if you don't know how, maybe you shouldn't do it. It really doesn't make much sense to have instructions included in EVERY single ROM thread.
When your mechanic changes the oil in your car, is he supposed to teach you how to drive too?
TheChampJT said:
The wiki is the place to go if you have questions. Are you saying you expect all the great cookers here to further spend more personal time to give you detailed step-by-step instructions on what to do because you feel searching is too much of a hassle for you? There are plenty of "how-to" guides floating around. Each cooker may give instructions, but I don't think it's their job to educate you how on how to do it, if you don't know how, maybe you shouldn't do it. It really doesn't make much sense to have instructions included in EVERY single ROM thread.
When your mechanic changes the oil in your car, is he supposed to teach you how to drive too?
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great responce
Im saying what you dont want me to say m.schmidler, use search...
God there are written SO FRICKEN many tutorials, we have been gathering links, in the threads in the wiki.
Dont we spend enough time cooking, developing etc? Should we start a school also? Who is gonna pay the teachers? you?
No, im not gonna spend more time making it easy on you, there are so much info, so much threads to help new guys (noobs) that im damn amazed that you cant figure it out.
If you cant figure out how to find stuff on XDA, then you really should sit down and think just for a sec.
Try HTC support, or MS support. Try see how helpfull they are, how they explain every thing you think you need to know.
Get a grip on reality man..either that or you and the rest of they guys demanding the things you do can start paying us by the hours we spend on making your device better.
And hey, yea, I know, my roms, and other cooks roms has bugs, flaws, this and that missing wich you deperatly need or w/e. But you know what, here is an idea:
Go back to using stock roms (here is a little help, just to show that I CAN be nice too:
Stock ROM=A operating system provided with the phone you have, in this case windows mobile, and it is not modded, altered or changed in any way. But hey, maybe that was to hard to understand too??)
Im sure the forum could be better, but making posts like that..
let me sum this up in a few words:
Respect the time we use on this, if not you will see that many of the beloved developers here just leave..and btw...thats happening all over the forum because of **** like this
OK. we will change ALL...we will make it like in other forums...a "How 2 post" so that EVERY post looks the same...so that noob can follow...
BUT YOU check ALL NEW post if they are posted the right way.
hahahahahahaahaha
NO man. IF you cannnot follow the instructions in the threads...DO NOT FLASH!!!
I spent 1 year ONLY READING before flashing my first rom!!!!!!!!!!!!!
SO don´t come here with 5 posts and tell us how to do our job
papamopps said:
OK. we will change ALL...we will make it like in other forums...a "How 2 post" so that EVERY post looks the same...so that noob can follow...
BUT YOU check ALL NEW post if they are posted the right way.
hahahahahahaahaha
NO man. IF you cannnot follow the instructions in the threads...DO NOT FLASH!!!
I spent 1 year ONLY READING before flashing my first rom!!!!!!!!!!!!!
SO don´t come here with 5 posts and tell us how to do our job
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LOL! How about he gets promoted to a Mod, then he can go through and change them all just the way he wants by his specs !
Hey Guys, pls...
Hey Guys,
Im new too and I know about the probs in the forum, but the seniors and mods. are right, when they say that we, the users, should use the search an read the wiki.
I`ve been reading 6 months before flashing bepe 0.67.
But with the manuals and the posts of the other guys it makes me happy!!!
This is a great forum!!
Stay tuned!!
m.schmidler said:
What I mean is a general problem of this forum: There loads of good tools, ROMs, tweaks etc but most of you don´t spend enough time to explain what is what.
If you provide such a huge mass of information like in this forum its just impossible for new users to sort out whats good, whats bad, whats new, what can I use.....And DO NOT tell me to use the search-function
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You know, this IS a developers forum. There is kind of the understanding that when you see certain keywords like ROM, .NET, C++, winlibs, MSDQ, SQL, etc...that you aleady know what it is and do not need explaining.
If every developer explained everything their releases could do, down to the finest detail, they wouldnt have any time to develop, they would just be posting all day long. I don't think anything more than one or two lines (which is the case now), is needed for a good explanation.
This forum is perfect for my needs, and since it IS a developer's forum, you cannot expect it to be setup like a regular forum for non-techies. I mean, you don't see any soccer moms on here...no offense to the small minority of soccer moms who develop, lol
::: Connor
wow, I didn´t expect such enormous response...but I think you got me wrong. I DO appreciate the hard work all the people here do, really. But what I suggested was just a little bit of time that could change a lot. As I said, there is plenty of info, or as TheChampJT said
There are plenty of "how-to" guides floating around.
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. Yes, floating around, but there should be some kind of link list for each device...Just let me think, how much work is this ?? 1 or 2 hours, maybe? And with that 1 or 2 hours you can help hundreds of users who would spend each 2 or 3 hours searching.
I really understand your argumentation and I will spend more time on reading and just doing some trial-and-error experiences.
But please, don´t just post such super-sarcastic responses, that won´t change anything.
I´d really do the work I suggested - but I am, as you noticed, just a beginner in flashing and modding. But maybe you guys start thinking social again and work together for a big community.
regards,
Martin
BTW:
I`ve been reading 6 months before flashing bepe 0.67.
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I managed to flash that ROM in 2 days..So I´m definitely not a n00b ?? lol
m.schmidler said:
wow, I didn´t expect such enormous response...but I think you got me wrong. I DO appreciate the hard work all the people here do, really. But what I suggested was just a little bit of time that could change a lot. As I said, there is plenty of info, or as TheChampJT said . Yes, floating around, but there should be some kind of link list for each device...Just let me think, how much work is this ?? 1 or 2 hours, maybe? And with that 1 or 2 hours you can help hundreds of users who would spend each 2 or 3 hours searching.
I really understand your argumentation and I will spend more time on reading and just doing some trial-and-error experiences.
But please, don´t just post such super-sarcastic responses, that won´t change anything.
I´d really do the work I suggested - but I am, as you noticed, just a beginner in flashing and modding. But maybe you guys start thinking social again and work together for a big community.
regards,
Martin
BTW: I managed to flash that ROM in 2 days..So I´m definitely not a n00b ?? lol
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He just dont get it....
Anyways, telling us that you flashed the rom after 2 days, just show us how nOOb you are.
itje said:
He just dont get it....
Anyways, telling us that you flashed the rom after 2 days, just show us how nOOb you are.
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I agree I have been around since - alot of years - I have just flashed for the first time. (On that note I hope you donated some money to Bepe) You flash quickly if a) you are stupid B) You have loads of money or C) you are a happy go lucky chappy.......
good luck son, piss some more people off! The seniors and moderators work very hard and for you to come in this quickly........ Wouldn't it be more sensible to read, read, help, help, help, understand, understand, understand, understand, and then do the whole lot again. and then offer some advice. People listen to people that are intelligent and not to quick off the mark.
This is a complicated forum with a hell of alot of info. I want to offer my congratualtions to the Mods here and say THANK-YOU.......
Will
OMFG, this goes way too far, you guys are really, really offending. Ok, I´ll give in, I´ll use the search, I´ll read read read and won´t flash a new rom again after 2 days...Happy?
It's unbelievable how incredibly arrogant some people are. You start this thread demanding to be spoon fed the information, and then say that people are offending you. YOU are the offensive one my friend. NOBODY HERE OWES YOU ANYTHING. Hire a tutor.
and BTW I don't think anyone here cares whether you search or flash or not, just don't come here telling everyone how they should spend more time making your life easier.
joemanb said:
It's unbelievable how incredibly arrogant some people are. You start this thread demanding to be spoon fed the information, and then say that people are offending you. YOU are the offensive one my friend. NOBODY HERE OWES YOU ANYTHING. Hire a tutor.
and BTW I don't think anyone here cares whether you search or flash or not, just don't come here telling everyone how they should spend more time making your life easier.
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hey man, relax, i got the point. I already said, i recognized it was just a stupid post and u are right. BUT there are two ways telling me that and some replies are really a bit offending.
I hope you accept this "mistake", but it´s just a normal reaction when coming to a forum..other newbies are thinking nearly the same.
Nevertheless, when I post into other threads here please don´t think of me as some kind of moron who just annoys people the whole day
Ok. I think we should let everyone get on with what they do best. Let Noobs search and read and learn (which he has already accepted) and let the experts cook their ROMs and let the users flash them to their devices
He's got the point of no spoon feeding from anyone in here coz everyone who's a developer today was a Noob yesterday and learnt everything from the forum pages
I would love to close this thread to avoid any further forest fires, but since papamopps has a post in it, I'll leave it to the best of his judgement
m.schmidler said:
OMFG, this goes way too far, you guys are really, really offending. Ok, I´ll give in, I´ll use the search, I´ll read read read and won´t flash a new rom again after 2 days...Happy?
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GREAT you start LEARNING!!! welcome to xda-DEVELOPERS .com haha
and next time after reading and not flashing.....start thinking first before you psot such a thread in 2 different subforums
regards
papamopps said:
GREAT you start LEARNING!!! welcome to xda-DEVELOPERS .com haha
regards
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Thank you, kind sir.
Yet I found the idea as quite sound and thoughtful, IMHO. If only it didn't sound as too "i need to be spoonfed" and being bashed right away. LoL
Standard templates/formats are increasingly become a necessity nowadays. In my work, they are the hero of the days. Tons of thousands of reports and informations are being streamlined in a common acknowledged formats. It saves time for BOTH information originators and users/readers. Imagine what they could do to this wonderful forum, it will save time, energy and space for not wasting them in basic queries and responses. Discussion could be more fruitful since it will only talk about advanced and detailed items since all basics are already covered in page 1 in standard form.
Again, if only the idea given some thoughts over
I don't know, but I can see pattern here that every single noob are being treated the same - the harsh way. And some people are also enjoying picking on them. I actually agree to some extent, since it also quite amusing sometimes, but please be more humane. I understand fully that sometimes they (noobs - including me) are so ignorant and lazy and almost always giving stupid and silly ideas. But it's not always 100% like that.
If you want to despise one's thinking, please despise the thinking, not the person. Just because he/she a noob, all his/her ideas are equally stupid/silly? It's an Argumentatum Ad Hominem, and it's not fair.
Noobs is only by definition that the person is new to THIS forum, the WM and HTC thingies forum. But it does not necessarily mean that the person is new to Internet Forum, right? You'll never know, but maybe the person you bash is actually a mod/admin in other respectful internet forum. Yea, who knows? So, I wish this forum could be more gentle to people.
Lastly, we know that this is a DEVELOPER forum. But it also never written that no noobs entrance allowed, right? Whoever now devs, chefs, mods and seniors are once noobs too. So anyone, including noobs, are actually a potential member to contribute to this community. It only requires time and well-grooming techniques, not hammering each one of them.
@Herr Martin Schmidler
Not a very bad idea at all, mate. I understand your frustration, since i sometimes felt the same. For me, the built-in search tool is quite (sorry) lame. And google does refine it a bit, but quite lagging since the gatherer bots need some times to cataloguing new items. But please always be respectful also to others, especially the seniors, they have spent so much time and energy building this great community. We cannot expect them to treat us as if we were kids. Guten tag, liebe gruss!