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TytYN vs. Hermes

What is the difference between these two phones (if any) and what are the differences between them and the Wizard?
Iy would be great if someone (e.g HTC) had a simple features comparison on their website but I guess that is asking for a little too much!

it's the same device... just different name

dcdivenut said:
What is the difference between these two phones (if any) and what are the differences between them and the Wizard?
Iy would be great if someone (e.g HTC) had a simple features comparison on their website but I guess that is asking for a little too much!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
http://europe.htc.com/products/tytn.php
here you can find all specs

well it just mean that htc will not be using their internal code name
as the name they will be selling their devices retail

Rudegar said:
well it just mean that htc will not be using their internal code name
as the name they will be selling their devices retail
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
yes they are planning from now sell also under the brand name HTC

The TyTN is the HTC branded Hermes. T-Mobile will call it the vario II, Orange the M3100 or something and HTC names it's own device the TyTN. They are all the same hardware, only software can differ from carrier to carrier, the same as in the past with Qtek, I-Mate, T-Mobile etc. HTC chose not only to produce the Hermes, but to market the device under their own brand name as well as the TyTN.
The main differences with the Vario I are UMTS, HSPDA ready, better camera, extra cam for video telephone, jog dial and different design and button lay-out.

Dopod call Dopod 9000 or CHT9000 came out Taiwan market today,price will be NT$25,800.00 about US$800.00.
http://shopping.pchome.com.tw/dopod/detail.php?pid=AZV00183
sorry that is Chinese.

Koksie said:
The TyTN is the HTC branded Hermes. T-Mobile will call it the vario II, Orange the M3100 or something and HTC names it's own device the TyTN. They are all the same hardware, only software can differ from carrier to carrier, the same as in the past with Qtek, I-Mate, T-Mobile etc. HTC chose not only to produce the Hermes, but to market the device under their own brand name as well as the TyTN.
The main differences with the Vario I are UMTS, HSPDA ready, better camera, extra cam for video telephone, jog dial and different design and button lay-out.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I started doing some digging and I am now wondering if it is really better than the Wizard. Here is what I found (warning - this is to the best of my knowledge and my uasge for the device may vary from yours so as always YMMV)
Here are the pros...
Faster processor (nice and sweet!)
more connectivity (nice if cingular gets the network up!)
Better camera (although this is a wash for me since I don't use the camera for anything close to serious.)
Jog dial - might be nice
Washes
Screen size and quality - same (not that it is bad now though)
Size - About the same. TyTN is a little longer but a bit narrower and not as deep.
Memory - Same with 128/64 and I was hoping this would be better.
Cons
Weight - The TyTN actually weighs more (26g) than the Wizard or at least the 8125 version. Not a huge deal but would be nicer to go the other way, especially if the extra weight is for a second camera for videophone that I will never use!
Micro SD - This is debatable but I see three negatives here... MicroSD does not have the capcaity that MiniSD does and I will have to get all new cards. Also mini sd is $34 for 1GB and micro SD is $47 or 38% more expensive (from new egg) If at least the tradeoff was a siginificantly smaller form factor then I would say it was okay but that is not the case so why!
odd Headphone jack - Okay, most people probably use bluetooth anyway so who cares about a hard jack, but why make upgrading any more costly than it is now. If it is to get a higher sound quality, who cares since with the reduced storage space of Micro SD it is not like you can load up 320 kbps mp3s anyway!
So basically my question is why would most people upgrade? This seems like a mild improvement at best with enough potential cons to make it a no go. That is really disappointing!

well my two cents on the Wizard and the Hermes ....
before the Cingular 8125 came out or any of the HTC Wizard flavors were available in the US, the Hermes has been in the news so i myself was planning to get an O2 XDA mini S (which i was planning to use in California) to somewhat replace my XDA Exec, I read about the Hermes and told myself to hold off and wait for the 3G version of the Wizard ... Note that the processor's clock speed is twice of the wizard ... Note also that the same Hermes CPU has been compared equal or better than the XDA Exec's Intel XScale 520Mhz CPU ...
If you are using the Cingular network then you might want to go get the Hermes maybe around the end of the year since 3G won't be available until then for Cingular ... while T-Mobile, well forget it, they won't roll out 3G in the next 2 years or so ...
It's just disappointing that we in the US are behind in mobile phone technology ... yeah we're catching up but we're still behind ....

For me the biggest plus is the UMTS. in Holland we have a 9.5 euros per month data plan with unlimited GPRS/WIfi/UMTS. A nice offer to go with the Hermes. You are right that the extra weight and the micro SD are cons, but since I hav not yet invested too much in mini SD that is not really an issue for me. Neither is the headset plug, I use the standard ones or a BT headset, so no biggie for me, especially since the Hermes will feature A2DP. And the extra weight is not important for me, I'm strong enough for the extra 26 gr.
The faster processor and the jog dial alone are worth the upgrade for me especially since it will not cost me much. Maybe 200 euros with a 1 year extension, so that's reasonable (Vario I only cost me 84 euros with a 1 year extension for 22.5 euros per month). UMTS is enough to really make the decision easy for me, let the Vario II arrive!

difensore said:
Note that the processor's clock speed is twice of the wizard ...
quote]
Partly true. The Mhz of the Hermes is twice as much and that might mean that the clock speed is doubled, but the overall speed and performance is not necessarily twice as high.
Different architecture makes an OMAP processor not easily comparable to an XScale or Samsung processor, at least not just based on Mhz. OMAP is double core and other architectural differences make the comparison above too simplified. You can compare it to the AMD and Intel processors, different Mhz (Ghz) but equal or better performance.
Anothe example are the MP in a digital camera. Just the amount of pixels does not mean much, 6 MP camera's with inferior lenses and chips may perform worse than 4 Mp camera's with better lenses and chips. We see it everyday in our beloved HTC devices, 1.3 MP in a Wizard sounds nice, but I know vga (300k) camera's that make better pictures than the Wizard.
Don't get blinded by the Mhz of the processor, that's all I want to say.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

for me umts is the plus
and the cam is the thing i care little about
the quality of cmos cams which are used in mobiles
because the ccd which real dig cams use, use too much power
is poor even if it's 10MP
their problem is not pixels but colours and light sensitivness
imho they can only be used to photo poor pictures of loch ness
and ufo's and then you can mms the photo to your friends or something

I think the first CCD phone/pda was announced this week. The Qool Labs QDA Icon http://asia.cnet.com/reviews/handhelds/0,39001708,39260541p,00.htm

Koksie said:
Don't get blinded by the Mhz of the processor, that's all I want to say.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But it's really fast. I have both, wizard and hermes.

Hi Raskal,
I know you are a big and busy man, but pls find some time to reply to my PMs sent to u..

hdubli said:
Hi Raskal,
I know you are a big and busy man, but pls find some time to reply to my PMs sent to u..
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
resend again, i deleted a bunch of pm

raskal said:
Koksie said:
Don't get blinded by the Mhz of the processor, that's all I want to say.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
But it's really fast. I have both, wizard and hermes.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Gotta be I guess...

Hermes is the project CodeName
Typically, when hardware or software products are originally developed, the engineering group chooses a code name for the project/product, so that (1) it will be easily spoken and recognized which project you're talking about in daily conversation (within the circle of people involved in it), and (2) to make it harder for competitors to initially figure out what the project is about if they hear the name. Hermes was HTC's code name for the development project for a device whose derivatives were ultimately produced under a variety of different Marketing Names for HTC's distribution partners (eg, O2, Vodaphone, Cingular, T-Mobile, Verizon, etc). Recently, HTC decided to distribute a Hermes version under their own marketing brand ("HTC Tytn", and developed a reseller distribution channel for that brand outside of their original wireless carrier partners.
Another example of this that many folks have already heard of: Microsoft's code name for the development of a future operating system project that they started back around 2001 or so was "Longhorn"; the resulting product(s) from that project is about to ship now as "Vista". BTW, an interesting bit of trivia on this one: the MS engineering team that develop Windows were being taken to Whistler/Blackcomb ski resort in BC once per year (perk) to party & relax. So when it came time to come up with a code name for the next version of Windows to develop, they chose "Whistler" (the products coming out of this project were eventually given the names by Marketing as "Windows XP" and "Windows Server 2003"). Shortly after the Whistler project began, they also began the development of Whistler's successor, and gave it the code name of "Blackcomb" (which is the twin mountain at the ski resort next to Whistler Mountain); however, the development timeline for the original specs of Blackcomb was underestimated, feature-creep also set in which lengthened completion even more, so it became apparent that an "interim" version of Windows needed to be released before Blackcomb was ready. At the ski resort' base village, the gondola lift stations for the two mountains are a short walking distance apart, and in-between them is a bar called the "Longhorn Saloon", so they named this "in-between" development project Longhorn; as mentioned above, the Marketing name assigned to the products from this project is Vista. Meanwhile, further delays and problems plagued the Blackcomb project, so another project & code name came into existence "Vienna", and it is now uncertain whether project Blackcomb will continue or if Vienna takes its place (probably the latter). The Vienna code name came about because it is one of the cities of the world with a spectacular vista (view). Just goes to show that there are usually interesting stories behind how the development groups choose project code names, and how creative they can be. Makes you wonder what the story is behind HTC choosing the "Hermes" name, huh?

I too have both the Wizard (Cingular 8125 version) and a new HTC Tytn version of Hermes. The most important differences to me are:
> A2DP/AVRCP, and it works! (supports stereo Bluetooth headphones)
> Jog-dial (I'll use keys before stylus any chance I can get)
> Faster processor (Need for Speed)
> 2mp camera (I've rarely used a phone camera in the past because of low-res/poor quality, but now we're getting into the ballpark of acceptable quality pix)
> teleconferencing camera on the front (curious about using a potentially very cool feature as teleconferencing continues to grow among my friends & family)
> UMTS/HSDPA (Need for Speed again). Browsing with Edge is a pain in the *ss. I've become addicted to UMTS in my notebook computer wireless card...almost like DSL, and now I can actually USE the phone for browsing. I'm a "blue-side" (ATT Wireless) Cingular customer, fortunate to have UMTS around me here.
> I think the Tytn is immediately superior to the Wizard phones over-all. Worth getting one now, instead of waiting for UMTS network completion.
I concur with the previous poster about the Tytn shortcomings, in particular:
> No 2.5/3.5mm headset jack (the HTC guys that decided that one should be hung by their tongues); I'm building an adapter right now so that I can hopefully use some decent headphones & mike (the earbuds/mike that comes with the phone is crap)
> headphone connector (miniUSB) is located in an unusual location, such that third party carrying cases' made for the installed base of popular HTC phones (eg, Vaja) now have the headphone hole cut-out in the "wrong" location (ie, can't listen to mp3 music via wired headphones when the phone is in the case, unless you butcher the case to make a hole in the "right" location)
> boring aesthetic design...in a world where Motorola, Sony and now even
Samsung are leading the market in sexy styling, the HTC phones are looking pretty staid & grim.
> When is a Windows Mobile phone going to get a reliable voice-dialer, like that of the Treo (had one of those before the Wizard)? This thing is a deaf & dumb when it comes to voice recognition!
> the freakin' dial-pad buttons are STILL too small (Wizard has same problem)! I'm constantly fat-fingering the wrong keys on the screen, and I'm tired of using my fingernail to dial...does anyone out there have a better dial-pad that takes up most of the screen that can be loaded into this thing?

Fed up with HTC and I-mate ultimates delayed, need a replacement!

Hi Guys
I have a HTC TyTN which I am using beyond its capabilities. I have upgraded it to WM6 and use a lot of the extra functionality that it contains however, I find it too slow and the screen is to low res. I am also seriously ****ed off with HTC build quality and it now has a fourth hardware issue that I cannot be bothered to return it for. - NO It has not been dropped, in fact its been treated better than an eggshell!
I was originaly looking at replacing it with an I-Mate Ultimate 5150 but I have now heard that they are not being released until November. I can't wait this long. I need a phone that can do all of the following but is NOT made by HTC
runs WM6
has HSDPA/3G
has Bluetooth/Not bothered about WiFi
is faster than this rubbish Samsung 2442A processor at 400mhz
ideally has more than 128meg ram - optional
has an optional extended battery
supports push Exchange email
Last but by no means least, MUST have a 640*480 screen
has a slide out/slide down keyboard
must NOT be made by HTC - no matter how well re-badged it is!
The monstrosity that is the JasJar is simply too big and doesn't support HSDPA anyway. Budget is not too much of a problem but I don't want to go bigger in size than the Ultimate 5150. I will be buying off-contract.
Apart from the I-Mate Ultimates, I can't find any phones to meet this criteria, anyone else know of any? I'm desperate!
Thanks loads in advance for saving my life! :thumbsup:

wow you're not asking for much...and limiting yourself to the small (albeit increasing) percentage of the market that is non-HTC isnt helping you. But then again HTC is a product cycle behind everyone else with VGA so no foul...
In any case your pretty well limited to:
Toshiba G900. Everything you want bar the Processor. Has a possibly low Samsung Processor onboard.
beyond that any other devices coming close to that criteria are comprimises
ie GLofish X800, Gigabyte T300 (Like the G900 due for Release soon). VGA screens aren't that all come on at the moment, but are gradually improving, this is certainly the year for them.

Hi
Thanks for that! Looking like the device for me
And yes, im a firm believer of never buying another product from a manufacturer when something I have bought from them has failed repeatedly. From what I understand, i'm not the only one that has a HTC device thats failed over and over again - google tells me this!
Anyway, i've alreadly found this for sale for 379 and that was with my first google!
Thanks again!!

Hi,
I am pretty much on the same boat, although I am reasonably happy with my TyTN... I just want more!
I have been looking at:
- Toshiba G900 - 800x480 screen, only slightly larger than the TyTN
- E-TEN Glofish X500+ - only just saw this in a magazine yesterday, it is supposed to be a 640x480 version of the X500, and it will be sold by Expansys... although its not on their website yet!

Monty: I know how you feel about HTC, which is why I went from BA -> Flame.
My requirements were slightly different. In descreasing order of importance:
At least 3.5" screen. 2.8 - 3.2" screens are too small, both for my eyes and my hands (with stylus).
VGA.
Lightweight and fits in pocket. (Rules out Universal and Athena.)
Portrait-normal form factor. I gotta be able to hold it in one hand and tap the stylus in the other, comfortably.
2.5G. 3G is still new here, and I can live with 2.5G speeds because of what I use it for (ssh).
Bluetooth. No need for GPS or KB if you have BT.
Prefer no keyboard or a hidden slide-out keyboard -- I'll use a soft, USB or BT keyboard instead of a keyboard with keys too tiny for my fingers, which ends up simply increasing the thickness of the device most of the time.
No HTC device satisfies these requirements. Only the XDA Flame does.
The HTC Panda is a throwback since it doesn't have VGA. Otherwise it might be an acceptable alternative when it comes out.
The iMate Ultimate 7150 would be my second choice when it comes out, despite its keyboard (looks hidable and does not increase thickness of device too much).
Until something better comes out, I'll stick with the Flame.

Monty Burns said:
I was originaly looking at replacing it with an I-Mate Ultimate 5150 but I have now heard that they are not being released until November. I can't wait this long. I need a phone that can do all of the following but is NOT made by HTC
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
heard? who did u hear it from??
"The highly acclaimed Ultimate range from i-mate will be on offer to customers throughout the region from Sept 2007"
http://msmobiles.com/news.php/6461.html

Toshiba G900 has 128M RAM, 128M ROM and a Marvell PXA270 520 Mhz cpu.
It has been released in the UK. The manual is available online - at the Toshiba.co.uk mobile communications site.
Not only is this faster than the SAMSUNG on the TyTN, but is also current Xscale / ARM - the Samsung was two generations out of date ... and generally regarded as end of line long before the TyTN came out.

Imate???? Their customer support SUCKS!!! I've had JasJam for 7months now and have had enough. No phone support. Representatives have NO IDEA what they are chatting about - absolutely no knowledge and noone responds to emails!!!!

Personally I am impressed by the imate ultimate series whenever it is released but I am troubled by their customer support.
For almost 3 months now the clubimate site (Jasjam) page mentions that a newer version of the operating system will soon be released. When I finally got on line with them yesterday the person mentioned that it has already been released. Before I could ask him where it is posted the on line chat disconnected not to be connected again. But I am sure that clown had no idea of what he was talking about.
Regards

the ultimates series have yet to prove themselfs not to be vaporware though

Rudegar said:
the ultimates series have yet to prove themselfs not to be vaporware though
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I dont think that it ll be a vaporware esp when considering the fact that the imate's future depends on them

Touch Diamond

Oh my, that makes me want to do a sex wee!
http://www.htc.com/www/product.aspx?id=46296

I hope we can find something useful in it for our devices.... i realy don't want to buy a new device...

Yes, on the face of it, it seems quite soon after the TC was launched but then I suppose this might take a good few months to turn up in the shops. I presume the VGA screen will mean a lot of the UI widgets won't be usable on the TC, sadly.
Lots more info/video here:
http://www.youtube.com/user/HTC

Unless someone makes them work, but I seriously doubt that HTC will stick to the VGA line...

Yeah I don't want to have to buy another device either. It does suck that it's so soon after the Cruise was released. No microSD memory slot right? I haven't see it mentioned anywhere. 4GB internal memory might be faster but is way too limited.

http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=389935
here they say microSD but then they also say EGPS where the htc site only say AGPS
so who is to know for sure yet...
being that it's vga it could also mean that if it have a working driver it's hardcoded to the vga res :S

Rudegar said:
being that it's vga it could also mean that if it have a working driver it's hardcoded to the vga res :S
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We'll see about that... but until this community gets it's hands on the ROM, we'll see what has Android to offer

Watch this video and submit your comments as to the fluidity of the OS.
Typical of HTC, init?
http://techdigest.tv/2008/05/shiny_video_rev_169.html

When she was actually demoing it, there seemed to be a certain lag when she scrolled whith her finger... Could it be that the diamond also suffers from the "TouchScreen Bug"?

According to Engaget it seems that Diamond has Video acceleration. If it's already implemented by that device, surely it will be available for Touch Cruise soon

chipset is not the same!
ovidiaconescu said:
According to Engaget it seems that Diamond has Video acceleration. If it's already implemented by that device, surely it will be available for Touch Cruise soon
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

While I do admire their efforts on the Diamond, I feel that the HTC product development process is just way to rushed. In the end they end up coming out with half assed devices. It seems like they make a new model every 2 months these days e.g. Touch, Touch Dual, Touch Cruise, P3470, Sedena, etc. So its no wonder they can't get any one model right.
They really need to take some notes of what Apple has been doing with the iPhone. New products have had more storage space, and they've been focusing on software updates for their current users. This way prospective buyers are happy and current owners are kept happy. HTC on the other hand delivers maybe one update to a device full of bugs its entire product lifetime in the form of an AKU. That's quite pathetic customer service esp. for devices that are nowhere near perfect from the get go.
I would buy a Diamond, or a WM7 phone, but HTC needs to start doing a better job respecting its current customers - seriously, the Kaiser ppl have been waiting practically a year now for some sort of update, and we Polaris ppl have been waiting nearly 6months. Until HTC does something about product support, my Touch Cruise and my HTC loyalty will hold me over just until the next generation iPhone comes along and the Apple SDK/Apple store has apps coming along.

I agree, they are releasing devices way too fast. They really should invest time in releasing a device that has quality design with well thought out hardware, something that can last for awhile and then release software updates to it. The iPhone comparisons though are not very accurate, since apple designed the hardware and the software and ATT has nothing to do with it (mostly). (as opposed to att needing to come out with their own ROMs for the tilt). But I see your point, where is the official WM6.1 release for example for HTC branded devices? End of March promised for some fix, it's now May and nothing, only an announcement for a new phone. Shame...

I really hate to admit it, but Apple does a good job whith their device/update probram, hell even M$ comes out with updates on a regular basis for its OS...
HTC should learn something from them... the sleek design, and user friendly interface may win the looks prize, but nothing else if it's unuseable and the support sucks...
Some people have more qualifications for PDAs then most of the personel at HTC from simple tech support, to development... and this is an open community (maybe that's why HTC tech support sucks, because we're here to sort out their mess)

Diamond pro:
WM 6.1
VGA
Diamond con:
battery capacity
no memory card slot
discutable GPS (real GPS or AGPS)
Just my opinnion, of course...

Diamond announced at O2 Germany
as I have just found out, O2 has already announced the HTC Diamond at their Online shop. At another site I found the rumor, that it will be available in June... we'll see.
http://shop2.o2online.de/nw/produkt...lesChannel=SHOP&articleId=617&categoryId=1120

Bodisson said:
Diamond pro:
WM 6.1
VGA
Diamond con:
battery capacity
no memory card slot
discutable GPS (real GPS or AGPS)
Just my opinnion, of course...
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
An the biggest con only 528 Mhz for VGA.
This thing will be slow as hell.
Just look at the E-Ten GloFiish Series with a 500 Mhz cpu.
TDO

TDO said:
An the biggest con only 528 Mhz for VGA.
This thing will be slow as hell.
Just look at the E-Ten GloFiish Series with a 500 Mhz cpu.
TDO
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Ah but it makes full use of the graphics chip to handle that kind of thing.

RE
actually i think this device is pretty cool. since my tytnII ended up in the washmachine i really doubting of buying this device or another tytnII from the insuarrance money...
pros tytn:
-keyboard
-i have 2 accus by then, 2 chargers etc etc...
-memory card slot (though i got 4 gb and it seems enough)
pros diamond:
-size!!! what a beatifull size at all, lighter and thinner then a n95, iphone etc.
-vga screen
-improved chipset and 192mb ram
I just wait till the first real reviews come out and then i decide!

andyturner said:
Ah but it makes full use of the graphics chip to handle that kind of thing.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
It has drivers which use the videocontroller.
But this driver can only accelerate the "drawing" of the graphics and there only specific functions.
The main-cpu has still to handle 4 times the data in comparison to a qvga device.
TDO

Considering an X7510 and looking for input...

So my HTC Wizard is getting a little old. And it's poor old CPU isn't standing up to Windows Mobile 6 ROM's very well. And it doesn't support anyhting past EDGE. And I'm thinking it's time for an upgrade. And my sweet BT SouthWing headset sucks on my HTC as soon as I do more than one thing. At the same time, my camera is busted. My girlfriend has a 6 megapixel camera we use for anything important, but I want a decent camera that's always on me.
I think I see a chance to combine some electronics. I'm looking for a beasty WM 6 based PDA. The current PDA I'm most interested in is the HTC Advantage X7510.
http://www.htc.com/www/product.aspx?id=474
GSM w / solid band support
3.1 MP camera w / flash
BT 2.0
624 Mhz CPU AND ATI gfx chip (<3 cell phone emulators)
16 gig internal flash for my tunes
detachable keyboard
FULL QWERTY KEYBOARD = WIN
Surprisingly sexy for a powerful PDA with a keyboard
This looks like the best one I've found overall. I've heard that HTC has been pretty lousy on implementing the ATI GFX chips, but as far as I can tell that's only on the TyTn II's. It's a little more than I want to spend on a phone, but if it gets the camera in there too then it's sold.
I'm pretty much sold on this guy, only holdup is the cost. I really haven't seen anything that can compete with it, although I found a lot of new companies today poking about. Anybody know of any brands I should look at, or have anything negative to say about this guy?

fatheadpi said:
So my HTC Wizard is getting a little old. And it's poor old CPU isn't standing up to Windows Mobile 6 ROM's very well. And it doesn't support anyhting past EDGE. And I'm thinking it's time for an upgrade. And my sweet BT SouthWing headset sucks on my HTC as soon as I do more than one thing. At the same time, my camera is busted. My girlfriend has a 6 megapixel camera we use for anything important, but I want a decent camera that's always on me.
I think I see a chance to combine some electronics. I'm looking for a beasty WM 6 based PDA. The current PDA I'm most interested in is the HTC Advantage X7510.
http://www.htc.com/www/product.aspx?id=474
GSM w / solid band support
3.1 MP camera w / flash
BT 2.0
624 Mhz CPU AND ATI gfx chip (<3 cell phone emulators)
16 gig internal flash for my tunes
detachable keyboard
FULL QWERTY KEYBOARD = WIN
Surprisingly sexy for a powerful PDA with a keyboard
This looks like the best one I've found overall. I've heard that HTC has been pretty lousy on implementing the ATI GFX chips, but as far as I can tell that's only on the TyTn II's. It's a little more than I want to spend on a phone, but if it gets the camera in there too then it's sold.
I'm pretty much sold on this guy, only holdup is the cost. I really haven't seen anything that can compete with it, although I found a lot of new companies today poking about. Anybody know of any brands I should look at, or have anything negative to say about this guy?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well if you really want the x7510 then you should buy an x7500 and put ap4 on there. than its like having the best of both worlds plus you get all the buttons that you dont get with the 7510

7510 is a good choice only if you intend to use it notebook style. If you use it tablet style, then 7500 or 7501 are better. 7510 does not have the a few of the hardware buttons that the older models have, and this is extremely limiting for table style users. Many users find it more convenient, more portable, and easier when using it table style.
BTW, 7500 and 7501 are lighter and cheaper too. The only drawback is the microdrive instead of SSD, but not a serious drawback. Capacity itself is not an issue for most of us, I believe. I only use about 1 GB out of the 8GB with all my programs installed there. All my large consuming files are on microSDHC, which can be swapped in and out at will so there is no practical limit on the effective capacity. Microdrive is a lot faster than microSDHC, although it consumes more power.

The answer is also in the new product cathegories from HTC marketing department ( www.htc.com ) :
They have :
TOUCH phones (From TOUCH to DIAMOND)
PDA phones (From P3300 to TyTN II)
Smartphones (From S310 to S730)
Mobile Computers (Advantage>Shift)
The strategy seems clear: WHAT DO YOU ARE LOOKING FOR ? :
Trendy and WOW effect PDA PHONE? (Play device with phone?) TOUCH product Line
A Powerfull Companion in your PHONE? (Biz device with phone?) PDA Phones Product Line
Lightweight but powerfull PHONE? (Phone for yor Digital Lifestyle?) Smartphones product line
Mobile computing (Mobile PC always on with SOME phone capabilities?) Mobile Computers product line
I agree with you we would like to have them ALL in a single device but....
I have PDA, SMartphone and Mobile computer, and I fully agree with this scenario. A clear idea (or a good help) and you will be really happy of the chosen device. Chose the wrong category for your purpose and you will sell it in few weeks (losing money )
HTC is out from a dark age now, time to buy stock quotes IMHO!

I'd go for an X7500 unless you can get a 7510 susidised. I use about 6Gb of my Microdrive and about 3Gb on my card but you can always expand with bigger cards.
Good luck!
[Edit]Just seen http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=391485 - might be of interest?[/Edit]

Interesting comments, really appreciate the feedback. So, a few things.
1. I haven't really found a good comparison or general video yet of any of the advantage models. I'll keep the keyboard difference in mind. As for the keyboard usage, how is it for texting? I've been pretty happy with the keyboard on my Wizard, but I'm open to something new. I just refuse to go back to not having a QWERTY keyboard. I'd buy the Diamond, but HTC doesn't get how awesome QWERTY texting is appearantly.
2. Looking at the Advantage, I don't see any buttons on it that would be especially good for gaming, especially anything like the pad on a Wizard / TyTn II. Am I missing something, or can I expect to have my PocketNesterness hampered by an Advantage?
3. Thanks for the info on the 7500/1 vs 7510. Looking at the specs page, I noticed the 7500 lists two cameras while the 7501 only has one. Is this the case? I'd just be giving up the VGA camera for voice calls, which I've never used anyways, but I guess it could be nice if I get to an area with better than EDGE service. Also, is the X7510's camera much / any better?
4. I've done a good bit of flashing / light bit of cooking with my Wizard. About how much harder is an advantage to reflash?
5. 8 gigs would be a considerable upgrade for me, I've been getting by on a 4 gig MiniSD that my Wizard only picks up about 3.7 gig of. Assuming I used a gig internally for pics, GPS, etc, I'd still have twice the capacity on HD alone vs my card.
Glad to get some input, got ignored at HowardForums.

Hmm... actually, saw some better pics of the Advantage. There is clearly no "D-Pad" like the PDA-style phones get. LAME.
Back to the drawing board. Kaiser's in the lead, AT&T owes me a discount phone since I bought my own hardware to the table. Too bad it doesn't have a flash.
http://www.imate.com/support/specs/SpecSheet_9502.pdf
Ooooooh... Do Want!

fatheadpi said:
Interesting comments, really appreciate the feedback. So, a few things.
1. ... how is it for texting? ...
2. ... can I expect to have my PocketNesterness hampered by an Advantage?
3. ... the 7500 lists two cameras while the 7501 only has one. Is this the case? Also, is the X7510's camera much / any better?...
4. ...About how much harder is an advantage to reflash?...
5. ...8 gigs ...
....got ignored at HowardForums.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We play soccer here, 2-1 is the score, and the winners are ...HERMES-KAISER!
1) ATHENA's kb haven't any backlight, hard to use without a stable surface. Big screen means BIG on screen Kb too, but for texting ATHENA Kb isn't really good in standing situation, in the car, on the bus.... WORST comparing it with the HERMES or KAISER
2) Many games aren't usable in a VGA device. I don't know about emulators but less buttons mean less control! WORST comparing it with the HERMES or KAISER
3) Yes, it is. No, don't.
4) Just the same complexity and risks as Kaiser or Hermes
5) Yes, but are built IN. I prefer to have DATA on SD, to manage with the PC utilities, to share data with friends... but, yes BETTER than HERMES or KAISER
HOFO?
Believe me: for a "texter" and "gamer" ATHENA is a nightmare!

Yeah, that's what I'm seeing so far. I might settle on a Kaiser, looks like those are pretty well hacked, and I can get one for like $100 refurb'd through AT&T. I'm gonna see if I can scrounge up a deal on that I-Mate tho, no flash on the camera has repeatedly pissed me off with my Wizard.
On a different note, how is WM6 on a 400 Mhz processor? I'm using a Wizard OC'd to 216Mhz on a custom WM6 rom, and alot of stuff is SLOOOOW. Granted, even a Kaiser would more than double my phone power, but just curious.

Hey guys, I think it's getting obvious the Athena isn't for me. I'm gonna head over to the Kaiser forum and see what I can see. Thanks for the help.

*NEW PHONES* HTC Diamond 2 & Touch Pro 2 **PICTURES**

WOW BREAKING NEWS
Touch Pro 2 News From engadget.com (http://www.engadget.com/2009/02/16/htc-touch-pro2-is-awesome-in-ways-the-touch-pro-never-could-be/)
So, how do you make HTC's Touch Pro -- already near the top of the WInMo heap -- an even beefier device? For starters, you can throw out that nasty VGA screen of yesteryear and up it with a 3.6-inch 800 x 400 replacement. Next, add a dedicated touch-sensitive zoom slider that works overtime to take maximum advantage of said screen, then throw in a few key carryovers: 512MB of ROM, 288MB of RAM, microSD expansion, and a 3.2 megapixel cam. Meet the Touch Pro2, the official follow-up to HTC's popular series of QWERTY sliders that introduces so-called "Straight Talk" technology for "seamlessly" transitioning conversations between email, single-line calls, and party calls. It'll also automatically switch to the crazy high-performance, full-duplex speakerphone simply by flipping the phone over, so it's clear that this bad boy was meant for business. It'll launch early in the second quarter in parts of Asia and Europe with other "major global markets" following in early Summer.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
DETAILED INFORMATION HERE: http://www.htc.com/www/press.aspx?id=83956

I just wish it had tv-out or I'd get it (or the diamond2) I guess I'm the one who uses that feature a lot on my omnia.
Edit: My bad... It DOES have tv-out))

awesome..
now i know why peoples selling their phones
Support HTC

The TouchPro 2 seems more like the Tytn II replacement to me,
I LIKE.​

The touch pro is more business oriented. . . so it probably wont have alot of media features were hoping it has .

A dump promise
Hopefully, someone will soon get their hands on these units to dump the ROMs and port them to Touch Diamond and Touch Diamond Pro.

1-very nice but the lack of d-pad and other buttons is annoying as hell.
2-lets hope the fix the very very poor performance of the diamond this time http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZHYimU-VHM&feature=related
3-also software,themes,apps development forums will be too segmented. diamond ,diamont2,tpro,tpro2, blackstone,x1 are all very similar phones(internally). is there a clean and logical way to combine them.
4-whats the code names of these two devices

very nice. Shame they wont work for more than about 3 minutes before something falls off/a random onboard chip of some random nature starts to malfunction.
HTC, design phones then get someone decent to manufacture them.... you cant manufature for toffe.

"...something falls off". Please explain. I've had the Diamond for 2/3 of a year now and nothing has "fallen off"....
In my opinion, the build quality of HTC products is impeccable.
Monty Burns said:
very nice. Shame they wont work for more than about 3 minutes before something falls off/a random onboard chip of some random nature starts to malfunction.
HTC, design phones then get someone decent to manufacture them.... you cant manufature for toffe.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse

My experience of HTC hardware is far from good. BlueAngel (dead speaker), two TyTN's, one TyTN II and now a TD - all and i mean ALL of them have had at least one warranty repair or replacement. Actually , thats a lie: TD was sent back for a full refund under UK consumer law as "Not Fit For Purpose" as at the time there was no way to play music without the famous skipping/pause issue.
Just fire up google and use terms like "HTC" "hardware" "fault" "Issue" and so on .... you'll soon see what a timebomb of a device you have.
My Toshiba G900 and now Omnia have restored my faith in Smartphones and there reliability.

thats odd....my TyTNII(Kaiser, from USA) has been nothing short of amazing, and it has taken its share of nasty falls!
anyone know what carrier in the U.S will be providing the TP2??
im praying its AT&T, Its almost time for an upgrade, and I think im in love

Perhaps you got some Gremlins
My HTC phones all work like they did on their first day. I didnt have any hardware Problems and the software problems where solved by this nice Community.
Ok, i hve to admit that HTC really doesnt care that much software-wise... I bet they wont release proper drivers for these devices either...
Thats no problem for me though, as i wont buy another arm or qualcom based Smartphone anyway. Im up for atom-powered voice capable MIDs now.

Hmmm. Quite fancy the Pro 2. Shame it doesn't have a slightly beefier processor though. I'm sure these will be replaced by Snapdragon or Tegra devices shortly after I buy one!

i opened a similar thread but it's closed cause i was to slow
now my question again
what's that "zoom bar" supposed to do

but if HTC devices are built so horribly, why use them over and over?

operative1 said:
i opened a similar thread but it's closed cause i was to slow
now my question again
what's that "zoom bar" supposed to do
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
my guess its just the touchwheel from diamond and tpro. not that usuful if you ask me since they could have added more usfel buttons with dpad or remove it for the sake of bigger screen or just remove it to make the phone smaller.

Copy from Raphael Thread
My thoughts:
1. First thing I thought was: I wonder if there will be some way to buy this from AT&T without breaking my contract? I mean, what do they do for people who got a 2-year contract with the original iPhone, and then a year later they want the new iPhone?
2. Longer battery life and a bigger screen are very welcome.
3. I hope that keyboard is a mock-up. Also, I can't imagine using a non-Fuze keyboard, let alone one of those 3-row keyboards most phones have, but it's just way too convenient to have all those punctuation marks available top row.
4. I wonder when this phone will reach stateside.
5. I wonder why the phone's specs aren't improved?
6. I wonder why it's not all-black. It better just be a mockup.
7. Almost Touch HD-sized screen, and the TYTTN II tilt *drools*
But really, it took an entire year for the Touch Pro to come out in the states, so who is really banking on this thing coming out by Summer? And what will AT&T do when I'm willing to give them 300 more dollars for the Touch Pro II, and I still have a contract?
Sure, it's not the improvement we'd all have made. Not more RAM, not a better processor, or drivers... but it's still an improvement over the Touch Pro (unless that isn't a mockup keyboard, in which case I may cry over the colour scheme and the fact that there are LESS KEYS on that phone than the existing Touch Pro) and I'll take it. Plus, the front-facing D-Pad is a pain to use anyway that I just open it up and use my Keyboard D-Pad.

Good point...
drama2747 said:
but if HTC devices are built so horribly, why use them over and over?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
When will we see some dedicated forums for these devices...? moderators...?

HANDS ON VIDEOS
I'm fallin' in love... no kiddin

good to see the phone in action...all though i was tempted to mute the sound lol