Related
:!: Sorry for the shameless attempt to get you here with a dreamy subject but it's relevant to the topic - honestly. :!:
I'm after a PDAPhone with built in everything. But looks so far like I'm going to have to compromise and get an external GPS receiver, however was just hoping someone might have a little gem that I couldn't find anywhere else in the forums.
I have owned and loved the O2 XDA range ever since my first XDA years ago and have since lugged around an XDAII. I damaged my II recently and have a nice cheque for £550 burning a hole in my pocket courtesy of the insurance company. This means that for the first time ever I don't need to go to a subsidised model. My initial thought was that I'd stump up a few extra quid and get a JamJar :lol: from expansys but now I'm a bit more mature I decided to check out the options first.
So far I've found (Ignoring Naming Variations):
Prices quoted are from expansys - they could be cheaper elsewhere. Pls let me know if you find any (UK Only though)
:arrow: iPAQ hw6515 - Looks a bit crap, small screen and no wi-fi listed but DOES have GPS & 1.3Mp Cam - Anyone know of any Square Aware issues with programs?
:idea: http://www.expansys.com/product.asp?code=120563
:idea: £439.95
:arrow: i-mate JAM - Small and sexy but no Wi-Fi and no GPS but would stop people asking if I've got a brick taped to my head. + 1.3Mp, COuld afford external GPS with this one.
:idea: http://www.expansys.com/product.asp?code=I-MATE_JAM
:idea: £359.95
:arrow:Qtek 9090- Has everything But GPS but would leave enough money for a BT GPS - No camera spec but I think it's 0.3Mp like the XDAIIs - Could be upgraded to WM5, My Mate has one and the Thumb Keyboard is easy to use whilst walking - If I use my head not my geekometer this is my favourite.
:idea: http://www.expansys.com/product.asp?code=QTEK_9090
:idea: £414.95
:arrow: i-mate JASJAR - Dogs balls but still no GPS and not much more than the 9090 + v Expensive & Getting Bigger - 1.3Mp Cam I think. (I have no 3G service anywhere near me so that's not a bonus) I really like the 3.5mm Jack - Overall a severe number of geek points! NO CRADLE Still needs GPS Seperate, not sure how useable while walking the keyboard will be. I really want one.
:idea: http://www.expansys.com/product.asp?code=119353
:idea: £669.95
:arrow: i-mate K-JAM - WiFi, BT etc, Smaller and lighter than Universal, WM5, 1.3Mp. I like the keyboard. Maybe my new best choice. JUST leaves enough money to think about an external GPS. Thanks JamiJam
:idea: http://www.expansys.com/product.asp?code=125518
:idea: £504.95
My criteria to consider are as follows, argue with them and persuade me otherwise with reasons if you so wish:
Phone + PDA Essential (Tri Band+)
Camera - Prefer 1+Mp
BT - Must Have
Wi-Fi - Optional but Preferred a lot
3G - Not required
Keyboard - Like to Have (It's awkward using handwriting when travelling)
GPS - Very Nice to Have I Drive a lot and would like to use TT in the future.
OS - Not Bothered, these can be changed
I have 1 Month to decide before I burst and spray money all over the place so I'd really appreciate any comments you might have.
Don't go off on any obscure tangents though please, post them in a new topic and link to it if you wish.
Wizard...
(aka K-Jam, aka Qtek 9100)
Not sure when it will be out but Orange are going to release the Wizard and call it the SPV M600. If you can wait then you'll have it subsidised. :wink:
hmmmmm
Ok, so far the Wizard is my favourite now. I'd completely forgotten about that. What's the keyboard like though? I'm not too fussed about the size (the one on the XDA III is smaller and still useable)? It's more the key action I'm bothered about.
Does it have those rubbish 'rubbery' 'spectrum' style keys? It looks like it does.
I'm still yearning for a Universal cos none of my mates will have one but my head is still saying I don't need it and one of the others will do everything I want.
AFAIK HTC has some kind of arrangement with compaq - HTC will not make a phone with GPS as it competes with a model HTC makes for compaq that does have GPS or something like that (the hw6515 maybe ?)
I have a Blue Angel (O2 XDA IIs) and it does all of this.
http://www.expansys.com/product.asp?code=I-MATE_III
WM5 now available and working fine on it.
It has a keyboard too, it's those blister things (more like a ZX81 than a spectrum) but it is useable, although the keyboard layout is a bit ****e.
What with the newer models coming out you should be able to pick one up cheapish.
I run mine with a Globalsat Bt-338 Bluetooth GPS and Tomtom 5
oh, and FYI, this PDA holder from halfords holds the BA perfectly and can be mounted to your dash. It obscures no ports.
(The pic is upside down BTW)
http://www.halfords.com/opd_product_details.asp?id=16600&type=0&cat=397
The keyboard on the wizard is excellent, in my humble opinion!
It also snaps in and out in a way that makes you feel it won't break down easily.
Finally, it automatically turns the phone's display into landscape mode, which is very handy.
Wizard or BA
I have to say I'm still impressed with the Wizard. Just made a scale model out of card (how sad is that) and it's tiny!
I like the BA but if the keyboard doesn't let the Wizard down I think it'll be my PDA of choice. The one thing I really didn't like about the Jam was its lack of Wi-Fi and that's solved in the K-Jam.
I assume the screen's readable, I like to think that I'll have good eyesight for a couple of years yet so I don't think the size will be an issue.
iPaq HW6515
I have tried without success to get details of the built-in GPS. The one authoritative source to whom I spoke was scathing about its performance. So whatever you do choose, I do not recommend the iPaq.
On a separate note I saw my first Jasjar close up today. It is lighter than you might think, but heavier than is reasonable for prolonged use as a phone. A bluetooth earpiece was being used that included a display for caller ID. As a data device it is pretty impressive.
I too run a GlobalSat BT-338 GPS, in my case with Mapopolis.
if you are going GPS, make sure it is SIRFstar III chipset (the current latest-and-greatest), especially if you live in a city as they are really good at "urban canyon" reception.
I have seen new BT-338s on ebay for £65 "buy it now" recently
plus another thing to think about...
a seperate BT GPS unit has various advantages:
1) Battery
It won't drain your PPC battery when operating, except the charge needed to communicate via BT.
2) Upgrading
If a new improved GPS unit comes out and you have an onboard GPS unit, you are carrying useless baggage and can't sell the old one.
Also bear in mind there will likely be new features added to GPS units.
one example: digital compass. At the moment, if you stand still and rotate, a GPS unit has no clue which way you are facing until you move. A GPS does already transmit heading AFAIK - it works out which way you are facing by assiming you are looking in the direction of travel. Integration of a digital compass therefore would probably require no changes to the protocol. This does exist ( see http://www.xemics.com/internet/solutions/compass.jsp?productID=108 )
3) Switching.
BT GPS units work on laptopss too you know
4) Safety. I use my GPS for a sport called mountain boarding. Same kinda deal as downhill mountain biking, I trace a route I have done using GPS software. I ride with my XDA in a reinforced case with foam in, but find the GPS reception suffers, so I keep the BT GPS unit in my bag and the XDA in the case.
Seeing as the XDA is MUCH more valuable than the GPS this makes sense.
5) Reception versus viewing position.
Sometimes the position with best reception is not the same as the position you can see the screen of your PPC best.
????
Good point.
Ok, more questions on the K-Jam
Camera: Says 1.3/2 Is this 1.3 with software to 'frig' it to 2?
Keyboard: Is the expansys keyboard silver ( http://www.expansys.com/product.asp?code=125518 ) or black ( http://www.expansys.com/zoompic.asp?type=item&code=125518 )
Silver ones look plastic whereas black ones look rubbery. Which have you got JamiJam? Is it from Expansys?
Processor: 200Mhz? Is that right? Seems quite a drop. Do you have any problems with media playback? I remember my XDA I used to have a problem playing big avi files.
Ta Very Much
Camera is 1.3MP, and it is ****.
Yes, it's better than the Magician, but it's still pretty bad. I wouldn't buy the Wizard hoping to use the camera for anything useful. In my opinion this is the #1 point on which HTC is lacking. They've worked on everything else, now they need to start putting decent cameras in these devices.
I have the silver keyboard and I bought my Wizard in a store. I believe that if you order from expansys you'll get a silver one.
Processor is 200MHz (different CPU architecture) but it seems to be on par with the Magician in practice, maybe 10% slower. So yes, you should be able to watch full screen movies, once you find a bit-rate/resolution/format that works for you. Not sure which XDA you had, but I would expect similar ballpark performance.
Hope this helps.
Ta
The 'performance lacking' XDA was the original XDA I and I'll take your word for it that performance is ok. I don't use it for anything too hot and my XDA II never had a problem with films.
To be honest, every camera phone I've had from the XDA Range was ****ty quality (Very grainy) but I spend a fair bit of time on site collecting info on wagons and stuff for my job and it's always handy to be able to snap a quick video or pic of something. The only reason I want a higher res is so that when some tit with a Sony Ericson goes on about his 2Mp camera I don't loose too many 'top trumps' points. I never print the pics and my main contract doesn't support GPRS so I don't often send MMS. You'd be surprised how easily you can still get by with just plain old WAP.
Good news on the silver buttons. I prefer them. Has anyone bought one from Expansys who can verify?
Sweetness & Joy
Just thought I'd post my decision for those of you who like seing things through to a conclusion.
After much ponderation and constructing various cardboard models I have decided on the HTC Wizard, purchased from expansys (i-Mate K-Jam). There's a delay on delivery at the moment (3 Days!!!! I can't wait) but once it arrives I'll post back with my oppinions.
I've also heard that my mate is buying the JasJar so I'll be able to make a comparison and post it back.
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:!: Come on Friday! :!:
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D'oh! Just a note not say the expansys delivery has been put back but they've dropped the price too.
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:!: Come on Some-Day! :!:
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Just been looking at some larger photos of the buttons
http://forum.xda-developers.com/files/keyboard-flash.jpg
I take back my spectrum comments, they look pretty good.
Hurrah!
Ok! I've got my Wizard at last. I ended up buying the Qtek 9100 rather than the K-Jam. Looks like I'll miss out on Club i-Mate. :-(
Thought I'd post my views on the phone here just to give closure to anyone reading this thread.
The screen is very sharp. Everything obviously is smaller because the pixels are closer together but the overall effect is a very good screen. The guy in our office with really bad eyesight liked it and he's normally a miserable git when it comes to gadgets.
I take back my comments about the keyboard, it looks fantastic, the action is really great and you can use it to type replies to text messages on the move, which is something I've always struggled with before using the Transcriber. People are also really impressed when the screen rotates thru' to landscape.
I've used it for playing some music and although the speakers built in are tinny as you'd expect, the headphones are really good. I don't know if they'd be the same for the i-Mate but they fit comfortably in my ears and have a very good sound compared to the old XDA & XDA II headphones (Not that that would be hard)!
I miss having a cradle. It was nice to be able to display your phone on your desk while it was charging. Just using a USB cable makes it all feel a bit less sexy as an experience but then you can't have everything I suppose.
The coolest thing I found was the Stylus. It's about 50mm long when it first comes out of the phone. Then you give it a little pull and it extends to... hold on let me get a ruler... 85mm. It's not as comfy to use as the XDA/XDA II styli but since i haven't used it for writing much it doesn't matter. The keyboard is so easy to pull out and use that I've only really used the stylus to point at stuff so that my fingers don't get the screen dirty. The softkeys in WM 2005 also mean that you rarely need to touch the screen.
It's a bit chunkier than I expected but still not big. It's only marginally bigger than my girlfriends Nokia 6230 and compared to an older XDA model it feels like it's tiny!
Voice recognition button on the side works really well so far. I've got about 10 contacts programmed in and it seems to be picking them up ok, even in the car.
Overall, i'm yet to find much of a fault with it. I'll try to get some piccies of bits posted sometime next week.
Feel free to ask any questions.
JASJAR II
When the damn thing releases.....of course
I really wouldnt auction my spare kidney and buy it, and then suffer with a RAM deficit! My xda 2 currently running on wm5, has 128megs ram and 32megs rom....compared to 43megs ram & rom of jasjar........one word.......RIDICULOUS!
i cant believe seeing a 7MB RAM free on a device, and i dont ever want to see it! HTC/ IMATE/ Whoever claim they put in less RAM for extended battery life....bucket of crap! I really dont care for those couple extra hours that i'd probably get, and i dont mind carrying a spare battery or a charger wherever i go....
Its a handicap which is BIG! Besides this, the Jasjar is divinely irresistable, and i cant stop oggling at it :shock:
So, i guess i'll wait for a JJ II to come out with same form factor, and somemore ram which would make the device practical....
HTC do you hear me??????
San
weeel
:shock:
RAM isn't everything. I have been using the device for a day now (Non-stop), often running WMP10, Outlook, PIE etc also playing Tomb Raider. I haven't noticed any diference between this and my XDA II which had I think 64Mb and a 400 odd MHz processor. The odd app is a trifle slow to load up but nothing more major than that.
If the battery life sacrifice is true, then it's not for this little puppy. All this usage (with wi-fi on but not actually using a wi-fi network) and the battery didn't drop below 60% yesterday (Using lightly whilst at work and heavily in the evening. I even synced using bluetooth).
Memory has crept down to 1Mb program mem free at times but I assume windows is just doing its thing because this comes back up after a while and I don't notice any drop in performance.
Re: Hurrah!
eayuwna said:
I miss having a cradle. It was nice to be able to display your phone on your desk while it was charging. Just using a USB cable makes it all feel a bit less sexy as an experience but then you can't have everything I suppose.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
This site: http://www.mobilefun.co.uk/product/5735.htm claims that this desktop charger/cradle is compatible with the K-Jam so if that's true then it should be OK for your QTek. 8)
Hi,
Ive decided to go with Wm over UIQ3/S60 due to more software.
Ive never had a ppc, but i expect to do some tinkering in terms of software and maybe custom rom's
Turns out that choosing the os was the easy part.
Im now faced with hardware dilemmas. Sorry if this is long, but i dont want to throw away 400$ or more on a phone that may not meet my expectations
1. The devices i looked at range from 200mhz omap to about 500mhz from various chip makers. How noticeable is the cpu speed if a phone has the same ram?
2. Next is Ram, how important is it to have 128 megs??
3. last is Rom, how useful is this- cant u just dump progs to the expandable memory card. performance wise how diff are progs installed on the rom verses the expandable memory?
phones i am considering are gsm: htc touch, touch cruise, SE x1, asus p527/p750, lg ks20, glofiish x650/x600, toshiba g810, gsmart i3xx?, samsung i780. How crippling is the htc driver problem?
a) i kinda want my phone to have some metal on the case- will it get less scratches?
b) how useful are phones with just direction and 2 buttons-send/end call? how useful is a 9# keypad in real buttons? seems redundant with soft key option
c) Am i better off with the cheaper options to get used to wm rather the go for a more luxury option?
I plan to keep the phone for about 3 years.
also how useful is the wifi versus data plan( i am in Ontario Canada)?
i plan to use it to call long distance in Canada via Voip, as i am around wifi hot spots often.
Thank you to all who give me some input.
I'll chime in where I can:
2. Very important. I find that 64 is not enough and 128 is too much. If they made 96MB RAM it would be perfect. But noone does that I know of. Better to have too much than too little. Battery life will suffer a little (less power used for less memory).
3. It's pretty important. I have 256 MB ROM and after everything I only have 128 free. If you only had 128 to begin with, who knows how much you'd be left with? Some apps need to be installed in ROM and not Storage Card. Get 256 if you can.
b) I never really use any buttons other than on/off and talk/end. I have a hardware button setup for the today screen, which helps me because I use it alot.
Hope that helps!
That clears it up thank you wildcard.
Ths could eliminate some phones from my list.
Could anyone clear up processor speed for me, does it really make a diff given enough ram?
Also out of the phones I mentioned, is there a clear choice that satisfy me- ignoring the phones not yet released( x1, g810)?
Is there an gsm htc touch clone from o2 or whoever that mimics the CDMA version ( 400mhz, 128 ram)?
Don't take this as entirely factual but:
-64mb RAM is good, but I could have used 128mb. Battery life is affected, but I don't know how much.
-CPU probably has some effect, but 400mhz is standard and fine. 200mhz is probably much slower.
-There is no 400mhz/128MB RAM Touch clone for GSM
-Apps run faster from ROM. With only system utilities on my device and with the ROM made spring clean, I could not have more than 32 out of 49MB of free RAM left. 64 is really small, 128 is a minimum if you don't want to count on your card or keep extra fonts/voice commands/media.
-You MUST have Wi-Fi. What kind of sane Canadian would rely on data... probably a filthy rich one! Rogers is about to bring affordable unlimited data soon tho, but they say it will be for "a selected list of phones" which will probably exclude the very phones that need it IMO. iPhone whores...
-If you're not sure about Windows Mobile, try an emulator (found on microsoft website using google) for developers and surf around. It's far from what you can actually do with your device but it helps you see what it's all about.
You might want to try PalmOS if Wi-Fi and web browsing is not a necessity. I changed to WM and would never switch back, but some did the opposite and loved it.
Suggestion:
-TyTN / TyTN II have plenty of buttons+hardware keyboard, great for playing video game ROMs and games in general, but makes the device much thicker. You will love having lots of hardware buttons (one for flashlight, another for calendar then another for...)
-HTC Touch. It must be slower, but if you remove web browsing, heavy customization and the like, it will be a nice pocketable device. It's so damn cute compared to my fat TyTN (which I love). It only lacks more buttons and some power under the hood.
Thanks again.
Rogers has some sort of Rogers Vision Plan that includes data for 7$ still dont know much about it, its all new. I'd rather not pay anything extra LOL.
www.tryphone.com has a preview of palm os, but that doesnt interest me.
I couldnt figure out the windows mobile simulation from microsoft, but i did use a htc briefly in a store.
Anyways from whats been posted:
Avoid 200 mhz
Avoid anything less then 128 ram
Avoid anything less then 256 rom
This basically leaves HTC, Samsung, toshiba, Hp 610 and upcoming expensive X1.
---
From what i understand Rom flashing is basically reinstalling WM and bundling less progs with it? Am I correct?
Could any one point me into the direction of more info on ROM flashing?
How hard is it to make a custom Rom from scratch in case I go with a non HTC phone i.e. Samsung/ Eten / Asus .. i gather the other communities dont have it as rich as this one.
Avoid LG KS20 !
Hello andrey08,
There is one thing I can tell : do not buy a LG KS20 !. It is plagued by totally flawed display drivers : many GAPI apps do not work, and most DirectDraw ones do not.
Moreover, LG stripped from the ROM QTV support, so you will not have hardware accelerated video playing.
There is also a problem with the microphone while phoning, which stops functionning while switching between GSM and 3G bands.
Finally, their customer support is even worst than HTC's since they always pretend not being aware of these problems and do not plan to release a new ROM to correct anything when asked (since there is no problem according to them...).
I'm the poor owner of this piece of crap, and can not even resell it since it would be scam (you can't not even rely on it to phone !).
You can search the internet to confirm what I say : european forums are full of messages of angry customers. Our problem is that we can not have class actions in europe as in the US, and it is not an easy task to individually sue vodaphone or LG.
Lastly, concerning HTC recent products : if you read this forum, you will find that recent MSM7xxx HTC products are plagued by a very slow display. Compatibility and applications support seems OK though.
what about screen type
i know VGA is 4 times the display ability of QVGA, however whatsthe draw back of VGA
do all programs run on both VGA/Qvga screens??
whats the issue with video play back??
andrey08 said:
what about screen type
i know VGA is 4 times the display ability of QVGA, however whatsthe draw back of VGA
do all programs run on both VGA/Qvga screens??
whats the issue with video play back??
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I would go for a VGA phone every time, but the advantages are relatively subtle.
Most QVGA programs will work on VGA, either because they are natively supported, or they use pixel-doubling.
You won't notice much of a difference for most of the built-in programs apart from smoother fonts and cleaner icons. This can be hacked using something like realVGA, but I find the icons get too small for practical benefit, although YMMV.
VGA, however, definitely comes into its own when you are web-browsing or using the remote desktop client, because the increased resolution means that you can get a near-desktop experience.
The disadvantage is that VGA displays theoretically sap more battery, although I haven't found this to be a problem in practice. Video playback is also more dependent on what hardware you have on the device and whether there is any acceleration.
ZSX said:
I would go for a VGA phone every time, but the advantages are relatively subtle.
Most QVGA programs will work on VGA, either because they are natively supported, or they use pixel-doubling.
You won't notice much of a difference for most of the built-in programs apart from smoother fonts and cleaner icons. This can be hacked using something like realVGA, but I find the icons get too small for practical benefit, although YMMV.
VGA, however, definitely comes into its own when you are web-browsing or using the remote desktop client, because the increased resolution means that you can get a near-desktop experience.
The disadvantage is that VGA displays theoretically sap more battery, although I haven't found this to be a problem in practice. Video playback is also more dependent on what hardware you have on the device and whether there is any acceleration.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Also make sure you read my (W)VGA-related articles & reviews - from MWC, I've posted a LOT on the brand new / forthcoming VGA devices (for example, the i-mate 9502, the x7510 etc)
andrey08 said:
Hi,
Ive decided to go with Wm over UIQ3/S60 due to more software.
Ive never had a ppc, but i expect to do some tinkering in terms of software and maybe custom rom's
Turns out that choosing the os was the easy part.
Im now faced with hardware dilemmas. Sorry if this is long, but i dont want to throw away 400$ or more on a phone that may not meet my expectations
1. The devices i looked at range from 200mhz omap to about 500mhz from various chip makers. How noticeable is the cpu speed if a phone has the same ram?
2. Next is Ram, how important is it to have 128 megs??
3. last is Rom, how useful is this- cant u just dump progs to the expandable memory card. performance wise how diff are progs installed on the rom verses the expandable memory?
phones i am considering are gsm: htc touch, touch cruise, SE x1, asus p527/p750, lg ks20, glofiish x650/x600, toshiba g810, gsmart i3xx?, samsung i780. How crippling is the htc driver problem?
a) i kinda want my phone to have some metal on the case- will it get less scratches?
b) how useful are phones with just direction and 2 buttons-send/end call? how useful is a 9# keypad in real buttons? seems redundant with soft key option
c) Am i better off with the cheaper options to get used to wm rather the go for a more luxury option?
I plan to keep the phone for about 3 years.
also how useful is the wifi versus data plan( i am in Ontario Canada)?
i plan to use it to call long distance in Canada via Voip, as i am around wifi hot spots often.
Thank you to all who give me some input.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I heartily recommend the MWC-based handset reviews I've posted in the last week into this very forum (i-mate, HP, Samsung etc)
Thanks i'll chekc it out.
im considering either an Eten x650 or MWg Atom V
reviews and such look good for both
So my HTC Wizard is getting a little old. And it's poor old CPU isn't standing up to Windows Mobile 6 ROM's very well. And it doesn't support anyhting past EDGE. And I'm thinking it's time for an upgrade. And my sweet BT SouthWing headset sucks on my HTC as soon as I do more than one thing. At the same time, my camera is busted. My girlfriend has a 6 megapixel camera we use for anything important, but I want a decent camera that's always on me.
I think I see a chance to combine some electronics. I'm looking for a beasty WM 6 based PDA. The current PDA I'm most interested in is the HTC Advantage X7510.
http://www.htc.com/www/product.aspx?id=474
GSM w / solid band support
3.1 MP camera w / flash
BT 2.0
624 Mhz CPU AND ATI gfx chip (<3 cell phone emulators)
16 gig internal flash for my tunes
detachable keyboard
FULL QWERTY KEYBOARD = WIN
Surprisingly sexy for a powerful PDA with a keyboard
This looks like the best one I've found overall. I've heard that HTC has been pretty lousy on implementing the ATI GFX chips, but as far as I can tell that's only on the TyTn II's. It's a little more than I want to spend on a phone, but if it gets the camera in there too then it's sold.
I'm pretty much sold on this guy, only holdup is the cost. I really haven't seen anything that can compete with it, although I found a lot of new companies today poking about. Anybody know of any brands I should look at, or have anything negative to say about this guy?
fatheadpi said:
So my HTC Wizard is getting a little old. And it's poor old CPU isn't standing up to Windows Mobile 6 ROM's very well. And it doesn't support anyhting past EDGE. And I'm thinking it's time for an upgrade. And my sweet BT SouthWing headset sucks on my HTC as soon as I do more than one thing. At the same time, my camera is busted. My girlfriend has a 6 megapixel camera we use for anything important, but I want a decent camera that's always on me.
I think I see a chance to combine some electronics. I'm looking for a beasty WM 6 based PDA. The current PDA I'm most interested in is the HTC Advantage X7510.
http://www.htc.com/www/product.aspx?id=474
GSM w / solid band support
3.1 MP camera w / flash
BT 2.0
624 Mhz CPU AND ATI gfx chip (<3 cell phone emulators)
16 gig internal flash for my tunes
detachable keyboard
FULL QWERTY KEYBOARD = WIN
Surprisingly sexy for a powerful PDA with a keyboard
This looks like the best one I've found overall. I've heard that HTC has been pretty lousy on implementing the ATI GFX chips, but as far as I can tell that's only on the TyTn II's. It's a little more than I want to spend on a phone, but if it gets the camera in there too then it's sold.
I'm pretty much sold on this guy, only holdup is the cost. I really haven't seen anything that can compete with it, although I found a lot of new companies today poking about. Anybody know of any brands I should look at, or have anything negative to say about this guy?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
well if you really want the x7510 then you should buy an x7500 and put ap4 on there. than its like having the best of both worlds plus you get all the buttons that you dont get with the 7510
7510 is a good choice only if you intend to use it notebook style. If you use it tablet style, then 7500 or 7501 are better. 7510 does not have the a few of the hardware buttons that the older models have, and this is extremely limiting for table style users. Many users find it more convenient, more portable, and easier when using it table style.
BTW, 7500 and 7501 are lighter and cheaper too. The only drawback is the microdrive instead of SSD, but not a serious drawback. Capacity itself is not an issue for most of us, I believe. I only use about 1 GB out of the 8GB with all my programs installed there. All my large consuming files are on microSDHC, which can be swapped in and out at will so there is no practical limit on the effective capacity. Microdrive is a lot faster than microSDHC, although it consumes more power.
The answer is also in the new product cathegories from HTC marketing department ( www.htc.com ) :
They have :
TOUCH phones (From TOUCH to DIAMOND)
PDA phones (From P3300 to TyTN II)
Smartphones (From S310 to S730)
Mobile Computers (Advantage>Shift)
The strategy seems clear: WHAT DO YOU ARE LOOKING FOR ? :
Trendy and WOW effect PDA PHONE? (Play device with phone?) TOUCH product Line
A Powerfull Companion in your PHONE? (Biz device with phone?) PDA Phones Product Line
Lightweight but powerfull PHONE? (Phone for yor Digital Lifestyle?) Smartphones product line
Mobile computing (Mobile PC always on with SOME phone capabilities?) Mobile Computers product line
I agree with you we would like to have them ALL in a single device but....
I have PDA, SMartphone and Mobile computer, and I fully agree with this scenario. A clear idea (or a good help) and you will be really happy of the chosen device. Chose the wrong category for your purpose and you will sell it in few weeks (losing money )
HTC is out from a dark age now, time to buy stock quotes IMHO!
I'd go for an X7500 unless you can get a 7510 susidised. I use about 6Gb of my Microdrive and about 3Gb on my card but you can always expand with bigger cards.
Good luck!
[Edit]Just seen http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=391485 - might be of interest?[/Edit]
Interesting comments, really appreciate the feedback. So, a few things.
1. I haven't really found a good comparison or general video yet of any of the advantage models. I'll keep the keyboard difference in mind. As for the keyboard usage, how is it for texting? I've been pretty happy with the keyboard on my Wizard, but I'm open to something new. I just refuse to go back to not having a QWERTY keyboard. I'd buy the Diamond, but HTC doesn't get how awesome QWERTY texting is appearantly.
2. Looking at the Advantage, I don't see any buttons on it that would be especially good for gaming, especially anything like the pad on a Wizard / TyTn II. Am I missing something, or can I expect to have my PocketNesterness hampered by an Advantage?
3. Thanks for the info on the 7500/1 vs 7510. Looking at the specs page, I noticed the 7500 lists two cameras while the 7501 only has one. Is this the case? I'd just be giving up the VGA camera for voice calls, which I've never used anyways, but I guess it could be nice if I get to an area with better than EDGE service. Also, is the X7510's camera much / any better?
4. I've done a good bit of flashing / light bit of cooking with my Wizard. About how much harder is an advantage to reflash?
5. 8 gigs would be a considerable upgrade for me, I've been getting by on a 4 gig MiniSD that my Wizard only picks up about 3.7 gig of. Assuming I used a gig internally for pics, GPS, etc, I'd still have twice the capacity on HD alone vs my card.
Glad to get some input, got ignored at HowardForums.
Hmm... actually, saw some better pics of the Advantage. There is clearly no "D-Pad" like the PDA-style phones get. LAME.
Back to the drawing board. Kaiser's in the lead, AT&T owes me a discount phone since I bought my own hardware to the table. Too bad it doesn't have a flash.
http://www.imate.com/support/specs/SpecSheet_9502.pdf
Ooooooh... Do Want!
fatheadpi said:
Interesting comments, really appreciate the feedback. So, a few things.
1. ... how is it for texting? ...
2. ... can I expect to have my PocketNesterness hampered by an Advantage?
3. ... the 7500 lists two cameras while the 7501 only has one. Is this the case? Also, is the X7510's camera much / any better?...
4. ...About how much harder is an advantage to reflash?...
5. ...8 gigs ...
....got ignored at HowardForums.
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
We play soccer here, 2-1 is the score, and the winners are ...HERMES-KAISER!
1) ATHENA's kb haven't any backlight, hard to use without a stable surface. Big screen means BIG on screen Kb too, but for texting ATHENA Kb isn't really good in standing situation, in the car, on the bus.... WORST comparing it with the HERMES or KAISER
2) Many games aren't usable in a VGA device. I don't know about emulators but less buttons mean less control! WORST comparing it with the HERMES or KAISER
3) Yes, it is. No, don't.
4) Just the same complexity and risks as Kaiser or Hermes
5) Yes, but are built IN. I prefer to have DATA on SD, to manage with the PC utilities, to share data with friends... but, yes BETTER than HERMES or KAISER
HOFO?
Believe me: for a "texter" and "gamer" ATHENA is a nightmare!
Yeah, that's what I'm seeing so far. I might settle on a Kaiser, looks like those are pretty well hacked, and I can get one for like $100 refurb'd through AT&T. I'm gonna see if I can scrounge up a deal on that I-Mate tho, no flash on the camera has repeatedly pissed me off with my Wizard.
On a different note, how is WM6 on a 400 Mhz processor? I'm using a Wizard OC'd to 216Mhz on a custom WM6 rom, and alot of stuff is SLOOOOW. Granted, even a Kaiser would more than double my phone power, but just curious.
Hey guys, I think it's getting obvious the Athena isn't for me. I'm gonna head over to the Kaiser forum and see what I can see. Thanks for the help.
I currently have a Blue Angel and I'm considering upgrading to an Orbit 2.
How would the performance compare between the 2? They're both 400MHz, but I just wondered how the Qualcomm is compared to the XScale?
Apart from the video driver issue, are there any other problems with it? I'd mainly be usig it for a phone, and running Tomtom.
Thanks!
Seriously... Don't bother!
LOL...it's that bad?
Can you explain why?
You will miss your qwerty. I don't know your Blue Angel, But my TC (i think all PocketPCs) has a delay when somebody calls you. Your phone will ring/vibrate after the one who calls you hears the first ring. So if somebody just gives you a call with one ring (bip) you won't hear it! Is it the same in your case, or mine is special? Maybe somebody else with TC can confirm/infirm this...
Yea, mine sort of have that sort of dealy.
I don't use my QWERTY keyboard anyway so that's not a problem.
the_scotsman said:
LOL...it's that bad?
Can you explain why?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Just everything about it...
The build quality is terrible. Feels like a new hobbyist threw it together in 5 mins.
It seriously underperforms compared to my Old SE P990i and older XDA's
The modifications o2 have made to the software are rubbish.
I'm miffed I didn't hold out for the SE X1i
^ In your opinion, yes its not perfect, the screen is less than ideal but the build quality is great I think. Much better than my old SE P series phone which used to creak whenever squeezed etc and the flush screen is better than orbit 1
But I would hold out for the Diamond
I want the built in GPS, and the Diamond prices ae too much for what it is...
Any other decent HTCs with built in GPS?
the_scotsman said:
I currently have a Blue Angel and I'm considering upgrading to an Orbit 2.
How would the performance compare between the 2? They're both 400MHz, but I just wondered how the Qualcomm is compared to the XScale?
Apart from the video driver issue, are there any other problems with it? I'd mainly be usig it for a phone, and running Tomtom.
Thanks!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
I've just switched from a Hermes/Tytn to the Orbit2. HardSPL'd it and installed the WM6.1 that's been floating about here and installed TomTom.
Losing the keyboard is a bit annoying (on screen is usable, but nowhere near as good) - but I realized I very rarely typed anything and smaller sized massively outweighs it.
GPS works very well - especially as Quick GPS which really does work.
Downsides:
Lost keyboard.
Upsides:
GPS - now just not having to lug around and charge my BT GPS module, but now much faster and lets me do all manner of stuff (geo-tag photos with a reg tweak), GPS trackers allowing me to see where I've been in google maps blah blah.
Much better camera - not so much the 2M -> 3M change - but AUTOFOCUS.
SMALLER - now it's not a small phone, but it's not an f'in brick like the last one.
No real difference noticed between the processors. Latest 6.1 I put on my Hermes made it lovely and snappy - and performs exactly the same on the Polaris. Only reservation I've got with the polaris is the screen res (i.e. same old rubbish). Not entirely convinced Hi-res WM is much better though after playign with colleagues PDAs - I've got an ipod touch and THAT is what i'd want somehow wedged into my phone..
In summary, if you want a phone now, I'd definitely get the XDA. If you can wait maybe see how Diamond and 3G iPhone stack up.
#edit - and build quality on my XDA (at least) is perfect. Nice solid feeling thing, love the slightly rubberized case.
Thanks very much for your opinion...I think I might just go with the Orbit 2 after all...a VGA screen would be nice, but I'm happy enough to have the standard one...and it's a little smaller than my BLue Angel so that's always a benefit.
Seriously this is an outstanding device. Software is software and any issues can 99% of the time be sorted with it and normally are, especially when you browse around these forums. Also bare in mind that all these devices now use windows mobile so I don't understand why someone would fault the Orbit 2 over another windows mobile device because of the software it comes with.....anyway the hardware itself is exceptional, I've posted a mini review if you look through my post history and there's plenty of in-depth reviews out there.
Losing the keyboard is a good thing in my opinion. A keyboard isn't necessary, its just as easy (if not easier) to use the software input (my personal preference is a T9 style pad that learns words and is very quick to use with just one hand like a normal phone) and obviously you save on weight and bulk.
The Orbit 2 looks great, is extremely responsive and comfortable to use and in my opinion is the best windows mobile device availible at this time.
Quick edit! - regarding the SW, the rom that the O2 Orbit 2 comes with is actually fine anyway, i've never encountered any issues with it - it would be nice to have the threaded SMS that 6.1 has but aside from that its fine and works great. Cheers!
SOunds like you're pretty damn happy with it then
So the 200MHz processor isn't an issue? Still responds well? Thing like TOmtom run well?
The Orbit 2 has a 400MHz CPU, it was the original Orbit that had 200 -it also has twice the amount of memory. TomTom was perfectly useable on the original Orbit but it noticeably runs smoother on the Orbit 2 - The Orbit 2 is a lot better at managing multiple tasks at the same time.
I was in two minds before upgrading becasue I had the original Orbit and wasn't sure if I'd get my money's worth. I was going to send it back if I wasn't happy with it. I'm more than happy with it though as you can tell! its a great device. You've always got that 14 day cooling period with O2 anyway so you may as well give it a go for yourself.
doh...you're right...I was thinking of the original Orbit.
No 14 day cooling off for me..I'm in Australia so the only way to get at a decent price is eBay.
I think I've been convinced to get the Orbit 2...just a pity it doesn't have VGA...and the diamond will probably be a fair amount more than the Orbit 2
Actually a the Diamond will be cheaper then the Polaris/Orbit2... But my oppinion is that the VGA is too much on a 2.8" screen...
The Orbit 2 is a damn good toy... after tuning the cache and graphic settings..speed was even better than before..
also gps works great...a lot of stuff in a small little case...
I am also happy with my orbit 2, copilot in mo is better then tomtom i have both installed.
I like golive's interface and extra settings plus the website for tracking is a good feature.
The Software available is none stop from here and other sources, unlike the iphone i had that you could only load decentish software if you hacked it..
a couple of minor gripes, the screen is a little shiny for sunny day use and the camera could be alot better.
apart from that i am very happy with it, let hops the diamond touch flo 3d becomes available then that will make this device look great.
the hsdpa speed is great when in the right areas, 50k download speed from my laptop...
the gps seems acurate enough, fast on a warm start as well.
its performance could be a little better but overall its very good.
I would install opera mini as i have found this much better then ie and opera mobile for day to day use.
as for the missing keyboard, try touchpal or the diamond keyboards, also make sure you adjust the sensivity of the screen do a search on here, i think the keyboard is great been software as you can load loads of different types and type quicker with the stylus on some over a flip out keyboard.
the flip out keyboard types can be a little thicker as well you cannot replace or remap keys like a software keyboard so there are plus's and minus's to both concepts...
if you type alot then get a bluetooth keyboard, or a laptop.....
i don't think you will b unhappy with your purchase...
Actually imho any HTC device when just introduced will very rarely be upto my expectation and initially i am always dissapointed,for the first few days,its just a matter of customizing(a heart felt thanks to this forum for teaching us how too) to our personal choice and then i just can't seem to live without them.When i took the Cruise i returned it the next day,very dissapointed with the handset,nothing it could do(and in the factory state it could'nt domuch)was enough,I thought that my Kaiser was far better,then after going through the Cruise forum went and picked it up again,customized it and now wonder how did I ever think negatively abbout this handset,I just love it the feel of it in my hand and also the perfomance,ended up keeping both the Kaiser and Cruise without regrets.
Since I got my first Universal (JasJar) some 2 years back, I have tried several other alternatives, including TyTN 2, HTC Touch Pro, and even Toshiba G910. I have always come back to the Universal. In fact, when I broke my JasJar, I replaced it with Vodafone V1640. I have come to conclude that the Uni is the closest to my ideal PDA/phone for a business user.
But I regret one or two things about the Universal, and I honestly wish we would have a Universal 2 to address these snags. My short wish list for Universal 2 are is follows:
1) Retain the present format - don't change the form factor; it is simply great as it is. Forget those who say it is too heavy or bulky - they don't know what they want. (If weight is your problem, then don't ask for a comfortable keyboard and a large screen as you have in the Uni.)
2) Give it 256MB RAM. This is by far the biggest issue with the current Uni with 64MB RAM. Often when I run something like TextMaker (SoftOffice), the device runs out of memory.
3) Make the stylus holder more secure. Either let it click into place or have a magnetic slot to secure it, like the HTC Touch Pro.
4) Make the SD card slot more secure - perhaps with a cover. As it is, it pops out rather easily.
5) Have a built-in GPS
Any further ideas for Universal 2?
We can fantasize all we want but we aint going to get it! There wont ever be a Uni 2 for sure....atleast i'm pretty convinced about it.
I just broke my uni a few weeks ago and couldnt help but buying another one...(was quite a struggle to find a seller!). I too love the form factor and ergonomics of the uni - simply brilliant.
Anyway, I guess I'll just wait up for a while until there is something like the TyTN 2 where you can tilt the display on the Touch pro and I might just buy one of them! Or the Touch HD Pro - if there will ever be one!
Cheers!
San
Anyway, for the "wishlist" I'd basically want a built in GPS, a better 3D accelerated graphics card, MORE RAM & storage, and an outside smaller display if possible!
Video out would be essential for me, & with that hardware run GFX.
Sadly I dont think there will be a Universal 2, although I wish they would. The line between laptop, PDA and mobile phone has blurred so much, all I really wish is that the mobile industry in general stops limiting the capabilitys of hand held devices (e.g. Iphone) with closed platforms, limiting hardware capabilities and add expansion ports.
Dear rsawoseyin,
You have a Grate Idea about Universal. I also love Universal very much.
If the Universal is made according to the Specs given by you and some other features, like Multitouch Display, Accelerometer, etc., like in iPhone, then it would become Deam Machine!!!!!!!!
So, you request the iMate or HTC to create such type of Universal.
Regards,
Shakeel Ahmed,
Datacom Engineer,
HUAWEI Technologies (Pvt.) Ltd.
I agree with you,
I have had Jasjar and Vodafone V1640. Now I've a Toshiba G900, I'm happy with it and I've started to cook roms for it, then G900 is really important for me.
But I've loved my UNI, perfect size for me, perfect display, perfect keyboard...
To have it today with its features plus a lot ram, storage and GPS, it'll be really a dream. Yes, today we have many devices like Xperia, HD, Touch pro... BUT, apart storage, ram and gps, no one offers all the things the UNI has!
And, if I had to add a thing on a new UNI, I would put the host usb function. I have it on G900 and it can be really usefull!
rsawoseyin said:
Since I got my first Universal (JasJar) some 2 years back, I have tried several other alternatives, including TyTN 2, HTC Touch Pro, and even Toshiba G910. I have always come back to the Universal. In fact, when I broke my JasJar, I replaced it with Vodafone V1640. I have come to conclude that the Uni is the closest to my ideal PDA/phone for a business user.
But I regret one or two things about the Universal, and I honestly wish we would have a Universal 2 to address these snags. My short wish list for Universal 2 are is follows:
1) Retain the present format - don't change the form factor; it is simply great as it is. Forget those who say it is too heavy or bulky - they don't know what they want. (If weight is your problem, then don't ask for a comfortable keyboard and a large screen as you have in the Uni.)
2) Give it 256MB RAM. This is by far the biggest issue with the current Uni with 64MB RAM. Often when I run something like TextMaker (SoftOffice), the device runs out of memory.
3) Make the stylus holder more secure. Either let it click into place or have a magnetic slot to secure it, like the HTC Touch Pro.
4) Make the SD card slot more secure - perhaps with a cover. As it is, it pops out rather easily.
5) Have a built-in GPS
Any further ideas for Universal 2?
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
You pretty much stated the main shortfalls of the Uni.
The only thing I can think of that you left out was EDGE compatibility....
I only been a Imate JasJar owner for 6 months however I love the device. I have a Wizard (T-Mobile MDA)...had it for almost 2 years but for work, I exclusively use my Uni. I send/receive A lot of emails at work and the Uni is perfect for that. Plus I like having an unique PDA.....I live in the US so many Americans never seen a Universal so most of my coworkers, friends, or people that happen to see me use the Uni look at it like WHAT IS THAT? lol.
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=443421
I love the from factor "Micro laptop" but I have not seen anything for the future.....
davideuck said:
I agree with you,
I have had Jasjar and Vodafone V1640. Now I've a Toshiba G900, I'm happy with it and I've started to cook roms for it, then G900 is really important for me.
But I've loved my UNI, perfect size for me, perfect display, perfect keyboard...
To have it today with its features plus a lot ram, storage and GPS, it'll be really a dream. Yes, today we have many devices like Xperia, HD, Touch pro... BUT, apart storage, ram and gps, no one offers all the things the UNI has!
And, if I had to add a thing on a new UNI, I would put the host usb function. I have it on G900 and it can be really usefull!
Click to expand...
Click to collapse
Glad to see you're a Uni user too.
Even tho we both have the G900 and love the 800x480, hackibility/cookibility wise the Uni is just so reliable.
It's very hard to make a perfect ROM for G900 due to the GF5500's lack of proper driver while the Uni is just a plain PXA27x device with drivers readily available.
IMO the perfect Uni2 should have the following:
-PXA32x 800Mhz+ (CorePlayer makes great use of the newer SIMD - WMMX2)
-800x480 WVGA 3.8"
-KB
-Slightly less than 20mm thick
-Same folding/twisting style
-aGPS (from MSM6281)
-Tri-band HSDPA 3.5G (from MSM6281)
-256MB+ RAM
-512MB ROM
-SDHC (or even two! )
Or that concept Touch HD Pro, but with PXA32x 800Mhz instead plus MSM6281 for aGPS+HSDPA. Qualcomm's QTv isn't powerful enough for WVGA H.264 playback.
Too bad HTC haven't made a replacement for the Uni. The closest contender is the Blackstone.
My Imate JasJar's camera doesn't work so I just bought a O2 exec in mint condition off ebay for an excellent price. The O2 should last for a another year...when the price of the Blackstone goes down a bit.... $700+ for a new Blackstone is a bit steep right now for me...lol
even tho i never seen it, on paper Touch Pro looks like ideal replacement.
Nevertheless, here's my wish list for Uni 2
GOOD CAMERA. (For ****'s sake HTC, if after all these years u still cant make a good one, LICENSE technology from sharp or sony!!!!)
fast CPU (900Mhz +)
and 2D drawing acceleration chip
GOBS of internal flash memory (storage), 8+ GB
dump SD card slot, in favour of USB 2.0 access to the internal 8.0GB+ flash
lots of RAM memory, ie 512MB+
ipod/touch pro UI
QUAD band
reduce weight/thickness
higher capacity battery
GPS that works with TOMTOM
scratch/shock resistant case
Actually, I think that HTC meant Touch Pro to be Universals successor. While it is better only in some respects, it is the only device with at least comparable keyboard. You may say that display is too small. But should not need to tap display too often when you have a good keaybord.